New Laptop Questions

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OldSport
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New Laptop Questions

Post by OldSport »

Want to get a new laptop ahead of the Windows 10 sunset.

Currently have an 2016/2017 HP Envy with 7th generation Core i7, 16GB RAM, that is still going strong.

I'm debating between a new HP Spectre x360 with Ulta 7, 32GB Ram, and OLED screen or an HP Elitebook 1040 x360 with 1365u processor, 32GB ram and a good IPS (non OLED) screen.

Any thoughts on which machine is a better long term replacement?
unix_joe
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Re: New Laptop Questions

Post by unix_joe »

The Elitebook is better long-term. Not only is it IPS, but it's a different class of machine designed for durability and user-replacable parts.
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MH2
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Re: New Laptop Questions

Post by MH2 »

OldSport wrote: Thu Feb 08, 2024 11:12 pm Want to get a new laptop ahead of the Windows 10 sunset.

Currently have an 2016/2017 HP Envy with 7th generation Core i7, 16GB RAM, that is still going strong.

I'm debating between a new HP Spectre x360 with Ulta 7, 32GB Ram, and OLED screen or an HP Elitebook 1040 x360 with 1365u processor, 32GB ram and a good IPS (non OLED) screen.

Any thoughts on which machine is a better long term replacement?
MacBook.

Otherwise stick to used Lenovo Thinkpads. Guessing that ones with Ryzen CPUs should be hitting their end of corporate lease cycle.

Edit: As far as HP, stay away from both.
Parkinglotracer
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Re: New Laptop Questions

Post by Parkinglotracer »

Just got a new MacBook Air 15” M2 from Best Buy for 1K. Really like it.
Yarlonkol12
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Re: New Laptop Questions

Post by Yarlonkol12 »

Neither, Id get a Macbook
My posts are for entertainment purposes only.
biscuit5
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Re: New Laptop Questions

Post by biscuit5 »

Personally would avoid any non-OLED screen. Picked up another laptop over the holiday on sale and the screen (non-OLED) was like looking thru cellophane. It was god awful. Returned it. Years back never had this issue.
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Re: New Laptop Questions

Post by bob60014 »

OldSport wrote: Thu Feb 08, 2024 11:12 pm Want to get a new laptop ahead of the Windows 10 sunset.
To be clear, if staying with Windows, you will be looking at WIN 11 laptop?
Vinny_in_NJ
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Re: New Laptop Questions

Post by Vinny_in_NJ »

Depending on what your doing on the laptop spending a lot of money on one is a waste of money for most people. My wife has an older, I think 6 YO, lower end HP laptop running Windows 10 and it is fine especially after I put a SSD drive in it. What happens when Windows 10 is no longer supported, if need be buy another lower end laptop. Hers is an I3 with maybe 6 Gb memory and a 1 TB SSD drive. My computer is a desktop with more power but I play around in photography so it is set up for that.

If you need to do things like video or photo editing then you need something more substantial but most people don't need a fully spec'd machine.
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OldSport
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Re: New Laptop Questions

Post by OldSport »

unix_joe wrote: Thu Feb 08, 2024 11:52 pm The Elitebook is better long-term. Not only is it IPS, but it's a different class of machine designed for durability and user-replacable parts.
Thanks. This is helpful. The Elitebook also has a better included warranty with the base product price, with on site service, but that probably means a lower probability of actually needing the warranty.
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OldSport
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Re: New Laptop Questions

Post by OldSport »

bob60014 wrote: Fri Feb 09, 2024 6:47 am
OldSport wrote: Thu Feb 08, 2024 11:12 pm Want to get a new laptop ahead of the Windows 10 sunset.
To be clear, if staying with Windows, you will be looking at WIN 11 laptop?
Yes, wanting a Windows 11 machine.
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OldSport
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Re: New Laptop Questions

Post by OldSport »

biscuit5 wrote: Fri Feb 09, 2024 6:12 am Personally would avoid any non-OLED screen. Picked up another laptop over the holiday on sale and the screen (non-OLED) was like looking thru cellophane. It was god awful. Returned it. Years back never had this issue.
I noticed this too, on the lower end laptops the screen is rubbish. The current "Envy" line appears to have gone way downhill since I bought mine. The current Envy only has lousy 250 nit IPS screens, which is worse than my 330 nit screen. The Spectre OLED look nice, but the Elitebook had a very decent 500 nit IPS screen, which is much better than the Envy IPS screen.
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OldSport
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Re: New Laptop Questions

Post by OldSport »

MH2 wrote: Fri Feb 09, 2024 5:03 am
OldSport wrote: Thu Feb 08, 2024 11:12 pm Want to get a new laptop ahead of the Windows 10 sunset.

