Need for Medicare supplemental plan?

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robebibb
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Re: Need for Medicare supplemental plan?

Post by robebibb » Mon Mar 19, 2018 12:37 pm

fishnskiguy wrote:
Mon Mar 19, 2018 12:05 pm

I agree. My point is that now that she has significant medical issues it is highly likely that the MA plan would be much costlier going forward than a MS plan and had she not relocated, she would be stuck in the MA plan. Folks should consider this when they opt for an inexpensive MA plan when they are young and healthy. It may not work out so well when they are old and get issues.

Chris
Of course there are exceptions but a large percentage of lifetime medical expenses are incurred in the last few years of life. Your mother saved 10s of thousands of dollars by choosing a lower cost plan which she now has available to spend in the last few years of life. It's strange to me that individuals tout increasing car/house deductibles and dropping collision coverage yet don't similarly advocate for lower cost/higher deductible retirement medical coverage. Every case is unique but many could benefit as your mother did from a lower premium higher deductible plan.

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dm200
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Re: Need for Medicare supplemental plan?

Post by dm200 » Mon Mar 19, 2018 12:38 pm

fishnskiguy wrote:
Mon Mar 19, 2018 12:05 pm
dm200 wrote:
Mon Mar 19, 2018 10:12 am
fishnskiguy wrote:
Sun Mar 18, 2018 6:47 pm
My 89 year old mother in law opted for a Medicare Advantage plan with no monthly premium when she retired at age 65. It worked great for her until last September when she was hospitalized for ten days for stage four chronic kidney failure, then discharged for a week and then readmitted for another ten days. She was told that she should no longer live alone, so she moved in with her other daughter and SIL who lived nearby in Philadelphia. In January the family decided it would be best for her to live with my wife and I here in Arizona.
As she was preparing to come out here I did my homework and found out that when permanently relocating, she could shift to a Medicare Supplement Plan F and would not have to answer any medical questions. With congestive heart disease, early stage diabetes along with stage 4 CKD, there would be no way anybody would issue her a medicare supplement plan if they could ask questions. The day she arrived here we signed her up for a no deductible supplement plan with USAA for $209 per month and a drug plan with Express Scripts for $30 per month. Although her only income is SS, we think that is quite affordable.
Two weeks ago she got a bill from the hospital back in Philadelphia for $4,200 for co-pays. When she saw it she had a heart attack. A real one. We rushed her to the ER two blocks away and she was then transported to the hospital by ambulance and stayed there five days. Thanks to the supplement plan she will pay mothing. She is back home with us now and is doing remarkably well.
That medicare supplement plan is making all of us breath easier.
My mission for next week is to contact the hospital in Philly and try to work out a reasonable repayment plan for that $4,200.
Chris
Glad that she was able to get the coverage she wants/needs in the new location.
I did not see what she was most recently paying for her MA plan that had no premiums 24 years ago. Twenty-four years of low/no premiums (to me) makes the $4,200 not seem so financially terrible, on balance. Sounds like she is probably quite a bit ahead, financially.
I agree. My point is that now that she has significant medical issues it is highly likely that the MA plan would be much costlier going forward than a MS plan and had she not relocated, she would be stuck in the MA plan. Folks should consider this when they opt for an inexpensive MA plan when they are young and healthy. It may not work out so well when they are old and get issues.
Chris
I do not disagree. The "quality" (including convenience) aspect can be an important factor as well. Compared with friends and acquaintances on Original Medicare with supplement, we have (for us at least) a very high quality of medical care in a much more convenient environment. That may or may not be true for other MA/MC plans either in this area or other areas. As well, in recent years, at least, enrollment in our plan seems to be growing and facilities and providers being added all the time.

I don't know about other MA/MC plans, but our Kaiser plan offers (can change every year during the fall window) a higher cost ($142 vs $30 this year) plan that has a lower annual out of pocket limit and lower costs/copays for most services.

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dm200
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Re: Need for Medicare supplemental plan?

Post by dm200 » Mon Mar 19, 2018 12:39 pm

robebibb wrote:
Mon Mar 19, 2018 12:37 pm
fishnskiguy wrote:
Mon Mar 19, 2018 12:05 pm
I agree. My point is that now that she has significant medical issues it is highly likely that the MA plan would be much costlier going forward than a MS plan and had she not relocated, she would be stuck in the MA plan. Folks should consider this when they opt for an inexpensive MA plan when they are young and healthy. It may not work out so well when they are old and get issues.
Chris
Of course there are exceptions but a large percentage of lifetime medical expenses are incurred in the last few years of life. Your mother saved 10s of thousands of dollars by choosing a lower cost plan which she now has available to spend in the last few years of life. It's strange to me that individuals tout increasing car/house deductibles and dropping collision coverage yet don't similarly advocate for lower cost/higher deductible retirement medical coverage. Every case is unique but many could benefit as your mother did from a lower premium higher deductible plan.
Yes - good points indeed.

Martello Shores
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Re: Need for Medicare supplemental plan?

Post by Martello Shores » Wed Apr 18, 2018 1:31 pm

We are both turning 65, so trying to research our options. Amazing that CR or our state or Medicare (just a little bit for my area) don't provide outlet for customer evaluation--not even as much info as Amazon provides!! F is being cancelled with hope we'll be more discerning consumers--with no customer satisfaction info, unintelligible/unassailable billing statements (under ACA anyway), and likely, declining capacity. Grr!

We live in Michigan, but may move to Florida in a couple years--apparently will trigger undetermined out-of-state rates...

(An inexpensive little book fr Amazon, "Medicare Demystified", by dermatologist Ronald Kahan was helpful as we commenced this search.)
Last edited by Martello Shores on Thu Apr 19, 2018 5:09 am, edited 1 time in total.

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dm200
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Re: Need for Medicare supplemental plan?

Post by dm200 » Wed Apr 18, 2018 1:40 pm

Martello Shores wrote:
Wed Apr 18, 2018 1:31 pm
We are both turning 65, so trying to research our options. Amazing that CR or our state or Medicare (just a little bit for my area) don't provide outlet for customer evaluation--not even as much info as Amazon provides!! F is being cancelled with hope we'll be more discerning consumers--with no customer satisfaction info, unintelligible/unassailable billing statements (under ACA anyway), and likely, declining capacity. Grr!
We live in Michigan, but may move to Florida in a couple years--apparently will trigger undetermined out-of-state rates...
(An inexpensive little book fr Amazon, "Medicare Demystified", by dermatologist Ronald Kahan was helpful as we commenced.)
Some jurisdictions (our County does) have a department that provides Medicare plan information to residents.

Many seniors (or similar) groups can be networking with experiences of others with various plans and providers.

Martello Shores
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Re: Need for Medicare supplemental plan?

