Tire issues - who to blame?

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dogbones
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Tire issues - who to blame?

Post by dogbones »

Hi friends - my car is under 10 years old and other than high mileage has been a dream. No mechanical issues other than fixes when we had a front-end accident. During inspections few years ago, my back tires failed inspection and needed replacement. Mechanic 1 said it was a camber issue, fixed it/aligned it, changed tires. Not even 10,000 miles later, it happened again. Failed inspection, this time at a different guy, for same issues. We're on round 3 in about 4 years now.

What gives? Each claim to have fixed the issue, and put new tires, but how can I rectify this? Is it possible that it is not any one particular person's fault, but something more underlying with the car causing more camber issues? Do I need to address this with the last mechanic involved and ask them to fix the issue at no cost to me (that doesn't sound reasonable because anything can go wrong at any time)?
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alpenglow
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Re: Tire issues - who to blame?

Post by alpenglow »

Do you need new springs?
Newaygo
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Re: Tire issues - who to blame?

Post by Newaygo »

Go to a store that specializes in nothing but tires. High probability that they will diagnose and fix the problem.
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dogbones
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Re: Tire issues - who to blame?

Post by dogbones »

alpenglow wrote: Wed Jan 12, 2022 9:44 am Do you need new springs?
Not that I am aware of
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dogbones
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Re: Tire issues - who to blame?

Post by dogbones »

Newaygo wrote: Wed Jan 12, 2022 9:50 am Go to a store that specializes in nothing but tires. High probability that they will diagnose and fix the problem.
Good idea - I am not sure why we are constantly reliant on generic mechanics (although our current one never gave us reason not to go to him)
shunkman
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Re: Tire issues - who to blame?

Post by shunkman »

What brand, model, and year car is this? Also, the frame or unibody itself could be out of alignment due to the earlier accident.
Last edited by shunkman on Wed Jan 12, 2022 10:00 am, edited 1 time in total.
Shallowpockets
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Re: Tire issues - who to blame?

Post by Shallowpockets »

Front end accident in the past.
Possible frame out of alignment.
dailybagel
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Re: Tire issues - who to blame?

Post by dailybagel »

dogbones wrote: Wed Jan 12, 2022 9:39 am Hi friends - my car is under 10 years old and other than high mileage has been a dream. No mechanical issues other than fixes when we had a front-end accident. During inspections few years ago, my back tires failed inspection and needed replacement. Mechanic 1 said it was a camber issue, fixed it/aligned it, changed tires. Not even 10,000 miles later, it happened again. Failed inspection, this time at a different guy, for same issues. We're on round 3 in about 4 years now.

What gives? Each claim to have fixed the issue, and put new tires, but how can I rectify this? Is it possible that it is not any one particular person's fault, but something more underlying with the car causing more camber issues? Do I need to address this with the last mechanic involved and ask them to fix the issue at no cost to me (that doesn't sound reasonable because anything can go wrong at any time)?
This is an opinion from a lay person, but maybe the problem lies in the parts that keep the rear tires on the road and in alignment, like springs or control arms.

I think it's reasonable for the first mechanic to try new tires and alignment before trying to replace suspension parts.

Your headline question is "who to blame," but I think you as the car owner bear most of the responsibility here. When this occurred for a second time shortly after the original fix, it would have been a great time to take it back to the original shop for a more in-depth diagnosis.

The second mechanic was at a bit of a disadvantage, as he/she only has whatever information you relayed. After experiencing the problem a second time, you could have insisted on a more thorough diagnosis, but maybe you just replaced the tire again.
Malum Prohibitum
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Re: Tire issues - who to blame?

Post by Malum Prohibitum »

A camber issue that ruins both tires ought to be pretty easy to diagnose.

Camber means that the tire is leaning in or out at the top. The inside or outside tread area wears prematurely because all of the weight is bearing on one little area of the treat instead of the entire tread evenly.

It may be something as simple as a worn component causing the alignment to shift as you are driving.

Take it to somebody competent, not a tire shop, to actually look at the rear suspension and all of the bushings.

