Grrr....why do new cars not have spare tires?

[texasdiver]

This enrages me.

I have a 2016 Prius that came without a spare, just a silly useless inflating tire patch kit. Back when I first bought it 9 years ago I went to Discount Tire and bought a full-size spare on a cheap rim and then tore out all the foam in the bottom of the cargo area and mounted the spare there just in case. Took me a long time to customize the cargo area to accept a full size spare but finally got it installed to my satisfaction and it has been there ever since.

This past weekend I was using the car to drive my daughter back to college at WSU in Pullman WA. We live in Vancouver WA so that is a 350 mile drive each way in winter through some exceedingly remote territory in eastern Washington. In route I had a rear tire blow out. The inside sidewall completely blew out on I-84 going through Hood River on a Sunday morning so the tire was in two pieces and completely unrepairable. The tires were a 1-year old set of Michelin CrossClimate 2 tires with only about 10,000 miles on them. They are also an odd size since this sport touring version of the Prius came with 215/45/R17 tires. No tire shops were open in Hood River on a Sunday morning. Luckily I had the full size spare to put on but after that experience I didn't really want to continue driving another 600 miles yesterday without a spare. We got the tires at Costco and the nearest Costco in route was in the Tri Cities so I dropped the tire off at Costco in Kennewick when they opened for a warranty replacement (luckily they had the correct size in stock) and continued to Pullman on the spare crossing my fingers since without an appointment it was going to be 4 hours until they could get it fixed. I drove the remaining 600 miles on the spare without issue and picked the replacement tire up from Costco on the way back so at least I had a spare for the last 200 miles.

Without a spare this entire trip would have been a complete disaster since I would have been unable to find a replacement tire within 50 miles on a Sunday morning. And there was no way to fix it. Probably would have had to spend the night in Hood River and get a replacement tire put on this morning. Or maybe just buy a whole new replacement wheel in the more common stock size of 195/65R15. So my daughter would have been missing her first day of class and I'd be missing a day of work unless I managed to rent a replacement car in Hood River to finish the trip yesterday.

In any event, we are about to hand this car down to my daughter and buy a new EV to replace it and once again, none of the cars we are looking at have spare tires. We are probably leaning at a Tesla Model 3 and of course they come with no spare so I'll be spending $400 for a donut spare and jack (Teslas don't come with those either... Sheesh). At least there are aftermarket options: https://modernspare.com/product/2017-20 ... t-options/ but I have to wonder about driving 700 miles on a donut spare since that is what I put on my regular spare yesterday.

In any event, I'm curious what the real logic is behind no longer putting spares on new cars and how many others of you are doing what I do and buying your own spares anyway?

[MrJones]

As to why, here's my understanding:

1. Flats are far less frequent than even three decades ago.

2. Alternate solutions (like the can) exist for these rare events. They shave off some weight

3. Some EVs are too heavy to lift using a jack (battery weight), so a tow is the best option

[Uniballer]

My newer RAV4 has a spare. Your Prius does not because carrying a spare lowers the MPG, and that is what Prius is all about..

[bobn60014]

Weight reduction for better MPG. You can always buy a spare and throw it in the trunk.

[stan1]

EPA/DoT corporate average fuel economy requirements (CAFE).

One of the easiest ways to improve fuel economy is to lower the weight of the car, thus runflats and no spare.

Runflats have come a long way.

[the_wiki]

EPA/DoT corporate average fuel economy requirements (CAFE).

One of the easiest ways to improve fuel economy is to lower the weight of the car, thus runflats and no spare.

Runflats have come a long way.

Sure, but a spare and jack is like 50-60lbs combined. Can't be more than a decimal rounding space of fuel economy.

[texasdiver]

EPA/DoT corporate average fuel economy requirements (CAFE).

One of the easiest ways to improve fuel economy is to lower the weight of the car, thus runflats and no spare.

Runflats have come a long way.

This is what my tire looked like yesterday. Run flats going to fix this? Could I have done 700 miles on run flats through eastern Washington yesterday?

[NHRATA01]

Quite a number of things I'm sure.

