Need guidance on charting next life steps

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kurious
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Need guidance on charting next life steps

Post by kurious » Sun Oct 14, 2018 2:14 am

Dear Bogleheads,

I had described my life situation earlier this year and received invaluable advice. Some things have evolved since then and I really need some perspective.

About us

I am almost 32. DW is almost 30. No progeny so far. I work for a start-up and am in the final year of my STEM OPT after completing graduate studies. If I don't get a work permit next year, I will need to leave the country in July.

This was my DW's final year of STEM OPT. She had a good job and her application got picked up in the H1B lottery. We just learned that she was denied the visa. She will leave the country next week and try coming back on a dependent visa. We are still trying to come to terms with the fact that half our reason for being in this country as well as income got yanked away from our life.

Financially, we have no debt. We bought a budget apartment in India (where we are from) worth ~USD 50k and have saved enough to be able to pay it off. My 401k stands at 45k and that of my wife at 35k. We also have 11k each in Roth IRA. Emergency fund is 15k (probably no point in having more as we need to leave the country within 2 months if I lose my job and don't find another one). Apart from these, we have saved ~10k in India-based bank accounts.

Our ideal state

Our ideal state was both of us working in the US for another 3 years and steadily climbing up the corporate ladder. We had thought of a number that we wanted to hit (~150k outside of maxed-out retirement accounts) and then go back to India. After that, DW planned to work part-time and I planned to join a non-profit or a social enterprise with rural focus. That plan appears untenable as of now.

What should we do next
I need some perspective on what we ought to do next. In that context, here is some more information about my job which is really the sole reason for us to be here at the moment.

My job
I work for a small start-up that is incredibly supportive. If you look at one of my prior posts, I mentioned being unhappy about a 105k salary (to which they added a 5k bonus last year). This year, they increased my salary to 120k (no bonus). Not a steep increase, but fairly decent in my understanding. More importantly, this is the figure I had requested. I would like to believe I am still ~20k underpaid but I cannot prove that unless I apply for other jobs and I am loathe to doing that. I am devoted to the company's success and love the product/technology/client challenges that I work on. I work in Solution Engineering at the interface of cutting edge data technologies and emergent business challenges. The ability to scratch my consulting itch while also working on real tangible solutions to problems that I care about (life sciences, healthcare and global health) helps me find meaning in my work.

My employer has assured me that I will have a job with them no matter where I am in the world. I cannot exaggerate how reassuring those words are under present circumstances. As for our options, these are the ones that I can think of:

Option 1

Work in the US till next H1B lottery and see if it gets picked up.

Pros
- Proximity to colleagues and clients. The best part about my job is working with mega- to midsize corps with deep pockets and interesting problems.
- USD earnings for the next few months

Cons
- DW will be unable to work. My PERM application is underway. Even if the H1B is successful next year, H4 EAD will likely go away this Dec. She is fairly well-qualified and will go nuts if she remains unemployed for long periods.

Option 2

Go back to India and work for the employer.

Pros
- Markedly reduced uncertainty in life
Cons
- I am not sure what my role will be. I have no interest in leading or being a part of "low-cost offshore" delivery team. I have been in such set-ups in the past and intensely disliked the notion of servitude associated with such an arrangement. Given a choice, I would like to continue working on projects like I am here. However, that will become difficult because of reduced client interaction and differences in time zones.
- Less money

Option 3
Go back to India and work for a different employer.

Pros
- Potentially interesting work that is not "low-cost offshore". A potential opportunity is product managing a rural supply chain-oriented solution.
Cons
- The overhead of job hunting
- Letting go of a job/company/technology that I really love

Option 4
Go to a different geography and work for the employer.

Europe - The employer wants to expand its business in Europe and could potentially fit me in a Solution Engg role where I become the technical-ish sidekick to a BD person looking to expand the market. We do operate some projects for EU-based clients and my presence in the vicinity could help drive our engagements with them.