Post by Martello Shores » Wed Apr 18, 2018 2:27 pm

Our county's Council on Aging provided a very long list of insurers, with premiums for various plans (A-N). DH called "Polish Falcons of America" out of curiosity, and was referred to an agent for AARP/United Healthcare...

The state health website listed insurance companies that issued 100 or more policies, which was a far shorter list than the county's, but didn't give plan premiums.

I called the county council to ask if any info on customer satisfaction and was told that they've been discussing maybe providing something like that. (There's a thought! :annoyed) The rep did tell me that the two most popular co. were BCBS and AARP. (Also Priority Health on other side of state.)

Medicare has 3 or 4 stars next to the even fewer plans (mostly HMOs) it lists on its website for my area.

A local, retired nurse practitioner, still a very active volunteer, told us most of her friends had BCBS 'F' and had no complaints, though it isn't cheap. A couple have AARP/United Healthcare, with maybe a complaint or two.

Grateful for this thread...more than a few new considerations to ponder.

Right now I'm thinking F, so I need not review another bill. In the last few years, my opthalmologist's office has twice billed me for services I haven't received (corrected when brought to their attention), and my Primary Care Provider's office has mischaracterized 2017 annual exam and vaccine such that BCBS refuses to pay under ACA. (No relief from PCP, so I'm in a last ditch appeal to BCBS.)

We keep telling ourselves that ours is a GOOD problem--at least we can afford premiums for Medicare and supplemental insurance...

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dm200
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Re: Need for Medicare supplemental plan?

Post by dm200 » Wed Apr 18, 2018 2:32 pm

Martello Shores wrote:
Wed Apr 18, 2018 2:27 pm
Our county's Council on Aging provided a very long list of insurers, with premiums for various plans (A-N). DH called "Polish Falcons of America" out of curiosity, and was referred to an agent for AARP/United Healthcare...

The state health website listed insurance companies that issued 100 or more policies, which was a far shorter list than the county's, but didn't give plan premiums.

I called the county council to ask if any info on customer satisfaction and was told that they've been discussing maybe providing something like that. (There's a thought! :annoyed) The rep did tell me that the two most popular co. were BCBS and AARP. (Also Priority Health on other side of state.)

Medicare has 3 or 4 stars next to the even fewer plans (mostly HMOs) it lists on its website for my area.

A local, retired nurse practitioner, still a very active volunteer, told us most of her friends had BCBS 'F' and had no complaints, though it isn't cheap. A couple have AARP/United Healthcare, with maybe a complaint or two.

Grateful for this thread...more than a few new considerations to ponder.

Right now I'm thinking F, so I need not review another bill. In the last few years, my opthalmologist's office has twice billed me for services I haven't received (corrected when brought to their attention), and my Primary Care Provider's office has mischaracterized 2017 annual exam and vaccine such that BCBS refuses to pay under ACA. (No relief from PCP, so I'm in a last ditch appeal to BCBS.)

We keep telling ourselves that ours is a GOOD problem--at least we can afford premiums for Medicare and supplemental insurance...
Do not exclude evaluating and considering a medicare Advantage (or the less common Medicare Cost) plan. They differ greatly from one another and plans in different areas. With a MA or MC plan, you do not purchase a Supplement. Most MA and MC plans include drug coverage.

Martello Shores
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Re: Need for Medicare supplemental plan?

Post by Martello Shores » Wed Apr 18, 2018 3:19 pm

I suspect MA won't work for us--we live in MI, but hope to move to FL in a couple of years.

Plus we have a summer place in Ontario, so need emergency coverage (being careful to return to the US every 60 days). Would probably return to MI for regular care, but NY is also an option.

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dm200
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Re: Need for Medicare supplemental plan?

Post by dm200 » Wed Apr 18, 2018 3:35 pm

Martello Shores wrote:
Wed Apr 18, 2018 3:19 pm
I suspect MA won't work for us--we live in MI, but hope to move to FL in a couple of years.
Plus we have a summer place in Ontario, so need emergency coverage (being careful to return to the US every 60 days). Would probably return to MI for regular care, but NY is also an option.
Maybe or maybe not. Check out MA plans in both places.

Some MA (or MC) plans have reasonable out of area provisions for emergency/urgent care - and some do not.

Good Listener
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Re: Need for Medicare supplemental plan?

Post by Good Listener » Wed Apr 18, 2018 3:40 pm

If you choose MA and then have medical problems, you may never be able to get a supplement. I wouldn't do it.

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dm200
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Re: Need for Medicare supplemental plan?

Post by dm200 » Wed Apr 18, 2018 3:46 pm

Good Listener wrote:
Wed Apr 18, 2018 3:40 pm
If you choose MA and then have medical problems, you may never be able to get a supplement. I wouldn't do it.
True - to a degree. The issue (in my opinion) can be complex and there are (as best I understand) many reasons why you can later get a supplement when returning to Original medicare from a MA plan. Evaluate the risks/rewards keeping in mind all relevant factors.

You should not pick an MA plan unless you know and understand what the MA plan offers for things like deductibles and maximum annual out of pocket.

Martello Shores
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Re: Need for Medicare supplemental plan?

Post by Martello Shores » Thu Apr 19, 2018 6:06 am

I'd already contacted my SHIP office for my area, but in case useful to others, this was posted on another thread:

Seniors' Resource Guide:
Find your State’s State Health Insurance Assistance Program (SHIP)
https://www.seniorsresourceguide.com/di ... onal/SHIP/

3feetpete
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Re: Need for Medicare supplemental plan?

Post by 3feetpete » Thu Apr 19, 2018 6:35 am

I'm paying $53 per month for a high deductible plan F. That's pretty cheap insurance against 20% of the cost of a major medical issue. The high deductible Plan F is a good choice for people that don't expect much medical expense. It saves around $1,000 a year in premiums so one would have to have over $5,000 in medical expenses to negate those savings. (20% of $5,000 = $1,000)

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munemaker
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Re: Need for Medicare supplemental plan?

Post by munemaker » Thu Apr 19, 2018 7:17 am

dm200 wrote:
Mon Mar 19, 2018 10:12 am
fishnskiguy wrote:
Sun Mar 18, 2018 6:47 pm
My 89 year old mother in law opted for a Medicare Advantage plan with no monthly premium when she retired at age 65. It worked great for her until last September when she was hospitalized for ten days for stage four chronic kidney failure, then discharged for a week and then readmitted for another ten days. She was told that she should no longer live alone, so she moved in with her other daughter and SIL who lived nearby in Philadelphia. In January the family decided it would be best for her to live with my wife and I here in Arizona.
As she was preparing to come out here I did my homework and found out that when permanently relocating, she could shift to a Medicare Supplement Plan F and would not have to answer any medical questions. With congestive heart disease, early stage diabetes along with stage 4 CKD, there would be no way anybody would issue her a medicare supplement plan if they could ask questions. The day she arrived here we signed her up for a no deductible supplement plan with USAA for $209 per month and a drug plan with Express Scripts for $30 per month. Although her only income is SS, we think that is quite affordable.
Two weeks ago she got a bill from the hospital back in Philadelphia for $4,200 for co-pays. When she saw it she had a heart attack. A real one. We rushed her to the ER two blocks away and she was then transported to the hospital by ambulance and stayed there five days. Thanks to the supplement plan she will pay mothing. She is back home with us now and is doing remarkably well.
That medicare supplement plan is making all of us breath easier.
My mission for next week is to contact the hospital in Philly and try to work out a reasonable repayment plan for that $4,200.
Chris
Glad that she was able to get the coverage she wants/needs in the new location.

