How much money do you want to retire?

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toocold
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Re: A poll: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by toocold » Wed Aug 02, 2017 9:57 pm

46. Targeting 50. About $6M with a passive income of $200k / year from 50 to 65.

Gropes & Ray
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Re: A poll: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by Gropes & Ray » Wed Aug 02, 2017 9:59 pm

To maintain my current lifestyle would probably take $2 million. But at 31, I would be reluctant to retire with that amount. Probably would want $3 million for cushion. In the future without student loans or mortgage or minor kids, my number would drop to around $1.5 million.

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David Jay
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Re: A poll: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by David Jay » Wed Aug 02, 2017 10:05 pm

I need $700,000 in retirement assets and a paid off home to retire at 62.

I am 60, with $700,000 in retirement assets and a $40,000 mortgage. I have about 18 months to get the mortgage paid off and achieve my goal.
Prediction is very difficult, especially about the future - Niels Bohr | To get the "risk premium", you really do have to take the risk - nisiprius

furikake
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Re: A poll: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by furikake » Wed Aug 02, 2017 10:11 pm

Hyperborea wrote: That all being said, I think there is something really out of whack where a 2% withdrawal is shown to not be enough. You aren't inputing a portfolio all in bonds or something are you?
No, I put in 84/13/3. I have 1% failure with this. I think it likes more bonds.

furikake
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Re: A poll: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by furikake » Wed Aug 02, 2017 10:12 pm

goblue100 wrote:
furikake wrote: I don't think it was a mistake. They randomly select the data, and since I'm in my mid-40's, the most I could choose was 50 years, and with 50 years of data, there were more down years compared to less than 50 years.

On firecalc, I found that the worst case scenario was 49 years, anything 50 and above would give me better results, so I stick with 49.
I think we are talking about this calculator?
https://retirementplans.vanguard.com/VG ... ggCalc.jsf

I used 40,000 withdrawal, 50 years, and a portfolio of 2.250 million(56x), and I get a 100% success rate if I use a 60 / 40 stock bond split. With more equities there was a 1 or 2% failure rate.
Right, I put in more equities, I got 1% failure.

furikake
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Re: A poll: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by furikake » Wed Aug 02, 2017 10:16 pm

temco_rep wrote: Just curious about the folks that answered, how are you paying for health care when you retired 50 to say 58?
I'm not retired yet because of this. I'm keeping my business for my group insurance since group insurance is more stable. If we go to Universal Healthcare, I'll sell my business and retire. :mrgreen: We have no pre-existing conditions but who knows what will happen in the future...

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Hyperborea
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Re: A poll: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by Hyperborea » Wed Aug 02, 2017 10:30 pm

furikake wrote:
goblue100 wrote:
furikake wrote: I don't think it was a mistake. They randomly select the data, and since I'm in my mid-40's, the most I could choose was 50 years, and with 50 years of data, there were more down years compared to less than 50 years.

On firecalc, I found that the worst case scenario was 49 years, anything 50 and above would give me better results, so I stick with 49.
I think we are talking about this calculator?
https://retirementplans.vanguard.com/VG ... ggCalc.jsf

I used 40,000 withdrawal, 50 years, and a portfolio of 2.250 million(56x), and I get a 100% success rate if I use a 60 / 40 stock bond split. With more equities there was a 1 or 2% failure rate.
Right, I put in more equities, I got 1% failure.
First, your failure rates are far lower than I had expected from the earlier discussion.

Second, I had a quick look at the linked retirement calculator. It's a Monte Carlo based calculator. Some people like them but I find them to be simplistic. They generally use only the statistics for a single time series without any correlation between them. They use some simple statistics (sometimes quite flawed) and generate a number for each piece of data for each simulated year. There is no connection in the model between the various pieces of data for the simulated model year. So, the interest rate data has no connection the bond rate data nor to the simulated stock returns. This can create non-sensical scenarios. Most people consider the failure rate threshold for Monte Carlo simulators to be higher than that from historical calculators. Even given that your portfolio survives almost all of the time in Monte Carlo.

