Refinance Mega Thread

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Jcwcable
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by Jcwcable »

Finally getting close to being done with my refinance. It was a long road with a lot of back and forth. The AMEX 2500 credit was huge in the bargaining process between lenders. I started out with quotes for 6k in fees for closing and worked down to actually making a couple hundred dollars on a 2.75% 30 year refinance of a 200k loan. So for those of you just starting out, it just takes a ton of patience and multiple quotes to barter with.

Below is the quotes for services I can shop for. See any reason to shop around or are these pretty reasonable?

Title-Closing/Settlement Fee: $495
Title-Iowa Title Guarantee Fee: $140
Title-Attorney Fee: $225
Title-Abstract Fee: $225
Mongoose42
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by Mongoose42 »

mt2k wrote: Wed Jul 01, 2020 11:21 am
Mongoose42 wrote: Wed Jul 01, 2020 10:09 am I just locked at 2.875% for a 30-yr FRM, with no points or lender fees. In fact, we got a lender credit of $1,500, bringing total closing costs to $500. I’ve never seen such good terms so jumped on it. Is this too good to be true? We’ve never heard of the lender, CF Bank, but they got good reviews on Bankrate. How can they make money on the loan?
You can still bring this LE to Better.com if they can match/beat it plus $2,500 Amex credit
I did just that and got a better deal:

2.875% on 30-yr Fixed
$2300 closing costs
$2800 lender credit
$2500 AMEX credit with free appraisal (worth about $500)

Here’s the original offer from CF Bank:

2.875% on 30-yr Fixed
$2000 closing costs
$1500 lender credit

I’m tempted to keep the competition going and get quotes from other lenders, but I’m happy with the Better terms and we’re already on track to close in two weeks.

Thanks everyone for your advice!
Berean
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by Berean »

Any advice as to how I can convince Better to waive escrow for my refi?
Berean
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by Berean »

Berean wrote: Fri Jul 03, 2020 11:18 am Any advice as to how I can convince Better to waive escrow for my refi?
Better maintains that waiving escrow will increase my origination costs by $460.
akpk
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by akpk »

My experience with better.com has been very stressful. They don't respond to your emails. It is impossible to get hold of anyone on phone. They sent incorrect papers for me to sign (i do not know if that is title company's fault or better.com's bad). On top of that you can't get any response from both title365 and better.com . Their amex offer is great. But now i am questioning if this worth the stress. I am considering backing off the refi. I won't recommend them to any friend.
Jags4186
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by Jags4186 »

akpk wrote: Fri Jul 03, 2020 12:17 pm My experience with better.com has been very stressful. They don't respond to your emails. It is impossible to get hold of anyone on phone. They sent incorrect papers for me to sign (i do not know if that is title company's fault or better.com's bad). On top of that you can't get any response from both title365 and better.com . Their amex offer is great. But now i am questioning if this worth the stress. I am considering backing off the refi. I won't recommend them to any friend.
I’m always surprised the disparate experiences people have. So far my experience with Better has been great.

1) best offer bar none I could get for refi
2) locked rate 6/16
3) appraiser showed up on 6/20
4) requested “reissue rate” on title insurance via email—received confirmation on LE next day saving me an additional $680
5) closing disclosure sent on 7/2
6) a few issues with closing disclosure were all resolved with 1 email which I received a response to within an hour
7) closing scheduled for 7/8

As long as the closing goes well, and I get my $2500 from AMEX I am one super happy camper.
happyyoda
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by happyyoda »

AnnabEllie wrote: Tue Jun 30, 2020 6:52 pm
happyyoda wrote: Tue Jun 30, 2020 6:16 pm Does anyone have lender recommendations for Jumbo Refinances in California? What is the best rate that people are getting?
If you live/work within the Travis CU service area (Solano, Yolo, Contra Costa, Merced, Napa, Alameda, Colusa, Placer, Sacramento, San Joaquin, Sonoma, Stanislaus counties), they were the most competitive I could find. Better couldn't match.

I locked on 6/22 for 3.0% with -0.75 discount points so it's no cost; actually getting money back towards pre-paids/escrow. 3.0% is their rate floor so they won't go lower. Their rates are up a bit - looks like right now you'll have to pay 0.375 points to get that rate, but it's changing daily.

Loan amount: $519,000 (technically super-conforming but they are writing it as jumbo as their rates for jumbo are better than conforming right now)
LTV: hopefully 80% (bought with 10% down last year), but rate is good up to 95% LTV, just would need to pay PMI
D+E: $3057
Lender Credit: $3893
Total Cost (excluding pre-paids/escrow): -$836
Thanks a lot for the detailed info on Travis CU! Yes, I do live in one of the counties that you listed.

I checked their website and called one of their local branches. The current rate with -0.75 discount points is 3.125%. They said I can apply now with a float rate of 3.125% and lock it if it gets better during a window of 70 days. I am thinking of getting started with Travis CU while exploring other options.

Thanks again!
hotelcalifornia
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by hotelcalifornia »

akpk wrote: Fri Jul 03, 2020 12:17 pm My experience with better.com has been very stressful. They don't respond to your emails. It is impossible to get hold of anyone on phone. They sent incorrect papers for me to sign (i do not know if that is title company's fault or better.com's bad). On top of that you can't get any response from both title365 and better.com . Their amex offer is great. But now i am questioning if this worth the stress. I am considering backing off the refi. I won't recommend them to any friend.
I’d give my experience with better 6/10. They’re not bad, they’re just processing a ton of loans and you’re a number. Have had to repeatedly email, text, call to make sure everything was in order and still have occasional errors come back.
Crazy_Aussie
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Location: San Antonio, TX

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by Crazy_Aussie »

WRT the $100 price match vs $1000 Better price Guarantee, there might be some hope for those using the AMEX campaign : I currently still see a Better.com webpage that is labeled for the American Express exclusive offer that shows the $1000 price guarantee.

From the link Amex sent to me in an email confirming my eligibility for the offer : https://www.americanexpress.com/us/camp ... ns/better/
At the bottom of that page you click on 'Get Offer' which takes you to : https://better.com/with/amex
That page specifically states it is an Amex exclusive offer with the Better Price Guarantee shown at $1000.
On that page there is a link to the terms and conditions for the Better Price Guarantee that takes you here : https://better.com/with/terms-and-conditions-bpg-amex/

Notice that the last link specifically had AMEX in it?
And on that page it is stated "This is an exclusive offer for eligible Card Members only".

So I'd make a case that anyone who applied to BETTER thru the Amex campaign should be getting $1000 Better Price Guarantee, not the lesser $100.
While BETTER may have withdrawn the $1000 Better Price Guarantee from the general public, I don't think they are a liberty to withdraw it from their AMEX caampaign applicants.

And for those who aren't sure if they qualify for the Amex campaign : I simply phoned customer service at Amex, told them I had heard about the Better Mortgage campaign and they put me thru to that dept in Amex who confirmed my eligibility and emailed me the offer with the link to the website. Took all of 5 mins.

I saved copies of all those webpages above, just in case Better tried to squirm out of the $2500 statement credit.


pindevil wrote: Tue Jun 30, 2020 1:59 am
pindevil wrote: Sat Jun 27, 2020 11:52 am There may be changes coming to better.com and their price guarantee. While talking to them on the phone yesterday I was told the price guarantee is being replaced by the better price match. They will match a competing offer and beat costs by $100. A big difference compared to the $1000 they had offered.