1. Cost to the mfg
2. Most people don't know how to change a tire anymore (or know where the proper jack points on a unibody car are) and would rather call roadside assistance
3. Many people who do know how to change a tire ignore the fact you're not supposed to drive on a donut for more that 50 miles at ~ 55mph
4. Many more people who know how to change a tire don't know that (in most cases) you're not supposed to put a donut on a drive wheel period since it is a smaller diameter and in time will overheat the differential due to different rotational speeds. AWD cars may also be specific on which corner is supposed to get the donut but who reads their owner's manual (and furthermore who supplies hard copy owners manuals now, GM doesn't).
5. Most donuts don't have a TPMS sensor which is a liability issue for the manufacturer now
6. Most people don't check the pressure in their spares, adding to above liability
7. Most people don't change out their spares every ~8 years either as tires have an expiration
8. Less weight which helps fuel economy numbers
9. Most of the luxury cars have switched to run flats
10. Cost to the mfg

[psteinx]

My son (then about 20 y.o.) had a huge blowout on one of his tires (maybe 4-5" long). He was around a metro area and could perhaps have called for help. But I had taught all of my kids how to change a tire as part of their teen driving instructions, and all of our vehicles, to date, have had spares.

I'm not saying lack of a spare would absolutely disqualify a potential purchase vehicle for me, but yeah, it's meaningful to me.

[psteinx]

As for the OP's question - why cars don't have them.

Some combination of:

Cost of the spare & jack
Weight of the spare & jack
Trunk space consumption of the spare & jack
Tires probably last longer
Most folks have cell phones with good coverage and can call for service much more easily than a generation ago

[psteinx]

Final note:

In cold weather, remind your kids to have warm gear (winter coat, etc), appropriate to the weather. Yes, the inside of the car may heat up nicely, but emergencies do occur so you want to be prepared for outside.

Also, the other usual car-emergency preparedness stuff:

First aid kit
Paper map(s)
Thin emergency blanket
A bit of cash
Flashlight

[Gort]

Weight reduction for better MPG. You can always buy a spare and throw it in the trunk.

If the trunk is open to the occupants (like in a SUV) make sure you secure the spare so it doesn't become a flying object in case of a crash.

[flyingcows]

Neither of our cars came with spare tires or places to put them, I bought a used full sized wheel and had a tire mounted to it...the few times we take a road trip I strap it down in the trunk with tools. However that takes up a lot of space in the trunk, thus I only have it in the car when the car is taken on long journeys, which is not often, I don't need it in the car 99% of the time

I will say the only tire issues I've had in the past 20 years have been slow puncture leaks, and in those cases I never even needed to use tire slime...I just filled up the tire with the air compressor and tires mostly self sealed the leak long enough to drive the car to a tire shop in town. My car had a TPMS sensor that takes continuous readings so I could monitor the actual tire pressure during the drive

I'm also about to buy kid a new Honda CRV Hybrid which doesn't have a spare or a place to put one, I might get a skinny spare that she could leave in the car at all times, but I'd really prefer to get a full size spare...I realize that would be much heavier and would take up a ton of space (and it's heavier, I get it), especially if it's going to be in there all the time, but I also have concerns about driving on a skinny spare too

[murkyfuture]

EPA/DoT corporate average fuel economy requirements (CAFE).

One of the easiest ways to improve fuel economy is to lower the weight of the car, thus runflats and no spare.

Runflats have come a long way.

This is what my tire looked like yesterday. Run flats going to fix this? Could I have done 700 miles on run flats through eastern Washington yesterday?

Hmmm, the Prius is made by Toyota, but the picture shows a Honda rim.

Either way, that looks like a catastrophic failure due to a defect or crashing into a curb or massive pothole. Cars occasionally have catastrophic failures that leave motorist stranded, either from a crash or parts failure. It's part of life.
As catastrophic failures go, a flat tire is far easier to fix than a cracked rim, broken suspension, or engine/transmission failure.

[gotoparks]

I've never heard of a car or truck without a spare. I've never been in the market for an EV so it sounds like a thing with them. I just had a nail in the tire and had to use my spare.

[texasdiver]

This is what my tire looked like yesterday. Run flats going to fix this? Could I have done 700 miles on run flats through eastern Washington yesterday?

