Lexus IS350 vs Mercedes C-Class

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bob1234
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Lexus IS350 vs Mercedes C-Class

Post by bob1234 »

I'm looking to purchase a new car and am leaning towards either the 2022 Lexus IS350 or Mercedes C-Class. I'm wondering the reliability difference between the two. I don't drive that many miles (around 4k/year, mostly short trips) and hope to keep the car at least 10 years. I'm wondering if the issues in reliability with Mercedes are typically a function of time or mileage. Also, wondering if there are extended warranty options designed for low mileage cases (e.g. longer time frame with a higher deductible).
Olemiss540
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Re: Lexus IS350 vs Mercedes C-Class

Post by Olemiss540 »

Personally I would take the lexus all day every day. How it drives, interior styling, dependability, etc. Not a fan of the interior of the Benz but either will have no issues lasting 40k plus miles so go with whatever you enjoy driving most.
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Re: Lexus IS350 vs Mercedes C-Class

Post by Valuethinker »

bob1234 wrote: Wed Jun 22, 2022 1:41 am I'm looking to purchase a new car and am leaning towards either the 2022 Lexus IS350 or Mercedes C-Class. I'm wondering the reliability difference between the two. I don't drive that many miles (around 4k/year, mostly short trips) and hope to keep the car at least 10 years. I'm wondering if the issues in reliability with Mercedes are typically a function of time or mileage. Also, wondering if there are extended warranty options designed for low mileage cases (e.g. longer time frame with a higher deductible).
A sibling has a BMW x3 rather than a Mercedes. With the extended warranty. It saved him thousands of dollars about 3 weeks before warranty expiry. North eastern winters are hard on cars. German cars are expensive to fix - cost of parts and also relatively few people able to service them.

TBH the Mercedes might be more fun to own. The Lexus is likely to be more reliable, be cheaper to fix (maybe), and to have a higher resale value if it ever is sold. However Lexuses are in short supply -- all cars are, but Toyota seems to be particularly bad.

It may come down to which car you can get when you need it. What the dealer has, and what extras you will have to pay for to secure the car. It appears, from what people post here, that $10k over MSRP is not impossible. Below MSRP is unlikely.
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Re: Lexus IS350 vs Mercedes C-Class

Post by jharkin »

The Lexus will go 10 years with nothing but tires, brake pads and fluid changes.

The Mercedes.... well.... I am sure they are a lot more reliable than they used to be but something expensive is likely to come up at some point. German cars are especially known for electrical problems (coil packs, injectors, etc) and the cooling systems having issues as they age.
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Re: Lexus IS350 vs Mercedes C-Class

Post by MGBMartin »

jharkin wrote: Wed Jun 22, 2022 6:40 am The Lexus will go 10 years with nothing but tires, brake pads and fluid changes.

The Mercedes.... well.... I am sure they are a lot more reliable than they used to be but something expensive is likely to come up at some point. German cars are especially known for electrical problems (coil packs, injectors, etc) and the cooling systems having issues as they age.
Tell me about it.
Just got my E350 back after being in the shop for 3 months, $2500 to replace 2 ECU’s that somehow fried themselves.
Same car, $3000 for a fuel pump a while back; whole tank has to be replaced.
Same model, different car $3000 when transmission went out.
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andypanda
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Re: Lexus IS350 vs Mercedes C-Class

Post by andypanda »

What year E350 and how many miles?
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topper1296
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Re: Lexus IS350 vs Mercedes C-Class

Post by topper1296 »

I'd also go Lexus between those two for reasons already mentioned and I'd also consider Acura and maybe Infiniti as well.
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Re: Lexus IS350 vs Mercedes C-Class

Post by Johny Fever »

bob1234 wrote: Wed Jun 22, 2022 1:41 am I'm looking to purchase a new car and am leaning towards either the 2022 Lexus IS350 or Mercedes C-Class. I'm wondering the reliability difference between the two. I don't drive that many miles (around 4k/year, mostly short trips) and hope to keep the car at least 10 years. I'm wondering if the issues in reliability with Mercedes are typically a function of time or mileage. Also, wondering if there are extended warranty options designed for low mileage cases (e.g. longer time frame with a higher deductible).
IF you can find one I would look at a Certified PreOwned Lexus. As someone that repairs both brands I will say that the Benz in a decent car and drives well. The E class is a MUCH better car terms of ride and handling over the C. As far as cost to drive its not going to be close. Take the Lexus all day long. IF you buy a Benz get all the warranty that you can from Benz, not an aftermarket warranty.
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Re: Lexus IS350 vs Mercedes C-Class

Post by Stinky »

Toyota/Lexus all the way. Ours are the most trouble free cars we’ve ever owned.
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Re: Lexus IS350 vs Mercedes C-Class

Post by Paddygirl »

I have a Lexus, fantastic vehicle. And a Toyota Avalon, 20 years old. My friend has a Mercedes and is always complaining about how much it costs to fix it!
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Re: Lexus IS350 vs Mercedes C-Class

Post by MikeG62 »

bob1234 wrote: Wed Jun 22, 2022 1:41 am I'm looking to purchase a new car and am leaning towards either the 2022 Lexus IS350 or Mercedes C-Class. I'm wondering the reliability difference between the two. I don't drive that many miles (around 4k/year, mostly short trips) and hope to keep the car at least 10 years. I'm wondering if the issues in reliability with Mercedes are typically a function of time or mileage. Also, wondering if there are extended warranty options designed for low mileage cases (e.g. longer time frame with a higher deductible).
We've had both cars in our garage as one point over the last decade for one of our family members.

No luxury car is as reliable as Lexus - period. If you are only driving it ~4,000 miles per year you should not have any issues with the Lexus. I would absolutely not purchase an extended warranty. Unlikely to be necessary or a wise financial decision.

