What's Your Credit Card Rewards Strategy?

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Drew777
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Re: What's Your Credit Card Rewards Strategy?

Postby Drew777 » Thu Feb 16, 2017 11:57 am

VictoriaF wrote:
Drew777 wrote:
michaeljc70 wrote:
np81 wrote:
michaeljc70 wrote:I got an offer for the Citi AA for 60k bonus miles. I just checked my credit report and I only have 3 new accounts in the last 24 mo. However, I had a Citi AA until May 2015. Does that affect my approval if everything else is good?

Verify that the following language does not appear on the offer or in the terms first, otherwise you are ineligible for a new Citi AA card: "American Airlines AAdvantage bonus miles are not available if you have had any Citi / AAdvantage® card (other than a CitiBusiness / AAdvantage® card) opened or closed in the past 24 months." Do the same on the application page itself. If that verbiage is not present, you should be okay to apply and receive the bonus.


I didn't see that on the invite or webpage. I was instantly approved. Happy as often 50k is the most you can get with this card.


You can get an extra 10k if you send them a secure message saying you saw a 60k offer and would like to be matched. No need to give specifics, they'll just do it no questions asked.


On one of the blog I saw a comment by a guy who asked for an extra 10k. The Citi CSR checked his account, saw that the guy had had this bonus recently and canceled it all together.

Victoria


Well, my wife and I have each had this bonus three times now, and I've got the 10k bonus twice on each of our accounts in the last month. It seems everyone is doing it now, it's even made it to Reddit. I get the same canned response each time, so I'd say they just had bad luck.

Drew777
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Re: What's Your Credit Card Rewards Strategy?

Postby Drew777 » Thu Feb 16, 2017 11:58 am

travellight wrote:
Drew777 wrote:
travellight wrote:
Drew777 wrote:
travellight wrote:
Thanks! For the benefit of others, I also read that one should wait 30 days before applying again with Chase, and 8 days for citi and no more than 2 cards with citi within 65 days:

Application frequency: 2 credit cards every 65 days (possibly 1 card every 30 days now)

Maximum number of cards: No maximum, limit based on amount of credit extended to you

Applications at one time: 1 application every 8 days

Sign-up bonus limit: One bonus per family of products every 24 months


FYI you can apply for one personal and one business Alaska card at the same time as well. If you're under 5/24 it's possible to get two, maybe even three cards with Chase within a month. The Citi rule is correct, although sometimes offers pop up without the 24 month language. In December there was an AA 50k offer without that language. My wife and I were each approved for one, and then we each got a second two days later. We had both already had these cards within the last years. We also had them match each one to a targeted 60k offer, so we ended up with 240,000 AA miles off of those cards. The miles did actually post to our AA accounts. There have also been Hilton offers without the 24 month language. Typically these are just an oversight and don't last long.


Is it too late to ask to match to a targeted 60k offer if the miles already posted? Was it a targeted offer you received or can it be an online offer you heard of? I never noticed that the offers had the language versus not. I thought the rules always applied. I once had a Delta card that didn't have the language but I wasn't given the reward after doing the spend because they cited the rule even though it wasn't in the offer language. That became a "never again" card, even before amex went never again.

Great to know about the Alaska card!


I'm not sure exactly what the timeframe is, I was just send a message online and say you saw a 60k offer and would like to be matched to the higher offer. They will just give you 10k miles as a courtesy separate from the 50k offer. You don't have to give any specifics about the offer, they don't ask questions. I actually have heard multiple recent reports of the same thing happening with Amex, and people have actually received the bonuses despite having the card before. I know some people have had success filing CFPB complaints when they were denied a bonus they were technically eligible for according to the terms.


Thanks Drew! I have had good luck in the past with cards matching a higher offer (IHG comes to mind) but was turned down on such an offer this week from amex for the everyday card. I opened an everyday card to keep my MR points since I was going to close the gold acct with AF of $195. The offer was 10k points when I offered but I later saw one for 15k, a much better offer very soon after I got the card. I was surprised they turned me down for the reward upgrade.


Amex is known for not matching offers. The only exception I've ever heard of is the SPG cards.

David Scubadiver
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Re: What's Your Credit Card Rewards Strategy?

Postby David Scubadiver » Thu Feb 16, 2017 11:59 am

I am sure that I can do better, but my most recent "strategy" is to move my brokerage account to Merrill Edge, qualify for platinum reward honors program at bank of america and use the Cash Rewards card for gas (earning 5.25%), and using their travel rewards card for everything else, but redeem those points against travel expenses so that I am earning 2.625% on those expenses. I assume a lot of people are doing exactly this.

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VictoriaF
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Re: What's Your Credit Card Rewards Strategy?

Postby VictoriaF » Thu Feb 16, 2017 12:34 pm

Sanity check, please!

I am about to apply for an AMEX SPG-Business card. As I am checking my upcoming expenses for the next 3 and 6 months, I am finding that many places do not accept AMEX, particularly in Europe. Thus, my default choice for meeting minimum spending is to pay estimated taxes with a credit card and pay 1.87% for the privilege.

One exception is a Marriott hotel for about $1,300. If I pay with an SPG card, I'll get 26k Marriott points =~ 9k SPG points =~ 11k UA miles. I'll also save 1.87% from taxes, or $25.
If I pay with a CSP, I'll get 2.6k UR = 2.6 UA miles.

Getting an SPG card and using it at Marriott seems far preferable to using a CSP. Please confirm that my estimates are approximately correct.

Thank you,
Victoria
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travellight
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Re: What's Your Credit Card Rewards Strategy?

Postby travellight » Thu Feb 16, 2017 12:48 pm

David Scubadiver wrote:I am sure that I can do better, but my most recent "strategy" is to move my brokerage account to Merrill Edge, qualify for platinum reward honors program at bank of america and use the Cash Rewards card for gas (earning 5.25%), and using their travel rewards card for everything else, but redeem those points against travel expenses so that I am earning 2.625% on those expenses. I assume a lot of people are doing exactly this.


Are the benefits with Merrill Edge much better than Chase private client? How much money do you need with them to get the benefits?

travellight
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Re: What's Your Credit Card Rewards Strategy?

Postby travellight » Thu Feb 16, 2017 12:52 pm

VictoriaF wrote:Sanity check, please!

I am about to apply for an AMEX SPG-Business card. As I am checking my upcoming expenses for the next 3 and 6 months, I am finding that many places do not accept AMEX, particularly in Europe. Thus, my default choice for meeting minimum spending is to pay estimated taxes with a credit card and pay 1.87% for the privilege.

One exception is a Marriott hotel for about $1,300. If I pay with an SPG card, I'll get 26k Marriott points =~ 9k SPG points =~ 11k UA miles. I'll also save 1.87% from taxes, or $25.
If I pay with a CSP, I'll get 2.6k UR = 2.6 UA miles.

