Real career path for a 23 yr old with no college degree

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simple man
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Real career path for a 23 yr old with no college degree

Post by simple man » Mon Jul 11, 2016 4:58 pm

I am hoping to tap the group's wisdom and experiences on this one as I am somewhat at a loss. My 23 year old son (ADHD and very dyslexic) has decided college is not for him. I can't disagree. His strengths are great personality, people like him, extroverted, and he is good at sales. I want to give career guidance but with the economy as is, employers can hire workers with college degrees and often dont want those without one. He does not want to go the electrician or plumber route, though i think those are great options. I think he will accel at sales, but I dont see any sales training programs like they used to have. Its the old - they wont hire him because he does not have experience, but cant get a job to get experience. He could do enterprise level sales if we could just get him in somewhere. Any ideas are greatly appreciated. Thanks.

Teague
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Re: Real career path for a 23 yr old with no college degree

Post by Teague » Mon Jul 11, 2016 5:04 pm

He could start out in new car sales. Last I checked, no experience necessary. Then build from there.
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livesoft
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Re: Real career path for a 23 yr old with no college degree

Post by livesoft » Mon Jul 11, 2016 5:06 pm

At my former employer, sales was a lot of reading Requests for Proposals, preparing quotes to be e-mailed, and following up. That is, it seems to me that dyslexia and ADHD would not go unnoticed in working in sales at my former employer.

Why not start a wholesale plant nursery and grow plants for retailers? I have a friend who owns his own business doing that.
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Angrypuppy
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Re: Real career path for a 23 yr old with no college degree

Post by Angrypuppy » Mon Jul 11, 2016 5:09 pm

Military?

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Re: Real career path for a 23 yr old with no college degree

Post by Fallible » Mon Jul 11, 2016 5:24 pm

simple man wrote:I am hoping to tap the group's wisdom and experiences on this one as I am somewhat at a loss. My 23 year old son (ADHD and very dyslexic) has decided college is not for him. I can't disagree. His strengths are great personality, people like him, extroverted, and he is good at sales. I want to give career guidance but with the economy as is, employers can hire workers with college degrees and often dont want those without one. He does not want to go the electrician or plumber route, though i think those are great options. I think he will accel at sales, but I dont see any sales training programs like they used to have. Its the old - they wont hire him because he does not have experience, but cant get a job to get experience. He could do enterprise level sales if we could just get him in somewhere. Any ideas are greatly appreciated. Thanks.


There should be organizations in your area that work with ADHD, dyslexia, etc, and can help In some way, either knowing of suitable jobs available or providing some kind of training. If he received special help in high school or the college he attended, perhaps you couId contact them.
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simple man
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Re: Real career path for a 23 yr old with no college degree

Post by simple man » Mon Jul 11, 2016 5:27 pm

Teague wrote:He could start out in new car sales. Last I checked, no experience necessary. Then build from there.


I think he is leaning towards this path...his only concern is getting pigeon-holed as a "car salesman" and being excluded from enterprise sales later on...
But maybe that is a risk he has to take. Thanks.

delamer
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Re: Real career path for a 23 yr old with no college degree

Post by delamer » Mon Jul 11, 2016 5:29 pm

Real estate sales would give him an independent path. He'd have to get licensed and work through a brokerage, but he wouldn't need to get "hired" as such.

I know of real estate teams in my area where one person focuses on sales and the other on the paperwork end. That might work for your son.

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Re: Real career path for a 23 yr old with no college degree

Post by joebh » Mon Jul 11, 2016 5:39 pm

Has he considered a services job?

I know a few bartenders who love the lifestyle and are making decent money. Personality can go a long way there.

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plannerman
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Re: Real career path for a 23 yr old with no college degree

Post by plannerman » Mon Jul 11, 2016 5:44 pm

Sounds a lot like our son.

He struggled at school, but managed to graduate HS. He went on to a two-year vocational school and worked in construction for while. He didn't have good fine-motor skills and couldn't read blueprints very well, so he ended up as the crew gofer and site clean up person. But we were very happy he was getting up and going to work every day when many kids his age were sleeping in their mother's basements and doing drugs to pass the time of day.

When home construction jobs collapsed in 2007-2008, he went to truck driving school and got a job as a long-haul truck driver. His strong suits are 1) he is a good driver and 2) he's very reliable--and that's what is valued in the trucking industry.

He has since bought his own truck and is now an independent, owner-operator. He works very long hours to make his truck payments and has learned he has to manage his expenses to be a successful small business person. He is away from home for weeks at a time (he's single) but he likes what he does and likes being his own boss. I can't tell you how proud we are of him.