Not sure if this is just something they are thinking about doing or if it's already in effect. The person I spoke to couldn't give me a price match and had to "open a ticket" with my loan processor. The old price guarantee is still listed on their web site and I don't see anything mentioned about the better price match I was told about over the phone.
And now they updated their web site... the $1000 price guarantee is gone.
wootwoot
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by wootwoot »

Crazy_Aussie wrote: Fri Jul 03, 2020 4:28 pm WRT the $100 price match vs $1000 Better price Guarantee, there might be some hope for those using the AMEX campaign : I currently still see a Better.com webpage that is labeled for the American Express exclusive offer that shows the $1000 price guarantee.

From the link Amex sent to me in an email confirming my eligibility for the offer : https://www.americanexpress.com/us/camp ... ns/better/
At the bottom of that page you click on 'Get Offer' which takes you to : https://better.com/with/amex
That page specifically states it is an Amex exclusive offer with the Better Price Guarantee shown at $1000.
On that page there is a link to the terms and conditions for the Better Price Guarantee that takes you here : https://better.com/with/terms-and-conditions-bpg-amex/

Notice that the last link specifically had AMEX in it?
And on that page it is stated "This is an exclusive offer for eligible Card Members only".

So I'd make a case that anyone who applied to BETTER thru the Amex campaign should be getting $1000 Better Price Guarantee, not the lesser $100.
While BETTER may have withdrawn the $1000 Better Price Guarantee from the general public, I don't think they are a liberty to withdraw it from their AMEX caampaign applicants.

And for those who aren't sure if they qualify for the Amex campaign : I simply phoned customer service at Amex, told them I had heard about the Better Mortgage campaign and they put me thru to that dept in Amex who confirmed my eligibility and emailed me the offer with the link to the website. Took all of 5 mins.

I saved copies of all those webpages above, just in case Better tried to squirm out of the $2500 statement credit.


pindevil wrote: Tue Jun 30, 2020 1:59 am
pindevil wrote: Sat Jun 27, 2020 11:52 am There may be changes coming to better.com and their price guarantee. While talking to them on the phone yesterday I was told the price guarantee is being replaced by the better price match. They will match a competing offer and beat costs by $100. A big difference compared to the $1000 they had offered.

Not sure if this is just something they are thinking about doing or if it's already in effect. The person I spoke to couldn't give me a price match and had to "open a ticket" with my loan processor. The old price guarantee is still listed on their web site and I don't see anything mentioned about the better price match I was told about over the phone.
And now they updated their web site... the $1000 price guarantee is gone.
Better still chooses whether or not to allow both promotions. From recent activity they are mostly disallowing people to take advantage of both. I appreciate the effort but don't see that link changing anything.
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anon_investor
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by anon_investor »

seawolf21 wrote: Thu Jul 02, 2020 8:37 pm
anon_investor wrote: Thu Jul 02, 2020 10:33 am How soon after completing a refi have other people started another refi?

I completed a refi with Ally at the end of May. My credit reports now show that my old WF mortgage is paid off, but still do not reflect my refi mortgage (which Ally sold to Fannie Mae, but still services through The Money Source). I have no claw back, and I actually got paid (credits larger than costs/fees/taxes), so there is no breakeven to worry about.

I am now begnining to see even lower rate refi mortgages starting to get closer to "no cost" for me.

I am wondering whether the fact that my new refi mortgage is not yet on my credit report will cause any issues if I try to start a new refi app now?
I don’t think to is a big deal if not on credit report. It might be a big deal if it hasn’t been recorded if your county clerk is backed up due to both covid and all the refi activity.

Might be helpful to bring this up with new lender and settlement agent (maybe use same settlement agent as current loan). I would imagine a settlement agent would want to ensure the payoff wire they are sending out is for a mortgage that is actually secured with the property and the proof is finding a recorded mortgage note.
The new refi mortgage just showed up today on Experian, but not Equifax or Transunion.
dragoncar
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by dragoncar »

Jags4186 wrote: Fri Jul 03, 2020 12:22 pm
akpk wrote: Fri Jul 03, 2020 12:17 pm My experience with better.com has been very stressful. They don't respond to your emails. It is impossible to get hold of anyone on phone. They sent incorrect papers for me to sign (i do not know if that is title company's fault or better.com's bad). On top of that you can't get any response from both title365 and better.com . Their amex offer is great. But now i am questioning if this worth the stress. I am considering backing off the refi. I won't recommend them to any friend.
I’m always surprised the disparate experiences people have. So far my experience with Better has been great.

1) best offer bar none I could get for refi
2) locked rate 6/16
3) appraiser showed up on 6/20
4) requested “reissue rate” on title insurance via email—received confirmation on LE next day saving me an additional $680
5) closing disclosure sent on 7/2
6) a few issues with closing disclosure were all resolved with 1 email which I received a response to within an hour
7) closing scheduled for 7/8

As long as the closing goes well, and I get my $2500 from AMEX I am one super happy camper.
It seems like it just really depends who your team is. The first two steps of the process for me were amazing - origination and processing expert were super responsive. In particular, the processing expert had an assistant who was a rockstar. The closing expert was still good, but sometimes would have to ping again 24 hours later if no response. Title company had issues but for all I know that's down to a new guy working the file. Obviously you want your lender to have only tons of super qualified people but since mortgage volume has exploded I'm sure they are short staffed and have lots of new staff that isn't 100% trained.
Jags4186
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by Jags4186 »

Crazy_Aussie wrote: Fri Jul 03, 2020 4:28 pm WRT the $100 price match vs $1000 Better price Guarantee, there might be some hope for those using the AMEX campaign : I currently still see a Better.com webpage that is labeled for the American Express exclusive offer that shows the $1000 price guarantee.

From the link Amex sent to me in an email confirming my eligibility for the offer : https://www.americanexpress.com/us/camp ... ns/better/
At the bottom of that page you click on 'Get Offer' which takes you to : https://better.com/with/amex
That page specifically states it is an Amex exclusive offer with the Better Price Guarantee shown at $1000.
On that page there is a link to the terms and conditions for the Better Price Guarantee that takes you here : https://better.com/with/terms-and-conditions-bpg-amex/

Notice that the last link specifically had AMEX in it?
And on that page it is stated "This is an exclusive offer for eligible Card Members only".

So I'd make a case that anyone who applied to BETTER thru the Amex campaign should be getting $1000 Better Price Guarantee, not the lesser $100.
While BETTER may have withdrawn the $1000 Better Price Guarantee from the general public, I don't think they are a liberty to withdraw it from their AMEX caampaign applicants.

And for those who aren't sure if they qualify for the Amex campaign : I simply phoned customer service at Amex, told them I had heard about the Better Mortgage campaign and they put me thru to that dept in Amex who confirmed my eligibility and emailed me the offer with the link to the website. Took all of 5 mins.

I saved copies of all those webpages above, just in case Better tried to squirm out of the $2500 statement credit.


pindevil wrote: Tue Jun 30, 2020 1:59 am
pindevil wrote: Sat Jun 27, 2020 11:52 am There may be changes coming to better.com and their price guarantee. While talking to them on the phone yesterday I was told the price guarantee is being replaced by the better price match. They will match a competing offer and beat costs by $100. A big difference compared to the $1000 they had offered.