Third, when planning for retirement, you will never get 100% chance of survival from the calculators until you are so far over-funded or under-withdrawing that you have wasted years of your life. The calculators generally assume that you will withdraw robotically, year after year the same amount. In real life it doesn't work that way. If the markets are down you will likely spend a little less and vice versa. Retirement withdrawals aren't static things you set and forget forever. They are planning guides to help you decide if you can retire.

I wouldn't worry about such low failure rates. Maybe you should read something William Bernstein wrote about portfolio failure rates from the calculators - http://www.efficientfrontier.com/ef/901/hell3.htm
"Plans are worthless, but planning is everything." - Dwight D. Eisenhower

blevine
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Re: A poll: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by blevine » Wed Aug 02, 2017 10:37 pm

So how do you count the 401k ?
Dollar for dollar, not same as your taxable savings.
And if you have large unrealized gain in taxable, is that really the same as if you had none ?

Kinda hard to meausure a total without considering the tax liabilities or possibly liquidity. If all your NW is tied up in real estate, then what ? You have to sell or live off cash flow.

Point is, not only are expenses a variable, but so is the value of your portfolio.

I just say save ALOT. More is better than less.
Then LBYM in retirement, whatever your means.

TheNightsToCome
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Re: A poll: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by TheNightsToCome » Wed Aug 02, 2017 10:46 pm

furikake wrote:
temco_rep wrote: Just curious about the folks that answered, how are you paying for health care when you retired 50 to say 58?
I'm not retired yet because of this. I'm keeping my business for my group insurance since group insurance is more stable. If we go to Universal Healthcare, I'll sell my business and retire. :mrgreen: We have no pre-existing conditions but who knows what will happen in the future...
I'm also reluctant to retire before Medicare eligibility.

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HomerJ
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Re: A poll: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by HomerJ » Wed Aug 02, 2017 10:51 pm

The answer to the question depends on WHEN we retire just as much as HOW MUCH we need.

We've been living on $6k a month ($72,000 a year) very comfortably, traveling often, and doing nearly everything we would want to do in retirement. That's with zero debt, and no house payments. Let's make it an even $80,000 a year to give us an extra buffer.

We're in our early 50s (if you average our ages).

To generate $80,000 right now, I'd want 33x expenses (3% withdrawal rate), since we're retiring early. That would be $2.6 million.

But if we wait another 7-8 years or so, my wife will be able to pull $2000 a month in Social Security, AND I'd be comfortable with a 4% withdrawal rate since we would be an average age of 60 together.

That's a huge difference. Now we only need $60k or so from our investments, and we only need 25x expenses. Which is $1.5 million.

Working another 7-8 years drops our "retirement number" from $2.6 million to $1.5 million.

Hmm... that doesn't make any sense, if I think about it further. If we only need $80,000 a year for the next 8 years, then we really only need $640,000 to get us through the gap until the wife hits Social Security age, and we're old enough to be comfortable with a 4% withdrawal rate and a $1.5 million portfolio.

So I guess... to retire today, we'd want $2.1 million or so (in addition to the paid off house)

But we're not very close to that, so I guess we keep on working... :)

But each year, the stash gets larger, and the amount needed gets smaller. :)

Calli114
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Re: A poll: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by Calli114 » Wed Aug 02, 2017 11:07 pm

HomerJ wrote:The answer to the question depends on WHEN we retire just as much as HOW MUCH we need.

We've been living on $6k a month ($72,000 a year) very comfortably, traveling often, and doing nearly everything we would want to do in retirement. That's with zero debt, and no house payments. Let's make it an even $80,000 a year to give us an extra buffer.

We're in our early 50s (if you average our ages).

To generate $80,000 right now, I'd want 33x expenses (3% withdrawal rate), since we're retiring early. That would be $2.6 million.

But if we wait another 7-8 years or so, my wife will be able to pull $2000 a month in Social Security, AND I'd be comfortable with a 4% withdrawal rate since we would be an average age of 60 together.

That's a huge difference. Now we only need $60k or so from our investments, and we only need 25x expenses. Which is $1.5 million.