It may take a while, but if your son preservers he will find something he's good at and enjoys doing.

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Toons
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Re: Real career path for a 23 yr old with no college degree

Post by Toons » Mon Jul 11, 2016 5:51 pm

Auto Sales. :happy
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Re: Real career path for a 23 yr old with no college degree

Post by rgs92 » Mon Jul 11, 2016 6:08 pm

Army?

TMCD75
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Re: Real career path for a 23 yr old with no college degree

Post by TMCD75 » Mon Jul 11, 2016 6:10 pm

I was going to suggest getting a trade. Electricians, heating and air, plumbers etc., make good money. He could start his own business and then make more money than most people with fancy degrees.

I'm a self employed painter, I do 80-125k per year in the Louisville Ky area. I went to college even though I had little desire to do so. One of the biggest problems facing young kids now days is the pressure of going to college. College IS NOT for everyone, but they will never tell you that because they want your MONEY. High schools need to do a better job of guiding kids and informing kids who don't want to spend 4 years and 60k chasing a degree.

There are wonderful trade school opportunities out there. College is out of control price wise, go to a trade school and make a living working for your self.

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gunn_show
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Re: Real career path for a 23 yr old with no college degree

Post by gunn_show » Mon Jul 11, 2016 6:16 pm

simple man wrote:
Teague wrote:He could start out in new car sales. Last I checked, no experience necessary. Then build from there.


I think he is leaning towards this path...his only concern is getting pigeon-holed as a "car salesman" and being excluded from enterprise sales later on...
But maybe that is a risk he has to take. Thanks.


I have a communications degree, couldn't find a real job post-grad, and had to start in sales. Started in insurance, where a lot of the larger firms (think auto insurance, home/life, Northwestern Mutual) do have true real training programs. Without that first job with crucial 3-mos training program, I am not sure I would be where I am today (in enterprise software sales). I did ~6 years in various insurance sales gigs (auto insurance, then commercial insurance (contractors liability/workers comp), and the last ~8 years in software. I got lucky that I found a local startup software firm willing to take me on with "no software sales experience" despite making 2x their salary at my last insurance gig. (I got out of contractors insurance in 2008 as it was falling knife)

The pigeon hole thing does exist, definitely, hands down. Many times in interviews I've had to overcome being "an insurance guy" or a "XXX software guy" or whatever, which is ridiculous, since I went to school for something totally different and have always had to adapt to sell something else. So it's been a hurdle but has not prevented me from landing bigger better jobs over time. Nobody grows up being a "XXX software guy" so that whole thing is flat dumb. You just have to come prepared and have a great story around it, which is not that hard.

However if by "enterprise sales later on" you mean enterprise software/hardware/tech... then without a BA degree, he may be out of luck no matter what. If I think of my last decade in tech sales, I cannot think of any peers without a degree that come to mind. Strike that, one guy, at the same initial software startup. It took him 10 years to find a growth position at another small local company. So, it's possible, but perhaps not at "enterprise / megacorp level" if that is what you're dreaming for your son. Very difficult for the larger companies, where often the resume screener or recruiter won't even answer the call or email with no degree on the ledger.

I also speak from experience, as my wife is in sales with no degree. Her options are limited. There are infinitely more sales reps than there are positions, especially at the higher levels, so companies are picky. Doesn't always make sense and often doesn't, but not much you can do but go get the degree.

I'd advise him to go get the biggest best sales job with formal training he can, buckle up, work his ass off, and see how far he can go with it. In this business it's mostly grit and hard work, it truly is. I see a lot of lazy reps and it just makes my job (and promotions and advancement) that much easier. If he can outwork everyone else, perhaps enterprise sales could be there someday. It helps to network and get to know a lot of people, so when the time comes, he can get warm intros to some higher level jobs that could compensate for the non-degree.
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VoiceOfReason
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Re: Real career path for a 23 yr old with no college degree

Post by VoiceOfReason » Mon Jul 11, 2016 6:32 pm

There is a lot to consider here.

If your son is extroverted and personable, those are great sales skills but also life skills. the good news is, many sales organizations do NOT care about a degree, gpa, or anything like that. In sales all that matters is if you are proven and good, period. So your son can be successful without a 4 yr college degree. Also, the adhd/dyslexia is not an issue in most sales positions. He can get around that. In fact I would submit most sales people have some level of adhd...that's one reason they aren't in 9-5 cubicle jobs.