It would be strange indeed for a camber issue to be on both tires. You did not describe any wear patterns on the tire at all for us.

What kind of vehicle? Go to a mechanic who specializes in that sort of vehicle. Some vehicles have known issues that, once you know about them, are easy to fix. You mentioned high mileage (how high?), so my guess is something in the rear suspension is worn out and needs to be replaced. All suspensions have wear items like bushings that have a projected lifespan and are intended to be replaced at the end of that lifespan. This is true for all cars, not just yours, but going to a mechanic who specializes in your type of car means the greatest chance of the mechanic recognizing the issue and dealing with it appropriately.
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Re: Tire issues - who to blame?

Post by dknightd »

What kind of car? What kind of tire?
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Re: Tire issues - who to blame?

Post by pizzy »

dogbones wrote: Wed Jan 12, 2022 9:39 am Hi friends - my car is under 10 years old and other than high mileage has been a dream. No mechanical issues other than fixes when we had a front-end accident. During inspections few years ago, my back tires failed inspection and needed replacement. Mechanic 1 said it was a camber issue, fixed it/aligned it, changed tires. Not even 10,000 miles later, it happened again. Failed inspection, this time at a different guy, for same issues. We're on round 3 in about 4 years now.

What gives? Each claim to have fixed the issue, and put new tires, but how can I rectify this? Is it possible that it is not any one particular person's fault, but something more underlying with the car causing more camber issues? Do I need to address this with the last mechanic involved and ask them to fix the issue at no cost to me (that doesn't sound reasonable because anything can go wrong at any time)?
Did the problem begin after the accident?
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galawdawg
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Re: Tire issues - who to blame?

Post by galawdawg »

What is/are the specific reason(s) your rear tires are failing inspection? For example, here are Virginia's standards for tires on their vehicle inspections:
nspect for and reject if:

1. Any tire is marked specifically for use other than on the highway, such as "For Farm Use Only," "For Off-Highway Use Only," any tire marked "Not for Steering Axle," "For Mobile Home Use Only," or "For Trailer Use Only."

EXCEPTION: "For Trailer Use Only" tires are allowed when used on trailers only.

2. A radial tire is mismatched on the same axle with a bias ply tire or a bias belted tire.

3. Bias ply or bias belted tires are used on the rear axle when radial ply tires are used on the front axle. Except:

a. On a two-axle vehicle equipped with truck tires with 20-inch rim diameter and larger. Bias or radial tires may be used on either axle if the vehicle has dual rear wheels or is equipped with wide-base single tires.

b. Either bias or radial tires may be used on the steering axle of vehicles with three or more axles.

4. Bias tires and radial tires are mixed in a tandem-drive axle combination on a vehicle equipped with truck tires with 20-inch rim diameter and larger.

5. Any tire on the front wheel of a bus, truck or any tractor truck has a tread groove pattern of less than 4/32 inch when measured at any point on a major tread groove.

6. Any bus has regrooved, recapped, or retreaded tires on the front wheels.

7. Any motor vehicle, trailer or semitrailer, except the dual wheels installed on motor vehicles having seats for more than seven passengers: (i) operated wholly within a municipality, or (ii) operated by urban and suburban bus lines, which are defined as bus lines operating over regularly scheduled routes and the majority of whose passengers use the buses for traveling a distance of not exceeding 40 miles, measured one way, on the same day between their place of abode and their place of work, shopping areas, or schools, is equipped with a tire that has a tread depth measuring less than 2/32 of an inch when measured as follows: NOTE: The exemptions provided in clauses (i) and (ii) of this subdivision do not apply to buses owned or operated by any public school district, private school, or contract operator of buses.

NOTE: Measure in two adjacent tread grooves where tread is thinnest. If either of the grooves measure 2/32 of an inch or more, no further measurements are necessary and tread depth is satisfactory. Do not measure on tread wear indicators.

If both adjacent grooves measure less than 2/32 of an inch, the tire tread depth must be measured again at two additional equally spaced intervals around the circumference of the tire in a like manner as the first measurement. If the tread depth is less than 2/32 of an inch in two adjacent tread grooves at each of the equally spaced intervals, the tire must be rejected.

