Why NOT make more money?

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bhsince87
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Re: Why NOT make more money?

Post by bhsince87 » Fri Nov 17, 2017 3:39 pm

wrongfunds wrote:
Fri Nov 17, 2017 1:37 pm
And that is one of the big fear of many BH. They might have good handle on their current expenses while employed and while having limited time for spending money but how do they estimate retirement expenses if they have unlimited amount of time to spend it? I know it sounds funny but still it is a legitimate concern.
Yes, this describes me. When we wanted to see what it would be like living off our bare minimum target, we simply set up a "harsh" budget for a year ($48k versus a typical $62k year) , and lived on that.

For retirement, I'm thinking of shooting for an $80k annual budget. But we really can't do trial run of that.
"If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, go home from us in peace." Samuel Adams

SQRT
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Re: Why NOT make more money?

Post by SQRT » Fri Nov 17, 2017 5:40 pm

EnjoyIt wrote:
Fri Nov 17, 2017 10:28 am
SQRT wrote:
Fri Nov 17, 2017 10:04 am
I retired 11years ago with what I thought was quite a lot “more than enough”. The early part of my retirement was influenced by the recession of 2008-2009. For a while it looked like I wouldnt have enough. I would now estimate that our spending is around 25% higher than I had planned for prior to retirement and I am very glad I have the extra spending power.

ThereforeI would recommend building in a fairly big cushion before you retire. Maybe 25%? Obviously it will depend on how much you want to stop working, but if you are building your assets at a fast pace, I would say do so for a while. Obviously, you have to put the pin in it at some point.
May I ask what caused the 25% increase? Is it because you have more money now then you thought you would or is it because expenses outpaced your expectations?
I ended up easily spending the extra 25% and was quite glad we had it.

SQRT
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Re: Why NOT make more money?

Post by SQRT » Fri Nov 17, 2017 5:43 pm

flyingaway wrote:
Fri Nov 17, 2017 10:42 am
SQRT wrote:
Fri Nov 17, 2017 10:04 am
I retired 11years ago with what I thought was quite a lot “more than enough”. The early part of my retirement was influenced by the recession of 2008-2009. For a while it looked like I wouldnt have enough. I would now estimate that our spending is around 25% higher than I had planned for prior to retirement and I am very glad I have the extra spending power.

ThereforeI would recommend building in a fairly big cushion before you retire. Maybe 25%? Obviously it will depend on how much you want to stop working, but if you are building your assets at a fast pace, I would say do so for a while. Obviously, you have to put the pin in it at some point.
Building a 25% cushion is not a problem in this market. I think the market just had about a 25% rise in the past year. It could just drop that much in a few weeks.
Agree. You really need to live through a 2008-2009period to understand this.

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White Coat Investor
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Re: Why NOT make more money?

Post by White Coat Investor » Fri Nov 17, 2017 6:04 pm

EnjoyIt wrote:
Fri Nov 17, 2017 9:07 am
White Coat Investor wrote:
Wed Nov 15, 2017 1:32 am
PhysicianOnFIRE wrote:
Tue Nov 14, 2017 8:23 pm
market timer wrote:
Sat Nov 11, 2017 2:34 am
PhysicianOnFIRE wrote:
Sat Nov 11, 2017 12:33 am
Also, I'm now able to disappear for weeks at a time. My family is embarking on a three-week Spanish immersion adventure starting this Sunday. I wouldn't be able to do so if I were focused on making more money.
This is the main freedom I miss by having a job. In my ideal world, I'd have summers off to travel with the kids, at least for 6 weeks, and another 4 weeks throughout the year. Hardly any jobs offer this. Maybe after I save another million, I'll request an amendment to my contract for 10 weeks of vacation. Worth a shot.
I think you just described the schedule of a teacher. You don't need a million dollars to do that!

:beer
-PoF
I married a teacher, but we never seemed to get this lifestyle. Seriously though, I would LOVE to figure out a way to get the summers completely off but still have a job come Fall. That sounds like a dream.
for you, locums
problem solved

I have an ED doc friend who is credentialed at multiple hospitals. He works when he wants and as much as he wants. Just recently he took 2 months off to travel.
I like owning my job, but if we lost the contract....that's probably the route I'd go. And taking the summers off would be one perk of doing so.
1) Invest you must 2) Time is your friend 3) Impulse is your enemy | 4) Basic arithmetic works 5) Stick to simplicity 6) Stay the course

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flyingaway
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Re: Why NOT make more money?

Post by flyingaway » Sat Nov 18, 2017 9:54 am

I have been calculating my annual retirement expenses to be $80k, with approximately $10k budgeted for travel and leisure. ($20k for healthcare, $20k for various taxes).
I am planning my 1st one-week vacation in 2018 (another thread), which comes around $5k. So I only can do such vacations in two week time, why should I even consider retire? Stay home and watch TV?

I am not a diehard workaholic. I am an advocate of early retirement. As long as I have good affordable retirement activities that are more meaningful than my money-making work, I will retire and enjoy those activities. Note that "affordable" is relative to the money I have. Making more money makes more activities affordable.

DrGoogle2017
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Re: Why NOT make more money?

Post by DrGoogle2017 » Sat Nov 18, 2017 5:03 pm

I would stay away from the week in between Xmas and after New year when I retire. In my years of booking, those dates are expensive. So maybe it’s cheaper at different dates.

afan
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Re: Why NOT make more money?

Post by afan » Sat Nov 18, 2017 6:09 pm

Crow Hunter wrote:
Fri Nov 10, 2017 4:55 pm

No matter how much money you have, you will never be able to buy more time.

How true. But one can draw different conclusions from that.

I do not have as my goal minimizing the total amount of work that I do in my life.
Therefore, I do not plan to retire as soon as I have saved, probably, enough money to survive without further earned income.

I would rather keep working and keep accomplishing things. I would consider "accumulating more money" to be an accomplishment.

If I knew I had a week to live I would take that week off to get my affairs in order.
If I knew I had a year to live, I would simply keep working, saving money and get things in order as needed. If I knew that I would die early in a calendar year, I would consider a Roth conversion, counting on the low tax rate for a partial year of earnings.

I don't like my job, but it pays well. So I will do it as long as I can and it continues to pay well.
We don't know how to beat the market on a risk-adjusted basis, and we don't know anyone that does know either | --Swedroe | We assume that markets are efficient, that prices are right | --Fama

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flyingaway
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Re: Why NOT make more money?