However, he will always be facing an uphill battle his entire life without the degree and will be limited in his advancement because of it. if the goal here is a livable income and regular life....he won't need the degree if he's good at sales. He will face more headwinds if a high comp position is the goal. If the latter is the goal, I strongly recommend a degree....something. Associates degree is better than nothing.

The concern over the car sales label is very valid. If he stays in a car sales position for longer than 2-3 years, then he will be labeled that.

For your son to get into B2B sales, he will HAVE to network like crazy. The only way he gets into a high earning b2b sales job without a degree is if someone who trusts him gives him that opportunity.

My suggestion is to map out the path as much as possible. if B2B sales is the goal, any B2C sales will be minimally valued. Car sales will get him immediate sales experience, but he would then need to almost immediately get into a B2B sales job afterwards otherwise he will be labeled.

The new "sales training" programs are inside sales at a large company. If he can find his way into one of those positions with a megacorp, have success and then express his will to be in outside sales, he can get it via this path. Companies look to their driven, flexible inside sales force to fill their open outside sales spots around the country. This is by far the most reliable path. His challenge will be to get the inside sales job without a degree....again networking.

It all really comes down to if he's above average consistently. B2B sales is the majors that all sales reps aspire to. B2C sales is the minors.

I personally know a handful of sales directors in medical sales that only have an associates degrees. It's possible but hard.

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Re: Real career path for a 23 yr old with no college degree

Post by Bee » Mon Jul 11, 2016 6:35 pm

simple man wrote:His strengths are great personality, people like him, extroverted, and he is good at sales.

I would agree with joebh about service industry jobs.
My suggestion would be going to barber school, it's a short program and sounds like it would play to your son's strengths. I have a very close friend who makes great money as a barber, just have to find the right shop and clientele. It can also eventually lead into a good business if you open your own shop with unique branding.

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Re: Real career path for a 23 yr old with no college degree

Post by August » Mon Jul 11, 2016 6:42 pm

If he likes sales, I'd look into roofing or restoration sales. He may get some great travel opportunities as well. Unless he's afraid of heights, then might not be the best career path.

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Re: Real career path for a 23 yr old with no college degree

Post by stoptothink » Mon Jul 11, 2016 6:43 pm

You don't necessarily need sales experience to get into sales, around here it seems you need to be willing to start from the bottom. Just speaking from my wife's experience, she quit a pretty good job as a director in a non-profit to take a job in the call center of a local tech company. She was tired of the industry, wanted something with more earning potential, and also wanted flexibility as she was pregnant with my son and was considering being a SAHM after. She had to start at near minimum wage, on the phones all day. It took her all of 9-months to be promoted to enterprise sales, with no prior sales experience, and she will likely break 6-figures this year. She doesn't have a degree, neither does her director, and I think there might be 4 people out of 10 on her team who do. They all started in the company's call center, all within the last handful of years. I have several friends and neighbors who have a similar story with various local tech companies. Find a growing local company and start from the bottom; couldn't be a whole lot worse than what he is doing now.

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Re: Real career path for a 23 yr old with no college degree

Post by KlangFool » Mon Jul 11, 2016 6:50 pm

simple man wrote: His strengths are great personality, people like him, extroverted, and he is good at sales.


simple man,

In order for you to say that, he must had sold something. What did he sales? I am asking in order to explore what else that he can sales.

KlangFool

P.S.: pharmaceutical sales -> Legal drug sales person is another great sales area.

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Re: Real career path for a 23 yr old with no college degree

Post by renue74 » Mon Jul 11, 2016 7:23 pm

HVAC or Plumbing? These jobs, he could make a good living.

Any service or retail jobs, but they are tough and lower paying.

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TxAg
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Re: Real career path for a 23 yr old with no college degree

Post by TxAg » Mon Jul 11, 2016 7:43 pm

He could work in the PVF world (pipe, valve, and fittings). There are countless distributors, rep agencies, and manufacturers that need good salesmen. There are part #'s and short product descriptions that he'd have to learn but never long sentences/paragraphs. It's all repeatable so he could pick it up and run with it. (I know very little about ADHD and Dyslexia)

With no college, he'd probably have to start with inside sales. Within 2-5 years he could make it to outside sales. Maybe 10 years depending on opportunity and turn over. So he'd probably start around $40k and could make $80k-$150k once he's outside depending on what products he's selling. Other perks include free car, gas, cell phone, and lots of free food :)

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Re: Real career path for a 23 yr old with no college degree

Post by joe8d » Mon Jul 11, 2016 8:27 pm

Target.
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Re: Real career path for a 23 yr old with no college degree

Post by Tamarind » Mon Jul 11, 2016 8:38 pm

stoptothink wrote:You don't necessarily need sales experience to get into sales, around here it seems you need to be willing to start from the bottom. Just speaking from my wife's experience, she quit a pretty good job as a director in a non-profit to take a job in the call center of a local tech company.


