Relocate to Seattle or NYC

[Broadway2018]

OP,

Have you and your wife visited both locations? Do you have time to visit before making a decision? Do you know anyone in either location or anyone doing your job in either location? WA has no state income tax and you'll be earning more in WA. Where are your respective families located? Is that a factor? If you choose Seattle and want public schools, you should look at Bellevue, Mercer Island, Bainbridge Island, Issaquah, Bothell, Woodinville and Kenmore. You can definitely make it work on your salary but $1,800-$2,000 for rent seems low (for the Seattle area and the NYC suburbs) assuming you need at least two bedrooms.

NYC may not be ideal if you don't like crowds. If you have to relocate either way, I would choose Seattle based on the info provided.

Rent is more like $3k+ in Seattle for a decent 2 bedroom. I just relocated and am having trouble finding somewhere with a $3k budget close to South Lake Union.

[core4portfolio]

If you plan to live in the suburbs, and have to go into the office every day in Seattle, and can work from home in New York, then New York. Seattle has horrendous, soul sucking suburban commutes. Really. Do not discount this.

I have to question, if you prefer suburban life, why you are considering those cities at all. If you like cities, they’re both in the top five places to live in the US, but if you prefer suburban life, practically anywhere else in the country will be better.

I got offer only on these locations.. i still have interview lined up but I decided to pick one of these and move on.

[core4portfolio]

OP,

Have you and your wife visited both locations? Do you have time to visit before making a decision? Do you know anyone in either location or anyone doing your job in either location? WA has no state income tax and you'll be earning more in WA. Where are your respective families located? Is that a factor? If you choose Seattle and want public schools, you should look at Bellevue, Mercer Island, Bainbridge Island, Issaquah, Bothell, Woodinville and Kenmore. You can definitely make it work on your salary but $1,800-$2,000 for rent seems low (for the Seattle area and the NYC suburbs) assuming you need at least two bedrooms.

NYC may not be ideal if you don't like crowds. If you have to relocate either way, I would choose Seattle based on the info provided.

Rent is more like $3k+ in Seattle for a decent 2 bedroom. I just relocated and am having trouble finding somewhere with a $3k budget close to South Lake Union.

I looked on Northern seattle like Northgate and GreenLake

[core4portfolio]

Do you work from home now? Work-at-home arrangements have great pluses but it can be challenging with young children at home even with a SAH spouse.

If you choose NYC, it is a long door-to-door commute from the NY/NJ/CT suburbs. On a good day. Be sure you can handle a 4-hour round trip commute even if it’s only 1 day per week. It’s not for everyone.

Best of luck!

Yes. Iam a WFH employee, 5 days a week WFH only. I used to drive in Atlanta for 1.5 hours in car and so Iam still thinking commute wont be problem but iam not used to public transport. So need to see how it goes.
Office is few blocks away from Penn station

[Broadway2018]

OP,

Have you and your wife visited both locations? Do you have time to visit before making a decision? Do you know anyone in either location or anyone doing your job in either location? WA has no state income tax and you'll be earning more in WA. Where are your respective families located? Is that a factor? If you choose Seattle and want public schools, you should look at Bellevue, Mercer Island, Bainbridge Island, Issaquah, Bothell, Woodinville and Kenmore. You can definitely make it work on your salary but $1,800-$2,000 for rent seems low (for the Seattle area and the NYC suburbs) assuming you need at least two bedrooms.

NYC may not be ideal if you don't like crowds. If you have to relocate either way, I would choose Seattle based on the info provided.

Rent is more like $3k+ in Seattle for a decent 2 bedroom. I just relocated and am having trouble finding somewhere with a $3k budget close to South Lake Union.

I looked on Northern seattle like Northgate and GreenLake

Those commutes are 45 minutes with no traffic on public transit and not much cheaper compared to a soul sucking commute. I rather pay $500 more a month to not sit in traffic but to each their own.

[ScubaHogg]

I don't think rats are a major issue for OP.

[KyleAAA]

OP,

Have you and your wife visited both locations? Do you have time to visit before making a decision? Do you know anyone in either location or anyone doing your job in either location? WA has no state income tax and you'll be earning more in WA. Where are your respective families located? Is that a factor? If you choose Seattle and want public schools, you should look at Bellevue, Mercer Island, Bainbridge Island, Issaquah, Bothell, Woodinville and Kenmore. You can definitely make it work on your salary but $1,800-$2,000 for rent seems low (for the Seattle area and the NYC suburbs) assuming you need at least two bedrooms.