Currently have an 2016/2017 HP Envy with 7th generation Core i7, 16GB RAM, that is still going strong.

I'm debating between a new HP Spectre x360 with Ulta 7, 32GB Ram, and OLED screen or an HP Elitebook 1040 x360 with 1365u processor, 32GB ram and a good IPS (non OLED) screen.

Any thoughts on which machine is a better long term replacement?
MacBook.

Otherwise stick to used Lenovo Thinkpads. Guessing that ones with Ryzen CPUs should be hitting their end of corporate lease cycle.

Edit: As far as HP, stay away from both.
Thanks, but we are not Mac people. I love Lenovo, and have a Lenovo laptop that I heavily use for gaming, media, etc. It is excellent. However, this laptop we will be using as our primary machine where we do taxes and other activities with very sensitive personal information, that family members aren't comfortable putting on a Lenovo.

Every Dell I've owned has had issues and needed service and has been very expensive for what it was. I've had much better luck with HP, at least the 2012-2017 era machines, but it comes down to the individual machine.

I've read last years Spectre had major thermal throttling performance issues, putting a 13800h in a portable machine, but this year's 155U should be better.
homebuyer6426
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Re: New Laptop Questions

Post by homebuyer6426 »

What is the reason you believe sensitive information will be less secure on a Lenovo compared to other brands?
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OldSport
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Re: New Laptop Questions

Post by OldSport »

homebuyer6426 wrote: Fri Feb 09, 2024 8:41 am What is the reason you believe sensitive information will be less secure on a Lenovo compared to other brands?
I don't want to go off topic and get the thread flagged. Genuinely am interested if the HP Spectre or Elitebook are better. That's what I've narrowed it down to. It's possible the Spectre may not be as robust, and I'm concerned about that. I would hope the Elitebook are at least as robust as the 2015-2017 era Envys, which have been good to us.
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just frank
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Re: New Laptop Questions

Post by just frank »

Could always get a MacBook, and install Windows 11 on it. :D

Might not run super peppy on the M2 chip though.

Other than that, I'd stick Lenovo and avoid OLED bc of burn-in issues.
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Re: New Laptop Questions

Post by anoop »

Make sure that you do ok with OLED. Most OLED screens use PWM flicker to lower brightness which can cause eye strain and headaches. IPS panels may not be as pretty but they are easier on the eyes.
88Mike
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Re: New Laptop Questions

Post by 88Mike »

Yarlonkol12 wrote: Fri Feb 09, 2024 5:07 am Neither, Id get a Macbook
Not at all the question OP was asking. Why do Apple fanboys always pop up when not asked? It's like wack-a-mole.
02nz
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Re: New Laptop Questions

Post by 02nz »

OldSport wrote: Thu Feb 08, 2024 11:12 pm Want to get a new laptop ahead of the Windows 10 sunset.

Currently have an 2016/2017 HP Envy with 7th generation Core i7, 16GB RAM, that is still going strong.

I'm debating between a new HP Spectre x360 with Ulta 7, 32GB Ram, and OLED screen or an HP Elitebook 1040 x360 with 1365u processor, 32GB ram and a good IPS (non OLED) screen.

Any thoughts on which machine is a better long term replacement?
Between the two, the EliteBook. But: the sunset isn't happening until late 2025; if the Envy is "still going strong," then maybe wait until Black Friday this year or even next.
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Re: New Laptop Questions

Post by MH2 »

OldSport wrote: Fri Feb 09, 2024 8:50 am
homebuyer6426 wrote: Fri Feb 09, 2024 8:41 am What is the reason you believe sensitive information will be less secure on a Lenovo compared to other brands?
I don't want to go off topic and get the thread flagged. Genuinely am interested if the HP Spectre or Elitebook are better. That's what I've narrowed it down to. It's possible the Spectre may not be as robust, and I'm concerned about that. I would hope the Elitebook are at least as robust as the 2015-2017 era Envys, which have been good to us.
We have a mix of MacBooks and HP Elitebooks, along with byod, where I work.