Getting an SPG card and using it at Marriott seems far preferable to using a CSP. Please confirm that my estimates are approximately correct.

Thank you,
Victoria


Is the 8k spend on the business worth it to you compared to the 5k for the personal card? It just gets you free food in the lounge.

David Scubadiver
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Re: What's Your Credit Card Rewards Strategy?

Postby David Scubadiver » Thu Feb 16, 2017 12:54 pm

travellight wrote:
David Scubadiver wrote:I am sure that I can do better, but my most recent "strategy" is to move my brokerage account to Merrill Edge, qualify for platinum reward honors program at bank of america and use the Cash Rewards card for gas (earning 5.25%), and using their travel rewards card for everything else, but redeem those points against travel expenses so that I am earning 2.625% on those expenses. I assume a lot of people are doing exactly this.


Are the benefits with Merrill Edge much better than Chase private client? How much money do you need with them to get the benefits?
I do not know what chase private client offers. The bank of america/merrill edge tiers/benefits can be seen here: http://info.bankofamerica.com/preferred ... s/details/

Basically with $200,000 in investments you get 100 free trades per month, ATM reimbursements, free checking accounts, free small safe deposit box and for your credit card bonuses they multiply by .75

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VictoriaF
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Re: What's Your Credit Card Rewards Strategy?

Postby VictoriaF » Thu Feb 16, 2017 1:02 pm

travellight wrote:
VictoriaF wrote:Sanity check, please!

I am about to apply for an AMEX SPG-Business card. As I am checking my upcoming expenses for the next 3 and 6 months, I am finding that many places do not accept AMEX, particularly in Europe. Thus, my default choice for meeting minimum spending is to pay estimated taxes with a credit card and pay 1.87% for the privilege.

One exception is a Marriott hotel for about $1,300. If I pay with an SPG card, I'll get 26k Marriott points =~ 9k SPG points =~ 11k UA miles. I'll also save 1.87% from taxes, or $25.
If I pay with a CSP, I'll get 2.6k UR = 2.6 UA miles.

Getting an SPG card and using it at Marriott seems far preferable to using a CSP. Please confirm that my estimates are approximately correct.

Thank you,
Victoria


Is the 8k spend on the business worth it to you compared to the 5k for the personal card? It just gets you free food in the lounge.


I already had AMEX SPG-Personal and would not qualify for another one. Also, I am abstaining from personal CC applications while waiting for the end of 24/5. AMEX SPG-Business would not count.

The reason for my question above is that I could just pay $8k of estimated taxes with a new SPG, pay $150 in fees, and collect all SPG points immediately. Alternatively, I can pay $5k of estimated taxes with a new SPG, pay $95 in fees, and meet the remaining $3k in spending with my Marriott stay and other relatively small expenses.

Victoria
WINNER of the 2015 Boglehead Contest. | Every joke has a bit of a joke. ... The rest is the truth. (Marat F)

Drew777
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Re: What's Your Credit Card Rewards Strategy?

Postby Drew777 » Thu Feb 16, 2017 1:24 pm

VictoriaF wrote:Sanity check, please!

I am about to apply for an AMEX SPG-Business card. As I am checking my upcoming expenses for the next 3 and 6 months, I am finding that many places do not accept AMEX, particularly in Europe. Thus, my default choice for meeting minimum spending is to pay estimated taxes with a credit card and pay 1.87% for the privilege.

One exception is a Marriott hotel for about $1,300. If I pay with an SPG card, I'll get 26k Marriott points =~ 9k SPG points =~ 11k UA miles. I'll also save 1.87% from taxes, or $25.
If I pay with a CSP, I'll get 2.6k UR = 2.6 UA miles.

Getting an SPG card and using it at Marriott seems far preferable to using a CSP. Please confirm that my estimates are approximately correct.

Thank you,
Victoria


Just keep in mind you can't transfer directly from SPG to UA, only from Marriott to UA. Well, you CAN transfer from SPG to UA, just at a very poor rate. It can actually be a better deal transferring from Marriott anyway if you're transferring large quantities. You need to transfer at least 24k Marriott (8k SPG) to get the same 1.25x you'd get with SPG, but if you transfer 56k Marriott (18.67k SPG) you get 25k UA miles, which is about 1.34x. You should end up with over 50k UA miles in the end.

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VictoriaF
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Re: What's Your Credit Card Rewards Strategy?

Postby VictoriaF » Thu Feb 16, 2017 1:33 pm

Drew777 wrote:Just keep in mind you can't transfer directly from SPG to UA, only from Marriott to UA. Well, you CAN transfer from SPG to UA, just at a very poor rate. It can actually be a better deal transferring from Marriott anyway if you're transferring large quantities. You need to transfer at least 24k Marriott (8k SPG) to get the same 1.25x you'd get with SPG, but if you transfer 56k Marriott (18.67k SPG) you get 25k UA miles, which is about 1.34x. You should end up with over 50k UA miles in the end.


You are right! I forgot that SPG --> UA is 2:1.

Thank you, Drew!

Victoria
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Calygos
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Re: What's Your Credit Card Rewards Strategy?

Postby Calygos » Thu Feb 16, 2017 2:11 pm

Maybe this is a dumb question (and maybe my though process is just influenced by the credit vs. cash thread) but how much of this points/miles chasing leads to money spent on trips and vacations that wouldn't have otherwise be spent, thus leading to a net loss despite the credit card rewards?

np81
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Re: What's Your Credit Card Rewards Strategy?

Postby np81 » Thu Feb 16, 2017 2:15 pm

Calygos wrote:Maybe this is a dumb question (and maybe my though process is just influenced by the credit vs. cash thread) but how much of this points/miles chasing leads to money spent on trips and vacations that wouldn't have otherwise be spent, thus leading to a net loss despite the credit card rewards?

Speaking only for myself, there is no loss here because I am doing my normal spending on these cards. In fact, I have to book some plane tickets in the next month or so, and will be opening yet another Citi AA card to use in order to maximize the bonus.

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Re: What's Your Credit Card Rewards Strategy?

Postby ResearchMed » Thu Feb 16, 2017 2:19 pm

Calygos wrote:Maybe this is a dumb question (and maybe my though process is just influenced by the credit vs. cash thread) but how much of this points/miles chasing leads to money spent on trips and vacations that wouldn't have otherwise be spent, thus leading to a net loss despite the credit card rewards?


Do you mean using awards/points on trips that would not have been taken if the awards/points had not been accumulated (or nicer/longer vacations, etc.)?

As long as the awards/points are accumulated without any extra spending, beyond what would have been spent anyway, are you suggesting that this would be some sort of "net loss" (perhaps because you think someone should instead have cashed in the awards/points)?