Post by flyingaway » Sun Nov 19, 2017 12:55 am

DrGoogle2017 wrote:
Sat Nov 18, 2017 5:03 pm
I would stay away from the week in between Xmas and after New year when I retire. In my years of booking, those dates are expensive. So maybe it’s cheaper at different dates.
I have plenty of time to do what I want to do, but my wife wants to do something in that week.

DrGoogle2017
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Re: Why NOT make more money?

Post by DrGoogle2017 » Sun Nov 19, 2017 1:49 am

flyingaway wrote:
Sun Nov 19, 2017 12:55 am
DrGoogle2017 wrote:
Sat Nov 18, 2017 5:03 pm
I would stay away from the week in between Xmas and after New year when I retire. In my years of booking, those dates are expensive. So maybe it’s cheaper at different dates.
I have plenty of time to do what I want to do, but my wife wants to do something in that week.
I understand you have a reason to go for that week, but when you retire, you don’t have to go at the most expensive time. Your travel budget may stretch further than 2 weeks.

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flyingaway
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Re: Why NOT make more money?

Post by flyingaway » Sun Nov 19, 2017 1:53 am

DrGoogle2017 wrote:
Sun Nov 19, 2017 1:49 am
flyingaway wrote:
Sun Nov 19, 2017 12:55 am
DrGoogle2017 wrote:
Sat Nov 18, 2017 5:03 pm
I would stay away from the week in between Xmas and after New year when I retire. In my years of booking, those dates are expensive. So maybe it’s cheaper at different dates.
I have plenty of time to do what I want to do, but my wife wants to do something in that week.
I understand you have a reason to go for that week, but when you retire, you don’t have to go at the most expensive time. Your travel budget may stretch further than 2 weeks.
You are absolutely right that in retirement, people will have more freedom to choose their travel time and thus lower their travel expenses. Sorry that I did not get that.

wrongfunds
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Re: Why NOT make more money?

Post by wrongfunds » Sun Nov 19, 2017 12:03 pm

But your point still stands i.e. it is not easy to estimate your actual expenses in retirement based upon your current expenses. I think one should just double them to be safe :-) If you had 70K of travel budget and 70K of rest of living expense, would you then be happy? Round up all of the other sources of income and then see if the numbers work out. Even if the other sources are not immediately available, you should be able to handle that situation for say 5 years or so. I am not longer kidding.

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flyingaway
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Re: Why NOT make more money?

Post by flyingaway » Sun Nov 19, 2017 12:44 pm

wrongfunds wrote:
Sun Nov 19, 2017 12:03 pm
But your point still stands i.e. it is not easy to estimate your actual expenses in retirement based upon your current expenses. I think one should just double them to be safe :-) If you had 70K of travel budget and 70K of rest of living expense, would you then be happy? Round up all of the other sources of income and then see if the numbers work out. Even if the other sources are not immediately available, you should be able to handle that situation for say 5 years or so. I am not longer kidding.
I know you are not serious. But I will have no problem to double the travel budget by just one OMY. I have been saying that one OMY reduces the needs of three years of retirement support.

wrongfunds
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Re: Why NOT make more money?

Post by wrongfunds » Sun Nov 19, 2017 11:48 pm

But I was not talking about doubling the travel budget, I was talking about travel budget being as much as the rest of the expenses aka 7x them :-) How many OMY would it take then? Seriously, your point about being able to do only two 1 week vacation in the travel budget was right on the money. What is the point if you are still limited to couple of weeks even when you have all the time off in the world?

3funder
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Re: Why NOT make more money?

Post by 3funder » Mon Nov 20, 2017 3:45 pm

Because I love quality but hate luxury.

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flyingaway
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Re: Why NOT make more money?

Post by flyingaway » Mon Nov 20, 2017 3:51 pm

wrongfunds wrote:
Sun Nov 19, 2017 11:48 pm
But I was not talking about doubling the travel budget, I was talking about travel budget being as much as the rest of the expenses aka 7x them :-) How many OMY would it take then? Seriously, your point about being able to do only two 1 week vacation in the travel budget was right on the money. What is the point if you are still limited to couple of weeks even when you have all the time off in the world?
Hopefully I will be able to double or triple my planned travel budget before I retire. We do not actually have a budget for travel now, I just have a line item in my retirement planning budget, currently for about $10K/year.

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TheTimeLord
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Re: Why NOT make more money?

Post by TheTimeLord » Mon Nov 20, 2017 3:57 pm

3funder wrote:
Mon Nov 20, 2017 3:45 pm
Because I love quality but hate luxury.
:oops: :confused :oops: :confused :oops:
IMHO, Investing should be about living the life you want, not avoiding the life you fear. | Run, You Clever Boy! [9085]

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HomerJ
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Re: Why NOT make more money?

Post by HomerJ » Tue Nov 21, 2017 12:22 am

daveydoo wrote:
Fri Nov 10, 2017 5:42 pm
The most depressing notion of the 4% withdrawal rate is the expectation that my life will be grocery bills, electric bills, and gas bills. I know the objective is to also average in all the new roofs and new cars and foreign travel and assorted other discretionary spending, but who knows what those numbers will be?
Well, hopefully you are already living that life BEFORE you retire. At least, by the time your kids are grown and you are getting close to retirement.

My wife and I take trips all the time, and buy things when we want, and go out to eat when we want. For the past couple of years, all we've done is check our checking balance on January and again a year later.

So we have a pretty good idea of how much we spend now, which is fairly close to what we will spend in retirement. I mean, add another 20% for a nice buffer, and there you go.

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HomerJ
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Re: Why NOT make more money?

Post by HomerJ » Tue Nov 21, 2017 1:28 am

flyingaway wrote:
Sun Nov 12, 2017 12:45 pm
This example has come up many times. I was thinking about it exactly last night. What if I die very soon? I would die peacefully, knowing that my family would be taken care of without worrying about the money.
You don't care that they would be sad they didn't get some more time with you because you were always working?

(Just playing devil's advocate) :)

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HomerJ
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Re: Why NOT make more money?

Post by HomerJ » Tue Nov 21, 2017 1:31 am

flyingaway wrote:
Sat Nov 18, 2017 9:54 am
I am planning my 1st one-week vacation in 2018 (another thread), which comes around $5k. So I only can do such vacations in two week time, why should I even consider retire? Stay home and watch TV?
The only two things you can think to do in retirement is travel and watch TV?

You probably shouldn't retire.

3funder
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Re: Why NOT make more money?