8. A tire equipped with tread wear indicators if found to have such indicators in contact with the pavement in any two adjacent grooves at three equally spaced intervals around the circumference of the tire.

9. Any tire has a cut to the extent a ply or belt material is exposed or puncture, not to include a plug or patch that may be used as a manner of repair.

NOTE: Plugs or patches shall be in the tread area only. Plugs or patches are not permitted in the sidewall of the tire.

10. Any tire is worn so that the fabric or steel cord is visible.

11. Any tire has knots or bulges in its sidewalls or if there is evidence of a broken belt under the tread, or if the tread is separating from the fabric.

12. Any tire that has been recut or regrooved except commercial tires so designed and constructed to provide for acceptable and safe recutting and regrooving. Each tire that has been regrooved must be labeled with the word "Regroovable" molded on or into the tire on both sidewalls in raised or recessed letters.

13. Any tire is flat or has an audible air leak.

14. Any tire so mounted or inflated that it comes into contact with its mate or any parts of the vehicle.

15. Rims, or lock rings or wheels are bent, cracked or damaged so as to affect safe operation of the vehicle. Reject if lug nut holes are elongated (out of round).

16. Any wheel studs, bolts, nuts, lugs, or other fasteners (both spoke and disc wheels) are loose, broken, cracked, stripped, missing, or damaged or otherwise ineffective.

17. Any welded repair on aluminum wheels on a steering axle or any welded repair (other than disc to rim attachment) on steel drive wheels mounted on the steering axle.

18. Directional tires or wheels, designed and manufactured to go in a certain direction of rotation not installed in the proper direction of rotation.
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Re: Tire issues - who to blame?

Post by tibbitts »

I don't really understand the "failed inspection" thing. Why are they failing inspection? Both tires are failing the same way? When you compare the alignment printouts from the various alignments you've had what's the difference?
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mrpotatoheadsays
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Re: Tire issues - who to blame?

Post by mrpotatoheadsays »

dogbones wrote: Wed Jan 12, 2022 9:39 am What gives?
"we had a front-end accident"

I had a Ford that had unusually limited ability to align the front wheels; it was a design issue. Every alignment maxed-out the range; they could never get it perfect. Cheap or soft tires wore-out after 10,000 miles. Buying high-quality Michelin tires helped, but they too wore early.

My WAG is that the accident slightly bent something. Take the car out on the highway and go 80+ mph; i bet it shakes all over the place.
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dogbones
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Re: Tire issues - who to blame?

Post by dogbones »

shunkman wrote: Wed Jan 12, 2022 9:57 am What brand, model, and year car is this? Also, the frame or unibody itself could be out of alignment due to the earlier accident.
Lots of great advice and questions here so I will try to give as much detail as possible:

2014 Tucson
150k miles
minor front end accident going under 20 mph
tires failing inspection because both back tires are wearing on the inside
problem started after the accident IIRC
I'll edit if there are more questions I missed

If this is a unibody/frame alignment issue, is it worth starting my search for a new/new to me car that we started saving for rather than dumping more money?
Californiastate
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Re: Tire issues - who to blame?

Post by Californiastate »

The accident damaged something. I'd go to a quality shop for a comprehensive diagnosis. I'd then consider selling it if nothing was exposed.
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Re: Tire issues - who to blame?

Post by galawdawg »

Find a high-quality and recommended alignment shop. They should be able to diagnose your issue and if it relates to alignment and/or worn or broken suspension parts they can correct it. A 20mph front-end collision should not have caused these issues. Your vehicle age and mileage are more likely to be a factor. A quick glance on Google suggests that unusual or excessive rear tire wear issues are not terribly uncommon among Hyundai models.
runningshoes
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Re: Tire issues - who to blame?

Post by runningshoes »

I'm not a mechanic but just to point out that a camber issue is completely different than an alignment issue. Think of mis-alignment as being off balance heading left or right when trying to go straight and camber as being off center top to bottom when rotating. With the inside of the tires wearing out, it means that the top of the tire is "leaning in" towards the frame on each side, putting more pressure on the inside of the tire as it rotates.

