How much money do you want to retire?

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randomizer
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Re: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by randomizer » Wed Aug 02, 2017 1:39 pm

Age: 40s, amount: "it depends", target age: ???

Based on my estimates, I should be able to retire some time between 45 and 65 years of age, with somewhere between $1m and $2.5m, and with a probability of "success" somewhere between 33% and 95% (especially if I have a flexible definition of success).

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Re: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by BHUser27 » Wed Aug 02, 2017 1:41 pm

Age 54, Retire 65 (maybe 62 if I can swing it).
No debt. Intend to keep it that way.
*Need* $1.1M in combined Taxable, Roth IRA, 401K and emergency fund.
*Want* $2M.
I am very close to having what I *need* already.
Not confident I can reach 100% of my *want* over next 10yrs.
Health care unknowns are my biggest concern right now.

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Pajamas
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Re: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by Pajamas » Wed Aug 02, 2017 1:44 pm

40 x annual expenses and no debt to stop working around 50.

invst65
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Re: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by invst65 » Wed Aug 02, 2017 1:55 pm

Need or Want?

Retired last year at age 67 with $1M but younger wife still working. It's meeting our needs just fine even while I'm delaying SS until 70.

But it would have been nice to have about another $.5 M just to be able to do more fun things. Could probably do those things any way but I wouldn't be so hesitant to do them if I had a more comfortable cushion.

ponyboy
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Re: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by ponyboy » Wed Aug 02, 2017 2:00 pm

Im not really sure how much we'll need...not yet anyway. We're only 34 and 33. We have a combined $800k in savings/retirement/investments...not including house. No other debts but house, owe $120k, 15 year 0% interest :)

Id like to retire before 54...hoping to hit $1mil within next 3 years (depends how market does.) Hoping to be north of $3mil by the time we retire...not sure why...sounds like a cool number.

furikake
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Re: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by furikake » Wed Aug 02, 2017 2:01 pm

Currently at 56x annual expenses, firecalc says I have more than enough to retire with 100% success and will have $41m leftover for my child when I die. But, Vanguard calculator says I'm short that I'd need 60x at least. So I don't know how much I need.

livelifealittle
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Re: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by livelifealittle » Wed Aug 02, 2017 2:07 pm

Age: 36, DH: 35 (DINK)
Target: now but that's not possible so maybe 50?
I think we need $1m to draw 4% (2017 $) but probably can do with less.

I'm good in finding deals and stretching my dollars - I actually enjoy it. Fancy dinners costs are pretty low since we eat a lot of veggies and we both don't drink.
Mortgage is low and we can always downside to a condo and rent out the house. Or better yet, travel full time, work occasionally, sell my landscape images (not hopeful though). I'm also qualified to do tax return and once I gain enough experience & confidence, pulling $10-20k during tax season should be doable.

mega317
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Re: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by mega317 » Wed Aug 02, 2017 2:30 pm

ponyboy wrote:Im not really sure how much we'll need...not yet anyway. We're only 34 and 33.
Yep me too. 35 and too many variables. Right now I think I'll want to cut back my hours when I'm relatively young, but continue working part time long after that. So for me it's two numbers. And of course expenses will change wildly between "relatively young" and full retirement.

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Re: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by azanon » Wed Aug 02, 2017 2:33 pm

Want? Probably 1.5 mil. Need? Probably about half of that + pension and 2 SS checks.

Age: current 45/retiring at 57.

WhiteMaxima
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Re: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by WhiteMaxima » Wed Aug 02, 2017 2:37 pm

What's the assumption? House paid off. Kids out of college. Good health. Low cost or high cost area? Yearly expense?

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Peter Foley
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Re: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by Peter Foley » Wed Aug 02, 2017 2:38 pm

When I was in my early 50's I figured about 1.5M. I'm 66. I figured correctly.