NYC may not be ideal if you don't like crowds. If you have to relocate either way, I would choose Seattle based on the info provided.

Rent is more like $3k+ in Seattle for a decent 2 bedroom. I just relocated and am having trouble finding somewhere with a $3k budget close to South Lake Union.

I looked on Northern seattle like Northgate and GreenLake

Northgate maybe, although not anything nice. Green lake is not a suburb and there's no way you'll find something decent for a family for $2000. Green lake is still part of Seattle city proper, which doesn't sound like what you want

[LilyFleur]

If you plan to live in the suburbs, and have to go into the office every day in Seattle, and can work from home in New York, then New York. Seattle has horrendous, soul sucking suburban commutes. Really. Do not discount this.

I have to question, if you prefer suburban life, why you are considering those cities at all. If you like cities, they’re both in the top five places to live in the US, but if you prefer suburban life, practically anywhere else in the country will be better.

Yes, the Seattle freeways have not kept up with the population growth. So many Californians moved up there, but they didn't bring with them what is really a very well-engineered system of freeways that we have in Southern California.

[core4portfolio]

+1 for NYC.

If you can work from home at least 2 days a week, then I'd suggest CT, NJ or upstate NY.

If schools are very important, then there are some ultra-competitive school districts in NJ that are very highly rated - much like a good school would look like in India or China. I personally don't like so much pressure on high-schoolers as it kills creativity in my opinion - but many people swear by it.

As far as NY State goes, many of the long island and east/west chester schools are fantastic e.g. Port Washington seems to produce National level Intel Talent Search finalists with alarming regularity.

CT may offer good schools + affordability. Everything with good schools in NJ/NY would cost a lot (think $1MM for house, and $25k/yr in taxes). Fairfield county in CT is similar (Greenwich/Darien/Westport/Fairfield). Housing prices would be similar to NJ/NY - ~800k to 1MM. You can also live on the south end of New Haven county if you are commuting only 2/3 days a week. Woodbridge/Orange have very good schools and are close to the new haven train line into Grand Central. If you like it more urban - Milford is good, and is the very first town in New Haven county. If you do this, the housing cost would drop below $500k. You can easily do $400k for a big SFH on half an acre, and may even be able to do $300k for a smaller SFH. Condos can be even cheaper if that is your thing. You would likely pay $6-7k in taxes/year as opposed to the $20k+ that all NJ/NYS residents seem to talk about.

I live in southern New Haven and commute in using Metro North. The train ride is comfortable and my door to door commute time to downtown (close to WTC) is 2hour and 5 minutes. This area is perfect for single earners intent on LBYM.

Thank you for detailed response. Its really helpful. I prefer to drive for 1 to 1.25 hours.
Work location is close to 23rd street station. Striking the balance of commute, budget and good school looks like a big challenge in NYC.
I will check on these location with spouse and pick one. Thanks again

[core4portfolio]

I am really curious about your personal preferences. For me there is no way in a million years I would choose NY or even the East Coast over Seattle or the West Coast in general. (I have lived on both coasts in more than one location each and have been to both NY and Seattle many times.) But I know people who love New York and choose to live there or wish they were living there. The people I know wouldn't imagine even thinking about a different choice. You obviously got far enough to get a job offer in NY so the question would be what are your interests and preferences?

I applied for a position in FL but they offered me position in NY.

[ctuser1]

Thank you for detailed response. Its really helpful. I prefer to drive for 1 to 1.25 hours.
Work location is close to 23rd street station. Striking the balance of commute, budget and good school looks like a big challenge in NYC.
I will check on these location with spouse and pick one. Thanks again

Driving into work is not really a feasible option for NYC.

NYC metro area is much bigger and much more populous than any other urban area in the US. 1 to 1.25 hours of drive won't get you too far in any reasonable peak traffic hours - and peak traffic hours are much broader than at other cities. If you decide to drive, total time taken may vary a lot.

Add in the toll + parking, and it quickly becomes very unaffordable.

If you live in NJ, it is either buses or NJTransit train. If north of the city, it is mostly MNR train. Driving is simply not a thing here!!

23rd street, depending on which avenue will be either closer to 6 line (or 4/5 line and walk from 14th street). In this case you would be better off living north of the city and coming into GCT.

Or it may be accessible from the A/B/C etc lines - in which case getting into either Penn or Port Authority Bus Terminal is perfect. Easy access to Port Authority will open up a much larger area of NJ than just the ones close to the train stations - but the housing prices for good schools will still be up in the $800k range.

In either case, it should be doable from either end of the city - north or south.

