Having my year end review with my manager, what to expect?

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achen9291
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Having my year end review with my manager, what to expect?

Post by achen9291 »

This is my first year out on the job, and i'm having a year end review with my manager for roughly an hour. I was told that is where I discuss my performance for the year, goals, strengths weaknesses and things I need to improve on, bonus/raises/incentives for the coming year. Does anybody have any tips for me on what might actually go on and how I can walk out feeling the meeting went successful? What if my boss offers me incentives that I don't like? Such as company stocks? Or what if the raise is too low? Or bonus is too low? Do I take it and not negotiate? Any advice would be appreciated, thanks!
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Re: Having my year end review with my manager, what to expec

Post by livesoft »

Let me twist this around a little bit: Put yourself in your manager's shoes. Do you think they like these year-end reviews? If you were the manager, how would you conduct this review?
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tibbitts
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Re: Having my year end review with my manager, what to expec

Post by tibbitts »

Everybody will have a different answer depending on their personal experience. You have to remember that what might have worked or not for someone else, whether on this forum or at your business, may have zero application to you.

One general rule I can think of is that if your position involves sales, you'll probably be expected to sell yourself and what you want with the same enthusiasm you'd sell your products or services - basically to give a sales presentation for yourself, and not take no for an answer. So if you get push-back, it'll be hard to know if it's a test, or if it's for real.
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Re: Having my year end review with my manager, what to expec

Post by FrugalInvestor »

I think you've pretty much outlined what will go on. Since it's your first year, I'd concentrate on listening and learning rather than reacting. You should go in with your own ideas about the subjects outlined and be prepared to lay them out thoughtfully. Differences between your perceptions and your manager's are the most fruitful areas for discussion. Don't go into the review wanting to 'win,' go in wanting to learn from your manager's feedback and hopefully allowing your manager to learn from yours. Your attitude in the review will go a long way toward establishing a good ongoing relationship. At this point in time the raise, bonus, etc. are likely already established. But how you handle and react to the manager's input, both short and long-term, will go a long way toward determining what they are next year. Be thoughtful, relax, and good luck!
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achen9291
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Re: Having my year end review with my manager, what to expec

Post by achen9291 »

So.. the review went well.. my manager had alot of good positive things to say.. our company did well this year, really well and they made me believe that we would get a big bonus and raise... but after the end of the review I was told I get a 1% raise and a 4% bonus... so the raise pretax is 610$ and bonus is 1035$ since I just started in in June... I was very disappointed because I calculated that after tax of 25% it's more like 776+458.... I work very hard at what i do and it just feels like a slap to the face... it makes me believe my company is Cheap. I understand it's better than nothing but that barely even covers inflation.. and not even a months rent...it's a tough and very stressful job. so I feel like I want to leave for another company that is less stress but I've been moving houses lately and there's alot going on. [OT comments deleted by admin alex]
lululu
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Re: Having my year end review with my manager, what to expec

Post by lululu »

You've only been there six months? And they handed you 5% at a year's rate? And you're complaining? What field is this?
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achen9291
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Re: Having my year end review with my manager, what to expec

Post by achen9291 »

It's 4% from the salary that I made since I started. it's in IT. I'm an incident manager. I'm unsure of the normal rates.... how how bonuses or raises generally go... so what is acceptable as a standard raise on average?
Savvy
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Re: Having my year end review with my manager, what to expec

Post by Savvy »

achen9291 wrote:So.. the review went well.. my manager had alot of good positive things to say.. our company did well this year, really well and they made me believe that we would get a big bonus and raise... but after the end of the review I was told I get a 1% raise and a 4% bonus... so the raise pretax is 610$ and bonus is 1035$ since I just started in in June... I was very disappointed because I calculated that after tax of 25% it's more like 776+458.... I work very hard at what i do and it just feels like a slap to the face... it makes me believe my company is Cheap. I understand it's better than nothing but that barely even covers inflation.. and not even a months rent...it's a tough and very stressful job. so I feel like I want to leave for another company that is less stress but I've been moving houses lately and there's alot going on.
I'm going to send you a private message.
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Re: Having my year end review with my manager, what to expec

Post by DFrank »

On the one hand I think a 4% bonus is pretty good for a person just starting out and at your income level. I don't think it's fair of you to downplay the dollar value based on the fact that you only worked there for 6 months. That's the way bonuses are calculated - a percentage of your salary, not a dollar amount. Next year will be different.