I did not see what she was most recently paying for her MA plan that had no premiums 24 years ago. Twenty-four years of low/no premiums (to me) makes the $4,200 not seem so financially terrible, on balance. Sounds like she is probably quite a bit ahead, financially.
Her new premium is $2,868/year. She had a heart attack over the $4,200 bill, but doesn't mind the $2,868 premium that has to be paid every year. Doesn't seem all that much different.

jpohio
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Re: Need for Medicare supplemental plan?

Post by jpohio » Thu Apr 19, 2018 8:15 am

When I turned 65 I signed up for Medicare and purchased a Med Supp Plan F. I was in very good health. 3 months later I tore my quad muscle in my leg, required surgery and physical therapy for several months. Doctor also discovered a partial blood clot resulting from my lack of mobility after the surgery. Medicare paid their percentage of all the bills, and the Med Supp plan picked up the rest - did not cost me a cent.

I realize Plan G is probably better choice than F, and I may change in the future, but my out of pocket for this surgery and clot would have far exceeded any premiums I paid for the Med Supp plan.

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munemaker
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Re: Need for Medicare supplemental plan?

Post by munemaker » Thu Apr 19, 2018 2:42 pm

jebmke wrote:
Fri Mar 16, 2018 5:42 pm
invst65 wrote:
Fri Mar 16, 2018 5:15 pm
First time I've ever heard of Plan "G".
G is basically F with a $183 deductible. At some point, F plans will no longer be sold to new enrollees.
Plan F is apparently still available to new enrollees today. I just received an ad in the mail today from Highmark pushing Plan F. They said "...you'll enjoy a monthly premium as low as $155.10..."

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CWRadio
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Re: Need for Medicare supplemental plan?

Post by CWRadio » Thu Apr 19, 2018 2:49 pm

munemaker wrote:
Thu Apr 19, 2018 2:42 pm
jebmke wrote:
Fri Mar 16, 2018 5:42 pm
invst65 wrote:
Fri Mar 16, 2018 5:15 pm
First time I've ever heard of Plan "G".

Plan F is apparently still available to new enrollees today. I just received an ad in the mail today from Highmark pushing Plan F. They said "...you'll enjoy a monthly premium as low as $155.10..."
If plan F goes away the only ones left will be old and sick people. This may cause higher payments in the future due to no younger people joining the plan. Paul

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munemaker
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Re: Need for Medicare supplemental plan?

Post by munemaker » Thu Apr 19, 2018 3:09 pm

CWRadio wrote:
Thu Apr 19, 2018 2:49 pm
munemaker wrote:
Thu Apr 19, 2018 2:42 pm
jebmke wrote:
Fri Mar 16, 2018 5:42 pm
invst65 wrote:
Fri Mar 16, 2018 5:15 pm
First time I've ever heard of Plan "G".

Plan F is apparently still available to new enrollees today. I just received an ad in the mail today from Highmark pushing Plan F. They said "...you'll enjoy a monthly premium as low as $155.10..."
If plan F goes away the only ones left will be old and sick people. This may cause higher payments in the future due to no younger people joining the plan. Paul
Still learning this, but aren't you eligible to change plans once a year? So if they goose the rate, you can skedaddle to another plan, right? Also, doesn't it depend on how the insurance company prices the policy. I thought there were 3 methods and one was aged based?

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FrugalInvestor
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Re: Need for Medicare supplemental plan?

Post by FrugalInvestor » Thu Apr 19, 2018 4:21 pm

munemaker wrote:
Thu Apr 19, 2018 3:09 pm
CWRadio wrote:
Thu Apr 19, 2018 2:49 pm
munemaker wrote:
Thu Apr 19, 2018 2:42 pm
jebmke wrote:
Fri Mar 16, 2018 5:42 pm
invst65 wrote:
Fri Mar 16, 2018 5:15 pm
First time I've ever heard of Plan "G".

Plan F is apparently still available to new enrollees today. I just received an ad in the mail today from Highmark pushing Plan F. They said "...you'll enjoy a monthly premium as low as $155.10..."
If plan F goes away the only ones left will be old and sick people. This may cause higher payments in the future due to no younger people joining the plan. Paul
Still learning this, but aren't you eligible to change plans once a year? So if they goose the rate, you can skedaddle to another plan, right? Also, doesn't it depend on how the insurance company prices the policy. I thought there were 3 methods and one was aged based?
No, you are not automatically eligible to change every year. Do some googling.
IGNORE the noise! | Our life is frittered away by detail... simplify, simplify. - Henry David Thoreau

barefootjan
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Re: Need for Medicare supplemental plan?

Post by barefootjan » Thu Apr 19, 2018 5:38 pm

munemaker wrote:
Thu Apr 19, 2018 3:09 pm
CWRadio wrote:
Thu Apr 19, 2018 2:49 pm
munemaker wrote:
Thu Apr 19, 2018 2:42 pm
jebmke wrote:
Fri Mar 16, 2018 5:42 pm
invst65 wrote:
Fri Mar 16, 2018 5:15 pm
First time I've ever heard of Plan "G".

Plan F is apparently still available to new enrollees today. I just received an ad in the mail today from Highmark pushing Plan F. They said "...you'll enjoy a monthly premium as low as $155.10..."
If plan F goes away the only ones left will be old and sick people. This may cause higher payments in the future due to no younger people joining the plan. Paul
Still learning this, but aren't you eligible to change plans once a year? So if they goose the rate, you can skedaddle to another plan, right? Also, doesn't it depend on how the insurance company prices the policy. I thought there were 3 methods and one was aged based?
Looking through the responses here, I was alarmed to read that an individual might be locked into their Medigap plan. Am I understanding that correctly? Because up til now I thought the only time you might find out later that you'd made an irreversible mistake was if you chose the Advantage plan. I'm not sure how I got this idea (insurance agent?) but I thought that you were free to choose - each year - whatever Medigap plan you wanted.

It's possible I'm mixing up two different types of coverage, since I'm still covered through the Marketplace (ACA bronze plan) but my husband is on Medicare (High deductible F plan). I don't know. Argh. I dread trying to sort this all out as we get older.

