"Spinning Off" my 20 Year Old Son

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Leesbro63
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"Spinning Off" my 20 Year Old Son

Post by Leesbro63 » Wed Mar 26, 2014 8:48 am

Here's one I've never seen on here. I am thinking about "spinning off" my 20 year old college Freshman (he'll be 20 soon and will complete his Freshman year...we held him back in Kindergarten). Due to gifting while he was a child, he has enough saved to pay his own way at least until he graduates from undergrad. He has his own car, now in my name, paid for, and I have a 529 account for him that pays his hard college expenses. He's currently on our health insurance but, as per my other thread, that could change.

I get it that I'll lose a $3900 tax deduction. What are the other benefits and consequences of doing this?

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Re: "Spinning Off" my 20 Year Old Son

Post by livesoft » Wed Mar 26, 2014 8:55 am

I think you have to "unfriend" him first. He has probably already done that to you. Other than that, I don't see any other benefits.
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Re: "Spinning Off" my 20 Year Old Son

Post by Grt2bOutdoors » Wed Mar 26, 2014 8:58 am

Quite possibly fracturing a relationship beyond repair, forever.
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Re: "Spinning Off" my 20 Year Old Son

Post by Leesbro63 » Wed Mar 26, 2014 9:00 am

Grt2bOutdoors wrote:Quite possibly fracturing a relationship beyond repair, forever.
I guess I need to retitle as "FINANCIALLY" Spinning off my 20 year old son...

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Re: "Spinning Off" my 20 Year Old Son

Post by Leesbro63 » Wed Mar 26, 2014 9:01 am

livesoft wrote:I think you have to "unfriend" him first. He has probably already done that to you. Other than that, I don't see any other benefits.
No doubt. My kids have me blocked from their Facebook pages. (However there IS a family "snitch" who they forgot to block ;) )

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Re: "Spinning Off" my 20 Year Old Son

Post by neurosphere » Wed Mar 26, 2014 9:17 am

My father used to say, when I was young and being a bratty teenager, that the happiest day of his life would be when I came to him and said "Dad, I don't need you, I'm going to do whatever I want!" and actually have the ability to do so. :D

I think it's perfectly fine to set the expectations for your son regarding his financial dependency on you. You've set him up to make it through college. He will have to live within those means until graduation, and then he's on his own after that. That's hardly unfair, or an abuse of the parent/child relationship.

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Re: "Spinning Off" my 20 Year Old Son

Post by Leesbro63 » Wed Mar 26, 2014 9:22 am

I guess I didn't make this clear. It's not that I want to disown him. I am thinking about this from a liability perspective mainly. He would get his own car and health insurance. It's something that will happen in 3 years anyway. And if he got into a bind, of course we'd rescue him just as we would if he was technically still a "dependent".

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Re: "Spinning Off" my 20 Year Old Son

Post by Leesbro63 » Wed Mar 26, 2014 9:25 am

Also he has a small amount of investment income. If I don't take him as a dependent, is that income still subject to the "kiddie tax"?

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Re: "Spinning Off" my 20 Year Old Son

Post by beachplum » Wed Mar 26, 2014 9:32 am

Leesbro63 wrote:I guess I didn't make this clear. It's not that I want to disown him. I am thinking about this from a liability perspective mainly. He would get his own car and health insurance. It's something that will happen in 3 years anyway. And if he got into a bind, of course we'd rescue him just as we would if he was technically still a "dependent".
Personally I wouldn't give up the tax deduction on him at this point.If he's a responsible driver then why not keep him on your insurance. An umbrella policy will help with liability. It's fine if you take him off, but it will cost him more. What would you save by taking him off your health insurance? I'm just guessing, but I assume that your health insurance coverage is way better then anything he will get on his own as well as probably cheaper so not sure how that saves anyone anything.

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Re: "Spinning Off" my 20 Year Old Son

Post by sscritic » Wed Mar 26, 2014 9:32 am

Leesbro63 wrote:Also he has a small amount of investment income. If I don't take him as a dependent, is that income still subject to the "kiddie tax"?
Not if it is small. Ask him to show you his tax return.

