Stolen Credit Card Number

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sport
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Stolen Credit Card Number

Post by sport » Sat Feb 09, 2019 6:30 pm

I just had my CC number stolen. I learned some things to watch out for, and I want to share them to save other Bogleheads the trouble that I have experienced. My Costco Visa card number was compromised. Citibank detected the unusual spending pattern and refused the charge and contacted me. I confirmed I had not made the charge. Citi cancelled the CC number and sent me a new card. They told me that all the regular monthly charges on my card would be switched to the new number automatically. This was not true. I found that AT&T land line, AT&T U-verse internet, and Spectrum cable did not know about the new number. I found out only because AT&T U-verse sent an email that my auto pay was refused.

So, I called AT&T U-verse, and gave them the new number for auto pay. However, that started with the next billing period. It did not include the current bill. The CR said there was a $5 service charge to put the current bill on the credit card. I asked her to waive that charge and she did. Then, I thought, what about the AT&T land line? Well, I had to go through the same process to reinstitute auto pay and pay the current bill separately. However, this time I used the automated system and avoided the service charge.

Then I noted that my Spectrum cable auto pay did not show on the credit card. So, I called them, and paid the current bill and the next bill. I started to set up auto pay with the new number. However, when she read the terms and conditions for my consent, they included a $30 fee for refused payments. For some reason, I was not charged this fee this time. Perhaps it was not part of the old agreement. In any case, since I feel that such a large fee for something that was not my fault is not appropriate, I declined the auto pay and will pay the bill monthly using my bank's bill pay.

So, even though Citi told me everything was all set, it really was not. So, if this happens to you, be sure to verity your payments are being made to avoid late fees, or service disconnection. Also, if you restart auto pay, be sure to pay the current bill.

lakpr
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Re: Stolen Credit Card Number

Post by lakpr » Sat Feb 09, 2019 6:51 pm

Just for future reference -- You should really give out only the virtual numbers, not the real credit card numbers, for auto billing. This way even if the virtual numbers are compromised, you can set them up with a new virtual number; and vice-versa, if the physical card gets compromised, the auto billing will continue as normal. When you login to the Citi website, look at the top of the page for "Virtual Number" link. You need to have Adobe Flash installed on your computer, though, for this feature to work.

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samsoes
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Re: Stolen Credit Card Number

Post by samsoes » Sat Feb 09, 2019 6:54 pm

I avoid autopay like the plague. Learned my lesson when I cancelled a newspaper subscription and my credit card kept getting charged. Never again.

I'll pay by credit card to get rewards, when possible, but I initiate each payment as a one-time transaction, usually using a virtual account number.

See: viewtopic.php?f=2&t=271935&newpost=4372 ... d#p4371914
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tibbitts
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Re: Stolen Credit Card Number

Post by tibbitts » Sat Feb 09, 2019 6:57 pm

lakpr wrote:
Sat Feb 09, 2019 6:51 pm
Just for future reference -- You should really give out only the virtual numbers, not the real credit card numbers, for auto billing. This way even if the virtual numbers are compromised, you can set them up with a new virtual number; and vice-versa, if the physical card gets compromised, the auto billing will continue as normal. When you login to the Citi website, look at the top of the page for "Virtual Number" link. You need to have Adobe Flash installed on your computer, though, for this feature to work.
When I used to get Citi virtual numbers, I believe they were only valid for a very short time - like a month. I haven't used them in a while. But unless they're valid for the full time the card itself is valid for, they wouldn't help much with auto-pay.

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Rob5TCP
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Re: Stolen Credit Card Number

Post by Rob5TCP » Sat Feb 09, 2019 7:11 pm

Capital one has permanent virtual numbers. Plus you can turn the virtual numbers on/off.
For most of my recurring charges, I try to arrange for the same time period for the recurring
charges so I turn that group on/off at the same time.

It's the best solution, I've seen, so far.

wilshuer
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Re: Stolen Credit Card Number

Post by wilshuer » Sat Feb 09, 2019 7:16 pm

tibbitts wrote:
Sat Feb 09, 2019 6:57 pm
lakpr wrote:
Sat Feb 09, 2019 6:51 pm
Just for future reference -- You should really give out only the virtual numbers, not the real credit card numbers, for auto billing. This way even if the virtual numbers are compromised, you can set them up with a new virtual number; and vice-versa, if the physical card gets compromised, the auto billing will continue as normal. When you login to the Citi website, look at the top of the page for "Virtual Number" link. You need to have Adobe Flash installed on your computer, though, for this feature to work.
When I used to get Citi virtual numbers, I believe they were only valid for a very short time - like a month. I haven't used them in a while. But unless they're valid for the full time the card itself is valid for, they wouldn't help much with auto-pay.
You can set them up for a year, I have done this for a few autopays.

lakpr
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Re: Stolen Credit Card Number

Post by lakpr » Sat Feb 09, 2019 10:11 pm

If you go to Advanced Options, you can set a max $ limit and the expiry date in terms of number of months out (12 max). Once a merchant uses the virtual number, if there is any $ balance left and expiry duration left, only that merchant can authorize additional charges on the card.

