Copy/paste from sister's Living Trust?

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BobaTeaGood
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Copy/paste from sister's Living Trust?

Post by BobaTeaGood » Wed Oct 10, 2018 6:28 pm

My sister and I spent a considerable amount of time discussing her Living Trust. My attorney friend then helped her put it all together into their "template".

So basically, now my sister is done with her Living Trust. Our thinking and lives are similar--both have 2 kids, both want to give equal share to each child, both married, both own a rental home, etc.

Question: should I just "recycle" her Living Trust and just change out the names and assets info? And then get it notarized? This will save me over $1000.

delamer
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Re: Copy/paste from sister's Living Trust?

Post by delamer » Wed Oct 10, 2018 6:43 pm

Sounds like you owe your “attorney friend” some business.

BobaTeaGood
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Re: Copy/paste from sister's Living Trust?

Post by BobaTeaGood » Wed Oct 10, 2018 7:21 pm

delamer wrote:
Wed Oct 10, 2018 6:43 pm
Sounds like you owe your “attorney friend” some business.
Yes. Perhaps a nice dinner out. :oops:

Loik098
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Re: Copy/paste from sister's Living Trust?

Post by Loik098 » Wed Oct 10, 2018 7:25 pm

delamer wrote:
Wed Oct 10, 2018 6:43 pm
Sounds like you owe your “attorney friend” some business.
The business came from OP's sister, so I think OP owes his sister a nice meal out :happy

OP, proceed. Many, many folks DIY this sort of thing, and if you are comfortable in your knowledge of state laws as well as your ability to properly edit such a document to keep it legal, go for it.

That being said, the lawyers here will likely have a different answer for you.

delamer
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Re: Copy/paste from sister's Living Trust?

Post by delamer » Wed Oct 10, 2018 7:54 pm

I meant that maybe you should actually go to your friend and pay her/him some money for legal work rather than doing this on the cheap.

bsteiner
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Re: Copy/paste from sister's Living Trust?

Post by bsteiner » Wed Oct 10, 2018 10:43 pm

BobaTeaGood wrote:
Wed Oct 10, 2018 6:28 pm
My sister and I spent a considerable amount of time discussing her Living Trust. My attorney friend then helped her put it all together into their "template".

So basically, now my sister is done with her Living Trust. Our thinking and lives are similar--both have 2 kids, both want to give equal share to each child, both married, both own a rental home, etc.

Question: should I just "recycle" her Living Trust and just change out the names and assets info? And then get it notarized? This will save me over $1000.
Is there some reason you need a revocable trust? They make sense in some cases and in some states, but not in most cases in most states.

Was your sister's lawyer able to do a good job on such a limited budget?

Did her lawyer prepare the riders to the beneficiary designation forms for her life insurance and retirement benefits?

megabad
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Re: Copy/paste from sister's Living Trust?

Post by megabad » Thu Oct 11, 2018 12:27 pm

BobaTeaGood wrote:
Wed Oct 10, 2018 6:28 pm
My sister and I spent a considerable amount of time discussing her Living Trust. My attorney friend then helped her put it all together into their "template".

So basically, now my sister is done with her Living Trust. Our thinking and lives are similar--both have 2 kids, both want to give equal share to each child, both married, both own a rental home, etc.

Question: should I just "recycle" her Living Trust and just change out the names and assets info? And then get it notarized? This will save me over $1000.
Personally, I would hire an experienced trust attorney. If $1000 is a lot, you probably don't need a revocable trust. That said, I think they can be useful but the problem with revocable trusts is you have to keep them updated and keep moving assets in to them. If you move to a different state, you will have to update it. If you get divorced, you will have to update it. If you have more kids, you will have to update it. At some point, I would want an attorney to make sure everything is still up to date with current situation and current law. Also, if sibling had $500k in assets and I had $500 million, I would probably want a...different...attorney drafting the document. I suspect most siblings are not quite open enough to discuss that kind of specific thing though. Just my thoughts. I mean LegalZoom is a very popular website and they do this everyday so to each his/her own.

sailaway
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Re: Copy/paste from sister's Living Trust?

Post by sailaway » Thu Oct 11, 2018 12:32 pm

Do you and your sister live in the same state?

J295
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Re: Copy/paste from sister's Living Trust?

Post by J295 » Thu Oct 11, 2018 1:36 pm

Ask your friend, the lawyer

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FIREchief
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Re: Copy/paste from sister's Living Trust?

Post by FIREchief » Thu Oct 11, 2018 1:54 pm

megabad wrote:
Thu Oct 11, 2018 12:27 pm

That said, I think they can be useful but the problem with revocable trusts is you have to keep them updated and keep moving assets in to them.
Please exlain what you are referring to here.
I am not a lawyer, accountant or financial advisor. Any advice or suggestions that I may provide shall be considered for entertainment purposes only.

megabad
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Re: Copy/paste from sister's Living Trust?