[Sam1]

+1 for NYC.

If you can work from home at least 2 days a week, then I'd suggest CT, NJ or upstate NY.

If schools are very important, then there are some ultra-competitive school districts in NJ that are very highly rated - much like a good school would look like in India or China. I personally don't like so much pressure on high-schoolers as it kills creativity in my opinion - but many people swear by it.

As far as NY State goes, many of the long island and east/west chester schools are fantastic e.g. Port Washington seems to produce National level Intel Talent Search finalists with alarming regularity.

CT may offer good schools + affordability. Everything with good schools in NJ/NY would cost a lot (think $1MM for house, and $25k/yr in taxes). Fairfield county in CT is similar (Greenwich/Darien/Westport/Fairfield). Housing prices would be similar to NJ/NY - ~800k to 1MM. You can also live on the south end of New Haven county if you are commuting only 2/3 days a week. Woodbridge/Orange have very good schools and are close to the new haven train line into Grand Central. If you like it more urban - Milford is good, and is the very first town in New Haven county. If you do this, the housing cost would drop below $500k. You can easily do $400k for a big SFH on half an acre, and may even be able to do $300k for a smaller SFH. Condos can be even cheaper if that is your thing. You would likely pay $6-7k in taxes/year as opposed to the $20k+ that all NJ/NYS residents seem to talk about.

I live in southern New Haven and commute in using Metro North. The train ride is comfortable and my door to door commute time to downtown (close to WTC) is 2hour and 5 minutes. This area is perfect for single earners intent on LBYM.

Thank you for detailed response. Its really helpful. I prefer to drive for 1 to 1.25 hours.
Work location is close to 23rd street station. Striking the balance of commute, budget and good school looks like a big challenge in NYC.
I will check on these location with spouse and pick one. Thanks again

You won’t be able to commute to/from NYC via car.

Over 10 years ago, a parking spot in my building in midtown Manhattan was $1k per month.

[Sam1]

I wouldn’t move to NYC because you won’t really be moving to NYC. You’ll be moving to a suburb. The cost of living in this suburb will be inflated due to most people working in manhattan. Except you’re not going to be enjoying NYC or what it has to offer. Are you going to be dining out in manhattan, going to the theatre, shopping, cultural events etc? I highly doubt it on that salary. My point is that I don’t see why I’d pay extra money to live outside of a city you’ll barely enjoy.

There are plenty of people living in NYC burbs because they HAVE to. The only high paying job they can find or think they can find is in manhattan. The location offers the most career growth. They have family in the area.

Some of the NYC suburbs are LOVELY. The problem is that with your salary you won’t be able to afford to live in a place like this. You’ll be in a more working class suburb with not as good of schools and/or living farther out. There is nothing wrong with these lower priced locations except why live here if you don’t have a compelling reason?

Would I pick up and move to the NYC suburbs for a job not making much more than a job in another city? No way. You’d be making your life a lot harder and from other posts, it doesn’t seem like it would be that great professionally.

[FireSekr]

Thank you for detailed response. Its really helpful. I prefer to drive for 1 to 1.25 hours.
Work location is close to 23rd street station. Striking the balance of commute, budget and good school looks like a big challenge in NYC.
I will check on these location with spouse and pick one. Thanks again

Driving into work is not really a feasible option for NYC.

NYC metro area is much bigger and much more populous than any other urban area in the US. 1 to 1.25 hours of drive won't get you too far in any reasonable peak traffic hours - and peak traffic hours are much broader than at other cities. If you decide to drive, total time taken may vary a lot.

Add in the toll + parking, and it quickly becomes very unaffordable.

If you live in NJ, it is either buses or NJTransit train. If north of the city, it is mostly MNR train. Driving is simply not a thing here!!

23rd street, depending on which avenue will be either closer to 6 line (or 4/5 line and walk from 14th street). In this case you would be better off living north of the city and coming into GCT.

Or it may be accessible from the A/B/C etc lines - in which case getting into either Penn or Port Authority Bus Terminal is perfect. Easy access to Port Authority will open up a much larger area of NJ than just the ones close to the train stations - but the housing prices for good schools will still be up in the $800k range.

In either case, it should be doable from either end of the city - north or south.

+1

Driving to NYC isn’t a great idea. You’ll be spending at least $50/day for parking, sitting in ridiculous amounts of traffic, wasting gas, putting wear on your car, and sitting in a car mindlessly. Instead you can sit on a comfortable commuter train and get work done, read a book or watch a movie or tv. Long Island Railroad, Metro North and NJ transit commuter trains are comfortable and much nicer than NYC subways, so if you’re living in the suburbs you’ll have nice trains not subways. They’re very different.