Not sure if this is just something they are thinking about doing or if it's already in effect. The person I spoke to couldn't give me a price match and had to "open a ticket" with my loan processor. The old price guarantee is still listed on their web site and I don't see anything mentioned about the better price match I was told about over the phone.
And now they updated their web site... the $1000 price guarantee is gone.
Better Mortgage reserves the right to rescind or modify the terms of this offer without prior notice.
Makes it sound to me there is no hope.
bling
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by bling »

for those who have refinanced multiple times before, what's your threshold for when it's worthwhile? most threads talk about about it terms of the expectation you'll still be living in your home. but what about the actual cost savings?

i refinanced earlier in the year with better.com, and the amex credit effectively made it no-cost to me. rates have since dropped again, and i can refinance from 3.125% -> 2.75%. this time, break even is around 7-10 years (i expect to still be living here), but the cost savings over 30 years is around ~4% of my current salary. i'm already paying extra principal each month, and if i maintain the same amount, the savings drop to 2% of my salary. that means, each year i'm saving 2%/30 per year = a very small number relatively speaking.
AnnabEllie
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by AnnabEllie »

happyyoda wrote: Fri Jul 03, 2020 2:04 pm
AnnabEllie wrote: Tue Jun 30, 2020 6:52 pm
happyyoda wrote: Tue Jun 30, 2020 6:16 pm Does anyone have lender recommendations for Jumbo Refinances in California? What is the best rate that people are getting?
If you live/work within the Travis CU service area (Solano, Yolo, Contra Costa, Merced, Napa, Alameda, Colusa, Placer, Sacramento, San Joaquin, Sonoma, Stanislaus counties), they were the most competitive I could find. Better couldn't match.

I locked on 6/22 for 3.0% with -0.75 discount points so it's no cost; actually getting money back towards pre-paids/escrow. 3.0% is their rate floor so they won't go lower. Their rates are up a bit - looks like right now you'll have to pay 0.375 points to get that rate, but it's changing daily.

Loan amount: $519,000 (technically super-conforming but they are writing it as jumbo as their rates for jumbo are better than conforming right now)
LTV: hopefully 80% (bought with 10% down last year), but rate is good up to 95% LTV, just would need to pay PMI
D+E: $3057
Lender Credit: $3893
Total Cost (excluding pre-paids/escrow): -$836
Thanks a lot for the detailed info on Travis CU! Yes, I do live in one of the counties that you listed.

I checked their website and called one of their local branches. The current rate with -0.75 discount points is 3.125%. They said I can apply now with a float rate of 3.125% and lock it if it gets better during a window of 70 days. I am thinking of getting started with Travis CU while exploring other options.

Thanks again!
Glad I was able to help! I'm sure your loan officer mentioned it, but they are pretty swamped so underwriting is delayed. Ours said it will probably be 45-60 days to close, but they'll extend the lock (ours is 45 days) for no cost. Appraiser just called yesterday to schedule (locked almost 2 weeks ago) and still nothing from underwriting yet.
wootwoot
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by wootwoot »

bling wrote: Sat Jul 04, 2020 9:43 am for those who have refinanced multiple times before, what's your threshold for when it's worthwhile? most threads talk about about it terms of the expectation you'll still be living in your home. but what about the actual cost savings?
For me, .375% or more of a rate decrease and a no cost refi.
Gadget
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by Gadget »

wootwoot wrote: Sat Jul 04, 2020 2:12 pm
bling wrote: Sat Jul 04, 2020 9:43 am for those who have refinanced multiple times before, what's your threshold for when it's worthwhile? most threads talk about about it terms of the expectation you'll still be living in your home. but what about the actual cost savings?
For me, .375% or more of a rate decrease and a no cost refi.
If I was single with no young kids, it'd be .125% and 0 months breakeven.

Since I have to coordinate signing docs with the wife and occupy the kids during closing, it's more like .5% and <6 months breakeven.

And it depends what you mean by actual cost savings. You have to add up interest saved, plus monthly P&I savings if invested, plus opportunity cost if you extend the mortgage payment term. So it's a bit complicated. I view it as would I take out a really cheap loan to invest this much in the stock market over the term. If my mortgage was under $100k principal remaining, I likely wouldn't consider it worth it. Or if I just had maybe <5 years left on a 15-30 year mortgage. It all depends on the specific numbers we're talking, and it's relative percent of your net worth. If you're worth $10 million and you have $200k left on a mortgage, it's probably not worth your time either.
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by abuss368 »

I still have not found a lower rate than what we currently have! Will keep watching.
John C. Bogle: “Simplicity is the master key to financial success."
Ron Ronnerson
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by Ron Ronnerson »

Owning is currently showing 2.75% for 30-year fixed on loans up to $510,400 with no closing costs. Their spread between the 15-year and 30-year is only 0.25% at the moment.
Triple digit golfer
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by Triple digit golfer »

psychoslowmatic wrote: Thu Jul 02, 2020 7:34 am
BrandonBogle wrote: Wed Jul 01, 2020 8:59 pm
Triple digit golfer wrote: Wed Jul 01, 2020 8:46 pm Am I overthinking? Essentially, I can pay $2k in loan fees to refinance a 30 year at 3.50% to a 30 year at 2.99%, and plan on not paying it off any faster than required and investing the difference. To me, that sums it up and there's nothing else to really iron out.

I am getting caught up on the mortgage balance starting essentially $3k higher than the balance would be (because the initial payment is delayed a month) at the same time with the old loan. But who cares, right, if we plan on being in the house for a long time.

Somebody reassure me or poke holes in it.
I wouldn’t get hung up on the $2k increase in principal. Instead, focus on making the term longer. It’s only $284/mo right now, but consider splitting the different if it bothers you. Pay your new loan extra such that it would end on the same month as the old one. Then invest that difference.

Either way isn’t bad though.
Or you could leave the payment $ amount exactly the same and shorten your term compared to the original. No matter which you do you're better off with a lower interest rate, so go for it and figure out which approach you want to take while they're in underwriting. Heck, if it's risk your wife is worried about you could invest the difference in EE Bonds and make 0.5% once the 20 year doubling happens.
I did my comparison showing that the loan would be paid off sooner, even with taking on a higher balance now by rolling in the closing fees, if we keep the payment the same. That alone tells me that refinancing is a win. If we do nothing different at all in our monthly payment, we pay it off sooner. What's not to like?
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by soobaerodude »

AnnabEllie wrote: Sat Jul 04, 2020 12:09 pm
happyyoda wrote: Fri Jul 03, 2020 2:04 pm
AnnabEllie wrote: Tue Jun 30, 2020 6:52 pm
happyyoda wrote: Tue Jun 30, 2020 6:16 pm Does anyone have lender recommendations for Jumbo Refinances in California? What is the best rate that people are getting?
If you live/work within the Travis CU service area (Solano, Yolo, Contra Costa, Merced, Napa, Alameda, Colusa, Placer, Sacramento, San Joaquin, Sonoma, Stanislaus counties), they were the most competitive I could find. Better couldn't match.

I locked on 6/22 for 3.0% with -0.75 discount points so it's no cost; actually getting money back towards pre-paids/escrow. 3.0% is their rate floor so they won't go lower. Their rates are up a bit - looks like right now you'll have to pay 0.375 points to get that rate, but it's changing daily.

Loan amount: $519,000 (technically super-conforming but they are writing it as jumbo as their rates for jumbo are better than conforming right now)
LTV: hopefully 80% (bought with 10% down last year), but rate is good up to 95% LTV, just would need to pay PMI
D+E: $3057
Lender Credit: $3893
Total Cost (excluding pre-paids/escrow): -$836
Thanks a lot for the detailed info on Travis CU! Yes, I do live in one of the counties that you listed.

I checked their website and called one of their local branches. The current rate with -0.75 discount points is 3.125%. They said I can apply now with a float rate of 3.125% and lock it if it gets better during a window of 70 days. I am thinking of getting started with Travis CU while exploring other options.