Post by 3funder » Tue Nov 21, 2017 5:36 am

TheTimeLord wrote:
Mon Nov 20, 2017 3:57 pm
3funder wrote:
Mon Nov 20, 2017 3:45 pm
Because I love quality but hate luxury.
:oops: :confused :oops: :confused :oops:
I'm serious!

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TheTimeLord
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Re: Why NOT make more money?

Post by TheTimeLord » Tue Nov 21, 2017 7:22 am

3funder wrote:
Tue Nov 21, 2017 5:36 am
TheTimeLord wrote:
Mon Nov 20, 2017 3:57 pm
3funder wrote:
Mon Nov 20, 2017 3:45 pm
Because I love quality but hate luxury.
:oops: :confused :oops: :confused :oops:
I'm serious!
I am sure you are I just don't understand what it means unless you are saying time is quality and money is luxury or that quality items costs less than luxury. Thus your comments confuses me.
IMHO, Investing should be about living the life you want, not avoiding the life you fear. | Run, You Clever Boy! [9085]

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flyingaway
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Re: Why NOT make more money?

Post by flyingaway » Tue Nov 21, 2017 8:04 am

HomerJ wrote:
Tue Nov 21, 2017 1:31 am
flyingaway wrote:
Sat Nov 18, 2017 9:54 am
I am planning my 1st one-week vacation in 2018 (another thread), which comes around $5k. So I only can do such vacations in two week time, why should I even consider retire? Stay home and watch TV?
The only two things you can think to do in retirement is travel and watch TV?

You probably shouldn't retire.
Retirement for me is a one way ticket. There is no come back or part-time job.

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TheTimeLord
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Re: Why NOT make more money?

Post by TheTimeLord » Tue Nov 21, 2017 8:17 am

HomerJ wrote:
Tue Nov 21, 2017 1:31 am
flyingaway wrote:
Sat Nov 18, 2017 9:54 am
I am planning my 1st one-week vacation in 2018 (another thread), which comes around $5k. So I only can do such vacations in two week time, why should I even consider retire? Stay home and watch TV?
The only two things you can think to do in retirement is travel and watch TV?

You probably shouldn't retire.
While I can think of some other daily activities to include I must say from my experience taking about a year break from work and talking to retirees there is a lot of watching TV, playing on the internet and puttering around the house involve in retirement. There seem to be 2 common pictures of retirement being painted. One of the new endless adventure, the other of life at a more leisurely unscheduled pace. Frankly, I think those seeking the latter are going to be happier an average than those expecting the former. This coming from a reformed Costco Zombie.
IMHO, Investing should be about living the life you want, not avoiding the life you fear. | Run, You Clever Boy! [9085]

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flyingaway
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Re: Why NOT make more money?

Post by flyingaway » Tue Nov 21, 2017 9:33 am

TheTimeLord wrote:
Tue Nov 21, 2017 7:22 am
3funder wrote:
Tue Nov 21, 2017 5:36 am
TheTimeLord wrote:
Mon Nov 20, 2017 3:57 pm
3funder wrote:
Mon Nov 20, 2017 3:45 pm
Because I love quality but hate luxury.
:oops: :confused :oops: :confused :oops:
I'm serious!
I am sure you are I just don't understand what it means unless you are saying time is quality and money is luxury or that quality items costs less than luxury. Thus your comments confuses me.
I guess he just meant: more money does not mean higher quality, or more money does not necessarily bring more happiness, as quoted in some other places.

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flyingaway
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Re: Why NOT make more money?

Post by flyingaway » Tue Nov 21, 2017 9:36 am

bhsince87 wrote:
Fri Nov 17, 2017 3:39 pm
wrongfunds wrote:
Fri Nov 17, 2017 1:37 pm
And that is one of the big fear of many BH. They might have good handle on their current expenses while employed and while having limited time for spending money but how do they estimate retirement expenses if they have unlimited amount of time to spend it? I know it sounds funny but still it is a legitimate concern.
Yes, this describes me. When we wanted to see what it would be like living off our bare minimum target, we simply set up a "harsh" budget for a year ($48k versus a typical $62k year) , and lived on that.

For retirement, I'm thinking of shooting for an $80k annual budget. But we really can't do trial run of that.
Future expenses are really difficult to be accurate. For example, I just received my house insurance rate for the next year with about 40% increase. I live in an area of no natural disasters and have not had any claim for at least 7 years.

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flyingaway
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Re: Why NOT make more money?

Post by flyingaway » Tue Nov 21, 2017 9:38 am

HomerJ wrote:
Tue Nov 21, 2017 1:28 am
flyingaway wrote:
Sun Nov 12, 2017 12:45 pm
This example has come up many times. I was thinking about it exactly last night. What if I die very soon? I would die peacefully, knowing that my family would be taken care of without worrying about the money.
You don't care that they would be sad they didn't get some more time with you because you were always working?

(Just playing devil's advocate) :)
I am spending more time with my family than many people who are retired.

EnjoyIt
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Re: Why NOT make more money?

Post by EnjoyIt » Tue Nov 21, 2017 10:02 am

TheTimeLord wrote:
Tue Nov 21, 2017 7:22 am
3funder wrote:
Tue Nov 21, 2017 5:36 am
TheTimeLord wrote:
Mon Nov 20, 2017 3:57 pm
3funder wrote:
Mon Nov 20, 2017 3:45 pm
Because I love quality but hate luxury.
:oops: :confused :oops: :confused :oops:
I'm serious!
I am sure you are I just don't understand what it means unless you are saying time is quality and money is luxury or that quality items costs less than luxury. Thus your comments confuses me.
Example:
Honda Accord = quality
vs vs
BMW 535i = luxury

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TheTimeLord
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Re: Why NOT make more money?

Post by TheTimeLord » Tue Nov 21, 2017 10:05 am

EnjoyIt wrote:
Tue Nov 21, 2017 10:02 am
TheTimeLord wrote:
Tue Nov 21, 2017 7:22 am
3funder wrote:
Tue Nov 21, 2017 5:36 am
TheTimeLord wrote:
Mon Nov 20, 2017 3:57 pm
3funder wrote:
Mon Nov 20, 2017 3:45 pm
Because I love quality but hate luxury.
:oops: :confused :oops: :confused :oops:
I'm serious!
I am sure you are I just don't understand what it means unless you are saying time is quality and money is luxury or that quality items costs less than luxury. Thus your comments confuses me.
Example:
Honda Accord = quality
vs vs
BMW 535i = luxury
Lexus ES 350 = Both
IMHO, Investing should be about living the life you want, not avoiding the life you fear. | Run, You Clever Boy! [9085]

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TheTimeLord
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Re: Why NOT make more money?