Mercedes is reliable (at least at the entry level). BUT, if it needs maintenance out of warranty, a four figure repair bill is not out of the question.
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jfmiii
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Re: Lexus IS350 vs Mercedes C-Class

Post by jfmiii »

Mercedes.

I personally think the reliability issues on German cars is way overblown. I think MB/Audi/BMW have made huge strides in reliability over the last decade. My wife has owned a GLC since new in 2018. It now has 50k miles and has needed only routine fluid changes and 1 set of new tires. It still has the original brakes. No other issues to speak of. I owned an Audi A4 in the early 2000s. Great car but lot of issues unrelated to the drivetrain; window regulators, sunroof motors, etc. It kept me away from Audi but I've heard they are miles ahead of were they were 20 years ago. Owned a BMW M3 in the mid-2000s that was under warranty. Owned the car for 5 years and had one issue that was covered under warranty that wouldve been $3k if the repair needed to be done out of warranty. Also owned a C300 from about 2012-2018. It needed nothing other than routine maintenance.
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Re: Lexus IS350 vs Mercedes C-Class

Post by retired@50 »

bob1234 wrote: Wed Jun 22, 2022 1:41 am I'm looking to purchase a new car and am leaning towards either the 2022 Lexus IS350 or Mercedes C-Class. I'm wondering the reliability difference between the two. I don't drive that many miles (around 4k/year, mostly short trips) and hope to keep the car at least 10 years. I'm wondering if the issues in reliability with Mercedes are typically a function of time or mileage. Also, wondering if there are extended warranty options designed for low mileage cases (e.g. longer time frame with a higher deductible).
If you're looking for a longer warranty, you might consider a Genesis G80.

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Re: Lexus IS350 vs Mercedes C-Class

Post by JackoC »

jfmiii wrote: Wed Jun 22, 2022 9:03 am Mercedes.

I personally think the reliability issues on German cars is way overblown. I think MB/Audi/BMW have made huge strides in reliability over the last decade.
I agree the reliability difference is often overblown here. That said among those two cars I'd take the IS350, because I believe both would be on the boring side of 'sports sedan' compared to comparable BMW. For BMW v. Lexus I would factor in what I believe is still an advantage for the Lexus in reliability, at least out to the horizon where old cars just have problems (our 2005 Lexus GX470 has been a 'loyal servant' but I can't say it's reliable at this point, stuff keeps cropping up in recent years) but it would not be the only thing. Recently I got Porsche Macan S where Lexus IS500* was another vehicle in the running (I know they aren't that closely comparable vehicles). I considered that the Lexus would probably be more reliable but didn't/don't believe it's a huge factor and it wasn't enough.

*stablemate of the 350 but besides being slower very few 350's in stock have the performance options to make them at all compelling driver cars which are standard on the 500, and Lexus dealers in my recent experience don't take custom orders. I custom ordered the Macan will all performance options. Obviously as always depends on the use, drive to and from work on suburban roads is one thing, our more expensive car is used predominantly on long road trips seeking out small, fun roads.
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Boomer01
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Re: Lexus IS350 vs Mercedes C-Class

Post by Boomer01 »

Agree with the Lexus recommendations. I use to have a LS430 and it was the best vehicle I've ever owned.
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Re: Lexus IS350 vs Mercedes C-Class

Post by MGBMartin »

andypanda wrote: Wed Jun 22, 2022 7:30 am What year E350 and how many miles?
When I bought it it was a 3 year old MB CPO with 32k, it’s a 2009 model.
Fuel pump went out less than a year after CPO warranty ran out with about 60k on the clock.
Since I retired I don’t drive it much and I was laid up a bit last year so didn’t use it for a month or so. Fired it up, it started ran for 5 seconds then died. MB mechanic said the only thing he could think of low voltage followed by sudden high voltage after starting killed the ECU’s.

My previous E350 was 5 years old and 57k when it’s transmission died, at least MB picked up 50% on that one.
I know people are going to say the newer ones are much more reliable.
There’s reliable with minor things causing breakdowns then there are major failures of things that are rare on any car.
I’ve owned plenty of cars in the past 50 years of 1960s vintage to present. Never owned a car that needed a fuel pump or transmission or ECU before.

My wife’s MB has been better, just things you expect to replace like alternator, water pump etc although less than 70k miles.
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Re: Lexus IS350 vs Mercedes C-Class

Post by MGBMartin »

MikeG62 wrote: Wed Jun 22, 2022 8:58 am
bob1234 wrote: Wed Jun 22, 2022 1:41 am I'm looking to purchase a new car and am leaning towards either the 2022 Lexus IS350 or Mercedes C-Class. I'm wondering the reliability difference between the two. I don't drive that many miles (around 4k/year, mostly short trips) and hope to keep the car at least 10 years. I'm wondering if the issues in reliability with Mercedes are typically a function of time or mileage. Also, wondering if there are extended warranty options designed for low mileage cases (e.g. longer time frame with a higher deductible).
We've had both cars in our garage as one point over the last decade for one of our family members.

No luxury car is as reliable as Lexus - period. If you are only driving it ~4,000 miles per year you should not have any issues with the Lexus. I would absolutely not purchase an extended warranty. Unlikely to be necessary or a wise financial decision.

Mercedes is reliable (at least at the entry level). BUT, if it needs maintenance out of warranty, a four figure repair bill is not out of the question.
Yes, definitely need maintenance when out of warranty; but, that doesn’t help when it’s the maintenance free items that fail.
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atdharris
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Re: Lexus IS350 vs Mercedes C-Class

Post by atdharris »

I love my C-Class, but it is expensive as hell to maintain. I spent ~$7k last year alone on fixing the steering (twice), and now I am hearing other strange noises when I hit the brakes, but I am too afraid to take it in for service because I will probably walk out with another $2k bill. The scheduled service maintenance costs alone, when nothing is wrong, are usually $1000 a trip.

