Should I accept this Job Offer ?

Non-investing personal finance issues including insurance, credit, real estate, taxes, employment and legal issues such as trusts and wills
Post Reply
PhillyPhan
Posts: 23
Joined: Wed Nov 28, 2012 9:35 am

Should I accept this Job Offer ?

Post by PhillyPhan » Wed Mar 25, 2015 6:21 pm

I received an offer to join a firm which represents a significant rise in my base salary, (23%) as well as the potential to double my current bonus if I reach the target/maximum bonus payout. As with any offer there are several factors to consider, and I was hoping to gain some insight from outsiders on whether or not this opportunity is viewed as worthwhile from an overall compensation and career perspective.

Current Role

Company - MegaCorp -

Salary Structure - Base Salary + Bonus(10% of base)

401K - 5% on Total Compensation

Pension - 3-4% of total compensation

Vacation - 4 weeks plus 3 personal days

Title - Associate


New Role

Company - Smaller firm - 400 employees

Salary Structure - Base Salary (23% higher than MegaCorp)+ Bonus (20%) target

401k - 4%

No Pension

3 weeks vacation

Title - "Manager" with no direct reports but direct oversight of the department "subject matter expert"

The reason I threw my hat into the mix and interviewed for the role was two fold. To propel my career through the opportunity to have more of a direct impact on a smaller company, and secondly to be paid closer to what I would define as "market". The risks associated with accepting the offer from the current company are plentiful do to uncertainties with how my performance will be interpreted, however on the other hand I feel that a promotion at my current company would be slow to materialize due to bureaucratic policies. I enjoyed the interview process at Company B, and their culture aligns well with what I would be seeking from my next role.

User avatar
Scott62
Posts: 47
Joined: Wed Nov 19, 2014 6:26 pm

Re: Should I accept this Job Offer ?

Post by Scott62 » Wed Mar 25, 2015 6:46 pm

Don't know enough about you (age, how much of a pension is already built up for you at Megacorp, married? - if so, what does spouse think?, etc.), so I'll just throw out some thoughts:

Pay and bonus potential are nice.

No pension and less vacation are bummers. But with 24% more pay, you can finance your own pension, right (Roth IRA, etc.)?

If new company culture appears to be a good fit, I would weigh that heavily in to you decision.

What about other work life balance issues: expected work hours / week, commute time, etc.

Good luck.

gbru316
Posts: 279
Joined: Fri Jan 23, 2015 11:59 am

Re: Should I accept this Job Offer ?

Post by gbru316 » Wed Mar 25, 2015 6:53 pm

If you could see yourself regretting not taking the job down the road, take the job.

hicabob
Posts: 2539
Joined: Fri May 27, 2011 5:35 pm
Location: cruz

Re: Should I accept this Job Offer ?

Post by hicabob » Wed Mar 25, 2015 7:00 pm

I have worked for mega(100k), medium (400), small (30), very small (6) and self.
To generalize - I think the smaller the company is, results in better opportunity but higher risk ( like stocks?). If you are aggressive and ambitious smaller is probably better.
Vacation is often negotiable.

User avatar
VictoriaF
Posts: 17410
Joined: Tue Feb 27, 2007 7:27 am
Location: Black Swan Lake

Re: Should I accept this Job Offer ?

Post by VictoriaF » Wed Mar 25, 2015 7:05 pm

Check if you will actually be able to take vacations. Sometimes, companies have a generous vacation policy, but the workload is such that you can never find time to take them. The smaller the company, the more difficult it is to get away.

Victoria
WINNER of the 2015 Boglehead Contest. | Every joke has a bit of a joke. ... The rest is the truth. (Marat F)

Bacchus01
Posts: 1053
Joined: Mon Dec 24, 2012 9:35 pm

Re: Should I accept this Job Offer ?

Post by Bacchus01 » Wed Mar 25, 2015 7:19 pm

Are you vested in the pension? If not, get vested. You will really think about this later. Few companies have them so every little bit will help.

rayson
Posts: 187
Joined: Mon Dec 23, 2013 2:46 pm

Re: Should I accept this Job Offer ?

Post by rayson » Wed Mar 25, 2015 7:31 pm

PhillyPhan wrote:..to materialize due to bureaucratic policies. I enjoyed the interview process at Company B, and their culture aligns well with what I would be seeking from my next role.


If you like new company's culture, you should take the new job. Be prepared to work harder compared to a megacorp.

coolguy954
Posts: 112
Joined: Fri Mar 08, 2013 6:47 am

Re: Should I accept this Job Offer ?