Post by TheTimeLord » Tue Nov 21, 2017 10:09 am

flyingaway wrote:
Tue Nov 21, 2017 9:33 am
TheTimeLord wrote:
Tue Nov 21, 2017 7:22 am
3funder wrote:
Tue Nov 21, 2017 5:36 am
TheTimeLord wrote:
Mon Nov 20, 2017 3:57 pm
3funder wrote:
Mon Nov 20, 2017 3:45 pm
Because I love quality but hate luxury.
:oops: :confused :oops: :confused :oops:
I'm serious!
I am sure you are I just don't understand what it means unless you are saying time is quality and money is luxury or that quality items costs less than luxury. Thus your comments confuses me.
I guess he just meant: more money does not mean higher quality, or more money does not necessarily bring more happiness, as quoted in some other places.
At some point I am sure that is true, but I think only a very few of those considering OMY have reached the point of maxing out quality and now are just looking to gold plate their possessions. I have no problem with the sentiment but I tend to lean more towards a balance approach on a spectrum instead of a binary one.
IMHO, Investing should be about living the life you want, not avoiding the life you fear. | Run, You Clever Boy! [9085]

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flyingaway
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Re: Why NOT make more money?

Post by flyingaway » Tue Nov 21, 2017 11:45 am

TheTimeLord wrote:
Tue Nov 21, 2017 10:09 am
flyingaway wrote:
Tue Nov 21, 2017 9:33 am
TheTimeLord wrote:
Tue Nov 21, 2017 7:22 am
3funder wrote:
Tue Nov 21, 2017 5:36 am
TheTimeLord wrote:
Mon Nov 20, 2017 3:57 pm


:oops: :confused :oops: :confused :oops:
I'm serious!
I am sure you are I just don't understand what it means unless you are saying time is quality and money is luxury or that quality items costs less than luxury. Thus your comments confuses me.
I guess he just meant: more money does not mean higher quality, or more money does not necessarily bring more happiness, as quoted in some other places.
At some point I am sure that is true, but I think only a very few of those considering OMY have reached the point of maxing out quality and now are just looking to gold plate their possessions. I have no problem with the sentiment but I tend to lean more towards a balance approach on a spectrum instead of a binary one.
Certainly, if I could afford business class seats for international flights, you would not find me doing OMY(s).

wrongfunds
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Re: Why NOT make more money?

Post by wrongfunds » Tue Nov 21, 2017 12:38 pm

Future expenses are really difficult to be accurate. For example, I just received my house insurance rate for the next year with about 40% increase. I live in an area of no natural disasters and have not had any claim for at least 7 years.
You example would make sense if your house insurance costs was costing you $10,000 before and is now going to be $14,000.

Since we are really talking about going from $1000 to $1400 (or something of that order), if your retirement budget does not have enough buffers for multiple unexpected $500 or $1000 expenses, you are not yet ready to retire then.

3funder
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Re: Why NOT make more money?

Post by 3funder » Tue Nov 21, 2017 8:40 pm

TheTimeLord wrote:
Tue Nov 21, 2017 10:05 am
EnjoyIt wrote:
Tue Nov 21, 2017 10:02 am
TheTimeLord wrote:
Tue Nov 21, 2017 7:22 am
3funder wrote:
Tue Nov 21, 2017 5:36 am
TheTimeLord wrote:
Mon Nov 20, 2017 3:57 pm


:oops: :confused :oops: :confused :oops:
I'm serious!
I am sure you are I just don't understand what it means unless you are saying time is quality and money is luxury or that quality items costs less than luxury. Thus your comments confuses me.
Example:
Honda Accord = quality
vs vs
BMW 535i = luxury
Lexus ES 350 = Both
I'm literally saying that luxury doesn't interest me. The definition of luxury isn't the same for everyone, though. In any case, good enough is definitely enough for me.

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TheTimeLord
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Re: Why NOT make more money?

Post by TheTimeLord » Tue Nov 21, 2017 8:42 pm

3funder wrote:
Tue Nov 21, 2017 8:40 pm
TheTimeLord wrote:
Tue Nov 21, 2017 10:05 am
EnjoyIt wrote:
Tue Nov 21, 2017 10:02 am
TheTimeLord wrote:
Tue Nov 21, 2017 7:22 am
3funder wrote:
Tue Nov 21, 2017 5:36 am


I'm serious!
I am sure you are I just don't understand what it means unless you are saying time is quality and money is luxury or that quality items costs less than luxury. Thus your comments confuses me.
Example:
Honda Accord = quality
vs vs
BMW 535i = luxury
Lexus ES 350 = Both
I'm literally saying that luxury doesn't interest me. The definition of luxury isn't the same for everyone, though. In any case, good enough is definitely enough for me.
I get luxury doesn't interest you but you say quality does. My experience is both often cost more. My guess is you value utility which is totally cool.
IMHO, Investing should be about living the life you want, not avoiding the life you fear. | Run, You Clever Boy! [9085]

3funder
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Re: Why NOT make more money?

Post by 3funder » Tue Nov 21, 2017 8:53 pm

TheTimeLord wrote:
Tue Nov 21, 2017 8:42 pm
3funder wrote:
Tue Nov 21, 2017 8:40 pm
TheTimeLord wrote:
Tue Nov 21, 2017 10:05 am
EnjoyIt wrote:
Tue Nov 21, 2017 10:02 am
TheTimeLord wrote:
Tue Nov 21, 2017 7:22 am


I am sure you are I just don't understand what it means unless you are saying time is quality and money is luxury or that quality items costs less than luxury. Thus your comments confuses me.
Example:
Honda Accord = quality
vs vs
BMW 535i = luxury
Lexus ES 350 = Both
I'm literally saying that luxury doesn't interest me. The definition of luxury isn't the same for everyone, though. In any case, good enough is definitely enough for me.
I get luxury doesn't interest you but you say quality does. My experience is both often cost more. My guess is you value utility which is totally cool.
I'd say that's a pretty accurate way of putting it. I don't mind spending money, but if it's something I don't need or feel is particularly important, I can be a tough sell.

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TheTimeLord
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Re: Why NOT make more money?