I've never owned a Lexus, but I can't imagine it being more expensive to maintain.
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Re: Lexus IS350 vs Mercedes C-Class

Post by pahkcah »

I've had two Lexus sedans. Never a single mechanical issue with either one. Will be buying a new Lexus RZ 450e as soon as one is available.

One other thing to consider is depreciation over time of the car's value. I would compare the residual value of each vehicle that you may eventually consider. Here's an example of a comparison between the Mercedes and Lexus models you are considering: https://caredge.com/compare/depreciatio ... -vs-is-350

You can also go to Edmunds and look at the overall cost of ownership for each of the cars: https://www.edmunds.com/tco.html
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Re: Lexus IS350 vs Mercedes C-Class

Post by Normchad »

I’m sure the Lexus will be more reliable.

I checked out an IS about a month ago. There was a big hump in the floor near the accelerator. A complete deal breaker for me. So I’d recommend you check that out and see how it suits you.

https://www.autoblog.com/amp/2021/03/16 ... explained/
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Re: Lexus IS350 vs Mercedes C-Class

Post by sureshoe »

jfmiii wrote: Wed Jun 22, 2022 9:03 am Mercedes.

I personally think the reliability issues on German cars is way overblown. I think MB/Audi/BMW have made huge strides in reliability over the last decade. My wife has owned a GLC since new in 2018. It now has 50k miles and has needed only routine fluid changes and 1 set of new tires. It still has the original brakes. No other issues to speak of. I owned an Audi A4 in the early 2000s. Great car but lot of issues unrelated to the drivetrain; window regulators, sunroof motors, etc. It kept me away from Audi but I've heard they are miles ahead of were they were 20 years ago. Owned a BMW M3 in the mid-2000s that was under warranty. Owned the car for 5 years and had one issue that was covered under warranty that wouldve been $3k if the repair needed to be done out of warranty. Also owned a C300 from about 2012-2018. It needed nothing other than routine maintenance.
I feel like this is a bad comparison. I know on paper they are both "luxury cars", but I feel there is a cachet to Mercedes that Lexus doesn't have.

To me, you buy a Mercedes if you want people see you have a luxury car. You buy a Lexus if you want a driver.
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Re: Lexus IS350 vs Mercedes C-Class

Post by Geronkas »

Go with the Lexus for reliability and cheaper cost of ownership. The C class is the entry-level Mercedes Benz and is often referred to as “the poor man’s Mercedes.”
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Re: Lexus IS350 vs Mercedes C-Class

Post by andypanda »

Thank you for the details.

"I know people are going to say the newer ones are much more reliable."

They certainly do claim they are more reliable than the really bad Mercedes years and models, but they never claim they are out and out reliable.
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Re: Lexus IS350 vs Mercedes C-Class

Post by Flyer24 »

Topic moved to Personal Consumer Issues.
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Re: Lexus IS350 vs Mercedes C-Class

Post by henry »

I have a 2013 Lexus GS 350 AWD. A family member has a 2017 Lexus GS 350 AWD. The same 3.5 liter V6 engine and same 6-speed automatic transmission as in the IS 350 AWD. Reliability has been excellent so far.

Neither of us drive a lot of miles, mostly short trips. I have 53,000 miles on mine and there are 30,000 miles on the other. No engine or transmission issues to date. Same family member had a 2007 Lexus ES 350 (similar engine/transmission) for 14 years and 75,000 miles without any engine or transmission issues either. All were owned since new.

There are many Toyota and Lexus models that use versions of the same or similar 3.5 liter V6 and transmission. It is an old but seemingly reliable engine and transmission.

No recalls on my 2013 car so far. I did get 2 customer support notices from Lexus over the years. One was for the dashboard potentially getting cracked or sticky if exposed to too much heat, light, or humidity. Lexus extended to coverage on the dashboard to 10 years. I haven’t noticed any issues though. I park in a garage everyday so that might help with that. Another was for the air conditioner servo motors failing prematurely. Lexus extended coverage on the AC servo motors to 7 years/125,000 miles. My car is about 9 years old so I am out of the coverage period for that now but no issues with the AC so far either.
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Re: Lexus IS350 vs Mercedes C-Class

Post by trizzle »

Normchad wrote: Wed Jun 22, 2022 9:56 am I’m sure the Lexus will be more reliable.

I checked out an IS about a month ago. There was a big hump in the floor near the accelerator. A complete deal breaker for me. So I’d recommend you check that out and see how it suits you.

https://www.autoblog.com/amp/2021/03/16 ... explained/
AFAIK this only exists in the AWD models and not RWDs. Not sure which the OP is considering. IS350 AWD owner here - I don't even notice the bump anymore.
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Re: Lexus IS350 vs Mercedes C-Class

Post by neilpilot »

jharkin wrote: Wed Jun 22, 2022 6:40 am The Lexus will go 10 years with nothing but tires, brake pads and fluid changes.

The Mercedes.... well.... I am sure they are a lot more reliable than they used to be but something expensive is likely to come up at some point. German cars are especially known for electrical problems (coil packs, injectors, etc) and the cooling systems having issues as they age.
If you are correct, i.e. "I am sure they are a lot more reliable than they used to be", then I can't even imagine how reliable the new Cs are since my old C-240 was great.

I bought my wife a new 2002 C-240, she drove it 125k miles, and then we replaced it with a GLC300 in 2018. I did all the usual maintenance (oil changes, filters, brake linings) and a few other easy repairs such as an O2 sensor replacement. The most serious repair were new sway bar bushings and end links at about 85k miles. After the first few oil changes and a recall, it never visited a Mercedes dealer. IIRC the only maintenance that wasn't DIY was for new tires, an alignment and a brake fluid flush.
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Re: Lexus IS350 vs Mercedes C-Class

Post by Stinky »

atdharris wrote: Wed Jun 22, 2022 9:47 am I love my C-Class, but it is expensive as hell to maintain…..