Post by coolguy954 » Wed Mar 25, 2015 8:38 pm

All depends if your vested enough to get the pension....

But again who knows if your company is still going to offer it when you retire

PhillyPhan
Posts: 23
Joined: Wed Nov 28, 2012 9:35 am

Re: Should I accept this Job Offer ?

Post by PhillyPhan » Wed Mar 25, 2015 8:48 pm

Thank you all for your feedback , all valid points to consider.

- I am not vesting in company pension or participating , 1 year of service is required and I am only at 10 months.

- Yes additional after tax net increase could be used to fund Roth , however I already fully fund Roth and 401K , therefore it would go to taxable or general savings.

- I do get the impression that I will need to work on a different level, less of a doer , more strategic , providing a voice , shape the future of the department.

- The Net gain if bonus is achieved after taxes is 8 or 9 thousand dollars once I subtract pension, loss of vacation, city wage tax and small 401k difference. I need to determine if accepting this opportunity, propelling myself into a new salary bracket and having the opportunity to make a name for myself is worth the risk of potentially having things not work out 3 months down the line.

I have significant savings, no debt and I single so this decision is purely on me to determine.

User avatar
LadyGeek
Site Admin
Posts: 40502
Joined: Sat Dec 20, 2008 5:34 pm
Location: Philadelphia
Contact:

Re: Should I accept this Job Offer ?

Post by LadyGeek » Wed Mar 25, 2015 8:52 pm

How long have you been "Associate" at MegaCorp? Do you have any current experience overseeing someone?

I'm wondering why your new title is called "Manager" with no direct reports. Supervising a "subject matter expert", sounds like matrix management. IOW, this "expert" has a technical lead and a manager (the one he really reports to). In case of a tie, the manager wins.

Have you considered pursuing your career advancement internally? That's the first thing to try. It's a small world, and you may end up back there at some point. The last thing you want to do is burn your bridges. Have a "career discussion" with your MegaCorp manager and let him/her know that you'd like more responsibility. Give them a chance to respond.

You'd be surprised how many problems are caused by lack of communication. Don't jeopardize your current job simply because you didn't know about an opportunity that was open to you - if you had only asked in the first place.

Don't mention anything about looking to the outside.
To some, the glass is half full. To others, the glass is half empty. To an engineer, it's twice the size it needs to be.

User avatar
ClevrChico
Posts: 976
Joined: Tue Apr 03, 2012 8:24 pm

Re: Should I accept this Job Offer ?

Post by ClevrChico » Wed Mar 25, 2015 8:59 pm

Less vacation and retirement benefits? I'd pass.

Dontridetheindexdown
Posts: 56
Joined: Sat Feb 14, 2015 10:08 pm

Re: Should I accept this Job Offer ?

Post by Dontridetheindexdown » Wed Mar 25, 2015 9:04 pm

Considering the typos and grammatical errors in your post, STAY WHERE YOU ARE!

Alternatively, pursue additional education BEFORE considering a career move.

You have a job, with excellent benefits, and a career ladder.

From my perspective, it looks like you don't realize you are filling a position slightly above your capabilities.

PhillyPhan
Posts: 23
Joined: Wed Nov 28, 2012 9:35 am

Re: Should I accept this Job Offer ?

Post by PhillyPhan » Wed Mar 25, 2015 9:10 pm

LadyGeek , very valid points you make and it makes me feel as though I might have jumped the gun and rushed into pursuing opportunities outside the company. I was a bit disappointed at my year end review that I did not receive an increase on my base and it made me feel that my trajectory in salary was limited therefore I needed to take control of my own career.
I will be 34 shortly and am approaching the point where it is challenging to be patient and wait for career mobility opportunities to materialize . I feel that an increase of the likes of what I have in front of me would probably take close to two or three years if I am lucky and land a high position at MegaCorp.

User avatar
Watty
Posts: 11320
Joined: Wed Oct 10, 2007 3:55 pm

Re: Should I accept this Job Offer ?

Post by Watty » Wed Mar 25, 2015 9:15 pm

I am not vesting in company pension or participating , 1 year of service is required and I am only at 10 months.

.....

on the other hand I feel that a promotion at my current company would be slow to materialize due to bureaucratic policies.




I would think that since you were already interviewing after being at your current job for less than a year that there is a good chance you will not be there very long even if you don't take this job. If you will likely not be there for long then moving sooner rather than later might be a good idea if this position sounds better than you might be able to get after working for Megacorp for a few years.