Post by TheTimeLord » Tue Nov 21, 2017 8:56 pm

3funder wrote:
Tue Nov 21, 2017 8:53 pm
TheTimeLord wrote:
Tue Nov 21, 2017 8:42 pm
3funder wrote:
Tue Nov 21, 2017 8:40 pm
TheTimeLord wrote:
Tue Nov 21, 2017 10:05 am
EnjoyIt wrote:
Tue Nov 21, 2017 10:02 am


Example:
Honda Accord = quality
vs vs
BMW 535i = luxury
Lexus ES 350 = Both
I'm literally saying that luxury doesn't interest me. The definition of luxury isn't the same for everyone, though. In any case, good enough is definitely enough for me.
I get luxury doesn't interest you but you say quality does. My experience is both often cost more. My guess is you value utility which is totally cool.
I'd say that's a pretty accurate way of putting it. I don't mind spending money, but if it's something I don't need or feel is particularly important, I can be a tough sell.
Nothing wrong with that. It seems like the larger my portfolio the more I am like that which seems counter intuitive but I have definitely noticed the trend. Or maybe I am just getting old.
IMHO, Investing should be about living the life you want, not avoiding the life you fear. | Run, You Clever Boy! [9085]

Topic Author
flyingaway
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Re: Why NOT make more money?

Post by flyingaway » Tue Nov 21, 2017 9:10 pm

wrongfunds wrote:
Tue Nov 21, 2017 12:38 pm
Future expenses are really difficult to be accurate. For example, I just received my house insurance rate for the next year with about 40% increase. I live in an area of no natural disasters and have not had any claim for at least 7 years.
You example would make sense if your house insurance costs was costing you $10,000 before and is now going to be $14,000.

Since we are really talking about going from $1000 to $1400 (or something of that order), if your retirement budget does not have enough buffers for multiple unexpected $500 or $1000 expenses, you are not yet ready to retire then.
I am worried about they increase year by year with large percentages and in several categories.

wrongfunds
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Re: Why NOT make more money?

Post by wrongfunds » Wed Nov 22, 2017 9:07 am

Are you not worried that as your living expense go up, may be your salary might not be able to keep up with it?

Suppose you make $200K as gross salary. If you could replace your gross salary at 2% draw, would you then not worry? If you had 8 figures in invest-able assets, you can take out $200K per year forever from $10M kitty and will never run out of money.

Once you realize that even then you will still worry (about black swan events), you will know that your worry has no rational basis.

OldSport
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Re: Why NOT make more money?

Post by OldSport » Wed Nov 22, 2017 9:28 am

flyingaway wrote:
Fri Nov 10, 2017 1:10 pm
There is a thread about "why make more money"? So this one is to discuss about the other side of the story. For myself, I am actually in the middle and in a difficult situation to go either way.

Here is my situation (said before in other threads): We are in early 50s and have achieved financial independence at the comfortable level (4% rule). But my financial independence has no margin of error, i.e., no specific money budgeted for kids' wedding in the future, for slow overseas travels, etc. (only $10K is budgeted for travel), and extra cushion for sequence of return risks, etc.

So why NOT make more money?

The potential problem for me is: Why not make more money to fly in business class, to slow travel overseas in good hotels 6 months every year, to eat lobsters every week, and to buy a luxury car every three years?
There is a huge difference between $10k travel budget and blowing $150k a year in luxury travel.

I would like to hit FI early too, but I'm not sure that will happen. I like working and plan to never stop, but I would not want to work full time til the end.

After hitting FI, I would be happy working 9 months of the year until reaching 60, then I'd dial it down to 6 months a year. I would still want to work 3-6 months a year until I was no longer able, even if I was 70+.

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JDCarpenter
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Re: Why NOT make more money?

Post by JDCarpenter » Wed Nov 22, 2017 10:12 am

OldSport wrote:
Wed Nov 22, 2017 9:28 am
....

There is a huge difference between $10k travel budget and blowing [diligently researching for the proper destinations and journeys to spend only] $150k a year in luxury [to] travel [for most of your days to all the places that your job kept you from seeing properly].

....
Fixed that for my DW (although 150K isn't her budgeting number). :D
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CyclingDuo
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Re: Why NOT make more money?

Post by CyclingDuo » Wed Nov 22, 2017 10:19 am

White Coat Investor wrote:
Wed Nov 15, 2017 1:32 am
I married a teacher, but we never seemed to get this lifestyle. Seriously though, I would LOVE to figure out a way to get the summers completely off but still have a job come Fall. That sounds like a dream.
I would like to say - "It is!"
8-) :D :D

However, that may not apply to everyone who is in a career with Summers off. Both of us are on the same schedule (academic calendar) as we both work in education now even though that is not how we began our careers three decades ago.

There is, of course a trade off for those of us that work in education. 8-) Teachers are paid for 9 months work (even though our paychecks are spread out over 12 months). So the lower salaries in the profession are what they are. Obviously, some in department chair positions are required to work the full 12 months due to administrative duties. Some faculty are also in research which expands beyond the 9 month time frame. Some write books, attend conferences, present papers, or other academic endeavors which eat into their Summers. Regardless, it is difficult for us to find fault with the 4 months on, three weeks to one month off for the December/January holidays, 4 months on - and then Summertime! :beer

It may be a wild ride with regard to the 12 hour days, 6-7 days per week of non-stop work during the semester, but recharging one's batteries during the Summer always seems to provide a clean slate for the next year.

Currently in my 15th year of college teaching (it is my second career). My first career (pro singer) also allowed me to have Summers off (some years I would take contracts for a month - six weeks of Summer work), so I am not complaining about the past 32 years of having at least 2-3 months off every Summer throughout my career. Work related, I have over 50+ overseas round trips as well under my belt. Since morphing into the teaching career, we usually average one big trip a year (international or domestic) every Summer. This career choice allowed us to front end load our lives with world travel as a couple and as a family where we enjoyed all of the experiences. Not to mention living and working overseas for over a decade. We have been very fortunate in that regard, and looking at it in retrospect at this vantage point - we now realize how much of a benefit it has been. We were young, mobile, and had endless energy for all of that. For us, it was just the norm. We knew no other way as it was our reality. (Aside: We have never flown anything but economy/coach over the past 32 years - be it on a 16 hour flight, or a 2 hour flight. And I'm 6'4"!)

So it colors our answer to the OP's question of "Why NOT make more money?" Our answer would be: "Exactly! Why not?"

Since we have been able to practice a miniature retirement on some level every Summer for the past 32 years, neither of us feel the rush to retire early as a result. 56/59 at the moment with plans to carry on in the workplace for many more years. We are positive that if we hadn't experienced the previous 32 years as we did (travel, Summers off, etc.) we would have a different view more akin to the FI/RE crowd who are on a 12 month work schedule with less vacation time.

