House on the market less than a day. Did listing agent commit fraud?

Non-investing personal finance issues including insurance, credit, real estate, taxes, employment and legal issues such as trusts and wills
clutchied
Posts: 501
Joined: Mon Jan 05, 2015 12:11 pm

Re: House on the market less than a day. Did listing agent commit fraud?

Post by clutchied » Fri Dec 08, 2017 9:26 am

motorcyclesarecool wrote:
Wed Dec 06, 2017 9:39 pm
The motorcyclesarecool family has been in the market for a house for the past year. Yesterday our buyer’s agent contacted us about a property that was at least 95% of our ideal and reasonably priced. We set up a showing for today. Showing was cancelled because the house went under contract last night. The listing agent never even put a sign in front of the house. That has me wondering:
1. On what planet is it in the seller’s best interest not to wait for additional offers when the house just came on the market and showings are scheduled?
2. Could this be a case of a realtor attempting to goose his “average days on the market” stat?
3. If so, it seems like a fraudulent listing. Do I have any recourse? We had to arrange extra childcare. Is there any body that reigns in realtor shenanigans?
sorry you didn't get the house.

It's most likely that you're probably feeling bad you didn't get it :(

staythecourse
Posts: 5522
Joined: Mon Jan 03, 2011 9:40 am

Re: House on the market less than a day. Did listing agent commit fraud?

Post by staythecourse » Fri Dec 08, 2017 9:32 am

dcd72 wrote:
Fri Dec 08, 2017 7:56 am
On one hand you say that a backup offer (secured through continued showings after signing a contract) provides the seller with leverage and that the buyer can use the lack of a backup offer to his or her advantage (e.g., whittling down the sales price after inspection). But on the other hand, you state, "It isn't like the buyer is going to get upset" by continued showings. Those seem tough to reconcile, if the buyer or the buyer's agent is at all savvy.
Why should they get upset if they are professional. BOTH parties signed a legal contract that is enforceable as long as all criteria are met. It is the buyer who would be changing the overall price if they wanted to negotiate a allowances for "fixing x or y or z". It is free country and real estate is ALL about supply and demand. If I owned, which I did, a property that would easily sell I would make sure I am in the firmest position contractually with whoever I chose to go into contract with. If they don't like it who cares. Just find another buyer who will.

There are PLENTY of buyers who use the approach I am talking about of working down the sales price which is unfair to the seller. Many times the seller (if in a good market) does NOT need to take that risk of being put in that situation if they don't want to. Being under contract and then falling out and going back on the market ALWAYS looks like to everyone else something is wrong with the property which puts the seller in a precarious situation.

Good luck.
"The stock market [fluctuation], therefore, is noise. A giant distraction from the business of investing.” | -Jack Bogle

DarthSage
Posts: 159
Joined: Tue Sep 19, 2017 9:39 am

Re: House on the market less than a day. Did listing agent commit fraud?

Post by DarthSage » Fri Dec 08, 2017 3:55 pm

Okay, clearly I should have re-read your post before posting myself.

I'm sorry you lost out on this house. It stinks. But, consider it a lesson learned--next time, you can't wait until the next day. Bring the kids along to the tour if you must--maybe take turns watching them? You and spouse take notes while touring, then sit down and discuss? It's possible if you'd seen the house that first night, and signaled that you were very interested, an offer from you would have at least been considered. No telling if the other people would have offered more, or offered less contingencies or whatever, but you would have had a shot--and you might also have gotten an inkling that there was someone else interested, allowing you to bid accordingly.

I still don't think there's any fraud or shenanigans involved. When my MIL sold her house last year, she just wanted to get rid of it, and priced it to sell. She had three competing bids in 24 hours.

chevca
Posts: 1332
Joined: Wed Jul 26, 2017 11:22 am

Re: House on the market less than a day. Did listing agent commit fraud?

Post by chevca » Fri Dec 08, 2017 4:35 pm

staythecourse wrote:
Fri Dec 08, 2017 9:32 am
dcd72 wrote:
Fri Dec 08, 2017 7:56 am
On one hand you say that a backup offer (secured through continued showings after signing a contract) provides the seller with leverage and that the buyer can use the lack of a backup offer to his or her advantage (e.g., whittling down the sales price after inspection). But on the other hand, you state, "It isn't like the buyer is going to get upset" by continued showings. Those seem tough to reconcile, if the buyer or the buyer's agent is at all savvy.
Why should they get upset if they are professional. BOTH parties signed a legal contract that is enforceable as long as all criteria are met. It is the buyer who would be changing the overall price if they wanted to negotiate a allowances for "fixing x or y or z". It is free country and real estate is ALL about supply and demand. If I owned, which I did, a property that would easily sell I would make sure I am in the firmest position contractually with whoever I chose to go into contract with. If they don't like it who cares. Just find another buyer who will.