DA200
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Re: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by DA200 » Wed Aug 02, 2017 2:41 pm

Age: 50 / 49 with 3.3M
Want to retire by 55 / 54 with 4.0M at 3% withdrawal rate

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inittowinit
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Re: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by inittowinit » Wed Aug 02, 2017 2:46 pm

Target FI Portfolio Size: $1.65 million
Annual FI Budget: $50k (in perpetuity)
Current age: 27
Target FI age: 50

All figures in 2017 dollars

financeguy88
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Re: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by financeguy88 » Wed Aug 02, 2017 2:57 pm

We could retire now with our $4.5m. I'm 32 and wife is 30, no kids yet. We'd probably move out of our HCOL area if we did that.

When I had 800k 4 years ago or so I thought 2m was my number and I did feel a lot of freedom / less stress when we hit that.

Now I feel like $10m to $15m is the range where we'd have complete freedom. Funny how that works.

That number would let us live in a nice 3br / 4br apartment, pay for future kids / colleges, and travel and eat very well without having to rely on an income, as long as we didn't make any stupid investment decisions.

flyingaway
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Re: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by flyingaway » Wed Aug 02, 2017 2:59 pm

I will need $2M at 55, but want $3M then. I only work 2 half days a week for 7 months per year for a job many people say they would volunteer to do in their retirement (teaching). That makes it difficult for me to retire even if I had the money.

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Sheepdog
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Re: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by Sheepdog » Wed Aug 02, 2017 3:02 pm

Since I am already retired, I know how much I need and that is what I have :sharebeer .
When I retired in 1998 at age 65 my figure was $650,000 living off of that and SS (no pension). The abode was paid for. With inflation added in, that would be $977,000 in 2017 dollars. Guess what? That is damn close to what I actually have even after living off of that all these years. 8-) Pretty good, huh?
People should not say everything they think. They should think about everything they say.

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tennisplyr
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Re: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by tennisplyr » Wed Aug 02, 2017 3:04 pm

FYI, so all of the younger folks don't get scared out of their minds, I'm in mid sixties, retired ~6 years and am living very nicely on far less than the millions reported here. To each his own, but worrying about not having enough when you are in the millions is foolish, there are lots and lots of happy retirees living with far less than a million.
Those who move forward with a happy spirit will find that things always work out.

Frank Grimes
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Re: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by Frank Grimes » Wed Aug 02, 2017 3:08 pm

tennisplyr wrote:FYI, so all of the younger folks don't get scared out of their minds, I'm in mid sixties, retired ~6 years and am living very nicely on far less than the millions reported here. To each his own, but worrying about not having enough when you are in the millions is foolish, there are lots and lots of happy retirees living with far less than a million.
My number's taking inflation into consideration. A few million bucks 25 years from now isn't going to have quite the same cache.

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Ice-9
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Re: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by Ice-9 » Wed Aug 02, 2017 3:17 pm

I'm posting before reading all the other responses.

I'm 44 now. I think I'd like to have about $2 million in 2017 dollars to retire in the vicinity of age 65. For what it's worth, Firecalc puts that number at a 99% success rate for spending approximately what we spend now for 30 years of retirement with no SS added.

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Re: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by HongKonger » Wed Aug 02, 2017 3:23 pm

Sheepdog wrote:Since I am already retired, I know how much I need and that is what I have :sharebeer .
When I retired in 1998 at age 65 my figure was $650,000 living off of that and SS (no pension). The abode was paid for. With inflation added in, that would be $977,000 in 2017 dollars. Guess what? That is damn close to what I actually have even after living off of that all these years. 8-) Pretty good, huh?
Similar here - retired 4 years ago aged 41 with 325k to live off, house paid for, no debt, no pension. Not scrimped at all and today have 350k plus a newly fully renovated house. All good.

mptfan
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Re: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by mptfan » Wed Aug 02, 2017 3:29 pm

I am confused because the title of the thread asks how much do you need, but the post asks how much you want. Which one is it?
I eat risk for breakfast. :)

goldendad
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Re: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by goldendad » Wed Aug 02, 2017 3:37 pm

I am 61. 2 million. Don't forget to factor cost of health insurance. Health problems can make a fortune go away quickly.

staythecourse
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Re: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by staythecourse » Wed Aug 02, 2017 3:41 pm

Christine_NM wrote:
benign_user wrote:
Christine_NM wrote: Sorry, guys, those days are gone for today's wannabe retirees. Seems like everything that advances a person now first sets you back way too much, so the gain is minimized.
What do you mean by this?
Mainly I was thinking of educational opportunities and the rise of student debt. Also, the loss of employer pensions to help fund retirement. Professional education is the basis of work and saving for retirement.