The Elitebooks are IMO garbage.

Not as much because of reliability, although it’s an HP, so it’s not going to be great, but more because of the overall fit, feel, and finish of the device.

If Lenovo doesn’t work and you can’t migrate off of Windows, consider something like System76.
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Re: New Laptop Questions

Post by MH2 »

88Mike wrote: Fri Feb 09, 2024 9:01 am
Yarlonkol12 wrote: Fri Feb 09, 2024 5:07 am Neither, Id get a Macbook
Not at all the question OP was asking. Why do Apple fanboys always pop up when not asked? It's like wack-a-mole.
Most laptops are hot junk.

Apple is one of the few manufacturers that makes quality consumer hardware. Lenovo is another, which is why they’re the go-to brands for these sorts of questions.
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SmileyFace
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Re: New Laptop Questions

Post by SmileyFace »

OP: I would go with the Elitebook - it's a better design as others have mentioned.

It's too bad there isn't a way of filtering out all posts that suggest MacBook in these threads to get rid of all the irrelevant responses. If someone has always used and wants Windows, there is no reason to switch to Apple.
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Re: New Laptop Questions

Post by elcadarj »

If you're concerned about Lenovo's intrusive optimization bloatware, do a clean install.

Wired points out that Microsoft itself is responsible for a lot of the junk on Windows 11: https://www.wired.com/story/how-to-clea ... indows-11/.
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Re: New Laptop Questions

Post by jayjayc »

I'm not too familiar with HP's models, but I like getting biz class laptops for long term use. They have better build quality and are purposed to last longer. Go for the Elitebook.
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Re: New Laptop Questions

Post by anoop »

elcadarj wrote: Fri Feb 09, 2024 9:17 am If you're concerned about Lenovo's intrusive optimization bloatware, do a clean install.

Wired points out that Microsoft itself is responsible for a lot of the junk on Windows 11: https://www.wired.com/story/how-to-clea ... indows-11/.
Is this true for both Home and Pro?
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Re: New Laptop Questions

Post by OldSport »

anoop wrote: Fri Feb 09, 2024 7:17 pm
elcadarj wrote: Fri Feb 09, 2024 9:17 am If you're concerned about Lenovo's intrusive optimization bloatware, do a clean install.

Wired points out that Microsoft itself is responsible for a lot of the junk on Windows 11: https://www.wired.com/story/how-to-clea ... indows-11/.
Is this true for both Home and Pro?
Thanks all. The Elitebook, being a business class laptop, seems to only come with Windows 11 Pro. Leaning toward the Elitebook due to the use case. Waiting til black Friday is a possibility, but the model then may have a 155U vs the current 1365U processor, but maybe that doesn't matter.

Good point on the OLED with burn in and PWM for our use case. Non OLED consumer class screens, like modern Envys are garbage, but the business class IPS screens seem much better.
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elcadarj
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Re: New Laptop Questions

Post by elcadarj »

anoop wrote: Fri Feb 09, 2024 7:17 pm
elcadarj wrote: Fri Feb 09, 2024 9:17 am If you're concerned about Lenovo's intrusive optimization bloatware, do a clean install.

Wired points out that Microsoft itself is responsible for a lot of the junk on Windows 11: https://www.wired.com/story/how-to-clea ... indows-11/.
Is this true for both Home and Pro?
According to this https://www.ctrl.blog/entry/windows-oob ... tware.html, yes.
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Re: New Laptop Questions

Post by 88Mike »

MH2 wrote: Fri Feb 09, 2024 9:11 am
88Mike wrote: Fri Feb 09, 2024 9:01 am
Yarlonkol12 wrote: Fri Feb 09, 2024 5:07 am Neither, Id get a Macbook
Not at all the question OP was asking. Why do Apple fanboys always pop up when not asked? It's like wack-a-mole.
Most laptops are hot junk.

Apple is one of the few manufacturers that makes quality consumer hardware. Lenovo is another, which is why they’re the go-to brands for these sorts of questions.
I don't disagree with you. It's annoying as it has nothing to do with what the OP is asking Why weigh in if you have nothing of benefit relating to the question? It would be like me asking people's opinion about purchasing a Pixel or Galaxy phone. And you chime with "don't do it, get an IPhone." it adds nothing of value to the conversation.
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Re: New Laptop Questions

Post by Dave5280 »

I bought 2 of the x360’s for people at work and they’ve done well with no complaints. Don’t have any experience with the other model. I’ve read a lot of good reviews on the x360. I was worried about HP durability but that has not been a problem.