Hmmm, the Prius is made by Toyota, but the picture shows a Honda rim.

Either way, that looks like a catastrophic failure due to a defect or crashing into a curb or massive pothole. Cars occasionally have catastrophic failures that leave motorist stranded, either from a crash or parts failure. It's part of life.
As catastrophic failures go, a flat tire is far easier to fix than a cracked rim, broken suspension, or engine/transmission failure.

That wasn't my tire. I didn't bother to take a pic of my tire. that was a google image I found of what my tire looked like. The entire sidewall was blown through like that all around the tire so it was actually in two separate pieces.

[texasdiver]

I've never heard of a car or truck without a spare. I've never been in the market for an EV so it sounds like a thing with them. I just had a nail in the tire and had to use my spare.

There is a whole aftermarket of companies that now make compact spares and jack kits for EVs that don't come with them. Will cost you about $400 and then you have to figure out where to put it in your car. Here is one that is recommended on the Tesla Redit forums: https://modernspare.com/

[watchnerd]

My 2023 Bronco Sport has a spare.

[chuckwalla]

How old was the blown tire? Dry rotted tires can separate like that.

[Vinny_in_NJ]

I bought a Hyundai Tucson around August 2024 and the lower end had no spare but the next level up did so I payed some extra money to get the slightly higher level.

I have had flats, hit something on the road and an unseen pothole and had a tire unusable. If you're around your home, maybe not a big deal but in places not too close it could be an issue. I'm not one to drive forever on a spare but it can get you somewhere vs nowhere.

BTW, I asked the salesperson and his answer was for MPG, I'm sure profit is there as well.

[AllMostThere]

We have a spare on our 2011 Traverse that is mounted underneath at rear of vehicle. Your post got me thinking that I have never dropped it down or even checked the air pressure. I would bet it is rusted in place. Looks like I'll have a project come this spring when the weather breaks. Luckily for us is that this vehicle is just a local traveler so always within quick range of AAA to tow us home where I can address a blowout in my driveway. Others may not have this luxury, so checking status of your spare is recommended. Purchasing a vehicle without a spare for any amount of distance travel is a serious no go in my book.

[neilpilot]

I've never heard of a car or truck without a spare. I've never been in the market for an EV so it sounds like a thing with them. I just had a nail in the tire and had to use my spare.

My 2021 EV came without a spare. But so did my 2016 ICE. In both cases I purchased a cheap spare on eBay ($100-125).

When the EV had a puncture, I was able to inflate it and get to a tire shop but it wasn't repairable and a replacement was 2-4 day delivery. I was able to have them mount my spare and drive while waiting for the replacement. If I didn't have a spare, my car would have been parked for days.

[texasdiver]

How old was the blown tire? Dry rotted tires can separate like that.

1-2 year old set of Michelin Cross Climate 2 tires bought from Costco. The tire had 6/32 of tread on it when they measured for the warranty replacement.

So modern newish tire that was in no way worn out.

[sailaway]

It also means no one can help when this girl opens up her trunk and doesn't find a jack in there with the spare tire...

[StrangePenguin]

I've never heard of a car or truck without a spare. I've never been in the market for an EV so it sounds like a thing with them. I just had a nail in the tire and had to use my spare.

There is a whole aftermarket of companies that now make compact spares and jack kits for EVs that don't come with them. Will cost you about $400 and then you have to figure out where to put it in your car. Here is one that is recommended on the Tesla Redit forums: https://modernspare.com/

My plug-in hybrid also doesn't have a spare. I thought about trying to buy one aftermarket for road trips and eventually gave up.

If this is indeed mostly an EV/hybrid phenomenon (I'm not sure), then I suspect it has a lot to do with trunk space. The batteries are big and every cubic inch not used for something else is space that can be used to make the battery (and thus the range) a bit bigger.

[chuckwalla]

1-2 year old set of Michelin Cross Climate 2 tires bought from Costco. The tire had 6/32 of tread on it when they measured for the warranty replacement.

So modern newish tire that was in no way worn out.

There are quite a few posts on internet of Michelin quality going down causing unexpected blowouts. This seems to be one of those cases.