+1. Not in sales but I work at a fast-hiring tech company and get to watch how sales is managed here. We hire new MBAs, new college grads, and those with no degree but a little sales experience. We don't much care what industry previous selling was in. All at the same rock bottom rate. :twisted:

The first three months are just weeding and then we start promoting those that succeed. I've seen people go from pure cold calling purgatory to closing inside to managing sales teams in under 3 years. After another year of that and they are ready to jump ship for somewhere that pays better.

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Re: Real career path for a 23 yr old with no college degree

Post by quantAndHold » Mon Jul 11, 2016 8:42 pm

renue74 wrote:HVAC or Plumbing? These jobs, he could make a good living.

Any service or retail jobs, but they are tough and lower paying.


When I was at the community college taking prerequisites for grad school, the guy who runs the HVAC program at the community college saw a bunch of us waiting around for class to start, so decided to come in and give his pitch. I don't remember all the details because I wasn't actually looking to change careers, but I remember the entry level pay was really, really good. I would think good people and sales skills would go a long way in that line of work as well.

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Re: Real career path for a 23 yr old with no college degree

Post by naha66 » Mon Jul 11, 2016 9:03 pm

Comcast (insert local cable company) installer. They will train you from zero. That where some of their sales people start. Plus the installer tech can and does upsales which pays bonuses. They are the front line sales people. My son started with them about a year ago and doing just fine with his ADHD.

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Re: Real career path for a 23 yr old with no college degree

Post by NoGambleNoFuture » Tue Jul 12, 2016 12:10 am

If he's outgoing and personable I think recruiting is a great industry. I have a teammate that has zero college completed making well into 6figs... Have your son look up recruiting coordinator positions as a place to start.

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Re: Real career path for a 23 yr old with no college degree

Post by 2comma » Tue Jul 12, 2016 12:53 am

My ex-BIL was a handful in HS (school record for number of times he dropped out) he finally got his GED. He got his first real job at a friends dad's electronics store (counter sales) which led to a job selling cable and wire. From what I've heard most of the work he did was over the phone. He changed jobs several times, for more money each time and eventually ended up as a sales manager. My college educated wife and I (I have a Masters), both in hi-tech computer stuff, were quickly surpassed salary wise because he had the gift. If he has an interest and ability it could work out very well for him.

From what little I understand about sales you have to have the ability to ignore rejection and move onto the next opportunity - most good sales people are driven and have the uncanny ability to externalize failures an internalized successes. Do you think your son has the ability to do that?
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Re: Real career path for a 23 yr old with no college degree

Post by JoinToday » Tue Jul 12, 2016 1:06 am

plannerman wrote:Sounds a lot like our son.

He struggled at school, but managed to graduate HS. He went on to a two-year vocational school and worked in construction for while. He didn't have good fine-motor skills and couldn't read blueprints very well, so he ended up as the crew gofer and site clean up person. But we were very happy he was getting up and going to work every day when many kids his age were sleeping in their mother's basements and doing drugs to pass the time of day.

When home construction jobs collapsed in 2007-2008, he went to truck driving school and got a job as a long-haul truck driver. His strong suits are 1) he is a good driver and 2) he's very reliable--and that's what is valued in the trucking industry.

He has since bought his own truck and is now an independent, owner-operator. He works very long hours to make his truck payments and has learned he has to manage his expenses to be a successful small business person. He is away from home for weeks at a time (he's single) but he likes what he does and likes being his own boss. I can't tell you how proud we are of him.

It may take a while, but if your son preservers he will find something he's good at and enjoys doing.

plannerman


This is a good story, I am happy for both you and your son. Your son is lucky to have you and your wife as parents, and you and your wife are lucky to have a son that turned out so well. Many are not so lucky.

I wish the OP & the son equal success.
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Re: Real career path for a 23 yr old with no college degree

Post by amr » Tue Jul 12, 2016 9:01 am

A few things to consider regarding car sales. (besides no experience required and income opportunity)

Plenty of companies sell/do business with car dealers from banks/credit unions, auto parts stores, marketing, and SAAS companies. Even if car sales isn't what he wants to do long term it can lead to a variety of opportunities with other companies. Some of these companies serve other industries.

I wouldn't worry about sales training programs. If he decides to sell then the training and mentorship he receives from his employer will be what is really important. Audio books would be a wise investment, though.

