Money and Happiness

Questions on how we spend our money and our time - consumer goods and services, home and vehicle, leisure and recreational activities
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gatorking
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Money and Happiness

Post by gatorking »

Article from Journal of Consumer Psychology: "If money doesn't make you happy, then you probably aren't spending it right."

http://dunn.psych.ubc.ca/files/2011/04/ ... hology.pdf
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soaring
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Post by soaring »

IMO money provides an opportunity to be happy but has nothing to do with happiness.
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Post by HomerJ »

"Money can't buy happiness, but it sure makes misery more comfortable."
staythecourse
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Post by staythecourse »

Johnathan Clement once wrote in one of his books that folks should spend money on memories and NOT material objects. That makes sense as the enjoyment of buying a new toy lasts for only a few weeks. Spending money on a vacation with the family to have memories that will last a lifetime is likely to produce more happiness.

Make sense to me.

Good luck.
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Post by Stonebr »

"I've been rich, and I've been poor. Honey, rich is better."

-- Old show business saying attributed to Mae West, Sophie Tucker, and others.
"have more than thou showest, | speak less than thou knowest" -- The Fool in King Lear
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Post by snyder66 »

Totally agree with staythecourse, although it certainly had been debated here before.
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gatorking
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Post by gatorking »

staythecourse wrote:Johnathan Clement once wrote in one of his books that folks should spend money on memories and NOT material objects. That makes sense as the enjoyment of buying a new toy lasts for only a few weeks. Spending money on a vacation with the family to have memories that will last a lifetime is likely to produce more happiness.

Make sense to me.

Good luck.
The authors go beyond that. From the abstract:
... we propose eight principles designed to help consumers get more happiness for their money. Specifically, we suggest that
consumers should (1) buy more experiences and fewer material goods; (2) use their money to benefit others rather than themselves; (3) buy many small pleasures rather than fewer large ones; (4) eschew extended warranties and other forms of overpriced insurance; (5) delay consumption; (6) consider how peripheral features of their purchases may affect their day-to-day lives; (7) beware of comparison shopping; and (8) pay close attention to the happiness of others.
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gatorking
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Post by gatorking »

soaring wrote:IMO money provides an opportunity to be happy but has nothing to do with happiness.
As the title suggests - it means "you probably aren't spending it right".
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Post by a »

Good article; it has new things to say.
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Post by ann_l »

Great article!
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Post by Triple digit golfer »

It's pretty simple. Money could make some people happy. It depends on how much the person values money or the things they could do with the money, as well as the situation causing the unhappiness. If my one year-old has a terminal illness, all the money in the world wouldn't make me happy.
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Re: Money and Happiness

Post by xerty24 »

gatorking wrote:"If money doesn't make you happy, then you probably aren't spending it right."
H&B usually do the trick.
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Post by Fallible »

staythecourse wrote:Johnathan Clement once wrote in one of his books that folks should spend money on memories and NOT material objects. That makes sense as the enjoyment of buying a new toy lasts for only a few weeks. Spending money on a vacation with the family to have memories that will last a lifetime is likely to produce more happiness.

Make sense to me.

Good luck.
Clements elaborated on happiness quite a bit in his book, "The Little Book of Main Street Money," including "Buy experiences, rather than things," "Count Your Blessings," "Find a purpose," etc. I think previous threads here have also talked about studies showing we should strive for things that can bring "sustainable happiness." All of these writings, including the one posted here today, seem to be getting back at the same things, which are achievable in the same or similar ways. I'm in agreement with just about all of them.

Then, too, there's that genetic happiness often described as a "general feeling of well-being or contentment" that some lucky people seem to have been born with, while others apparently can also achieve it but have to work a little harder at getting it.

Whatever, I enjoyed reading the report posted here and was happy to see the link. :)
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Post by Ed 2 »

soaring wrote:IMO money provides an opportunity to be happy but has nothing to do with happiness.
Money may not buy happiness, but it can buy you a yacht, and you can sail up real damn close ... :moneybag
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Post by Tyrobi »

Very nice article. I didn't know that a businessman named Frank McNamara in 1949 started up the whole "consume now and pay later" credit card industry after finding himself without any cash after a diner with his wife.

