Should I sell my car?

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Mike8305
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Joined: Mon Oct 14, 2013 8:57 pm

Should I sell my car?

Post by Mike8305 »

Hello Everyone,



This is my first post as a Boglehead Forum member.

I am looking for some advice on what to do about my car.

I recently got married to my wife about 3 months ago.

We both work. Her commute is about 3 miles each way. She drives a 15 year old Infiniti which she owns (her father pays for the car insurance). My commute is 35 miles each way. I drive a 2007 Lexus ES 350 which I own (no car loan).

We live in Charlotte, NC. The public transportation here is decent and I can technically use the bus to get to work. Nevertheless, if I did this, my commute would be 90 minutes each way instead of 45 minutes each way. I'm estimating I would save about $30 to $40 per month in my gas expenses.

I'm also paying about $2000 per year with my car insurance. The $$ amount is high due to a minor accident I had with my car. Although it was my fault, there was no damage/injury to the other person or their car. The damage to my car affected my headlights/bumper.

The state of North Carolina also issues an annual tax in owning a vehicle if the vehicle is registered in NC, about $250 per year.

I also face a higher than normal amount of maintenance/repairs to my car. It's not that I am negligent with driving my car. I consider myself a fairly safe driver. However, it seems like there is always a maintenance issue whenever I bring my car in for my car in for normal servicing issues, like oil changes.

I'm getting ready to pull my hair out from all of the stress this car gives me.

Because of all of the factors above and the depreciation expense, I almost feel like selling my car, taking the bus to and from work and using my wife's car on the weekends.

My wife needs a new car. However, we will be looking for our first home to buy next year. I'm not sure if applying for a car loan is a smart idea when looking for homes and applying for a mortgage.

Does anyone have any suggestions as to what I should do?

Thank you for your input.
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bottlecap
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Re: Should I sell my car?

Post by bottlecap »

First, stop taking your car to the dealer. The maintenance issues should stop. Second, determine what an hour and a half extra of your life each day is worth. Then make the decision. I would never choose a 90 minute commute.

JT
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Watty
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Re: Should I sell my car?

Post by Watty »

Nevertheless, if I did this, my commute would be 90 minutes each way instead of 45 minutes each way. I'm estimating I would save about $30 to $40 per month in my gas expenses.
On an hourly basis you would not be making not anywhere close to minimum wage by taking the bus. Those times are also for a normal day and most likely several times a month there will be days when it takes much longer because of a missed bus or something.


If you decide to go with one car it would likely be better to keep your seven year old car and retire her 15 year old car.
Twins Fan
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Re: Should I sell my car?

Post by Twins Fan »

Doubling the commute time each day would not be worth it to me either. No way... 3 hours a day commuting!!

Try commuting by bus for a week or two to see if you could stand it before deciding to sell the car or not.

If you guys are planning to buy a house, that should be all you are saving and getting ready for. Get the house first and then see what kind of car payment you can take on, if any. Not the other way around.
Swampy
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Re: Should I sell my car?

Post by Swampy »

Hmmm, so you've been married three months?

Your wife is receiving economic aid from her dad for her car insurance?

You want to potentially save $200/month by getting rid of your car and increasing your commuting time from 7.5 hours a week to 15 hours a week?

You complain about additional maintenance issues when you get an oil change.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
First, it's time to be economically independent from the parents. Once you say your "I do's" it's time to strike out on your own and pay your own bills!

Second, adding 30 hours a month in commuting is a bad idea - period. It's even worse for a newlywed (If you want to stay married for long)!
Instead, keep the car and try to see if you can work an hour a day extra, if you must. You'll still come out better than a long commute.

Third, go somewhere else for your lube jobs. They're crooked salesmen trying to wring extra bucks out of you. I used to go to a place like that where they pulled the same nonsense on me time after time till I wised up.

If you feel compelled to get rid of a car, consider having your wife use public transportation instead as her commute is 1/12th of your commute. Honestly, either move closer to your work or find a job closer to your home. Long commutes are sheer lunacy. I know.
If I have seen further, it was by standing on the shoulders of giants.
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William4u
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Re: Should I sell my car?

Post by William4u »

I'd change car insurance companies, and get the legal minimum. Consumer Reports recommends shopping around every three years. I do this and get a much lower insurance rate as a result.
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fishnskiguy
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Re: Should I sell my car?