Canada - The employer hasn't thought of this in detail. We don't have an office there. Given the expeditious nature of the "Global Skills Strategy" program, I am considering proposing that I be implanted there as a representative of the company to grow our business (by delivering PoC and Pilot solutions ) there. A big pro is that DW can potentially find a job there.

The con of relocating to Canada or elsewhere is that I will be leaving Boston, my beloved home for the last 5 years and the mecca of KR (Knowledge Representation)/AI/ML in life sciences, my area of interest and sphere of work. I feel a sense of belonging to the city, have a 20-minute commute to work by train, and focus almost all of my efforts on work and advancing my knowledge. A lot of that will take a hit if we move.

Dubai - My whim. Potentially as a hub to start chasing clients in Asia, Europe, and Africa.

Option 5

Work for a non-profit in the US

There are a couple of non-profits whose work I deeply admire and where I have unsuccessfully interviewed in the past. I might still have a shot at getting a job there. Assuming that the government finds my job there worth an H1B, I will be able to work on something I care about as well as stay in this country. The con, again, is that DW will be unable to work.

These are all the options I could think of. I will be grateful if you can share your thoughts on what our next steps should be.

Cheers,

kurious
Last edited by kurious on Sun Oct 14, 2018 12:50 pm, edited 1 time in total.

kurious
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Re: Need guidance on charting next life steps

Post by kurious » Sun Oct 14, 2018 12:49 pm

Bumping this up for some attention. In a pickle right now, will be very grateful for some advice and guidance.

stan1
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Re: Need guidance on charting next life steps

Post by stan1 » Sun Oct 14, 2018 12:55 pm

I don't have a lot of advice for you other than to keep your options open, be flexible, and consider many options (which seems to be what you are already doing). I hope the path is clearer in a few months.

kurious
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Re: Need guidance on charting next life steps

Post by kurious » Sun Oct 14, 2018 1:13 pm

Thank you, stan1. I am trying to think through my options with as much clarity as I can. I just find the number of options a bit overwhelming and cannot decide which trade-offs are worth keeping and which are worth discarding.

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Re: Need guidance on charting next life steps

Post by LadyGeek » Sun Oct 14, 2018 1:20 pm

This thread is now in the Personal Finance (Not Investing) forum (career guidance).
Wiki To some, the glass is half full. To others, the glass is half empty. To an engineer, it's twice the size it needs to be.

MrJones
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Re: Need guidance on charting next life steps

Post by MrJones » Sun Oct 14, 2018 1:25 pm

If we assume financial goals are important, which they should be at the stage of your life, that effectively removes options 2 and 5.

Options three and four are interesting in that they suffer from uncertainty and the loss of familiarity. Here's my perspective on that: you're young. Increasing your skills at adaptability to whatever life throws at you can be one of the most invaluable skills you can build, and the best investments you can make. Figuring out what it takes to make a home out of a new city; taking on a role outside your comfort zone and excelling in it; going to a new company and fitting into the culture and figuring out how best to contribute to the company and to society. And so on. at this point in your life, I would consider building this skill set as a core part of my general strategy. That said, option four I'm guessing works a little better financially.

That brings us to option one. IMHO, this sounds like the best one for now, but I can't say I fully understand it. If you get a H1B, what exactly does that mean for DW? Does she still have to get her own in order to work? Would time solve her problem at some point? Regardless, in the short-term, and this seems like the best option since you can always bail out of it if things don't go your way into one of the other options. The biggest downside is DW not being able to work meanwhile. That could be a great blessing in disguise as it would force DW to build that skillset of adaptability. She could explore new interests and hobbies. She could find meaningful volunteer work (I assume that's legal?), and even more importantly learn how to do that. She could decide to pour energy into building strong relationships with family and friends, which tends to take a beating once you have kids. The options are endless.

So I'd consider 1, 4, and 3 in that order if I were you.

But those are based on my internal guiding philosophies and values. Most importantly, what are yours? It takes some thought to understand and figure out your own, but once you do, decisions of this sort become much easier.

