Who takes financial chances and why is this forum so financially conservative?

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ThankYouJack
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Who takes financial chances and why is this forum so financially conservative?

Post by ThankYouJack » Tue Jun 13, 2017 11:35 am

Maybe it's just me, but it seems like this forum is getting more financially conservative. For example, people feeling uneasy with 25x in retirement accounts, debt free, great job, ~65% savings rate. I think the fear and financial anxiety on here can be contagious, and the "what-if you got hit by a bus" always come up. I think what if you did get hit by a bus and missed out on everything you wish you had done. IMO, people should also have some FOMO (fear of missing out). I'm not going to be on my death bed wishing that I had gone to more meetings or spent more time with work emails.

Who has taken a chance and how did it work out?

I've taken a few - quit my job when I was younger, moved to Hawaii with hardly anything in the bank and no job lined up. I was fine and it was an amazing experience.

More recently, I was ready to quit my job but my employer didn't want me to leave. After negotiating for a while, I switched to a low hour, complete flexible, consulting role where I'm making significantly more per hour.

I'm not sure what direction this thread will go (my guess is it may get locked), but my family is considering taking additional chances and wondering if the responses will entice or scare us from taking them


EDIT: I just went through all of the responses. By conservative, I didn't mean investment strategy - I couldn't agree more with Jack Bogle and the general consensus on here. By conservative, I mean concerned with not having enough and fearful of the future. In this regard, I would prefer to think/be like Mr. Bogle than have a lot of the concerns I see on here. I know it's generalizing and many on here are way riskier than myself, but from my perspective it seems like a growing trend. It's not a bad thing for society, I'd rather have a world of Bogleheads than gamblers buying mansions and sports cars :beer
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Goal33
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Re: Who takes financial chances and why is this forum so financially conservative?

Post by Goal33 » Tue Jun 13, 2017 11:38 am

I took an internship that caused me to go out of pocket for living expenses all summer instead of the fancy internship that came with free housing and nice hourly pay. It lead to a job where I'm now making 150k only 2 years out of college.
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rgs92
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Re: Who takes financial chances and why is this forum so financially conservative?

Post by rgs92 » Tue Jun 13, 2017 11:38 am

You think putting 60% of your life savings into the S&P 500 is conservative? Not if you look at the charts. It's certainly a reasonable amount of risk. Reasonable is the key word here.

If you talk to greatest-generation people with full-on depression mentalities, then you will know what financially conservative is.
And these days, fear of losing your job is a very healthy fear, probably more sensible than stock market fear.

But you really can't rest until you have at least a million and a half for a couple (or the equivalent in pensions). And this is in addition to social security.
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Re: Who takes financial chances and why is this forum so financially conservative?

Post by bloom2708 » Tue Jun 13, 2017 11:40 am

Two things stand out.

Low interest rates - Your money just doesn't make much, so having $1 or $2 million (outside of appreciation) doesn't spin off that much income. You have to have that 4, 5, 6% return that is certainly not guaranteed.

Healthcare - One blip can really set you back, not having coverage from work is very expensive

A third would be the unknowns of retaining your job at 50 and after. I see threads all the time where people state "I plan to work until 67" and earn more each and every year. Well, best laid plans.
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Re: Who takes financial chances and why is this forum so financially conservative?

Post by jebmke » Tue Jun 13, 2017 11:40 am

Starting in the mid 80s we moved a significant chunk of our equity to small cap value. Over the next two decades we averaged 65-75% of our equity tilted this way.

I don't find this site all that conservative. There seem to be plenty of people who are very high percentage and even 100% in equity.
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Re: Who takes financial chances and why is this forum so financially conservative?

Post by David Jay » Tue Jun 13, 2017 11:43 am

It is possible for fear to overwhelm an individual, I sense that when I see the "bidding war" that we sometimes get around here for sustainable withdrawal rate: 4%, 3.5%, 3%, 2.5%, etc.

I think we all want some measure of control over our lives and we have no control over the future, see the first quote in my signature (below).
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Re: Who takes financial chances and why is this forum so financially conservative?

Post by FelixTheCat » Tue Jun 13, 2017 11:44 am

A lot of people remember 2008-2009.
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bligh
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Re: Who takes financial chances and why is this forum so financially conservative?