I don't know what average raises were this year in IT, but 1% does seem a little low in general. I know at our technology megacorp the raise pool this year was 3%. However, and this is important, many companies will look at from the perspective that they hired you just 6 months ago at a competitive salary, so just 6 months in there may not be a need to make much of an adjustment. It could be that you might expect something more next year once you've been there for 18 months.

I would not be looking to move to another job based on this. I can tell you that as a hiring manager I would be very suspicious of someone who was only at their prior employer for 6 months, and would not be very likely to hire them unless they had a very good reason for leaving. If they told me they were leaving because they were unhappy with their raise I'd probably show them the door immediately, no point in wasting any more of my time.
Last edited by DFrank on Thu Dec 18, 2014 5:44 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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achen9291
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Re: Having my year end review with my manager, what to expec

Post by achen9291 »

DFrank wrote:On the one hand I think a 4% bonus is pretty good for a person just starting out and at your income level. I don't think it's fair of you to downplay the dollar value based on the fact that you only worked there for 6 months. That's the way bonuses are calculated - a percentage of your salary, not a dollar amount. Next year will be different.

I don't know what average raises were this year in IT, but 1% does seem a little low in general. I know at our technology megacorp the raise pool this year was 3%. However, and this is important, many companies will look at from the perspective that they hired you just 6 months ago at a competitive salary, so just 6 months in there may not be a need to make much of an adjustment. It could be that you might expect something more next year once you've been there for 18 months.

I would not be looking to move to another job based on this. I can tell you that as a hiring manager I would be very suspicious of someone who was only at their prior employer for 6 months, and would not be very likely to hire them unless they had a very good reason for leaving. If they told me they were leaving because they were unhappy with their raise I'd probably show them the door immediately, no point in wasting any more of my time.

Dave
Thanks dave, if I were in another interview, I would not tell the hiring manager that I left because of pay. I'd say something like it was too far from work and I just moved so I wanted to be closer to home or something. But I have heard that generally it's good to stay at least 2-3 years before jumping ship. I know alot of hiring managers do get suspicious and would wonder why someone would leave a job so soon. I don't want to seem like im complaining, I just feel under compensated for the amount of work I put in and have to deal with for this role vs another IT role within the company. It is one of the toughest roles in the company and it looks good on the resume, but maybe it's just a time in my life where I'm being built up for better things in the future.. I'm trying to be happy with what I have and not let it get to me.
covertfantom
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Re: Having my year end review with my manager, what to expec

Post by covertfantom »

I think you're expecting a bit much especially for what is effectively a mid-year review. Going to PM you with my numbers...
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Re: Having my year end review with my manager, what to expec

Post by FelixTheCat »

I agree with the other guys. You got something decent for being there six months.

I suggest looking up the average salary for your position to see if you are fairly compensated. Here's a glassdoor example http://www.glassdoor.com/Salaries/incid ... KO0,16.htm
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Re: Having my year end review with my manager, what to expec

Post by tennisplyr »

Having spent 40 years in corporate America, here's what I suggest:

--listen carefully to what they are saying quietly
--don't get defensive, this is your boss' impressions
--be positive, smile and make legitimate attempts to implement what they are saying
--question things that you clarification on in a constructive way.

Remember though this is for you, it is not about you....it is about how you fit and work within the border team effectively.
Good luck and be open-minded.
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Re: Having my year end review with my manager, what to expec

Post by fposte »

achen9291 wrote: Thanks dave, if I were in another interview, I would not tell the hiring manager that I left because of pay. I'd say something like it was too far from work and I just moved so I wanted to be closer to home or something.
Unless the workplace moved, that would raise my antennae in hiring--you knew where the office was when you took the job.
achen9291 wrote:I just feel under compensated for the amount of work I put in
I'm not clear--did you take the job at a rate you already weren't happy with? Is the problem here that you were hoping that raises would move you up toward the rate you wish you started at? Or did the job turn out to be different from what you thought?
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Re: Having my year end review with my manager, what to expec

Post by cfs »

Do not discuss.