The poll question could be rephrased as "How much education do you need to retire?". Low-skilled (or underappreciated skilled) workers are rarely fully employed and will never fully retire until disabled.
Umm... no. In your world there is not one blue collar worker that is retired then? They are either unemployed, between jobs, disabled, or dead?
Anyone can retire at ANY point. That is the greatness or curse of american safety nets. It just matters how well or poor one wants to live.

Good luck.
"The stock market [fluctuation], therefore, is noise. A giant distraction from the business of investing.” | -Jack Bogle

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1210sda
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Re: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by 1210sda » Wed Aug 02, 2017 3:43 pm

Where you plan to retire is very important. The cost of living index for New York city is 245. The cost of living in Tucson is 122.

Source: Expatistan

So, if you feel you need $4,000,000 in New York, you'll only need $2,000,000 in Tucson.

1210

bigred77
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Re: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by bigred77 » Wed Aug 02, 2017 3:44 pm

furikake wrote:Currently at 56x annual expenses, firecalc says I have more than enough to retire with 100% success and will have $41m leftover for my child when I die. But, Vanguard calculator says I'm short that I'd need 60x at least. So I don't know how much I need.
If Vanguard says your short with a sub 2% withdrawal rate you are either using the calculator wrong, misinterpreting the results, or the application is broken. You passed what you needed a long time ago.

staythecourse
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Re: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by staythecourse » Wed Aug 02, 2017 3:51 pm

1210sda wrote:Where you plan to retire is very important. The cost of living index for New York city is 245. The cost of living in Tucson is 122.

Source: Expatistan

So, if you feel you need $4,000,000 in New York, you'll only need $2,000,000 in Tucson.

1210
This should have its own thread.

It is NOT just the amount of money one has, but variables like COL that makes a BIG difference in the longevity of a portfolio.

Good luck.

p.s. For those looking to to retire and who are on the edge of their numbers you should consider moving to a LCOL. The numbers all the sudden look a lot better.
"The stock market [fluctuation], therefore, is noise. A giant distraction from the business of investing.” | -Jack Bogle

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meowcat
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Re: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by meowcat » Wed Aug 02, 2017 4:01 pm

Me: 54. DW: 52. Would like to see 1.5mm - 2.0mm. We are on track if we work until 67.
More people should learn to tell their dollars where to go instead of asking them where they went. | -Roger Babson

retired recently
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Re: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by retired recently » Wed Aug 02, 2017 4:08 pm

I retired in 2008 at 40 with a bit more than $4 million plus my home which I paid for in cash. So far all has worked out just fine. We live in a low COL area. Our annual spending is between $120K-$150K.

Assets have grown to $6.6 million plus still have the same house but we hope to downsize in a few years after last kid goes to college.

JBTX
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Re: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by JBTX » Wed Aug 02, 2017 4:14 pm

Goal has always been 3 million. Currently have about 2.1 million. I'm 54 and wife 48. We both expect to work at least 10'more years although I may scale back before then. Plus we have special needs child who will need some future help.

CnC
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Re: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by CnC » Wed Aug 02, 2017 4:18 pm

I can't assume my pension in 0 it's too painful and my pension is too well funded.

Our pension will cover 78% of my and dw expenses at 55 and has guaranteed 3% growth. Our SS added to our pension will cover 170% of our expenses at our current standard of living in future dollars.