The scheduled service maintenance costs alone, when nothing is wrong, are usually $1000 a trip.
This alone is a deal killer for me.
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Re: Lexus IS350 vs Mercedes C-Class

Post by tim1999 »

Stinky wrote: Wed Jun 22, 2022 12:25 pm
atdharris wrote: Wed Jun 22, 2022 9:47 am I love my C-Class, but it is expensive as hell to maintain…..

The scheduled service maintenance costs alone, when nothing is wrong, are usually $1000 a trip.
This alone is a deal killer for me.
Yeah, and even if you take it to an independent M-B shop in my MCOL area, you are still looking at around $250 for the "A" service (every year or 10k) and $500 for the "B" service (every 2 years or 20k) on a 4-cyl M-B. Once you get into the 50-60k mile range, you are due for a spark plug change and transmission fluid change, together which will run you over $1,000 even at the indie shop, in addition to the A or B service due then.

The IS350 (V6) has a very reliable and proven powertrain with very low service costs if you stay away from the dealer. It will get worse fuel economy than a MB C300, but I prefer the V6 and wouldn't mind paying the extra fuel cost myself.
Last edited by tim1999 on Wed Jun 22, 2022 1:58 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Lexus IS350 vs Mercedes C-Class

Post by WhiteMaxima »

IS350
vfinx
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Re: Lexus IS350 vs Mercedes C-Class

Post by vfinx »

A couple notes that may not have been mentioned yet:
- The Lexus fuel economy will likely be significantly worse in the real world (you can see this in fuelly). Lexus can sacrifice fuel economy for reliability, because they rely on Toyota to drown out their inefficient vehicles to achieve their fleet-wide average mpg requirements.
- Please confirm this for yourself, but I believe the IS350 has a spare tire, while the C300 does not.
- In many cases, a Lexus can be taken to a Toyota shop/dealership for services.
- Lexus has really good air conditioning and seat ventilation. It's almost as good as American cars.
- I recommend staying away from the "F Sport" variants unless you really love the styling. It's not worth the harsher/stiffer ride in my opinion.
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Re: Lexus IS350 vs Mercedes C-Class

Post by firebirdparts »

bob1234 wrote: Wed Jun 22, 2022 1:41 am I'm looking to purchase a new car and am leaning towards either the 2022 Lexus IS350 or Mercedes C-Class. I'm wondering the reliability difference between the two.
Oh my. The stereotype is that they are at opposite extremes of the spectrum. But in reality, it's hard to say for sure what a 2022 C-class is really like. We have to look at a 2010 C-class and guess. That's all we can do. If you were a gambling man, you would gamble on IS350 being more reliable.

i suppose it's fair to say the periodic service requirements for a Lexus are actually onerous. If you actually read that, there is a lot in there. I just don't let the dealer actually do it.

Lexus parts, to my eye, are a good value.
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Re: Lexus IS350 vs Mercedes C-Class

Post by atdharris »

tim1999 wrote: Wed Jun 22, 2022 1:45 pm
Stinky wrote: Wed Jun 22, 2022 12:25 pm
atdharris wrote: Wed Jun 22, 2022 9:47 am I love my C-Class, but it is expensive as hell to maintain…..

The scheduled service maintenance costs alone, when nothing is wrong, are usually $1000 a trip.
This alone is a deal killer for me.
Yeah, and even if you take it to an independent M-B shop in my MCOL area, you are still looking at around $250 for the "A" service (every year or 10k) and $500 for the "B" service (every 2 years or 20k) on a 4-cyl M-B. Once you get into the 50-60k mile range, you are due for a spark plug change and transmission fluid change, together which will run you over $1,000 even at the indie shop, in addition to the A or B service due then.

The IS350 (V6) has a very reliable and proven powertrain with very low service costs if you stay away from the dealer. It will get worse fuel economy than a MB C300, but I prefer the V6 and wouldn't mind paying the extra fuel cost myself.
Yup. The "A" service usually runs me ~$800 at minimum and the B service is always over $1000. I take my car to the dealership for service. We have one independent MB shop in my area, but with all the electronics on my car, I am not comfortable taking it there. It looks like they service a lot of older models.
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Re: Lexus IS350 vs Mercedes C-Class

Post by neilpilot »

atdharris wrote: Wed Jun 22, 2022 2:32 pm
Yup. The "A" service usually runs me ~$800 at minimum and the B service is always over $1000. I take my car to the dealership for service. We have one independent MB shop in my area, but with all the electronics on my car, I am not comfortable taking it there. It looks like they service a lot of older models.
I'm constantly amazed what dealers and many indy shops charge for MB A & B service. The only real maintenance performed for the "A" service is an oil & oil filter change, and a reset of the maintenance counter. Everything else is a simple inspection (i.e. are other fluid levels OK, are the tires at the proper pressure, etc.). No special tools are required but I use an oil extractor I've had for a decade, so I don't even have to get under the car. I spend under $40 for parts to complete the "A" service that others here pay the dealer $800 (!) to complete.

The "B" service is the "A" service PLUS engine air & cabin filters. Once again no special tools or talent is required. I completed the "B" service on my 2016 GLC300 in May. I used OEM filters and Mobil 1 Euro formula synthetic oil, and my total cost was under $100. The first time I did the "B" service it took me about 2-3 hours since it was my first on the GLC, but this time it was done in about 1-1/2 hours. I work slowly, but still probably spend less time completing the maintenance than if I waited at the dealer.
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Re: Lexus IS350 vs Mercedes C-Class

Post by ClevrChico »

The Lexus is the safe bet. The Mercedes is a bit of a gamble. At only 4k miles/year, I'd think the risk is very small no matter what you buy. In your situation, I'd go with whatever dealer gets you the deal you want.
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Re: Lexus IS350 vs Mercedes C-Class

Post by snackdog »

We have owned MB! BMW, Audi and VW. All had horrifying issues and costs. We are now a Lexus family. The cars are comfortable, quiet, fast and dead reliable.
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Re: Lexus IS350 vs Mercedes C-Class

Post by atdharris »

neilpilot wrote: Wed Jun 22, 2022 2:57 pm
atdharris wrote: Wed Jun 22, 2022 2:32 pm
Yup. The "A" service usually runs me ~$800 at minimum and the B service is always over $1000. I take my car to the dealership for service. We have one independent MB shop in my area, but with all the electronics on my car, I am not comfortable taking it there. It looks like they service a lot of older models.
I'm constantly amazed what dealers and many indy shops charge for MB A & B service. The only real maintenance performed for the "A" service is an oil & oil filter change, and a reset of the maintenance counter. Everything else is a simple inspection (i.e. are other fluid levels OK, are the tires at the proper pressure, etc.). No special tools are required but I use an oil extractor I've had for a decade, so I don't even have to get under the car. I spend under $40 for parts to complete the "A" service that others here pay the dealer $800 (!) to complete.

