Relocate to Seattle or NYC

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Topic Author
core4portfolio
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Relocate to Seattle or NYC

Post by core4portfolio » Fri Jun 28, 2019 5:34 pm

Hi Friends

Family of 3. Single earner. Spouse not working and not planned for next few years. 4 yr old kid. Currently in Richmond VA
I got 2 job offers on my table. I need to pick one but not sure which one.

Edit 3: Current pay is 103k and no bonus, 3% 401k match, current apartment rent is $1145, 10% on ESPP

Job offer 1 at NYC itself at a Bank:
142k base + 10% bonus
401k match - 6%
Flexible WFH upto 3 or 5 days per week.
Interesting job with new technologies


Job offer 2 at Seattle downtown at an Insurance company

150k Base + 12.5% bonus + 6k relocation assistance
401k match - 4% AND also pension plan with 5% of pay
May be 1 or 2 days maximum WFH allowed but not sure

Going to new technologies but still not.

Both are IT programmer jobs and stable Fortune 500 company.
Offer match is not possible and no further negotiation possible.

Both are like take it or leave it.

Kid going to public school next year.
Which one to pick ?

Edit: If we move either city , we live in Suburbs only and not in actual city itself.
Probably Edison NJ or Bellevue WA like that.

Edit2: Iam not planning to buy home. So only going to rent for next few years to see if NYC or Seattle really liked by family.
I rarely eat outside may be once a month. I love driving car, swimming but no hiking or trial walks.
Not a huge fan of shopping or going movies or going to clubs.
I go for costco, farmers market, whole foods, target,walmart and a mall where kohls, JCP, Macys
My spare time is mostly play with my kid nowadays.


Final update: Chosen Seattle and moved to Issaquah area.
1 hour bus commute to downtown but still okay. 2 days WFH
Thanks for all the advise.
Last edited by core4portfolio on Sat Nov 23, 2019 12:37 pm, edited 9 times in total.
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Watty
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Re: Relocate to Seattle or NYC

Post by Watty » Fri Jun 28, 2019 5:43 pm

It would be good to do dummy tax returns to find out what your after tax income would be like.

Washington does not have a state income tax and as I recall in NYC you would not only have state taxes but also a city income tax.

NYC has always been expensive and Seattle has gotten a lot more expensive too especially right downtown. I would suspect that you would have a hard time finding a nice place to live with good schools on those incomes in either city.

It might be a good idea to keep looking for some lower cost of living area.

runner3081
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Re: Relocate to Seattle or NYC

Post by runner3081 » Fri Jun 28, 2019 5:48 pm

Seattle is having some pretty major growing pains these days. No way would I suggest someone move there, especially having to work downtown.

aristotelian
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Re: Relocate to Seattle or NYC

Post by aristotelian » Fri Jun 28, 2019 6:28 pm

runner3081 wrote:
Fri Jun 28, 2019 5:48 pm
Seattle is having some pretty major growing pains these days. No way would I suggest someone move there, especially having to work downtown.
Growing pains would be an understatement for NYC.

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tennisplyr
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Re: Relocate to Seattle or NYC

Post by tennisplyr » Fri Jun 28, 2019 6:32 pm

Having lived in the suburbs of NYC and worked in NYC most of my adult life, I am partial to it. Only visited Seattle a couple of times and it seems like a pleasant enough place. But hey, NY is NY and there's nothing quite like it.
Those who move forward with a happy spirit will find that things always work out.

lostinjersey
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Re: Relocate to Seattle or NYC

Post by lostinjersey » Fri Jun 28, 2019 6:33 pm

I mean, neither is cheap, but your salary will go a lot further in Seattle than NYC (I have lived in both metros, currently in SEA).

vladb
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Re: Relocate to Seattle or NYC

Post by vladb » Fri Jun 28, 2019 6:34 pm

core4portfolio wrote:
Fri Jun 28, 2019 5:34 pm
Which one to pick ?
I'd say financially the offers are close enough that you should instead focus on other considerations, like:
* Which do you think is more likely to make you happier, motivated, etc? This is surprisingly often overlooked.
* Which is likely to give you better options in the future, say, 2 years from now? Which one would project better career growth on your resume?
* If it happens that you soon realize you made the wrong choice, which of the cities has better selection of other employers in your domain?
* Does your spouse plan to work in the future? If yes, where would (s)he likely have better employment options?

Of course you can't answer those questions precisely, but a best-effort estimate might be enough to make the right choice.

Trader Joe
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Re: Relocate to Seattle or NYC

Post by Trader Joe » Fri Jun 28, 2019 6:37 pm

core4portfolio wrote:
Fri Jun 28, 2019 5:34 pm
Hi Friends

Family of 3. Single earner. Spouse not working. 4 yr old kid. Currently in Richmond VA
I got 2 job offers on my table. I need to pick one but not sure which one.

Job offer 1 at NYC itself at a Bank:
142k base + 10% bonus
401k match - 6%
Flexible WFH upto 3 or 5 days per week.
Interesting job with new technologies


Job offer 2 at Seattle downtown at an Insurance company

150k Base + 12.5% bonus + 6k relocation assistance
401k match - 4%
May be 1 or 2 days maximum WFH allowed but not sure

Going to new technologies but still not.