That being said we are shooting for $3mil on that day we will both hang it up. Be it 45 or 54 but 55 is that latest we could possibly stand.

Dude2
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Re: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by Dude2 » Wed Aug 02, 2017 4:19 pm

48 and single. I think 1.5 Mil will do it (around 65). Will retire in low cost of living area with no state tax (Florida).

bubbadog
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Re: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by bubbadog » Wed Aug 02, 2017 4:32 pm

In the past, my number has always seemed to be one million more than I currently have. 10 years ago, I thought 3 million would be more than enough. I am starting to change my way of thinking. I have been blessed to make and accumulate more money than most. What if I keep doing something that I enjoy and start helping others with the excess?

wrongfunds
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Re: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by wrongfunds » Wed Aug 02, 2017 4:43 pm

furikake wrote:Currently at 56x annual expenses, firecalc says I have more than enough to retire with 100% success and will have $41m leftover for my child when I die. But, Vanguard calculator says I'm short that I'd need 60x at least. So I don't know how much I need.
Assuming there is no typo in the above numbers, I am impressed!
For me, I want $13M. We already had a long thread on that particular number and it is still active. I thought I would just use that one.

mega317
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Re: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by mega317 » Wed Aug 02, 2017 5:15 pm

bigred77 wrote:
furikake wrote:Currently at 56x annual expenses, firecalc says I have more than enough to retire with 100% success and will have $41m leftover for my child when I die. But, Vanguard calculator says I'm short that I'd need 60x at least. So I don't know how much I need.
If Vanguard says your short with a sub 2% withdrawal rate you are either using the calculator wrong, misinterpreting the results, or the application is broken. You passed what you needed a long time ago.
I used the vanguard calculator recently and the results were far from what I expected in a similar way. Since I didn't see any relevant threads here I assumed the mistake was mine.

Broken Man 1999
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Re: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by Broken Man 1999 » Wed Aug 02, 2017 5:33 pm

We have retirement portfolios with $2.25mil in total assets. House worth about $250K-$260K. No debts, no mortgage. Age 64 for both of us.

Currently we need $40K/year to supplement SS, which gives us a very low withdrawal rate.

Hopefully we can maintain our low withdrawal rate, as I want to leave an inheritance to our children and grandchildren.

Though our withdrawal rate is below what we could safely withdraw, we seem to have everything we want and need, with the present withdrawal rate.

Neither of us feel we are deprived of anything. Life is good.

Broken Man 1999
“If I cannot drink Bourbon and smoke cigars in Heaven than I shall not go. " -Mark Twain

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Portfolio7
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Re: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by Portfolio7 » Wed Aug 02, 2017 5:44 pm

50 yrs old. House will not be paid off. $2.3M by age 60. My wife's business should throw off some money

$ exclude house and business (A loan for the latter will be paid off in 5 years.)
An investment in knowledge pays the best interest.

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pjshen
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Re: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by pjshen » Wed Aug 02, 2017 7:00 pm

My wife and I are both 54. Firecalc shows 100% success at $2.2M. Ideally, we would want $3M (in 2017 dollars) in light of heightened uncertainties for health insurance and social security. Hopefully, we'll retire by 58 when, coincidentally, the kids are off to college and we'll likely be within shooting distance of paying off the mortgage. Interesting to read the replies to this thread showing a wide range in "the number" for Bogleheads to retire comfortably -- the big numbers are either way too conservative (<3% withdrawal rate) or are intended to fund a lavish lifestyle! :D

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Re: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by The Wizard » Wed Aug 02, 2017 7:08 pm

mptfan wrote:I am confused because the title of the thread asks how much do you need, but the post asks how much you want. Which one is it?
This is a most excellent question.
The distinction between these two concepts needs to be made more often and more explicitly...
Attempted new signature...