Car sales, like any sales job, is very competitive, though. It is not easy money by any means. Long hours and lots of work are required to succeed.

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Re: Real career path for a 23 yr old with no college degree

Post by simplesimon » Tue Jul 12, 2016 9:42 am

Someone I know started working for a staffing firm, which was a total grind for four years. He was successful at it and with his experience was able to become a recruiter at big tech firms (this was in the Bay Area) making very good money and benefits all without a college degree.

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Re: Real career path for a 23 yr old with no college degree

Post by market timer » Tue Jul 12, 2016 10:59 am

Being personable is a good skill, but I don't think it's enough to build a career on. Virtually any white collar job, including sales, is going to require a college degree. I would suggest learning a trade, then using people skills to grow the business and manage a team.

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Re: Real career path for a 23 yr old with no college degree

Post by stoptothink » Tue Jul 12, 2016 11:52 am

market timer wrote:Being personable is a good skill, but I don't think it's enough to build a career on. Virtually any white collar job, including sales, is going to require a college degree.


I can't speak for other areas of the country, but this simply isn't true around here. My wife is only one example of a successful sales person who has no college education, so is my best friend, her best friend, and the majority of her team. My best friend not only had no college education, but a criminal record. You do have to be willing to start at the bottom and prove yourself...took my wife all of 9-months to go from call center to enterprise sales in a large tech company.

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Re: Real career path for a 23 yr old with no college degree

Post by reriodan » Tue Jul 12, 2016 12:24 pm

stoptothink wrote:
market timer wrote:Being personable is a good skill, but I don't think it's enough to build a career on. Virtually any white collar job, including sales, is going to require a college degree.


I can't speak for other areas of the country, but this simply isn't true around here. My wife is only one example of a successful sales person who has no college education, so is my best friend, her best friend, and the majority of her team. My best friend not only had no college education, but a criminal record. You do have to be willing to start at the bottom and prove yourself...took my wife all of 9-months to go from call center to enterprise sales in a large tech company.


What age are you talking about though? Nowadays, a college degree is like a what a highschool diploma used to be. Sure, it is possible to make it without one, but it is going to be MUCH harder and I think you will get turned down from many positions simply for not being able to mark that checkbox.

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Re: Real career path for a 23 yr old with no college degree

Post by roflwaffle » Tue Jul 12, 2016 12:39 pm

That sounds like me. I was fortunate and was able to switch up my majors/courses enough to get enough credits/courses to graduate, but it was touch and go even without dyslexia. After college, my degree didn't help out a whole lot with my job search because of my spotty job history, but it was helpful once I had enough industry experience (IT) under my belt. How has behavioral therapy/medication been for your son? I was diagnosed after I found a decent job/got married, and those two have really helped me hold things together. :beer

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Re: Real career path for a 23 yr old with no college degree

Post by stoptothink » Tue Jul 12, 2016 12:47 pm

reriodan wrote:
stoptothink wrote:
market timer wrote:Being personable is a good skill, but I don't think it's enough to build a career on. Virtually any white collar job, including sales, is going to require a college degree.


I can't speak for other areas of the country, but this simply isn't true around here. My wife is only one example of a successful sales person who has no college education, so is my best friend, her best friend, and the majority of her team. My best friend not only had no college education, but a criminal record. You do have to be willing to start at the bottom and prove yourself...took my wife all of 9-months to go from call center to enterprise sales in a large tech company.


What age are you talking about though? Nowadays, a college degree is like a what a highschool diploma used to be. Sure, it is possible to make it without one, but it is going to be MUCH harder and I think you will get turned down from many positions simply for not being able to mark that checkbox.


My wife is 29, my best friend is 35, her best friend is 27. They all started at their current employers within the last 4yrs, without a single degree or any sales experience between them. They all started in positions which definitely don't require a degree (call center, customer service) and simply showed that they had a natural affinity for it. I am very aware that college degrees are near a pre-req for many jobs today (I have a doctorate), but tech (and especially sales) is turning that tide a bit.

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Re: Real career path for a 23 yr old with no college degree

Post by meowcat » Tue Jul 12, 2016 12:57 pm

Teague wrote:He could start out in new car sales. Last I checked, no experience necessary. Then build from there.

Agreed. The automotive industry is a great place to make a lot of money without a higher education.
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Re: Real career path for a 23 yr old with no college degree

Post by William4u » Tue Jul 12, 2016 1:11 pm

CNN had an article a few days ago...