IF the Tucson has a solid axle the axle could be bent towards the ground at the middle or it could be any number of other issues, all which should be pretty easy to diagnose - I'm guessing a semi-competent mechanic should be able to figure this out. I tend to agree that the accident had no part in this and there's simply a failure in one or more parts on the back assembly.
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dogbones
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Re: Tire issues - who to blame?

Post by dogbones »

runningshoes wrote: Wed Jan 12, 2022 2:45 pm I'm not a mechanic but just to point out that a camber issue is completely different than an alignment issue. Think of mis-alignment as being off balance heading left or right when trying to go straight and camber as being off center top to bottom when rotating. With the inside of the tires wearing out, it means that the top of the tire is "leaning in" towards the frame on each side, putting more pressure on the inside of the tire as it rotates.

IF the Tucson has a solid axle the axle could be bent towards the ground at the middle or it could be any number of other issues, all which should be pretty easy to diagnose - I'm guessing a semi-competent mechanic should be able to figure this out. I tend to agree that the accident had no part in this and there's simply a failure in one or more parts on the back assembly.
Thank you that makes sense to me.

Thank you everyone I feel like some discussions are going to be had on our end
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Re: Tire issues - who to blame?

Post by CorradoJr »

Most alignment shops provide a computer printout of the “before” and “after” specs from an alignment. You could reference those and also check online forums specific to Hyundai to see if this is an issue.

Most honest alignment shops will give you accurate info if they can’t put the wheel back within spec. They will say essentially - I put this back to spec as much as possible but your tires will wear on the inside/outside, etc. faster because there is an issue with XYZ.

My guess is your car was never repaired correctly or you’ve got some wear items that need to be replaced at 150k miles (control arms, bushings, tie-rods, etc.)
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Re: Tire issues - who to blame?

Post by suemarkp »

Some vehicles have no adjustment for camber and it typically doesn't change much. It only changes if something got bend and you have to bend it back or replace it if its a suspension item instead of a body mounting. Others have shims you add, remove, exchange, or bolts with a cam surface that you turn. There is only so much adjustment you can make with the factory items. Toe could possibly also wear out in inside edges if it is toed out instead of in.

Looks like the Tucson has adjustable camber for front and rear. https://www.carparts.com/camber-and-ali ... dai/tucson
Alignment specs are here http://www.jltechno.com/en/alignment_sp ... lID=303940
Rear camber should be between -1.5 and -0.5 degrees.

Find a good alignment shop (typically at a tire store like Discount Tire, Goodyear, etc). Specifically mention the rear wear issue to have them focus on that. Ask for the current and aligned settings for front and rear. Look on that sheet and see what the rear camber and toe is and did they change it.
Mark | Somewhere in WA State
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Re: Tire issues - who to blame?

Post by neilpilot »

suemarkp wrote: Wed Jan 12, 2022 4:34 pm Some vehicles have no adjustment for camber and it typically doesn't change much. It only changes if something got bend and you have to bend it back or replace it if its a suspension item instead of a body mounting. Others have shims you add, remove, exchange, or bolts with a cam surface that you turn. There is only so much adjustment you can make with the factory items. Toe could possibly also wear out in inside edges if it is toed out instead of in.

Looks like the Tucson has adjustable camber for front and rear. https://www.carparts.com/camber-and-ali ... dai/tucson
Alignment specs are here http://www.jltechno.com/en/alignment_sp ... lID=303940
Rear camber should be between -1.5 and -0.5 degrees.

Find a good alignment shop (typically at a tire store like Discount Tire, Goodyear, etc). Specifically mention the rear wear issue to have them focus on that. Ask for the current and aligned settings for front and rear. Look on that sheet and see what the rear camber and toe is and did they change it.
Discount Tire is a good tire store but don't think they do alignments
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Re: Tire issues - who to blame?

Post by suemarkp »

You may be right, I've never had one done there. Big O, Mr Tire, there are others....but depends on your region as to who does alignments.
Mark | Somewhere in WA State
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Re: Tire issues - who to blame?