Working another 7-8 years drops our "retirement number" from $2.6 million to $1.5 million.

Hmm... that doesn't make any sense, if I think about it further. If we only need $80,000 a year for the next 8 years, then we really only need $640,000 to get us through the gap until the wife hits Social Security age, and we're old enough to be comfortable with a 4% withdrawal rate and a $1.5 million portfolio.

So I guess... to retire today, we'd want $2.1 million or so (in addition to the paid off house)

But we're not very close to that, so I guess we keep on working... :)

But each year, the stash gets larger, and the amount needed gets smaller. :)
I like your calculations; my thoughts are similar!

furikake
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Re: A poll: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by furikake » Wed Aug 02, 2017 11:11 pm

Hyperborea wrote:
furikake wrote:
goblue100 wrote:
furikake wrote: I don't think it was a mistake. They randomly select the data, and since I'm in my mid-40's, the most I could choose was 50 years, and with 50 years of data, there were more down years compared to less than 50 years.

On firecalc, I found that the worst case scenario was 49 years, anything 50 and above would give me better results, so I stick with 49.
I think we are talking about this calculator?
https://retirementplans.vanguard.com/VG ... ggCalc.jsf

I used 40,000 withdrawal, 50 years, and a portfolio of 2.250 million(56x), and I get a 100% success rate if I use a 60 / 40 stock bond split. With more equities there was a 1 or 2% failure rate.
Right, I put in more equities, I got 1% failure.
First, your failure rates are far lower than I had expected from the earlier discussion.

Second, I had a quick look at the linked retirement calculator. It's a Monte Carlo based calculator. Some people like them but I find them to be simplistic. They generally use only the statistics for a single time series without any correlation between them. They use some simple statistics (sometimes quite flawed) and generate a number for each piece of data for each simulated year. There is no connection in the model between the various pieces of data for the simulated model year. So, the interest rate data has no connection the bond rate data nor to the simulated stock returns. This can create non-sensical scenarios. Most people consider the failure rate threshold for Monte Carlo simulators to be higher than that from historical calculators. Even given that your portfolio survives almost all of the time in Monte Carlo.

Third, when planning for retirement, you will never get 100% chance of survival from the calculators until you are so far over-funded or under-withdrawing that you have wasted years of your life. The calculators generally assume that you will withdraw robotically, year after year the same amount. In real life it doesn't work that way. If the markets are down you will likely spend a little less and vice versa. Retirement withdrawals aren't static things you set and forget forever. They are planning guides to help you decide if you can retire.

I wouldn't worry about such low failure rates. Maybe you should read something William Bernstein wrote about portfolio failure rates from the calculators - http://www.efficientfrontier.com/ef/901/hell3.htm
Thanks for the link! He says, "any estimate of long-term financial success greater than about 80% is meaningless." I should live a little and not worry about the 1%. :D

Incendiary
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Re: A poll: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by Incendiary » Wed Aug 02, 2017 11:42 pm

My plan:
Retire at 70
Live till 100

Based on an annual spend of $180k and a 3.25% withdrawal rate, I would need a little over $5.53MM.

Also assuming I have paid off my house, stay in a moderately HCOL area, put my kids through college and grad school, bought them cars, paid down payments for their house, paid for their wedding, and they have stable, well-remunerating jobs.

:sharebeer

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Christine_NM
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Re: A poll: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by Christine_NM » Thu Aug 03, 2017 12:04 am

staythecourse wrote: In your world there is not one blue collar worker that is retired then? They are either unemployed, between jobs, disabled, or dead?
That's right. Not one is fully retired or likely to be so.
17% cash 47% stock 36% bond. Retired, w/d rate 2.85%

Ter
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Re: A poll: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by Ter » Thu Aug 03, 2017 12:13 am

We are 4 1/2 yrs into retirement (66+ yrs old). We receive Pension + SS of about $112k/yr. I figure this is equivalent to about $2.2M in savings (2% discount rate, 25 yrs, PV). The 401 K will be about $1 M when RMD's kick in in about 5 yrs. We own our home, have zero debt (homeowners), our expenses are about $50k / yr, and we just sock away the excess income. We just spent $70k for 2 vehicles, foundation repairs, and landscaping our 5 acres. These type of expenses should be allowed for in living expenses estimations. Savings (after tax)/investments are now about $700k.