"College grads are getting nearly all the jobs."
http://money.cnn.com/2016/06/30/news/ec ... index.html

While there are plenty of stories of individuals who buck the trend and get a good job without a degree, there are far more that do not. Everyone likes the story of an outlier (like a NBA player who worked hard and became a millionaire) but "Hoop Dreams" is the norm for the vast majority of people. People revert to the mean. For every non-degree success there are dozens of people who fit the CNN story. Hard work isn't enough. Luck plays a big role.

Nowadays the good blue collar jobs virtually require a Community College (CC) degree. Many auto repair shops now only hire new mechanics with CC degrees for insurance reasons, as well as welders, electricians, plumbers, body shops, carpenters, HVAC, etc. Here is a video discussing this in the automotive industry...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OkQxDgktTO8

Of course, 5% of people are outliers, and 5% of a large number is a pretty large number. So there will be plenty of people who fit into the 5% who get good jobs without a degree. But most people will be in the 95% no matter how hard they work. It isn't fair but that is how employers are.

69% of American adults lack a 4-year college degree. 62% lack any college degree including both 2 and 4 year degrees (about 7% of adults have a 2-year associates degree which includes things like HVAC, auto technician, electrician, LPN, etc.). That is a huge number of people without any degrees competing tooth-and-nail for the few decent jobs for those without a degree.
http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter ... k-santoru/

If he is interested he might look into a CC degree.

nukewerker
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Re: Real career path for a 23 yr old with no college degree

Post by nukewerker » Tue Jul 12, 2016 8:51 pm

I have a cousin that does alarm sales, makes $210k I believe. Around 30.

Pharmacist
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Re: Real career path for a 23 yr old with no college degree

Post by Pharmacist » Wed Jul 13, 2016 12:48 am

I'd pick up a trade like trucking driving, welding, mechanic, etc. All will make a lot more money than my friends who graduated with business degrees that are running cash registers for $8 an hour.

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William4u
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Re: Real career path for a 23 yr old with no college degree

Post by William4u » Wed Jul 13, 2016 1:08 am

Pharmacist wrote:I'd pick up a trade like trucking driving, welding, mechanic, etc. All will make a lot more money than my friends who graduated with business degrees that are running cash registers for $8 an hour.


Outside of econ or finance, a business degree is a bad degree to get. They consistently have low skill levels, low lifetime earnings, and they are a dime and dozen (as the most popular degrees with 40% of current students in a low-earning business major)...
http://www.nytimes.com/roomfordebate/20 ... ess-degree
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/04/17/educa ... ess-t.html

Tha Rev
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Re: Real career path for a 23 yr old with no college degree

Post by Tha Rev » Wed Jul 13, 2016 8:16 pm

Simple Man,

If your son is low income and under age 24 (eligibility window of opportunity closes at 24), has his HED or HSD (many do who completed via IEP and if he does not then he may be working on his education there too but if he does he can get in just for a trade) and can avoid the drama of other youth transitioning to young adulthood...Job Corps.

Things to Know...Skills will fill your till. Knowing about things and knowing how to do things are two different things.

1. Job Corps mission is employability. 124 Job Corps Centers nation wide (one minimum per state and they are rank ordered based on how good they are) and each has many well paying career trade options (sales is not one that I am aware of). The local OA (Outreach and Admissions Counselor) will always try to place at Job Crops Center closest to home. However, he may be able to request a choice that is farther away to meet a need or choice. Students get to request three choices of career trade and once at Center go through a trade rotation to be selected for one of their choices.

2. Job Corps Centers are required to provide "reasonable accommodations" for students. Only ones with most profound/acute needs may not want to attend. Many students have different challenges but almost all are workable. I recommend you both go to the Center you are interested and take a tour (schedule it) and speak with students and see the programming in the facilities. There are about 24 U.S. Forest Service Civilian Conservation Centers (CCCs) and the rest are contractor-run centers but all run the same metrics. CCCs usually have a camp crew or fire crew and students go help fight wildfires and make good money doing so.

3. Career trades are in ones you mentioned but also Medical Office Support; Masonry; Carpentry; Urban Forestry; Wildfire Firefighting, etc.
If your son has a good work ethic, likes interactive, hands on, physical work he can have a great paying career and his own business from the skills he will acquire. The best students are wired into well paying placements with union jobs. If they do very well they can go on to advanced training centers and/or public lands corps job as a Federal employee in the U.S. Forest Service.

4. Centers have a strict zero tolerance for violence or drugs so if your son has these issues he most likely will not be successful there nor on the job.