Post by fishnskiguy »

Mike8305 wrote: I also face a higher than normal amount of maintenance/repairs to my car. It's not that I am negligent with driving my car. I consider myself a fairly safe driver. However, it seems like there is always a maintenance issue whenever I bring my car in for my car in for normal servicing issues, like oil changes.

I'm getting ready to pull my hair out from all of the stress this car gives me.
That's why they call them stealerships.

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yatesd
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Re: Should I sell my car?

Post by yatesd »

One advantage of getting married is lower car insurance. Combine both policies and also gain independence. Make sure you drop collision from both policies. They should be cheap enough to throw away next time you have an accident. Throw the savings into your emergency fund.

Edit: especially with the bus as a temp backup
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Ged
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Re: Should I sell my car?

Post by Ged »

I wouldn't look to sell your car. 7 years to me is in the prime of the lifetime of a car. It's mostly depreciated yet young enough to be reliable. It sounds like it has been highly maintained as well. A Lexus should be very reliable.

Find other places to save money. Set up a budget etc. if you don't have one. Investigate insurance alternatives. Maybe see if either you or your wife can change jobs so the distance between workplaces is shorter. Ideally you want to find something close to where you want to buy a home.
chrisjul
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Re: Should I sell my car?

Post by chrisjul »

Don't sell it.. Find an indy mechanic….the 90 minute commute and losing control of your own mobility……….cannot be measured.

Smack yourself.
nordlead
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Re: Should I sell my car?

Post by nordlead »

Personally, I'd check to see if the Lexus demands expensive parts compared to a non-luxury vehicle. If so I'd sell it even though I do my own maintenance. Luxury cars tend to have very expensive parts for no other reason than being a luxury vehicle. However, I wouldn't sell it and significantly increase your commute time as it isn't worth it.

Now, what I would do is buy your wife an awesome bike. 3 miles is like 10 minutes of biking each way, excellent exercise and significantly cheaper. She can drop the gym membership if she has one. I wish I was 3 miles away from my work. We actually have a large population of bikers (both motor and bicycle actually) and some do come from 10 miles away, so I'm going to give it a go even though I'm 10 miles away and haven't biked that far in over 10 years now.

I would then sell both cars and buy a cheap reliable used car. Say a Honda Accord, or a Toyota Camry that is ~7 years old and buy it in cash. No comprehensive and start saving for a new car. The liability on my old Honda was ~$35/month (or $420/year) for I believe the maximum liability coverage. I now have comprehensive on my Forester since it is the only car I own (I own a motorcycle though), but I'm probably going to drop that next summer as my car savings is built up and the car value has come down.
Outer Marker
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Re: Should I sell my car?

Post by Outer Marker »

I'd keep both cars and find a good, independent mechanic as others have suggested; and shop around for better insurance. Is there something seriously wrong with the 15 year Infinity?

I used to bike commute when I lived with good access to bike path, and enjoyed it. But, there are plenty of hot, humid and rainy days when it is not practical. If you've got a bike friendly city its great, but if you have to drive on congested roads clogged by angry SUV and pickup drivers, not so much. I've had a few shouting matches with arrogant drivers who see no need to "share the road" with cyclists. I've discouraged my wife from bike commuting for this reason.
strafe
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Re: Should I sell my car?

Post by strafe »

nordlead wrote:Personally, I'd check to see if the Lexus demands expensive parts compared to a non-luxury vehicle. If so I'd sell it even though I do my own maintenance. Luxury cars tend to have very expensive parts for no other reason than being a luxury vehicle. However, I wouldn't sell it and significantly increase your commute time as it isn't worth it.

Now, what I would do is buy your wife an awesome bike. 3 miles is like 10 minutes of biking each way, excellent exercise and significantly cheaper. She can drop the gym membership if she has one. I wish I was 3 miles away from my work. We actually have a large population of bikers (both motor and bicycle actually) and some do come from 10 miles away, so I'm going to give it a go even though I'm 10 miles away and haven't biked that far in over 10 years now.