Both are IT programmer jobs and stable Fortune 500 company.
Offer match is not possible and no further negotiation possible.

Both are like take it or leave it.

Kid going to public school next year.
Which one to pick ?
I know both cities very well. This is an easy choice. I would choose the Seattle job.

CurlyDave
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Re: Relocate to Seattle or NYC

Post by CurlyDave » Fri Jun 28, 2019 6:45 pm

Trader Joe wrote:
Fri Jun 28, 2019 6:37 pm

...I know both cities very well. This is an easy choice. I would choose the Seattle job.
I agree. Seattle is lower COL -- not low by any stretch of the imagination, but lower than NYC.

If you were young and single NYC might have some attraction for that scene, but with a 4 year old kid, Seattle is a much better bet.

Plus the salary is higher. If this is not your final job, you will be able to negotiate the next one from a stronger position.

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AerialWombat
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Re: Relocate to Seattle or NYC

Post by AerialWombat » Fri Jun 28, 2019 7:00 pm

To me, personally, this isn’t even a question.

I despise NYC with a burning passion. There is no amount of money — literally, it doesn’t exist— that could possibly entice me to live there. Ever. I’d rather live on welfare in a trailer in a dusty desert town in Texas than be a billionaire in NYC.

Seattle, while it does have problems, is better in every way imaginable (to me).

Lower COL, better schools, nicer people, lower taxes, less business regulation, far better weather, just as good restaurants and entertainment (if not better, depending on preferences), cleaner streets, cleaner air, cleaner water, fewer people. I could go on and on.

London
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Re: Relocate to Seattle or NYC

Post by London » Fri Jun 28, 2019 7:03 pm

I’m shocked there is a bank in NYC that allows that much WFH. If that’s the case, you don’t need to live in NYC proper. You can find a lower cost suburb a little further out than if you needed to go in every day.

Blue456
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Re: Relocate to Seattle or NYC

Post by Blue456 » Fri Jun 28, 2019 7:08 pm

AerialWombat wrote:
Fri Jun 28, 2019 7:00 pm
To me, personally, this isn’t even a question.

I despise NYC with a burning passion. There is no amount of money — literally, it doesn’t exist— that could possibly entice me to live there. Ever. I’d rather live on welfare in a trailer in a dusty desert town in Texas than be a billionaire in NYC.

Seattle, while it does have problems, is better in every way imaginable (to me).

Lower COL, better schools, nicer people, lower taxes, less business regulation, far better weather, just as good restaurants and entertainment (if not better, depending on preferences), cleaner streets, cleaner air, cleaner water, fewer people. I could go on and on.
Funny. I feel the same. Happily moving out this summer down south. Lower cost of living, cleaner streets, no rats, no graffiti, no trash, I can go on and on too.

Lookingforanswers
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Re: Relocate to Seattle or NYC

Post by Lookingforanswers » Fri Jun 28, 2019 7:17 pm

I have lived multiple places, spent a lot of time in NYC (and have relatives there), and have spent a dozen years now in Seattle.

Some considerations:

- COL is much lower in Seattle (esp. including taxes).
- Seattle by far is one of the best major cities in the US for being close to outdoor activities (skiing, hiking, water sports, cycling, snow shoeing, mountaineering, etc.). When my kids were young they were in ski school on Saturdays, took rock climbing lessons, took sailing lessons in the summer, etc. All very doable from a city or suburban location.
- Though Seattle has "growing pains" the locals are really complaining vs. where Seattle was 10 or 20 years ago. Modern day Seattle still less congested than other cities.
- You are close to lots of fabulous west coast destinations (Montana, Wyoming, Oregon, British Columbia). Lots to do in a day's drive.
- If you are in technology, the job market is very, very hot. Local tech companies fight each other to hire tech talent.
- I like the weather. Winters are gray, but not cold/icy in the city. Yet you can drive up to the mountains for snow. Summers are beautiful.

Downsides:

- Cultural institutions exist but not at the scale of NYC (museums, classical music, art museums, etc.).
- Geographic distances if you have close friends/family on the East Coast or Midwest. This is the single biggest downside to me; it's a real journey to get to the East Coast.
Last edited by Lookingforanswers on Fri Jun 28, 2019 7:19 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Arlington2019
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Re: Relocate to Seattle or NYC

Post by Arlington2019 » Fri Jun 28, 2019 7:19 pm

I am one of the few-remaining Seattle-area natives, and have been here for 60 years. The changes in traffic, housing prices, the homeless population and crime are staggering to one who has been here for any length of time. If you come to Seattle, look to North of downtown or east of Lake Washington in terms of good housing and school districts. The Eastside (Bellevue, Redmond, Kirkland) are the local tech centers in terms of living and working. There is good rapid transit access from the Eastside to downtown, if your office ends up being downtown.

Gnirk
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Re: Relocate to Seattle or NYC

Post by Gnirk » Fri Jun 28, 2019 7:20 pm

runner3081 wrote:
Fri Jun 28, 2019 5:48 pm
Seattle is having some pretty major growing pains these days. No way would I suggest someone move there, especially having to work downtown.
Yes, Seattle has growing pains. However, my single, adult daughters both work in downtown Seattle and take public transportation, and have done so for years.
Housing is pricey, though. The 1200 SF 1908- built house with no garage and no driveway, or place for one, on the north slope of Queen Anne Hill that we bought for $16,500 in the late 60's recently sold for $960,000. Minimal updating.