Thanks again!
Glad I was able to help! I'm sure your loan officer mentioned it, but they are pretty swamped so underwriting is delayed. Ours said it will probably be 45-60 days to close, but they'll extend the lock (ours is 45 days) for no cost. Appraiser just called yesterday to schedule (locked almost 2 weeks ago) and still nothing from underwriting yet.
Yup, their days to close estimate is about right. I applied for a refinance with Travis in mid-April and signed closing documents about 52 days later. Makes me jealous to see the 2-3 week closing time that others are getting with better.com
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anon_investor
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by anon_investor »

wootwoot wrote: Sat Jul 04, 2020 2:12 pm
bling wrote: Sat Jul 04, 2020 9:43 am for those who have refinanced multiple times before, what's your threshold for when it's worthwhile? most threads talk about about it terms of the expectation you'll still be living in your home. but what about the actual cost savings?
For me, .375% or more of a rate decrease and a no cost refi.
+1.
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BrandonBogle
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by BrandonBogle »

anon_investor wrote: Sat Jul 04, 2020 5:52 pm
wootwoot wrote: Sat Jul 04, 2020 2:12 pm
bling wrote: Sat Jul 04, 2020 9:43 am for those who have refinanced multiple times before, what's your threshold for when it's worthwhile? most threads talk about about it terms of the expectation you'll still be living in your home. but what about the actual cost savings?
For me, .375% or more of a rate decrease and a no cost refi.
+1.
+2.

I closed at 2.625% in May and told myself I wouldn’t pull the trigger unless 2.25% and no-cost. So I’m also at 0.375%.
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Cobra Commander
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by Cobra Commander »

Ron Ronnerson wrote: Sat Jul 04, 2020 3:42 pm Owning is currently showing 2.75% for 30-year fixed on loans up to $510,400 with no closing costs. Their spread between the 15-year and 30-year is only 0.25% at the moment.
Not to quibble over details but I wouldnt consider that a true no cost loan because they don't cover state transfer taxes/recording fees. Still a decent deal though.
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anon_investor
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by anon_investor »

BrandonBogle wrote: Sat Jul 04, 2020 5:59 pm
anon_investor wrote: Sat Jul 04, 2020 5:52 pm
wootwoot wrote: Sat Jul 04, 2020 2:12 pm
bling wrote: Sat Jul 04, 2020 9:43 am for those who have refinanced multiple times before, what's your threshold for when it's worthwhile? most threads talk about about it terms of the expectation you'll still be living in your home. but what about the actual cost savings?
For me, .375% or more of a rate decrease and a no cost refi.
+1.
+2.

I closed at 2.625% in May and told myself I wouldn’t pull the trigger unless 2.25% and no-cost. So I’m also at 0.375%.
Did you find that yet?
User avatar
BrandonBogle
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by BrandonBogle »

anon_investor wrote: Sat Jul 04, 2020 6:26 pm
BrandonBogle wrote: Sat Jul 04, 2020 5:59 pm +2.

I closed at 2.625% in May and told myself I wouldn’t pull the trigger unless 2.25% and no-cost. So I’m also at 0.375%.
Did you find that yet?
BrandonBogle wrote: Tue Jun 30, 2020 11:52 pm
BrandonBogle wrote: Mon Jun 29, 2020 4:16 pm Got a rate lock (locked on Friday) and estimate today for:

State: NC
Rate: 2.25% *
Term: 15-year fixed
Loan Amount: $150k
No escrow
Section A + B + C + E = $2,977 - $338 lender credit = $2,639

* includes free float down option if rate drops 0.25%

Knowing local pricing available to me for C and E, it would end up actually being $2,345. Now to shop this estimate around to beat it.
I took this offer to Better and they couldn't beat it, but got within $500 of it (before the Amex credit). Better came back with $3,100 in closing costs for 2.25%.

Remember folks that the adjustments they make apply to all their rate tables.

So, I went ahead and locked with a new refi with Better tonight, going from 2.625% 15-year (at no closing costs after the Amex credit) I got from Better in May to 2.625% 15-year with $2k in my pocket (after Amex). Bogles my mind, but in essence, it is free money like chasing a bank or brokerage bonus.

I'll keep my toe in the water though to see if it can sweeten the deal.
After adjusting for overestimating a few things on their initial LE, 2.25% would be no-cost w/o prepaids. My rep last time wasn't bad. Did the job, but it required me to be on top of him very much. This rep is miles ahead of him. Very responsive and when I asked if there was anything to do since they didn't exactly match the offer, he came back with financing the closing costs. That pushed me into another bucket that reduced the closing cost of the points. So I'm financing basically the Amex credit vs. paying it out of pocket and reimbursed like last time.
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anon_investor
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by anon_investor »

BrandonBogle wrote: Sat Jul 04, 2020 7:05 pm
anon_investor wrote: Sat Jul 04, 2020 6:26 pm
BrandonBogle wrote: Sat Jul 04, 2020 5:59 pm +2.

I closed at 2.625% in May and told myself I wouldn’t pull the trigger unless 2.25% and no-cost. So I’m also at 0.375%.
Did you find that yet?
BrandonBogle wrote: Tue Jun 30, 2020 11:52 pm
BrandonBogle wrote: Mon Jun 29, 2020 4:16 pm Got a rate lock (locked on Friday) and estimate today for:

State: NC
Rate: 2.25% *
Term: 15-year fixed
Loan Amount: $150k
No escrow
Section A + B + C + E = $2,977 - $338 lender credit = $2,639

* includes free float down option if rate drops 0.25%

Knowing local pricing available to me for C and E, it would end up actually being $2,345. Now to shop this estimate around to beat it.
I took this offer to Better and they couldn't beat it, but got within $500 of it (before the Amex credit). Better came back with $3,100 in closing costs for 2.25%.

Remember folks that the adjustments they make apply to all their rate tables.

So, I went ahead and locked with a new refi with Better tonight, going from 2.625% 15-year (at no closing costs after the Amex credit) I got from Better in May to 2.625% 15-year with $2k in my pocket (after Amex). Bogles my mind, but in essence, it is free money like chasing a bank or brokerage bonus.

I'll keep my toe in the water though to see if it can sweeten the deal.
After adjusting for overestimating a few things on their initial LE, 2.25% would be no-cost w/o prepaids. My rep last time wasn't bad. Did the job, but it required me to be on top of him very much. This rep is miles ahead of him. Very responsive and when I asked if there was anything to do since they didn't exactly match the offer, he came back with financing the closing costs. That pushed me into another bucket that reduced the closing cost of the points. So I'm financing basically the Amex credit vs. paying it out of pocket and reimbursed like last time.
Better's initial rates are not competitive, much worse than Ally (even factoring in the $2.5k Amex credit), even though I thought they were the same company...
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anon_investor
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by anon_investor »

BrandonBogle wrote: Sat Jul 04, 2020 7:05 pm
anon_investor wrote: Sat Jul 04, 2020 6:26 pm
BrandonBogle wrote: Sat Jul 04, 2020 5:59 pm +2.