Or are you asking something else?

RM
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VictoriaF
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Re: What's Your Credit Card Rewards Strategy?

Postby VictoriaF » Thu Feb 16, 2017 2:22 pm

Calygos wrote:Maybe this is a dumb question (and maybe my though process is just influenced by the credit vs. cash thread) but how much of this points/miles chasing leads to money spent on trips and vacations that wouldn't have otherwise be spent, thus leading to a net loss despite the credit card rewards?


This is an excellent question, because in the Credit vs. Cash thread I am strongly on the side that people do overspend with credit.

For a long time I was ignoring banks, credit cards, and travel bonuses because I understand behavioral economics and the insidious nature of rewards and conveniences. Eventually, I was presented with a simple arithmetic: apply for a card X, spend amount $Y (most of which you would spend anyway), and soon you'll get frequent flyer miles worth hundreds of dollars. I tried it and it worked.

But in order to make it work, I needed to do a lot of reading to understand how to apply, how to spend, and how to claim. My reading was not limited to the specific topics I needed to investigate. I was also reading about peripheral matters and discovering other opportunities. In short, I was discovering "needs" that I did not have before and was tailoring my travel to satisfy some of these needs.

To be clear, while these phenomena did and do take place, my net result is positive. I am saving several thousand dollars every year in comparison to what I would have paid for my travel without bonuses. But, again, I do acknowledge that the points-and-miles game creates some additional expenses and spending.

Victoria
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Re: What's Your Credit Card Rewards Strategy?

Postby Calygos » Thu Feb 16, 2017 2:25 pm

ResearchMed wrote:
Calygos wrote:Maybe this is a dumb question (and maybe my though process is just influenced by the credit vs. cash thread) but how much of this points/miles chasing leads to money spent on trips and vacations that wouldn't have otherwise be spent, thus leading to a net loss despite the credit card rewards?


Do you mean using awards/points on trips that would not have been taken if the awards/points had not been accumulated (or nicer/longer vacations, etc.)?

As long as the awards/points are accumulated without any extra spending, beyond what would have been spent anyway, are you suggesting that this would be some sort of "net loss" (perhaps because you think someone should instead have cashed in the awards/points)?

Or are you asking something else?

RM


The former. Trips/vacations cost a lot more than just the airfare, of course, so I am just often astonished at how much I hear people taking all these trips given how much they must be spending while on said trips. Keep in mind though this is coming from a person who's basically never taken a real vacation in his life (see my original Iceland thread from a while back) and hates traveling (I just flew cross country at the beginning of the month and now I have to do so again in a week for a bereavement trip), which explains my perspective. To give an example, one of my colleagues is leaving for yet another short trip tomorrow with their SO using miles but also using PTO they don't have (negative that will have to be covered if they were to ever leave this company).

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Re: What's Your Credit Card Rewards Strategy?

Postby np81 » Thu Feb 16, 2017 2:29 pm

Calygos wrote:
ResearchMed wrote:
Calygos wrote:Maybe this is a dumb question (and maybe my though process is just influenced by the credit vs. cash thread) but how much of this points/miles chasing leads to money spent on trips and vacations that wouldn't have otherwise be spent, thus leading to a net loss despite the credit card rewards?


Do you mean using awards/points on trips that would not have been taken if the awards/points had not been accumulated (or nicer/longer vacations, etc.)?

As long as the awards/points are accumulated without any extra spending, beyond what would have been spent anyway, are you suggesting that this would be some sort of "net loss" (perhaps because you think someone should instead have cashed in the awards/points)?

Or are you asking something else?

RM


The former. Trips/vacations cost a lot more than just the airfare, of course, so I am just often astonished at how much I hear people taking all these trips given how much they must be spending while on said trips. Keep in mind though this is coming from a person who's basically never taken a real vacation in his life (see my original Iceland thread from a while back) and hates traveling (I just flew cross country at the beginning of the month and now I have to do so again in a week for a bereavement trip), which explains my perspective. To give an example, one of my colleagues is leaving for yet another short trip tomorrow with their SO using miles but also using PTO they don't have (negative that will have to be covered if they were to ever leave this company).

This strategy might work for some who would otherwise not have taken that vacation, because it allows them to offset some of the costs - assuming that they're doing their normal spending on the card, and not spending money just to meet the bonus requirement, which is never a good practice.

I try and use up as much of the five weeks of vacation that I get annually, though I have never actually used every last day; my accumulation rate is too high. Miles can offset a significant amount of costs for me, which is why I only churn AA cards.

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Re: What's Your Credit Card Rewards Strategy?

Postby Ron Ronnerson » Thu Feb 16, 2017 2:57 pm

Calygos wrote:Maybe this is a dumb question (and maybe my though process is just influenced by the credit vs. cash thread) but how much of this points/miles chasing leads to money spent on trips and vacations that wouldn't have otherwise be spent, thus leading to a net loss despite the credit card rewards?


I suppose this will vary. In my own case, my annual budget for vacations has gone down from about $5k/year to about $1k/year out-of-pocket. I've met minimum spending requirements on bonuses by paying utility bills, insurance, and property taxes. This is spending that would have occurred in any case. The points have been enough to fully cover airfare and hotel costs. There are some additional charges like a ride to/from the airport and eating. We try to keep the dining costs down by picking up food at the grocery store at our destination or eating at inexpensive restaurants and not ordering anything other than a main dish (no drinks, appetizers, desserts). The $4k difference between how much I used to spend on vacations and how much I do these days is actually fairly big for me as I'd need to earn $8k before taxes at my job to end up with $4k in my pocket. By vacationing using points, I've been able to increase my contributions to tax-advantaged accounts. Compounded over time, the points/miles may actually be even more lucrative than they appear.

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Re: What's Your Credit Card Rewards Strategy?

Postby TheRightKost87 » Thu Feb 16, 2017 3:06 pm

Ron Ronnerson wrote: The $4k difference between how much I used to spend on vacations and how much I do these days is actually fairly big for me as I'd need to earn $8k before taxes at my job to end up with $4k in my pocket. By vacationing using points, I've been able to increase my contributions to tax-advantaged accounts. Compounded over time, the points/miles may actually be even more lucrative than they appear.


I'm trying to wrap my head around this. So your income is high enough that you're marginally taxed at 50%, but you don't max out your tax-advantaged accounts (or at least, wouldn't max them out without the additional $4k saved). Does that equate to a really low savings rate, or is there something I'm missing here?
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Re: What's Your Credit Card Rewards Strategy?