Post by andypanda »

Before we left at noon for appointments with the contractor and the plumbing supply house, I did a quick google search for 2014 Tucson rear tire problems and found a lot of interest in Tucson rear tires wearing on the inside. They were spread over more than just the 2014 model year. It may be worth looking into. I'd volunteer, but I'm worn out from looking at stuff.
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dogbones
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Re: Tire issues - who to blame?

Post by dogbones »

andypanda wrote: Wed Jan 12, 2022 5:03 pm Before we left at noon for appointments with the contractor and the plumbing supply house, I did a quick google search for 2014 Tucson rear tire problems and found a lot of interest in Tucson rear tires wearing on the inside. They were spread over more than just the 2014 model year. It may be worth looking into. I'd volunteer, but I'm worn out from looking at stuff.
Thank you so much for just the quick search! Very much appreciated and I will dig deeper!
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dogbones
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Re: Tire issues - who to blame?

Post by dogbones »

suemarkp wrote: Wed Jan 12, 2022 4:34 pm Some vehicles have no adjustment for camber and it typically doesn't change much. It only changes if something got bend and you have to bend it back or replace it if its a suspension item instead of a body mounting. Others have shims you add, remove, exchange, or bolts with a cam surface that you turn. There is only so much adjustment you can make with the factory items. Toe could possibly also wear out in inside edges if it is toed out instead of in.

Looks like the Tucson has adjustable camber for front and rear. https://www.carparts.com/camber-and-ali ... dai/tucson
Alignment specs are here http://www.jltechno.com/en/alignment_sp ... lID=303940
Rear camber should be between -1.5 and -0.5 degrees.

Find a good alignment shop (typically at a tire store like Discount Tire, Goodyear, etc). Specifically mention the rear wear issue to have them focus on that. Ask for the current and aligned settings for front and rear. Look on that sheet and see what the rear camber and toe is and did they change it.
This is great information, thank you!
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dogbones
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Re: Tire issues - who to blame?

Post by dogbones »

CorradoJr wrote: Wed Jan 12, 2022 3:27 pm Most alignment shops provide a computer printout of the “before” and “after” specs from an alignment. You could reference those and also check online forums specific to Hyundai to see if this is an issue.

Most honest alignment shops will give you accurate info if they can’t put the wheel back within spec. They will say essentially - I put this back to spec as much as possible but your tires will wear on the inside/outside, etc. faster because there is an issue with XYZ.

My guess is your car was never repaired correctly or you’ve got some wear items that need to be replaced at 150k miles (control arms, bushings, tie-rods, etc.)
We have never been to a specialist for alignments, but now realizing as my car ages that's likely an important factor to consider repairs/maintenance. I will bring this all up with my spouse
chuckwalla
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Re: Tire issues - who to blame?

Post by chuckwalla »

Do you regularly rotate your tires? Most cars have slight negative camber in the back by default.
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dogbones
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Re: Tire issues - who to blame?

Post by dogbones »

dailybagel wrote: Wed Jan 12, 2022 10:01 am
dogbones wrote: Wed Jan 12, 2022 9:39 am Hi friends - my car is under 10 years old and other than high mileage has been a dream. No mechanical issues other than fixes when we had a front-end accident. During inspections few years ago, my back tires failed inspection and needed replacement. Mechanic 1 said it was a camber issue, fixed it/aligned it, changed tires. Not even 10,000 miles later, it happened again. Failed inspection, this time at a different guy, for same issues. We're on round 3 in about 4 years now.

What gives? Each claim to have fixed the issue, and put new tires, but how can I rectify this? Is it possible that it is not any one particular person's fault, but something more underlying with the car causing more camber issues? Do I need to address this with the last mechanic involved and ask them to fix the issue at no cost to me (that doesn't sound reasonable because anything can go wrong at any time)?
Your headline question is "who to blame," but I think you as the car owner bear most of the responsibility here. When this occurred for a second time shortly after the original fix, it would have been a great time to take it back to the original shop for a more in-depth diagnosis.
I absolutely agree the blame lies on me. Using the word "blame" was inaccurately used as a way to question if I had been duped or should expect the prior mechanics to correct their mistakes. It is certainly our issue that we didn't pay closer attention to these things as they came up and just dealt with it as quickly/painlessly as possible. With little kids it was certainly survival mode there.
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dogbones
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Re: Tire issues - who to blame?