Although I haven't lived in the city of Seattle for years, I wouldn't live anywhere else other than the Pacific Northwest.

7eight9
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Re: Relocate to Seattle or NYC

Post by 7eight9 » Fri Jun 28, 2019 7:22 pm

I'll preface my remarks by saying that I've never been to Seattle. Nor ever had the urge to visit. My wife has been there. Flying fish. Big deal.

I lived in New York City back in the late 1980s / early-mid 1990s. My sister lives there today.

You may remember the classic New Yorker magazine cover View of the World from 9th Avenue --- https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/View_of_t ... 9th_Avenue

Pretty much accurate in my opinion having lived outside the City for the past 24 years. Nothing compares to New York (in the United States).

Go to New York. You won't regret it.
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stoptothink
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Re: Relocate to Seattle or NYC

Post by stoptothink » Fri Jun 28, 2019 7:23 pm

Blue456 wrote:
Fri Jun 28, 2019 7:08 pm
AerialWombat wrote:
Fri Jun 28, 2019 7:00 pm
To me, personally, this isn’t even a question.

I despise NYC with a burning passion. There is no amount of money — literally, it doesn’t exist— that could possibly entice me to live there. Ever. I’d rather live on welfare in a trailer in a dusty desert town in Texas than be a billionaire in NYC.

Seattle, while it does have problems, is better in every way imaginable (to me).

Lower COL, better schools, nicer people, lower taxes, less business regulation, far better weather, just as good restaurants and entertainment (if not better, depending on preferences), cleaner streets, cleaner air, cleaner water, fewer people. I could go on and on.
Funny. I feel the same. Happily moving out this summer down south. Lower cost of living, cleaner streets, no rats, no graffiti, no trash, I can go on and on too.
Shocked that I found two people that agree with my extreme dislike for NYC. I am not exactly a fan of the Seattle area either, but there are two cities in the continental U.S. that I wouldn't move to under almost any circumstances: NYC and New Orleans.

The WFH is enticing (my freedom to work from home about half the time - whenever I am not publicly representing the company - is a huge bonus), but otherwise this is a complete no-brainer.

Topic Author
core4portfolio
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Re: Relocate to Seattle or NYC

Post by core4portfolio » Fri Jun 28, 2019 7:56 pm

London wrote:
Fri Jun 28, 2019 7:03 pm
I’m shocked there is a bank in NYC that allows that much WFH. If that’s the case, you don’t need to live in NYC proper. You can find a lower cost suburb a little further out than if you needed to go in every day.
Iam really surprised when heard but they do allowed and I asked during interview with hiring manager as well as colleagues.
If I move to woodbridge or Brunswick --> do they really consider as LCOL or you have any suggestions with good school area ??
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jebmke
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Re: Relocate to Seattle or NYC

Post by jebmke » Fri Jun 28, 2019 8:06 pm

Watty wrote:
Fri Jun 28, 2019 5:43 pm
It would be good to do dummy tax returns to find out what your after tax income would be like.
This may not be a trivial hit - definitely worth doing a pro-forma return. NY, NJ and CT all have a pretty high income tax. Not sure how the NYC tax works for non-NYC residents but I don't think it is helpful. I think all three rate worse than my state (MD) and the hit here is ~8%+ once your income gets up anywhere. My brother lives in NYC and I think I remember him telling me his combined rate for NY and NYC was around 14%. And don't forget the state income tax deduction on your federal is capped.
When you discover that you are riding a dead horse, the best strategy is to dismount.

Blue456
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Re: Relocate to Seattle or NYC

Post by Blue456 » Fri Jun 28, 2019 8:25 pm

core4portfolio wrote:
Fri Jun 28, 2019 5:34 pm
Hi Friends

Family of 3. Single earner. Spouse not working. 4 yr old kid. Currently in Richmond VA
I got 2 job offers on my table. I need to pick one but not sure which one.

Job offer 1 at NYC itself at a Bank:
142k base + 10% bonus
401k match - 6%
Flexible WFH upto 3 or 5 days per week.
Interesting job with new technologies


Job offer 2 at Seattle downtown at an Insurance company

150k Base + 12.5% bonus + 6k relocation assistance
401k match - 4%
May be 1 or 2 days maximum WFH allowed but not sure

Going to new technologies but still not.

Both are IT programmer jobs and stable Fortune 500 company.
Offer match is not possible and no further negotiation possible.

Both are like take it or leave it.

Kid going to public school next year.
Which one to pick ?
https://smartasset.com/taxes/paycheck-calculator

Plug in your numbers.

GreenerPastures
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Re: Relocate to Seattle or NYC

Post by GreenerPastures » Fri Jun 28, 2019 8:32 pm

Interesting to read posts. I've lived in both cities, NYC for 8 glorious years in 80s-90s, but chose to make Seattle home. In terms of economics, no question you should choose Seattle. Costs, taxes are much cheaper in Seattle. But I always say, I never understood the meaning of "conservation" until I moved to Seattle because where I'd lived before (BoshWash corridor) there was nothing to conserve. Seattle has been a great place to raise our children, great, thriving economy, absolutely beautiful mountains and dramatic water views. Every time we cross one of our bridges going into Seattle, we marvel at the beauty before us, and my spouse says, "a little different from Wilmington DE, eh?

livesoft
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Re: Relocate to Seattle or NYC

Post by livesoft » Fri Jun 28, 2019 8:40 pm

The OP currently lives in Richmond, VA. I am wondering why they are even asking the question they are asking. Did they even visit either place? Is there something not stated such as spouse is from NYC?