Postby Calygos » Thu Feb 16, 2017 3:19 pm

Ron Ronnerson wrote:
Calygos wrote:Maybe this is a dumb question (and maybe my though process is just influenced by the credit vs. cash thread) but how much of this points/miles chasing leads to money spent on trips and vacations that wouldn't have otherwise be spent, thus leading to a net loss despite the credit card rewards?


I suppose this will vary. In my own case, my annual budget for vacations has gone down from about $5k/year to about $1k/year out-of-pocket. I've met minimum spending requirements on bonuses by paying utility bills, insurance, and property taxes. This is spending that would have occurred in any case. The points have been enough to fully cover airfare and hotel costs. There are some additional charges like a ride to/from the airport and eating. We try to keep the dining costs down by picking up food at the grocery store at our destination or eating at inexpensive restaurants and not ordering anything other than a main dish (no drinks, appetizers, desserts). The $4k difference between how much I used to spend on vacations and how much I do these days is actually fairly big for me as I'd need to earn $8k before taxes at my job to end up with $4k in my pocket. By vacationing using points, I've been able to increase my contributions to tax-advantaged accounts. Compounded over time, the points/miles may actually be even more lucrative than they appear.


That definitely sounds like a BH approach, or at least an /r/frugal one, to travel since most people would likely look at their points and think they're getting a free vacation when in fact they're spending even more on fancy restaurants, souvenirs, etc. when traveling, especially abroad. (In that regard, think of airline points like loss leaders in places like Best Buy.) I think it also has to do with destination, though. Going to Maine for that New England experience is generally treated differently from going to another country. How many Americans are going to travel to France or Japan and just buy groceries rather than going to local restaurants for that foreign dining experience?

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Re: What's Your Credit Card Rewards Strategy?

Postby Ron Ronnerson » Thu Feb 16, 2017 3:24 pm

TheRightKost87 wrote:
Ron Ronnerson wrote: The $4k difference between how much I used to spend on vacations and how much I do these days is actually fairly big for me as I'd need to earn $8k before taxes at my job to end up with $4k in my pocket. By vacationing using points, I've been able to increase my contributions to tax-advantaged accounts. Compounded over time, the points/miles may actually be even more lucrative than they appear.


I'm trying to wrap my head around this. So your income is high enough that you're marginally taxed at 50%, but you don't max out your tax-advantaged accounts (or at least, wouldn't max them out without the additional $4k saved). Does that equate to a really low savings rate, or is there something I'm missing here?


I'm at the very top of the 15% tax bracket. Any additional money would be taxed at 25%. State tax rate is 8%. I contribute 10.25% toward a pension. Our AGI is at $110,000. Any additional income would mean we'd be in the phaseout for the child tax credit (so effectively a 5% tax increase). I pay 1.45% for medicare as well. All this adds up to 50%. I max out a 457b, my wife's employer contributes 15% of her salary in a SEP-IRA to her, and we max out two Roth IRAs. I contribute 10k toward a pension as well. I have 18k of space left in a 403b. My pension should largely cover our retirement expenses.
Last edited by Ron Ronnerson on Thu Feb 16, 2017 5:19 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: What's Your Credit Card Rewards Strategy?

Postby cbr shadow » Thu Feb 16, 2017 3:44 pm

My wife and I recently both applied for the Chase Reserve card for the 100k point sign up bonus after spending $4,000 in the first 3 months. Our next payment will put us over that $4000 limit on each card, so we'll get the points.

I'm hoping to open another Chase credit card to use it for the sign up bonus, since I can combine the rewards to Chase Ultimate Rewards and have everything in one place. It looks likes the Chase Freedom card has a 50k point sign up bonus, and the Chase Ink Business Preferred card has a 80k sign on bonus if you spend $5,000 in the first 3 months. Two questions:

1) Can an individual (not a business) sign up for a business credit card? In the distant past I was able to do this without issue. Still the case?
2) I believe this is the best Chase card for us to sign up for. True? I'd sign up first and get the 80k bonus after we spent $5,000 in 3 months, then have my wife do the same.

-CBR

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Re: What's Your Credit Card Rewards Strategy?

Postby Bfwolf » Thu Feb 16, 2017 7:45 pm

cbr shadow wrote:My wife and I recently both applied for the Chase Reserve card for the 100k point sign up bonus after spending $4,000 in the first 3 months. Our next payment will put us over that $4000 limit on each card, so we'll get the points.

I'm hoping to open another Chase credit card to use it for the sign up bonus, since I can combine the rewards to Chase Ultimate Rewards and have everything in one place. It looks likes the Chase Freedom card has a 50k point sign up bonus, and the Chase Ink Business Preferred card has a 80k sign on bonus if you spend $5,000 in the first 3 months. Two questions:

1) Can an individual (not a business) sign up for a business credit card? In the distant past I was able to do this without issue. Still the case?
2) I believe this is the best Chase card for us to sign up for. True? I'd sign up first and get the 80k bonus after we spent $5,000 in 3 months, then have my wife do the same.

-CBR


I've not heard of a 50K offer on the Chase Freedom. There is such an offer on the Chase Sapphire Preferred.

Chase Ink Plus 80K is a great offer. That would probably be the next one to get. I don't think you'll have to prove you have any business income if that's what you're asking. People are expected to get these cards even if they are pre-revenue. Sounds like you can avoid the first year annual fee on this one by applying in branch.

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Re: What's Your Credit Card Rewards Strategy?

Postby Drew777 » Fri Feb 17, 2017 6:43 am

Calygos wrote:
ResearchMed wrote:
Calygos wrote:Maybe this is a dumb question (and maybe my though process is just influenced by the credit vs. cash thread) but how much of this points/miles chasing leads to money spent on trips and vacations that wouldn't have otherwise be spent, thus leading to a net loss despite the credit card rewards?


Do you mean using awards/points on trips that would not have been taken if the awards/points had not been accumulated (or nicer/longer vacations, etc.)?

As long as the awards/points are accumulated without any extra spending, beyond what would have been spent anyway, are you suggesting that this would be some sort of "net loss" (perhaps because you think someone should instead have cashed in the awards/points)?

Or are you asking something else?

RM


The former. Trips/vacations cost a lot more than just the airfare, of course, so I am just often astonished at how much I hear people taking all these trips given how much they must be spending while on said trips. Keep in mind though this is coming from a person who's basically never taken a real vacation in his life (see my original Iceland thread from a while back) and hates traveling (I just flew cross country at the beginning of the month and now I have to do so again in a week for a bereavement trip), which explains my perspective. To give an example, one of my colleagues is leaving for yet another short trip tomorrow with their SO using miles but also using PTO they don't have (negative that will have to be covered if they were to ever leave this company).