I closed at 2.625% in May and told myself I wouldn’t pull the trigger unless 2.25% and no-cost. So I’m also at 0.375%.
Did you find that yet?
BrandonBogle wrote: Tue Jun 30, 2020 11:52 pm
BrandonBogle wrote: Mon Jun 29, 2020 4:16 pm Got a rate lock (locked on Friday) and estimate today for:

State: NC
Rate: 2.25% *
Term: 15-year fixed
Loan Amount: $150k
No escrow
Section A + B + C + E = $2,977 - $338 lender credit = $2,639

* includes free float down option if rate drops 0.25%

Knowing local pricing available to me for C and E, it would end up actually being $2,345. Now to shop this estimate around to beat it.
I took this offer to Better and they couldn't beat it, but got within $500 of it (before the Amex credit). Better came back with $3,100 in closing costs for 2.25%.

Remember folks that the adjustments they make apply to all their rate tables.

So, I went ahead and locked with a new refi with Better tonight, going from 2.625% 15-year (at no closing costs after the Amex credit) I got from Better in May to 2.625% 15-year with $2k in my pocket (after Amex). Bogles my mind, but in essence, it is free money like chasing a bank or brokerage bonus.

I'll keep my toe in the water though to see if it can sweeten the deal.
After adjusting for overestimating a few things on their initial LE, 2.25% would be no-cost w/o prepaids. My rep last time wasn't bad. Did the job, but it required me to be on top of him very much. This rep is miles ahead of him. Very responsive and when I asked if there was anything to do since they didn't exactly match the offer, he came back with financing the closing costs. That pushed me into another bucket that reduced the closing cost of the points. So I'm financing basically the Amex credit vs. paying it out of pocket and reimbursed like last time.
Better's initial rates are not competitive, much worse than Ally (even factoring in the $2.5k Amex credit), even though I thought they were the same company...
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BrandonBogle
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by BrandonBogle »

anon_investor wrote: Sat Jul 04, 2020 7:29 pm
anon_investor wrote: Sat Jul 04, 2020 6:26 pm
BrandonBogle wrote: Sat Jul 04, 2020 5:59 pm +2.

I closed at 2.625% in May and told myself I wouldn’t pull the trigger unless 2.25% and no-cost. So I’m also at 0.375%.
Did you find that yet?
BrandonBogle wrote: Tue Jun 30, 2020 11:52 pm I took this offer to Better and they couldn't beat it, but got within $500 of it (before the Amex credit). Better came back with $3,100 in closing costs for 2.25%.
Better's initial rates are not competitive, much worse than Ally (even factoring in the $2.5k Amex credit), even though I thought they were the same company...
After the adjustments to the overestimated numbers the 2.25% was $150. With the tweak to finance the closing costs, it is down to $-15. Yeah, my cost in points went down $165 for increasing my loan amount. However, unless there is a hiccup, I am going to go with the 2.625% with $2k in my pocket and then plan on a third refi to 2.25% at no cost.
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anon_investor
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by anon_investor »

BrandonBogle wrote: Sat Jul 04, 2020 7:45 pm
anon_investor wrote: Sat Jul 04, 2020 7:29 pm
anon_investor wrote: Sat Jul 04, 2020 6:26 pm
BrandonBogle wrote: Sat Jul 04, 2020 5:59 pm +2.

I closed at 2.625% in May and told myself I wouldn’t pull the trigger unless 2.25% and no-cost. So I’m also at 0.375%.
Did you find that yet?
BrandonBogle wrote: Tue Jun 30, 2020 11:52 pm I took this offer to Better and they couldn't beat it, but got within $500 of it (before the Amex credit). Better came back with $3,100 in closing costs for 2.25%.
Better's initial rates are not competitive, much worse than Ally (even factoring in the $2.5k Amex credit), even though I thought they were the same company...
After the adjustments to the overestimated numbers the 2.25% was $150. With the tweak to finance the closing costs, it is down to $-15. Yeah, my cost in points went down $165 for increasing my loan amount. However, unless there is a hiccup, I am going to go with the 2.625% with $2k in my pocket and then plan on a third refi to 2.25% at no cost.
Ambitious! I have $2k in my pocket from my May refi, I just want to get the lowest rate possible now at no cost.
dragoncar
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by dragoncar »

anon_investor wrote: Sat Jul 04, 2020 7:29 pm
BrandonBogle wrote: Sat Jul 04, 2020 7:05 pm
anon_investor wrote: Sat Jul 04, 2020 6:26 pm
BrandonBogle wrote: Sat Jul 04, 2020 5:59 pm +2.

I closed at 2.625% in May and told myself I wouldn’t pull the trigger unless 2.25% and no-cost. So I’m also at 0.375%.
Did you find that yet?
BrandonBogle wrote: Tue Jun 30, 2020 11:52 pm
BrandonBogle wrote: Mon Jun 29, 2020 4:16 pm Got a rate lock (locked on Friday) and estimate today for:

State: NC
Rate: 2.25% *
Term: 15-year fixed
Loan Amount: $150k
No escrow
Section A + B + C + E = $2,977 - $338 lender credit = $2,639

* includes free float down option if rate drops 0.25%

Knowing local pricing available to me for C and E, it would end up actually being $2,345. Now to shop this estimate around to beat it.
I took this offer to Better and they couldn't beat it, but got within $500 of it (before the Amex credit). Better came back with $3,100 in closing costs for 2.25%.

Remember folks that the adjustments they make apply to all their rate tables.

So, I went ahead and locked with a new refi with Better tonight, going from 2.625% 15-year (at no closing costs after the Amex credit) I got from Better in May to 2.625% 15-year with $2k in my pocket (after Amex). Bogles my mind, but in essence, it is free money like chasing a bank or brokerage bonus.

I'll keep my toe in the water though to see if it can sweeten the deal.
After adjusting for overestimating a few things on their initial LE, 2.25% would be no-cost w/o prepaids. My rep last time wasn't bad. Did the job, but it required me to be on top of him very much. This rep is miles ahead of him. Very responsive and when I asked if there was anything to do since they didn't exactly match the offer, he came back with financing the closing costs. That pushed me into another bucket that reduced the closing cost of the points. So I'm financing basically the Amex credit vs. paying it out of pocket and reimbursed like last time.
Better's initial rates are not competitive, much worse than Ally (even factoring in the $2.5k Amex credit), even though I thought they were the same company...
I don’t think they are the same company. I think they have an agreement for better to process loans and ally partially owns better. But I’m curious the details of their arrangement. They definitely immediately sold my mortgage to better, and my deposit listed better.com, but they are separate financial entities with the same loan processing backend
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anon_investor
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by anon_investor »

dragoncar wrote: Sat Jul 04, 2020 8:22 pm
anon_investor wrote: Sat Jul 04, 2020 7:29 pm
BrandonBogle wrote: Sat Jul 04, 2020 7:05 pm
anon_investor wrote: Sat Jul 04, 2020 6:26 pm
BrandonBogle wrote: Sat Jul 04, 2020 5:59 pm +2.

I closed at 2.625% in May and told myself I wouldn’t pull the trigger unless 2.25% and no-cost. So I’m also at 0.375%.
Did you find that yet?
BrandonBogle wrote: Tue Jun 30, 2020 11:52 pm
BrandonBogle wrote: Mon Jun 29, 2020 4:16 pm Got a rate lock (locked on Friday) and estimate today for:

State: NC
Rate: 2.25% *
Term: 15-year fixed
Loan Amount: $150k
No escrow
Section A + B + C + E = $2,977 - $338 lender credit = $2,639

* includes free float down option if rate drops 0.25%

Knowing local pricing available to me for C and E, it would end up actually being $2,345. Now to shop this estimate around to beat it.
I took this offer to Better and they couldn't beat it, but got within $500 of it (before the Amex credit). Better came back with $3,100 in closing costs for 2.25%.

Remember folks that the adjustments they make apply to all their rate tables.