furikake
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Re: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by furikake » Wed Aug 02, 2017 7:10 pm

mega317 wrote:
bigred77 wrote:
furikake wrote:Currently at 56x annual expenses, firecalc says I have more than enough to retire with 100% success and will have $41m leftover for my child when I die. But, Vanguard calculator says I'm short that I'd need 60x at least. So I don't know how much I need.
If Vanguard says your short with a sub 2% withdrawal rate you are either using the calculator wrong, misinterpreting the results, or the application is broken. You passed what you needed a long time ago.
I used the vanguard calculator recently and the results were far from what I expected in a similar way. Since I didn't see any relevant threads here I assumed the mistake was mine.
I don't think it was a mistake. They randomly select the data, and since I'm in my mid-40's, the most I could choose was 50 years, and with 50 years of data, there were more down years compared to less than 50 years.

On firecalc, I found that the worst case scenario was 49 years, anything 50 and above would give me better results, so I stick with 49.

retire57
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Re: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by retire57 » Wed Aug 02, 2017 7:25 pm

Retired x 1.5 years at 59. (Hence the user name). Our goal was always 1.25 million with no debt, and we achived that right on time. We have 2 pensions and are awaiting SS at FRA. Life is pretty great right now.
Last edited by retire57 on Wed Aug 02, 2017 7:29 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Jackson12
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Re: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by Jackson12 » Wed Aug 02, 2017 7:28 pm

2.8 to 3 million. Age 64.

Would be far less ( we're frugal) but a special needs child is the outlier that skews things and SSI and disability payments won't be enough to cut it. So a Special Needs Trust and an Able account needs funding. It's a moving target. We're better off than we'd hoped so there's that.

Masterblaster
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Re: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by Masterblaster » Wed Aug 02, 2017 7:48 pm

financeguy88 wrote:When I had 800k 4 years ago or so I thought 2m was my number and I did feel a lot of freedom / less stress when we hit that.
Many people do this. Once they hit their number they move the goal higher.
It's called hedonistic adaptation. And those that do it tend to suffer, but suffer in more comfort than before.

hmw
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Re: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by hmw » Wed Aug 02, 2017 8:39 pm

I would like to have 5 million when I retire. We spent about 125k to 150k a year after tax over the last several years. I am 42 and plan to retire at 55. Barring any financial catastrophe, we will likely have more than 5 million at age 55.

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Hyperborea
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Re: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by Hyperborea » Wed Aug 02, 2017 9:02 pm

furikake wrote:
mega317 wrote:
bigred77 wrote:
furikake wrote:Currently at 56x annual expenses, firecalc says I have more than enough to retire with 100% success and will have $41m leftover for my child when I die. But, Vanguard calculator says I'm short that I'd need 60x at least. So I don't know how much I need.
If Vanguard says your short with a sub 2% withdrawal rate you are either using the calculator wrong, misinterpreting the results, or the application is broken. You passed what you needed a long time ago.
I used the vanguard calculator recently and the results were far from what I expected in a similar way. Since I didn't see any relevant threads here I assumed the mistake was mine.
I don't think it was a mistake. They randomly select the data, and since I'm in my mid-40's, the most I could choose was 50 years, and with 50 years of data, there were more down years compared to less than 50 years.

On firecalc, I found that the worst case scenario was 49 years, anything 50 and above would give me better results, so I stick with 49.
I'd be careful with long duration retirement periods in the various calculators. When you do that you take a very small amount of data and make it smaller - probably too small. We've got at most 140 years of very limited S&P500 data (actual and extrapolated/simulated). Less than that if you use slice and dice portfolios in the tools. From this 140 years of data we've got just a bit less than 5 fully independent 30 year periods and less than 3 50 year periods.

50 year periods also start blocking out some of the worst retirement time periods - the late 60's. We had a crash in '68 followed by the oil crisis and high inflation of the 70's. It was a worse time to retire than the Great Depression.

Rather than use those calculators for those long periods you should consider keeping the period to 30 years but requiring that the portfolio have some minimum value at the end. So, in 30 years you will be in your mid-70's (if you are still here) so how much will you need? You've got a likely max of 20 years left. Firecalc will do something close to this except it's more restrictive in that it requires that the portfolio NEVER drop below that minimum. Still useful.