When I lived on Long Island, I lived in western Nassau County. There was an express Long Island railroad train from my station that got to penn station in 34 minutes. The train station was a 5 minute drive from my house and penn station was a 15 minute walk to my office, so door to door I spent about an hour commuting. To make that same trip driving took about 1.5-1.75hrs each way and parking near my office was $40-50. The parking is much more expensive now. Also had to pay the toll at midtown tunnel which is $6 each way.

[ohai]

Some of the NYC suburbs are LOVELY. The problem is that with your salary you won’t be able to afford to live in a place like this. You’ll be in a more working class suburb with not as good of schools and/or living farther out. There is nothing wrong with these lower priced locations except why live here if you don’t have a compelling reason?

Agree. I was reading a lot of nice things in this thread about NY suburbs. However, none of that really applies to people with sub $200k income.

Also, NY property taxes are high and you have to pay for a lot of weather related housing expense that are largely absent in Seattle.

[a_movable_life]

I turned down a hospital position about 10 years ago. It would have been driving in from NJ to the Midtown at 3PM 1-2 hours because the transit commute on the way home at 1AM would have been 2-3 hours or 10-15 minutes by car. Add in 12 dollars in tolls and 25+ dollars for parking each way.

NYC tax is about another 1-2% on top of the NY State brackets. I know two well compensated friends who moved to NJ to save about 20-30K in income taxes since if you don't live in NYC you don't pay the tax.

I have a friend who lives in Stroudsburg PA, but commutes to NYC. It was supposed to be 4 days work from home. Now they sit on a bus for 2 hours each way each day usually 3-4 days a week. Work from home can change.

[ctuser1]

There are loads of economic reasons for moving to NYC even if you have to live in a suburb and don't much care for the cultural scene there!

Two words - flexibility and options!! The sheer size and depth of the economy, that too concentrated in a smallish area, offer a whole lot of flexibility!!

NYC is the hub of finance. And yet, Finance/Insurance is a bigger percent of US GDP than Wall Street is of NYC GDP!!

During 2008 downturn - our entire department was nixed just after Lehman tanked. We were 30 people in the IT team. Each and Every one of us were employed again within 2 months and most of them did not have to move!! Yes, this was while in the teeth of the recession. Imagine that in any other town.

DW was a homemaker. She wanted to jumpstart a professional career. Well - she found a community college 12 miles from home to pick up required classes, then enrolled in a reasonably good MSCS program 10 miles from home, then found a professional tech job 5 miles from home after graduation!!

California economy gets lots of well-deserved props. If you tried to calculate GDP per square mile - NE states (including Vermont/NH) would come out ahead. We have a bigger economy in a smaller area. NYC (and also Boston/Washington/Phily) metro area is even more concentrated within that!!

[FireSekr]

Some of the NYC suburbs are LOVELY. The problem is that with your salary you won’t be able to afford to live in a place like this. You’ll be in a more working class suburb with not as good of schools and/or living farther out. There is nothing wrong with these lower priced locations except why live here if you don’t have a compelling reason?

Agree. I was reading a lot of nice things in this thread about NY suburbs. However, none of that really applies to people with sub $200k income.

It’s much easier finding affordable housing in NY suburbs than it is near Seattle. In NYC area you can be within an hour train ride in a nice middle class area with houses in the $400-500k range. I lived in western Nassau county and there were plenty of homes in a nice middle class village within 400-600k range. In Seattle, you’ll get a 1 maybe 2 bd condo within 45 minute commute. Good luck finding a single family house for less than $600 within a 45 minute commute
Also, NY property taxes are high and you have to pay for a lot of weather related housing expense that are largely absent in Seattle.

A lot of posters are under the assumption that housing in Seattle is cheaper than NYC. That’s absolutely true comparing housing within the city.

But they don’t understand that housing in NYC suburbs is cheaper than the housing in Seattle suburbs. This is because NYC is connected to many more places by train and people can live further away from NYC and still have an hour commute. In Seattle, there are very few places within an hour commute especially with traffic increasing and further limiting how far from downtown Seattle you can go and still be there within an hour. Also, public transit in Seattle is pretty good but it’s by bus so the busses get stuck in traffic whereas trains in NYC area don’t have traffic. Yes, trains have issues of course but they’re pretty consistent.