Airfare and hotel costs are typically the largest expenses of any trip, so the rest is pretty negligible to me. As far as eating out when traveling, I think it's more accurate to look at the difference between what you spent while traveling vs. what you would have spent eating at home rather than just the total spent on eating out. My wife and I don't really do souvenirs, shopping, etc. when traveling. We will spend money on experiences, like comedy shows, football games, scuba diving, etc. My travel hacking has actually led me to start a side business which wouldn't have happened otherwise, and it brings in more than both my day job and my wife's combined, so you could say it's been pretty profitable for me.

barreg
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Re: What's Your Credit Card Rewards Strategy?

Postby barreg » Fri Feb 17, 2017 10:24 am

cbr shadow wrote:My wife and I recently both applied for the Chase Reserve card for the 100k point sign up bonus after spending $4,000 in the first 3 months. Our next payment will put us over that $4000 limit on each card, so we'll get the points.

I'm hoping to open another Chase credit card to use it for the sign up bonus, since I can combine the rewards to Chase Ultimate Rewards and have everything in one place. It looks likes the Chase Freedom card has a 50k point sign up bonus, and the Chase Ink Business Preferred card has a 80k sign on bonus if you spend $5,000 in the first 3 months. Two questions:

1) Can an individual (not a business) sign up for a business credit card? In the distant past I was able to do this without issue. Still the case?
2) I believe this is the best Chase card for us to sign up for. True? I'd sign up first and get the 80k bonus after we spent $5,000 in 3 months, then have my wife do the same.

-CBR


My wife and I also got the CSR for the 100k points each (and also for the 1.5x UR point value for travel). We're getting the Chase Sapphire Preferred cards next (just got mine approved) to get 50k points each.

My understanding for the Ink Preferred card is that while the 5/24 rule is used when you apply for the card (e.g. won't get approved if over 5/24), once you receive the card, it doesn't affect your next Chase CC application with regards to 5/24 (e.g. it won't get counted against 5/24 for your next Chase CC application). Not sure why it works that way, but that's what I read on the Reddit churning threads.

You can get approved for a business CC as an individual, but you likely won't get approved unless you claim that you at least have some significant business revenue. You might not need to actually substantiate the reported revenue.

Ethelred
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Re: What's Your Credit Card Rewards Strategy?

Postby Ethelred » Fri Feb 17, 2017 10:58 am

michaeljc70 wrote:My spouse is not citizen but legal resident. They have had 1 Chase Freedom Visa (on their own) for around a year and have no other credit history. Does anyone know if they would be eligible for any kind of card with a bonus (the Chase had a bonus of $100 or $150)? They don't want to apply and have inquiries only to be declined. On the one hand I think they should go for easier to get cards and build their credit history but on the other hand it sucks to miss out on the bonus rewards.

I don't think anyone replied to you on this.

I am an LPR, and my wife is a US citizen. Being an LPR has no impact on credit score of itself. What does have an impact is the potential lack of US credit history.

They have two options:
1. Estimate current credit score or get it from a website that allows you to sign up and find out your a score, then apply for cards with bonuses that are likely to be available with that score and build further from there.
2. Be added to your credit card(s) with several years of history, which will add that card to their credit report, including its long history. This is what we did, and my credit score was immediately excellent. That said, if you are with Chase, they don't allow joint credit cards any more, only adding authorized users. I don't know how much being an authorized user would help.

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Re: What's Your Credit Card Rewards Strategy?

Postby michaeljc70 » Fri Feb 17, 2017 11:19 am

Ethelred wrote:
michaeljc70 wrote:My spouse is not citizen but legal resident. They have had 1 Chase Freedom Visa (on their own) for around a year and have no other credit history. Does anyone know if they would be eligible for any kind of card with a bonus (the Chase had a bonus of $100 or $150)? They don't want to apply and have inquiries only to be declined. On the one hand I think they should go for easier to get cards and build their credit history but on the other hand it sucks to miss out on the bonus rewards.

I don't think anyone replied to you on this.

I am an LPR, and my wife is a US citizen. Being an LPR has no impact on credit score of itself. What does have an impact is the potential lack of US credit history.

They have two options:
1. Estimate current credit score or get it from a website that allows you to sign up and find out your a score, then apply for cards with bonuses that are likely to be available with that score and build further from there.
2. Be added to your credit card(s) with several years of history, which will add that card to their credit report, including its long history. This is what we did, and my credit score was immediately excellent. That said, if you are with Chase, they don't allow joint credit cards any more, only adding authorized users. I don't know how much being an authorized user would help.


They have been on my Amex for years. However, I doubt it shows up on their credit report. How would they associate it to them? I gave no SSN to Amex. They are an authorized user. Most companies don't allow joint CC accounts anymore.

We did try getting a score from CreditKarma, but it didn't work. I don't know if because of lack of history or it couldn't identify them (error was vague). I guess we can try another credit score site.

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Re: What's Your Credit Card Rewards Strategy?

Postby Barefootgirl » Mon Feb 20, 2017 9:27 am

I'm fine with waiting out the time period until I qualify for the CSR, but I figure I will have some time in the next few months to play this hobby while I wait, so that brings me to business cards only.

So far, the only business card I've ever had is the Amex SPG.

What other business cards do you find valuable?
"The best you can do is set up like a baseball team does against an unknown hitter. That is spread the defense and wait for the ball to come to you." - pkcrafter

Barefootgirl
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Re: What's Your Credit Card Rewards Strategy?

Postby Barefootgirl » Mon Feb 20, 2017 9:30 am

I'm a bit confused by something I've read on other sites. Seems that Amex is sensitive to spend on it's card if the spend is for GCs, MS or just regular spend.

But this doesn't seem to be across the board - they only seem to track or crack down on some of their cards, not the whole Amex line of cards.

Any personal data points to share? PM if that's better - would appreciate.
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BeneIRA
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Re: What's Your Credit Card Rewards Strategy?

Postby BeneIRA » Mon Feb 20, 2017 10:10 am

Barefootgirl wrote:I'm a bit confused by something I've read on other sites. Seems that Amex is sensitive to spend on it's card if the spend is for GCs, MS or just regular spend.

But this doesn't seem to be across the board - they only seem to track or crack down on some of their cards, not the whole Amex line of cards.

Any personal data points to share? PM if that's better - would appreciate.


I don't MS, but I do have a Blue Cash Preferred and I easily hit the $6,000 every year with gift cards. Usually gas, Amazon, Groupon, etc. If Amex sees any $500 gift cards, they have frozen my account and they like to fraud my account regularly for seemingly no reason. A call always corrects the issue, but it is very annoying. They haven't shut me down since my charges, over 90% of the time, are for legitimate purchases, but the datapoint here is that their algorithm is watching.

As for Chase, I don't know that they have a fraud algorithm. I have bought all types of services with my Chase Sapphire Reserve and before that, the Preferred, and they have never frauded me. I've bought expensive plane tickets, museum entries in foreign countries, food in foreign places and so on and there doesn't seem to be a point in notifying them because they obviously think it is normal spending.