The "B" service is the "A" service PLUS engine air & cabin filters. Once again no special tools or talent is required. I completed the "B" service on my 2016 GLC300 in May. I used OEM filters and Mobil 1 Euro formula synthetic oil, and my total cost was under $100. The first time I did the "B" service it took me about 2-3 hours since it was my first on the GLC, but this time it was done in about 1-1/2 hours. I work slowly, but still probably spend less time completing the maintenance than if I waited at the dealer.
My issue is that I have no skills at servicing cars whatsoever, so I blindly take it to the dealer for service, where they always find something else wrong with the car on top of the general service. I looked it up and I spent $6,726.19 on service and repairs in 2021 alone. And this car isn't that old. It's a 2016 c-class with 65k miles on it.

As much as I love the car, there are days I wonder if I should sell it and buy something like a Lexis. But with the price of used cars now, I probably can't do that.
srt7
Posts: 864
Joined: Mon Sep 29, 2014 12:19 pm

Re: Lexus IS350 vs Mercedes C-Class

Post by srt7 »

That Lexus will never let you down but it may also never give you a rise :wink:

Great cars! Can't go wrong with either.
Taking care of tomorrow while enjoying today.
leland
Posts: 59
Joined: Sun Sep 12, 2021 5:21 pm

Re: Lexus IS350 vs Mercedes C-Class

Post by leland »

Personally, Lexus for all reasons cited by others. If your trips tend to be short a full electric could be a fun option, too. Could land in the same price range. But either way can't lose if this is what you're cross-shopping.
neilpilot
Posts: 4213
Joined: Fri Dec 04, 2015 1:46 pm
Location: Memphis area

Re: Lexus IS350 vs Mercedes C-Class

Post by neilpilot »

atdharris wrote: Wed Jun 22, 2022 3:18 pm
neilpilot wrote: Wed Jun 22, 2022 2:57 pm
atdharris wrote: Wed Jun 22, 2022 2:32 pm
Yup. The "A" service usually runs me ~$800 at minimum and the B service is always over $1000. I take my car to the dealership for service. We have one independent MB shop in my area, but with all the electronics on my car, I am not comfortable taking it there. It looks like they service a lot of older models.
I'm constantly amazed what dealers and many indy shops charge for MB A & B service. The only real maintenance performed for the "A" service is an oil & oil filter change, and a reset of the maintenance counter. Everything else is a simple inspection (i.e. are other fluid levels OK, are the tires at the proper pressure, etc.). No special tools are required but I use an oil extractor I've had for a decade, so I don't even have to get under the car. I spend under $40 for parts to complete the "A" service that others here pay the dealer $800 (!) to complete.

The "B" service is the "A" service PLUS engine air & cabin filters. Once again no special tools or talent is required. I completed the "B" service on my 2016 GLC300 in May. I used OEM filters and Mobil 1 Euro formula synthetic oil, and my total cost was under $100. The first time I did the "B" service it took me about 2-3 hours since it was my first on the GLC, but this time it was done in about 1-1/2 hours. I work slowly, but still probably spend less time completing the maintenance than if I waited at the dealer.
My issue is that I have no skills at servicing cars whatsoever, so I blindly take it to the dealer for service, where they always find something else wrong with the car on top of the general service. I looked it up and I spent $6,726.19 on service and repairs in 2021 alone. And this car isn't that old. It's a 2016 c-class with 65k miles on it.

As much as I love the car, there are days I wonder if I should sell it and buy something like a Lexis. But with the price of used cars now, I probably can't do that.
I guess I'm lucky to be able to DIY maintenance. I keep detailed records for all my cars, and I spent $3390 for the 15+ years and 125k miles we owned the 2002 C-240. That includes everything except gas, registration, insurance and a windshield replacement covered by insurance.
JackoC
Posts: 3496
Joined: Sun Aug 12, 2018 11:14 am

Re: Lexus IS350 vs Mercedes C-Class

Post by JackoC »

sureshoe wrote: Wed Jun 22, 2022 10:48 am
jfmiii wrote: Wed Jun 22, 2022 9:03 am Mercedes.

I personally think the reliability issues on German cars is way overblown. I think MB/Audi/BMW have made huge strides in reliability over the last decade. My wife has owned a GLC since new in 2018. It now has 50k miles and has needed only routine fluid changes and 1 set of new tires. It still has the original brakes. No other issues to speak of. I owned an Audi A4 in the early 2000s. Great car but lot of issues unrelated to the drivetrain; window regulators, sunroof motors, etc. It kept me away from Audi but I've heard they are miles ahead of were they were 20 years ago. Owned a BMW M3 in the mid-2000s that was under warranty. Owned the car for 5 years and had one issue that was covered under warranty that wouldve been $3k if the repair needed to be done out of warranty. Also owned a C300 from about 2012-2018. It needed nothing other than routine maintenance.
I feel like this is a bad comparison. I know on paper they are both "luxury cars", but I feel there is a cachet to Mercedes that Lexus doesn't have.