So, I went ahead and locked with a new refi with Better tonight, going from 2.625% 15-year (at no closing costs after the Amex credit) I got from Better in May to 2.625% 15-year with $2k in my pocket (after Amex). Bogles my mind, but in essence, it is free money like chasing a bank or brokerage bonus.

I'll keep my toe in the water though to see if it can sweeten the deal.
After adjusting for overestimating a few things on their initial LE, 2.25% would be no-cost w/o prepaids. My rep last time wasn't bad. Did the job, but it required me to be on top of him very much. This rep is miles ahead of him. Very responsive and when I asked if there was anything to do since they didn't exactly match the offer, he came back with financing the closing costs. That pushed me into another bucket that reduced the closing cost of the points. So I'm financing basically the Amex credit vs. paying it out of pocket and reimbursed like last time.
Better's initial rates are not competitive, much worse than Ally (even factoring in the $2.5k Amex credit), even though I thought they were the same company...
I don’t think they are the same company. I think they have an agreement for better to process loans and ally partially owns better. But I’m curious the details of their arrangement. They definitely immediately sold my mortgage to better, and my deposit listed better.com, but they are separate financial entities with the same loan processing backend
That begs the question can I get Better to match an Ally LE...
Ron Ronnerson
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by Ron Ronnerson »

Cobra Commander wrote: Sat Jul 04, 2020 6:24 pm
Ron Ronnerson wrote: Sat Jul 04, 2020 3:42 pm Owning is currently showing 2.75% for 30-year fixed on loans up to $510,400 with no closing costs. Their spread between the 15-year and 30-year is only 0.25% at the moment.
Not to quibble over details but I wouldnt consider that a true no cost loan because they don't cover state transfer taxes/recording fees. Still a decent deal though.
It may be worth letting other lenders know about this publicized rate, though. Perhaps they are willing to match or beat it under certain circumstances (depending on loan-to-value, credit score, amount of the loan, etc.). I would look at Owning's rate as the starting point. Hopefully, another lender will offer enough of a credit to cover the government taxes/fees.
Jwalker678
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by Jwalker678 »

Currently 3.175% with Quicken on $410,000 mortgage. Considering a refi with Quicken using a 10 yr ARM.

Options are:

10 yr ARM at 2.375%

10 yr ARM, interest only, 2.625%

Closing costs, $4,700 (includes $2,200 in tax stamp). No points.

Lender credit option of $2,500 for additional .125 rate.

No escrow required.

I intend to pay additional principal annually and pay off over the 10-year period.

Monthly P&I on the lower rate option, $1,593

Monthly pmt on interest only 2.625% option, $863. Payments adjusted downward as principal is reduced.

Do I go for lowest rate or lowest payment? Since I intend to make yearly prepayments anyway, lower rate makes sense. But, the flexibility of interest only provides some protection against disruption in cash flow or unexpected expense. Based on my prepayment schedule this option would cost around $7,000 of additional interest over 10 years Not inclined to pay higher rate for lender credit since I don’t expect to refi again and will be more costly over the term.
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BrandonBogle
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by BrandonBogle »

Jwalker678 wrote: Sun Jul 05, 2020 11:47 am Options are:

10 yr ARM at 2.375%

10 yr ARM, interest only, 2.625%

Closing costs, $4,700 (includes $2,200 in tax stamp). No points.

Lender credit option of $2,500 for additional .125 rate.

No escrow required.

I intend to pay additional principal annually and pay off over the 10-year period.
If the intention is to pay off over 10 years, why not get a 10-year or 15-year elsewhere for 2.25 - 2.5% with no closing costs or 2% with some closing costs?
mt2k
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by mt2k »

Mongoose42 wrote: Thu Jul 02, 2020 11:08 pm
mt2k wrote: Wed Jul 01, 2020 11:21 am
Mongoose42 wrote: Wed Jul 01, 2020 10:09 am I just locked at 2.875% for a 30-yr FRM, with no points or lender fees. In fact, we got a lender credit of $1,500, bringing total closing costs to $500. I’ve never seen such good terms so jumped on it. Is this too good to be true? We’ve never heard of the lender, CF Bank, but they got good reviews on Bankrate. How can they make money on the loan?
You can still bring this LE to Better.com if they can match/beat it plus $2,500 Amex credit
I did just that and got a better deal:

2.875% on 30-yr Fixed
$2300 closing costs
$2800 lender credit
$2500 AMEX credit with free appraisal (worth about $500)

Here’s the original offer from CF Bank:

2.875% on 30-yr Fixed
$2000 closing costs
$1500 lender credit

I’m tempted to keep the competition going and get quotes from other lenders, but I’m happy with the Better terms and we’re already on track to close in two weeks.

Thanks everyone for your advice!
:thumbsup :thumbsup Awesome. You got a great deal!
Jwalker678
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by Jwalker678 »

BrandonBogle wrote: Sun Jul 05, 2020 12:20 pm
Jwalker678 wrote: Sun Jul 05, 2020 11:47 am Options are:

10 yr ARM at 2.375%

10 yr ARM, interest only, 2.625%

Closing costs, $4,700 (includes $2,200 in tax stamp). No points.

Lender credit option of $2,500 for additional .125 rate.

No escrow required.

I intend to pay additional principal annually and pay off over the 10-year period.
If the intention is to pay off over 10 years, why not get a 10-year or 15-year elsewhere for 2.25 - 2.5% with no closing costs or 2% with some closing costs?
Prepayments will come from dividends and the amount can vary widely especially if the economy worsens. If dividends dry up the larger payments on a 10 or 15 yr amort could make cash flow tight.
dragoncar
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by dragoncar »

anon_investor wrote: Sat Jul 04, 2020 8:27 pm
dragoncar wrote: Sat Jul 04, 2020 8:22 pm
anon_investor wrote: Sat Jul 04, 2020 7:29 pm
BrandonBogle wrote: Sat Jul 04, 2020 7:05 pm
anon_investor wrote: Sat Jul 04, 2020 6:26 pm

Did you find that yet?
BrandonBogle wrote: Tue Jun 30, 2020 11:52 pm

I took this offer to Better and they couldn't beat it, but got within $500 of it (before the Amex credit). Better came back with $3,100 in closing costs for 2.25%.

Remember folks that the adjustments they make apply to all their rate tables.

So, I went ahead and locked with a new refi with Better tonight, going from 2.625% 15-year (at no closing costs after the Amex credit) I got from Better in May to 2.625% 15-year with $2k in my pocket (after Amex). Bogles my mind, but in essence, it is free money like chasing a bank or brokerage bonus.