One downside of laying down the options so nicely and thoughtfully as you have is, responders like me might not think outside the box for other options.

Do report back on what you do, and regardless, I wish you great luck! You sound like a thoughtful couple interested in contributing to society, and we can't have enough of those.

kurious
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Re: Need guidance on charting next life steps

Post by kurious » Sun Oct 14, 2018 1:54 pm

Thank you for the encouragement and wisdom, MrJones.
If you get a H1B, what exactly does that mean for DW? Does she still have to get her own in order to work? Would time solve her problem at some point?
She will not be able to work. I have an ongoing PERM (green card) application. If my H1B were to be successful in such a scenario, DW could have used the H4 EAD provision to work. That provision is slated to get discontinued at the end of this year.
That could be a great blessing in disguise as it would force DW to build that skillset of adaptability. She could explore new interests and hobbies. She could find meaningful volunteer work (I assume that's legal?), and even more importantly learn how to do that.
I will have to differ with that thought at this point. Volunteer work is legal and I get the point here. DW (and me), however, will not be able to overcome our sense of dissatisfaction if she cannot work on a job she considers worthwhile. She went to graduate school here and in her last job was responsible for deliverables that enabled an entire vertical with direct oversight from director and the CFO of a well-regarded firm. Going from such a job to not having one suddenly has been quite a pain to absorb for both of us. We both take immense pride in our work and it is a part of our identity. Even if I made twice as much as I did, a job she finds meaningful is equally important to both of us.
But those are based on my internal guiding philosophies and values. Most importantly, what are yours? It takes some thought to understand and figure out your own, but once you do, decisions of this sort become much easier.
I do not have a good answer to that question yet. However, it is an excellent point to start reflection.

I will report back with what our next plan of action is. Your advice will help shape our thought process.

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Re: Need guidance on charting next life steps

Post by cherijoh » Sun Oct 14, 2018 2:26 pm

kurious wrote:
Sun Oct 14, 2018 2:14 am
I am almost 32. DW is almost 30. No progeny so far. I work for a start-up and am in the final year of my STEM OPT after completing graduate studies. If I don't get a work permit next year, I will need to leave the country in July.

This was my DW's final year of STEM OPT. She had a good job and her application got picked up in the H1B lottery. We just learned that she was denied the visa. She will leave the country next week and try coming back on a dependent visa. We are still trying to come to terms with the fact that half our reason for being in this country as well as income got yanked away from our life.
I'm a little confused about your wife's visa. Was it denied because there were too many H1B applicants and she didn't win one of the slots OR was there something in particular about her visa application that caused it to be denied? If she goes back to India, how long would it take to get a dependent visa? (It might not make sense if she gets her visa next May and you have to leave the country in July).

How far along are you in your application for a green card? Is you current employer sponsoring you? What would happen to your application if you end up leaving the country?

If you opt to stick with your current employer and go to another country, would that leave an opening to transfer back to the States later?

What are your wife's job prospects in India or any of the other countries you mentioned for your job?

kurious
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Re: Need guidance on charting next life steps

Post by kurious » Sun Oct 14, 2018 2:43 pm

Was it denied because there were too many H1B applicants and she didn't win one of the slots OR was there something in particular about her visa application that caused it to be denied?
My wife's application was selected in the lottery. However it was denied because her job wasn't deemed to be a "specialty occupation".
If she goes back to India, how long would it take to get a dependent visa?
A couple of months if all goes well.
How far along are you in your application for a green card? Is you current employer sponsoring you? What would happen to your application if you end up leaving the country?
The wage determination is underway. They had to repeat the process because the prior attorney didn't do a good job the first time. Ended up costing us almost a year in the process. They will soon submit the application. The application will, in all likelihood, continue at its own pace if I leave the country. I don't know if I will ever receive it, given that I do not expect to live for another 150 years.
If you opt to stick with your current employer and go to another country, would that leave an opening to transfer back to the States later?
I think so. I am going out on a limb with a lot of my answers. I have had unflinching support from my employer and I have been absolutely dedicated to them as well (spent my own money on airfare and living in hostels on frequent visits to Boston when they let let me work remotely last year because I needed to be with DW in Seattle).