Anyway - Munemaker, I thought I'd do the googling for both of us. I didn't want someone's opinion, so I went straight to the source: Medicare.gov.

Switching Medigap policies https://www.medicare.gov/supplement-oth ... igap-.html

I've read it a couple of times and to be honest I'm still not sure under what circumstances you can change your plan. For instance, it says If you decide to change insurance companies, you have a 30-day look back period, but it doesn't say what happens if you decide you don't like the plan. Can you choose another and try that one out for 30 days? Or is the only option to revert back to your previous plan?

Also - is it possible that you can be denied Medigap coverage???? Further on down it says "If your application is accepted, call your current insurance company, and ask for your coverage to end." (emphasis mine) Under what circumstances might it not be accepted?!

It's clear I have a lot more to learn.

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celia
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Re: Need for Medicare supplemental plan?

Post by celia » Thu Apr 19, 2018 5:58 pm

I have been participating in the forum for a long time. It appears that most Bogleheads on Medicare (at least those who post about Medicare) have a supplemental insurance because it pays for the part that Medicare doesn't, assuming the test/ doctor/ hospital is covered by/contracted with Medicare. A minority choose a Medicare Advantage plan (like HMOs) but then you are stuck with one doctor group and may not be able to get Medicare + Supplemental in the future once you have a serious/expensive condition.

For non-hospital services, basically Medicare pays for 80% of the "contract price" and the Supplemental covers the remaining 20%.
For hospitalization, Medicare covers the first 90 days a year and a lifetime reserve of 60 more days (can only be used once). Supplemental pays for hospitalization after this.
Deductibles apply for all of these.
Prescriptions are all together separate from this.

So, if you don't have a Supplemental plan or an HMO, can you afford the part that Medicare doesn't cover?

Spirit Rider
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Re: Need for Medicare supplemental plan?

Post by Spirit Rider » Thu Apr 19, 2018 7:30 pm

munemaker wrote:
Thu Apr 19, 2018 2:42 pm
jebmke wrote:
Fri Mar 16, 2018 5:42 pm
invst65 wrote:
Fri Mar 16, 2018 5:15 pm
First time I've ever heard of Plan "G".
G is basically F with a $183 deductible. At some point, F plans will no longer be sold to new enrollees.
Plan F is apparently still available to new enrollees today. I just received an ad in the mail today from Highmark pushing Plan F. They said "...you'll enjoy a monthly premium as low as $155.10..."
No new enrollment to Plan F allowed after 12/31/2019.

Spirit Rider
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Re: Need for Medicare supplemental plan?

Post by Spirit Rider » Thu Apr 19, 2018 7:58 pm

barefootjan wrote:
Thu Apr 19, 2018 5:38 pm
Looking through the responses here, I was alarmed to read that an individual might be locked into their Medigap plan. Am I understanding that correctly? Because up til now I thought the only time you might find out later that you'd made an irreversible mistake was if you chose the Advantage plan. I'm not sure how I got this idea (insurance agent?) but I thought that you were free to choose - each year - whatever Medigap plan you wanted.
You have a guaranteed issue right during your open enrollment period and under certain other unique circumstances. During this period the insurers must sell you a Medigap policy without regard to pre-existing conditions and can't charge you more than any other policyholder of the same age.

Once you are outside this period and seeking to change the plan and/or insurer, the insurer can subject you to medical underwriting. The insurer can decline to offer you coverage or charge you based on your health and subject you to pre-existing condition limitations.

So technically you are free to change each year, but the insurer is free to say no or charge you more.

Finally, there are a few states that require the insurers to allow you to change once per year with guaranteed issue rights.

montanagirl
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Re: Need for Medicare supplemental plan?

Post by montanagirl » Thu Apr 19, 2018 8:37 pm

Good Listener wrote:
Wed Apr 18, 2018 3:40 pm
If you choose MA and then have medical problems, you may never be able to get a supplement. I wouldn't do it.
I got laid off at 65 and took advantage of the loophole of "trying" MA the first year, with guaranteed issue when I switched to F a year later. It cost only 33/mo.

bberris
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Re: Need for Medicare supplemental plan?

Post by bberris » Thu Apr 19, 2018 9:49 pm

I'm curious about the Doc asking for a supplemental plan and refusing service if you don't have one. Isn't that just because the copays are hard to collect from the self insured?
I have an individual plan (not medicare) with a 13,000 deductible. No one asks me to pay until I get the bill, even when the sign says "Copays are due on day of service."

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munemaker
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Re: Need for Medicare supplemental plan?

Post by munemaker » Fri Apr 20, 2018 7:58 am

FrugalInvestor wrote:
Thu Apr 19, 2018 4:21 pm


No, you are not automatically eligible to change every year. Do some googling.
Googling, it looks like you have the right to switch from one Medicare Advantage plan to another Medicare Advantage plan once a year. However the same does not apply to Medigap (You don't have the right to switch from one Medigap plan to another Medigap plan once a year).

As someone else pointed out, if you want to switch from Medicare Advantage to Medigap, you can move out of the coverage area of the Medicare Advantage Plan.

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dm200
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Re: Need for Medicare supplemental plan?

Post by dm200 » Fri Apr 20, 2018 8:03 am

montanagirl wrote:
Thu Apr 19, 2018 8:37 pm
Good Listener wrote:
Wed Apr 18, 2018 3:40 pm
If you choose MA and then have medical problems, you may never be able to get a supplement. I wouldn't do it.
I got laid off at 65 and took advantage of the loophole of "trying" MA the first year, with guaranteed issue when I switched to F a year later. It cost only 33/mo.
Not sure I would call this a "loophole" - but a low risk way of trying out an MA plan.

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dm200
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Re: Need for Medicare supplemental plan?

Post by dm200 » Fri Apr 20, 2018 8:12 am

celia wrote:
Thu Apr 19, 2018 5:58 pm
I have been participating in the forum for a long time. It appears that most Bogleheads on Medicare (at least those who post about Medicare) have a supplemental insurance because it pays for the part that Medicare doesn't, assuming the test/ doctor/ hospital is covered by/contracted with Medicare. A minority choose a Medicare Advantage plan (like HMOs) but then you are stuck with one doctor group and may not be able to get Medicare + Supplemental in the future once you have a serious/expensive condition.
For non-hospital services, basically Medicare pays for 80% of the "contract price" and the Supplemental covers the remaining 20%.
For hospitalization, Medicare covers the first 90 days a year and a lifetime reserve of 60 more days (can only be used once). Supplemental pays for hospitalization after this.
Deductibles apply for all of these.
Prescriptions are all together separate from this.
So, if you don't have a Supplemental plan or an HMO, can you afford the part that Medicare doesn't cover?
There are varying types of MA plans. Some are like PPOs, while others are like HMOs (two types). While you may be "stuck" with certain doctors, on the other hand you are assured that there are plenty of doctors (primary care and specialty) that will take your plan. As best I understand, almost all MA plans that are not arranged/subsidized for retirees have maximum out of pocket per year amounts you may need to be prepared to pay. Most (as I understand, though, do not have annual deductibles.