Full disclosure: I lived near NYC for many years and have visited Seattle many times. I have a clear preference between the two cities.
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London
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Re: Relocate to Seattle or NYC

Post by London » Fri Jun 28, 2019 8:42 pm

core4portfolio wrote:
Fri Jun 28, 2019 7:56 pm
London wrote:
Fri Jun 28, 2019 7:03 pm
I’m shocked there is a bank in NYC that allows that much WFH. If that’s the case, you don’t need to live in NYC proper. You can find a lower cost suburb a little further out than if you needed to go in every day.
Iam really surprised when heard but they do allowed and I asked during interview with hiring manager as well as colleagues.
If I move to woodbridge or Brunswick --> do they really consider as LCOL or you have any suggestions with good school area ??
South Brunswick has good schools and is not that expensive. I wouldn’t want to commute from there everyday but once a week wouldn’t be too bad.

livesoft
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Re: Relocate to Seattle or NYC

Post by livesoft » Fri Jun 28, 2019 8:48 pm

Arlington2019 wrote:
Fri Jun 28, 2019 7:19 pm
The changes in traffic, housing prices, the homeless population and crime are staggering to one who has been here for any length of time.
I read that sentence and thought: That applies to almost every place in the entire world.
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abyan
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Re: Relocate to Seattle or NYC

Post by abyan » Fri Jun 28, 2019 9:01 pm

I lived in NYC for a few years a few years back, love the place, but it is expensive, especially housing and taxes. Even out in Queens, a cheap 1 bedroom in a building I didn't want to live in would have cost me $2300 a month -- instead it cost me $3300 per month, and I was still in Queens, and not Manhattan! And while some people try to claim that even $200k isn't much in NYC, which I find a bit of an absurd claim, $142k for a three-person family is obviously doable, people do it all the time, but that's the kind of salary I'd want as a single person living in NYC with a good professional job -- not for 3 people. I wish I knew what taxes were like in Seattle to compare, but I know NYC, they're a lot! I find NYC an amazing place, but boy it's a different place than Seattle -- I assume you and your spouse have visited both cities recently, so at least you know if you'd even like the place?

Topic Author
core4portfolio
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Re: Relocate to Seattle or NYC

Post by core4portfolio » Fri Jun 28, 2019 9:21 pm

livesoft wrote:
Fri Jun 28, 2019 8:40 pm
The OP currently lives in Richmond, VA. I am wondering why they are even asking the question they are asking. Did they even visit either place? Is there something not stated such as spouse is from NYC?

Full disclosure: I lived near NYC for many years and have visited Seattle many times. I have a clear preference between the two cities.
I have visited NYC twice but never visited Seattle. My spouse also visited NYC.
We are not from USA and so we visited as a visitor for a week in NYC but not for job
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random_walker_77
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Re: Relocate to Seattle or NYC

Post by random_walker_77 » Fri Jun 28, 2019 9:30 pm

abyan wrote:
Fri Jun 28, 2019 9:01 pm
I wish I knew what taxes were like in Seattle to compare, but I know NYC, they're a lot!
That's an easy one. There's no state income tax return because there's no state income tax.

(seattle tried to add a city income tax, but that one is tied up in court, and possibly dead:
https://www.seattletimes.com/seattle-ne ... ncome-tax/)

Seattle is beautiful, but isn't anywhere as populous as NYC. You're not going to have the same amount of cultural opportunities, but the outdoors are readily available. There's a reason why everyone is so pale there -- and note that not everyone can handle the lack of sunshine and the really long winter days.

[edit: oh look, and appropriate to the subject, this is my 737th post. Since the Boeing 737 is assembled locally in my hometown]
Last edited by random_walker_77 on Fri Jun 28, 2019 9:33 pm, edited 1 time in total.

abyan
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Re: Relocate to Seattle or NYC

Post by abyan » Fri Jun 28, 2019 9:31 pm

Just re-read your post, and NJ is definitely cheaper than looking at NYC, even Queens. What makes this especially hard is that NYC is either magical or it's not. It really just depends on what you two like. I just wish the salary was a bit more for a 3-person family. (Again, not that there aren''t plenty of blue collar families in the NYC area).

I'd be curious for you to work out a budget -- what ARE the comparable rents for Seattle and Edison, NJ, for example? Also, if you're in Edison NJ, then you're not really in NYC, are you? That's another consideration -- you'll be living in Edison. Maybe compare that to Seattle. Seattle could end up being far more interesting than Edison.

I guess it also depends on your long-term plans. Will you be job-hopping? If so, are there more opportunities for your kind of work in NYC than Seattle? Can you trade up to a better salary as time goes on in NYC?

PS No state or city taxes?! Man...

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Re: Relocate to Seattle or NYC

Post by Sandtrap » Fri Jun 28, 2019 9:42 pm

Salaries are similar so. . .