One set of our parents retired at age 62 (and the father then worked part-time for another 20+ years or so because he was bored stiff and had no hobbies), the other set worked into their 70's and 80's. Not because they had to, but because they still enjoyed it and wanted to work that long. We also have colleagues in our profession who work well into their 60's and 70's and are happy.

Our answer to the OP's question in support of working and making more money for us include (listed in no certain order)...

1. To continue to build the nest egg to include a more comfortable cushion.
2. To pass wealth on to our heirs.
3. To give to charity/philanthropy.
4. To be prepared for the unknown (health, pension, SS, relocating).
5. To account for all of the upcoming recessions during the remainder of our lifetime.

Personally, due to our previous 32 years of Summers off and travel/world experiences, we have no fears of missing out on anything by working longer. So we read a few less books. See a few less movies. Join a few less organizations. Volunteer a few less hours. Are viewed as gray haired senior citizens by our students.

All one needs to travel internationally is a passport and a plane ticket. One week vacation. Two week vacation. 4-5 day weekend. No need for anyone to retire, or wait until retirement for that. :mrgreen:
"Everywhere is within walking distance if you have the time." ~ Steven Wright

Topic Author
flyingaway
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Re: Why NOT make more money?

Post by flyingaway » Wed Nov 22, 2017 11:31 am

CyclingDuo wrote:
Wed Nov 22, 2017 10:19 am
White Coat Investor wrote:
Wed Nov 15, 2017 1:32 am
I married a teacher, but we never seemed to get this lifestyle. Seriously though, I would LOVE to figure out a way to get the summers completely off but still have a job come Fall. That sounds like a dream.
I would like to say - "It is!"
8-) :D :D

However, that may not apply to everyone who is in a career with Summers off. Both of us are on the same schedule (academic calendar) as we both work in education now even though that is not how we began our careers three decades ago.

There is, of course a trade off for those of us that work in education. 8-) Teachers are paid for 9 months work (even though our paychecks are spread out over 12 months). So the lower salaries in the profession are what they are. Obviously, some in department chair positions are required to work the full 12 months due to administrative duties. Some faculty are also in research which expands beyond the 9 month time frame. Some write books, attend conferences, present papers, or other academic endeavors which eat into their Summers. Regardless, it is difficult for us to find fault with the 4 months on, three weeks to one month off for the December/January holidays, 4 months on - and then Summertime! :beer

It may be a wild ride with regard to the 12 hour days, 6-7 days per week of non-stop work during the semester, but recharging one's batteries during the Summer always seems to provide a clean slate for the next year.

Currently in my 15th year of college teaching (it is my second career). My first career (pro singer) also allowed me to have Summers off (some years I would take contracts for a month - six weeks of Summer work), so I am not complaining about the past 32 years of having at least 2-3 months off every Summer throughout my career. Work related, I have over 50+ overseas round trips as well under my belt. Since morphing into the teaching career, we usually average one big trip a year (international or domestic) every Summer. This career choice allowed us to front end load our lives with world travel as a couple and as a family where we enjoyed all of the experiences. Not to mention living and working overseas for over a decade. We have been very fortunate in that regard, and looking at it in retrospect at this vantage point - we now realize how much of a benefit it has been. We were young, mobile, and had endless energy for all of that. For us, it was just the norm. We knew no other way as it was our reality. (Aside: We have never flown anything but economy/coach over the past 32 years - be it on a 16 hour flight, or a 2 hour flight. And I'm 6'4"!)

So it colors our answer to the OP's question of "Why NOT make more money?" Our answer would be: "Exactly! Why not?"

Since we have been able to practice a miniature retirement on some level every Summer for the past 32 years, neither of us feel the rush to retire early as a result. 56/59 at the moment with plans to carry on in the workplace for many more years. We are positive that if we hadn't experienced the previous 32 years as we did (travel, Summers off, etc.) we would have a different view more akin to the FI/RE crowd who are on a 12 month work schedule with less vacation time.

One set of our parents retired at age 62 (and the father then worked part-time for another 20+ years or so because he was bored stiff and had no hobbies), the other set worked into their 70's and 80's. Not because they had to, but because they still enjoyed it and wanted to work that long. We also have colleagues in our profession who work well into their 60's and 70's and are happy.

Our answer to the OP's question in support of working and making more money for us include (listed in no certain order)...

1. To continue to build the nest egg to include a more comfortable cushion.
2. To pass wealth on to our heirs.
3. To give to charity/philanthropy.
4. To be prepared for the unknown (health, pension, SS, relocating).
5. To account for all of the upcoming recessions during the remainder of our lifetime.

Personally, due to our previous 32 years of Summers off and travel/world experiences, we have no fears of missing out on anything by working longer. So we read a few less books. See a few less movies. Join a few less organizations. Volunteer a few less hours. Are viewed as gray haired senior citizens by our students.

All one needs to travel internationally is a passport and a plane ticket. One week vacation. Two week vacation. 4-5 day weekend. No need for anyone to retire, or wait until retirement for that. :mrgreen:
If bot are teachers, there is probably no issue related to needing time off work for travels and other things.

However, I guess the amount of energy that one can devote to work may diminish as one ages. To some point, you might not want to get out of bed and drive to school in snow, especially if you have sufficient amount of money.

I have been losing motivation for work. Although I do not hate my teaching job and I make money out of it. But I cannot think of me still working after 65. I will evaluate my situation every two years after 55.

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bligh
Posts: 1139
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Re: Why NOT make more money?

Post by bligh » Wed Nov 22, 2017 12:03 pm

SQRT wrote:
Fri Nov 17, 2017 5:43 pm
flyingaway wrote:
Fri Nov 17, 2017 10:42 am
SQRT wrote:
Fri Nov 17, 2017 10:04 am
I retired 11years ago with what I thought was quite a lot “more than enough”. The early part of my retirement was influenced by the recession of 2008-2009. For a while it looked like I wouldnt have enough. I would now estimate that our spending is around 25% higher than I had planned for prior to retirement and I am very glad I have the extra spending power.

ThereforeI would recommend building in a fairly big cushion before you retire. Maybe 25%? Obviously it will depend on how much you want to stop working, but if you are building your assets at a fast pace, I would say do so for a while. Obviously, you have to put the pin in it at some point.
Building a 25% cushion is not a problem in this market. I think the market just had about a 25% rise in the past year. It could just drop that much in a few weeks.
Agree. You really need to live through a 2008-2009period to understand this.
Isn't that also accomplished with a withdrawal rate that is more conservative than the generally recommend 4% rule of thumb?

For example A 3.33% withdrawal rate requires you to have ~20% more saved.