To answer your other question about best business cards, the American Express Business Platinum, if you can hit the minimum spend, is a great choice. The redemptions on that card are incredible. The Chase Ink with its 80,000 point bonus and award categories is also very good.

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Re: What's Your Credit Card Rewards Strategy?

Postby Jack FFR1846 » Mon Feb 20, 2017 10:36 am

I believe that within Bogleheads, there are a lot of "gamers of points" who work the system to acquire points and cash in their regular spending without spending extra. I consider myself to be one of them. I'll throw out an example of something going on right now.

DW has decided that she's tired of the old washer and dryer that we have. The heat doesn't always work on the dryer and it makes lots of "something's broken" noises and I've replaced the belt on the washer recently (nobody local carries belts so Amazon wait times happened) which forced a trip and few hours to the coin op laundry. So we're both looking and comparing and have come up with what we feel are the washer and dryer that we want. Several stores sell the same exact models and they're all priced within 10 cents of each other on sale. Here's my plan and why. The cost for both will be about $1200. I will first go to Stop & Shop and buy Sears gift cards which have a 5X gas points promo going on. So this translates into $1.50 a gallon off of 20 gallons of gas, done 4 times ($120). I'll buy these with a citi double cash, getting 2% back ($24) and paying for that gas with the Freedom card 5% off. At $2.20 a gallon (minus $1.50), that's $56 to pay for the gas and ($2.80) in rewards. Sears has a 10% bonus points and free delivery on something like $400 purchase, so I'll pay for the washer with gift cards ($60 in points), then use those ($60) in points and gift cards to pay for the dryer, giving me an instant $60 off and another ($60) in points. I need new water hookups and figure that'll be in the $40 range for stainless braided ones so I'll get those with points and have some points left over.

So in this single purchase (a bit convoluted but a purchase), of $1240 in stuff, I'm getting benefit from $246.80 from the benefits of using rewards cards and the associated other benefits. I will, of course sell the old washer and dryer on craigslist for probably $40 just to get something out of them. If they don't sell, I'll put them on my scrap steel pile and bring them over for cash.

I bought nothing extra and made no vacation trips in this exercise (unless you consider a trip into Sears to be a vacation).
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d0gerz
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Re: What's Your Credit Card Rewards Strategy?

Postby d0gerz » Mon Feb 20, 2017 10:59 am

Jack FFR1846:

Am curious, per the Stop and Shop T&C, wouldn't Sears gift cards be excluded from gas points? Is it just the case of them not enforcing their own terms or some other special case?

Gas Rewards points are not available on purchases of gasoline and other fuels, alcohol, tobacco, money orders, postage stamps, gift cards, lottery tickets, amusement park and other tickets, Western Union wire transfer services, fax and copy machine services, coin operated vending machines, utility payments, prepaid telephone calling or wireless cards, video rental, delivery charges, dry cleaning, fundraising activities and donations, returned check service fees, payments toward store charge account balances, personal shopper fees, bottle deposits, sales tax, and any other purchase prohibited by law.


Also what about extended warranty protection often offered by credit cards? Is there a way to have that transfer over to when paying with gift cards?

ThreeBears
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Re: What's Your Credit Card Rewards Strategy?

Postby ThreeBears » Mon Feb 20, 2017 11:06 am

American Express Delta -

Just a warning. The card claims that you cannot get the miles bonus if you've ever had the card before . . . apparently they mean it, as I just spent $3,000 and they said I won't be getting the miles. I guess it's my fault, but I'm sharing as other people have had luck with other credit cards that claim to limit whether you can get the bonus a second time.

The customer service rep said I should apply for American Express Gold if I want to get more miles as I'm still eligible for that card.

BeneIRA
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Re: What's Your Credit Card Rewards Strategy?

Postby BeneIRA » Mon Feb 20, 2017 11:14 am

ThreeBears wrote:American Express Delta -

Just a warning. The card claims that you cannot get the miles bonus if you've ever had the card before . . . apparently they mean it, as I just spent $3,000 and they said I won't be getting the miles. I guess it's my fault, but I'm sharing as other people have had luck with other credit cards that claim to limit whether you can get the bonus a second time.

The customer service rep said I should apply for American Express Gold if I want to get more miles as I'm still eligible for that card.


Yep, it is American Express's way of combatting the churners. On all Amex cards, you can only get the bonus once. They don't care about 5/24 or other rules because once you exhaust all of your bonus opportunities, you're done.

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Re: What's Your Credit Card Rewards Strategy?

Postby michaeljc70 » Mon Feb 20, 2017 12:08 pm

Calygos wrote:Maybe this is a dumb question (and maybe my though process is just influenced by the credit vs. cash thread) but how much of this points/miles chasing leads to money spent on trips and vacations that wouldn't have otherwise be spent, thus leading to a net loss despite the credit card rewards?


For me, not at all because I easily spend that on my credit card anyway. I just switch for the 3 months (or however long it takes) and use the new card for all purchases I normally make. If you typically don't use a credit card or spend enough to qualify for the bonus, then I could see it being an issue.

Barefootgirl
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Re: What's Your Credit Card Rewards Strategy?

Postby Barefootgirl » Mon Feb 20, 2017 12:09 pm

They don't care about 5/24 or other rules because once you exhaust all of your bonus opportunities, you're done.


This is the game changer...once you've run through all the major bank cards, you are done churning for bonuses - left with only waiting for new cards w/bonuses or watching for special promotions. Outside of that, regular spend which brings the game back to regular road warriors, who typically have been either reimbursed by their employers or self-employed with business expenses. There is reselling, but even there, without a bonus, it becomes a bit of work and you need to consider the value of your time.

I've not been in this long enough to know whether it shares any similarities to other business cycles - i.e. when banks see fewer new cards, less spend, will they loosen and re-ignite another cycle?
"The best you can do is set up like a baseball team does against an unknown hitter. That is spread the defense and wait for the ball to come to you." - pkcrafter

Barefootgirl
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Re: What's Your Credit Card Rewards Strategy?

Postby Barefootgirl » Mon Feb 20, 2017 12:11 pm

Calygos wrote:
Maybe this is a dumb question (and maybe my though process is just influenced by the credit vs. cash thread) but how much of this points/miles chasing leads to money spent on trips and vacations that wouldn't have otherwise be spent, thus leading to a net loss despite the credit card rewards?


For me, it does not result in *additional* trips or vacations (until I retire, lol). It results in drastically reduced cost of otherwise already planned travel.
"The best you can do is set up like a baseball team does against an unknown hitter. That is spread the defense and wait for the ball to come to you." - pkcrafter

BeneIRA
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Re: What's Your Credit Card Rewards Strategy?