Family, recreation, down time, climate, interesting things within driving distance for family oriented outings that don't cost a fortune, culture (big one), what the children will grow up remembering, traffic, congestion, ease of getting around for everyone in the family, etc, etc.

Seattle.

I would take the entire family and visit each place. Spend at least a week or 2 doing regular life things, not touristy things.
Pretend like you're living there.
It's important that the whole family be on board.

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Re: Relocate to Seattle or NYC

Post by drk » Fri Jun 28, 2019 10:50 pm

If those are final numbers, you'll make a lot more money in Seattle. While NYC is a better city, Seattle is a much better area. It depends on your priorities, ultimately. If NYC is interesting to you, though, I would take the Seattle numbers to the bank and tell them to improve their offer.

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core4portfolio
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Re: Relocate to Seattle or NYC

Post by core4portfolio » Sat Jun 29, 2019 5:35 am

abyan wrote:
Fri Jun 28, 2019 9:31 pm
Just re-read your post, and NJ is definitely cheaper than looking at NYC, even Queens. What makes this especially hard is that NYC is either magical or it's not. It really just depends on what you two like. I just wish the salary was a bit more for a 3-person family. (Again, not that there aren''t plenty of blue collar families in the NYC area).

I'd be curious for you to work out a budget -- what ARE the comparable rents for Seattle and Edison, NJ, for example? Also, if you're in Edison NJ, then you're not really in NYC, are you? That's another consideration -- you'll be living in Edison. Maybe compare that to Seattle. Seattle could end up being far more interesting than Edison.

I guess it also depends on your long-term plans. Will you be job-hopping? If so, are there more opportunities for your kind of work in NYC than Seattle? Can you trade up to a better salary as time goes on in NYC?

PS No state or city taxes?! Man...
I plan to live in suburbs only. For some reason I hate huge crowd :( . I have target rent set at 1800 to 2000 budget and both Seattle subrurbs and NJ are fit well for this. Iam not a job hopper however my resume says I change employer every 4 years
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Re: Relocate to Seattle or NYC

Post by cadreamer2015 » Sat Jun 29, 2019 6:34 am

I have lived in the suburbs of both Seattle (Eastside) and NYC (NJ) and commuted into NYC on NJ Transit 5 days a week. So I know a good bit about both places.

If you’re going to live in the NYC suburbs, you’ll probably have good public schools but the commute to NYC is a pain and trips with the family into the city for cultural activities are a real schlep. You won’t go into the city nearly as often as you think you will. You can find good to very good public schools in the Seattle area.

If you live in the NYC area in a suburban house, get a snowblower. You might not be used to the amount and number of winter snow storms the area gets. Seattle does get snow occasionally during the winter, but the whole place shuts down until the snow melts in a day or two, as it usually does.

Seattle is gray and dark during the winter, because of the almost constant cloud cover. My wife discovered she had Seasonal Affective Disorder when we lived there. There are ways to deal with it but it is a major problem for those impacted. You probably won’t know if you are susceptible until you live in a dark place in the winter. Yes you can get to the sun in 45 minutes by driving East on I90 to Snoqualmie Pass or East of the Cascades. Many people in Seattle take winter vacations to places where it’s sunnier. The NYC area is colder in the winter but you get many more sunny days.

The natural world is very close to you in Seattle. Not unusual to see Bald Eagles flying around. Our kids school would sometimes go on lockdown because bear or cougar were sighted in the area. Although areas of New Jersey can be very pretty, the natural world is not nearly so present in the NYC area.

Both areas sound doable financially. Seattle probably better because of somewhat lower cost of living and no state or city income tax. I’d choose based on family cultural fit to the area. One thing you may find is that there are many transplants in the Seattle area, which can make it easier to make friends and socialize. In some areas of the NYC suburbs people have been there forever and are not that interested in meeting new people.
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TxAg
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Re: Relocate to Seattle or NYC

Post by TxAg » Sat Jun 29, 2019 7:06 am

Seattle

Blue456
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Re: Relocate to Seattle or NYC

Post by Blue456 » Sat Jun 29, 2019 7:12 am

abyan wrote:
Fri Jun 28, 2019 9:31 pm
Just re-read your post, and NJ is definitely cheaper than looking at NYC, even Queens.
I live in NJ and I am moving out of there and I tell you I can't wait to move out:
- no Freeways (mostly Routes with lights)
- dirty
- it's basically one big suburb but very expensive
- most expensive property tax in the country
- as someone else noted, nature is not as close as you would think
- lots of traffic
- tolls, tolls and more tolls, we spend $400 a month on tolls
- drive to NYC without traffic in the middle of a night is 55 minutes but on Friday it is 2.5 hours
- drivers are terrible in NJ

Nobody really commutes to work from NJ to NYC unless they really have to. There are bridges to cross over which are huge bottle neck in time and very expensive. If I had to work in NYC, then I would look for an apartment near a subway station and skip the morning commute via car.

Another option to consider is working New York State outside of NYC and taking Amtrak to the destination. You could probably take a direct train from NJ or NY outside of NYC. If I had to choose between these two, I would look into a nice medium size town north of NYC and take Amtrak. No driving over bridges, no tolls, don't have to deal with reckless NYC/NJ drivers who rather crash into you then let you change lane.