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Re: "Spinning Off" my 20 Year Old Son

Post by sscritic » Wed Mar 26, 2014 9:37 am

P.S. In most cases whether you claim him or not makes no difference to him. He is subject to the "can someone claim you" rules, whether that someone does or not.

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Re: "Spinning Off" my 20 Year Old Son

Post by rustymutt » Wed Mar 26, 2014 9:40 am

I think I'm going through the same thing with my 19 year old. They won't listen to mom, or dad, and know everything. He suddenly learned to lie, and be less than honest with me. We're in the process of setting up his own account at Vanguard, and letting him manage his money 100%. He'll be on our health insurance til he's 26, and we gave him his car. He's might even pay us back for his auto insurance, and he's doing his own taxes. Did I mention how supportive of him his friends, and their families have been. He lived with them for a year, moving from one house to another when need be. Now he's in college living on campus.
This all started when on his 18th birthday, instead of having his party, I called for a room cleaning party, and mom and me helped him clean the pig pen. I had ask him repeatedly over 2 weeks to clean his room up. (fire hazard) That's why he moved out. Good luck to all you loving, caring parents. It's tough to see kids grow up into what they are, but we have to cut ties at some point, and I believe nature does a great job of encouraging this.
Last edited by rustymutt on Wed Mar 26, 2014 9:46 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: "Spinning Off" my 20 Year Old Son

Post by Jack FFR1846 » Wed Mar 26, 2014 9:44 am

Not sure if financial aid is a consideration, but at 20, he's still going to need your info on the FAFSA in most cases. Just "not taking" him as a dependent means nothing to FAFSA.

You may want to look hard at the health insurance part, depending on where you get it. I know there are differences in policies. Where I work, my choices are myself alone or my entire family. If I cut my older son free when he goes to college this fall, I don't save a dime on insurance and he'll have to pay $100 a month for his school sponsored insurance.
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Re: "Spinning Off" my 20 Year Old Son

Post by carorun » Wed Mar 26, 2014 9:46 am

Recent legislation has made it very difficult for college students to be declared independent of their parents for financial aid purposes. I think the impetus for this was that lots of middle-income students were passing the bar to be declared independent, and thus receiving more financial aid. Unfortunately, the new requirements mean that parents who make good incomes but refuse to pay their kids' college have essentially screwed their kids from obtaining loans or aid for school. I know a few instances of this.

Benefits to him? Probably lower taxes on whatever earned income he has, a generous deduction for money spent on tuition, which will probably result in an Earned Income Tax Credit. Once he's independent, he'll file his own FAFSA.

Benefits to you? Loss of tax deduction, and a lower health insurance premium from removing him.

My understanding is that he needs to prove that he supports himself (sounds like he does, via savings), and he's not on your health insurance. Try googling things like "emancipation" and "independent student" until you find the IRS regs, and go by the letter on those.

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Re: "Spinning Off" my 20 Year Old Son

Post by DanDav » Wed Mar 26, 2014 9:57 am

Leesbro63 wrote:I guess I didn't make this clear. It's not that I want to disown him. I am thinking about this from a liability perspective mainly. He would get his own car and health insurance. It's something that will happen in 3 years anyway. And if he got into a bind, of course we'd rescue him just as we would if he was technically still a "dependent".
Well if he stays on your insurance he'll actually be covered until he's 26 if I'm not mistaken.

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Re: "Spinning Off" my 20 Year Old Son

Post by Leesbro63 » Wed Mar 26, 2014 10:47 am

rustymutt wrote:I think I'm going through the same thing with my 19 year old. They won't listen to mom, or dad, and know everything. He suddenly learned to lie, and be less than honest with me. We're in the process of setting up his own account at Vanguard, and letting him manage his money 100%. He'll be on our health insurance til he's 26, and we gave him his car. He's might even pay us back for his auto insurance, and he's doing his own taxes. Did I mention how supportive of him his friends, and their families have been. He lived with them for a year, moving from one house to another when need be. Now he's in college living on campus.
This all started when on his 18th birthday, instead of having his party, I called for a room cleaning party, and mom and me helped him clean the pig pen. I had ask him repeatedly over 2 weeks to clean his room up. (fire hazard) That's why he moved out. Good luck to all you loving, caring parents. It's tough to see kids grow up into what they are, but we have to cut ties at some point, and I believe nature does a great job of encouraging this.
I am the OP. Just for the record, my situation does not derive from that situation. My kid IS a kid...and he does have teenager attitude often, but overall he's a good kid doing what we expect him to do. This isn't about punishing him. It's just about making him a bit more independent a bit earlier than usual and about some additional liability protection for me.