Post by dogbones »

chuckwalla wrote: Wed Jan 12, 2022 5:18 pm Do you regularly rotate your tires? Most cars have slight negative camber in the back by default.
Yes with every oil change
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Watty
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Re: Tire issues - who to blame?

Post by Watty »

dogbones wrote: Wed Jan 12, 2022 11:23 am
shunkman wrote: Wed Jan 12, 2022 9:57 am What brand, model, and year car is this? Also, the frame or unibody itself could be out of alignment due to the earlier accident.
Lots of great advice and questions here so I will try to give as much detail as possible:

2014 Tucson
150k miles
minor front end accident going under 20 mph
tires failing inspection because both back tires are wearing on the inside
problem started after the accident IIRC
I'll edit if there are more questions I missed

If this is a unibody/frame alignment issue, is it worth starting my search for a new/new to me car that we started saving for rather than dumping more money?
When I have had fender benders my insurance company encourages people to go to one of their preferred body shops by giving a lifetime guarantee on the work. You might check the paperwork on those repairs to see if you have a similar guarantee that might apply.

There was a post a while back where someone had had a vehicle repaired like that and fender was painted. Something like 15 years later it was fading unendingly and they were able to get the vehicle repainted under that lifetime guarantee.
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Re: Tire issues - who to blame?

Post by Grifin »

Are you sure your toe in the rear is in spec? Out of spec toe adjustment usually eats tires quicker than aggressive camber in my experience.

Grifin
hunoraut
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Re: Tire issues - who to blame?

Post by hunoraut »

dogbones wrote: Wed Jan 12, 2022 9:39 am Hi friends - my car is under 10 years old and other than high mileage has been a dream. No mechanical issues other than fixes when we had a front-end accident. During inspections few years ago, my back tires failed inspection and needed replacement. Mechanic 1 said it was a camber issue, fixed it/aligned it, changed tires. Not even 10,000 miles later, it happened again. Failed inspection, this time at a different guy, for same issues. We're on round 3 in about 4 years now.

What gives? Each claim to have fixed the issue, and put new tires, but how can I rectify this? Is it possible that it is not any one particular person's fault, but something more underlying with the car causing more camber issues? Do I need to address this with the last mechanic involved and ask them to fix the issue at no cost to me (that doesn't sound reasonable because anything can go wrong at any time)?
-root cause of improper tire wear is suspension misalignment.

-the shop performing alignment services should provide you with a printout showing suspension geometry before/after. (not ALL aspects of geometry can be corrected on all cars)

-the alignment can drift over time due to accidents, potholes, curbs, etc. its literally just nuts and bolts and bushings keeping the geometry fixed.

-camber is typically slightly negative on the FRONT axle of sportier cars (to compensate for car roll when turning)

-factory spec for camber/suspension should not result in improper tire wear at 10,000 miles, even in sporty vehicles.

bottom line, if your car measures with in-spec suspension geometry *today*, with new tires and normal usage there should not be issues 10k-miles down the road. any of the other stuff above could have gone wrong in the past - poor repair, misalignment could not be corrected, etc.
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Re: Tire issues - who to blame?

Post by Sandtrap »

150000 miles

Options
Suspension shop alignment and repair suspension components .
Replace with Toyota or Honda.

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Re: Tire issues - who to blame?

Post by livesoft »

At 5000 miles, remove tires from rims and put back on the other way, so what was inside becomes the outside.
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Re: Tire issues - who to blame?

Post by hunoraut »

livesoft wrote: Thu Jan 13, 2022 8:38 am At 5000 miles, remove tires from rims and put back on the other way, so what was inside becomes the outside.
-many tires are assymetric and cannot be swapped sides
-the root cause of accelerated uneven wear continue to exist and manifest in 2 bald shoulders (though to lower extent)
-out of spec geometry can be detrimental to vehicle driving characteristics
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Re: Tire issues - who to blame?