I also understand that if your MA plan terminates and there are no MA plans available in your area, you can get a supplement.

montanagirl
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Re: Need for Medicare supplemental plan?

Post by montanagirl » Fri Apr 20, 2018 8:39 am

dm200 wrote:
Fri Apr 20, 2018 8:03 am
montanagirl wrote:
Thu Apr 19, 2018 8:37 pm
Good Listener wrote:
Wed Apr 18, 2018 3:40 pm
If you choose MA and then have medical problems, you may never be able to get a supplement. I wouldn't do it.
I got laid off at 65 and took advantage of the loophole of "trying" MA the first year, with guaranteed issue when I switched to F a year later. It cost only 33/mo.
Not sure I would call this a "loophole" - but a low risk way of trying out an MA plan.
Wasn't sure what to call it, but that's how I used it. It was a bridge to a regular supplement once I got on spousal SS at 66. I had no intention of staying there but it worked out great. But I didn't really use it either.

pshonore
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Re: Need for Medicare supplemental plan?

Post by pshonore » Fri Apr 20, 2018 9:35 am

dm200 wrote:
Fri Apr 20, 2018 8:12 am
celia wrote:
Thu Apr 19, 2018 5:58 pm
I have been participating in the forum for a long time. It appears that most Bogleheads on Medicare (at least those who post about Medicare) have a supplemental insurance because it pays for the part that Medicare doesn't, assuming the test/ doctor/ hospital is covered by/contracted with Medicare. A minority choose a Medicare Advantage plan (like HMOs) but then you are stuck with one doctor group and may not be able to get Medicare + Supplemental in the future once you have a serious/expensive condition.
For non-hospital services, basically Medicare pays for 80% of the "contract price" and the Supplemental covers the remaining 20%.
For hospitalization, Medicare covers the first 90 days a year and a lifetime reserve of 60 more days (can only be used once). Supplemental pays for hospitalization after this.
Deductibles apply for all of these.
Prescriptions are all together separate from this.
So, if you don't have a Supplemental plan or an HMO, can you afford the part that Medicare doesn't cover?
There are varying types of MA plans. Some are like PPOs, while others are like HMOs (two types). While you may be "stuck" with certain doctors, on the other hand you are assured that there are plenty of doctors (primary care and specialty) that will take your plan. As best I understand, almost all MA plans that are not arranged/subsidized for retirees have maximum out of pocket per year amounts you may need to be prepared to pay. Most (as I understand, though, do not have annual deductibles.

I also understand that if your MA plan terminates and there are no MA plans available in your area, you can get a supplement.
I'm being switched by previous employer to an Anthem Medicare Advanatge PPO plan effective 7/1. (Have the option of staying on traditional Medicare with Plan G but that would cost $125/month more than the MA Plan). Anthem Plan is $5 copay for most stuff (office visits, etc) with $100 for ER and $200 for hospital admission. Max annual OOP is $2K. $0 deductible - Same drug coverage either way.

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dm200
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Re: Need for Medicare supplemental plan?

Post by dm200 » Fri Apr 20, 2018 9:39 am

Wasn't sure what to call it, but that's how I used it. It was a bridge to a regular supplement once I got on spousal SS at 66. I had no intention of staying there but it worked out great. But I didn't really use it either.
Glad it worked for you. For those considering an MA plan (vs Original Medicare with supplement), this one year trial period is a good way to learn about an MA plan.

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dm200
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Re: Need for Medicare supplemental plan?

Post by dm200 » Fri Apr 20, 2018 9:42 am

I'm being switched by previous employer to an Anthem Medicare Advanatge PPO plan effective 7/1. (Have the option of staying on traditional Medicare with Plan G but that would cost $125/month more than the MA Plan). Anthem Plan is $5 copay for most stuff (office visits, etc) with $100 for ER and $200 for hospital admission. Max annual OOP is $2K. $0 deductible - Same drug coverage either way.
These employer/retiree MA plans (as does yours) have lower (or much lower) annual OOP and low (or very low) fees and copays compared to regular MA plans Medicare eligible folks can get. An acquaintence of ours is a retired teacher and hers has no cost to her and almost no cost for services. It is great for her because she has multiple and significant health problems.

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Re: Need for Medicare supplemental plan?

Post by barefootjan » Fri Apr 20, 2018 9:43 am

What I don't understand is why, in article after article, there's no mention of the high deductible Plan F? Are high deductible plans only available in some states?

Contrary to a lot of the stories I'm reading about the coming end to Plan F (see https://www.forbes.com/sites/forbesfina ... 72204699a8), my husband chose his because it was the only plan with affordable premiums - not because it was the "Cadillac" of plans. :oops:

If, as this https://www.gomedigap.com/blog/plan-f-going-away/ article states, the intention of the 2015 law is that all Medicare participants "have some skin in the game," how can they justify dropping a plan where the insured has quite a lot of skin in the game?

You would think they'd encourage more high-deductible options, instead of doing away with the only plan (as far as I know) that offers it.

Has anyone seen any mention of a new high deductible offering taking Plan F's place? A high deductible G plan, perhaps?

barefootjan
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Re: Need for Medicare supplemental plan?

Post by barefootjan » Fri Apr 20, 2018 9:52 am

Going back to my OP, this article - Understanding the Hidden Costs in Medicare -
Keeping Your Out of Pocket from Getting Out of Control
- refutes the claim that Medicare supplement plans might not be necessary. But you all knew that already. :wink:
https://www.moneytips.com/understanding ... -medicare

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dm200
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Re: Need for Medicare supplemental plan?

Post by dm200 » Fri Apr 20, 2018 10:20 am

barefootjan wrote:
Fri Apr 20, 2018 9:52 am
Going back to my OP, this article - Understanding the Hidden Costs in Medicare -
Keeping Your Out of Pocket from Getting Out of Control
- refutes the claim that Medicare supplement plans might not be necessary. But you all knew that already. :wink:
https://www.moneytips.com/understanding ... -medicare
very good ...

ncbill
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Re: Need for Medicare supplemental plan?

Post by ncbill » Fri Apr 20, 2018 10:28 am

barefootjan wrote:
Fri Apr 20, 2018 9:43 am
What I don't understand is why, in article after article, there's no mention of the high deductible Plan F? Are high deductible plans only available in some states?