There are PLENTY of buyers who use the approach I am talking about of working down the sales price which is unfair to the seller. Many times the seller (if in a good market) does NOT need to take that risk of being put in that situation if they don't want to. Being under contract and then falling out and going back on the market ALWAYS looks like to everyone else something is wrong with the property which puts the seller in a precarious situation.

Good luck.
In this argument you keep making about how unfair the process is to sellers, you do realize the seller can say no to any price reduction or repairs brought up after the inspection, right? You have a very slanted view on this. Seems you may have done better with a Realtor in your situation?

staythecourse
Posts: 5522
Joined: Mon Jan 03, 2011 9:40 am

Re: House on the market less than a day. Did listing agent commit fraud?

Post by staythecourse » Fri Dec 08, 2017 4:50 pm

chevca wrote:
Fri Dec 08, 2017 4:35 pm
staythecourse wrote:
Fri Dec 08, 2017 9:32 am
dcd72 wrote:
Fri Dec 08, 2017 7:56 am
On one hand you say that a backup offer (secured through continued showings after signing a contract) provides the seller with leverage and that the buyer can use the lack of a backup offer to his or her advantage (e.g., whittling down the sales price after inspection). But on the other hand, you state, "It isn't like the buyer is going to get upset" by continued showings. Those seem tough to reconcile, if the buyer or the buyer's agent is at all savvy.
Why should they get upset if they are professional. BOTH parties signed a legal contract that is enforceable as long as all criteria are met. It is the buyer who would be changing the overall price if they wanted to negotiate a allowances for "fixing x or y or z". It is free country and real estate is ALL about supply and demand. If I owned, which I did, a property that would easily sell I would make sure I am in the firmest position contractually with whoever I chose to go into contract with. If they don't like it who cares. Just find another buyer who will.

There are PLENTY of buyers who use the approach I am talking about of working down the sales price which is unfair to the seller. Many times the seller (if in a good market) does NOT need to take that risk of being put in that situation if they don't want to. Being under contract and then falling out and going back on the market ALWAYS looks like to everyone else something is wrong with the property which puts the seller in a precarious situation.

Good luck.
In this argument you keep making about how unfair the process is to sellers, you do realize the seller can say no to any price reduction or repairs brought up after the inspection, right? You have a very slanted view on this. Seems you may have done better with a Realtor in your situation?
My advice is for one to look out for their best interest. If I am the seller I would do what is best for me. If I was the buyer I would do what is best for me. I have bought, sold, and built a million+ home before the age of 40 so can say I am pretty experienced with the process. No offense, to real estate agents, but the process is probably the simplest thing I have seen and see MANY flaws in the system because folks just "go with how it is always done".

As to your question, of course, as the seller you can say no to postinspection demands, but if the buyer walks out you have to put the house back on the market which never looks good as folks start thinking it fell out of contract because of something negative. Besides why even get yourself in that situation if you could just have the advantage of going with a back up offer.

Another town home same as ours sold similar as ours 2 weeks later for less money NOT including the difference in real estate commission savings so I think I just did fine. Real estate is not complex, but the industry (like finance) likes you to think it is so they feel they are needed.

Good luck.

p.s. There is no point arguing about it. If you want to sell your home do it the way you want and if you want to buy one do it your way. Great thing about American is you can do nearly ANYTHING you want. I was giving advice to the OP on things I would have done different after my experience selling on my own. An intelligent person looks at a process and no matter how successful looks at ways to improve it from a system related POV.
"The stock market [fluctuation], therefore, is noise. A giant distraction from the business of investing.” | -Jack Bogle

chevca
Posts: 1332
Joined: Wed Jul 26, 2017 11:22 am

Re: House on the market less than a day. Did listing agent commit fraud?

Post by chevca » Fri Dec 08, 2017 4:59 pm

Then why are you arguing? :wink:

To say the system is unfair to the sellers without saying also that the sellers can say no to the unfair demands is an incomplete statement/argument. Especially in recent years where sellers have the upper hand. The back up offer is likely going to have an inspection done also, right? How is that going to turn out any better of different if the same issues come up?

The dollar amount of your sales and purchases doesn't make you more of an expert either. But, nice humble brag there.

TropikThunder
Posts: 873
Joined: Sun Apr 03, 2016 5:41 pm

Re: House on the market less than a day. Did listing agent commit fraud?

Post by TropikThunder » Tue Dec 12, 2017 2:37 pm

chevca wrote:
Fri Dec 08, 2017 4:59 pm
The dollar amount of your sales and purchases doesn't make you more of an expert either. But, nice humble brag there.
Especially if it’s a single incident. N=1 is unconvincing.

Post Reply