Postby BeneIRA » Mon Feb 20, 2017 2:05 pm

Barefootgirl wrote:
They don't care about 5/24 or other rules because once you exhaust all of your bonus opportunities, you're done.


This is the game changer...once you've run through all the major bank cards, you are done churning for bonuses - left with only waiting for new cards w/bonuses or watching for special promotions. Outside of that, regular spend which brings the game back to regular road warriors, who typically have been either reimbursed by their employers or self-employed with business expenses. There is reselling, but even there, without a bonus, it becomes a bit of work and you need to consider the value of your time.

I've not been in this long enough to know whether it shares any similarities to other business cycles - i.e. when banks see fewer new cards, less spend, will they loosen and re-ignite another cycle?


Keep in mind that is just American Express's rule. In that same vein, they are cracking down on bonus matches. If you applied a month ago for the Starwood Preferred Guest card for 25,000 bonus points and now see the 35,000 bonus point offer, they won't match it.

Yes and no. There are still some churnable bonuses such as Alaska Airlines, the Citi offers without the 24 months language, and Chase if it has been 24 months since you last got the bonus, but banks are cracking down across the board. It seems the clear trend is worse for the churner, but there is some of what you are referring to. Typically for travel cards, the slow times is when we see better offers. After summer, look for expanded bonus offers. It is no coincidence that the Delta 70,000 mile bonus happened in January when travel is slower and not in the summer. We have seen some effects of competition such as American Express sending out more targeted offers for the Amex Platinum such as 50,000 and up bonuses and offering the 5X cash back on airfare when previously it was practically useless as an ongoing card. It will be interesting to see if any card tries to compete with Chase for travel card supremacy.

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VictoriaF
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Re: What's Your Credit Card Rewards Strategy?

Postby VictoriaF » Mon Feb 20, 2017 2:08 pm

An interesting article in The Points Guy Why US Credit Card Bonuses Are So High — And Why That May Change reviews the reasons for the U.S. consumers getting higher sign-up bonuses than the rest of the world. It also provides explanations for the disappearance of the debit card bonuses.

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hoops777
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Re: What's Your Credit Card Rewards Strategy?

Postby hoops777 » Mon Feb 20, 2017 10:51 pm

I love the cc reward threads.You can just sense the my strategy is the best vibe but nobody wants to actually say it :D :D :D
K.I.S.S........so easy to say so difficult to do.

Drew777
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Re: What's Your Credit Card Rewards Strategy?

Postby Drew777 » Tue Feb 21, 2017 9:53 am

Barefootgirl wrote:
They don't care about 5/24 or other rules because once you exhaust all of your bonus opportunities, you're done.


This is the game changer...once you've run through all the major bank cards, you are done churning for bonuses - left with only waiting for new cards w/bonuses or watching for special promotions. Outside of that, regular spend which brings the game back to regular road warriors, who typically have been either reimbursed by their employers or self-employed with business expenses. There is reselling, but even there, without a bonus, it becomes a bit of work and you need to consider the value of your time.

I've not been in this long enough to know whether it shares any similarities to other business cycles - i.e. when banks see fewer new cards, less spend, will they loosen and re-ignite another cycle?


It's impossible to totally run out of bonuses. There are plenty of churnable cards that you can get the bonus over and over again on. There are loopholes that allow you to churn cards that would not typically be churnable as well. Chase prequalified offers, Citi links without 24 month language, Amex links without lifetime language, Amex business cards for different businesses, etc. BOA, Barclays, and Capital One are pretty much infinitely churnable.

Drew777
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Re: What's Your Credit Card Rewards Strategy?

Postby Drew777 » Tue Feb 21, 2017 9:56 am

hoops777 wrote:I love the cc reward threads.You can just sense the my strategy is the best vibe but nobody wants to actually say it :D :D :D


Depends on what you mean be "best". If your goal is to earn as much cc rewards as possible that's pretty easy to measure.

Jack FFR1846
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Re: What's Your Credit Card Rewards Strategy?

Postby Jack FFR1846 » Tue Feb 21, 2017 10:04 am

d0gerz wrote:Jack FFR1846:

Am curious, per the Stop and Shop T&C, wouldn't Sears gift cards be excluded from gas points? Is it just the case of them not enforcing their own terms or some other special case?

Gas Rewards points are not available on purchases of gasoline and other fuels, alcohol, tobacco, money orders, postage stamps, gift cards, lottery tickets, amusement park and other tickets, Western Union wire transfer services, fax and copy machine services, coin operated vending machines, utility payments, prepaid telephone calling or wireless cards, video rental, delivery charges, dry cleaning, fundraising activities and donations, returned check service fees, payments toward store charge account balances, personal shopper fees, bottle deposits, sales tax, and any other purchase prohibited by law.


Also what about extended warranty protection often offered by credit cards? Is there a way to have that transfer over to when paying with gift cards?


This week, S&S's promotion is 5X gas points on Sears gift cards. Any gift cards not in the promo get zip. You're certainly right that we would waive the price rollback of the Citi double cash, which we usually use or the extended warranty that I know AMEX does (which I have in the sock drawer). To be honest, I'm a big do-it-yourselfer and have found too often that some service people are less competent than I am. I'd rather buy a part on Amazon for $10 and put it in myself than use the warranty. I'm also a realist and expect Sears to be out of business before an extended warranty would end.
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DiMAn0684
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Re: What's Your Credit Card Rewards Strategy?

Postby DiMAn0684 » Tue Feb 21, 2017 11:04 am

ThreeBears wrote:American Express Delta -

Just a warning. The card claims that you cannot get the miles bonus if you've ever had the card before . . . apparently they mean it, as I just spent $3,000 and they said I won't be getting the miles. I guess it's my fault, but I'm sharing as other people have had luck with other credit cards that claim to limit whether you can get the bonus a second time.

The customer service rep said I should apply for American Express Gold if I want to get more miles as I'm still eligible for that card.


When was the last time you had the card? From what I hear after ~7 yrs AMEX forgets that you've had the card...although that might be changing now.

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Re: What's Your Credit Card Rewards Strategy?

Postby DiMAn0684 » Tue Feb 21, 2017 11:11 am

Barefootgirl wrote:
They don't care about 5/24 or other rules because once you exhaust all of your bonus opportunities, you're done.


This is the game changer...once you've run through all the major bank cards, you are done churning for bonuses - left with only waiting for new cards w/bonuses or watching for special promotions. Outside of that, regular spend which brings the game back to regular road warriors, who typically have been either reimbursed by their employers or self-employed with business expenses. There is reselling, but even there, without a bonus, it becomes a bit of work and you need to consider the value of your time.