We’ve also used Dell in the past and many durability issues.

I really like the Lenovo Thinkpads the best and we have those and may be the best, but cost more.
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Re: New Laptop Questions

Post by alexbogle »

Macbook if you value battery life. Frame.work if you don't care about battery life and don't care for osx.
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Re: New Laptop Questions

Post by hudson »

just frank wrote: Fri Feb 09, 2024 8:52 am Could always get a MacBook, and install Windows 11 on it. :D

Might not run super peppy on the M2 chip though.

Other than that, I'd stick Lenovo and avoid OLED bc of burn-in issues.
I have that setup: Macbook Air with Parallel with a Windows 11 Pro license installed. It's works kind of like windows, but it's not that hot.
As a long time Windows user, Macs are kind of foreign to me. There's a learning curve. If I threw out my windows machine and went full-time Mac, I'd probably be back to normal in a year or two.
Don't get me wrong, the Macbook Air is a great machine; I'm just a slow learner.

Subject change:
I've purchased and supported dozens of Dell business model laptops...very few if any problems.
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just frank
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Re: New Laptop Questions

Post by just frank »

hudson wrote: Sun Feb 11, 2024 6:54 am
just frank wrote: Fri Feb 09, 2024 8:52 am Could always get a MacBook, and install Windows 11 on it. :D

Might not run super peppy on the M2 chip though.

Other than that, I'd stick Lenovo and avoid OLED bc of burn-in issues.
I have that setup: Macbook Air with Parallel with a Windows 11 Pro license installed. It's works kind of like windows, but it's not that hot.
As a long time Windows user, Macs are kind of foreign to me. There's a learning curve. If I threw out my windows machine and went full-time Mac, I'd probably be back to normal in a year or two.
Don't get me wrong, the Macbook Air is a great machine; I'm just a slow learner.

Subject change:
I've purchased and supported dozens of Dell business model laptops...very few if any problems.
Makes sense. I've been on the Mac since 1986, so similar UI for 38 years. I can use Windows machines, but since I do so only every few years, the UI looks different every time I use one!

I'm not fanatical about it at this point (and since about 2015). Both operating systems are now similarly functional, but switching between them is quite difficult cognitively. This is largely due to intentional choices a looong time ago at the dawn of DOS/Windows to make them different from Unix/Mac so as to avoid patent infringement.
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Re: New Laptop Questions

Post by 02nz »

MH2 wrote: Fri Feb 09, 2024 9:11 am
88Mike wrote: Fri Feb 09, 2024 9:01 am
Yarlonkol12 wrote: Fri Feb 09, 2024 5:07 am Neither, Id get a Macbook
Not at all the question OP was asking. Why do Apple fanboys always pop up when not asked? It's like wack-a-mole.
Most laptops are hot junk.

Apple is one of the few manufacturers that makes quality consumer hardware. Lenovo is another, which is why they’re the go-to brands for these sorts of questions.
In the PC world, it's not really the brand that matters but the market segment.

Lenovo's $300 IdeaPads aren't all that much different from Dell's $300 Inspirons. The enterprise products are much better built, and all the major PC makers offer them - Lenovo ThinkPad, Dell Latitude, HP ProBook/EliteBook.
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Re: New Laptop Questions

Post by unix_joe »

One follow up: it looks as though the Elitebook has soldered memory. Not all Elitebooks; just the particular one you mentioned. This is a tradeoff that has affected business-class lineups for the past several years, including some Dell, Lenovo, and System76 product lines. So make sure you get as much RAM as possible up front, because you are going to be stuck with it for a while.

FWIW, I had 8GB on my laptop as a college student in 2008, and 32GB on my laptop in 2016. For me, that would be the absolute minimum moving forward.
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02nz
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Re: New Laptop Questions

Post by 02nz »

unix_joe wrote: Sun Feb 11, 2024 10:13 am One follow up: it looks as though the Elitebook has soldered memory. Not all Elitebooks; just the particular one you mentioned. This is a tradeoff that has affected business-class lineups for the past several years, including some Dell, Lenovo, and System76 product lines. So make sure you get as much RAM as possible up front, because you are going to be stuck with it for a while.