I would then sell both cars and buy a cheap reliable used car. Say a Honda Accord, or a Toyota Camry that is ~7 years old and buy it in cash. No comprehensive and start saving for a new car. The liability on my old Honda was ~$35/month (or $420/year) for I believe the maximum liability coverage. I now have comprehensive on my Forester since it is the only car I own (I own a motorcycle though), but I'm probably going to drop that next summer as my car savings is built up and the car value has come down.
His 2007 ES350 is essentially a 2007 Toyota Camry with a much nicer interior and different sheet metal. Under the hood they're the same.

Why on earth should he sell his 6 year-old Camry to buy a 7-year old one?

The problem is not the car, it's the dealer. ($100 to replace a $5 cabin filter in the gloebox. $200 for snake oil "throttle body cleaning." Flushes, bidets, the list goes on.) Oil changes are cheap because they're loss leaders for upselling unnecessary, overpriced services.
Dandy
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Re: Should I sell my car?

Post by Dandy »

I always had a long commute -- most years it was driving and unfortunately you get used to it. For the last 10 years before retirement I took the train (my car to the train, light rail from train to work). I actually liked the last 10 years of commuting by train. I wasn't fighting traffic and could relax and read the paper and have a cup of coffee. It was longer but less stressful -- most of the time. Being tied to a train or bus schedule can be annoying. Staying late at the office might mean a longer wait at the station etc.

The good thing it is not an irreversible decision. Try the bus for a month or two and see how you like the trade off.

As far as the Lexus - if you are using the dealer that might be why every time you change the oil you get nicked for other "repairs". You might want to sell it - it should get a decent amount (except for your accident). You can buy a cheaper new or used car to replace it if the bus commute doesn't work out.
killjoy2012
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Re: Should I sell my car?

Post by killjoy2012 »

strafe wrote:The problem is not the car, it's the dealer. ($100 to replace a $5 cabin filter in the gloebox. $200 for snake oil "throttle body cleaning." Flushes, bidets, the list goes on.) Oil changes are cheap because they're loss leaders for upselling unnecessary, overpriced services.
While there's no question that you're going to pay top dollar for dealership services, are you also suggesting that all manufacturer recommended maintenance is unnecessary? There's certainly different value propositions of DIY vs. local independent mechanic vs. the dealer, but to suggest that all maintenance is unnecessary (other than oil changes?) is a bit reckless.
Dandy
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Re: Should I sell my car?

Post by Dandy »

I certainly didn't want to suggest that all required maint from dealer is bad. But if you are taking a Lexus which usually has pretty good reliability ratings you shouldn't need a "extra services" that make you want to sell the car every time you get an oil change. Do I think dealers push services that aren't needed or aren't needed now? Why not? Most dealers are trying to get you for everything, whether your needed it or want it when they sell you the car -- so why would their service department be the paragon of virtue?

A recent purchase from a dealer was going very well - not much negotiation re price of car or trade in allowance. He wrote up the paperwork and pre printed was a few hundred dollars for "etching" with a notation that it was optional. My wife almost signed it until I spotted it and had it removed. The salesman said the dealership always recommends it. If the dealership does this type of tactic when it is in plain sight - do you think a non mechanic taking the car to that dealership should trust that the service department will just do what is really required? Not all salesmen or dealers are crooks -- but they can be mighty slippery.
nordlead
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Re: Should I sell my car?

Post by nordlead »

strafe wrote: His 2007 ES350 is essentially a 2007 Toyota Camry with a much nicer interior and different sheet metal. Under the hood they're the same.

Why on earth should he sell his 6 year-old Camry to buy a 7-year old one?

The problem is not the car, it's the dealer. ($100 to replace a $5 cabin filter in the gloebox. $200 for snake oil "throttle body cleaning." Flushes, bidets, the list goes on.) Oil changes are cheap because they're loss leaders for upselling unnecessary, overpriced services.
If i wasnt clear, I think I said I'd check to see if it has expensive parts. This is independent of the fact that that he is being hosed by the dealer/mechanic. I'm not an expert on Lexus, but I am aware Toyota makes them.

In general a luxury car will be more expensive to own all around (insurance and maintenance). If that isn't the case then stick with the lexus.

Obviously the op is concerned about cost, I just posted what I would do. It is his job to calculate cost of ownership, I'm not going to go look up part prices and insurance costs.
nanosour
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Re: Should I sell my car?