[TOM1964]

I just picked up my new VW Golf R last week, no spare or foam insert under the cargo floor to hold the tools, just a subwoofer! Maybe that’s another clue that I’ve purchased a car intended for a younger demographic.

As far as I know, the EU still requires at least a compact spare. All the parts you need, including the spare, are available from specialist “enthusiast” sites that trade in European-market parts. I bought the spare and foam tool holder for $350, but it’s back ordered until March. I guess a lot of other people wanted a spare too.

And I’m running Michelin Cross-Climate tires too, just like the OP, but 235/40-18. I hope that was a one-off, I really like them so far.

[TOM1964]

This is what my tire looked like yesterday. Run flats going to fix this? Could I have done 700 miles on run flats through eastern Washington yesterday?

Hmmm…that is not a Michelin Cross Climate…

[texasdiver]

This is what my tire looked like yesterday. Run flats going to fix this? Could I have done 700 miles on run flats through eastern Washington yesterday?

Hmmm…that is not a Michelin Cross Climate…

That isn't the actual tire. I didn't bother to take a picture of it before dropping it at Costco. That is just a random internet pic showing what the blow-out was like. It split at the sidewall all around the tire just like that.

[Sprucebark]

EPA/DoT corporate average fuel economy requirements (CAFE).

One of the easiest ways to improve fuel economy is to lower the weight of the car, thus runflats and no spare.

Runflats have come a long way.

This is what my tire looked like yesterday. Run flats going to fix this? Could I have done 700 miles on run flats through eastern Washington yesterday?

Honda hub caps on a Toyota Prius?

When looking at new cars recently, the hybrid version of the CRV did not come with a spare while the regular gas version did. This was due to weight / space concerns as the hybrid has a big battery in the back.

[gavinsiu]

It's probably the same reason that Apple has stop shipping AC adapter for iphones. It's courage to save corporate expense . They save the cost of tire and passing the buck to you.

I have to disagree about newer cars having less flats. The current trend, probably started by BMW, or having low profile tires probably result in more flats.

[FIRWYW]

OP. I feel your pain. Although I had not had a flat tire (away from discovery of a nail in the tire in the garage) for 26 years and so was not worried when I bought a car without a spare, it got me 2 years ago. Had to hike a couple miles to get cell phone coverage (after just completing a 14 mile day hike) and then call my wife who had to drive 3 hours to pick me up and take me to a shop.

That being said, one time in 26 years so won’t worry for the future. Did learn that those repair kits are a joke on car tires. Tiny hole but the sealant did nothing.

(And yes, as others have said, it is the weight and in the case of EVs and PHEVs, the spare would take away areas the battery is in)

[LadyGeek]

n any event, I'm curious what the real logic is behind no longer putting spares on new cars and how many others of you are doing what I do and buying your own spares anyway?

To keep this discussion actionable, do you have a spare tire for your own car? If not, did you purchase a spare?

[tarheel91]

Remarkable thoughts.

[texasdiver]

n any event, I'm curious what the real logic is behind no longer putting spares on new cars and how many others of you are doing what I do and buying your own spares anyway?

To keep this discussion actionable, do you have a spare tire for your own car? If not, did you purchase a spare?

The problem is that many modern cars come with no spares.

The actionable part beyond the rant is what do people do about that? As the OP I have bought my own spares and they have been invaluable. Curious what others have done or are doing.

It is all theoretical until suddenly it isn't as I discovered yesterday.

[Kagord]

Because we have cell phones now.

[TheGiantess]

We bought a,Honda HRV 2024 last year and it has a spare. We made sure to ask about that. The sales person said that the only gas powered car they sell that doesn't have one was one of their sedan sport models that has some kind of special tire. I would not buy one without but that's just me.
TG

[enad]

New cars often lack a spare tire primarily because of the weight and space it takes up, which can negatively impact fuel efficiency and cargo capacity; manufacturers are increasingly removing them to meet stricter fuel economy standards and optimize vehicle design, often replacing them with a tire sealant kit or relying on roadside assistance instead.

Perhaps a letter campaign to your congressmen asking them to legislate that all vehicles have at the very least a donut spare tire with room for a full size could help. I tried putting a full size spare in my 2011 model vehicle and could not, so I have the donut, and a tire kit that includes a tire sealant as well as a compressor.