Well, shipmate Achen, you have discussed the situation here, but my recommendation is to keep this information to yourself and [for various reasons] do not discuss this with anyone at work. Just my two centimos. Have a Merry Christmas and a productive year of 2015.
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achen9291
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Re: Having my year end review with my manager, what to expec

Post by achen9291 »

The job turned out to be way different than I expected.. we can end the discussion here..
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Re: Having my year end review with my manager, what to expec

Post by poker27 »

tibbitts wrote:
One general rule I can think of is that if your position involves sales, you'll probably be expected to sell yourself and what you want with the same enthusiasm you'd sell your products or services - basically to give a sales presentation for yourself, and not take no for an answer. So if you get push-back, it'll be hard to know if it's a test, or if it's for real.
Thats not necessarily true. If in sales, reviews can be very simple as there is a plethora of data available to judge your year on. I'm in sales, and my annual review is a pretty generic power point with my boss and I. Usually we discuss successes, opportunities to learn from, and future development during the hour.
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Re: Having my year end review with my manager, what to expec

Post by LadyGeek »

This thread is now in the Personal Finance (Not Investing) forum (employment).
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Re: Having my year end review with my manager, what to expec

Post by market timer »

In my experience, the only way to negotiate a decent raise is to get a counteroffer. That means networking is just as essential as performing your job well and building relevant skills. Always assume megacorp will give you what they think is the minimum bonus/raise to retain you.
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Re: Having my year end review with my manager, what to expec

Post by 4nursebee »

Interesting read.

For a new six month employee the OP strikes me as having a poor attitude especially after saying the review went well. [response to OT comment removed by admin alex]

I would not hire an average employee that left a job at 6 months. Build skills and training at current job, mine the job for these opportunities, be industrious.
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Re: Having my year end review with my manager, what to expec

Post by leonidas »

I'm in IT and this year I got a 2% raise and 8% bonus. Same as last year. Unless they gave you some indication that your starting salary was to be adjusted upwards based on some erformance metric I would say you did ok. I would not be against looking around at other companies to see what the pay scales are for similar jobs.
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Re: Having my year end review with my manager, what to expec

Post by investingdad »

I'm in engineering and mid-career. Our company is undergoing re-structuring and I fully expect to be let go next month.

My raise this year was 2% and my bonus was 2%. My end of year review was generally positive but I'm not stupid and can read between the lines on the bonus details.

I can tell you, OP, that your raise and bonus was VERY much in line for only having been there for 6 months, and pretty generous. Plus you said it's your first job after graduating from college? Naturally the bonus was pro-rated for 1/2 the year, how could it not be?
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Re: Having my year end review with my manager, what to expec

Post by wxz76 »

I am so in IT and I would be very happy with 5%. Last year I got less than 1% pay increase and 1.75% bonus and the year before that I also got less than 1% pay increase and no bonus.
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Re: Having my year end review with my manager, what to expec

Post by Cosmo »

livesoft wrote:Let me twist this around a little bit: Put yourself in your manager's shoes. Do you think they like these year-end reviews? If you were the manager, how would you conduct this review?
Here is what it always comes down to with me. It seems to be a lot less to do with your performance and accomplishments over the past year and a lot more to do with whether the manager likes you or not. If he genuinely likes you for what ever reason (perhaps you got them out of a jam or made him/her look good), he will give you a good review and be much more forgiving on your past performance shortcomings, if any. If he does not care for you for whatever reason (perhaps you said some comment or joke about him in front of others) that made him look bad, you will not get a good review regardless of how many home runs you hit this year.

Cosmo
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Re: Having my year end review with my manager, what to expec

Post by tibbitts »

market timer wrote:In my experience, the only way to negotiate a decent raise is to get a counteroffer. That means networking is just as essential as performing your job well and building relevant skills. Always assume megacorp will give you what they think is the minimum bonus/raise to retain you.
The downside to getting a counteroffer for you annual review is that if there are a limited number of employers in your industry, or preferred geographic area, you can wear out your welcome getting counteroffers. After hitting up megacorp2 for a job offer every twelve months, those offers are likely to dry up at some point, possibly pretty quickly. And you need a genuine counteroffer, not just some vague indication that megacorp2 might hire you for a certain amount more than your current employer.

If you have an amazingly in-demand skill, and are amazingly talented at what you do, that might work for a while, but for some of the rest of us, it might serve more to limit possibilities down the road.
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Re: Having my year end review with my manager, what to expec

Post by burt »

Performance reviews are a crock. Just engage, smile and play along.

I wish management would concentrate on the top 10% “shooting stars” and the bottom 10% “one foot out the door”. For the 80% in the middle, it doesn’t make any difference how you perform. In fact for the 80% in the middle, chances are good your ranking for the next 2 years is already predetermined regardless of what you do. Don’t kill yourself for a cost of living increase and a bonus bump of 1% over the next guy. It’s not worth it. Just do your job.

Hopefully you won’t experience a “promotion” …. With no pay raise.
For the 80% in the middle the carrot doesn't exist or it’s one of those tiny baby carrots.