Company helps with supplemental medical insurance and with Medicare we spend about $3500 /yr for medical insurance for both of us combined. I had both hips replaced in 2016 with Medicare approved expenses of ~ $40k which cost me nothing but the deductible ($140.00). Medical insurance is big deal!

Pension and SS is a big help for us. If they diminish in the future for unforeseen reasons, I suspect our savings will keep us afloat. At our age, I don't think they will become zero in our lifetime. If they don't diminish we may never touch our savings and they will pass to our children.

If I convert everything to cash savings (NPV) I get about $4M excluding our homestead. The $1M 401k will be about $750k after taxes.
This has worked for us so far.
Last edited by Ter on Thu Aug 03, 2017 12:58 pm, edited 3 times in total.

chinto
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Re: A poll: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by chinto » Thu Aug 03, 2017 1:28 am

I am 54, I planned to retire with 62.5 times expenses in investment assets at age 55 with a 1.6% withdraw rate. At this point I have exceeded the 62.5 x goal. However my retirement plans are on hold due to the uncertainty surrounding Obamacare.

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Noobvestor
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Re: A poll: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by Noobvestor » Thu Aug 03, 2017 1:41 am

Would like $3,000,000 ideally - very flexible in that situation ($120,000/year SWR - me and a sig other with no income), but probably only need more like 2-2.5 to do most of what I want to do from year to year without any real worry (except maybe a home in a HCOL area). With luck, I'll be there in the next 5 to 10 years. Could also pull the bronze parachute and work with what I have in a low COL state/situation.
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GoldenFinch
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Re: A poll: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by GoldenFinch » Thu Aug 03, 2017 5:22 am

alfaspider wrote:
NoGambleNoFuture wrote:
Cyclesafe wrote:
alfaspider wrote:My number is $4 million in 2017 dollars, $5 million if retiring before 50. I wouldn't say this is how much I "need"- I could do with much less- but how much I would need to continue my lifestyle infidelity with no concessions and minimal risk of running out of money.

I am currently 32.
Alfaspider, a lifestyle of infidelity will cost you way more than $4-5M. Just say'in.
:oops: :oops: :oops: HAHAH

32. Want to retire in about 20-25 years max. Ideally somewhere north of 4.5m.
That's a rather unfortunate typo :oops:

Of course I met indefinitely :happy
You needed to meet a proofreader. :wink:

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wander
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Re: A poll: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by wander » Thu Aug 03, 2017 5:42 am

$1.3 million of 2017 dollar at 62 to maintain life style.

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TomatoTomahto
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Re: A poll: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by TomatoTomahto » Thu Aug 03, 2017 6:44 am

How much? Whatever we had last year.

I'm retired, DW still works.

lostdog
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Re: A poll: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by lostdog » Thu Aug 03, 2017 6:51 am

Good posts. The information that I gather from these posts are rare for most people?
Financial independence is the best revenge.

goblue100
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Re: A poll: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by goblue100 » Thu Aug 03, 2017 6:54 am

HomerJ wrote: We're in our early 50s (if you average our ages).
Sounds like I need to marry a 20 year old. Then I'd be 35 by this calculation. :)
Some people are immune to good advice. - Saul Goodman

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avenger
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Re: A poll: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by avenger » Thu Aug 03, 2017 7:07 am

37. Plan to retire (or slow down significantly) between 45 and 50 at 2.5 million. Bottom line is to reach financial independence.
Last edited by avenger on Thu Aug 03, 2017 7:19 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: A poll: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by SirRunsabit » Thu Aug 03, 2017 7:10 am

2.5 million + healthcare and I walk. 4 million after tax cash and I walk away from it all, pension, health insurance, the lot. I have a very healthy pension, and consequently my savings rate hasn't been that high. There's room to haggle, if there are any offers. :sharebeer
Hi!