[Sprucebark]

n any event, I'm curious what the real logic is behind no longer putting spares on new cars and how many others of you are doing what I do and buying your own spares anyway?

To keep this discussion actionable, do you have a spare tire for your own car? If not, did you purchase a spare?

In the first paragraph of OPs post he says he went to discount tire and bought a spare since the car didn’t come
with one and cut out the foam in the back and manually made room to store the spare.

[criticalmass]

The problem with fix a flat sprays is they permanently change the tire, may void the warranty, and can greatly shorten tire life, while making it hard to balance as the junk shifts around inside.
It’s good for an emergency situation where getting going immediately is more important than using the tire again.

The National Highway Traffic Safety Administration writes the Federal Motor Vehicle Safety Standards and already has Congressional authority to regulate spare tires, if they wanted to.

Use caution with flat tire sprays. I agree that a full size spare is far better for long trips, especially beyond easy range of roadside assistance. That reminds me I need to inspect and check pressure on mine.

[just frank]

I felt similar, and put a donut spare in my first care without a spare... never needed it.

My next car without a spare, I just got a $15 plug kit instead. 6 mos later I picked up a nail (and a steady leak) on a roadtrip, diagnosed mid return leg, 150 miles from home. Used the plug kit to fix the hole in about 5 minutes, reinflated the tire in 5 more minutes and was on my way. I have since put several years and another 30k miles on that tire and plug.

Now I have a plug kit and inflator in every car, and figure I will 'deal' if I have a rare event that the plug can't fix.

Rare events happen, but sometimes precautions to prevent rare events are not 'worth it'.

[WhyNotUs]

My next car without a spare, I just got a $15 plug kit instead. 6 mos later I picked up a nail (and a steady leak) on a roadtrip, diagnosed mid return leg, 150 miles from home. Used the plug kit to fix the hole in about 5 minutes, reinflated the tire in 5 more minutes and was on my way. I have since put several years and another 30k miles on that tire and plug.

I was with you until you kept driving it. I have the inflator kit and plug kit but then get a new tire in the rare instance this happens (once in about 20 years).

[Cletus Davenport]

The answer to all your questions is “money”.

Car makers save money by not giving you a spare.

The rationalizations are more complex. Tesla said at one point that they omit them, because 95% of all cars traded in, have the original spare tire in the trunk in new condition. I.e. spare tires just don’t get used.

Honestly, in my 40 years of driving, I’ve only ever had 1 flat on the road. Had a few more at home.

I’m 100% with you though. I want a full size spare tire in all my cars.

[FreemanB]

In the last 25 years, my wife or I have had several issues with flat tires, including:

1. Wife's car tire basically fell apart going down the road.(Don't ask me how long she probably drove with it flat) Result: Changed to spare and continued on.
2. Flat tire on the interstate, then the key for the lock nut broke. Result: Had to be towed to dealership and lug nut chiseled off.
3. Hit a huge pothole(Filled with water in the dark, so almost invisible), popping both right side tires. Result: Towed to tire repair shop.
4. Wife found a flat tire while parked in a parking garage(Based on paint, then she may have scraped/bumped a corner): Result: Changed to spare and drove home.
   [*} Slow leak in wife's tire caused by nail. Result: Detected by TPMS system, re-inflated at home and drove to shop for repair.
5. Low pressure caused by improperly installed TPMS sensor. Result: Sensor warned me ahead of time, re-inflated and took it to a shop to get fixed.
6. Slow leak after wife scraped/bumped/something a curb, I think. Result: Sensor warned her it was low, re-inflated and eventually took to a shop to get fixed.
7. Multiple flat tires after wife ran over a curb, a concrete parking bumper thingy, whatever they are called. And some trees. Result: Towed to a shop.

There's probably others that I've forgotten. I was surprised when we first got vehicles without spare tires, but I realized that they had rarely actually been useful to us. With the continuous monitoring provided by vehicles now, only actual failures are really going to be an issue, and those have been rare enough not to concern me. If we lived in a rural area and frequently drove long, uninhabited stretches, I would probably consider having one, but our suburban neighborhood means we're never far from anything. My wife's driving is a much bigger worry, but there's not really anything I can do about that

[fogalog]

To keep this discussion actionable, do you have a spare tire for your own car? If not, did you purchase a spare?