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Re: "Spinning Off" my 20 Year Old Son

Post by Leesbro63 » Wed Mar 26, 2014 10:49 am

Jack FFR1846 wrote:Not sure if financial aid is a consideration, but at 20, he's still going to need your info on the FAFSA in most cases. Just "not taking" him as a dependent means nothing to FAFSA.

You may want to look hard at the health insurance part, depending on where you get it. I know there are differences in policies. Where I work, my choices are myself alone or my entire family. If I cut my older son free when he goes to college this fall, I don't save a dime on insurance and he'll have to pay $100 a month for his school sponsored insurance.
He gets no aid and I am not doing this as an attempt for that.

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Re: "Spinning Off" my 20 Year Old Son

Post by Randomize » Wed Mar 26, 2014 11:39 am

rustymutt wrote: This all started when on his 18th birthday, instead of having his party, I called for a room cleaning party, and mom and me helped him clean the pig pen. I had ask him repeatedly over 2 weeks to clean his room up. (fire hazard) That's why he moved out. Good luck to all you loving, caring parents. It's tough to see kids grow up into what they are, but we have to cut ties at some point, and I believe nature does a great job of encouraging this.
Rusty, that's pretty harsh. His 18th birthday was the big one, the day he officially became a man, and you chose that to make him clean his room? Obviously I don't know any backstory, but if I were him, I'd view that as having my dependence on you rubbed in my face at the worst possible time. Then I'd move out and hold it against you for a long, long time.

It's your relationship - I can't tell you what to do. I can only suggest that you sincerely apologize for making a show of force on his 18th birthday. Good luck, whatever you decide to do.

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Re: "Spinning Off" my 20 Year Old Son

Post by 3Wood85 » Wed Mar 26, 2014 11:47 am

Randomize wrote:
rustymutt wrote: This all started when on his 18th birthday, instead of having his party, I called for a room cleaning party, and mom and me helped him clean the pig pen. I had ask him repeatedly over 2 weeks to clean his room up. (fire hazard) That's why he moved out. Good luck to all you loving, caring parents. It's tough to see kids grow up into what they are, but we have to cut ties at some point, and I believe nature does a great job of encouraging this.
Rusty, that's pretty harsh. His 18th birthday was the big one, the day he officially became a man, and you chose that to make him clean his room? Obviously I don't know any backstory, but if I were him, I'd view that as having my dependence on you rubbed in my face at the worst possible time. Then I'd move out and hold it against you for a long, long time.

It's your relationship - I can't tell you what to do. I can only suggest that you sincerely apologize for making a show of force on his 18th birthday. Good luck, whatever you decide to do.

Asking to clean his room is harsh? Well you wouldn't have liked my mother.

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Re: "Spinning Off" my 20 Year Old Son

Post by Random Musings » Wed Mar 26, 2014 11:56 am

Leesbro63 wrote:Here's one I've never seen on here. I am thinking about "spinning off" my 20 year old college Freshman
Just don't get Carl Icahn involved. Although he'll get the job down, it might get too ugly for your tastes.

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Re: "Spinning Off" my 20 Year Old Son

Post by MN Finance » Wed Mar 26, 2014 12:05 pm

Just to highlight a previous post, you don't get to decide if someone is a dependent or not on your tax return (though you can decide NOT to claim a dependent, that act is dumb because it doesn't mean they can then claim themselves just because you didn't.) They're either a dependent or not.

Now if you want to change health insurance, car ownership, or something else, that's a totally different issue.