Post by bligh » Tue Jun 13, 2017 11:45 am

rgs92 wrote:You think putting 60% of your life savings into the S&P 500 is conservative? Not if you look at the charts. It's certainly a reasonable amount of risk. Reasonable is the key word here.
+1

My perception of the people on this forum isn't that they are financially conservative as much as financially prudent. Various factors such as the need and ability to take risk are taken into account. I feel the commonality is more of a rational, measured, organized and thoughtful approach to investing and personal finance.

I wouldn't consider myself financially conservative either. I have done some things that were risky (career wise) in my past too, and they might still backfire on me. My experience has taught me, the old adage "fortune favors the brave" has some truth to it. It is just that it can sometimes be hard to tell the difference between being brave and being foolish. :sharebeer
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livesoft
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Re: Who takes financial chances and why is this forum so financially conservative?

Post by livesoft » Tue Jun 13, 2017 11:45 am

Are you serious? I'm taking financial chances ALL the TIME!

1. Invest for home down payment in stock funds.

2. Keep emergency fund in stock fund.

3. Invest instead of pay off mortgage.

4. Move to Europe while in my 20's and have a great time.

5. Stop working full-time at age 50.

6. Gotta love that RBD strategy!

7. Market timing is great when not done in the way folks typically think market timing is done.

8. No where near "age-in-bonds" for an asset allocation.

9. I'm not a diehard.
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Re: Who takes financial chances and why is this forum so financially conservative?

Post by dbr » Tue Jun 13, 2017 11:47 am

I think there is a subset of posters who are almost frantic about the security of their actual or anticipated retirement. I don't think the Forum as such is conservative, aggressive, or anything else. There is a range. I agree if there is a mainstream it is, as the other poster stated, prudent.

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Re: Who takes financial chances and why is this forum so financially conservative?

Post by Jags4186 » Tue Jun 13, 2017 11:48 am

I assume that what I have is the best I'll ever have going forward. I'll only make less, work more, get sicker, etc. I plan for the worst. In a scenario where things don't go the worst, I can hang up my boots that much earlier.

I personally have a lot of anxiety around money. I grew up in an upper middle class lifestyle but my parents always fought about money--in fact that is my most prevalent childhood memory. That environment made my sister and me overly conservative.

Flashes1
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Re: Who takes financial chances and why is this forum so financially conservative?

Post by Flashes1 » Tue Jun 13, 2017 12:03 pm

The only thing about the forum members I would stereotype with being conservative is with cars and a house (and I defy that stereotype in a big way!).

staythecourse
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Re: Who takes financial chances and why is this forum so financially conservative?

Post by staythecourse » Tue Jun 13, 2017 12:10 pm

I do agree with you the board is a little nuts about the "numbers" needed. For a rational bunch of folks they think it is somehow rational to try to eliminate ALL risks. No offense to many great posters on this board, but I see certain personality traits consistent by occupation. For engineers and computer guys they are very inflexible and detail oriented. That makes many on here GREAT investors and lousy at accepting that there are no absolutes in life. In my career about 20 minutes into a conversation I can figure out the math oriented folks as they want logic for EVERYTHING. Only problem is life doesn't work that way.

Good luck.
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Re: Who takes financial chances and why is this forum so financially conservative?

Post by jebmke » Tue Jun 13, 2017 12:20 pm

Flashes1 wrote:The only thing about the forum members I would stereotype with being conservative is with cars and a house (and I defy that stereotype in a big way!).
I think on cars and houses you have to distinguish between people who are financially "conservative" and those that just don't give a hoot about cars or houses other than basic functionality. I'm one of the latter. My ultimate goal is to have less house and no car. Money has nothing to do with it.
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Re: Who takes financial chances and why is this forum so financially conservative?

Post by Dottie57 » Tue Jun 13, 2017 12:23 pm

dbr wrote:I think there is a subset of posters who are almost frantic about the security of their actual or anticipated retirement. I don't think the Forum as such is conservative, aggressive, or anything else. There is a range. I agree if there is a mainstream it is, as the other poster stated, prudent.

I just remember 2008/2009 too well and the sinking feeling I had. I will retire in 0-5 years. The money for thefirst 10 years is something I want to be sure of - hence CD fdic insured. I also have bond funds for that time until SS begins.

my money is less conservativly invested for after SS. I have two time periods.