Seattle suburbs along I-90 are the best bet to avoid the traffic on I-5, but even going out to Redmond which is a great suburb, the housing is out of OPs price range. Finding a single family home less than 600k will be very challenging and you really need to be in the 800-1.2M range to get something newer and clean. There are condos starting around $375k in that area

[core4portfolio]

+1 for NYC.

If you can work from home at least 2 days a week, then I'd suggest CT, NJ or upstate NY.

If schools are very important, then there are some ultra-competitive school districts in NJ that are very highly rated - much like a good school would look like in India or China. I personally don't like so much pressure on high-schoolers as it kills creativity in my opinion - but many people swear by it.

As far as NY State goes, many of the long island and east/west chester schools are fantastic e.g. Port Washington seems to produce National level Intel Talent Search finalists with alarming regularity.

CT may offer good schools + affordability. Everything with good schools in NJ/NY would cost a lot (think $1MM for house, and $25k/yr in taxes). Fairfield county in CT is similar (Greenwich/Darien/Westport/Fairfield). Housing prices would be similar to NJ/NY - ~800k to 1MM. You can also live on the south end of New Haven county if you are commuting only 2/3 days a week. Woodbridge/Orange have very good schools and are close to the new haven train line into Grand Central. If you like it more urban - Milford is good, and is the very first town in New Haven county. If you do this, the housing cost would drop below $500k. You can easily do $400k for a big SFH on half an acre, and may even be able to do $300k for a smaller SFH. Condos can be even cheaper if that is your thing. You would likely pay $6-7k in taxes/year as opposed to the $20k+ that all NJ/NYS residents seem to talk about.

I live in southern New Haven and commute in using Metro North. The train ride is comfortable and my door to door commute time to downtown (close to WTC) is 2hour and 5 minutes. This area is perfect for single earners intent on LBYM.

Thank you for detailed response. Its really helpful. I prefer to drive for 1 to 1.25 hours.
Work location is close to 23rd street station. Striking the balance of commute, budget and good school looks like a big challenge in NYC.
I will check on these location with spouse and pick one. Thanks again

You won’t be able to commute to/from NYC via car.

Over 10 years ago, a parking spot in my building in midtown Manhattan was $1k per month.

I will use train and bus. Understood car is very costly and tolls + heavy traffic sitting

[Atilla]

NYC winters are no picnic; but I think I'd go crazy with the lack of sun in Seattle. I'll take cold and clear winter days over warmer cloudy fog for days on end.

We did use the Metro North train during a visit to NYC last month. Made the run up to Beacon NY. The trains are very decent and run frequently. The scenery is nice upstate.

I don't imagine it would be too hard to find a decent place to live and take the train in on days you have to. It would be small town living if you go the upstate direction, but with pretty easy access to the city.

Manhattan is officially smellier than the French Quarter, and that's saying something.

[Que1999]

Hi Friends

Family of 3. Single earner. Spouse not working. 4 yr old kid. Currently in Richmond VA
I got 2 job offers on my table. I need to pick one but not sure which one.

Job offer 1 at NYC itself at a Bank:
142k base + 10% bonus
401k match - 6%
Flexible WFH upto 3 or 5 days per week.
Interesting job with new technologies


Job offer 2 at Seattle downtown at an Insurance company

150k Base + 12.5% bonus + 6k relocation assistance
401k match - 4%
May be 1 or 2 days maximum WFH allowed but not sure

Going to new technologies but still not.

Both are IT programmer jobs and stable Fortune 500 company.
Offer match is not possible and no further negotiation possible.

Both are like take it or leave it.

Kid going to public school next year.
Which one to pick ?

I know both cities very well. This is an easy choice. I would choose the Seattle job.

I live and work in NYC. Go for the Seattle job. NYC is NOT in a good place right now.... Can't get into the politics of it here obviously but stay away if you have the option.

[FireSekr]

Hi Friends

Family of 3. Single earner. Spouse not working. 4 yr old kid. Currently in Richmond VA
I got 2 job offers on my table. I need to pick one but not sure which one.

Job offer 1 at NYC itself at a Bank:
142k base + 10% bonus
401k match - 6%
Flexible WFH upto 3 or 5 days per week.
Interesting job with new technologies


Job offer 2 at Seattle downtown at an Insurance company

150k Base + 12.5% bonus + 6k relocation assistance
401k match - 4%
May be 1 or 2 days maximum WFH allowed but not sure

Going to new technologies but still not.

Both are IT programmer jobs and stable Fortune 500 company.
Offer match is not possible and no further negotiation possible.

Both are like take it or leave it.

Kid going to public school next year.
Which one to pick ?

I know both cities very well. This is an easy choice. I would choose the Seattle job.