When it gets to be near the expiry date set originally, you can always pull up that virtual number from “View Previous Numbers” submenu under Advanced Options. Then you can increase the $ limit and or move the expiry date to an additional 12 months max into the future to continue additional charges from that merchant. Or of course you can close the virtual number to any future charges completely in case of issues like the poster samsoes mentioned above where the auto pay keeps happening in spite of canceling subscriptions.

Horsefly
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Re: Stolen Credit Card Number

Post by Horsefly » Sat Feb 09, 2019 11:05 pm

I'm more than a bit confused here. People are talking about using virtual numbers. The OP has a Costco Citi Visa card, as do I. As far as I can tell, virtual numbers are not available for Costco Visa.

I use virtual numbers with my CapitalOne card. I really wish all credit card companies had that feature. But just because Citi provides it on some cards, I don't think it means they provide it on all cards.

JBTX
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Re: Stolen Credit Card Number

Post by JBTX » Sun Feb 10, 2019 1:27 am

I've used autopay for years and rarely had issues. And on the very rare occasion where something gets messed up (not set for first payment or perhaps cancelation/change of cards I've always found vendors and card companies willing to waive any applicable fees if the come about.

I have ATT/direct TV combined billing, and while the billing cycle and actual amount determination can be convoluted, setting up and changing auto pay online is very easy.

AllMostThere
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Re: Stolen Credit Card Number

Post by AllMostThere » Sun Feb 10, 2019 9:00 am

Horsefly wrote:
Sat Feb 09, 2019 11:05 pm
I'm more than a bit confused here. People are talking about using virtual numbers. The OP has a Costco Citi Visa card, as do I. As far as I can tell, virtual numbers are not available for Costco Visa.

I use virtual numbers with my CapitalOne card. I really wish all credit card companies had that feature. But just because Citi provides it on some cards, I don't think it means they provide it on all cards.
I would agree with these comments. If virtual numbers are available for Costco Visa, I can't find it. I had this functionality on my Fidelity card, prior to them switching banks, and used the service often.

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RickBoglehead
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Re: Stolen Credit Card Number

Post by RickBoglehead » Sun Feb 10, 2019 9:08 am

Citi does not offer virtual numbers for the Costco Visa, but they do for the Citi DoubleCash...
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TravelforFun
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Re: Stolen Credit Card Number

Post by TravelforFun » Sun Feb 10, 2019 9:16 am

samsoes wrote:
Sat Feb 09, 2019 6:54 pm
I avoid autopay like the plague. Learned my lesson when I cancelled a newspaper subscription and my credit card kept getting charged. Never again.

I'll pay by credit card to get rewards, when possible, but I initiate each payment as a one-time transaction, usually using a virtual account number.

See: viewtopic.php?f=2&t=271935&newpost=4372 ... d#p4371914
Interesting! I love autopay. Been using using it on all my utility, cell phone, cable, Starbucks and toll tag accounts for years without problem.

TravelforFun

likegarden
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Re: Stolen Credit Card Number

Post by likegarden » Sun Feb 10, 2019 1:48 pm

I also avoid autopay, want to see where my money is going, every month. I think by having mostly no autopay I also will have less problems.

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RickBoglehead
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Re: Stolen Credit Card Number

Post by RickBoglehead » Sun Feb 10, 2019 1:51 pm

likegarden wrote:
Sun Feb 10, 2019 1:48 pm
I also avoid autopay, want to see where my money is going, every month. I think by having mostly no autopay I also will have less problems.
I have everything on Autopay. I see where my money is going just fine.
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cherijoh
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Re: Stolen Credit Card Number

Post by cherijoh » Sun Feb 10, 2019 2:05 pm

Horsefly wrote:
Sat Feb 09, 2019 11:05 pm
I'm more than a bit confused here. People are talking about using virtual numbers. The OP has a Costco Citi Visa card, as do I. As far as I can tell, virtual numbers are not available for Costco Visa.

I use virtual numbers with my CapitalOne card. I really wish all credit card companies had that feature. But just because Citi provides it on some cards, I don't think it means they provide it on all cards.
I think all credit cards have them, but many CC companies don't share them with the customer. If that number gets compromised then getting a replacement card won't do the customer any good.
sport wrote:
Sat Feb 09, 2019 6:30 pm
I just had my CC number stolen. I learned some things to watch out for, and I want to share them to save other Bogleheads the trouble that I have experienced. My Costco Visa card number was compromised. Citibank detected the unusual spending pattern and refused the charge and contacted me. I confirmed I had not made the charge. Citi cancelled the CC number and sent me a new card. They told me that all the regular monthly charges on my card would be switched to the new number automatically. This was not true. I found that AT&T land line, AT&T U-verse internet, and Spectrum cable did not know about the new number. I found out only because AT&T U-verse sent an email that my auto pay was refused.
I had the same issue - the bills are paid for the billing cycle in which your card is compromised and possibly for the next billing cycle. But eventually the old number is no longer good for payments where the company pulls the payment from your card. I had a pay-as-you-go phone (on a quarterly automatic recharge) where I lost all my accumulated roll-over minutes :annoyed. (They claimed they sent me an email, but I never saw it). Fortunately my gym called me when the payment bounced - two cycles after I got the unsolicited replacement card.