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Re: Need guidance on charting next life steps

Post by Tdubs » Sun Oct 14, 2018 3:01 pm

Really sympathize with your plight. No idea what to do. As I read your posts, you really, really, really want to stay here. But I don't see any option where your DW can work in the U.S. Is there any long-term scenario where that could happen?

If she stepped out of the work world for a few years and had a family while you got an H1B, would she be able to step back in to a U.S. job later?

If there is no way you stay and eventually find her work, you have to move on. She will never be happy.

kurious
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Re: Need guidance on charting next life steps

Post by kurious » Sun Oct 14, 2018 5:44 pm

Thank you for your kind words.
As I read your posts, you really, really, really want to stay here.
Indeed. I spent several years preparing to get into a highly competitive graduate school (one of those two in Cambridge, MA). I am not anywhere close to the professional heights that I have planned for years to climb. It just feels deeply dissatisfying to not be able to invest myself into the kind of work I intend to do, a function of whether or not I can remain in this country.
If she stepped out of the work world for a few years and had a family while you got an H1B, would she be able to step back in to a U.S. job later?
Even if I manage to find a way, DW will never be truly happy to be a stay-at-home mother. I do not know if she will be able to find a job later. If it's hard now, I cannot fathom it getting any easier after several years of gap in her work experience. I cannot bear to have her go through the kinds of experiences that other women in similar scenarios have.

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Re: Need guidance on charting next life steps

Post by simas » Sun Oct 14, 2018 6:26 pm

Not sure what type of guidance you expect - someone to make choice of various options?

1. Do you (as a family) want to stay at current place (in current arrangement) or not? Can you live with it? If the answer is 'yes', then stay the course and move on. Also, almost 15% bump is exceptionally high for the same role in the same company. "Not a steep increase" is 1.5-2%.

2. If you (as a family) do not want to stay (wife will go crazy , etc.) then actively look and see where that take you (Gulf, India, EU, whatever). Again, make a list in range from 'this would be awesome' to 'no way in hell' and apply to the part you can accept.

I went though H1B ->GC route as well and it is difficult (especially to India, China, Philippines), stress inducing

My recommendation to you would be to have an honest chat with yourself and make decisions based on that. forget passive-aggressive 'I love the company however would also be open to new opportunities', this makes no sense, which one is it? if you want to stay and weather it until you get through PERM, LC/i140, etc then stay on , take your salary that is 2X of median in US and make it work. if grass is greener on the other side, research where you want to be, network like crazy and actively do let people know you want to make a move.

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Re: Need guidance on charting next life steps

Post by KlangFool » Sun Oct 14, 2018 6:45 pm

OP,

My opinion which may or may not help you.

1) You are making low salary while staying in Boston with 120K. So, I have no idea why do you think that this is a good job and opportunity. You are 30+. So, you are wasting valuable youth making a low salary.

2) You are from India. Let's say that you get the H1B visa. How long before you can get your green card? 10 years? 15 years? Meanwhile, your wife is stuck with you in the same situation. So, we have 2 persons in their 30s wasting 10+ years earning a low salary in an HCOL area.

3) After all said and done, then, you get your green card in the 40s. You had wasted all your opportunity to make good money. And, you will face age discrimination.

4) I do not understand why you cannot do the same job and get paid the same in India? Is there no customer for this startup in the AsiaPac area? Can you not fly in to meet the customer in the USA as needed?

In summary, I do not think to stay in the USA is a good deal for you. If you think my opinion is useful, let me know. Then, I might provide more of my opinion.

KlangFool

simas
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Re: Need guidance on charting next life steps

Post by simas » Sun Oct 14, 2018 6:58 pm

KlangFool wrote:
Sun Oct 14, 2018 6:45 pm
4) I do not understand why you cannot do the same job and get paid the same in India? Is there no customer for this startup in the AsiaPac area? Can you not fly in to meet the customer in the USA as needed?