I also found it useful to play with the inputs to get an idea of what changes will do. I have a number of planned expenses in the future that I have entered. So, I adjust the amount of them - if the portfolio is down I might buy a smaller house. I also adjust the timing - if the portfolio is down I might delay buying a house. Being able to adjust to conditions as they are in the future is probably one of the biggest things to remember in retirement. There is only so much the calculator can tell us and at some point we need to make the jump.

That all being said, I think there is something really out of whack where a 2% withdrawal is shown to not be enough. You aren't inputing a portfolio all in bonds or something are you?

temco_rep
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Re: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by temco_rep » Wed Aug 02, 2017 9:17 pm

Hello-
Just curious about the folks that answered, how are you paying for health care when you retired 50 to say 58?
My wife and I currently hold 2.5m but that's taxable, 401K's and IRA's.
Complete mix of funds and individual stocks. If we retired and I converted much of the taxable
stocks and funds to more income generating, I'm afraid that a significant amount would all go to pay for the annual health care bill.

Thoughts?

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Hyperborea
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Re: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by Hyperborea » Wed Aug 02, 2017 9:25 pm

temco_rep wrote:Hello-
Just curious about the folks that answered, how are you paying for health care when you retired 50 to say 58?
I retired at 51 last year. I am currently on COBRA right now. At the end of this year, depending on what goes on in not to be discussed politics, I will decide whether to take Obama-Care next year or to continue with COBRA + Cal-COBRA. By late next year I will be out of the US and onto the national health care in my wife's home country (I too am a non-US citizen of a different country which also has national health care).

This isn't a general solution but some US citizens do go elsewhere. The best known are probably the Terhorsts who retired at 35 in the 80's and wrote a book about it back then. They didn't do it for health care reasons nor would I suggest anybody do that but if you are thinking about traveling or living elsewhere it's an extra benefit.
Last edited by Hyperborea on Wed Aug 02, 2017 9:54 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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3wood
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Re: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by 3wood » Wed Aug 02, 2017 9:30 pm

45 and shooting for $4mm.

gkaplan
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Re: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by gkaplan » Wed Aug 02, 2017 9:44 pm

benign_user wrote:How much money do you want to retire? . . . .

Your thread title asks, "How much money do you need to retire?", while your thread text asks, "How much money do you want to retire?" It seems like these are two different questions.
Gordon

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Re: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by goblue100 » Wed Aug 02, 2017 9:49 pm

furikake wrote: I don't think it was a mistake. They randomly select the data, and since I'm in my mid-40's, the most I could choose was 50 years, and with 50 years of data, there were more down years compared to less than 50 years.

On firecalc, I found that the worst case scenario was 49 years, anything 50 and above would give me better results, so I stick with 49.
I think we are talking about this calculator?
https://retirementplans.vanguard.com/VG ... ggCalc.jsf

I used 40,000 withdrawal, 50 years, and a portfolio of 2.250 million(56x), and I get a 100% success rate if I use a 60 / 40 stock bond split. With more equities there was a 1 or 2% failure rate.
Some people are immune to good advice. - Saul Goodman

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Watty
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Re: How much money do you need to retire?

Post by Watty » Wed Aug 02, 2017 9:53 pm

celia wrote:We're retired late 60s.

I realized about 15 years ago that once the house was paid off, kids here on their own, and retirement accounts were funded, we could live on about 1/3 our original income. So it is not a matter of having a lot of money, but rather having decreased expenses that makes it possible to retire.
+1 on the need part.

It helps that I live in a medium to low cost of living area with low property taxes but for the most part with a paid off house and medicare we could live modestly but comfortably on just Social Security if we had to.

If there is just one of us is surviving when long term care is needed our home equity, and Social Security, would be enough to pay for years of long term care.

You need to also remember that the median household income is only about $56,000 so the people needing multi million dollar nest eggs are far from typical.

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