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Re: Who takes financial chances and why is this forum so financially conservative?

Post by Fallible » Tue Jun 13, 2017 12:27 pm

ThankYouJack wrote:Maybe it's just me, but it seems like this forum is getting more financially conservative. For example, people feeling uneasy with 25x in retirement accounts, debt free, great job, ~65% savings rate. I think the fear and financial anxiety on here can be contagious, and the "what-if you got hit by a bus" always come up. I think what if you did get hit by a bus and missed out on everything you wish you had done. IMO, people should also have some FOMO (fear of missing out). I'm not going to be on my death bed wishing that I had gone to more meetings or spent more time with work emails.
...
It would help to have an example of what you're "missing out" on.

Overall, I don't see the forum as financially conservative, fearful, or anxious. But if you feel unfairly held back from doing something you want to do, I can see how you might be perceiving it this way, such as singling out instances of the conservative, fearful, and anxious. But the forum overall is about managing money well, saving and investing wisely for retirement based on what is right for you and your family. That includes finding financially responsible ways to not be "missing out."
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Re: Who takes financial chances and why is this forum so financially conservative?

Post by CppCoder » Tue Jun 13, 2017 12:28 pm

staythecourse wrote: In my career about 20 minutes into a conversation I can figure out the math oriented folks as they want logic for EVERYTHING. Only problem is life doesn't work that way.
But shouldn't life work that way? Quick, am I mathematically oriented or not? :D

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Re: Who takes financial chances and why is this forum so financially conservative?

Post by jebmke » Tue Jun 13, 2017 12:42 pm

Dottie57 wrote:I just remember 2008/2009 too well and the sinking feeling I had. I will retire in 0-5 years.
I retired in December, 2007 :shock:

I have to say, even though I wasn't facing retirement in 2000-2003, that bear market was psychologically more brutal than I remember '08-09. 2008-09 was fairly fast -- deep but fast.
When you discover that you are riding a dead horse, the best strategy is to dismount.

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Re: Who takes financial chances and why is this forum so financially conservative?

Post by GerryL » Tue Jun 13, 2017 12:42 pm

When I was (much) younger, I took plenty of risks, even if I didn't really think of them as risks. Moved cross-country -- or even to other countries -- sometimes with no job lined up. Hitch hiked around Europe (2 young women thumbing rides!) and quit jobs just to travel. Aside from being oblivious to many risks, younger people have more time to recover from poor or risky financial decisions. As you get older, you become more aware of risks and lose the time you would need to recover your financial footing.

Now that I am in my "settled" years, I enjoy having enough $$ to be financially independent. ENOUGH (and then some). I am not interested in taking risks to have MORE. That said, I am approaching 70 with a 60/40 AA and expect to stick with it.

PS Next week I'm taking the "risk" of traveling to Peru for an Amazon river cruise. Taking all sorts of precautions to avoid mosquito bites and travel illnesses.

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Re: Who takes financial chances and why is this forum so financially conservative?

Post by bottlecap » Tue Jun 13, 2017 12:51 pm

Well, you didn't take much of a chance, either. Quitting a job when you are young is not exactly a huge risk. Nor is scaling back your employment.

But, to answer your question, Bogleheads are a relatively stable group that are about making a living, living below your means and getting average market returns. Most are over 40 and/or have children.

It's not exactly a mystery why we don't all gamble on penny stocks and quit our jobs to climb Mt. Everest.

JT
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Re: Who takes financial chances and why is this forum so financially conservative?

Post by Tamalak » Tue Jun 13, 2017 12:52 pm

The OP's concern hits home. I do plan to use a 2.25% withdrawal rate in retirement. Ridiculously low, yes, my justifications are:

1. I plan to retire early, around age 40.
2. I plan to live indefinitely (in the hopes of rejuvenation technologies coming out) so my timeframe is very long.

I also kind of want to have a growing (real value) portfolio. I want my real wealth to be sustainably increasing even as I kick back.

But I also look at the giant pile of money I'm aiming for versus how I plan to spend it and wonder if I'm crazy.

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Re: Who takes financial chances and why is this forum so financially conservative?

Post by Texanbybirth » Tue Jun 13, 2017 12:54 pm

bottlecap wrote:Well, you didn't take much of a chance, either. Quitting a job when you are young is not exactly a huge risk. Nor is scaling back your employment.