Comparing NY outside of NYC and NJ, definitely consider NY. Property tax in NJ can be more expensive than rents here. Houses in NJ alone are very expensive and you can get much better deal in New York as long as it is not NYC.

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core4portfolio
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Re: Relocate to Seattle or NYC

Post by core4portfolio » Sat Jun 29, 2019 7:22 am

Thanks for sharing.
If I choose seattle its 20k more take home.
Allocation : 80/20 (80% TSM, 20% TBM) | Need to learn fishing sooner

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Pizza_and_Beer
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Re: Relocate to Seattle or NYC

Post by Pizza_and_Beer » Sat Jun 29, 2019 7:23 am

As an FYI, if OP intends to live outside of NYC limits, there will not be any NYC income taxes due.

Sam1
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Re: Relocate to Seattle or NYC

Post by Sam1 » Sat Jun 29, 2019 7:38 am

Sadly I wouldn’t choose NYC because I don’t see how you can own property AND invest. Since you’re on this site I assume you care about investing in index funds!

I’m unaware of a decent NY suburb where you can buy a home for 400-500k. Even a condo will be a stretch. Since you care about schools, I don’t see how you could buy in an inexpensive area or not yet gentrified. Then there are steep costs for commuting into the city.

In the city even a basic one bedroom starts at $3k. You can probably find a two bedroom for $4k but it will be far from ideal. I think it depends on if after spending $48k in after tax dollars you will have enough to live on and also invest.

The main difference in cost from Seattle and NY is that there are still areas outside of Seattle where you can commute and find a decently priced property. In NY this is very, very hard to find. Maybe in NJ, but then you face high taxes, long commutes, miserable people etc.

I simply wouldn’t relocate a family to NY on that income and a SAH spouse. BUT - everyone has different standards and investment goals.

fasteddie911
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Re: Relocate to Seattle or NYC

Post by fasteddie911 » Sat Jun 29, 2019 7:45 am

Seattle easily. Primarily for the natural beauty and proximity to outdoor activities. But that's what I enjoy and am not a big city person, especially the NYC area. The second factor is proximity to family and friends.

jebmke
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Re: Relocate to Seattle or NYC

Post by jebmke » Sat Jun 29, 2019 7:49 am

If they will allow you to work from home 5 days per week is there any reason to leave Richmond?
When you discover that you are riding a dead horse, the best strategy is to dismount.

FireSekr
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Re: Relocate to Seattle or NYC

Post by FireSekr » Sat Jun 29, 2019 7:50 am

Sam1 wrote:
Sat Jun 29, 2019 7:38 am
The main difference in cost from Seattle and NY is that there are still areas outside of Seattle where you can commute and find a decently priced property. In NY this is very, very hard to find. Maybe in NJ, but then you face high taxes, long commutes, miserable people etc.

I simply wouldn’t relocate a family to NY on that income and a SAH spouse. BUT - everyone has different standards and investment goals.
You can easily find nice communities on Long Island with houses in the 350-600k price range within a 35-40 minute train ride of NYC with solid public schools. Take a look at Lynbrook, Malverne, Franklin Square, Rockville Center in New York.

In the 350k-$600k price range, you’re not getting a decent house or apartment within 30-45 minutes of Seattle. Redmond is basically $600k starting price for a run down crappy house. You can probably get a good 2bd condo in the 450-500k range in Redmond and Redmond is not an upscale area. Bothell is a bit cheaper but the commute is 45-60 minutes due to more traffic.

The affordable housing options in NYC area are much better because you’ve got more areas accessible from train and you don’t have a ton of techies from San Francisco moving there and overpaying for crappy houses.

gold99xx
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Re: Relocate to Seattle or NYC

Post by gold99xx » Sat Jun 29, 2019 8:08 am

Hello, NY native here... WHATEVER you do do NOT move to NYC. It is not the city you see in the movies anymore. Your salary of 150K will be worth about $500 in actual spending power. It is the most overpriced hell hole. I make well over your salary and have done so for a long time, after the tax man cometh and all the price gouging that has accelerated in the last 5 years, its a terrible place to live. I would not recommend it to my worst enemies.

Seattle has also become less enjoyable as a result of the techno explosion. BUT it is infinitely better in terms of quality of life. AND BTW no state income tax.... sales tax is a wash for both NY and WA. If you need to make a huge purchase, you can drive to Oregon.. ZERO sales tax.

DONT move to NYC, you can thank me in a year.

GmanJeff
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Re: Relocate to Seattle or NYC

Post by GmanJeff » Sat Jun 29, 2019 8:14 am

jebmke wrote:
Sat Jun 29, 2019 7:49 am
If they will allow you to work from home 5 days per week is there any reason to leave Richmond?
This. You can take the Acela to NYC from D.C. from time to time if you need to visit the office. Richmond is a much lower cost of living environment than the alternatives you propose, and there's nothing wrong with the quality of life in the nicer suburbs. Why are you even thinking of relocating to two very expensive areas which each have significant detracting factors (as well as positives, depending on perspective and preferences, of course)? You'd have to consider the two jobs you describe as remarkable opportunities compared to what you have now to make the disruption of your family and professional risk of things not working out. In your professional field, you ought to have opportunities in any number of lower cost areas where you'd have a better commute, the same work from home potential, good schools, etc. Without more details it's difficult to know why you want to move at all and why you want to move to the two locations you mention.
Last edited by GmanJeff on Sat Jun 29, 2019 12:47 pm, edited 1 time in total.