Andres
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Re: A poll: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by Andres » Thu Aug 03, 2017 7:16 am

60, $2.5 million (25x spend) at 65+?
I'm conflicted about retiring, I like my job, I like my income, not sure what I'll do retired. I guess I need to start taking long vacations to practice not having the current routine. My SO is more likely to retire first and that might pull me in that direction.

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knpstr
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Re: A poll: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by knpstr » Thu Aug 03, 2017 7:16 am

32. After counting rental income, need $875,000 to maintain current standards of living (using 4% rule).

EDIT:
If I count potential Social Security, I don't need to save anything for retirement. Our SS and rental income will maintain current standard of living.
Last edited by knpstr on Thu Aug 03, 2017 12:49 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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grettman
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Re: A poll: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by grettman » Thu Aug 03, 2017 7:18 am

$1,743,600

I am 47. Plan to retire at 57.

I expect a pension. Otherwise, I would need more. I don't expect or factor in SS.

mega317
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Re: A poll: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by mega317 » Thu Aug 03, 2017 8:07 am

I find it interesting how many people don't factor in social security. What is the reason for that? Legitimate expectation that it won't be there? Desire to "round up" and come up with a more conservative number? I didn't count it for a long time, but that was mostly because I didn't really understand it.

flyingaway
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Re: A poll: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by flyingaway » Thu Aug 03, 2017 8:29 am

mega317 wrote:I find it interesting how many people don't factor in social security. What is the reason for that? Legitimate expectation that it won't be there? Desire to "round up" and come up with a more conservative number? I didn't count it for a long time, but that was mostly because I didn't really understand it.
Social security is just a buffer if I have at least $2M.

freebeer
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Re: A poll: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by freebeer » Thu Aug 03, 2017 8:56 am

flyingaway wrote:...I only work 2 half days a week for 7 months per year for a job many people say they would volunteer to do in their retirement (teaching)...
What sort of professorship yields a six-figure salary (which you noted in another thread) for that light a workload? I.e., where do I apply??

MichDad
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Re: A poll: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by MichDad » Thu Aug 03, 2017 9:24 am

I'm 62 and will retire before I reach 63. My wife is already retired.

I want to have at least $2.5 million in our retirement accounts before I retire. This is in addition to my inflation-adjusted pension for which I've already qualified but have not begun collecting. We presently have over $2.8 million in our retirement accounts so we have a bit of a cushion. We'll also downsize from a large house to a condo in a few years which should add to our retirement assets. I'll hold off on collecting Social Security until I'm 70. If the equity markets tank today and remain at low levels, I've got enough money saved in the TSP's G Fund to carry us until I begin to collect Social Security.

MichDad

BHUser27
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Re: A poll: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by BHUser27 » Thu Aug 03, 2017 9:36 am

mega317 wrote:I find it interesting how many people don't factor in social security. What is the reason for that? Legitimate expectation that it won't be there? Desire to "round up" and come up with a more conservative number? I didn't count it for a long time, but that was mostly because I didn't really understand it.
I don't think there are many BH-ers that ignore SS benefits. Not sure where you get that impression.

Regarding OP's question and this discussion, OP said to "assume pensions are zero". Unfortunately this is somewhat ambiguous. Personally I consider SS benefit to be a small pension amount. So I only posted what I was targeting in *excess of my expected SS benefit*. Not sure if that is exactly what OP was asking however.

dsmil
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Re: A poll: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by dsmil » Thu Aug 03, 2017 9:40 am

I'm 30, and am aiming for at least $1M in today's dollars and a paid off mortgage to retire at age 60. Saving 12% of my income with 4% real returns would get me there. This projection also assumes a cut in our social security by 1/3.

zinders
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Re: A poll: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by zinders » Thu Aug 03, 2017 9:41 am

Interesting to read the responses. My husband and I have been running different scenarios. Combined income with bonuses is about $250,000. He's 55, I'm 48. No kids. We still have a significant mortgage, as we've relocated several times. Current portfolio has $1.1 million. Neither of us will have pensions, but between the two of us, we will likely inherit between $500,000-$750,000. We do work with a financial advisor and contribute maximums to the 401Ks, including catch-up in husband's case.