FWIW, I had 8GB on my laptop as a college student in 2008, and 32GB on my laptop in 2016. For me, that would be the absolute minimum moving forward.
For people who do a bit of browsing, watch some videos, and run office apps, 16GB is plenty, and will remain plenty even in 5-10 years.

The biggest factors that have increased RAM requirements have been 1) the transition from 32- to 64-bit Windows, and 2) the tendency of the most popular browser, Chrome, to gobble up RAM. There's nothing similar to the 64-bit transition on the horizon to increase RAM requirements yet again; as for Chrome, Google has taken some steps to reign in its RAM usage.

ETA: With 12 tabs in Chrome, a 4K video playing in YouTube, and Word, Excel, and PowerPoint all open, my Windows 11 PC uses about 7.5 to 8 GB of the available 16 GB of RAM (15.3 accounting for RAM reserved for the system).
Last edited by 02nz on Sun Feb 11, 2024 10:31 am, edited 1 time in total.
srt7
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Re: New Laptop Questions

Post by srt7 »

OldSport wrote: Fri Feb 09, 2024 8:50 am
homebuyer6426 wrote: Fri Feb 09, 2024 8:41 am What is the reason you believe sensitive information will be less secure on a Lenovo compared to other brands?
I don't want to go off topic and get the thread flagged. Genuinely am interested if the HP Spectre or Elitebook are better. That's what I've narrowed it down to. It's possible the Spectre may not be as robust, and I'm concerned about that. I would hope the Elitebook are at least as robust as the 2015-2017 era Envys, which have been good to us.
I'll just add this here and let readers decide for themselves.
https://www.tomshardware.com/news/lenov ... -questions
Taking care of tomorrow while enjoying today.
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Re: New Laptop Questions

Post by srt7 »

OP - I currently have a personal 2020 MacBook Air (Intel i5 chip) and used to have a work issued 2022 HP EliteBook. The latter was not only more expensive but also noisy. It seemed underpowered and like it was trying hard. Thought it was the work security software so returned the HP and got a 2022 16" MacBook Pro (M2 chip). Zero issues with both my Mac's now.

Wife, son and daughter all have Lenovo ThinkPads and are very happy with them. I have a 10 year old one T460 that still chugs along nicely.

So for us it's either a Mac or a Lenovo (ThinkPads only). Definitely not a HP or Dell.
Taking care of tomorrow while enjoying today.
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Re: New Laptop Questions

Post by MH2 »

02nz wrote: Sun Feb 11, 2024 9:51 am
MH2 wrote: Fri Feb 09, 2024 9:11 am
88Mike wrote: Fri Feb 09, 2024 9:01 am
Yarlonkol12 wrote: Fri Feb 09, 2024 5:07 am Neither, Id get a Macbook
Not at all the question OP was asking. Why do Apple fanboys always pop up when not asked? It's like wack-a-mole.
Most laptops are hot junk.

Apple is one of the few manufacturers that makes quality consumer hardware. Lenovo is another, which is why they’re the go-to brands for these sorts of questions.
In the PC world, it's not really the brand that matters but the market segment.

Lenovo's $300 IdeaPads aren't all that much different from Dell's $300 Inspirons. The enterprise products are much better built, and all the major PC makers offer them - Lenovo ThinkPad, Dell Latitude, HP ProBook/EliteBook.
Agreed, but the quality of commercial/enterprise laptops isn't great. HP is subpar. I haven't see a Dell Latitude in years, but I guess they're ok.

That said, when you can buy a gently used ThinkPad for a couple of hundred, why wouldn't you?
MH2
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Re: New Laptop Questions

Post by MH2 »

srt7 wrote: Sun Feb 11, 2024 10:31 am OP - I currently have a personal 2020 MacBook Air (Intel i5 chip) and used to have a work issued 2022 HP EliteBook. The latter was not only more expensive but also noisy. It seemed underpowered and like it was trying hard. Thought it was the work security software so returned the HP and got a 2022 16" MacBook Pro (M2 chip). Zero issues with both my Mac's now.

Wife, son and daughter all have Lenovo ThinkPads and are very happy with them. I have a 10 year old one T460 that still chugs along nicely.