User avatar
LadyGeek
Site Admin
Posts: 40502
Joined: Sat Dec 20, 2008 5:34 pm
Location: Philadelphia
Contact:

Re: Should I accept this Job Offer ?

Post by LadyGeek » Wed Mar 25, 2015 9:35 pm

PhillyPhan wrote:I will be 34 shortly and am approaching the point where it is challenging to be patient and wait for career mobility opportunities to materialize . I feel that an increase of the likes of what I have in front of me would probably take close to two or three years if I am lucky and land a high position at MegaCorp.

One thing that jumps out here is that you are waiting for an opportunity. That never happens in real life. IOW, you need to make the opportunity and the best way to do that is immediately start doing the job of what you want to do.

For example, you are in charge of making green widgets.There's a problem making blue widgets and production is down. However, you've noticed what's wrong and it's going to take some initiative to fix the production process. Cost, schedule, and managing people are needed.

Here's your opportunity. Plan it out, present your case to management, then offer to take the lead. The opportunity is taken and (if everything goes right) they will give you the job. That's the theory.

In real life, think about what's going on at MegaCorp. Instead of looking at the "big picture", look at the "little picture". Is there anything that you can do which would stretch your responsibilities a bit? All it takes is doing a minor task or two. Eventually, you will be recognized and will have "made a name for yourself" in the process. That's how you get ahead.

As I stated previously, talk to your manager. Let him/her know that you want to take on more responsibility - what do you suggest? You'll get an idea of how you are perceived by management, which will be an eye-opener for you.

Here's some unsolicited career advice: Your reputation is the most important thing you can have and it follows you throughout your working career. It takes years to earn and can be lost in a heart beat. Always do your best, help others, and be honest.
To some, the glass is half full. To others, the glass is half empty. To an engineer, it's twice the size it needs to be.

Lynette
Posts: 1349
Joined: Sun Jul 27, 2014 9:47 am

Re: Should I accept this Job Offer ?

Post by Lynette » Wed Mar 25, 2015 9:36 pm

Promotion is likely slower in a megacorp but there are more opportunities to move to other positions. In my megacorp, one is expected to stay in a position for three years before moving to another area. So, you need to evaluate how much experience you can gain in your present position. Pensions are great but a corporation can get rid of them at any point in time.

With vacations, it really depends if you can take them. In my previous position. I could take up to four weeks consecutive weeks vacation. I've been in another position for about 5 years but is is difficult to take more than a week. No one tells me what to do but I have no one to back me up so it's difficult when I return to an inbox of 1000 emails. I plan to retire as I c cant travel as much as I would like.

It seems that you are restless in your present position. Would you be able to find another position if the new job doesn't work out? Unless a megacorp is really growing, advancement is usually slow unless you have been chosen as one of the fast trackers. Good luck with your decision.

OneWorld111
Posts: 107
Joined: Tue Mar 20, 2012 9:59 am

Re: Should I accept this Job Offer ?

Post by OneWorld111 » Wed Mar 25, 2015 9:56 pm

I was in your situation few years ago.

Bigger and nicer titles are common with smaller companies Vs. bigger companies. Also, smaller companies pay more to attract top notch talent.

Do what motivates you, if money is primary motivator then go for it! People typically don't leave companies, they leave bosses. So in grand scheme of things, money is not the motivator. Good luck!

energy2156

rgs92
Posts: 1384
Joined: Mon Mar 02, 2009 8:00 pm

Re: Should I accept this Job Offer ?

Post by rgs92 » Wed Mar 25, 2015 10:05 pm

Stay in your job unless you hate it or think it could disappear. It's better to gather some moss, and the pension is nice too, but the stability and security these days should be your main priority.
Going to a new job is a minefield I have found, and you need to prove yourself and maybe you have forgotten how bad it feels to be the new person who hasn't accomplished anything.
The grass is always greener...
The only way I would say take the new job is if it was a gov't job, which is like winning the lottery, like it's the 1950s with pensions and job security.
If the new job doesn't work out (a very real possibility no matter how it looks from the outside), it could ruin your life. You go to a new job, and someone doesn't like your face, and you are out on the street.
The professional job market is like a war zone now, with many more candidates than jobs.
And as far as "better corporate culture" and fulfilling work and career goals and touchy-feely ideas like that, well, that is just a 1980s dream now, and again, if you sense that you are not getting fired in the near term,
forget everything else and enjoy the ride where you are now.
I'm a former corporate dude tossed out like an old dishrag if you hadn't already guessed.