I live and work in NYC. Go for the Seattle job. NYC is NOT in a good place right now.... Can't get into the politics of it here obviously but stay away if you have the option.

Agree that NYC is facing many problems that are reducing the quality of life, but I can assure you having lived in both, Seattle is far worse. I've never been afraid for my safety in NYC but in Seattle I was constantly seeing things that put me on edge because the homeless there are much more aggressive and have serious mental issues. NY definitely has a problem, but you don't see the sort of aggression and violence because the worst people are treated...in Seattle they're left to their own devices.

http://komonews.com/news/local/komo-new ... e-is-dying

[Sam1]

Some of the NYC suburbs are LOVELY. The problem is that with your salary you won’t be able to afford to live in a place like this. You’ll be in a more working class suburb with not as good of schools and/or living farther out. There is nothing wrong with these lower priced locations except why live here if you don’t have a compelling reason?

Agree. I was reading a lot of nice things in this thread about NY suburbs. However, none of that really applies to people with sub $200k income.

It’s much easier finding affordable housing in NY suburbs than it is near Seattle. In NYC area you can be within an hour train ride in a nice middle class area with houses in the $400-500k range. I lived in western Nassau county and there were plenty of homes in a nice middle class village within 400-600k range. In Seattle, you’ll get a 1 maybe 2 bd condo within 45 minute commute. Good luck finding a single family house for less than $600 within a 45 minute commute
Also, NY property taxes are high and you have to pay for a lot of weather related housing expense that are largely absent in Seattle.

A lot of posters are under the assumption that housing in Seattle is cheaper than NYC. That’s absolutely true comparing housing within the city.

But they don’t understand that housing in NYC suburbs is cheaper than the housing in Seattle suburbs. This is because NYC is connected to many more places by train and people can live further away from NYC and still have an hour commute. In Seattle, there are very few places within an hour commute especially with traffic increasing and further limiting how far from downtown Seattle you can go and still be there within an hour. Also, public transit in Seattle is pretty good but it’s by bus so the busses get stuck in traffic whereas trains in NYC area don’t have traffic. Yes, trains have issues of course but they’re pretty consistent.

Seattle suburbs along I-90 are the best bet to avoid the traffic on I-5, but even going out to Redmond which is a great suburb, the housing is out of OPs price range. Finding a single family home less than 600k will be very challenging and you really need to be in the 800-1.2M range to get something newer and clean. There are condos starting around $375k in that area

I question there are nice middle class areas with homes from 400-600k in the NY metro area. That seems very low for the NY metro area. I’m from a LCOL city and even there a middle class neighborhood is 300-400k.

We looked at nicer towns in NJ and NY and don’t remember finding any 3-4 bedroom houses under $1 million. These “starter” homes also came with steep property taxes - 5 figures. Based on the fact these towns were still a long commute, I can’t imagine where these commutable towns of $400-600k homes would even be!

I will give you that since OP only has to go into the office one day a week that he or she can manage a long train ride. That greatly reduces housing costs.

I would be concerned with a 1.5 hour commute each way because what happens if OP wants to change jobs and the new job requires one to come into the office every day?

[Sam1]

Hi Friends

Family of 3. Single earner. Spouse not working. 4 yr old kid. Currently in Richmond VA
I got 2 job offers on my table. I need to pick one but not sure which one.

Job offer 1 at NYC itself at a Bank:
142k base + 10% bonus
401k match - 6%
Flexible WFH upto 3 or 5 days per week.
Interesting job with new technologies


Job offer 2 at Seattle downtown at an Insurance company

150k Base + 12.5% bonus + 6k relocation assistance
401k match - 4%
May be 1 or 2 days maximum WFH allowed but not sure

Going to new technologies but still not.

Both are IT programmer jobs and stable Fortune 500 company.
Offer match is not possible and no further negotiation possible.

Both are like take it or leave it.

Kid going to public school next year.
Which one to pick ?

I know both cities very well. This is an easy choice. I would choose the Seattle job.

I live and work in NYC. Go for the Seattle job. NYC is NOT in a good place right now.... Can't get into the politics of it here obviously but stay away if you have the option.

Agree that NYC is facing many problems that are reducing the quality of life, but I can assure you having lived in both, Seattle is far worse. I've never been afraid for my safety in NYC but in Seattle I was constantly seeing things that put me on edge because the homeless there are much more aggressive and have serious mental issues. NY definitely has a problem, but you don't see the sort of aggression and violence because the worst people are treated...in Seattle they're left to their own devices.

http://komonews.com/news/local/komo-new ... e-is-dying

I say go with neither!! Find another job in a city with lower housing costs and without issues like we are reading about on this board.