The authors pointed out that the “consume now and pay later” leads people to engage in shortsighted behavior and end up less well off—to rack up debts, to save little for retirement. Also, “consume now, pay later” is a bad idea because anticipation is a source of “free” happiness.

Conclusion: People who devote time to anticipating enjoyable experiences report being happier in general.
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Post by Christine_NM »

Interesting article. Thanks!
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Post by mlebuf »

Money may not have a lot to do with happiness, but poverty has one hell of a lot to do with unhappiness. It's not what money does for you, it's what it delivers you from.
Best wishes, | Michael | | Invest your time actively and your money passively.
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Post by Call_Me_Op »

soaring wrote:IMO money provides an opportunity to be happy but has nothing to do with happiness.
I'd say if it provides the opportunity, then it has something to do with it (by definition).
Best regards, -Op | | "In the middle of difficulty lies opportunity." Einstein
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Post by Opponent Process »

I think the fact that so many people choose to remain poor suggests that money is at best an accessory to happiness. many who specifically seek things like enlightenment and contentment will even take vows of poverty to get there faster with fewer distractions.
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Post by Fallible »

mlebuf wrote:Money may not have a lot to do with happiness, but poverty has one hell of a lot to do with unhappiness. It's not what money does for you, it's what it delivers you from.
This reminded me of something that Jonathan Clements (former Wall Street Journal columnist) said in his last book: "As people are lifted out of poverty and brought up to a fairly basic standard of living, their happiness can vastly increase. But after that, a lot of extra dollars don't necessarily buy a lot of extra happiness."
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Post by Ed 2 »

Fallible wrote:
"As people are lifted out of poverty and brought up to a fairly basic standard of living, their happiness can vastly increase. But after that, a lot of extra dollars don't necessarily buy a lot of extra happiness."
Yes and than after that comes extra stress .... what to do with all this money, bogleheads?
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Post by nisiprius »

mlebuf wrote:Money may not have a lot to do with happiness, but poverty has one hell of a lot to do with unhappiness. It's not what money does for you, it's what it delivers you from.
Right. It's all about the Maslow hierarchy of needs. The article is all about what you do when you're up there at the top of the pyramid in the "self-actualization" zone.

Image
Annual income twenty pounds, annual expenditure nineteen nineteen and six, result happiness; Annual income twenty pounds, annual expenditure twenty pounds ought and six, result misery.
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Post by nukephd »

It has to do with the the diminishing marginal utility of money. If you're interested, you can read up on utility functions. Here is a very short wikipedia excerpt on it: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Utility#Money

This reminds me of the article stating that after $75k, things don't get much better: http://blogs.wsj.com/wealth/2010/09/07/ ... 00-a-year/

Our ultimate goal in life is to be happy. People all-too-often lose sight of this.
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Post by LazyNihilist »

nukephd wrote: Our ultimate goal in life is to be happy. People all-too-often lose sight of this.
There is no goal/purpose in life. :wink:

Just be happy. :)
The strong do what they can and the weak suffer what they must -Thucydides
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Post by LazyNihilist »

Happiness is all about expectations.

If you expect too much out of something, then you are likely to be disappointed and unhappy if you don't achieve it.

But if you have lower expectations and achieve it, there are more chances that you will achieve it and be happy.
The strong do what they can and the weak suffer what they must -Thucydides
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Post by Random Musings »

On average, having money reduces stress in marital relationships. Allows you more choice with respect to health care. And so on..... Still comes down to how you feel about yourself and your life.

I do agree with life experiences over material items concept.