So for us it's either a Mac or a Lenovo (ThinkPads only). Definitely not a HP or Dell.
We use EliteBooks at my workplace. Thankfully, BYOD is also an option.
02nz
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Re: New Laptop Questions

Post by 02nz »

MH2 wrote: Sun Feb 11, 2024 7:58 pm
02nz wrote: Sun Feb 11, 2024 9:51 am
MH2 wrote: Fri Feb 09, 2024 9:11 am
88Mike wrote: Fri Feb 09, 2024 9:01 am
Yarlonkol12 wrote: Fri Feb 09, 2024 5:07 am Neither, Id get a Macbook
Not at all the question OP was asking. Why do Apple fanboys always pop up when not asked? It's like wack-a-mole.
Most laptops are hot junk.

Apple is one of the few manufacturers that makes quality consumer hardware. Lenovo is another, which is why they’re the go-to brands for these sorts of questions.
In the PC world, it's not really the brand that matters but the market segment.

Lenovo's $300 IdeaPads aren't all that much different from Dell's $300 Inspirons. The enterprise products are much better built, and all the major PC makers offer them - Lenovo ThinkPad, Dell Latitude, HP ProBook/EliteBook.
Agreed, but the quality of commercial/enterprise laptops isn't great. HP is subpar. I haven't see a Dell Latitude in years, but I guess they're ok.

That said, when you can buy a gently used ThinkPad for a couple of hundred, why wouldn't you?
I'm a big fan of used ThinkPads - something like the T14 Gen 2 AMD. But many aren't willing to go the used route (which is why they are so cheap). There are also far fewer convertible models (ThinkPad Yoga), and it souns like the 360-degree hinge is important to OP.
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Re: New Laptop Questions

Post by tibbitts »

MH2 wrote: Sun Feb 11, 2024 7:58 pm
02nz wrote: Sun Feb 11, 2024 9:51 am
MH2 wrote: Fri Feb 09, 2024 9:11 am
88Mike wrote: Fri Feb 09, 2024 9:01 am
Yarlonkol12 wrote: Fri Feb 09, 2024 5:07 am Neither, Id get a Macbook
Not at all the question OP was asking. Why do Apple fanboys always pop up when not asked? It's like wack-a-mole.
Most laptops are hot junk.

Apple is one of the few manufacturers that makes quality consumer hardware. Lenovo is another, which is why they’re the go-to brands for these sorts of questions.
In the PC world, it's not really the brand that matters but the market segment.

Lenovo's $300 IdeaPads aren't all that much different from Dell's $300 Inspirons. The enterprise products are much better built, and all the major PC makers offer them - Lenovo ThinkPad, Dell Latitude, HP ProBook/EliteBook.
Agreed, but the quality of commercial/enterprise laptops isn't great. HP is subpar. I haven't see a Dell Latitude in years, but I guess they're ok.

That said, when you can buy a gently used ThinkPad for a couple of hundred, why wouldn't you?
How do you determine if it's been "gently used?" I recently bought a manufacturer-refurbished computer, but there's a big difference between the 'like new" refurbished computers sold by manufacturers that are still-current models (generally with a similar-to-new warranty), and three-year-old lease returns. You can't buy a like-new manufacturer-refurbished reasonably-configured computer for "a couple of hundred dollars." I've bought many generically-refurbished laptops over the years, all of them "business-class" machines, but they've been considerably older (usually 3-4 years) and they've been good to me on average, but not the same experience as a new computer.
MH2
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Re: New Laptop Questions

Post by MH2 »

tibbitts wrote: Mon Feb 12, 2024 9:50 am
MH2 wrote: Sun Feb 11, 2024 7:58 pm
02nz wrote: Sun Feb 11, 2024 9:51 am
MH2 wrote: Fri Feb 09, 2024 9:11 am
88Mike wrote: Fri Feb 09, 2024 9:01 am

Not at all the question OP was asking. Why do Apple fanboys always pop up when not asked? It's like wack-a-mole.
Most laptops are hot junk.

Apple is one of the few manufacturers that makes quality consumer hardware. Lenovo is another, which is why they’re the go-to brands for these sorts of questions.
In the PC world, it's not really the brand that matters but the market segment.

Lenovo's $300 IdeaPads aren't all that much different from Dell's $300 Inspirons. The enterprise products are much better built, and all the major PC makers offer them - Lenovo ThinkPad, Dell Latitude, HP ProBook/EliteBook.
Agreed, but the quality of commercial/enterprise laptops isn't great. HP is subpar. I haven't see a Dell Latitude in years, but I guess they're ok.