To me, you buy a Mercedes if you want people see you have a luxury car. You buy a Lexus if you want a driver.
I guess almost few would *say* 'I'm buying this car so people can see I have a luxury car' yet a lot of people here are sure other people are doing that. Probably some are, I'm just less sure than some what other people are 'really' thinking.

Anyway I'm not sure for younger people whether Lexus and Mercedes have that a much different image in terms of prestige. I'd guess if that were true if would be among somewhat older people, though not as old as the cohort that would still view Cadillac as top prestige. :happy My point is just that that kind of perception can vary over time not only individual. If I were considering Lexus and Mercedes and consciously cared about prestige perception (in either direction, including if I wanted to be lower profile with a less showy ride) I wouldn't view them as much different that way. I agree the Lexus by most evidence is more likely to have lower ownership costs at least for pretty many years*, but I don't think that means Mercedes can only sell cars to people who find them more prestigious. Lexi tend to be more boring also (though Merc's are also generally boring IMO) and often have, to my eye, whacky styling in recent years.

*our 2005 Lexus GX470 bought new replaced a 2000 Mercedes E320 which was indeed not reliable and I decided wasn't very exciting either. That Lexus was solid for many years if you didn't mind boring, though in recent years it's had some potentially quite expensive things go wrong, $10k+ I'd say if I'd taken it even to an independent and said 'this is broken' or 'this warning light came on', 'please fix it'. I spent way less because either I trouble-shot myself to find less expensive reasons for warning light/error codes, or got work arounds from the owner community to decommission certain expensive systems rather than actually repair them (steel spring kit replaced failed air suspension, electronic bypass system to decommission secondary air injection emission control system which you can't actually fix without removing the engine, $k's, but car will still pass state emission test with the bypass). 'Reliable' has phases: during warranty it's a pain to take to dealer but it doesn't cost in cash, after that to some end date some cars have hardly anything go wrong (though that also applies to my 2015 BMW 328i, also a very enjoyable to drive car, to me), eventually all cars have expensive problems IME.
MGBMartin
Posts: 229
Joined: Thu Nov 04, 2021 11:09 am

Re: Lexus IS350 vs Mercedes C-Class

Post by MGBMartin »

neilpilot wrote: Wed Jun 22, 2022 2:57 pm
atdharris wrote: Wed Jun 22, 2022 2:32 pm
Yup. The "A" service usually runs me ~$800 at minimum and the B service is always over $1000. I take my car to the dealership for service. We have one independent MB shop in my area, but with all the electronics on my car, I am not comfortable taking it there. It looks like they service a lot of older models.
I'm constantly amazed what dealers and many indy shops charge for MB A & B service. The only real maintenance performed for the "A" service is an oil & oil filter change, and a reset of the maintenance counter. Everything else is a simple inspection (i.e. are other fluid levels OK, are the tires at the proper pressure, etc.). No special tools are required but I use an oil extractor I've had for a decade, so I don't even have to get under the car. I spend under $40 for parts to complete the "A" service that others here pay the dealer $800 (!) to complete.

The "B" service is the "A" service PLUS engine air & cabin filters. Once again no special tools or talent is required. I completed the "B" service on my 2016 GLC300 in May. I used OEM filters and Mobil 1 Euro formula synthetic oil, and my total cost was under $100. The first time I did the "B" service it took me about 2-3 hours since it was my first on the GLC, but this time it was done in about 1-1/2 hours. I work slowly, but still probably spend less time completing the maintenance than if I waited at the dealer.
You are right about the services.
A and B are nothing more than oil and filters etc as well as checking a few things.
I started doing my own A and B on my E350 and the wife’s C240. I use Mobil 1 and Mann filters with a vacuum oil extractor, I think the dealers suck the oil out too.
We are hardly use our MBs these days as we have a Kia Soul EV that we use to potter around in. Time for one of the MBs to go I think, and it will probably be the E350 as even though the C240 is older I don’t have much confidence in the E350 as it has let me down too many times. I forgot to mention the day the key completely died while I was I was at a gas station, fortunately the mrs was home and brought me the second key.
Bad spellers of the world untie | Autocorrect is my worst enema
vfinx
Posts: 309
Joined: Thu Apr 19, 2018 9:35 pm

Re: Lexus IS350 vs Mercedes C-Class

Post by vfinx »

MGBMartin wrote: Wed Jun 22, 2022 4:54 pm
neilpilot wrote: Wed Jun 22, 2022 2:57 pm
atdharris wrote: Wed Jun 22, 2022 2:32 pm
Yup. The "A" service usually runs me ~$800 at minimum and the B service is always over $1000. I take my car to the dealership for service. We have one independent MB shop in my area, but with all the electronics on my car, I am not comfortable taking it there. It looks like they service a lot of older models.
I'm constantly amazed what dealers and many indy shops charge for MB A & B service. The only real maintenance performed for the "A" service is an oil & oil filter change, and a reset of the maintenance counter. Everything else is a simple inspection (i.e. are other fluid levels OK, are the tires at the proper pressure, etc.). No special tools are required but I use an oil extractor I've had for a decade, so I don't even have to get under the car. I spend under $40 for parts to complete the "A" service that others here pay the dealer $800 (!) to complete.