We spend about $100,000-$125,000 annually. Sounds like a lot, but we travel quite a bit, go to Broadway shows, etc. (I tend to spend on experiences, not stuff). We also have home projects we want to do. I'd like us to have $3 million before we retire.

I have a job that many people consider one of those "dream" ones so I don't see leaving it before 60. Even after that, I will likely do it on a freelance basis, which will offset travel costs (but not bring in much income). Husband is a different story, but he's the higher earner. Right now, he says he'll work another 10 years. If we reach $3 million before then, I'm not sure he'll want to. Would definitely not want to stop working until we had access to Medicare.

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TomatoTomahto
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Re: A poll: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by TomatoTomahto » Thu Aug 03, 2017 9:45 am

flyingaway wrote:
mega317 wrote:I find it interesting how many people don't factor in social security. What is the reason for that? Legitimate expectation that it won't be there? Desire to "round up" and come up with a more conservative number? I didn't count it for a long time, but that was mostly because I didn't really understand it.
Social security is just a buffer if I have at least $2M.
With respect, you have that backwards. Social security is COLAed. Your $2M isn't.

gamboolman
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Re: A poll: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by gamboolman » Thu Aug 03, 2017 11:46 am

58 and plan to retire at age 60.

On track to have ~$3.3M at retirement

100% with Firecalc for our desired estimated annual expenses.

This gives us a good bit of room to cut way back if need be.

We plan on 75% of Social Security that we are due.

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Pajamas
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Re: A poll: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by Pajamas » Thu Aug 03, 2017 11:51 am

mega317 wrote:I find it interesting how many people don't factor in social security. What is the reason for that? Legitimate expectation that it won't be there? Desire to "round up" and come up with a more conservative number? I didn't count it for a long time, but that was mostly because I didn't really understand it.
It's very far off. It's not under my control. It's subject to change. I may die before I get it. Even if it stays the same, it will be a relatively small amount. Ignoring it provides a margin of safety. Presumably I will need assistance with daily living or have higher health care expenses that it could easily be spent on, anyway. So it's not a matter of not factoring it in at all for me, it's just not nearly as certain or important as personal wealth and so I don't rely on it or even include it directly in my planning. As it gets closer and more predictable, it will become more important, especially for tax planning, and I will count it when I start receiving it.
Last edited by Pajamas on Thu Aug 03, 2017 12:02 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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ray.james
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Re: A poll: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by ray.james » Thu Aug 03, 2017 11:58 am

$1.3 million of 2017 dollar plus paid off home for financial independence.(no social security)
To retire early at 50 -55, I might target 2- 2.5mill depending on healthcare and education inflation.
When in doubt, http://www.bogleheads.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=79939

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Blister
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Re: A poll: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by Blister » Thu Aug 03, 2017 12:05 pm

Just retired 2 months ago at 66
No pension
3.1M more than enough.
:D
Everthing works out in the end. If it doesn't then its not the end.

dave_k
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Re: A poll: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by dave_k » Thu Aug 03, 2017 12:12 pm

flyingaway wrote:
mega317 wrote:I find it interesting how many people don't factor in social security. What is the reason for that? Legitimate expectation that it won't be there? Desire to "round up" and come up with a more conservative number? I didn't count it for a long time, but that was mostly because I didn't really understand it.
Social security is just a buffer if I have at least $2M.
My target is about $2.5M, but SS is still significant. Without it my wife and I would need around an extra $500K at 50, or an extra $1M at 70 when we plan to take it. That would delay retirement a few years. Figuring 75% of projected SS benefits after 2034 should be safe.

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Re: A poll: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by Flashes1 » Thu Aug 03, 2017 12:14 pm

I'm 49 and spouse is 42----want $4.0 million portfolio, and paid-for house in the high six figures. I plan on working to 62, and hope/pray wife will work to 60.