Ie. if you set a goal for 30x your annual expenses instead of 25x you are essentially saving 20% extra as part of the safety margin.

If you are upping your expenses by 25% as a safety margin, and then also using a conservative withdrawal of 3%-3.5% in addition to that.. you are essentially shooting for a perpetual withdrawal rate of something like 2.5% or so.

Topic Author
flyingaway
Posts: 2590
Joined: Fri Jan 17, 2014 10:19 am

Re: Why NOT make more money?

Post by flyingaway » Wed Nov 22, 2017 3:45 pm

bligh wrote:
Wed Nov 22, 2017 12:03 pm
SQRT wrote:
Fri Nov 17, 2017 5:43 pm
flyingaway wrote:
Fri Nov 17, 2017 10:42 am
SQRT wrote:
Fri Nov 17, 2017 10:04 am
I retired 11years ago with what I thought was quite a lot “more than enough”. The early part of my retirement was influenced by the recession of 2008-2009. For a while it looked like I wouldnt have enough. I would now estimate that our spending is around 25% higher than I had planned for prior to retirement and I am very glad I have the extra spending power.

ThereforeI would recommend building in a fairly big cushion before you retire. Maybe 25%? Obviously it will depend on how much you want to stop working, but if you are building your assets at a fast pace, I would say do so for a while. Obviously, you have to put the pin in it at some point.
Building a 25% cushion is not a problem in this market. I think the market just had about a 25% rise in the past year. It could just drop that much in a few weeks.
Agree. You really need to live through a 2008-2009period to understand this.
Isn't that also accomplished with a withdrawal rate that is more conservative than the generally recommend 4% rule of thumb?

For example A 3.33% withdrawal rate requires you to have ~20% more saved.

Ie. if you set a goal for 30x your annual expenses instead of 25x you are essentially saving 20% extra as part of the safety margin.

If you are upping your expenses by 25% as a safety margin, and then also using a conservative withdrawal of 3%-3.5% in addition to that.. you are essentially shooting for a perpetual withdrawal rate of something like 2.5% or so.
I am going to take relative valuation into consideration. The market is highly valued at this time. I believe the value of the portffolio needs to be discounted somehow.

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TheTimeLord
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Re: Why NOT make more money?

Post by TheTimeLord » Wed Nov 22, 2017 4:06 pm

flyingaway wrote:
Wed Nov 22, 2017 3:45 pm
bligh wrote:
Wed Nov 22, 2017 12:03 pm
SQRT wrote:
Fri Nov 17, 2017 5:43 pm
flyingaway wrote:
Fri Nov 17, 2017 10:42 am
SQRT wrote:
Fri Nov 17, 2017 10:04 am
I retired 11years ago with what I thought was quite a lot “more than enough”. The early part of my retirement was influenced by the recession of 2008-2009. For a while it looked like I wouldnt have enough. I would now estimate that our spending is around 25% higher than I had planned for prior to retirement and I am very glad I have the extra spending power.

ThereforeI would recommend building in a fairly big cushion before you retire. Maybe 25%? Obviously it will depend on how much you want to stop working, but if you are building your assets at a fast pace, I would say do so for a while. Obviously, you have to put the pin in it at some point.
Building a 25% cushion is not a problem in this market. I think the market just had about a 25% rise in the past year. It could just drop that much in a few weeks.
Agree. You really need to live through a 2008-2009period to understand this.
Isn't that also accomplished with a withdrawal rate that is more conservative than the generally recommend 4% rule of thumb?

For example A 3.33% withdrawal rate requires you to have ~20% more saved.

Ie. if you set a goal for 30x your annual expenses instead of 25x you are essentially saving 20% extra as part of the safety margin.

If you are upping your expenses by 25% as a safety margin, and then also using a conservative withdrawal of 3%-3.5% in addition to that.. you are essentially shooting for a perpetual withdrawal rate of something like 2.5% or so.
I am going to take relative valuation into consideration. The market is highly valued at this time. I believe the value of the portffolio needs to be discounted somehow.
Have you considered discounting it by lowering your equity allocation?
IMHO, Investing should be about living the life you want, not avoiding the life you fear. | Run, You Clever Boy! [9085]

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CyclingDuo
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Re: Why NOT make more money?

Post by CyclingDuo » Wed Nov 22, 2017 4:09 pm

flyingaway wrote:
Wed Nov 22, 2017 11:31 am
If bot are teachers, there is probably no issue related to needing time off work for travels and other things.

However, I guess the amount of energy that one can devote to work may diminish as one ages. To some point, you might not want to get out of bed and drive to school in snow, especially if you have sufficient amount of money.

I have been losing motivation for work. Although I do not hate my teaching job and I make money out of it. But I cannot think of me still working after 65. I will evaluate my situation every two years after 55.
Once we get into our 50's, I do believe it is normal for motivation to wane as things we find personally fulfilling become more important and take center stage compared to something such as career advancement did in our earlier decades. Good time to stop worrying about pleasing people, and enjoy your wisdom, as well as accomplishments that got you to this point. Letting that human capital work for you to build up the nest egg cushion to at least provide enough flexibility in the gap years, and in retirement seems like worthy motivation.

We're personally shooting for age 65 (my spouse) and 67 (for me) as the final working years - in spite of where we stand financially at this point. I expect there to be some doubtful snowy mornings between now and then. However, I listed our reasons in the above post based on your original post.
"Everywhere is within walking distance if you have the time." ~ Steven Wright

Topic Author
flyingaway
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Joined: Fri Jan 17, 2014 10:19 am

Re: Why NOT make more money?

Post by flyingaway » Wed Nov 22, 2017 5:08 pm

TheTimeLord wrote:
Wed Nov 22, 2017 4:06 pm
flyingaway wrote:
Wed Nov 22, 2017 3:45 pm
bligh wrote:
Wed Nov 22, 2017 12:03 pm
SQRT wrote:
Fri Nov 17, 2017 5:43 pm
flyingaway wrote:
Fri Nov 17, 2017 10:42 am


Building a 25% cushion is not a problem in this market. I think the market just had about a 25% rise in the past year. It could just drop that much in a few weeks.
Agree. You really need to live through a 2008-2009period to understand this.
Isn't that also accomplished with a withdrawal rate that is more conservative than the generally recommend 4% rule of thumb?

For example A 3.33% withdrawal rate requires you to have ~20% more saved.

Ie. if you set a goal for 30x your annual expenses instead of 25x you are essentially saving 20% extra as part of the safety margin.