The "B" service is the "A" service PLUS engine air & cabin filters. Once again no special tools or talent is required. I completed the "B" service on my 2016 GLC300 in May. I used OEM filters and Mobil 1 Euro formula synthetic oil, and my total cost was under $100. The first time I did the "B" service it took me about 2-3 hours since it was my first on the GLC, but this time it was done in about 1-1/2 hours. I work slowly, but still probably spend less time completing the maintenance than if I waited at the dealer.
You are right about the services.
A and B are nothing more than oil and filters etc as well as checking a few things.
I started doing my own A and B on my E350 and the wife’s C240. I use Mobil 1 and Mann filters with a vacuum oil extractor, I think the dealers suck the oil out too.
We are hardly use our MBs these days as we have a Kia Soul EV that we use to potter around in. Time for one of the MBs to go I think, and it will probably be the E350 as even though the C240 is older I don’t have much confidence in the E350 as it has let me down too many times. I forgot to mention the day the key completely died while I was I was at a gas station, fortunately the mrs was home and brought me the second key.
Do MB keys not let you enter the vehicle with the actual physical “key” and then let you hold the key against the steering column to disable the immobilizer?
neilpilot
Posts: 4213
Joined: Fri Dec 04, 2015 1:46 pm
Location: Memphis area

Re: Lexus IS350 vs Mercedes C-Class

Post by neilpilot »

vfinx wrote: Wed Jun 22, 2022 5:04 pm
MGBMartin wrote: Wed Jun 22, 2022 4:54 pm
neilpilot wrote: Wed Jun 22, 2022 2:57 pm
atdharris wrote: Wed Jun 22, 2022 2:32 pm
Yup. The "A" service usually runs me ~$800 at minimum and the B service is always over $1000. I take my car to the dealership for service. We have one independent MB shop in my area, but with all the electronics on my car, I am not comfortable taking it there. It looks like they service a lot of older models.
I'm constantly amazed what dealers and many indy shops charge for MB A & B service. The only real maintenance performed for the "A" service is an oil & oil filter change, and a reset of the maintenance counter. Everything else is a simple inspection (i.e. are other fluid levels OK, are the tires at the proper pressure, etc.). No special tools are required but I use an oil extractor I've had for a decade, so I don't even have to get under the car. I spend under $40 for parts to complete the "A" service that others here pay the dealer $800 (!) to complete.

The "B" service is the "A" service PLUS engine air & cabin filters. Once again no special tools or talent is required. I completed the "B" service on my 2016 GLC300 in May. I used OEM filters and Mobil 1 Euro formula synthetic oil, and my total cost was under $100. The first time I did the "B" service it took me about 2-3 hours since it was my first on the GLC, but this time it was done in about 1-1/2 hours. I work slowly, but still probably spend less time completing the maintenance than if I waited at the dealer.
You are right about the services.
A and B are nothing more than oil and filters etc as well as checking a few things.
I started doing my own A and B on my E350 and the wife’s C240. I use Mobil 1 and Mann filters with a vacuum oil extractor, I think the dealers suck the oil out too.
We are hardly use our MBs these days as we have a Kia Soul EV that we use to potter around in. Time for one of the MBs to go I think, and it will probably be the E350 as even though the C240 is older I don’t have much confidence in the E350 as it has let me down too many times. I forgot to mention the day the key completely died while I was I was at a gas station, fortunately the mrs was home and brought me the second key.
Do MB keys not let you enter the vehicle with the actual physical “key” and then let you hold the key against the steering column to disable the immobilizer?
My c240 had a mechanical key, not sure about the immobilizer. Never had a dead battery since the key and/or car would advise to change fob battery when low.
MMiroir
Posts: 377
Joined: Sun Mar 29, 2020 12:14 pm

Re: Lexus IS350 vs Mercedes C-Class

Post by MMiroir »

atdharris wrote: Wed Jun 22, 2022 3:18 pm
neilpilot wrote: Wed Jun 22, 2022 2:57 pm
atdharris wrote: Wed Jun 22, 2022 2:32 pm
Yup. The "A" service usually runs me ~$800 at minimum and the B service is always over $1000. I take my car to the dealership for service. We have one independent MB shop in my area, but with all the electronics on my car, I am not comfortable taking it there. It looks like they service a lot of older models.
I'm constantly amazed what dealers and many indy shops charge for MB A & B service. The only real maintenance performed for the "A" service is an oil & oil filter change, and a reset of the maintenance counter. Everything else is a simple inspection (i.e. are other fluid levels OK, are the tires at the proper pressure, etc.). No special tools are required but I use an oil extractor I've had for a decade, so I don't even have to get under the car. I spend under $40 for parts to complete the "A" service that others here pay the dealer $800 (!) to complete.

The "B" service is the "A" service PLUS engine air & cabin filters. Once again no special tools or talent is required. I completed the "B" service on my 2016 GLC300 in May. I used OEM filters and Mobil 1 Euro formula synthetic oil, and my total cost was under $100. The first time I did the "B" service it took me about 2-3 hours since it was my first on the GLC, but this time it was done in about 1-1/2 hours. I work slowly, but still probably spend less time completing the maintenance than if I waited at the dealer.
My issue is that I have no skills at servicing cars whatsoever, so I blindly take it to the dealer for service, where they always find something else wrong with the car on top of the general service. I looked it up and I spent $6,726.19 on service and repairs in 2021 alone. And this car isn't that old. It's a 2016 c-class with 65k miles on it.

As much as I love the car, there are days I wonder if I should sell it and buy something like a Lexis. But with the price of used cars now, I probably can't do that.
You are being taken advantage of by the dealership.
MGBMartin
Posts: 229
Joined: Thu Nov 04, 2021 11:09 am

Re: Lexus IS350 vs Mercedes C-Class

Post by MGBMartin »

vfinx wrote: Wed Jun 22, 2022 5:04 pm
MGBMartin wrote: Wed Jun 22, 2022 4:54 pm
neilpilot wrote: Wed Jun 22, 2022 2:57 pm
atdharris wrote: Wed Jun 22, 2022 2:32 pm
Yup. The "A" service usually runs me ~$800 at minimum and the B service is always over $1000. I take my car to the dealership for service. We have one independent MB shop in my area, but with all the electronics on my car, I am not comfortable taking it there. It looks like they service a lot of older models.
I'm constantly amazed what dealers and many indy shops charge for MB A & B service. The only real maintenance performed for the "A" service is an oil & oil filter change, and a reset of the maintenance counter. Everything else is a simple inspection (i.e. are other fluid levels OK, are the tires at the proper pressure, etc.). No special tools are required but I use an oil extractor I've had for a decade, so I don't even have to get under the car. I spend under $40 for parts to complete the "A" service that others here pay the dealer $800 (!) to complete.