Don’t negotiate, just leave (on good terms). You can negotiate when they try to rehire you.

burt
(38 years at Mega Corps.)

Edit.
By the way.... if you aren't in the top 10% ("high potential employees") within 2-3 years of your start date.... forget it.
Game over. You ain't gonna get there.
Just trying to save the young people disappointment. Spend your time on your family and friends.

burt
Last edited by burt on Sat Dec 20, 2014 6:15 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Having my year end review with my manager, what to expec

Post by epitomist »

[response to OT comment deleted by admin alex]
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Re: Having my year end review with my manager, what to expec

Post by investingdad »

burt wrote:Performance reviews are a crock. Just engage, smile and play along.

I wish management would concentrate on the top 10% “shooting stars” and the bottom 10% “one foot out the door”. For the 80% in the middle, it doesn’t make any difference how you perform. In fact for the 80% in the middle, chances are good your ranking for the next 2 years is already predetermined regardless of what you do. Don’t kill yourself for a cost of living increase and a bonus bump of 1% over the next guy. It’s not worth it. Just do your job.

Hopefully you won’t experience a “promotion” …. With no pay raise.
For the 80% in the middle the carrot doesn't exist or it’s one of those tiny baby carrots.

Don’t negotiate, just leave (on good terms). You can negotiate when they try to rehire you.

burt
(38 years at Mega Corps.)
This post has a fairly high degree of accuracy.
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market timer
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Re: Having my year end review with my manager, what to expec

Post by market timer »

tibbitts wrote:
market timer wrote:In my experience, the only way to negotiate a decent raise is to get a counteroffer. That means networking is just as essential as performing your job well and building relevant skills. Always assume megacorp will give you what they think is the minimum bonus/raise to retain you.
The downside to getting a counteroffer for you annual review is that if there are a limited number of employers in your industry, or preferred geographic area, you can wear out your welcome getting counteroffers. After hitting up megacorp2 for a job offer every twelve months, those offers are likely to dry up at some point, possibly pretty quickly. And you need a genuine counteroffer, not just some vague indication that megacorp2 might hire you for a certain amount more than your current employer.

If you have an amazingly in-demand skill, and are amazingly talented at what you do, that might work for a while, but for some of the rest of us, it might serve more to limit possibilities down the road.
Sounds like it could be modeled as an interesting option exercise problem--probably has, in fact. Of course, not always easy to get that option/offer in the first place.
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Re: Having my year end review with my manager, what to expec

Post by Cosmo »

market timer wrote:
tibbitts wrote:
market timer wrote:In my experience, the only way to negotiate a decent raise is to get a counteroffer. That means networking is just as essential as performing your job well and building relevant skills. Always assume megacorp will give you what they think is the minimum bonus/raise to retain you.
The downside to getting a counteroffer for you annual review is that if there are a limited number of employers in your industry, or preferred geographic area, you can wear out your welcome getting counteroffers. After hitting up megacorp2 for a job offer every twelve months, those offers are likely to dry up at some point, possibly pretty quickly. And you need a genuine counteroffer, not just some vague indication that megacorp2 might hire you for a certain amount more than your current employer.

If you have an amazingly in-demand skill, and are amazingly talented at what you do, that might work for a while, but for some of the rest of us, it might serve more to limit possibilities down the road.
Sounds like it could be modeled as an interesting option exercise problem--probably has, in fact. Of course, not always easy to get that option/offer in the first place.
This can work but on the other hand, many employers like loyal employees or perceived loyal employees. Playing this game can often backfire at a later time, especially if you get a nice bump up in pay but perhaps your performance is not matching.

Cosmo
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Re: Having my year end review with my manager, what to expec

Post by jackholloway »

Many megacorps give raises based on increased skills and capabilities, not inflation. Someone who has been there six months would probably not get a raise at all, and would get a bonus based on the six months they were at the megacorp. To get a notable raise next year, you need to show notable improvement. Most people do after a year and a half, but not everyone.

Every manager I know has seen the new person get more than the existing staff, or the long term employees get more than new ones for the same work. Several megacorps aspire to doing neither, but their techniques differ. One megacorp has relatively few levels, ties salaries to those levels, then assigns duties based on cost. Another has a whole bunch of levels and job codes tied to what they can bill their granting authorities. A third gives each manager objectives and a budget to get them, and it is up to the hiring manager how they do that - that one tends to shaft people on initial salary, reward the stars, and fire everyone else eventually. I like the first two better, but you should find out what your own org is like.
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