MikeG62
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Re: Stolen Credit Card Number

Post by MikeG62 » Sun Feb 10, 2019 2:07 pm

RickBoglehead wrote:
Sun Feb 10, 2019 1:51 pm
likegarden wrote:
Sun Feb 10, 2019 1:48 pm
I also avoid autopay, want to see where my money is going, every month. I think by having mostly no autopay I also will have less problems.
I have everything on Autopay. I see where my money is going just fine.
Me too. Never encountered a single problem using autopay.

Here is a list of our monthly expense line items that I have set to autopay:

Electric/Gas
Cell Phone
Cable
Auto Insurance
Homeowners Insurance
Auto Leases
Heath Insurance Premiums
Home Security
AAA
Health Club Dues
Coffee Delivery
Amazon Subscription (Recurring) Purchases

There are a dozen items in that list that I set up for payment one time and I've never worried about since. I do check our CC statements when they come in and never once identified a problem. All of these, except Amazon, are charged to the same CC (my general 2% CB card).

The only issue (if you could call it that) with autopay is when that CC has been compromised it takes about an hour to contact all the relevant parties to provide the new CC number (most can be done online). Never once has this been done automatically (as the OP was told would happen with his Citi card).
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Artful Dodger
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Re: Stolen Credit Card Number

Post by Artful Dodger » Sun Feb 10, 2019 3:38 pm

MikeG62 wrote:
Sun Feb 10, 2019 2:07 pm
The only issue (if you could call it that) with autopay is when that CC has been compromised it takes about an hour to contact all the relevant parties to provide the new CC number (most can be done online). Never once has this been done automatically (as the OP was told would happen with his Citi card).
Just had to redo auto pays twice on my Fidelity card. Maybe there was some miscommunication from the OP's CC company. I can see if they're sending the same amount to a merchant on a regular basis (kind of like a bill pay program), the CC co could adjust for that. But, most auto pays are being pulled by the merchant / vendor and often with different $ amounts, and the new card info will need to be added to the merchant / vendor site.

Topic Author
sport
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Re: Stolen Credit Card Number

Post by sport » Sun Feb 10, 2019 4:38 pm

Artful Dodger wrote:
Sun Feb 10, 2019 3:38 pm
MikeG62 wrote:
Sun Feb 10, 2019 2:07 pm
The only issue (if you could call it that) with autopay is when that CC has been compromised it takes about an hour to contact all the relevant parties to provide the new CC number (most can be done online). Never once has this been done automatically (as the OP was told would happen with his Citi card).
Just had to redo auto pays twice on my Fidelity card. Maybe there was some miscommunication from the OP's CC company. I can see if they're sending the same amount to a merchant on a regular basis (kind of like a bill pay program), the CC co could adjust for that. But, most auto pays are being pulled by the merchant / vendor and often with different $ amounts, and the new card info will need to be added to the merchant / vendor site.
Whenever a card hits its expiration date, they send me a new card. They also seem to notify the autopay companies because I never had an autopay refused due to the wrong expiration date. So, when they told me the new number would be automatically updated, I believed them. Perhaps the automatic update should have happened as promised, but something went wrong in the process.

lynneny
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Re: Stolen Credit Card Number

Post by lynneny » Mon Feb 11, 2019 12:31 am

Auto pays transfer on an expired/renewed card because it's still the same number. A card replaced due to fraud has a new and different number, so auto pays don't transfer.

I had to cancel my Capital One card today due to fraud, after they flagged a suspicious payment for $500 to a money transfer service I'd never heard of. When I called Capital One, there were a horrifying number of attempts at fraudulent charges on my account in the last few days by the hacker; they were either pending or had been refused by the vendor.

Capital One suggested what other posters recommended: a Virtual Account Number (VAN) so online purchases are assigned a different number, one for each vendor. That way, if your card is hacked, you just cancel the virtual number and your real credit card isn't compromised. Plus, since a different number is used for each vendor, you can tell where the hackers got your number when they try to use that same number elsewhere (not realizing it's a virtual number). This link explains it better than I do: https://www.creditcardinsider.com/blog/ ... hdwMSrbQIs

It's a hassle. Right after Capital One cancelled my card this morning, I had to take a friend to the emergency room. We live in a big city where few people have cars, so we call Uber. And of course my Uber app didn't work because the payment method on record had just been cancelled.

Trism
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Re: Stolen Credit Card Number

Post by Trism » Mon Feb 11, 2019 5:13 am

The narrow group of people obsessed with virtual card numbers fascinates (and amuses) me.

There are over 350 million active credit card accounts in the US. A tiny percentage will become compromised, and yes, in the extremely remote event it happens to you it will create some inconvenience.

It shouldn't take more than 15 or 20 minutes to log into the impacted card account, verify which merchants bill you on a recurring basis, and log into each of those accounts and provide details for a different card for future payments.

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