NY - Crazy property taxes, expensive housing, long commutes, bad weather

Seattle - bad traffic, expensive housing for the salaries, crazy homeless people

[FireSekr]

Some of the NYC suburbs are LOVELY. The problem is that with your salary you won’t be able to afford to live in a place like this. You’ll be in a more working class suburb with not as good of schools and/or living farther out. There is nothing wrong with these lower priced locations except why live here if you don’t have a compelling reason?

Agree. I was reading a lot of nice things in this thread about NY suburbs. However, none of that really applies to people with sub $200k income.

It’s much easier finding affordable housing in NY suburbs than it is near Seattle. In NYC area you can be within an hour train ride in a nice middle class area with houses in the $400-500k range. I lived in western Nassau county and there were plenty of homes in a nice middle class village within 400-600k range. In Seattle, you’ll get a 1 maybe 2 bd condo within 45 minute commute. Good luck finding a single family house for less than $600 within a 45 minute commute
Also, NY property taxes are high and you have to pay for a lot of weather related housing expense that are largely absent in Seattle.

A lot of posters are under the assumption that housing in Seattle is cheaper than NYC. That’s absolutely true comparing housing within the city.

But they don’t understand that housing in NYC suburbs is cheaper than the housing in Seattle suburbs. This is because NYC is connected to many more places by train and people can live further away from NYC and still have an hour commute. In Seattle, there are very few places within an hour commute especially with traffic increasing and further limiting how far from downtown Seattle you can go and still be there within an hour. Also, public transit in Seattle is pretty good but it’s by bus so the busses get stuck in traffic whereas trains in NYC area don’t have traffic. Yes, trains have issues of course but they’re pretty consistent.

Seattle suburbs along I-90 are the best bet to avoid the traffic on I-5, but even going out to Redmond which is a great suburb, the housing is out of OPs price range. Finding a single family home less than 600k will be very challenging and you really need to be in the 800-1.2M range to get something newer and clean. There are condos starting around $375k in that area

I question there are nice middle class areas with homes from 400-600k in the NY metro area. That seems very low for the NY metro area. I’m from a LCOL city and even there a middle class neighborhood is 300-400k.

We looked at nicer towns in NJ and NY and don’t remember finding any 3-4 bedroom houses under $1 million. These “starter” homes also came with steep property taxes - 5 figures. Based on the fact these towns were still a long commute, I can’t imagine where these commutable towns of $400-600k homes would even be!

I will give you that since OP only has to go into the office one day a week that he or she can manage a long train ride. That greatly reduces housing costs.

I would be concerned with a 1.5 hour commute each way because what happens if OP wants to change jobs and the new job requires one to come into the office every day?

Lynbrook, Malverne, and some parts of Rockville Centre on Long Island are much cheaper than what you're suggesting and within an hour commute of NYC. They are nice communities with good schools and very safe. They all have their own police departments too, rather than relying on the nassau county PD like some of the other areas. Here are some houses I found with a quick search. They may need some updating but overall they're nice houses and they have a decent sized yard.

https://www.trulia.com/p/ny/malverne/6- ... 2089052869
https://www.trulia.com/p/ny/lynbrook/50 ... 2010390086
https://www.trulia.com/p/ny/malverne/21 ... 2010393459

There are definitely other areas of Long Island which have similar commutes and similar neighborhoods besides these, I just know these well enough to speak to them, but certainly there are more options that I haven't mentioned.

In the Seattle area, houses tend to be much larger relative to the plot of land, so you may have a 1500sq ft house, but you'll have no front or backyard whereas these places you have a decent sized yard and lower cost. Any of these houses with this size property would cost about $150k more in Redmond WA area, $200-300k more in Kirkland or Bellevue.

The other thing to factor is that in NY suburban areas, you're paying list price or lower for the houses. In Seattle area, there are still bidding wars and people are offering above asking in many cases, although that has cooled down over the last 2 years.

[Moneta]

I've never been to New York, but I moved to Seattle in 1999 and love it here. Yes, it has problems, but I'm OK with the balance of pros and cons that I find here. And it's a huge upgrade from my Midwest roots.

Re transit: Consider looking for a place to rent near a light rail station, assuming the potential job is located in downtown Seattle, and train up to the city for your job. Since the train has dedicated right-of-way, it doesn't have to sit in car traffic like the buses do. Right now, there are stations to the south. Three new light rail stations are due to come online in the north in 2021.

https://www.soundtransit.org/system-exp ... -extension

[ctuser1]

I would be concerned with a 1.5 hour commute each way because what happens if OP wants to change jobs and the new job requires one to come into the office every day?