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Re: "Spinning Off" my 20 Year Old Son

Post by MnD » Wed Mar 26, 2014 12:40 pm

If you transfer the 529 account to his ownership, he should qualify as non-dependent and be able to take his own exemption and he shouldn't be subject to the kiddie tax.
He may also qualify for some of the low and middle-class income college tax breaks that are unavailable to parents with higher incomes.

I don't know what can of worms a 529 ownership transfer might open up.
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Re: "Spinning Off" my 20 Year Old Son

Post by IlliniDave » Wed Mar 26, 2014 1:26 pm

Leesbro63 wrote:Here's one I've never seen on here. I am thinking about "spinning off" my 20 year old college Freshman (he'll be 20 soon and will complete his Freshman year...we held him back in Kindergarten). Due to gifting while he was a child, he has enough saved to pay his own way at least until he graduates from undergrad. He has his own car, now in my name, paid for, and I have a 529 account for him that pays his hard college expenses. He's currently on our health insurance but, as per my other thread, that could change.

I get it that I'll lose a $3900 tax deduction. What are the other benefits and consequences of doing this?
Since you've already in effect paid for everything in advance, doesn't seem to be much impact except the deduction. Until he's 25 you still count against him on FAFSA (might not be an issue). So the major potential result is that he might be on his own for health insurance (I didn't see your other post)?

I was essentially "spun off" three months after my 18th birthday when I went off to school. Just meant I had to exercise a little more maturity and restraint than some of my classmates at times (e.g., I'd sometimes work extra hours over spring break instead of going to the beach somewhere).
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Re: "Spinning Off" my 20 Year Old Son

Post by Rodc » Wed Mar 26, 2014 1:49 pm

If you have a 20 year old, they crash their car, cause a horrible injury and the victim is looking for someone to sue, does declaring you think he was already spun off provide any reduction in liability? You bought the car, you are funding his education (through previous gifting). Somehow I would be surprised, but not only am I not a lawyer, I don't play one on the internet.

If this was a concern of mine (and it was) I would get an umbrella insurance policy (I did).
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Re: "Spinning Off" my 20 Year Old Son

Post by Leesbro63 » Wed Mar 26, 2014 1:51 pm

Rodc wrote:If you have a 20 year old, they crash their car, cause a horrible injury and the victim is looking for someone to sue, does declaring you think he was already spun off provide any reduction in liability? You bought the car, you are funding, did fund, his education. Somehow I would be surprised, but not only am I not a lawyer, I don't play one on the internet.

If this was a concern of mine (and it was) I would get an umbrella insurance policy (I did).
Actually my insurance agent pretty much said the same thing. To be honest. Although I would argue that while being independent is not an iron clad guarantee, it's one more wall of protection.

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Re: "Spinning Off" my 20 Year Old Son

Post by pshonore » Wed Mar 26, 2014 2:27 pm

vachica wrote:Recent legislation has made it very difficult for college students to be declared independent of their parents for financial aid purposes. I think the impetus for this was that lots of middle-income students were passing the bar to be declared independent, and thus receiving more financial aid. Unfortunately, the new requirements mean that parents who make good incomes but refuse to pay their kids' college have essentially screwed their kids from obtaining loans or aid for school. I know a few instances of this.

Benefits to him? Probably lower taxes on whatever earned income he has, a generous deduction for money spent on tuition, which will probably result in an Earned Income Tax Credit. Once he's independent, he'll file his own FAFSA.
Sounds like he's under 24 and his earned income is less than 1/2 his support. In that case, he's ineligible for the refundable portion of the AOC and his credit would be limited to the lesser of $1500 or his tax libility. No EIC if you're under 25 and do not have a qualifying child.

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Re: "Spinning Off" my 20 Year Old Son

Post by Meg77 » Wed Mar 26, 2014 2:36 pm

I think making your son more independent is a great goal, and an appropriate one given his life stage. I don't think doing so will lower your own liability in any way.