The problem is that many modern cars come with no spares.

The actionable part beyond the rant is what do people do about that? As the OP I have bought my own spares and they have been invaluable. Curious what others have done or are doing.

It is all theoretical until suddenly it isn't as I discovered yesterday.

BMW has been using run flat tyres on their cars for 10+ years. The sidewalls are very stiff and a little thicker. They work very well though for all but really catastrophic failures. I don’t like them because they are expensive, noisy and very hard.

I purchased a “space saver” spare for my wife’s X5 when they started removing the spare and - worse, IMHO - removed the space below the trunk.

Neither of our current cars have spares, they both have run flats. So I also have a AAA membership for the whole family, just in case.

[simplesimon]

The actionable part beyond the rant is what do people do about that? As the OP I have bought my own spares and they have been invaluable. Curious what others have done or are doing.

I go with what the manufacturers gave me. In the case of the 2019 Honda CRV, there is a spare. In the case of the 2022 Toyota Sienna there is not.

[cubs1999]

I was thinking about making a thread about what one does if one gets a flat nowadays with no spare. I have been casually looking at several car models that don't have a spare. All my cars so far have had spares, and I've had several flats that were resolved by calling AAA and having the spare put on.

I was going to ask what the protocol is when you get a flag with no spare. It seems the with AAA, I call them and get towed to a tire shop, in my case the nearest Discount Tire where I have been buying all my tires as of late?

As mentioned here, I know some cars come with a can of tire slime but I've read that those can destroy the TMPS and shops often can't/won't repair the tire with that stuff in there. Others carry a plug kit, but I am not handy and then there's the issue that Discount Tire won't repair tired with a plug repair in it. (There was a long thread on the Bobistheoilguy forums who plugged his tire and the. Couldn't get it repaired there bc of the plug (The jist of it is that the proper repair by the tire association is to have a plug/patch and for liability reasons, they won't touch a tire with the unsanctioned plug only repair).

I guess the answer again is a tow to the repair shop if I get one of these no spare cars after my clunkers are eventually finished. On a road trip, this might be bad as the OP suggested, especially if a replacement tire isn't in stock and has to be ordered.

[lazydavid]

If this is indeed mostly an EV/hybrid phenomenon (I'm not sure), then I suspect it has a lot to do with trunk space. The batteries are big and every cubic inch not used for something else is space that can be used to make the battery (and thus the range) a bit bigger.

It is decidedly not an EV/hybrid phenomenon. I have 4 ICE vehicles, and none of them came with a spare. The last car we had with one was a 2007 Lexus. My parents' last 3 cars did not come with one either. Now, 2 of those were hybrids, but the non-hybrid versions of the same vehicles also did not have a spare, so we can't blame it on that.

[LadyGeek]

A few months ago, I tore through the sidewall of my passenger side front tire. My fault, I didn't take a turn as sharply as I could have. I was at nearly at my destination, pulled into the parking lot, and changed out the spare.

This was an instant flat with no possibility of repair. The only fun part was that a few guys came over asking if I needed help. It was a bit tough to yank the tire off the axle, so I got one guy to do that. The rest of the replacement was no sweat. The guys asked if I needed more help. Nope. I got this, thanks.

If this happens again, I'll know that I can hit the tire a lot harder than I was doing. BTW, I removed the lug nuts with impact force. Just jump on the tire iron to loosen the nuts. Works fine.

Tip: If you do have a spare, be very sure that it's up to pressure. I had just checked it the week before and I'm glad I did. It was low. I topped it off to the recommended 60 psi.

[lazydavid]

Tip: If you do have a spare, be very sure that it's up to pressure. I had just checked it the week before and I'm glad I did. It was low. I topped it off to the recommended 60 psi.

I'm assuming this was a temporary "donut" spare? I've never seen a full-size tire on a car/SUV with a recommended pressure anywhere near 60 psi. Mine are just over half that.