KlangFool
it is unknown whether he would be paid the same if he moves back, very likely he would be paid as local (which he is at that point). So that $120k annual salary that is 'too low' would become 80k rupees a month ($1200?) for which he would have insane competition of hundreds of thousands local universities churn out. You may get to live in hellhole of megacities in India (polluted, dirty, dangerous) and constantly watch over your shoulder, desperately kissing body parts so you can keep your place. India is not special in that regard, that is very similar anywhere else in developing world.

and for those who turn their nose away from 80k rupees, you can also do hard physical labor for 20k ($300) and be very thankful you have permanent job..

in reality $120k in Boston is a ticket to 1st world out of extremely poor country, not only for this couple but also may be for their parents, for their relatives, etc.

if company can keep his US salary when he moves, he should absolutely consider it especially since he and his spouse already bought a house there.

I run into this over and over and over in my experiences with "Indians" (in quotes since it is very many completely different cultures and say Gujarati are not Punjabi and not Kannadigas) which may be very cultural
- very passive and very passive aggressive in some ways. 'I need to prove myself' language .
- very hierachal system, initiative is not expected or welcomed. boss knows better (even when he/she is completely wrong)
- very status aware and status crazy. 2 weddings? 'shame on the family' and other BS.
- refusal to take charge and own the responsibility of ones decision.

so my thoughts to the OP is not be the above. dont be the typical cultural 'indian'. if you want for things to happen , work to make them happen.
I also do not get why coming here (with intent to stay?) , you ended up buying a house back home.
Last edited by simas on Sun Oct 14, 2018 7:02 pm, edited 1 time in total.

HEDGEFUNDIE
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Re: Need guidance on charting next life steps

Post by HEDGEFUNDIE » Sun Oct 14, 2018 7:01 pm

OP, the right forum for you ask this question is on Blind.

Here is a survey back in January when rumors were flying about that H1B extensions would be capped at six years max: “If the H1-B changes materialize and you are deported (or self-deport), where would you go?”

https://teamblind.com/article/If-deport ... t-sGOpD34t

42% of respondents answered “back to home country”

35% said Canada

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Re: Need guidance on charting next life steps

Post by KlingKlang » Sun Oct 14, 2018 7:13 pm

kurious wrote:
Sun Oct 14, 2018 2:14 am
If I don't get a work permit next year, I will need to leave the country in July.
Please leave the country.

Of all of the scores of 401(k) workers that I have tried to mentor over the years the only positive outcome was from a person who is now voluntarily working from back in India.

kurious
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Re: Need guidance on charting next life steps

Post by kurious » Sun Oct 14, 2018 7:25 pm

Thank you, simas. You seem to know the professional set-up in India pretty well. I did have to work very hard to dig myself out of that hole. I do love my country and cannot imagine not being an Indian, but the sad truth for most of us is that we are too many too few opportunities and the effects of it show on the most of us.
I also do not get why coming here (with intent to stay?) , you ended up buying a house back home.
Precisely for a scenario such as this. A roof to call our own where we are not answerable to anybody else when things go south.
in reality $120k in Boston is a ticket to 1st world out of extremely poor country, not only for this couple but also may be for their parents, for their relatives, etc.
Fortunately, this isn't the situation with my family. My parents made every effort to ensure financial independence during retirement. We only have ourselves to take care of financially.
so my thoughts to the OP is not be the above. dont be the typical cultural 'indian'. if you want for things to happen , work to make them happen.
I totally relate to your sentiment. I will get cracking on figuring out what I want, and then strive to get there.

kurious
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Re: Need guidance on charting next life steps

Post by kurious » Sun Oct 14, 2018 7:27 pm

Dear KlangFool,

First up, BIG FAN! I have diligently read your posts on several questions over the last couple of years and learned a lot. Thank you for taking the time to respond to my predicament.
You are making low salary while staying in Boston with 120K. So, I have no idea why do you think that this is a good job and opportunity. You are 30+. So, you are wasting valuable youth making a low salary.
Exactly (about your point of low salary)! I think it's a good job and opportunity because the kinds of problems we solve with the product (as well as my belief that we will be successfully acquired in the next few years). This baby took several years to build by a team of excellent engineers (I am not one of them). I get to use the product to solve fairly difficult data problems for major clients.