When I went off to college I had a college fund that had been set up that was enough to fund my education and personal expenses - and then some. I submitted a budget for each semester of what I thought I would need and was granted a monthly allowance from the fund based on that. By sophomore year I was given a lump sum each semester to budget and by senior year I'd realized that nobody read my budgets and nothing I'd ever requested had been questioned or denied. I asked for extra money for every spring break trips, for sorority dues, studying abroad - I even figured out how to get my small scholarship paid to me in cash by sending the tuition bill before the grant had been applied so that then I could go collect the "overpayment refund" in person later, which is always made out to the student regardless of who pays the tuition.

Lucky for everyone I was funding a Roth IRA not a drug habit. But either way I was an adult and looking back my family used this opportunity to let me learn how to handle my money on my own. Even if the money is coming from you, make your son pay his own bills. Put the cell phone, car insurance, healthcare, etc in his name and have the bills go to him and adjust his allowance as appropriate. He's going to have to figure out how to do that sooner or later.

Also I think it's a good time to let him file his own taxes, even if he doesn't make enough to have to. It sounds like he's not technically a dependent for you anyway since he's living off "gifts." To offset the increased cost of his insurance and healthcare (and it is likely to go up), let him have his own exemption.
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Re: "Spinning Off" my 20 Year Old Son

Post by frugaltype » Wed Mar 26, 2014 2:45 pm

Leesbro63 wrote: I am the OP. Just for the record, my situation does not derive from that situation. My kid IS a kid...and he does have teenager attitude often, but overall he's a good kid doing what we expect him to do. This isn't about punishing him. It's just about making him a bit more independent a bit earlier than usual and about some additional liability protection for me.
Yes. People seem to be assuming the worst here, when the OP's original post did not read that way to me at all.

I went financially independent of my parents when I turned twenty. Although I was done with undergraduate school at that point. Twenty is pretty old to be still in the financial nest, imho. Being financially independent contributes to maturing.

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Re: "Spinning Off" my 20 Year Old Son

Post by jj » Wed Mar 26, 2014 2:47 pm

pshonore wrote: No EIC if you're under 25 and do not have a qualifying child.
http://www.irs.gov/Individuals/EITC-Inc ... aw-Updates

Yes, must be age 25, but no qualifying child is required - although the AGI limits to qualify without a child are very low...
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Re: "Spinning Off" my 20 Year Old Son

Post by frugaltype » Wed Mar 26, 2014 2:49 pm

3Wood85 wrote:
Randomize wrote:
rustymutt wrote: This all started when on his 18th birthday, instead of having his party, I called for a room cleaning party, and mom and me helped him clean the pig pen. I had ask him repeatedly over 2 weeks to clean his room up. (fire hazard) That's why he moved out. Good luck to all you loving, caring parents. It's tough to see kids grow up into what they are, but we have to cut ties at some point, and I believe nature does a great job of encouraging this.
Rusty, that's pretty harsh. His 18th birthday was the big one, the day he officially became a man, and you chose that to make him clean his room? Obviously I don't know any backstory, but if I were him, I'd view that as having my dependence on you rubbed in my face at the worst possible time. Then I'd move out and hold it against you for a long, long time.

It's your relationship - I can't tell you what to do. I can only suggest that you sincerely apologize for making a show of force on his 18th birthday. Good luck, whatever you decide to do.

Asking to clean his room is harsh? Well you wouldn't have liked my mother.
Asking him to clean his room is not harsh. No eighteenth birthday party and rubbing his face in it is harsh.

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Re: "Spinning Off" my 20 Year Old Son

Post by pshonore » Wed Mar 26, 2014 2:50 pm

jj wrote:
pshonore wrote: No EIC if you're under 25 and do not have a qualifying child.
http://www.irs.gov/Individuals/EITC-Inc ... aw-Updates

Yes, must be age 25, but no qualifying child is required - although the AGI limits to qualify without a child are very low...
I believe my sentence says if you're under 25, you need a qualifying child. Do you disagree?

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Re: "Spinning Off" my 20 Year Old Son

Post by jlj » Wed Mar 26, 2014 2:59 pm

Stand solidly in his corner at least until he get his undergraduate degree.