Contrary to a lot of the stories I'm reading about the coming end to Plan F (see https://www.forbes.com/sites/forbesfina ... 72204699a8), my husband chose his because it was the only plan with affordable premiums - not because it was the "Cadillac" of plans. :oops:

If, as this https://www.gomedigap.com/blog/plan-f-going-away/ article states, the intention of the 2015 law is that all Medicare participants "have some skin in the game," how can they justify dropping a plan where the insured has quite a lot of skin in the game?

You would think they'd encourage more high-deductible options, instead of doing away with the only plan (as far as I know) that offers it.

Has anyone seen any mention of a new high deductible offering taking Plan F's place? A high deductible G plan, perhaps?
A high deductible G plan is supposedly coming next year.

BUT, there's not much difference between "regular" F & G plans and G plans are much less expensive here locally.

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munemaker
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Re: Need for Medicare supplemental plan?

Post by munemaker » Fri Apr 20, 2018 12:42 pm

munemaker wrote:
Fri Apr 20, 2018 7:58 am
FrugalInvestor wrote:
Thu Apr 19, 2018 4:21 pm


No, you are not automatically eligible to change every year. Do some googling.
Googling, it looks like you have the right to switch from one Medicare Advantage plan to another Medicare Advantage plan once a year. However the same does not apply to Medigap (You don't have the right to switch from one Medigap plan to another Medigap plan once a year).

As someone else pointed out, if you want to switch from Medicare Advantage to Medigap, you can move out of the coverage area of the Medicare Advantage Plan.
Regarding being able to switch Medigap plans, I did find this (unfortunately I live in PA so this won't help me):
Some States Allow Switching Without Medical Questions
Lucky you if you live in one of the states listed below. These states have laws that will allow you to switch from one Medigap plan to another without answering medical questions. Even if you move to a new insurance company, you will be approved without medical review. See below for each state’s rules:

California and Oregon have the Medigap Birthday Rule. If you are currently enrolled in a Medigap plan, you can change each year during your birth month with no medical questions asked. Learn more about the Birthday Rule here. Compare CA Medigap prices here.

Connecticut and New York have guaranteed issuance for all at anytime. Learn more about CT’s and NY’s 100% guaranteed issuance here. Compare CT & NY Medigap prices here

Missouri has the Medigap Anniversary Rule. This allows you to switch during the anniversary date of when you first signed up. Learn more about MO’s MO Anniversary Rule here. Compare MO Medigap prices here

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Re: Need for Medicare supplemental plan?

Post by Spirit Rider » Fri Apr 20, 2018 1:29 pm

ncbill wrote:
Fri Apr 20, 2018 10:28 am
A high deductible G plan is supposedly coming next year.

BUT, there's not much difference between "regular" F & G plans and G plans are much less expensive here locally
The Plan G high deductible plan was approved by CMS and published in the Federal Register on 9/1/17, but we do not know if any states will approve it in time to allow insurers to offer it for 2019.

You would hope some might, but in many states it requires enabling legislation. We might see it offered by insurers in some states, but I wouldn't be surprised if in many states it isn't available until required by law on 1/1/2020.

I think if anyone is trying to do planning, I would take the worst case approach and assume it will not be available to you until 1/1/2020.

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FrugalInvestor
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Re: Need for Medicare supplemental plan?

Post by FrugalInvestor » Fri Apr 20, 2018 1:47 pm

munemaker wrote:
Fri Apr 20, 2018 7:58 am
FrugalInvestor wrote:
Thu Apr 19, 2018 4:21 pm


No, you are not automatically eligible to change every year. Do some googling.
Googling, it looks like you have the right to switch from one Medicare Advantage plan to another Medicare Advantage plan once a year. However the same does not apply to Medigap (You don't have the right to switch from one Medigap plan to another Medigap plan once a year).

As someone else pointed out, if you want to switch from Medicare Advantage to Medigap, you can move out of the coverage area of the Medicare Advantage Plan.
Here's an article with more details. It's not terribly straightforward - sometimes that's to the insured's advantage and sometimes not.

https://www.ehealthmedicare.com/medicar ... nce-plans/
IGNORE the noise! | Our life is frittered away by detail... simplify, simplify. - Henry David Thoreau

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dm200
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Re: Need for Medicare supplemental plan?

Post by dm200 » Fri Apr 20, 2018 2:26 pm

FrugalInvestor wrote:
Fri Apr 20, 2018 1:47 pm
munemaker wrote:
Fri Apr 20, 2018 7:58 am
FrugalInvestor wrote:
Thu Apr 19, 2018 4:21 pm
No, you are not automatically eligible to change every year. Do some googling.
Googling, it looks like you have the right to switch from one Medicare Advantage plan to another Medicare Advantage plan once a year. However the same does not apply to Medigap (You don't have the right to switch from one Medigap plan to another Medigap plan once a year).
As someone else pointed out, if you want to switch from Medicare Advantage to Medigap, you can move out of the coverage area of the Medicare Advantage Plan.
Here's an article with more details. It's not terribly straightforward - sometimes that's to the insured's advantage and sometimes not.
https://www.ehealthmedicare.com/medicar ... nce-plans/
The question I have is if your MA plan ceases, BUT there are other MA plans available to you, can you go to original medicare and purchase a supplement (without medical underwriting)? The referenced article seems to say that you can.

Martello Shores
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Re: Need for Medicare supplemental plan?

Post by Martello Shores » Fri Apr 20, 2018 2:58 pm

https://www.senior65.com/

Not sure who provided this link, but thanks. Some useful, short articles with questions to keep in mind when researching plans and companies. Agents appear to sell entire range of products but the articles, plus being featured in Forbes, PBS, etc. were reassuring:

"...Senior65.com is made up of our small group of licensed independent agents. We are not captive to one insurance carrier. We are appointed with several of the top Medicare insurance providers such as AARP United Health, Aetna, Anthem, Blue Cross, Blue Shield, Cigna, HealthNet, Humana, Mutual of Omaha, etc in over 40 states."

"While there is NEVER A CHARGE or HIDDEN FEE passed on to our customers, we do receive commissions directly from insurance providers if we help you enroll in a plan. Each insurance provider sets their own commission amounts - although, due to the regulated nature of Medicare supplemental insurance, commissions do not vary much from carrier to carrier. Senior65 strives to provide you with a transparent experience and we guarantee the lowest prices allowed by law..."

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Re: Need for Medicare supplemental plan?