I've not been in this long enough to know whether it shares any similarities to other business cycles - i.e. when banks see fewer new cards, less spend, will they loosen and re-ignite another cycle?


I'd love to be wrong, but I don't see Chase / Citi / AMEX making general policies more lax. Maybe some targeted offers, but not general policies. Policies like 5/24 are not an issue for absolute majority of people, so there's really no reason to make the rules less restrictive.

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Re: What's Your Credit Card Rewards Strategy?

Postby rjbraun » Tue Feb 21, 2017 11:16 am

ThreeBears wrote:American Express Delta -

Just a warning. The card claims that you cannot get the miles bonus if you've ever had the card before . . . apparently they mean it, as I just spent $3,000 and they said I won't be getting the miles. I guess it's my fault, but I'm sharing as other people have had luck with other credit cards that claim to limit whether you can get the bonus a second time.

The customer service rep said I should apply for American Express Gold if I want to get more miles as I'm still eligible for that card.

Sorry about the setback. I take it that you never received a targeted offer or similar from Amex offering / ensuring you the sign-up bonus. If you did and they didn't follow through with the miles bonus that would be surprising and good to know. Thanks

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Re: What's Your Credit Card Rewards Strategy?

Postby protagonist » Tue Feb 21, 2017 11:32 am

DiMAn0684 wrote:
I'd love to be wrong, but I don't see Chase / Citi / AMEX making general policies more lax. Maybe some targeted offers, but not general policies. Policies like 5/24 are not an issue for absolute majority of people, so there's really no reason to make the rules less restrictive.


I think for the majority of people, 5/24 is , indeed, a big issue, because they don't know how to get around it, and even if they do, they may not have access to a Chase branch or want to go through the hassle knowing they may be rejected.

However, if the "workarounds" are advertised enough, more and more people will use them, and I would guess they would get more and more restrictive (which is what has happened in general with credit card promos these last few years).

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Re: What's Your Credit Card Rewards Strategy?

Postby VictoriaF » Tue Feb 21, 2017 11:47 am

protagonist wrote:
DiMAn0684 wrote:
I'd love to be wrong, but I don't see Chase / Citi / AMEX making general policies more lax. Maybe some targeted offers, but not general policies. Policies like 5/24 are not an issue for absolute majority of people, so there's really no reason to make the rules less restrictive.


I think for the majority of people, 5/24 is , indeed, a big issue, because they don't know how to get around it, and even if they do, they may not have access to a Chase branch or want to go through the hassle knowing they may be rejected.

However, if the "workarounds" are advertised enough, more and more people will use them, and I would guess they would get more and more restrictive (which is what has happened in general with credit card promos these last few years).


I think, Protagonist, you mean "the majority of people who play the credit cards/points/miles game". Some of us know more than others, some of us follow the news more diligently than others. For people who do not play the game 24/5 is not an issue.

it turns out that now even an easy access to a Chase branch does not help someone with a 24/5 problem. It used to work, but it does not work any longer.

In my opinion, the banks will be relaxing and firming their policies and enforcement of existing policies depending on their needs and the competition. A large bank can easily hire an employee whose job is to read FlyerTalk and a dozen of major blogs daily, including comments, and tell bank's policy makers about intended and unintended consequences of their policies. Banks estimate their tradeoffs and while they still get 3% from purchases by the churners, they much prefer to get new customers who do not pay their balances in full and are on the hook for double-digit interest. If however, the 3% merchant fee had disappeared, lucrative bonus offers would have vanished too.

My own attitude is to get low hanging fruits while while they are still hanging, and not to bite more than I can chew.

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Last edited by VictoriaF on Tue Feb 21, 2017 11:58 am, edited 1 time in total.
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ResearchMed
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Re: What's Your Credit Card Rewards Strategy?

Postby ResearchMed » Tue Feb 21, 2017 11:57 am

I've been wondering why charge card companies (Amex, Citi, Chase, etc.) actually do give bonuses for folks who churn.

After all, if we've got one of their cards (or 2 or 3!) already, "why can't we just use that one" for charges, especially if it is of the same type (gold or plat, etc.) so the perks are the same?
The client gets to charge, and the charge card company gets their percentage.

I could understand if someone closed an account and later regretted it or found a new use/need.
But realistically, that shouldn't be happening regularly (except perhaps for very slow learners!?).
So an occasional "new one", but only when the old one was closed for a while (and not repeatedly without long intervals), that might make sense.

The Amex policy makes sense, or maybe they should do it as once every 5 or 10 years, rather than once "ever".
Speaking of which, we've had our cards so long, I doubt we ever got such bonuses, so, time to check on that.

Anyway, "what's in it for them" to give duplicate cards when that means giving lots of points, along with the extra cards?

Inquiring minds...

RM
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VictoriaF
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Re: What's Your Credit Card Rewards Strategy?

Postby VictoriaF » Tue Feb 21, 2017 12:05 pm

ResearchMed wrote:I've been wondering why charge card companies (Amex, Citi, Chase, etc.) actually do give bonuses for folks who churn.


Take a look at a blog post I have linked earlier. It provides some explanations.
VictoriaF earlier wrote:An interesting article in The Points Guy Why US Credit Card Bonuses Are So High — And Why That May Change reviews the reasons for the U.S. consumers getting higher sign-up bonuses than the rest of the world. It also provides explanations for the disappearance of the debit card bonuses.


Victoria
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ResearchMed
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Re: What's Your Credit Card Rewards Strategy?

Postby ResearchMed » Tue Feb 21, 2017 12:20 pm

VictoriaF wrote:
ResearchMed wrote:I've been wondering why charge card companies (Amex, Citi, Chase, etc.) actually do give bonuses for folks who churn.


Take a look at a blog post I have linked earlier. It provides some explanations.
VictoriaF earlier wrote:An interesting article in The Points Guy Why US Credit Card Bonuses Are So High — And Why That May Change reviews the reasons for the U.S. consumers getting higher sign-up bonuses than the rest of the world. It also provides explanations for the disappearance of the debit card bonuses.


Victoria


I'm not sure that answers the duplication question.
That answers "why cards", and why a bonus, but not multiples per customer.

If customers have A card (or a few) from a charge card company, then they already can "swipe" to have their own convenience and also to give the card company their swipe fee... and also hopefully the interest on charges not paid off.
If they want to allow a customer the chance to "carry an even higher balance" via multiple cards, why not just increase the credit limit similar to the combined total?

I could also understand customers wanting a second back-up card in case of loss/theft/block, etc.
So perhaps 2 per customer (someone may want a duplicate of the exact perks, etc.).

But why over and over, each time with the big points?
What's in it for the card company, vs. being as sure as they can that more individuals have cards, and perhaps higher credit limits (instead of multiple cards, each with bonus)?

RM
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