That said, when you can buy a gently used ThinkPad for a couple of hundred, why wouldn't you?
How do you determine if it's been "gently used?" I recently bought a manufacturer-refurbished computer, but there's a big difference between the 'like new" refurbished computers sold by manufacturers that are still-current models (generally with a similar-to-new warranty), and three-year-old lease returns. You can't buy a like-new manufacturer-refurbished reasonably-configured computer for "a couple of hundred dollars." I've bought many generically-refurbished laptops over the years, all of them "business-class" machines, but they've been considerably older (usually 3-4 years) and they've been good to me on average, but not the same experience as a new computer.
Clear and relatively high resolution pictures of the actual device. Look for scratches on the body (down to the plastic/metal) and the screen. Some discoloration on the keyboard is ok - these are generally user replaceable on ThinkPads. Buy from a reputable reseller.

Specs aren't as much of an issue to me. There was a good five-seven year period in the teens where Intel was chasing power efficiency instead of performance. Anything bought during that period will generally be good enough for the average user.

RAM is a different story. The laptop should come with at least accessible DIMM slot. Screen size and resolution also matter.
tibbitts
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Re: New Laptop Questions

Post by tibbitts »

MH2 wrote: Mon Feb 12, 2024 11:21 pm Clear and relatively high resolution pictures of the actual device. Look for scratches on the body (down to the plastic/metal) and the screen. Some discoloration on the keyboard is ok - these are generally user replaceable on ThinkPads. Buy from a reputable reseller.

Specs aren't as much of an issue to me. There was a good five-seven year period in the teens where Intel was chasing power efficiency instead of performance. Anything bought during that period will generally be good enough for the average user.

RAM is a different story. The laptop should come with at least accessible DIMM slot. Screen size and resolution also matter.
Good point about keyboards. Most laptops used to have easily replaced keyboards but as you say that feature seems to be starting to be limited only a subset of business-class laptops now. The keyboard is an item that I'd be concerned about with a refurb - if it couldn't be easily and inexpensively replaced.

With 201x-era laptops you do have to verify win11 compatibility.
anoop
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Re: New Laptop Questions

Post by anoop »

unix_joe wrote: Thu Feb 08, 2024 11:52 pm The Elitebook is better long-term. Not only is it IPS, but it's a different class of machine designed for durability and user-replacable parts.
I wasn’t familiar with the Elitebook lineup of HP’s and after checking them out they are very pricey — even more than a MacBook Pro! It appears like most are build to order.
hudson
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Re: New Laptop Questions

Post by hudson »

anoop wrote: Wed Feb 14, 2024 8:46 am
unix_joe wrote: Thu Feb 08, 2024 11:52 pm The Elitebook is better long-term. Not only is it IPS, but it's a different class of machine designed for durability and user-replacable parts.
I wasn’t familiar with the Elitebook lineup of HP’s and after checking them out they are very pricey — even more than a MacBook Pro! It appears like most are build to order.
I price compared a $1239, 32GB, 1TB, Touchscreen EliteBook to a Dell Latitude and a DELL XPS. The Dells cost at least $800 more.
anoop
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Re: New Laptop Questions

Post by anoop »

hudson wrote: Wed Feb 14, 2024 9:13 am
anoop wrote: Wed Feb 14, 2024 8:46 am
unix_joe wrote: Thu Feb 08, 2024 11:52 pm The Elitebook is better long-term. Not only is it IPS, but it's a different class of machine designed for durability and user-replacable parts.
I wasn’t familiar with the Elitebook lineup of HP’s and after checking them out they are very pricey — even more than a MacBook Pro! It appears like most are build to order.
I price compared a $1239, 32GB, 1TB, Touchscreen EliteBook to a Dell Latitude and a DELL XPS. The Dells cost at least $800 more.
I must be doing something wrong. I tried to configure an Elitebook 835 G10 (13” with AMD) with 16/512 and got to a price north of $2K.
https://www.hp.com/us-en/shop/pdp/hp-el ... 709y9av-mb
hudson
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Re: New Laptop Questions