Post by megabad » Thu Oct 11, 2018 3:58 pm

FIREchief wrote:
Thu Oct 11, 2018 1:54 pm
megabad wrote:
Thu Oct 11, 2018 12:27 pm

That said, I think they can be useful but the problem with revocable trusts is you have to keep them updated and keep moving assets in to them.
Please exlain what you are referring to here.
Well without getting too specific, most recently for me this has meant transferring title of vehicles and rental homes. These are typically not able to be held by the trust initially for various reasons in my case. There are also other forms of compensation that I have received over the years that can't be sent to the trust directly for whatever reason (ie. things like equity compensation plans).

HEDGEFUNDIE
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Re: Copy/paste from sister's Living Trust?

Post by HEDGEFUNDIE » Thu Oct 11, 2018 4:02 pm

megabad wrote:
Thu Oct 11, 2018 3:58 pm
FIREchief wrote:
Thu Oct 11, 2018 1:54 pm
megabad wrote:
Thu Oct 11, 2018 12:27 pm

That said, I think they can be useful but the problem with revocable trusts is you have to keep them updated and keep moving assets in to them.
Please exlain what you are referring to here.
Well without getting too specific, most recently for me this has meant transferring title of vehicles and rental homes. These are typically not able to be held by the trust initially for various reasons in my case. There are also other forms of compensation that I have received over the years that can't be sent to the trust directly for whatever reason (ie. things like equity compensation plans).
Normally you would have your will say that upon your death those types of assets (cars, RSUs, etc.) will go to your trust.

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FIREchief
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Re: Copy/paste from sister's Living Trust?

Post by FIREchief » Thu Oct 11, 2018 4:12 pm

megabad wrote:
Thu Oct 11, 2018 3:58 pm
FIREchief wrote:
Thu Oct 11, 2018 1:54 pm
megabad wrote:
Thu Oct 11, 2018 12:27 pm

That said, I think they can be useful but the problem with revocable trusts is you have to keep them updated and keep moving assets in to them.
Please exlain what you are referring to here.
Well without getting too specific, most recently for me this has meant transferring title of vehicles and rental homes. These are typically not able to be held by the trust initially for various reasons in my case. There are also other forms of compensation that I have received over the years that can't be sent to the trust directly for whatever reason (ie. things like equity compensation plans).
Thanks. Vehicles and most real estate should be a one time thing for most people. I understand that it can get more complicated when loans are involved.
I am not a lawyer, accountant or financial advisor. Any advice or suggestions that I may provide shall be considered for entertainment purposes only.

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celia
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Re: Copy/paste from sister's Living Trust?

Post by celia » Thu Oct 11, 2018 4:25 pm

FIREchief wrote:
Thu Oct 11, 2018 4:12 pm
megabad wrote:
Thu Oct 11, 2018 3:58 pm
Well without getting too specific, most recently for me this has meant transferring title of vehicles and rental homes. These are typically not able to be held by the trust initially for various reasons in my case. There are also other forms of compensation that I have received over the years that can't be sent to the trust directly for whatever reason (ie. things like equity compensation plans).
Thanks. Vehicles and most real estate should be a one time thing for most people. I understand that it can get more complicated when loans are involved.
We were advised not to put vehicles in the trust since you tend to replace them over time. Also having your trust own a vehicle can signal to some people (after an accident) that there must be lots of wealth there, because the vehicle is owned by a trust, rather than a person. You could then be sued for a higher amount.

When we re-financed our house, escrow prepared a new deed for us to sign to change ownership of the house from our trust to our names. While preparing that deed, I asked them to also prepare a new deed for us to sign to put the house back in the trust when everything was finished. We just had to wait until the new mortgage was added as a lien. Then we had the new deed notarized and sent it in. I don't think escrow even charged us for preparing the last deed.

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celia
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Re: Copy/paste from sister's Living Trust?

Post by celia » Thu Oct 11, 2018 4:40 pm

BobaTeaGood wrote:
Wed Oct 10, 2018 6:28 pm
Question: should I just "recycle" her Living Trust and just change out the names and assets info? And then get it notarized? This will save me over $1000.
That might be considered "stealing" someone else's work (similar to copyright infringement).

Why don't you talk to the same lawyer, who would still need to talk to you to see if the same trust template is appropriate for you. Then mention, that since you think the same trust is suitable for you except for changing the names and birthdates and beneficiaries, could you get a discounted price.

It is possible that she will respond that she has used the same template for 100s of trusts. Why should yours be discounted when others paid the going rate? Really, $1,000 isn't that much when you consider what the trust will save you in probate.

Also take into account that the lawyer may have to pay for each use of the software template. Someone needs to maintain that software and they deserve to be paid too.

megabad
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Re: Copy/paste from sister's Living Trust?