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HomerJ
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Re: A poll: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by HomerJ » Thu Aug 03, 2017 12:35 pm

goblue100 wrote:
HomerJ wrote: We're in our early 50s (if you average our ages).
Sounds like I need to marry a 20 year old. Then I'd be 35 by this calculation. :)
Heh, well it does make it somewhat harder to do the calculations if you have a big age difference. I'm 8 years younger than my wife, which isn't huge, but it does complicate the planning a little. I can't imagine how people with 20 years difference handle it.

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HomerJ
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Re: A poll: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by HomerJ » Thu Aug 03, 2017 12:38 pm

mega317 wrote:I find it interesting how many people don't factor in social security. What is the reason for that? Legitimate expectation that it won't be there? Desire to "round up" and come up with a more conservative number? I didn't count it for a long time, but that was mostly because I didn't really understand it.
I expect it to be there. Not counting it is just a way to be extra conservative.

In our case, we use my wife's SS in our calculations. My SS we ignore, and just think of it as another buffer for peace of mind. 8-12 years into retirement, I'll start drawing SS, and hopefully it will just be fun money to take the grandkids on vacations (or we may need it pay for health-care).

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Re: A poll: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by ubermax » Thu Aug 03, 2017 12:46 pm

Just a quick observation , the title says need and the OP's initial post says want , these two amounts could be far apart ; I also believe that the analysis begins with expenses , either current or projected.

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Re: A poll: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by chuppi » Thu Aug 03, 2017 12:56 pm

age 41/38. Net worth without home equity 1.6mil
Want to get kids college tuition and pay off home. I want to retire or switch to part time by 56/53. I think 3million will do but I am not sure. I will reevaluate every few years.

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David Jay
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Re: A poll: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by David Jay » Thu Aug 03, 2017 1:20 pm

mega317 wrote:I find it interesting how many people don't factor in social security. What is the reason for that? Legitimate expectation that it won't be there? Desire to "round up" and come up with a more conservative number? I didn't count it for a long time, but that was mostly because I didn't really understand it.
I do three calculations and add up the total:
1. Expenses from retirement to start of SS (likely age 68 - 70)
2. Expenses after start of SS with 2 SS benefits
3. Expenses after passing of 1 spouse with only 1 SS benefit

I use 4% withdrawal rate on the last two and actual balance (no portfolio gains) on #1
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Re: A poll: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by goodenyou » Thu Aug 03, 2017 2:08 pm

Every time I get close to what I think is "critical mass", my number goes up. It's not the number, per se, it is when I can stop working and retire. At the current cash-burn rate with 3 teenage kids (college, cars, etc.,) it seems more distant. With no dependents, it would be low 7 figures in my late 50's. Mid 7-figures with dependents. 30x annual expenses.
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Re: A poll: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by mister_sparkle » Thu Aug 03, 2017 2:09 pm

I am 51 with about $1.1M in assets.

Years ago I had targeted $2M as my GTFO milemarker, but lately I've been more focused on refining my calculations based on my actual scenario -- including a pension at 65 and SS at 67 or whatever that number gets moved to by Congress.

So right now my GTFO date is 55 or $1.5M, which may get moved up to 54 or $1.4M if I'm feeling like taking more of a chance. So between my own contributions + employer match + growth of investments, if I can average at least $100K/year I should be sitting pretty.

:sharebeer

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Elsebet
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Re: A poll: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by Elsebet » Thu Aug 03, 2017 3:22 pm

From 55-59.5 we will start calculating and planning, and if we have around 1 million around that time and a paid-off home we will consider moving to part-time work if possible. We have no kids and very low expenses

Worst case scenario is at 59.5 we're retiring with whatever we have at the time and we will make do. I will have been working continuously full-time for 37 years at that point and that is enough.

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Re: A poll: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by latesaver » Thu Aug 03, 2017 3:48 pm

I am shocked by the amounts that people are listing. I assume either a) they want to live fairly lavishly or b) they are listing the amount they "want".

I am 37, wife is 34. We are late to the game but good jobs have allowed us to amass $1.7M in savings, $2.2m w/ home equity included.

Spending $90K/year should allow us to live pretty comfortably and at 3% SWR indicates we need around $3M to retire.

I think we'll hit that in the next 7-10 years.

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