PhillyPhan
Posts: 23
Joined: Wed Nov 28, 2012 9:35 am

Re: Should I accept this Job Offer ?

Post by PhillyPhan » Wed Mar 25, 2015 10:22 pm

I think "ruin my life" is quite the stretch, but the idea of having to tell that story is not appealing at all. I appreciate everyone chiming in, other than the person who pointed out my grammatical issues, as it stands I am leaning strongly to staying put and chalking this up to a good exercise. For those who have suggested I "raise my hand" and take initiative, I have launched several new projects and I believe they are well received. I am managed remotely which can be a challenge being that I am not observed day to day.

User avatar
HomerJ
Posts: 10253
Joined: Fri Jun 06, 2008 12:50 pm

Re: Should I accept this Job Offer ?

Post by HomerJ » Wed Mar 25, 2015 10:37 pm

gbru316 wrote:If you could see yourself regretting not taking the job down the road, take the job.


On the other hand, if you could see yourself regretting taking the job down the road, you better not take it...

:)

User avatar
HomerJ
Posts: 10253
Joined: Fri Jun 06, 2008 12:50 pm

Re: Should I accept this Job Offer ?

Post by HomerJ » Wed Mar 25, 2015 10:43 pm

Do you have a history of job hopping? How long were you at the job before this?

I'm all for changing jobs for big raises, since MegaCorp rarely gives big raises, but you don't want to change jobs too often, or you may jump into a new job, discover you hate it, but then be unable to get out because your resume is starting to look a jackrabbit wrote it.

10 months is not very long at your current job... I'm surprised you're already a little mad about not getting a raise after less than a year... It doesn't sound like MegaCorp is really being unfair yet.

4 weeks of vacation plus 3 personal days is a very generous. Very few companies give that much vacation time to a new employee and a pension.

I'm not 100% convinced that you should leave MegaCorp just yet.

PhillyPhan
Posts: 23
Joined: Wed Nov 28, 2012 9:35 am

Re: Should I accept this Job Offer ?

Post by PhillyPhan » Sun Mar 29, 2015 9:44 am

New development, I turned in notice and was immediately contacted by my manager's boss in a plea to have me remain with the company. They plan on presenting a counter offer, and he made it clear it would categorically not impact my future with the company. I understand the prevailing sentiment is that counteroffers are a poor choice, however in some circumstances when an increase in compensation was the main motivator, I believe they can work out just fine. In fact, I work in the recruiting field and first hand have seen more individuals attempt to come back to their previous company after they declining a counter offer when the new company they joined was not a fit. On the other hand, of all the candidates who I have had call me to explain they were accepting a counter offer, I can not recall one who contacted me months later to request we reengage in discussions.

User avatar
LadyGeek
Site Admin
Posts: 40502
Joined: Sat Dec 20, 2008 5:34 pm
Location: Philadelphia
Contact:

Re: Should I accept this Job Offer ?

Post by LadyGeek » Sun Mar 29, 2015 10:03 am

Look at the reasons you want to leave:
PhillyPhan wrote:...The reason I threw my hat into the mix and interviewed for the role was two fold. To propel my career through the opportunity to have more of a direct impact on a smaller company, and secondly to be paid closer to what I would define as "market".

A counter offer solves the 2nd reason (compensation), but does not solve the first reason. If you stay, you will not fulfill your first objective and forever wonder "what would have happened." Reject the counter offer.

Don't burn your bridges. Be objective and explain that it wasn't just the compensation. Try to leave the door open if you need to return.
To some, the glass is half full. To others, the glass is half empty. To an engineer, it's twice the size it needs to be.

Former Usher
Posts: 35
Joined: Fri Mar 27, 2015 9:21 am

Re: Should I accept this Job Offer ?

Post by Former Usher » Sun Apr 05, 2015 7:55 pm

Just curious how this one turned out. Any updates?

Boglegrappler
Posts: 919
Joined: Wed Aug 01, 2012 9:24 am

Re: Should I accept this Job Offer ?

Post by Boglegrappler » Mon Apr 06, 2015 9:00 am

Here's some unsolicited career advice: Your reputation is the most important thing you can have and it follows you throughout your working career. It takes years to earn and can be lost in a heart beat. Always do your best, help others, and be honest.


This is absolute gospel.

Every time you hear somebody whining about "its not what you know its who you know", mostly they are whining that their own reputation is too well known. The working world does operate based on what others think of you, and you build that perception through what you do and how you behave.

Post Reply