Post by megabad » Thu Oct 11, 2018 5:21 pm

celia wrote:
Thu Oct 11, 2018 4:25 pm
FIREchief wrote:
Thu Oct 11, 2018 4:12 pm
megabad wrote:
Thu Oct 11, 2018 3:58 pm
Well without getting too specific, most recently for me this has meant transferring title of vehicles and rental homes. These are typically not able to be held by the trust initially for various reasons in my case. There are also other forms of compensation that I have received over the years that can't be sent to the trust directly for whatever reason (ie. things like equity compensation plans).
Thanks. Vehicles and most real estate should be a one time thing for most people. I understand that it can get more complicated when loans are involved.
We were advised not to put vehicles in the trust since you tend to replace them over time. Also having your trust own a vehicle can signal to some people (after an accident) that there must be lots of wealth there, because the vehicle is owned by a trust, rather than a person. You could then be sued for a higher amount.

When we re-financed our house, escrow prepared a new deed for us to sign to change ownership of the house from our trust to our names. While preparing that deed, I asked them to also prepare a new deed for us to sign to put the house back in the trust when everything was finished. We just had to wait until the new mortgage was added as a lien. Then we had the new deed notarized and sent it in. I don't think escrow even charged us for preparing the last deed.
Keep in mind that a vehicle can be a great deal many things...some of which are not usually subject to the same legal concerns that you have indicated. In my case I was not permitted to have some of my real estate fully owned by the trust at that time it was acquired, but others do not have this issue. Once again, I believe the fact that everyone's situation is different (and changes over time) supports my suggestion to hire an attorney.

megabad
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Re: Copy/paste from sister's Living Trust?

Post by megabad » Thu Oct 11, 2018 5:22 pm

celia wrote:
Thu Oct 11, 2018 4:25 pm
FIREchief wrote:
Thu Oct 11, 2018 4:12 pm
megabad wrote:
Thu Oct 11, 2018 3:58 pm
Well without getting too specific, most recently for me this has meant transferring title of vehicles and rental homes. These are typically not able to be held by the trust initially for various reasons in my case. There are also other forms of compensation that I have received over the years that can't be sent to the trust directly for whatever reason (ie. things like equity compensation plans).
Thanks. Vehicles and most real estate should be a one time thing for most people. I understand that it can get more complicated when loans are involved.
We were advised not to put vehicles in the trust since you tend to replace them over time. Also having your trust own a vehicle can signal to some people (after an accident) that there must be lots of wealth there, because the vehicle is owned by a trust, rather than a person. You could then be sued for a higher amount.

When we re-financed our house, escrow prepared a new deed for us to sign to change ownership of the house from our trust to our names. While preparing that deed, I asked them to also prepare a new deed for us to sign to put the house back in the trust when everything was finished. We just had to wait until the new mortgage was added as a lien. Then we had the new deed notarized and sent it in. I don't think escrow even charged us for preparing the last deed.
Keep in mind that a "vehicle" can be a great deal many things...some of which are not usually subject to the same legal concerns that you have indicated. In my case I was not permitted to have some of my real estate fully owned by the trust at that time it was acquired, but others do not have this issue. Once again, I believe the fact that everyone's situation is different (and changes over time) supports my suggestion to hire an attorney.

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FIREchief
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Re: Copy/paste from sister's Living Trust?

Post by FIREchief » Thu Oct 11, 2018 7:15 pm

celia wrote:
Thu Oct 11, 2018 4:25 pm
We were advised not to put vehicles in the trust since you tend to replace them over time. Also having your trust own a vehicle can signal to some people (after an accident) that there must be lots of wealth there, because the vehicle is owned by a trust, rather than a person. You could then be sued for a higher amount.
The replacement part I don't understand unless loans are involved. If I trade in my car for a new one, and pay cash, I can just as easily conduct the sale and purchase as a trustee versus individual (although, some dealers might be greatly confused).

The insurance one raises some questions. I do not have any vehicles owned by a trust, but have been told by an insurance agent that if the ownership is transferred to a trust, they just add the trust to the auto policy as an additional party with an ownership interest (just like GMAC would have been listed on an auto policy if they held a lien against the car). Specifically, I was told that DW and I would still be the ones listed as the policy holders. I've never leased a car, but I would imagine it works the same way. Ford leasing might own the car, but I would be the one buying insurance for it. How does the other party in an accident even know who or what owns the vehicle. Don't they just recieve the name and insurance policy info from the other driver?
I am not a lawyer, accountant or financial advisor. Any advice or suggestions that I may provide shall be considered for entertainment purposes only.

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cheese_breath
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Re: Copy/paste from sister's Living Trust?

Post by cheese_breath » Thu Oct 11, 2018 9:56 pm

Unless you understand every single word in her trust and your situation is exactly like hers down to the last minute detail I think you need a lawyer. Actually I think you need a lawyer anyway. This is too serious a matter to pinch pennies on.
The surest way to know the future is when it becomes the past.

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