5. If he has GED/HSD he just does his trade full-time however he will take the TABE Test as all do to target what areas he needs to study and improve so if he goes on to community college he may be able to avoid a lot of pre-req work. In some cases we did reasonable accommodation for over a year for graduation...longest was a student for two years. He never did pass GED (five points shy) BUT he is a welder making good money.

Keep in mind we graduated about 2-3 every week...it is self-paced and voluntary (can quit at any time but not something most do after they get past first 30 days of change and being our of parent's house adjusting to rules and overcoming homesickness).

Several have suggested military...maybe, but it is not the military of yesteryear...very competitive and tech oriented today. ASFAB Test will tell. On possibility is go into the National Guard or Reserves then volunteer for active duty. All go through basic and technical school training but the Guard might be a good starting point.

Many community colleges and universities have students like you son doing well because they have tutors and reasonable accommodations, it just depends on son's motivation, commitment and acuity. Your local workforce center also is to have job coaching programs.

Before you decide anything go to www.collegeincolorado.org it is a one stop-shop that is robust and can help you two figure it out. The account is free and you don't have to be a Colorado resident to use it and it is linked to workforce too. Nope, you don't have to go or be there. Just know it well and wish I had it when my kids were sorting out their direction. Maybe your state has a similar one. Many cool features and one to look at is click in financial aid tab and on the keyboard click on all to see a bonanza of scholarships and sort by interest.

Your state probably has buried in state government (they can be complex) an agency that supports helping people with disabilities to gain employment. Google it and research.

I always encourage my students to "be a business" and diversify your skill sets so you will never be out of work. Many young people think all or nothing versus both and thinking and a parent can guide them to this way of thinking.

There are MANY famous people who have had disabilities and very successful so your son will succeed too because he has at least one key invested supporter...YOU! And you will make all the difference in his life, because you are a real Dad.

In CommUnity...Tha Rev

stoptothink
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Re: Real career path for a 23 yr old with no college degree

Post by stoptothink » Wed Jul 13, 2016 8:24 pm

nukewerker wrote:I have a cousin that does alarm sales, makes $210k I believe. Around 30.


I would assume you are referring to "summer sales". I live in the epicenter of this industry. I actually know the two founders of (what I believe is) the largest alarm sales company on the planet pretty well; talk about a scummy industry. My neighbor made enough last summer to buy his home and two new cars in cash (and he left his wife and two kids to go to Atlanta this summer), but 95% of them don't make a penny. If I was to count the number of people I know who were talked into selling alarm systems and never made a penny, I'd need about a dozen hands. There is absolutely zero barrier to entry though, they'll "hire" anybody willing to pack their stuff and head to Houston, Dallas, Atlanta, Memphis, etc. for the summer.

nukewerker
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Re: Real career path for a 23 yr old with no college degree

Post by nukewerker » Wed Jul 13, 2016 8:29 pm

stoptothink wrote:
nukewerker wrote:I have a cousin that does alarm sales, makes $210k I believe. Around 30.


I would assume you are referring to "summer sales". I live in the epicenter of this industry. I actually know the two founders of (what I believe is) the largest alarm sales company on the planet pretty well; talk about a scummy industry. My neighbor made enough last summer to buy his home and two new cars in cash (and he left his wife and two kids to go to Atlanta this summer), but 95% of them don't make a penny. If I was to count the number of people I know who were talked into selling alarm systems and never made a penny, I'd need about a dozen hands. There is absolutely zero barrier to entry though, they'll "hire" anybody willing to pack their stuff and head to Houston, Dallas, Atlanta, Memphis, etc. for the summer.


Not sure about his current company but the first one was a startup I believe in the DC area. He made slightly less at the first one, currently in Pittsburgh. He been doing it for 6 or 7 years now.

Estate_Esq
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Re: Real career path for a 23 yr old with no college degree

Post by Estate_Esq » Wed Jul 13, 2016 8:45 pm

simple man wrote:I am hoping to tap the group's wisdom and experiences on this one as I am somewhat at a loss. My 23 year old son (ADHD and very dyslexic) has decided college is not for him....


I salute your son! His recognition that college isn't for him indicates a degree of wisdom vastly superior to most college students today, students far better suited to a trade or sales.

He'd probably do well to get over his aversion to a trade. And, as Cal Newport explains in his book, So Good They Can't Ignore You, today's "follow your passion" dogma is a poisonous sham. The unfashionable truth is that passion generally follows competence. The more competent at something, the more passion for it. Thus it's quite possible that his passion for carpentry, for example, would increase as he became more competent at it.