RM
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Post by Fallible »

nukephd wrote:It has to do with the the diminishing marginal utility of money. If you're interested, you can read up on utility functions. Here is a very short wikipedia excerpt on it: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Utility#Money

This reminds me of the article stating that after $75k, things don't get much better: http://blogs.wsj.com/wealth/2010/09/07/ ... 00-a-year/

Our ultimate goal in life is to be happy. People all-too-often lose sight of this.
Or, as Aristotle put it: “Happiness is the meaning and the purpose of life, the whole aim and end of human existence”
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Post by PaddyMac »

reminds me of a recent NPR Planet Money podcast on Happiness:

http://www.npr.org/blogs/money/2011/03/ ... -happiness

FWIW, I'm not of the camp that says vacations and the memories they give are worth more than stuff. I enjoy vacations (I'm on my third one this year) but I've had occasions to be very sick on vacation (Paris with broncisis, Barcelona with food poisoning) to know that you can end up wasting money on vacations that you're not well enough to enjoy due to bad luck.

However, whenever I buy some "thing" that I really want, I get lots of value from it, especially if its original art that I can look at every day etc. I also would rather spend money to learn a new skill in a workshop or class than go on vacation. So I think you have to know yourself. Some people enjoy stuff.
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Post by epilnk »

Having lived (quite happily) at a very wide range of income levels, I have come to believe that money can buy quite a lot of happiness. You do have to shop very carefully.
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Post by Curlyq »

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Last edited by Curlyq on Thu Oct 18, 2018 1:23 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Post by epilnk »

Curlyq wrote:In my teens, when I wanted something frivilous, my dad would say, "Where's your money?", and I would have to work and save for whatever I wanted and many times, never bought the item as the novelty of it wore off before I had enough money to buy it. Did I inherit this trait or was I taught this trait?
When my boys were ages 5 and 3 I started them on weekly allowances of 75 and 50 cents, then regularly brought them to the dollar store to spend it. At this age the dollar store is a mindboggling treasure trove of consumer choice with just about everything a preschool heart can desire - dart guns, mini flashlights, army tanks, giant bags of chips, foam swords, etc - and every bit of this vast wealth is within the reach of the preschooler who is able to save for two long, long weeks.
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Post by HongKonger »

As the girls in China say (with regards to their choice of future husbands):

It's better to cry in a Mercedes than smile on a bicycle.
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Post by jodydavis »

Curlyq wrote:This article reminds me of the somewhat famous "marshmallow" experiments with children that showed that those who could delay gratification and receive two marshmallows rather than eating one marshmallow right away, were also much better off financially when they reached their 30s. Those children who could not wait 15 minutes to get two marshmallows were in financial distress by the time they reached their 30s.
That is a classic experiment. Here's a video of some of the children in the experiment. Their expressions, while trying to resist the marshmallow, make me laugh every time:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6EjJsPylEOY

More generally, "The Happiness Hypothesis" by Jonathan Haidt does a nice job of summarizing the psychological research on happiness. Despite the kind of new-agey title, it's a very interesting read and corroborates many of the things people have already noted in this thread.
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Post by scrabbler1 »

Money bought me happiness by buying my way out of the misery I had associated with working - mainly, the commute. Being able to retire early (at age 45) and live off investment income since that began 3 years was all made possible by money.
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Post by chaz »

[quote="mlebuf"]Money may not have a lot to do with happiness, but poverty has one hell of a lot to do with unhappiness. It's not what money does for you, it's what it delivers you from.[/quote


Exactlly..
Chaz | | “Money is better than poverty, if only for financial reasons." Woody Allen | | http://www.bogleheads.org/wiki/index.php/Main_Page
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Post by Fallible »

jodydavis wrote:
Curlyq wrote:This article reminds me of the somewhat famous "marshmallow" experiments with children that showed that those who could delay gratification and receive two marshmallows rather than eating one marshmallow right away, were also much better off financially when they reached their 30s. Those children who could not wait 15 minutes to get two marshmallows were in financial distress by the time they reached their 30s.
That is a classic experiment. Here's a video of some of the children in the experiment. Their expressions, while trying to resist the marshmallow, make me laugh every time:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6EjJsPylEOY
This video great - I can't stop laughing. Thanks for post it.
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Re: Money and Happiness

Post by Valuethinker »

gatorking wrote:Article from Journal of Consumer Psychology: "If money doesn't make you happy, then you probably aren't spending it right."

http://dunn.psych.ubc.ca/files/2011/04/ ... hology.pdf
Every so often someone posts here a truly useful link.

Thank you.
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