I'll keep my toe in the water though to see if it can sweeten the deal.
After adjusting for overestimating a few things on their initial LE, 2.25% would be no-cost w/o prepaids. My rep last time wasn't bad. Did the job, but it required me to be on top of him very much. This rep is miles ahead of him. Very responsive and when I asked if there was anything to do since they didn't exactly match the offer, he came back with financing the closing costs. That pushed me into another bucket that reduced the closing cost of the points. So I'm financing basically the Amex credit vs. paying it out of pocket and reimbursed like last time.
Better's initial rates are not competitive, much worse than Ally (even factoring in the $2.5k Amex credit), even though I thought they were the same company...
I don’t think they are the same company. I think they have an agreement for better to process loans and ally partially owns better. But I’m curious the details of their arrangement. They definitely immediately sold my mortgage to better, and my deposit listed better.com, but they are separate financial entities with the same loan processing backend
That begs the question can I get Better to match an Ally LE...
I sent my ally LE to better and they said they couldn’t beat it. They didn’t say anything along the lines of “we won’t consider a competing LE from ally”. However that was the end of it since my loan was too large for their $1000 guarantee. The LE for ally clearly says ally bank and better says better and the terms didn’t say anything about exempted banks, so I think you’d have a strong case to get the $1k if you were otherwise eligible (but did I read up thread they no longer offer that guarantee?)
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anon_investor
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by anon_investor »

dragoncar wrote: Mon Jul 06, 2020 3:32 am
anon_investor wrote: Sat Jul 04, 2020 8:27 pm
dragoncar wrote: Sat Jul 04, 2020 8:22 pm
anon_investor wrote: Sat Jul 04, 2020 7:29 pm
BrandonBogle wrote: Sat Jul 04, 2020 7:05 pm



After adjusting for overestimating a few things on their initial LE, 2.25% would be no-cost w/o prepaids. My rep last time wasn't bad. Did the job, but it required me to be on top of him very much. This rep is miles ahead of him. Very responsive and when I asked if there was anything to do since they didn't exactly match the offer, he came back with financing the closing costs. That pushed me into another bucket that reduced the closing cost of the points. So I'm financing basically the Amex credit vs. paying it out of pocket and reimbursed like last time.
Better's initial rates are not competitive, much worse than Ally (even factoring in the $2.5k Amex credit), even though I thought they were the same company...
I don’t think they are the same company. I think they have an agreement for better to process loans and ally partially owns better. But I’m curious the details of their arrangement. They definitely immediately sold my mortgage to better, and my deposit listed better.com, but they are separate financial entities with the same loan processing backend
That begs the question can I get Better to match an Ally LE...
I sent my ally LE to better and they said they couldn’t beat it. They didn’t say anything along the lines of “we won’t consider a competing LE from ally”. However that was the end of it since my loan was too large for their $1000 guarantee. The LE for ally clearly says ally bank and better says better and the terms didn’t say anything about exempted banks, so I think you’d have a strong case to get the $1k if you were otherwise eligible (but did I read up thread they no longer offer that guarantee?)
I don't think they have the $1k guarantee anymore, but the $2.5k Amex credit for Better.com is still available. I had a good experience with my May refi with Ally (2 weeks from rate lock to funding), I assume since their backend is Better that a refi with Better would be a similar experience. While I am looking for the best deal, I also want a smooth process.
McJammer
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by McJammer »

Hi everyone - I think I know the answer but wanted thoughts from here . . . appraiser is coming on Friday. Taking photos of inside and outside of the house. Report will go to the lender and us. Should I clean up? LOL. Not sure how much difference it would make but do I want the house to appraise for higher because that will improve my loan to value ratio, thus improving how our loan looks to the lender?

Will they report our appraisal to the city, i.e. higher property taxes? ewwwwww.
dsmil
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by dsmil »

McJammer wrote: Mon Jul 06, 2020 10:47 am Hi everyone - I think I know the answer but wanted thoughts from here . . . appraiser is coming on Friday. Taking photos of inside and outside of the house. Report will go to the lender and us. Should I clean up? LOL. Not sure how much difference it would make but do I want the house to appraise for higher because that will improve my loan to value ratio, thus improving how our loan looks to the lender?

Will they report our appraisal to the city, i.e. higher property taxes? ewwwwww.
Yes, you should definitely clean up, especially if you could be paying PMI, or anywhere close to 20% equity. I don't think that appraisals go to anyone other than you and the lender, so I wouldn't worry about the taxes.
dsmil
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by dsmil »

I finally bailed on Better.com and locked at 2.875% with a $3k lender credit with Keystone Funding (30 year fixed, 20% equity).

The appraisal process with Better.com was a disaster, and it was even more frustrating considering that the other lenders were waiving the appraisal completely, and taking my valuation which put us at 20% equity. Better.com used a company called Mueller Reports, who did a bifurcated appraisal, meaning that a 3rd party came to take awful pictures and the actual appraiser used the pictures and did the appraisal from another state. He had no clue about our neighborhood values and chose comps from incomparable neighborhoods, including a short sale that recently sold at a $70k lower price than it had in 2018. In the end, we appraised for $10k less than we just had in October, which was before we did $20k of renovations. My appeal took a month to get a response from them and was unsuccessful, so it was time to bail.
Young Fellow
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by Young Fellow »

AnnabEllie wrote: Sat Jul 04, 2020 12:09 pm
happyyoda wrote: Fri Jul 03, 2020 2:04 pm
AnnabEllie wrote: Tue Jun 30, 2020 6:52 pm
happyyoda wrote: Tue Jun 30, 2020 6:16 pm Does anyone have lender recommendations for Jumbo Refinances in California? What is the best rate that people are getting?
If you live/work within the Travis CU service area (Solano, Yolo, Contra Costa, Merced, Napa, Alameda, Colusa, Placer, Sacramento, San Joaquin, Sonoma, Stanislaus counties), they were the most competitive I could find. Better couldn't match.

I locked on 6/22 for 3.0% with -0.75 discount points so it's no cost; actually getting money back towards pre-paids/escrow. 3.0% is their rate floor so they won't go lower. Their rates are up a bit - looks like right now you'll have to pay 0.375 points to get that rate, but it's changing daily.

Loan amount: $519,000 (technically super-conforming but they are writing it as jumbo as their rates for jumbo are better than conforming right now)
LTV: hopefully 80% (bought with 10% down last year), but rate is good up to 95% LTV, just would need to pay PMI
D+E: $3057
Lender Credit: $3893
Total Cost (excluding pre-paids/escrow): -$836
Thanks a lot for the detailed info on Travis CU! Yes, I do live in one of the counties that you listed.

I checked their website and called one of their local branches. The current rate with -0.75 discount points is 3.125%. They said I can apply now with a float rate of 3.125% and lock it if it gets better during a window of 70 days. I am thinking of getting started with Travis CU while exploring other options.

Thanks again!
Glad I was able to help! I'm sure your loan officer mentioned it, but they are pretty swamped so underwriting is delayed. Ours said it will probably be 45-60 days to close, but they'll extend the lock (ours is 45 days) for no cost. Appraiser just called yesterday to schedule (locked almost 2 weeks ago) and still nothing from underwriting yet.
Thank you Thank you AnnabEllie, for writing about Travis CU, found 3.0% for 30 years there yesterday, applied and use this for shopping mortgage rates since so far I found lenders with 3.25% and abobe thus far. best to you and in this forum
Young Fellow
WhyRWeHere
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Joined: Fri Jun 12, 2020 9:40 am

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by WhyRWeHere »

dsmil wrote: Mon Jul 06, 2020 11:43 am

The appraisal process with Better.com was a disaster, and it was even more frustrating considering that the other lenders were waiving the appraisal completely, and taking my valuation which put us at 20% equity. Better.com used a company called Mueller Reports, who did a bifurcated appraisal, meaning that a 3rd party came to take awful pictures and the actual appraiser used the pictures and did the appraisal from another state. He had no clue about our neighborhood values and chose comps from incomparable neighborhoods, including a short sale that recently sold at a $70k lower price than it had in 2018. In the end, we appraised for $10k less than we just had in October, which was before we did $20k of renovations. My appeal took a month to get a response from them and was unsuccessful, so it was time to bail.
Same here with Better. They insisted on an interior appraisal, when we have 40-50% equity. I wouldn't normally care about an appraisal, but I am not ok with letting a stranger walk around my house during covid when there's no reason for it and they refused to do an exterior appraisal. Other lenders waived the appraisal due to the low LTV.
Young Fellow
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Loan is in process and not underwritten yet, but now found 0.25% lower interest rate, advise please