Post by livesoft »

hunoraut wrote: Thu Jan 13, 2022 9:15 am
livesoft wrote: Thu Jan 13, 2022 8:38 am At 5000 miles, remove tires from rims and put back on the other way, so what was inside becomes the outside.
-many tires are assymetric and cannot be swapped sides
-the root cause of accelerated uneven wear continue to exist and manifest in 2 bald shoulders (though to lower extent)
-out of spec geometry can be detrimental to vehicle driving characteristics
Don't buy asymmetric tires.
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Re: Tire issues - who to blame?

Post by hunoraut »

livesoft wrote: Thu Jan 13, 2022 9:18 am Don't buy asymmetric tires.
higher quality tires tend to be asymmetric.
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Re: Tire issues - who to blame?

Post by livesoft »

hunoraut wrote: Thu Jan 13, 2022 9:24 am
livesoft wrote: Thu Jan 13, 2022 9:18 am Don't buy asymmetric tires.
higher quality tires tend to be asymmetric.
OK, but why pay for a higher quality tire that the OP is only going to use for 10,000 miles on an old car that has been in an accident?
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pizzy
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Re: Tire issues - who to blame?

Post by pizzy »

livesoft wrote: Thu Jan 13, 2022 9:28 am
hunoraut wrote: Thu Jan 13, 2022 9:24 am
livesoft wrote: Thu Jan 13, 2022 9:18 am Don't buy asymmetric tires.
higher quality tires tend to be asymmetric.
OK, but why pay for a higher quality tire that the OP is only going to use for 10,000 miles on an old car that has been in an accident?
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hunoraut
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Re: Tire issues - who to blame?

Post by hunoraut »

livesoft wrote: Thu Jan 13, 2022 9:28 am OK, but why pay for a higher quality tire that the OP is only going to use for 10,000 miles on an old car that has been in an accident?
why leave the underlying problem uncorrected on a car that "has been a dream" and expend 1/2 the price on low quality tires but has to be disposed 4x as frequently, while providing poorer traction

but hey, your car, your choice
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Re: Tire issues - who to blame?

Post by Jack FFR1846 »

Grifin wrote: Wed Jan 12, 2022 10:19 pm Are you sure your toe in the rear is in spec? Out of spec toe adjustment usually eats tires quicker than aggressive camber in my experience.

Grifin
THIS is the problem. Your rear wheels are toe'd out. Even extreme camber will wear a tire less than a bad toe in or out. Toe out and the inside wears out. If there's too much camber, with toe out, you have 2 things working to wear out your tires. I do my own alignments on my own cars and set my toe for both front and back at zero. I could care less what the factory specs are. I run zero with very little camber. This gives the best wear. Perhaps it's why in the snow tire threads, I can point out many times where I get 70k miles out of a set of snows running year round.
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tibbitts
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Re: Tire issues - who to blame?

Post by tibbitts »

We've been through a range of advice from helpful to not, but the OP doesn't appear to have the time or inclination to deal with whatever the problem is. This vehicle seems like it's given good service so it's probably best to just buy a new replacement. I'm guessing the OP has more money than time, so there's really nothing wrong with moving on.
urban
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Re: Tire issues - who to blame?

Post by urban »

dogbones wrote: Wed Jan 12, 2022 5:18 pm
chuckwalla wrote: Wed Jan 12, 2022 5:18 pm Do you regularly rotate your tires? Most cars have slight negative camber in the back by default.
Yes with every oil change
How do you know that the wheels on the rear axle are actually misaligned? If wheels are rotated, let say, every 5k miles, and right now rear tires are unevenly worn (less than 10k miles after being replaced), they could stay a full rotation period (5k miles) on the front, before being rotated back to the rear axle.

If you want to get to the bottom of this, you would need to go to a couple of alignment shops, and compare results. The alternative is to buy the least expensive tires every 10k miles or so. But with installation/balance and other fees it can get costly even with the cheapest tires.
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