BrooklynInvest
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Re: Relocate to Seattle or NYC

Post by BrooklynInvest » Sat Jun 29, 2019 8:32 am

Some of the anti-NY comments are truly fascinating. Have lived here 25 years and my experience has been incredible. My neighborhood has great people, top notch schools, restaurants that run the price gamut, lacks rats, graffiti, noise, "price gouging" (although I'm not entirely sure what that is in this context) and almost all of the bad things that others seem to think are endemic. My cost of living is higher than rural areas and my taxes did go up significantly so there is that.

Different strokes I guess.

That said, I'm not sure I would recommend a NY location if you weren't living IN New York. Has the potential to be the worst of both worlds - more expensive real estate and high COL form the 'burbs, plus what can be a pain in the neck commute. Although plenty of folks do it and like it.

Seattle's proximity to great outdoor activities might be an attraction. Plus if you are doing the suburban approach, getting into and out of the city I have to imagine would be easier even with increased development.

Good luck!

FireSekr
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Re: Relocate to Seattle or NYC

Post by FireSekr » Sat Jun 29, 2019 8:37 am

[Edited by Moderator Misenplace to remove inappropriate quoted content.]
If you think JFK is bad, I can’t imagine what you’d think of LAX..it’s like LGA but larger and more traffic

I lived in NY area for 28 years, London for 1 year, Seattle area for 2, and now I am in SoCal. Up until 2 years ago I traveled extensively for work. The last few years before I stopped traveling I was averaging 175 nights a year away from home and taking at least 40 flights a year usually more.

JFK certainly isn’t the best airport, but it’s a great airport to have a problem at. If your flight is delayed or cancelled there is probably another one you can try to get on. There are plenty of lounges, restaurants and places to eat. You can take a train into NYC and check into a hotel.

Sea-Tac is decent but the options are much more limited. There aren’t many restaurants and they close early. The airport itself is rundown. If you’re stuck there overnight the hotels near the airport aren’t great. The lounges are dated and don’t have great food in the lounge. Number of flights are limited and airline selection is even further limited. You’re basically stuck with delta and Alaska...there are a few others that go to certain destinations. JFK has way more options.
Last edited by FireSekr on Sat Jun 29, 2019 8:49 am, edited 2 times in total.

gold99xx
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Re: Relocate to Seattle or NYC

Post by gold99xx » Sat Jun 29, 2019 8:46 am

BrooklynInvest wrote:
Sat Jun 29, 2019 8:32 am
Some of the anti-NY comments are truly fascinating. Have lived here 25 years and my experience has been incredible. My neighborhood has great people, top notch schools, restaurants that run the price gamut, lacks rats, graffiti, noise, "price gouging" (although I'm not entirely sure what that is in this context) and almost all of the bad things that others seem to think are endemic. My cost of living is higher than rural areas and my taxes did go up significantly so there is that.

Different strokes I guess.

That said, I'm not sure I would recommend a NY location if you weren't living IN New York. Has the potential to be the worst of both worlds - more expensive real estate and high COL form the 'burbs, plus what can be a pain in the neck commute. Although plenty of folks do it and like it.

Seattle's proximity to great outdoor activities might be an attraction. Plus if you are doing the suburban approach, getting into and out of the city I have to imagine would be easier even with increased development.

Good luck!
" price gouging " in this context is OVERCHARGING everyone for everything because you can. Passing the buck due to the terribly run and overpriced city and infrastructure. Also, nobody mentioned the TERRIBLE subway system. It is quite possibly the worst in the WORLD. How do you like those rush hour commutes to the city? DONT COME HERE EVER, EVEN ON VACATION, nothing to see here any more. I mean I am a NATIVE NYer literally born and raised in Manhattan, and while the city was THE BEST place to ever live and be from Pre-late 1990s it is now a JOKE. Save yourself, move to WA.

FireSekr
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Re: Relocate to Seattle or NYC

Post by FireSekr » Sat Jun 29, 2019 8:54 am

gold99xx wrote:
Sat Jun 29, 2019 8:46 am
BrooklynInvest wrote:
Sat Jun 29, 2019 8:32 am
Some of the anti-NY comments are truly fascinating. Have lived here 25 years and my experience has been incredible. My neighborhood has great people, top notch schools, restaurants that run the price gamut, lacks rats, graffiti, noise, "price gouging" (although I'm not entirely sure what that is in this context) and almost all of the bad things that others seem to think are endemic. My cost of living is higher than rural areas and my taxes did go up significantly so there is that.

Different strokes I guess.

That said, I'm not sure I would recommend a NY location if you weren't living IN New York. Has the potential to be the worst of both worlds - more expensive real estate and high COL form the 'burbs, plus what can be a pain in the neck commute. Although plenty of folks do it and like it.

Seattle's proximity to great outdoor activities might be an attraction. Plus if you are doing the suburban approach, getting into and out of the city I have to imagine would be easier even with increased development.