But, to answer your question, Bogleheads are a relatively stable group that are about making a living, living below your means and getting average market returns. Most are over 40 and/or have children.

It's not exactly a mystery why we don't all gamble on penny stocks and quit our jobs to climb Mt. Everest.

JT
+1, I'm not just gambling for myself anymore when I take chances. There seems to be a LOT of research about the strategy I have employed that will help me reach my goals. If I deviate from that too drastically because I've got a hunch or want a financial thrill, there are a lot of people besides me who would suffer any ill-fate it caused.

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Re: Who takes financial chances and why is this forum so financially conservative?

Post by nedsaid » Tue Jun 13, 2017 1:08 pm

My suspicion is that the forum is getting more financially conservative because we are all getting older. My best guess is that forum members probably tilt towards the 50 and older crowd. For me, you see that things can go badly wrong in life so it always is a good idea to have good reserves.
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Re: Who takes financial chances and why is this forum so financially conservative?

Post by alex_686 » Tue Jun 13, 2017 1:20 pm

ThankYouJack wrote:Maybe it's just me, but it seems like this forum is getting more financially conservative.
This is my take. Bogleheads push a simple generic strategy. Index funds, static asset allocation, don't risk more than you can lose. The Toyota Corolla of investing. Not sexy, but lots of value which is hard to beat.

Generally speaking we are against people taking risks because people do it so badly. Most of the individual investors that I know who take large risks are basically throwing darts at the wall and hoping that they land on a winner. I do think people can make intelligent risky investments but it is a skill based activity and it takes a considerable investment in time and money to become good at it. Is this something you want to do?

I will point to your own example, quitting a steady job to go flex. Probably a decision you took seriously, not a dart thrown against a wall. I suspect it takes time and effort to continually earn that higher salary. Now, here is the nub of the question. Do you want to spend your time, effort, and risk budget on your job or the stock market? For most people, the answer is to skip the stock market and just index invest.

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Re: Who takes financial chances and why is this forum so financially conservative?

Post by saladdin » Tue Jun 13, 2017 1:22 pm

"Taking risks" is all fun and games when it's just you. People are reckless when they have nothing to lose. Add a family that depends on your actions and life becomes clearer. The thought of your spouse living in a cardboard box because of your actions causes people to tighten up a tad.

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Re: Who takes financial chances and why is this forum so financially conservative?

Post by TomCat96 » Tue Jun 13, 2017 1:24 pm

This forum is getting more financially conservative because the marginal utility of each additional dollar/yen/pound earned diminishes as one's wealth grows, and it diminishes as one ages, which also lessens the need to take on risk to earn more.

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Re: Who takes financial chances and why is this forum so financially conservative?

Post by mega317 » Tue Jun 13, 2017 1:31 pm

I'd say anyone who spent significant time and/or money on their job training took a big financial chance. What if they got to the end and hated the work?

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Re: Who takes financial chances and why is this forum so financially conservative?

Post by triceratop » Tue Jun 13, 2017 1:33 pm

Au contraire! When I talk to friends I am by far the most financially aggressive. But I don't take unnecessary risks. Consider:

1. I use intermediate-term treasuries both as my emergency fund and as a 5-10% bond allocation.

2. I am effectively 100% equities with extra-volatile allocations to SCV, EM, EMV.

3. I am in grad school for a degree which should increase my career options. But, this is a risk.

Many of my friends use short-term CDs and think stock investing is for daring folks who want to get rich. With CDs they're losing ~1% real. Studies have shown my millennial generation owns fewer stocks than the boomers. I'm okay with the risk of stocks; at least they have a positive expected real return.
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Re: Who takes financial chances and why is this forum so financially conservative?

Post by Tamarind » Tue Jun 13, 2017 1:34 pm

nedsaid wrote:My suspicion is that the forum is getting more financially conservative because we are all getting older. My best guess is that forum members probably tilt towards the 50 and older crowd.
I think this is likely. Doing my best to bring in a mess of 30-something whippersnappers. :D

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Re: Who takes financial chances and why is this forum so financially conservative?