A more somber reason is that I am a one-trick-pony as far as tech is concerned. I learned a small piece of highly specialized tech in grad school that is of value to my employer (but not too many others in the market). My experience in consulting is also valuable to my employer. I found my consulting work in the past devoid of meaning. With my current work, I feel like I am making an active contribution towards solving problems that I care about (global drug safety, better clinical trials,etc.)

I have gone back-and-forth several times about trying to become a quasi-techie (that I am not good at) or become a consultant (that I am fairly good at). I still do not have a good answer to that question, but my job is an excellent mix of the two skill-sets and my employer values me for that. They are currently paying me what top performers in my role typically get paid (as per publicly available data) which isn't really a lot of money for the Boston area.
You are from India. Let's say that you get the H1B visa. How long before you can get your green card? 10 years? 15 years?
More like a 150 years by some estimates. It is unfathomable for us to spend a decade with only one person working.
I do not understand why you cannot do the same job and get paid the same in India? Is there no customer for this startup in the AsiaPac area? Can you not fly in to meet the customer in the USA as needed?
Most of our business is in the US with some in Europe. We don't have a formal presence in India. Also, my net savings will get minimized drastically with an equivalent salary in India when accounting for PPP. I can see how my presence in EU, or India, or some place like Dubai could help the company. If I were to approach the management with a proposition, I need to articulate the value proposition for it.

I am very keen to learn more of your thoughts. Please do fill me in.

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Re: Need guidance on charting next life steps

Post by KlangFool » Sun Oct 14, 2018 7:57 pm

kurious wrote:
Sun Oct 14, 2018 7:27 pm

Most of our business is in the US with some in Europe. We don't have a formal presence in India. Also, my net savings will get minimized drastically with an equivalent salary in India when accounting for PPP. I can see how my presence in EU, or India, or some place like Dubai could help the company. If I were to approach the management with a proposition, I need to articulate the value proposition for it.

I am very keen to learn more of your thoughts. Please do fill me in.
kurious,

Please explain what do you mean by this? Do you mean that you will save less money if you make USD $120K but live in India?

Aka, India costs more than Boston?

KlangFool

kurious
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Re: Need guidance on charting next life steps

Post by kurious » Sun Oct 14, 2018 8:24 pm

Not at all!

When an Indian moves to India, the typical practice is to pay a salary in Indian Rupees (INR) that is calculated using Purchasing Power Parity (PPP) value of 0.3. The rule doesn't apply to expats from other countries who instead get a significant raise instead.

A 120k salary in India will equate to:

(120k * 70)/0.3 = INR 2.8M annual salary where 70 is the exchange rate. That isn't a bad salary in India. Because there is extreme economic disparity, the salary is enough to lead a mid- to upper middle class life. The annual savings would be around INR 1.2M.

In Boston, we live quite frugally and spend ~2.7k per month inclusive of rent. We don't want to live like this forever, of course. Continuing our grad school lifestyle has helped us develop a small next egg that I detailed earlier within ~2 years of working here. At our current savings rate, we can probably get to about INR 2.7M in net savings.

It's a different story, of course, if I get to keep my US salary in India. I would argue one's quality of life is better in India (minus the public infrastructure) if one is quite rich compared to here. That I will get to keep my current salary if I move back is unlikely.

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Re: Need guidance on charting next life steps

Post by KlangFool » Sun Oct 14, 2018 9:06 pm

kurious wrote:
Sun Oct 14, 2018 8:24 pm

That I will get to keep my current salary if I move back is unlikely.
kurious,

Why? One of the fundamental questions that you need to ask and answer is if you need to move back to India and work for the same employer with the same job, how much do you want to be paid at? Please note that it is a small startup with a minimal number of employees in India. They could be flexible. It is not a big deal for them to pay you at 120K. In fact, money is probably not the issue for them.