Good luck!
" price gouging " in this context is OVERCHARGING everyone for everything because you can. Passing the buck due to the terribly run and overpriced city and infrastructure. Also, nobody mentioned the TERRIBLE subway system. It is quite possibly the worst in the WORLD. How do you like those rush hour commutes to the city? DONT COME HERE EVER, EVEN ON VACATION, nothing to see here any more. I mean I am a NATIVE NYer literally born and raised in Manhattan, and while the city was THE BEST place to ever live and be from Pre-late 1990s it is now a JOKE. Save yourself, move to WA.
At least NYC has a subway. I was there a few weeks ago and traveled about 4 miles from midtown to Wall Street in about 20 minutes on the subway during rush hour.

In LA where we don’t have any subways or public transit except our useless metro line and the bus system which is basically a moving homeless shelter , you can drive 4 miles in about 40 minutes. NYC subways may not be as good as London or other cities, but they work way better than having to drive through soul crushing traffic.

In Seattle the bus system is pretty decent.
Traffic north and south bound on I-5 in Seattle is awful during rush hour. Much easier to live on the east side and go west to the city during the morning commute than to live north of the city and try to go south.
Last edited by FireSekr on Sat Jun 29, 2019 8:56 am, edited 1 time in total.

dbr
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Re: Relocate to Seattle or NYC

Post by dbr » Sat Jun 29, 2019 8:56 am

Do you have those offers because you chose to apply to companies in those locations? If so, why?

An obvious choice is neither. There must be a way to get other options on the table.

gold99xx
Posts: 78
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Re: Relocate to Seattle or NYC

Post by gold99xx » Sat Jun 29, 2019 8:57 am

dbr wrote:
Sat Jun 29, 2019 8:56 am
Do you have those offers because you chose to apply to companies in those locations? If so, why?

An obvious choice is neither. There must be a way to get other options on the table.
DBR for the WIN!!!!!

:sharebeer

Arlington2019
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Location: Snohomish County, Washington, USA

Re: Relocate to Seattle or NYC

Post by Arlington2019 » Sat Jun 29, 2019 9:02 am

I agree with most of what ssquared87 has said, being a Seattle-area resident myself. I live 45 miles north of downtown Seattle, and my commute takes approximately two hours each way (drive to Everett, ride train into Seattle and reverse in the afternoon). It is actually faster to do this than to drive a single-occupancy vehicle on I-5 in rush hour(s) which I did for 23 years. Take careful note of what he and other locals have said about housing costs and be prepared to spend way more than your budget. My youngest daughter lives in Queens after graduating from the School of Visual Arts and she likes NYC much more than Seattle.

Blue456
Posts: 362
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Re: Relocate to Seattle or NYC

Post by Blue456 » Sat Jun 29, 2019 9:15 am

ssquared87 wrote:
Sat Jun 29, 2019 8:54 am
gold99xx wrote:
Sat Jun 29, 2019 8:46 am
BrooklynInvest wrote:
Sat Jun 29, 2019 8:32 am
Some of the anti-NY comments are truly fascinating. Have lived here 25 years and my experience has been incredible. My neighborhood has great people, top notch schools, restaurants that run the price gamut, lacks rats, graffiti, noise, "price gouging" (although I'm not entirely sure what that is in this context) and almost all of the bad things that others seem to think are endemic. My cost of living is higher than rural areas and my taxes did go up significantly so there is that.

Different strokes I guess.

That said, I'm not sure I would recommend a NY location if you weren't living IN New York. Has the potential to be the worst of both worlds - more expensive real estate and high COL form the 'burbs, plus what can be a pain in the neck commute. Although plenty of folks do it and like it.

Seattle's proximity to great outdoor activities might be an attraction. Plus if you are doing the suburban approach, getting into and out of the city I have to imagine would be easier even with increased development.

Good luck!
" price gouging " in this context is OVERCHARGING everyone for everything because you can. Passing the buck due to the terribly run and overpriced city and infrastructure. Also, nobody mentioned the TERRIBLE subway system. It is quite possibly the worst in the WORLD. How do you like those rush hour commutes to the city? DONT COME HERE EVER, EVEN ON VACATION, nothing to see here any more. I mean I am a NATIVE NYer literally born and raised in Manhattan, and while the city was THE BEST place to ever live and be from Pre-late 1990s it is now a JOKE. Save yourself, move to WA.
At least NYC has a subway. I was there a few weeks ago and traveled about 4 miles from midtown to Wall Street in about 20 minutes on the subway during rush hour.

In LA where we don’t have any subways or public transit except our useless metro line and the bus system which is basically a moving homeless shelter , you can drive 4 miles in about 40 minutes. NYC subways may not be as good as London or other cities, but they work way better than having to drive through soul crushing traffic.

In Seattle the bus system is pretty decent.
Traffic north and south bound on I-5 in Seattle is awful during rush hour. Much easier to live on the east side and go west to the city during the morning commute than to live north of the city and try to go south.
Except for train traffic where you are stuck 2-3 hours due to construction or train re-routing. Not to mention complete New Yorker incompetence to even let you know that a train is not working. I commuted 4 years on 405 freeway in Los Angeles and 2 years in NY Subway. By far I would rather be stuck in LA traffic, 100F, no AC then in NY Subway. Expect NYC subways to be always late.

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