Commuting by train is a very different thing compared to driving, or even bus!

Tons of people do 2-hour each way commute to NYC!! I currently work from home a lot, but have done everyday commute to office for years as well. If I start a new job, I expect to go to office every day. I take the train from very close to it's starting point (in my case, New Haven). This means I always get a seat - and the seats are very spacious (much more so than any buses I have seen).

When coming back, just reach GCT 15 minutes before the train starts (or skip the train leaving immediately and take the next one) and you will get a comfortable seat.

I have done M-Th travel by flight for years, and let me just say it is way more comfortable than that!! I have also done a 50 minute to 1 hour drive commute for 6 months. Same thing! The train commute is preferable to me!

I can read on the train, and even work if I want to!!

So yes, I am out of my home a lot longer. Typically I am out of my home by 7 and back only by 8pm!! But this commute is much more comfortable and doable compared to what rest of the US understands as "commute".

[Sam1]

I would be concerned with a 1.5 hour commute each way because what happens if OP wants to change jobs and the new job requires one to come into the office every day?

Commuting by train is a very different thing compared to driving, or even bus!

Tons of people do 2-hour each way commute to NYC!! I currently work from home a lot, but have done everyday commute to office for years as well. If I start a new job, I expect to go to office every day. I take the train from very close to it's starting point (in my case, New Haven). This means I always get a seat - and the seats are very spacious (much more so than any buses I have seen).

When coming back, just reach GCT 15 minutes before the train starts (or skip the train leaving immediately and take the next one) and you will get a comfortable seat.

I have done M-Th travel by flight for years, and let me just say it is way more comfortable than that!! I have also done a 50 minute to 1 hour drive commute for 6 months. Same thing! The train commute is preferable to me!

I can read on the train, and even work if I want to!!

So yes, I am out of my home a lot longer. Typically I am out of my home by 7 and back only by 8pm!! But this commute is much more comfortable and doable compared to what rest of the US understands as "commute".

I lived in NY for years and I’m perfectly aware that some people spend 4 hours a day on a train. That doesn’t mean it’s okay or something OP should try and do.

[quantAndHold]

Rent is more like $3k+ in Seattle for a decent 2 bedroom. I just relocated and am having trouble finding somewhere with a $3k budget close to South Lake Union.

I looked on Northern seattle like Northgate and GreenLake

You can’t afford Greenlake, and Northgate isn’t very nice, at least not the parts that can be had for <$2000.

If you’re driving downtown and your employer doesn’t subsidize parking, figure at least $300/month for parking. Probably more, but it depends on what part of downtown. If you have to drive over a bridge, figure $150/month for that. Walking onto a ferry is about that, too.

You can take a commuter bus, but I’ve heard tell that you have to be at a lot of the park and rides by 6:30 to get a parking space.

Will your employer give you an Orca card? If you can live where you can take transit, this will cut your commute costs mightily, even if you have to pay for it yourself.

Also, if you’re working downtown, try to live on the same side of downtown as you work. Getting through downtown can add a lot of time to the commute, unless you can take the light rail.

[protagonist]

Realize that Seattle (and metro area) is VERY DIFFERENT than NYC (and metro area), and people tend to be very divided about living in/around NYC (some love it, some hate it).

Thus, take opinions here with a grain of salt. Spend enough time visiting both and then decide which most speaks to you and your needs. And of course, consider the job aspect too.

[core4portfolio]

OP here: Chosen Seattle and moved to Issaquah area.
1 hour bus commute to downtown but still okay.
Thanks for all the advise.
Used ABF relocube to pack items
Shipped the car through broker but came with no issues

[KyleAAA]

OP here: Chosen Seattle and moved to Issaquah area.
1 hour bus commute to downtown but still okay.
Thanks for all the advise.
Used ABF relocube to pack items
Shipped the car through broker but came with no issues

Welcome to Seattle! Your commute should get much easier once the light rail across the lake is completed in however many years. Lots of tech companies in Bellevue as well if you want to make a jump in a year or two for higher pay.

[beyou]

Smart move. Banks are moving IT jobs away from NYC.
JPM just announced they would do so, and many other smaller firms are in progress. They are moving to LCOL areas scattered around the US. You could have moved here and been asked to relocate away. At the very least, the other opportunities in NYC are dwindling so you would be stuck with your employer even if they don’t move but their competitors do.