Should he pursue real estate sales, as some have suggested, he might consider training through Kevin Ward's YESMasters or the Mike Ferry Organization.

spammagnet
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Re: Real career path for a 23 yr old with no college degree

Post by spammagnet » Wed Jul 13, 2016 10:16 pm

Estate_Esq wrote:... a degree of wisdom vastly superior to most college students today ...

... vastly superior to most ... ?

Miriam2
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Re: Real career path for a 23 yr old with no college degree

Post by Miriam2 » Wed Jul 13, 2016 10:56 pm

Tha Rev wrote:If your son is low income and under age 24 (eligibility window of opportunity closes at 24), has his HED or HSD (many do who completed via IEP and if he does not then he may be working on his education there too but if he does he can get in just for a trade) and can avoid the drama of other youth transitioning to young adulthood...Job Corps.

Things to Know...Skills will fill your till. Knowing about things and knowing how to do things are two different things.
( . . . . . )
I always encourage my students to "be a business" and diversify your skill sets so you will never be out of work. Many young people think all or nothing versus both and thinking and a parent can guide them to this way of thinking.

There are MANY famous people who have had disabilities and very successful so your son will succeed too because he has at least one key invested supporter...YOU! And you will make all the difference in his life, because you are a real Dad.

Tha Rev - very direct and to the point post with helpful information. Thank you for taking the time to post it :happy

simple man
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Re: Real career path for a 23 yr old with no college degree

Post by simple man » Sun Jul 17, 2016 4:53 pm

Wow. Sorry for the delay, but all of these ideas have been great! I appreciate the discussion of different paths and helpful experiences. There is so much I have not thought of. And I had never heard of the Job Corps or the Colorado web site. Again, thanks for taking the time to make a difference in someone's life. We will get going... :beer

tbradnc
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Re: Real career path for a 23 yr old with no college degree

Post by tbradnc » Sun Jul 17, 2016 6:00 pm

My 21 year old son worked as a new car salesperson at the Honda dealership up the road and was really good at it. He worked a LOT of hours but they have so many ways to make money it's crazy.

After that, he started buying used cars, cleaning them up, and selling them - made even more money.

Then this past April he finished the welding program at the local community college and had a job making $23/hr waiting for him before he received his certificate in the mail. He's working 60+ hours a week and is making serious money for a 21 year old.

I have 3 kids - this is the one I was worried about. So there's hope!

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Fieldsy1024
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Re: Real career path for a 23 yr old with no college degree

Post by Fieldsy1024 » Sun Jul 17, 2016 7:59 pm

stoptothink wrote:
market timer wrote:Being personable is a good skill, but I don't think it's enough to build a career on. Virtually any white collar job, including sales, is going to require a college degree.


I can't speak for other areas of the country, but this simply isn't true around here. My wife is only one example of a successful sales person who has no college education, so is my best friend, her best friend, and the majority of her team. My best friend not only had no college education, but a criminal record. You do have to be willing to start at the bottom and prove yourself...took my wife all of 9-months to go from call center to enterprise sales in a large tech company.


stoptothink, stoptothink

I know dozens of white collar employees who didn't go to college.

Plus, Someone we hang out with makes more than any person in our friends circle with ease.

finite_difference
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Re: Real career path for a 23 yr old with no college degree

Post by finite_difference » Sun Jul 17, 2016 11:40 pm

I think sales is a skill that can be taught and you can get better at, but not everyone can do it successfully. I know because I am terrible at selling anything :). So a job in sales would seriously stress me out, before being fired.

But if he has the talent for sales (and enjoys it), then it sounds like an awesome job that doesn't require a college degree. If for some reason that doesn't work out, I recommend a trade school or college degree in something that he enjoys.

If your son actually has ADHD he should not let it hold him back from accomplishing his dreams. A combination of medication and potentially temporary behavioral therapy make a huge difference.
The most precious gift we can offer anyone is our attention. - Thich Nhat Hanh

UnitaryExecutive
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Re: Real career path for a 23 yr old with no college degree

Post by UnitaryExecutive » Sun Jul 17, 2016 11:56 pm

If it were me I'd be driving an uber for income, living at home, and building up a real estate practice. The thing to understand is most people don't have it figured out in their 20s. I have so many friends who were f ups in their 20s, bouncing from low wage job to low wage job and figured out a niche or found an opportunity later and are now crushing it.

I may be in the minority since I don't see living at home as a terrible thing. To me, I always thought I could take huge risks, join startups, start businesses in my 20s and if the worst thing that happened is I'd have to move home while I got on my feet it really wasn't that big of a risk and helped me confidently pursue the best long term options.

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