Post by njboater74 » Tue Jun 13, 2017 1:45 pm

ThankYouJack wrote:IMO, people should also have some FOMO (fear of missing out). I'm not going to be on my death bed wishing that I had gone to more meetings or spent more time with work emails.
Everything requires balance. Nobody uses the exact words "I wish I spent more time at work" on their deathbeds, but I'm sure there are plenty of people who are living their retirements in poverty, struggling to get by, and would say in another context "I wish I worked harder", "I wish I studied harder", "I wish I managed my money better".

Risk is not absolute. An expert climber scaling El Capitan would be taking less risk than I would be scaling a simple 100ft rock wall - because I don't know how to climb. I made moves when I was younger that would be very risky today and would put my home, career, and children's futures at risk. In my 20's, it simply meant I was broke and living with my parents for a couple years.
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Re: Who takes financial chances and why is this forum so financially conservative?

Post by munemaker » Tue Jun 13, 2017 1:47 pm

livesoft wrote:Are you serious? I'm taking financial chances ALL the TIME!

...

2. Keep emergency fund in stock fund.

...
You are living on the edge!

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Re: Who takes financial chances and why is this forum so financially conservative?

Post by munemaker » Tue Jun 13, 2017 1:52 pm

To me, if you have a "fear of missing out," you just don't get it.

Adjust your lifestyle and expectations, be happy with what you have and keep everything in balance. Once you reach a certain point, you don't have to spend a lot of additional money to life a satisfying and fulfilling life.

Is having a Mercedes (instead of a Honda) or a bigger house what you are missing out on? Would it really affect your satisfaction with your life? If so, you may be focusing on the wrong things.

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Re: Who takes financial chances and why is this forum so financially conservative?

Post by Raabe34 » Tue Jun 13, 2017 1:55 pm

The thing that doesn't get enough play on this board is inflation. Not everyone should be 100% equity but over a standard 20yr retirement costs will double. That post with the 30 something in a 60-40 is just wrong. If he retires he should have cash for 2 years expenses and be out there much further on the equity side. I disagree with Sir Bogle on this one.

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Re: Who takes financial chances and why is this forum so financially conservative?

Post by Sheepdog » Tue Jun 13, 2017 1:58 pm

I changed companies only once in my career. I am conservative by nature and happy with it.
However, I married my girl friend after seeing her on only 23 occasions over 11 months before marriage. (We courted mostly by mail. Long distance telephone was too expensive back then. We lived a hundred miles apart initially then 700 miles apart.) That was 56 years ago. It worked out quite well psychologically and financially.

And, I have had only 22 to24% stocks in my investments over the last dozen years! Happy with that too.
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Re: Who takes financial chances and why is this forum so financially conservative?

Post by mac808 » Tue Jun 13, 2017 1:59 pm

munemaker wrote:To me, if you have a "fear of missing out," you just don't get it.

Adjust your lifestyle and expectations, be happy with what you have and keep everything in balance. Once you reach a certain point, you don't have to spend a lot of additional money to life a satisfying and fulfilling life.

Is having a Mercedes (instead of a Honda) or a bigger house what you are missing out on? Would it really affect your satisfaction with your life? If so, you may be focusing on the wrong things.
No, but having financial freedom and then losing it can really screw with your mind.

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Re: Who takes financial chances and why is this forum so financially conservative?

Post by DaftInvestor » Tue Jun 13, 2017 2:00 pm

I've worked at 5 different tech startups over the years - none worked out the way I hoped. One gave me a good boost up though. For one - I had young kids and no EF and finally decided to take a vacation after 2 years of hard work with no time off. When I was out on vacation the company shut down (I knew we were burning through cash but didn't know how fast). It wasn't a good feeling.

My FOMO now revolves around having financial security and an early retirement versus blowing through money on silly things.
So yes - I have a FOMO - but its a FOMO on a comfortable retirement.

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Re: Who takes financial chances and why is this forum so financially conservative?

Post by marti038 » Tue Jun 13, 2017 2:15 pm

I once used a weed eater without safety glasses. Does that count?

Kidding aside, The answer for me is time. I'm only 36 and have a lot of time to save. The path to financial security with the most likely outcome of success, IMHO, is the Boglehead way. I could spend everything I make in income up into my 50's then try to make up for lost time with riskier investments, but why take the chance? It seems foolish.

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Re: Who takes financial chances and why is this forum so financially conservative?