Post by nanosour »

I have a 2005 Lexus ES330 owned since Aug 05. In 8 years I haven't once taken it to the shop except for oil change at a local garage. I have literally done zero maintenance in 8 years and 80K miles with the exception of replacing the windshield wipers. I put Blizzak snow tires on every winter and just tossed the original tires that came with the car when I put the snow tires back on a couple weeks ago.

The Lexus was a great choice for me and hope to get another 8 years out of it.
karpems
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Re: Should I sell my car?

Post by karpems »

For some of us, reliability of a new car every three years is a must. Being in the medical field, the excuse of my car won't start does not work. I lease a new car every three years just for the peace of mind of knowing I won't have any issues.

I can usually find an AWD "luxury" car for zero down and less than $350 a month. Right now I have a Volvo, which I love...
Grt2bOutdoors
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Re: Should I sell my car?

Post by Grt2bOutdoors »

Mike8305 wrote:Hello Everyone,



This is my first post as a Boglehead Forum member.

I am looking for some advice on what to do about my car.



I also face a higher than normal amount of maintenance/repairs to my car. It's not that I am negligent with driving my car. I consider myself a fairly safe driver. However, it seems like there is always a maintenance issue whenever I bring my car in for my car in for normal servicing issues, like oil changes.

I'm getting ready to pull my hair out from all of the stress this car gives me.
Does anyone have any suggestions as to what I should do?

Thank you for your input.
How many miles do you have on your Lexus? What kind of issues?
Change the oil every 3 thousand miles. Change as the manufacturer recommends for radiator fluid, timing belt (if any) + water pump at the same time, change the car battery every 4 or 5 years - to prevent alternator failure, transmission fluid (if an automatic). Check your tire air pressure monthly. That should be it. The car will age and so will the original parts - but a car that is 6 years old should not need anything beyond oil and normal repair like brake pads.
"One should invest based on their need, ability and willingness to take risk - Larry Swedroe" Asking Portfolio Questions
Grt2bOutdoors
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Re: Should I sell my car?

Post by Grt2bOutdoors »

strafe wrote:
nordlead wrote:Personally, I'd check to see if the Lexus demands expensive parts compared to a non-luxury vehicle. If so I'd sell it even though I do my own maintenance. Luxury cars tend to have very expensive parts for no other reason than being a luxury vehicle. However, I wouldn't sell it and significantly increase your commute time as it isn't worth it.

Now, what I would do is buy your wife an awesome bike. 3 miles is like 10 minutes of biking each way, excellent exercise and significantly cheaper. She can drop the gym membership if she has one. I wish I was 3 miles away from my work. We actually have a large population of bikers (both motor and bicycle actually) and some do come from 10 miles away, so I'm going to give it a go even though I'm 10 miles away and haven't biked that far in over 10 years now.

I would then sell both cars and buy a cheap reliable used car. Say a Honda Accord, or a Toyota Camry that is ~7 years old and buy it in cash. No comprehensive and start saving for a new car. The liability on my old Honda was ~$35/month (or $420/year) for I believe the maximum liability coverage. I now have comprehensive on my Forester since it is the only car I own (I own a motorcycle though), but I'm probably going to drop that next summer as my car savings is built up and the car value has come down.
His 2007 ES350 is essentially a 2007 Toyota Camry with a much nicer interior and different sheet metal. Under the hood they're the same.

Why on earth should he sell his 6 year-old Camry to buy a 7-year old one?

The problem is not the car, it's the dealer. ($100 to replace a $5 cabin filter in the gloebox. $200 for snake oil "throttle body cleaning." Flushes, bidets, the list goes on.) Oil changes are cheap because they're loss leaders for upselling unnecessary, overpriced services.
You want to clean the throttle body? - Use brand name gasoline - like Shell, BP, Exxon, Chevron which have branded detergents in the gas intended to keep deposits down to a minimum. Still not satisfied, throw a can of Techron (find it at an auto parts chain) in the gas and drive the car. Your throttle body, fuel line, fuel tank, injectors have now been cleaned - and you should never ever have to do such a cleaning again! Change your own air filter - $20 at AutoZone - the dealer will charge you $50 for the same job and it takes less than 2 minutes to take out the old and put in the new.
"One should invest based on their need, ability and willingness to take risk - Larry Swedroe" Asking Portfolio Questions
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