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Re: "Spinning Off" my 20 Year Old Son

Post by plannerman » Wed Mar 26, 2014 3:29 pm

Good luck. I'm still trying to financially spin off my 44 year old son.

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Re: "Spinning Off" my 20 Year Old Son

Post by livesoft » Wed Mar 26, 2014 4:26 pm

I guess I got spun off when I was 18. I didn't even notice. I was not on my parent's auto insurance. I didn't have a car. I never went to a doctor. They didn't pay my college tuition. I filed my own taxes. I paid for my own phone. I don't know what they did on their tax return. And I stopped visiting them mostly because I couldn't afford the trip.

The OP's son may think he has already been spun off.

As for my oldest in college. She probably thinks she is spun off, too, even though she gets an allowance, health insurance, car insurance, and her phone paid for as well as some other benefits. I am unconcerned about all that as she wants to get out on her own financially because I am too controlling. :) That is, she thinks I don't give her enough money as it is.
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Re: "Spinning Off" my 20 Year Old Son

Post by donall » Wed Mar 26, 2014 7:32 pm

As a parent, emotional support should be forever.

Be gradual with the independence. This is best done after child receives a degree, unless child has independent source of funds and should be done in 6 month increments.
-Let child pay cell phone
-Put car in child's name (but buy car if one's budget allows)
-Let child pay car insurance
-Let child pay credit card
-Let child pay for everything

I think children need to mature first and that usually happens at about age 24.

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Re: "Spinning Off" my 20 Year Old Son

Post by Crimsontide » Wed Mar 26, 2014 7:46 pm

livesoft wrote:I guess I got spun off when I was 18. I didn't even notice. I was not on my parent's auto insurance. I didn't have a car. I never went to a doctor. They didn't pay my college tuition. I filed my own taxes. I paid for my own phone. I don't know what they did on their tax return. And I stopped visiting them mostly because I couldn't afford the trip.
+1. I didn't have no stinking 18th birthday party either :happy Kids these days....

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Re: "Spinning Off" my 20 Year Old Son

Post by Wannabe » Thu Mar 27, 2014 9:40 am

livesoft wrote:As for my oldest in college. She probably thinks she is spun off, too, even though she gets an allowance, health insurance, car insurance, and her phone paid for as well as some other benefits. I am unconcerned about all that as she wants to get out on her own financially because I am too controlling. :) That is, she thinks I don't give her enough money as it is.
I have a sibling who thinks this way, too. It's frustrating to many in the family.

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Re: "Spinning Off" my 20 Year Old Son

Post by sscritic » Thu Mar 27, 2014 9:58 am

Crimsontide wrote: +1. I didn't have no stinking 18th birthday party either :happy Kids these days....
Did you get a Quinceañera or a Sweet 16? How about a Bat Mitzvah? Anything to recognize you as an adult? It doesn't have to be at 18, just at some point in your life. What about a 40th birthday party?

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Re: "Spinning Off" my 20 Year Old Son

Post by Longdog » Thu Mar 27, 2014 10:09 am

Leesbro63 wrote:Here's one I've never seen on here. I am thinking about "spinning off" my 20 year old college Freshman (he'll be 20 soon and will complete his Freshman year...we held him back in Kindergarten). Due to gifting while he was a child, he has enough saved to pay his own way at least until he graduates from undergrad. He has his own car, now in my name, paid for, and I have a 529 account for him that pays his hard college expenses. He's currently on our health insurance but, as per my other thread, that could change.

I get it that I'll lose a $3900 tax deduction. What are the other benefits and consequences of doing this?
Are there any suitors, willing to pay a handsome sum of money, who may be interested in a merger with your spun-off asset? That could be a benefit to everyone! :happy
Steve

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gunn_show
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Re: "Spinning Off" my 20 Year Old Son