The "B" service is the "A" service PLUS engine air & cabin filters. Once again no special tools or talent is required. I completed the "B" service on my 2016 GLC300 in May. I used OEM filters and Mobil 1 Euro formula synthetic oil, and my total cost was under $100. The first time I did the "B" service it took me about 2-3 hours since it was my first on the GLC, but this time it was done in about 1-1/2 hours. I work slowly, but still probably spend less time completing the maintenance than if I waited at the dealer.
You are right about the services.
A and B are nothing more than oil and filters etc as well as checking a few things.
I started doing my own A and B on my E350 and the wife’s C240. I use Mobil 1 and Mann filters with a vacuum oil extractor, I think the dealers suck the oil out too.
We are hardly use our MBs these days as we have a Kia Soul EV that we use to potter around in. Time for one of the MBs to go I think, and it will probably be the E350 as even though the C240 is older I don’t have much confidence in the E350 as it has let me down too many times. I forgot to mention the day the key completely died while I was I was at a gas station, fortunately the mrs was home and brought me the second key.
Do MB keys not let you enter the vehicle with the actual physical “key” and then let you hold the key against the steering column to disable the immobilizer?
The car does have a mechanical key but I didn’t need it as the car was unlocked.
The key just completely died, would not unlock the steering when inserted into the column.
The batteries in the key do not have anything to do with starting the car or so I’m told.
The key won’t even unlock the doors, I did change the batteries just to be sure.
Fortunately it was just that key as the second key still works fine.
Last edited by MGBMartin on Wed Jun 22, 2022 7:48 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Bad spellers of the world untie | Autocorrect is my worst enema
GreatLaker
Posts: 72
Joined: Mon Jun 12, 2017 7:19 pm

Re: Lexus IS350 vs Mercedes C-Class

Post by GreatLaker »

My '12 IS350 AWD has only had 2 repairs. One rear shock, and a loose wind deflector by the back wheel, that the dealer fixed free out of warranty. I replaced the tires and the battery. It is still on the original brake pads, but I think it will need brakes done soon, along with coolant change (10 years) and spark plugs (60,000 mi). I think it has had 3 recalls in >10 years. I don't drive a lot, a bit over 6k miles / year. I hope to get many more years out of it. Lexus is almost always at or near the top of the Consumer Reports and J.D. Power reliability and durability rankings.

I don't even notice the footwell hump for the front wheel power take-off. It makes a nice leg rest. Reading reviews some drivers notice it and some don't. It seems to depend on their height and foot size.
tim1999
Posts: 4152
Joined: Tue Dec 16, 2008 7:16 am

Re: Lexus IS350 vs Mercedes C-Class

Post by tim1999 »

neilpilot wrote: Wed Jun 22, 2022 2:57 pm The "B" service is the "A" service PLUS engine air & cabin filters. Once again no special tools or talent is required. I completed the "B" service on my 2016 GLC300 in May. I used OEM filters and Mobil 1 Euro formula synthetic oil, and my total cost was under $100. The first time I did the "B" service it took me about 2-3 hours since it was my first on the GLC, but this time it was done in about 1-1/2 hours. I work slowly, but still probably spend less time completing the maintenance than if I waited at the dealer.
Many MB models require a brake fluid change at every B service interval which drives up the price as well. Plenty of other makes of cars out there that have much longer intervals (Lexus included).
Mother Biggles
Posts: 17
Joined: Thu Mar 03, 2022 8:49 pm

Re: Lexus IS350 vs Mercedes C-Class

Post by Mother Biggles »

Lexus all day. I drive a 2010 or 2011 Lexus IS350 convertible. It’s so boring to drive. The amenities are not luxurious at all. I have about 150k miles on it and it’s only needed routine maintenance and similar. It turns on when it’s supposed to and gets me where I need to go.

Before this car I bought a young, maybe three year old, BMW three series convertible. It was probably in the shop maybe not every month but maybe every other month. Thank goodness for the extended warranty. The repairs were constant and expensive once I got off warranty. The final problem that drove me to sell it and get the Lexus was that the lock would not reliably open. It was a manual key but there was an electronic component to it to ensure the car recognized the key. The dealership could not reliably reproduce it and could not fix it. I took it to an independent mechanic. He said it was fixable but the amount of money it would take to run through all the wires that run all throughout the car to fix it would cost almost as much as the car is worth. He recommended selling it and buying something more reliable. At that time about every months the car was in the shop. I will never again buy a German car. It was a heck of a lot of fun to drive. But my first priority is the car it has to work. German cars are probably great to lease as long as they are under three years old. It seems to me that order them out they start having significant and expensive problems.

I wish the Lexus or more fun to drive. But it is a convertible and driving fast with the top down is more fun than having a BMW in the shop.
Mother Biggles
Posts: 17
Joined: Thu Mar 03, 2022 8:49 pm

Re: Lexus IS350 vs Mercedes C-Class

Post by Mother Biggles »

vfinx wrote: Wed Jun 22, 2022 1:51 pm A couple notes that may not have been mentioned yet:
- The Lexus fuel economy will likely be significantly worse in the real world (you can see this in fuelly). Lexus can sacrifice fuel economy for reliability, because they rely on Toyota to drown out their inefficient vehicles to achieve their fleet-wide average mpg requirements.
- Please confirm this for yourself, but I believe the IS350 has a spare tire, while the C300 does not.
- In many cases, a Lexus can be taken to a Toyota shop/dealership for services.
- Lexus has really good air conditioning and seat ventilation. It's almost as good as American cars.
- I recommend staying away from the "F Sport" variants unless you really love the styling. It's not worth the harsher/stiffer ride in my opinion.
My ten year old IS350 mix of expressway and surface street driving I probably get 22-25 mpg. I drive pretty aggressively though.
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