I used to work for a US megacorp. I worked out a deal with my employer that I telecommute for my US job while I live in Asia. In return, I will pay for my own plane ticket to fly into the USA 3 to 4 times per year. If I can work out a deal with a US megacorp, you cannot work something out with a small startup?

In summary, you could become a one-person consulting company in India that they outsourced to.

KlangFool

kurious
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Re: Need guidance on charting next life steps

Post by kurious » Sun Oct 14, 2018 9:14 pm

It's very encouraging that you mention this approach. I had been researching this exact business model last night before posting on this forum. I found that I can be a one person company. That way, my employer doesn't have to go through the hassle of creating an India office and I get to save on taxes.

To be honest, I will prefer being in some place like Dubai that has proximity to 3 continents (I consider myself fairly ambitious) from where I can help build our business.

Your success with this approach gives me a lot of hope.

KlangFool
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Re: Need guidance on charting next life steps

Post by KlangFool » Sun Oct 14, 2018 9:16 pm

OP,

1) I think you have a tunnel vision. I do not know your area of expertize. But, I seriously doubt that you cannot find an equivalent position overseas with some of the larger megacorps like Amazon, Google, Microsoft, IBM, and so on. And, you could be living in places like Europe or Singapore instead of India.

2) If it is going to take a very long time for you to get a green card even if you get your H1B visa, you should plan to get out of the USA.

KlangFool

kurious
Posts: 41
Joined: Mon Nov 07, 2016 12:39 am

Re: Need guidance on charting next life steps

Post by kurious » Sun Oct 14, 2018 9:41 pm

But, I seriously doubt that you cannot find an equivalent position overseas with some of the larger megacorps like Amazon, Google, Microsoft, IBM, and so on
We compete as well as partner with some of the names you mention. An advantage of my job is I get to learn the end-to-end of data management and analytics using a radically different approach using the platform we work with. I expect my learning to not have as much breadth if I switch. Also, I am a small-company person that likes to be in the thick of things instead of being a cog in the wheel of a megacorp. I have worked at megacorp in the past and did not enjoy the experience one bit.
If it is going to take a very long time for you to get a green card even if you get your H1B visa, you should plan to get out of the USA.
I increasingly feel that is what is going to happen.

KlangFool
Posts: 10445
Joined: Sat Oct 11, 2008 12:35 pm

Re: Need guidance on charting next life steps

Post by KlangFool » Sun Oct 14, 2018 9:51 pm

kurious wrote:
Sun Oct 14, 2018 9:41 pm
But, I seriously doubt that you cannot find an equivalent position overseas with some of the larger megacorps like Amazon, Google, Microsoft, IBM, and so on
We compete as well as partner with some of the names you mention. An advantage of my job is I get to learn the end-to-end of data management and analytics using a radically different approach using the platform we work with. I expect my learning to not have as much breadth if I switch. Also, I am a small-company person that likes to be in the thick of things instead of being a cog in the wheel of a megacorp. I have worked at megacorp in the past and did not enjoy the experience one bit.
kurious,

<< Also, I am a small-company person that likes to be in the thick of things instead of being a cog in the wheel of a megacorp. I have worked at megacorp in the past and did not enjoy the experience one bit.>>

Sorry to say this. YOU are probably the source of the problem. I never let my job title limit what I can do and what I can learn. This is independent of whatever environment that I work in (megacorp or small company). For example, I tend to go out lunch with folks from all other departments. And, I always make sure that I bring back gifts and souvenirs to all the secretaries and administrative assistants when I travel.