Post by gunn_show » Thu Mar 27, 2014 11:14 am

Leesbro63 wrote:I guess I didn't make this clear. It's not that I want to disown him. I am thinking about this from a liability perspective mainly. He would get his own car and health insurance. It's something that will happen in 3 years anyway. And if he got into a bind, of course we'd rescue him just as we would if he was technically still a "dependent".
didn't read all the replies, but as a former insurance guy, I would absolutely 100% get that car out of your name and into his sole name, like yesterday. if he gets in an accident today, you can be sued. this is a big mistake a lot of folks make and forget to fix as kids get older. you want as much crap in his name as possible. otherwise, I like the idea of spinning him off, there is nothing better for a kid IMHO. my parents did it to me when they let me live in the state school dorms (when they lived less than 10mi away), and then fully cut me off from financial help the summer after I graduated (I had multiple jobs all through college). nothing helped me grow up faster than to be on my own... all the while I knew my parents were there for me, and even today should something ever happen to me or a sibling...
"The best life hack of all is to just put the work in and never give up." Bas Rutten

TFinator
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Re: "Spinning Off" my 20 Year Old Son

Post by TFinator » Thu Mar 27, 2014 11:32 am

I graduated from school 2 years ago. I went to a UC ~12 miles from my parents house. Lived with my parents and commuted for a couple of years too..

It makes no difference to my parents whether I stay on their health care plan via my dad's work. So, I set up a repeating payment to them to help with the cost. They win, and I won. I won because the coverage was good and about 1/2 the price of the ACA for me. They won because their premium didn't change but they had me helping, so ~ $1,000 after tax income for them. I'll be sad when I no longer get their coverage this July...

For other finances. My parents tried to hide the burdens of finance and school from me as much as possible. I let them. I am a bit ashamed that I got to wait so long before facing the facts. I would have spent less money from 19-23 had I seen the costs of school, on campus housing, etc. Fortunately I still ended up on bogleheads w/in a year of graduation, so all is well. THat being said, looking back I wish i had known more. I encourage you to show your son exactly how you see the finances working out!

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Re: "Spinning Off" my 20 Year Old Son

Post by Crimsontide » Thu Mar 27, 2014 11:32 am

sscritic wrote:
Crimsontide wrote: +1. I didn't have no stinking 18th birthday party either :happy Kids these days....
Did you get a Quinceañera or a Sweet 16? How about a Bat Mitzvah? Anything to recognize you as an adult?
Come to think of it, I did get a nice letter from the Selective Service folks :happy

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Re: "Spinning Off" my 20 Year Old Son

Post by Ron » Thu Mar 27, 2014 11:33 am

sscritic wrote:
Crimsontide wrote: +1. I didn't have no stinking 18th birthday party either :happy Kids these days....
Did you get a Quinceañera or a Sweet 16? How about a Bat Mitzvah? Anything to recognize you as an adult? It doesn't have to be at 18, just at some point in your life. What about a 40th birthday party?
I received my draft notice (actually to report for my pre-draft physical) on Jan 20th. I turned 18 on Jan 3rd. I guess the government considered me an adult, even though voting age at that time was 21 :oops: .

And no, I never did get a birthday party (any year). Parents said my birthday was too close to Christmas . Today (at age 66), my birthday is just another day on the calendar.

BTW, I agree with the comments on having the car/insurance in the son's name. That's a great liability in todays "sue crazy" world. You could loose everything just because your son had a lapse in judgement. We did the same for our son when he turned 18.

- Ron
Last edited by Ron on Fri Mar 28, 2014 3:51 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Leesbro63
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Re: "Spinning Off" my 20 Year Old Son

Post by Leesbro63 » Thu Mar 27, 2014 11:36 am

Ron wrote: BTW, I agree with the comments on having the car/insurance in the son's name. That's a great liability in todays "sue crazy" world. You could loose everything just because your son had a lapse in judgement. We did the same for our son when he turned 18.

- Ron
My agent gave me good, I think, advice. She said that doing that...putting the car in the kid's name with his own separate insurance policy...adds a layer of protection. But it's still much weaker than would be the case for a non-relative. In the event of a tragedy, a good lawyer would sniff out every detail of the family relationship and try to make any possible connection to "support". And with the right jury, he/she might win. But separating the kid from the parent, financially, does add a layer of protection.
Last edited by Leesbro63 on Thu Mar 27, 2014 11:41 am, edited 1 time in total.