Post by Good Listener » Fri Apr 20, 2018 4:44 pm

dm200 wrote:
Fri Apr 20, 2018 2:26 pm
FrugalInvestor wrote:
Fri Apr 20, 2018 1:47 pm
munemaker wrote:
Fri Apr 20, 2018 7:58 am
FrugalInvestor wrote:
Thu Apr 19, 2018 4:21 pm
No, you are not automatically eligible to change every year. Do some googling.
Googling, it looks like you have the right to switch from one Medicare Advantage plan to another Medicare Advantage plan once a year. However the same does not apply to Medigap (You don't have the right to switch from one Medigap plan to another Medigap plan once a year).
As someone else pointed out, if you want to switch from Medicare Advantage to Medigap, you can move out of the coverage area of the Medicare Advantage Plan.
Here's an article with more details. It's not terribly straightforward - sometimes that's to the insured's advantage and sometimes not.
https://www.ehealthmedicare.com/medicar ... nce-plans/
The question I have is if your MA plan ceases, BUT there are other MA plans available to you, can you go to original medicare and purchase a supplement (without medical underwriting)? The referenced article seems to say that you can.
It's just not worth the risk as far as I am concerned. A supplemental plan can be bought for 200 a month for the Cadillac Plan F and less for other plans.

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munemaker
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Re: Need for Medicare supplemental plan?

Post by munemaker » Fri Apr 20, 2018 8:40 pm

Good Listener wrote:
Fri Apr 20, 2018 4:44 pm
dm200 wrote:
Fri Apr 20, 2018 2:26 pm
FrugalInvestor wrote:
Fri Apr 20, 2018 1:47 pm
munemaker wrote:
Fri Apr 20, 2018 7:58 am
FrugalInvestor wrote:
Thu Apr 19, 2018 4:21 pm
No, you are not automatically eligible to change every year. Do some googling.
Googling, it looks like you have the right to switch from one Medicare Advantage plan to another Medicare Advantage plan once a year. However the same does not apply to Medigap (You don't have the right to switch from one Medigap plan to another Medigap plan once a year).
As someone else pointed out, if you want to switch from Medicare Advantage to Medigap, you can move out of the coverage area of the Medicare Advantage Plan.
Here's an article with more details. It's not terribly straightforward - sometimes that's to the insured's advantage and sometimes not.
https://www.ehealthmedicare.com/medicar ... nce-plans/
The question I have is if your MA plan ceases, BUT there are other MA plans available to you, can you go to original medicare and purchase a supplement (without medical underwriting)? The referenced article seems to say that you can.
It's just not worth the risk as far as I am concerned. A supplemental plan can be bought for 200 a month for the Cadillac Plan F and less for other plans.
So what's the risk? If I go with Plan F/G and Part D, it is $2,500/year. If I go with Medicare Advantage, it is $240/year which is offset by gym membership, with a $4,000 maximum out of pocket. So say you pocket the $2,500 every year until you have a health problem? Seems to me that one approach is not obviously better than the other. I think I will take my chances on being healthy.

ncbill
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Re: Need for Medicare supplemental plan?

Post by ncbill » Sat Apr 21, 2018 8:01 am

munemaker wrote:
Fri Apr 20, 2018 8:40 pm
Good Listener wrote:
Fri Apr 20, 2018 4:44 pm
dm200 wrote:
Fri Apr 20, 2018 2:26 pm
FrugalInvestor wrote:
Fri Apr 20, 2018 1:47 pm
munemaker wrote:
Fri Apr 20, 2018 7:58 am

Googling, it looks like you have the right to switch from one Medicare Advantage plan to another Medicare Advantage plan once a year. However the same does not apply to Medigap (You don't have the right to switch from one Medigap plan to another Medigap plan once a year).
As someone else pointed out, if you want to switch from Medicare Advantage to Medigap, you can move out of the coverage area of the Medicare Advantage Plan.
Here's an article with more details. It's not terribly straightforward - sometimes that's to the insured's advantage and sometimes not.
https://www.ehealthmedicare.com/medicar ... nce-plans/
The question I have is if your MA plan ceases, BUT there are other MA plans available to you, can you go to original medicare and purchase a supplement (without medical underwriting)? The referenced article seems to say that you can.
It's just not worth the risk as far as I am concerned. A supplemental plan can be bought for 200 a month for the Cadillac Plan F and less for other plans.
So what's the risk? If I go with Plan F/G and Part D, it is $2,500/year. If I go with Medicare Advantage, it is $240/year which is offset by gym membership, with a $4,000 maximum out of pocket. So say you pocket the $2,500 every year until you have a health problem? Seems to me that one approach is not obviously better than the other. I think I will take my chances on being healthy.
That plan worked out fine for one of my older relatives until their early 70s.

They saved money by not signing up for Part B until last month.

Now they're in pain but can't afford to start any real treatment until Part B (and Plan G) kick in, starting July 1.

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munemaker
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Re: Need for Medicare supplemental plan?

Post by munemaker » Sat Apr 21, 2018 9:02 am

ncbill wrote:
Sat Apr 21, 2018 8:01 am
munemaker wrote:
Fri Apr 20, 2018 8:40 pm
Good Listener wrote:
Fri Apr 20, 2018 4:44 pm
dm200 wrote:
Fri Apr 20, 2018 2:26 pm
FrugalInvestor wrote:
Fri Apr 20, 2018 1:47 pm

Here's an article with more details. It's not terribly straightforward - sometimes that's to the insured's advantage and sometimes not.
https://www.ehealthmedicare.com/medicar ... nce-plans/
The question I have is if your MA plan ceases, BUT there are other MA plans available to you, can you go to original medicare and purchase a supplement (without medical underwriting)? The referenced article seems to say that you can.
It's just not worth the risk as far as I am concerned. A supplemental plan can be bought for 200 a month for the Cadillac Plan F and less for other plans.
So what's the risk? If I go with Plan F/G and Part D, it is $2,500/year. If I go with Medicare Advantage, it is $240/year which is offset by gym membership, with a $4,000 maximum out of pocket. So say you pocket the $2,500 every year until you have a health problem? Seems to me that one approach is not obviously better than the other. I think I will take my chances on being healthy.
That plan worked out fine for one of my older relatives until their early 70s.

They saved money by not signing up for Part B until last month.

Now they're in pain but can't afford to start any real treatment until Part B (and Plan G) kick in, starting July 1.
I misunderstood. I thought you meant too much risk in an Advantage Plan. You meant too much risk in going bare. I certainly agree I would not risk going without either a supplement Plan (with a drug plan) or an Advantage Plan that includes a drug plan.

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dm200
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Re: Need for Medicare supplemental plan?

Post by dm200 » Sat Apr 21, 2018 9:07 am

If I go with Medicare Advantage, it is $240/year which is offset by gym membership, with a $4,000 maximum out of pocket. So say you pocket the $2,500 every year until you have a health problem? Seems to me that one approach is not obviously better than the other. I think I will take my chances on being healthy.
Yes - I agree with much of this "logic". Our Medicare plans are $30/month ($360/year) - but do not include gym membership. They do include Optometry exams for glasses for $20. Our annual maximum out of pocket if $6,000. Another big pluses (for us) are excellent quality Physicians, access to care 24x7 (urgent care in person, telephone help and smart phone virtual housecalls and quick access to specialists when needed.

ncbill
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Re: Need for Medicare supplemental plan?