Post by Young Fellow »

Hi I gave consent for $225K refinance loan at 3.25% for 30 years plus costs of $3032 (includes 0.45% points) with Chase and they not underwritten even after 20 days. Off course Chase took $500 deposit. In the mean while with the help from this forum, I found Travis CU, they have approved me for 3.0% interest rate. I sent Travis approval to Chase, Chase is saying they will address my pricing concerns only after the underwriting. Is that common, what should I do now, To lock at Travis, need to deposit for appraisal and If I wait Travis interest rate may not hold and on the other hand Chase may not match Travis rate after loan is underwritten, Can they do that? or I forgo $500 paid to Chase and move with Travis since there is a difference of 0.25% and also $1000 cheap with closing costs. Any feed back, experience would be helpful for me. Also I am in a situation where debt to income ratio is close to 50% making traditional Banks approving my refinance.
Young fellow
Last edited by Young Fellow on Mon Jul 06, 2020 12:47 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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BrandonBogle
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Re: Gave consent to process and not underwritten, but now found almost 0.25% lower interest rate, advise please

Post by BrandonBogle »

Young Fellow wrote: Mon Jul 06, 2020 12:32 pm forgo $500 and move with Travis since there is a difference of 0.25%? Any feed back, experience would be helpful for me. Also I am in a situation where dead to income is close to 50% making traditional Banks approving my refinance.
If you feel that your debt-to-income may make it hard for banks to play ball vs. credit unions, then I'd bite the bullet and pull the trigger at Travis. At Travis, you said this is a deposit for an appraisal. Ask them to see if you qualify for a PIW (property inspection waiver), a.k.a., an appraisal waiver. If not, let them know not to order the appraisal until you've had your initial underwriting review. Basically, don't have the appraisal ordered/paid until after you had an initial review from their underwriting department that they would even approve you for that debt-to-income level.

Meanwhile, if Chase has taken 20 days for underwriting review of your file already, it is unlikely they will close quickly. Have others using Travis chimed in on generally how long they take to process a refinance? When I used PenFed, they would take 45 days minimum and potentially even 60 (especially as of late). I ask this b/c how long is their rate lock? Would they keep the guarantee on the rate long enough?
Young Fellow
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Re: Gave consent to process and not underwritten, but now found almost 0.25% lower interest rate, advise please

Post by Young Fellow »

BrandonBogle wrote: Mon Jul 06, 2020 12:40 pm
Young Fellow wrote: Mon Jul 06, 2020 12:32 pm forgo $500 and move with Travis since there is a difference of 0.25%? Any feed back, experience would be helpful for me. Also I am in a situation where dead to income is close to 50% making traditional Banks approving my refinance.
If you feel that your debt-to-income may make it hard for banks to play ball vs. credit unions, then I'd bite the bullet and pull the trigger at Travis. At Travis, you said this is a deposit for an appraisal. Ask them to see if you qualify for a PIW (property inspection waiver), a.k.a., an appraisal waiver. If not, let them know not to order the appraisal until you've had your initial underwriting review. Basically, don't have the appraisal ordered/paid until after you had an initial review from their underwriting department that they would even approve you for that debt-to-income level.

Meanwhile, if Chase has taken 20 days for underwriting review of your file already, it is unlikely they will close quickly. Have others using Travis chimed in on generally how long they take to process a refinance? When I used PenFed, they would take 45 days minimum and potentially even 60 (especially as of late). I ask this b/c how long is their rate lock? Would they keep the guarantee on the rate long enough?
Hi BrandonBogle, thank you for great response and suggestion, People posted in this forum that it is taking 50 days plus and they are extending rate lock if the loan is not closed by that date. I also edited my post where in Travis CU closing costs are cheaper by $1000 even with home appraisal where Chase did waive home appraisal.
Young Fellow
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BrandonBogle
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Re: Gave consent to process and not underwritten, but now found almost 0.25% lower interest rate, advise please

Post by BrandonBogle »

Young Fellow wrote: Mon Jul 06, 2020 12:56 pm Hi BrandonBogle, thank you for great response and suggestion, People posted in this forum that it is taking 50 days plus and they are extending rate lock if the loan is not closed by that date. I also edited my post where in Travis CU closing costs are cheaper by $1000 even with home appraisal where Chase did waive home appraisal.
Young Fellow
Gotcha. In that case, I would do as I mentioned above. Proceed with Travis, but ask them not to order the appraisal yet. Once the initial review comes in approved, hopefully Chase has answered by then. If not, $500 lost will still put you $500 ahead at closing, plus the interest savings.

Meanwhile, if Chase comes back and beats Travis, the cost of the appraisal (if done by then) at Travis will still put you ahead. I would gamble the $500 on the premise “don’t let perfect be the enemy of good”.

Good luck!
Ron Ronnerson
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Location: Bay Area

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by Ron Ronnerson »

WhyRWeHere wrote: Mon Jul 06, 2020 12:25 pm
dsmil wrote: Mon Jul 06, 2020 11:43 am

The appraisal process with Better.com was a disaster, and it was even more frustrating considering that the other lenders were waiving the appraisal completely, and taking my valuation which put us at 20% equity. Better.com used a company called Mueller Reports, who did a bifurcated appraisal, meaning that a 3rd party came to take awful pictures and the actual appraiser used the pictures and did the appraisal from another state. He had no clue about our neighborhood values and chose comps from incomparable neighborhoods, including a short sale that recently sold at a $70k lower price than it had in 2018. In the end, we appraised for $10k less than we just had in October, which was before we did $20k of renovations. My appeal took a month to get a response from them and was unsuccessful, so it was time to bail.
Same here with Better. They insisted on an interior appraisal, when we have 40-50% equity. I wouldn't normally care about an appraisal, but I am not ok with letting a stranger walk around my house during covid when there's no reason for it and they refused to do an exterior appraisal. Other lenders waived the appraisal due to the low LTV.
Better said an appraisal would be required for us as well. We have 60% LTV. It’s a 10-year old property that is valued at $850k with a mortgage balance of $345k. Better also lowered their lender credit by $600 from their initial estimate after doing a hard pull on my credit. My credit scores were 789, 795, and 805. They based their initial estimate on a soft pull and if my credit score was close to not qualifying for the lender credit they had stated, I think it would have been best to tell me as much prior to doing a hard pull.

They still had a competitive rate and fees but requiring an appraisal for our situation during a pandemic seemed pointless, especially in light of the fact that other lenders said it wasn’t necessary. Then lowering the lender credit just left a bit of bad taste in my mouth. It’s not about $600 for me but just being straightforward and customer-friendly. Emails I sent were not promptly responded to either. That’s just my experience and it sounds like some others have had better luck with Better.
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Cobra Commander
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by Cobra Commander »

Has anyone actually gotten the AMEX credit with Quicken? It looks like from the AMEX offer page you have to apply through a special link. I was curious whether that was actually the case in practice or whether the AMEX offer could be added otherwise. I ask because I've already got someone I'm talking to and, if the offer is only available through that link, I question whether the pricing I have can be combined with the AMEX offer.

As somewhat of a vent, it's really irritating to me the lack of transparency with this process. That I can't just go to a website and look at rates (other than Lenderfi but rates are different online vs. once you apply) and that people will not send you the rate sheet so you have to jot down what they are saying. The only company that sent me a rate sheet was Amerisave.
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