Post by ecotone » Tue Jun 13, 2017 2:16 pm

I'm 36 and feel that my approach to saving/investing is more aggressive than much of what I read on here. My assumption is that many people who actively contribute are older than I am, so I am not surprised by the philosophical tilt. I like to plan & study and reading/learning about smart investors personal approach is helpful and interesting...whether or not it falls in line strategically with mine.

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Re: Who takes financial chances and why is this forum so financially conservative?

Post by Grt2bOutdoors » Tue Jun 13, 2017 2:25 pm

Raabe34 wrote:The thing that doesn't get enough play on this board is inflation. Not everyone should be 100% equity but over a standard 20yr retirement costs will double. That post with the 30 something in a 60-40 is just wrong. If he retires he should have cash for 2 years expenses and be out there much further on the equity side. I disagree with Sir Bogle on this one.
What's more important is deflation, permanent deflation of assets if one bails out at a low price instead of being able to stay the course. The 2008-2009 time period ought to be a stark reminder of what happens when you panic (I'll remember this line myself the next time the market tanks heavily :wink: ).

Yes, inflation, however, all the retirees I know, even the ones who retired early eventually trimmed back their activities and consequently their spending. The nursing home? I only know of one individual who ever got to that stage, all others made a stopover at the cemetary first, where they went after that is anyone's guess, but they did not have a need for money at that point.
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Re: Who takes financial chances and why is this forum so financially conservative?

Post by delamer » Tue Jun 13, 2017 2:38 pm

There is a regular contributor to this forum whose wife recently had a massive stroke at age 70. She will likely need expensive care for an unknown, and possibly long, period. Many members of my family had dementia at the end of life, and also required expensive care for a few months to many years.

When you see those situations and you are approaching your retirement, it makes you consider how well prepared you are for "worst case" scenarios and tends to limit your financial risk-tasking.

Not to mention the impact of seeing friends/family lose their jobs in their 50's with little to no chance of finding a comparable position.

So there were times in my younger, single years that I took financial chances -- for instance, left a government job that I was unhappy with and moved to the private sector. But I would not have done that in the last 10 years at my age with my responsibilities.

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Re: Who takes financial chances and why is this forum so financially conservative?

Post by chinto » Tue Jun 13, 2017 2:40 pm

To the OP, It seems to me you are simply projecting your view of the world on others. People view money and assets differently.

For example some who may have religious convictions may not even view their assets as something they can actually spend, rather as a talent that has to be productively employed.

I think your comment about missing out it telling. Some of us delight in what others may view as mundane. To give you an idea, I really do not think you have lived until you have eaten a tree ripe Belle of Georgia peach, a tree ripened Harvest Queen pear, a Chenago Strawberry apple, fully ripe Taylor Raspberries, a tree ripened Ozark Premier plum. Few have ever experienced these ambrosiac delights and to my way of thinking they have missed a gift from the gods, but I am projecting my view on others, much the way it appears you are.

What you consider conservative others may view as foolhardy and from their vantage point they are most assuredly right. I would consider a conservative portfolio one that assumes you will live until 115 years of age and have 125% of your yearly expenses invested in TIPs times (115-age at retirement). To me that eliminates a great of risk. So opinions vary on what is conservative.

jjface
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Re: Who takes financial chances and why is this forum so financially conservative?

Post by jjface » Tue Jun 13, 2017 2:41 pm

I quit my corporate job I was excelling in when I was young and traveled with my wife. It was life changing. Traveling later on in life would not have been the same and I would have missed the opportunity. Youthful energy and open eyes. I started my own business as well and now work from home for myself and make enough. I get to spend more time with my family. I don't have lots of money though. If I stuck with the straight path I would have been making what a lot of people on here seem to make and maybe be retired a lot sooner. Those working years would have been torture to me though. Not the best decision financially but it is worth it for a better quality of life.

I think people tend to get more conservative the closer to retirement they are. It makes sense. A glide path of risk taking.

heyyou
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Re: Who takes financial chances and why is this forum so financially conservative?