Post by ncbill » Sat Apr 21, 2018 3:44 pm

munemaker wrote:
Sat Apr 21, 2018 9:02 am
ncbill wrote:
Sat Apr 21, 2018 8:01 am
munemaker wrote:
Fri Apr 20, 2018 8:40 pm
Good Listener wrote:
Fri Apr 20, 2018 4:44 pm
dm200 wrote:
Fri Apr 20, 2018 2:26 pm


The question I have is if your MA plan ceases, BUT there are other MA plans available to you, can you go to original medicare and purchase a supplement (without medical underwriting)? The referenced article seems to say that you can.
It's just not worth the risk as far as I am concerned. A supplemental plan can be bought for 200 a month for the Cadillac Plan F and less for other plans.
So what's the risk? If I go with Plan F/G and Part D, it is $2,500/year. If I go with Medicare Advantage, it is $240/year which is offset by gym membership, with a $4,000 maximum out of pocket. So say you pocket the $2,500 every year until you have a health problem? Seems to me that one approach is not obviously better than the other. I think I will take my chances on being healthy.
That plan worked out fine for one of my older relatives until their early 70s.

They saved money by not signing up for Part B until last month.

Now they're in pain but can't afford to start any real treatment until Part B (and Plan G) kick in, starting July 1.
I misunderstood. I thought you meant too much risk in an Advantage Plan. You meant too much risk in going bare. I certainly agree I would not risk going without either a supplement Plan (with a drug plan) or an Advantage Plan that includes a drug plan.
How's the network with that advantage plan? (one reason my relative picked a "regular" supplement plan)

And does that $4,000 cover you if you have an in/outpatient procedure, but an out-of-network provider ends up in the mix?

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munemaker
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Re: Need for Medicare supplemental plan?

Post by munemaker » Sun Apr 22, 2018 8:17 pm

ncbill wrote:
Sat Apr 21, 2018 3:44 pm

How's the network with that advantage plan? (one reason my relative picked a "regular" supplement plan)

And does that $4,000 cover you if you have an in/outpatient procedure, but an out-of-network provider ends up in the mix?
The network is University of Pittsburgh Medical Center (UPMC) and they are also the insurer. They are by far the dominant provider network in Western PA, so no problem with the network.

Since the insurer is the same as the provider, I believe being billed for out-of-network providers in a UPMC facility is unlikely. I will make an inquiry to confirm this. Appreciate you mentioning it.

I currently have a similar situation where I have UPMC insurance purchased on the ObamaCare exchange, and it includes UPMC as the Exclusive Provider (EPO). There was an out-of-network provider involved in examining polyps removed during a colonoscopy, and I was not balance billed for that. Not sure who ate the difference, but it was not me.

In addition to the gym membership, this Medicare Advantage Plan provides help with dental exams/cleaning/bite wing x-rays, and vision exams, and includes drug coverage.

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Re: Need for Medicare supplemental plan?

Post by Martello Shores » Mon Apr 23, 2018 4:57 am

Trying to decide between Plan F and G--any thoughts?
(F pays everything. G pays all--except for Part B deductible, now $183 per year.)

1. F is being phased out in 2020, although one can keep plan bought before then. With no new enrollees, the plan will be populated by fewer, older people, so should become more expensive for health insurance agencies? One agent, who was steering me to G, said that in past when a plan was cancelled, the premiums for grandfathered enrollees increased from, say, an annual 2% increase to 5-6%.

2. By cancelling F, the govt wants to make us more careful, less frequent consumers with more "skin in the game". It doesn't seem to me that paying a once-yearly Part B deductible of $183 would accomplish this? I'm wondering if govt, after abolishing F plans, will next restructure the deductible to maybe a smaller one, but for every doctor's visit? The $183 annual Part B deductible one expected to pay in a G plan could then become much more expensive?

F or G--which will be more expensive in the long run??

ETA______________________________________________________

Little-Noticed Medicare Cut Will Cause Medigap Premium Sticker Shock Wildly Unpopular, Says Recent Survey By The Senior Citizens League
PRWeb | April 04, 2018

"A little-noticed Medicare cut is likely to subject roughly 10 percent of beneficiaries to sharply rising Medigap supplement premiums, warns The Senior Citizens League. The provision prohibits beneficiaries from purchasing "first dollar coverage"— popular Medigap policies (F) which cover the Part B deductible — a move that is overwhelmingly disliked by 96 percent of older voters, according to a recent survey by the League.

..."The effect of that change may make itself felt soon," says The Senior Citizens League's Medicare policy analyst Mary Johnson.

"Beneficiaries currently enrolled in Medigap plans F or C will be able to keep their policies," Johnson explains. "However, premiums are likely to undergo sharp increases because the plans won't be taking in any more younger, healthier people to spread the risk," she says. "As people remaining in the plans get sicker and older, they use more medical services, and Medigap Plan F and C premiums are likely to increase sharply —something that Medigap customers need to consider," Johnson notes...."

https://www.benzinga.com/pressreleases/ ... er-shock-w

ETA_________________________________________________________

(Poll) A new proposal before Congress would make sure Medicare Part B premium increases do not exceed 30% of the annual Social Security COLA. Congress should...
__ Adopt this proposal immediately.
__ Leave the COLA and premiums alone.
__ Find a different solution to the problem.

http://seniorsleague.org/legislative-up ... l-20-2018/

ETA___________________________________________________________

"...The hold harmless provision kicks in when the dollar amount of an individual’s Medicare Part B premium rises more than the dollar amount of an individual’s COLA adjustment to prevent a reduction in Social Security benefits. The provision applies to individuals with incomes below $85,000, and whose Medicare Part B premium is automatically deducted from their Social Security benefits...about 35.5 million Social Security recipients were held harmless in 2016 and 2017..."

http://seniorsleague.org/medicare-part- ... ns-league/
Last edited by Martello Shores on Mon Apr 23, 2018 12:28 pm, edited 2 times in total.

Martello Shores
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Re: Need for Medicare supplemental plan?

Post by Martello Shores » Mon Apr 23, 2018 9:03 am

"...A 2017 review by the U.S. Government Accountability Office, for example, found that in some Advantage plans, enrollees in poor health were substantially more likely to dump the plan than those in good health. A recent study by Brown University researchers found that Medicare Advantage enrollees are more likely to enter lower-quality nursing homes compared with people on original Medicare. Earlier studies have also found that people using high-cost services such as nursing-home care disproportionately switch from Medicare Advantage to original Medicare."

"Medicare Advantage “tends to work for people when they are relatively well,” says Judith Stein, executive director of the Center for Medicare Advocacy. “But if they become ill or injured and really need a significant length of care, they’re not as well served.” ..."

https://www.kiplinger.com/article/retir ... witch.html

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