Post by hudson »

anoop wrote: Wed Feb 14, 2024 9:56 am
hudson wrote: Wed Feb 14, 2024 9:13 am
anoop wrote: Wed Feb 14, 2024 8:46 am
unix_joe wrote: Thu Feb 08, 2024 11:52 pm The Elitebook is better long-term. Not only is it IPS, but it's a different class of machine designed for durability and user-replacable parts.
I wasn’t familiar with the Elitebook lineup of HP’s and after checking them out they are very pricey — even more than a MacBook Pro! It appears like most are build to order.
I price compared a $1239, 32GB, 1TB, Touchscreen EliteBook to a Dell Latitude and a DELL XPS. The Dells cost at least $800 more.
I must be doing something wrong. I tried to configure an Elitebook 835 G10 (13” with AMD) with 16/512 and got to a price north of $2K.
https://www.hp.com/us-en/shop/pdp/hp-el ... 709y9av-mb
I hope this link works: https://www.hp.com/us-en/shop/pdp/hp-pr ... -450-15.6-

NOTE: THE ABOVE IS A PROBOOK NOT AN ELITEBOOK. Thanks Talzara!
Last edited by hudson on Thu Feb 15, 2024 7:11 am, edited 1 time in total.
talzara
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Re: New Laptop Questions

Post by talzara »

hudson wrote: Wed Feb 14, 2024 12:59 pm
anoop wrote: Wed Feb 14, 2024 9:56 amI must be doing something wrong. I tried to configure an Elitebook 835 G10 (13” with AMD) with 16/512 and got to a price north of $2K.
https://www.hp.com/us-en/shop/pdp/hp-el ... 709y9av-mb
I hope this link works: https://www.hp.com/us-en/shop/pdp/hp-pr ... -450-15.6-
That is not an EliteBook. That is a ProBook.

HP EliteBooks are better-built than ProBooks, and the configurations are better-tested. There's even a separate phone number for Elite support, which is US-based. They are allowed to skip the script and do what is necessary to fix the problem. If you need a part, they will ship it by Next Day Air.
ubermax
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Re: New Laptop Questions

Post by ubermax »

My wife and I have had very good experience with the Lenovo T series ( i.e. ThinkPads) - I have the T470S ( 14", slim, 2017 ) - 7 years old this year and still going strong - she has the T14s that she got in '20 or '21 - on the Lenovo website there are packages for this model but there has also been an option to build your own - we kept our prior models at least 5 years as well .

We extend ourselves price wise but we think the same with auto tires - it's paid off with longevity and reliability - I will be getting the 14s soon myself because my current model won't handle W11 and as you said the sunset is fast approaching .

Good luck !!
hudson
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Re: New Laptop Questions

Post by hudson »

talzara wrote: Wed Feb 14, 2024 1:44 pm
hudson wrote: Wed Feb 14, 2024 12:59 pm
anoop wrote: Wed Feb 14, 2024 9:56 amI must be doing something wrong. I tried to configure an Elitebook 835 G10 (13” with AMD) with 16/512 and got to a price north of $2K.
https://www.hp.com/us-en/shop/pdp/hp-el ... 709y9av-mb
I hope this link works: https://www.hp.com/us-en/shop/pdp/hp-pr ... -450-15.6-
That is not an EliteBook. That is a ProBook.

HP EliteBooks are better-built than ProBooks, and the configurations are better-tested. There's even a separate phone number for Elite support, which is US-based. They are allowed to skip the script and do what is necessary to fix the problem. If you need a part, they will ship it by Next Day Air.
Thanks Talzara! You do good work!
I screwed that up. My apologies!
talzara
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Re: New Laptop Questions

Post by talzara »

ubermax wrote: Thu Feb 15, 2024 6:48 am My wife and I have had very good experience with the Lenovo T series ( i.e. ThinkPads) - I have the T470S ( 14", slim, 2017 ) - 7 years old this year and still going strong - she has the T14s that she got in '20 or '21 - on the Lenovo website there are packages for this model but there has also been an option to build your own - we kept our prior models at least 5 years as well .

We extend ourselves price wise but we think the same with auto tires - it's paid off with longevity and reliability - I will be getting the 14s soon myself because my current model won't handle W11 and as you said the sunset is fast approaching .
The Lenvo ThinkPad T470S was available with 6th and 7th generation Intel Core processors.

If you have a 7th generation processor, you can run Windows 11 in an unsupported configuration.

This is the safest unsupported configuration to run. Microsoft supports Windows 11 on Microsoft Surface tablets with 7th generation processors. Microsoft cannot compile Windows 11 for 8th generation processors because it will stop working on first-party hardware.

I would not risk it with a 6th generation Intel Core processor.
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