Rodc
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Re: "Spinning Off" my 20 Year Old Son

Post by Rodc » Thu Mar 27, 2014 11:37 am

sscritic wrote:
Crimsontide wrote: +1. I didn't have no stinking 18th birthday party either :happy Kids these days....
Did you get a Quinceañera or a Sweet 16? How about a Bat Mitzvah? Anything to recognize you as an adult? It doesn't have to be at 18, just at some point in your life. What about a 40th birthday party?
Alas no.

So I am left in my 50s wondering if I am an adult. :(

(well, my wife invited a few friends over for dinner on my 40th, and I ran a 3:39 marathon a couple of days later, I suppose as an initiation rite, so not all was lost...)

FWIW: The last thing I wanted at 18 was a parent sponsored party. I could throw my own party, no parental type adults invited or allowed! (I have long forgotten, but presume we had a cake after dinner)
We live a world with knowledge of the future markets has less than one significant figure. And people will still and always demand answers to three significant digits.

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Re: "Spinning Off" my 20 Year Old Son

Post by Confused » Thu Mar 27, 2014 12:12 pm

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Re: "Spinning Off" my 20 Year Old Son

Post by ShortInSeattle » Thu Mar 27, 2014 12:27 pm

Confused wrote:Dang, you people are nice. Either that or kids are hanging onto their parents longer these days? What's with all the "you're 20 now, so pay for your own cell phone"? Geez. You want a cell phone? Pay for it yourself. I left for college at age 17. It's true that my parents paid my apartment rent, of about $220/month Sept-April and $99/month May-Aug, but I paid for tuition, food, etc. I wwent and got a cell phone for myself when I needed it, at age 23. Why would a kid or teenager need their own phone?

Spin off your kid immediately, he's 20! Perhaps cover some major expenses while he's in school, so he can focus on his education and only work minimally, but stop coddling him.
Adolescence has been extended somewhat. You and I are relics of a different time. :)

To the OP, I think your plans are reasonable. Perhaps a graduated plan? This year you get your own cell phone, next year you get your own insurance....

I'm not sure I'd turn over a 529 plan in one go. Perhaps give him/her one year's worth of expenses and see how that goes before handing over the whole pile.

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Re: "Spinning Off" my 20 Year Old Son

Post by clubby » Thu Mar 27, 2014 10:40 pm

Holy cow, I was fighting wars on foreign soil when I was 18 and earning my own way. Who are these 20 year old college freshman and where do I sign up? :D Wait, 20 year old freshman? My son started high school this year as a 13 year old freshman.

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Re: "Spinning Off" my 20 Year Old Son

Post by carorun » Thu Mar 27, 2014 10:49 pm

clubby wrote:Holy cow, I was fighting wars on foreign soil when I was 18 and earning my own way. Who are these 20 year old college freshman and where do I sign up? :D Wait, 20 year old freshman? My son started high school this year as a 13 year old freshman.
I started high school at 13, and finished at 17. Except for turning 16 later, and not turning 21 till senior year of college, being younger wasn't so bad. Come to think of it, as a parent, you may like the decreased risk for driving and drinking later than his peers :D

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Re: "Spinning Off" my 20 Year Old Son

Post by desiderium » Thu Mar 27, 2014 11:10 pm

I'm for exposing him to reality. I agree with OP's position on maximally facilitating his education and being there in case of true need. However, I think it is hunger, or the fear of it, that drives us to think ahead, and do what is necessary to succeed.

My first born is graduating from a prestigious and expensive liberal arts college this year. He has received a great education, is well traveled, and has fantastic leadership and organizational skills. So far, he cant seem to grow out of the college adventure and bring himself to line up a job. I feel complicit in having removed all his need to worry about where the next meal is coming from these last 4 years.

I have been clear about the coming approach of reality. He is aware that his alternative is to come home and live in his old room, eating out of our fridge and drinking water. He would need to live by the schedule of hard working people who leave the house every morning and go to bed early during the week, and otherwise hone his skills as a pedestrian. It probably looks like a big come-down from college life, but it isn't disrespectful or cruel.

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