KlangFool

kurious
Posts: 41
Joined: Mon Nov 07, 2016 12:39 am

Re: Need guidance on charting next life steps

Post by kurious » Sun Oct 14, 2018 10:05 pm

I don't dispute that. If I ever work for a megacorp again, I will do things differently.

simas
Posts: 287
Joined: Wed Apr 04, 2007 5:50 pm

Re: Need guidance on charting next life steps

Post by simas » Wed Oct 17, 2018 9:03 am

Coming back to the thread
Skills - if you do end to end data management (or even most of the data management disciplines as defined by DAMA), you skills are already in very high demand. Note that this is not 'I will see you next fantastic whiz bang disruptor thingy' which frankly people who are in the industry are very tired of. have high confidence in your skillset and continue to grow it

Challenge - your real challenges are two fold , US immigration system and expectations.
US immigration system right now and historically has been skewed towards family based immigration with very little opening (H1B , Perm) for skilled talent. Worse, in name of fairness, there are quotas to insure no single country will overtake the limited number of visas Congress made available so it is worse for high supply countries (China, India, etc). All you already know. you either play in that game or you don't . if you decide to play then grow your skills, manage your expectations , and stick it out. all of the noise about 'I want more pay' etc, forget it as it makes it even harder to make a case for you immigration wise. remember that the idea of sponsoring for permanent residency is that 'no US worker is available with similar skillset for that money' and once you hit 100k + that would be hundreds of resumes instantly for your job out of college. manage your expectations, be real. stop listening to BS of these jobs are plentiful , everywhere, and everyone could get it. 120k is twice annual household income in US. it is extremely high salary by world standards

if you decide not to stick out, see where you can go with Indian national passport in terms of work. expect the same competition (or even stronger), may have to learn other languages, learn to adapt to another culture. on positive side, you may not have to deal with US immigration system. Canada, Europe, etc - I do not know what their provisions are for Indian nationals.


either way you decide, good luck!

KlangFool
Posts: 10445
Joined: Sat Oct 11, 2008 12:35 pm

Re: Need guidance on charting next life steps

Post by KlangFool » Wed Oct 17, 2018 9:10 am

simas wrote:
Wed Oct 17, 2018 9:03 am
Coming back to the thread
Skills - if you do end to end data management (or even most of the data management disciplines as defined by DAMA), you skills are already in very high demand. Note that this is not 'I will see you next fantastic whiz bang disruptor thingy' which frankly people who are in the industry are very tired of. have high confidence in your skillset and continue to grow it

Challenge - your real challenges are two fold , US immigration system and expectations.
US immigration system right now and historically has been skewed towards family based immigration with very little opening (H1B , Perm) for skilled talent. Worse, in name of fairness, there are quotas to insure no single country will overtake the limited number of visas Congress made available so it is worse for high supply countries (China, India, etc). All you already know. you either play in that game or you don't . if you decide to play then grow your skills, manage your expectations , and stick it out. all of the noise about 'I want more pay' etc, forget it as it makes it even harder to make a case for you immigration wise. remember that the idea of sponsoring for permanent residency is that 'no US worker is available with similar skillset for that money' and once you hit 100k + that would be hundreds of resumes instantly for your job out of college. manage your expectations, be real. stop listening to BS of these jobs are plentiful , everywhere, and everyone could get it. 120k is twice annual household income in US. it is extremely high salary by world standards

if you decide not to stick out, see where you can go with Indian national passport in terms of work. expect the same competition (or even stronger), may have to learn other languages, learn to adapt to another culture. on positive side, you may not have to deal with US immigration system. Canada, Europe, etc - I do not know what their provisions are for Indian nationals.


either way you decide, good luck!
simas,

Please refer back to OP's original post.

<< Our ideal state

Our ideal state was both of us working in the US for another 3 years and steadily climbing up the corporate ladder. We had thought of a number that we wanted to hit (~150k outside of maxed-out retirement accounts) and then go back to India. After that, DW planned to work part-time and I planned to join a non-profit or a social enterprise with rural focus. That plan appears untenable as of now.>>

OP's goal is to make and save enough money and move back to India in 3 years.

KlangFool

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