Post by heyyou » Tue Jun 13, 2017 2:43 pm

Who needs conservative?
After buying my first house, just less than a year later, I was laid off for six weeks.
A few years later, I made quick money with a $9000 investment in a limited partnership, so I boosted my investment (all my recent inheritance) to $50K in the next one. That LP failed in the RE bust of the early 1980s, so I lost all of the principal.
That 50K in the VG index fund (there was only one then) would now equal my current portfolio value in retirement, and for a while, I used my pension credits as my fixed income allocation.
I choose conservative because it suits me.
Since you are asking the question, what financial losses have you experienced?

chinto
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Re: Who takes financial chances and why is this forum so financially conservative?

Post by chinto » Tue Jun 13, 2017 2:48 pm

alex_686 wrote:
ThankYouJack wrote:The Toyota Corolla of investing.
It must be nice to be rich and be able to afford the name brand. We had to settle for the lower price twins in the form of a Geo Prizm and then a Chevy Prizm (still driving a 1994 and 1999 respectively) - LOL.

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bligh
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Re: Who takes financial chances and why is this forum so financially conservative?

Post by bligh » Tue Jun 13, 2017 2:51 pm

Sometimes.. when I think no one is watching.... I buy lottery tickets. :moneybag

mptfan
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Re: Who takes financial chances and why is this forum so financially conservative?

Post by mptfan » Tue Jun 13, 2017 2:55 pm

Tamalak wrote: But I also look at the giant pile of money I'm aiming for versus how I plan to spend it and wonder if I'm crazy.
I do think that a 2.25% withdrawal rate is way too low, that means you saved too much and are spending too little (in my opinion). But that's just my opinion, and your money is not my money, so if that is how you want to live then it is not crazy, it is a reasonable choice, and I support your right to make that choice.
I eat risk for breakfast. :)

TomCat96
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Re: Who takes financial chances and why is this forum so financially conservative?

Post by TomCat96 » Tue Jun 13, 2017 2:59 pm

I just wanted to say for those of you who don't know, there's a subreddit called FIRE which stands for Financially Independent, Retire Early, which is essentially the younger version of bogleheads.

By definition, most are not yet retired. If you're looking for advice (and implicit higher risk tolerance) from the younger crowd, that might be more up your alley.
I do think however their discussion is a little more disorganized.

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knpstr
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Re: Who takes financial chances and why is this forum so financially conservative?

Post by knpstr » Tue Jun 13, 2017 3:06 pm

What kind of "additional chances"?
Very little is needed to make a happy life; it is all within yourself, in your way of thinking. -Marcus Aurelius

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triceratop
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Re: Who takes financial chances and why is this forum so financially conservative?

Post by triceratop » Tue Jun 13, 2017 3:16 pm

TomCat96 wrote:I just wanted to say for those of you who don't know, there's a subreddit called FIRE which stands for Financially Independent, Retire Early, which is essentially the younger version of bogleheads.

By definition, most are not yet retired. If you're looking for advice (and implicit higher risk tolerance) from the younger crowd, that might be more up your alley.
I do think however their discussion is a little more disorganized.
Boglehead philosophy applies to all age groups. I don't think a young person would necessarily want advice from a younger crowd, they would want advice tailored for a younger person. Older, more experienced, more knowledgeable investors may have the best advice for young investors.
"To play the stock market is to play musical chairs under the chord progression of a bid-ask spread."

DetroitRick
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Re: Who takes financial chances and why is this forum so financially conservative?

Post by DetroitRick » Tue Jun 13, 2017 3:41 pm

I take financial chances, but I realize that my "chances" definition can be a relative thing. Haven't bet the house at the gaming tables, for example. But I've changed professions several times - worked out well; retired early - so far, so good; and maintain a fairly aggressive asset allocation through two massive downturns - came out great. No doubt I could have taken more risks, but we all have our own sweet spot. And I do think that move to Hawaii was just plain cool. Moving around more is something that I do regret not doing.

I like being exposed to financially conservative points of view. I use them to assess and understand the risks I'm taking. They make me think, analyze and study. But I would never take advice on how much risk I should take on from anybody else - my only need is to understand the risk itself. That's what is important to me - nobody else lives your life. And let's face it, financial advice out there in the world can brutally wrong. And we all have different risk tolerances.

I'm looking forward to a long death-bed debate with myself someday as to whether my optimal withdrawal strategy should have been 3.26% or 4.05% (initial rate, adjusted for inflation of course). Likewise whether my social security choice should have been 62, 66 or 70. I can only hope that I'm heavily medicated at that point :oops: .

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