If you are upping your expenses by 25% as a safety margin, and then also using a conservative withdrawal of 3%-3.5% in addition to that.. you are essentially shooting for a perpetual withdrawal rate of something like 2.5% or so.
I am going to take relative valuation into consideration. The market is highly valued at this time. I believe the value of the portffolio needs to be discounted somehow.
Have you considered discounting it by lowering your equity allocation?
Haha, I am doing that, moving from 15% CD to 30% CD+total bond funds in my fixed income allocation.
I am thinking to put everything beyond my FI number to fixed income.

SQRT
Posts: 1243
Joined: Sat Feb 05, 2011 9:44 am

Re: Why NOT make more money?

Post by SQRT » Thu Nov 23, 2017 3:36 am

bligh wrote:
Wed Nov 22, 2017 12:03 pm
SQRT wrote:
Fri Nov 17, 2017 5:43 pm
flyingaway wrote:
Fri Nov 17, 2017 10:42 am
SQRT wrote:
Fri Nov 17, 2017 10:04 am
I retired 11years ago with what I thought was quite a lot “more than enough”. The early part of my retirement was influenced by the recession of 2008-2009. For a while it looked like I wouldnt have enough. I would now estimate that our spending is around 25% higher than I had planned for prior to retirement and I am very glad I have the extra spending power.

ThereforeI would recommend building in a fairly big cushion before you retire. Maybe 25%? Obviously it will depend on how much you want to stop working, but if you are building your assets at a fast pace, I would say do so for a while. Obviously, you have to put the pin in it at some point.
Building a 25% cushion is not a problem in this market. I think the market just had about a 25% rise in the past year. It could just drop that much in a few weeks.
Agree. You really need to live through a 2008-2009period to understand this.
Isn't that also accomplished with a withdrawal rate that is more conservative than the generally recommend 4% rule of thumb?

For example A 3.33% withdrawal rate requires you to have ~20% more saved.

Ie. if you set a goal for 30x your annual expenses instead of 25x you are essentially saving 20% extra as part of the safety margin.

If you are upping your expenses by 25% as a safety margin, and then also using a conservative withdrawal of 3%-3.5% in addition to that.. you are essentially shooting for a perpetual withdrawal rate of something like 2.5% or so.
Yes, you have a point. In my case though, my retirement plan was simply based on spending dividends. This was 15 years ago and I wasn’t aware of the so called 4% rule. Once I retired, it turned out I had more than I thought I would have since my employee options appreciated so much.

Topic Author
flyingaway
Posts: 2590
Joined: Fri Jan 17, 2014 10:19 am

Re: Why NOT make more money?

Post by flyingaway » Thu Nov 23, 2017 11:54 am

SQRT wrote:
Thu Nov 23, 2017 3:36 am
bligh wrote:
Wed Nov 22, 2017 12:03 pm
SQRT wrote:
Fri Nov 17, 2017 5:43 pm
flyingaway wrote:
Fri Nov 17, 2017 10:42 am
SQRT wrote:
Fri Nov 17, 2017 10:04 am
I retired 11years ago with what I thought was quite a lot “more than enough”. The early part of my retirement was influenced by the recession of 2008-2009. For a while it looked like I wouldnt have enough. I would now estimate that our spending is around 25% higher than I had planned for prior to retirement and I am very glad I have the extra spending power.

ThereforeI would recommend building in a fairly big cushion before you retire. Maybe 25%? Obviously it will depend on how much you want to stop working, but if you are building your assets at a fast pace, I would say do so for a while. Obviously, you have to put the pin in it at some point.
Building a 25% cushion is not a problem in this market. I think the market just had about a 25% rise in the past year. It could just drop that much in a few weeks.
Agree. You really need to live through a 2008-2009period to understand this.
Isn't that also accomplished with a withdrawal rate that is more conservative than the generally recommend 4% rule of thumb?

For example A 3.33% withdrawal rate requires you to have ~20% more saved.

Ie. if you set a goal for 30x your annual expenses instead of 25x you are essentially saving 20% extra as part of the safety margin.

If you are upping your expenses by 25% as a safety margin, and then also using a conservative withdrawal of 3%-3.5% in addition to that.. you are essentially shooting for a perpetual withdrawal rate of something like 2.5% or so.
Yes, you have a point. In my case though, my retirement plan was simply based on spending dividends. This was 15 years ago and I wasn’t aware of the so called 4% rule. Once I retired, it turned out I had more than I thought I would have since my employee options appreciated so much.
The unpredictable healthcare cost really scares me, even a 25% cushion does not mitigate my concern when I am 12 years away from Medicare. I would feel much better if I am 2 years away with a 25% cushion.

SQRT
Posts: 1243
Joined: Sat Feb 05, 2011 9:44 am

Re: Why NOT make more money?

Post by SQRT » Thu Nov 23, 2017 12:09 pm

@Flyingaway: Yes. I understand, but being Canadian healthcare not much of an issue for me.

Topic Author
flyingaway
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Re: Why NOT make more money?

Post by flyingaway » Thu Nov 23, 2017 12:13 pm

CyclingDuo wrote:
Wed Nov 22, 2017 4:09 pm
flyingaway wrote:
Wed Nov 22, 2017 11:31 am
If bot are teachers, there is probably no issue related to needing time off work for travels and other things.

However, I guess the amount of energy that one can devote to work may diminish as one ages. To some point, you might not want to get out of bed and drive to school in snow, especially if you have sufficient amount of money.

I have been losing motivation for work. Although I do not hate my teaching job and I make money out of it. But I cannot think of me still working after 65. I will evaluate my situation every two years after 55.
Once we get into our 50's, I do believe it is normal for motivation to wane as things we find personally fulfilling become more important and take center stage compared to something such as career advancement did in our earlier decades. Good time to stop worrying about pleasing people, and enjoy your wisdom, as well as accomplishments that got you to this point. Letting that human capital work for you to build up the nest egg cushion to at least provide enough flexibility in the gap years, and in retirement seems like worthy motivation.

We're personally shooting for age 65 (my spouse) and 67 (for me) as the final working years - in spite of where we stand financially at this point. I expect there to be some doubtful snowy mornings between now and then. However, I listed our reasons in the above post based on your original post.
I was very ambitious before 42 and was working 7 days a week and 12 hours a day, on lots of interesting research topics. I began losing ambitions after 42 and now am just OK to have average performance. Finding this board and other early retirement forums really makes me feel that I want to get out as soon as possible. But on another thought, my job is no longer demanding and my portfolio is not rock solid yet. So I will hang on there and make a little bit more money, while I start experimenting retirement.

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