What can I expect from new golf clubs

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Sandtrap
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Re: What can I expect from new golf clubs

Post by Sandtrap »

An elder retiree fellow once joined our 3some. He smoked a fat cigar and it never left his mouth (no comment). Did not hit very far but stayed in the fairway all day. And, on nearly every green, he chipped once from greenside and putted "once". Displayed incredible touch from 20-30 yards out to the cup. And, never landed in a sand trap or hazard.
This is a great way to lower scores. (cigar optional).

j :happy
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TN_Boy
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Re: What can I expect from new golf clubs

Post by TN_Boy »

Peculiar_Investor wrote: Mon Sep 21, 2020 6:33 pm
TN_Boy wrote: Mon Sep 21, 2020 9:53 am I upgraded a 10 year old set of irons recently and picked up 2 to 4 strokes a round. And 10 to 15 yards a club. The key being the senior flex shafts.
Did you compare the lofts between the sets? Many new 8 irons have the lofts of older 7 irons. A pretty decent write-up on the subject is Do equipment companies decrease iron lofts simply for more distance?
Oh yes, the lofts are stronger, continuing a trend that has been going on for decades. From memory, my new seven iron loft is about my old six iron loft, etc. through the bag.

But it is not just the loft.

I had a 10 year set of game improvement irons with regular flex steel shafts. I was fitted at a well-known golf resort/facility where I'm hitting to a fairway and they have a launch monitor so they are tracking both distance and ball flight.

Although from a different maker, these clubs are also game improvement irons, with a senior flex shaft. And my new seven iron goes 10 to 15 yards further and just as importantly, it goes higher. I also tried the same set of clubheads with a regular flex and while they went almost as far, they did not go as high (but still went as high or higher than my old set, matched club to club).

Yes, the loft is stronger, but as noted above, the ball flight was as high or higher with similar shafts. So I think the clubhead technology is better. I also *think* these clubs are a bit more forgiving on shots hit slightly thin; that's subjective so I won't definitely claim that as true.

What I can definitely say is true is that the ball goes both higher and further with the same club; the ball is absolutely stopping better on iron shots than it was. As per the article you linked, there are other changes in the clubhead itself rather than just loft.

Given my swing speed (in the 80s with the driver, neither terrible nor impressive for someone my age) the switch to senior flex was probably the biggest win. But that is part of getting new clubs and properly fitted ....

Also, interestingly, the fitting this time had the same adjustments to lie angle as the one I had over ten years ago, but at a different facility, with a somewhat different swing.
shiftyg
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Re: What can I expect from new golf clubs

Post by shiftyg »

I will add to the recommendation to get a good fitting, not from someone trying to sell you clubs, but from a pro with the right equipment to work with your body type and swing type to make considered recommendations. With that data in hand, you can shop knowing what you are looking for.
Then you know the rest: hit it, find it, and hit it again...
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Petrocelli
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Re: What can I expect from new golf clubs

Post by Petrocelli »

Yes. You should absolutely get new clubs. Particularly irons.

Look on Golf Digest's hot list for "game improvement irons."

About two years ago, I got new Taylor Made Irons and a new Callaway Epic Flash driver. I also got a Stroke Lab putter.

The irons made a huge difference. In particular, manufacturers keep working on irons to get the weight lower in the club. This means you are more likely to get the ball up in the air. My shots used to go really low, and often roll off the green. Now, they go really, really high.

As for the driver, it easily added 15-20 yards to my drive.

My index used to be over 18. I am now at 16.1.

I used to have trouble breaking 90. Now, I do it frequently, and have shot as low as an 82 this year.

So I would pick a set of clubs you like, and when the new model of the club comes out, get the "older" model. I got a new set of Taylor made irons for $499.
Petrocelli (not the real Rico, but just a fan)
jayk238
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Re: What can I expect from new golf clubs

Post by jayk238 »

dodgy55 wrote: Sun Sep 20, 2020 10:17 am Several years ago when I retired I took up the game of golf. My brother-in-law had some clubs he never used and gave them to me. After playing for the past several years I find my game has not improved to the level I feel I should be at. I am 72 years old and in good health. My golf handicap is around 26, but I feel I should be around 18 to 20. Hitting for distance is not an issue, my biggest concern is accuracy and consistency. Some folks have suggested a new set of clubs might make a big difference. My current clubs I am guessing are around 20 years old or more. I try to play once or twice a week. Not sure if my problems are due to lack of sufficient playing time; my lack of ability; or the age of my clubs. Before I shell out a +$1,000 or so for new clubs, I am curious whether other golfers have found a significant difference (either good or bad) with new golf clubs.
I am much younger but similar golf position.

I was using 20+ year FIL clubs.

I went ahead and tried them. Made sure I liked it and then bought these callaway XR set. It works great and i have experienced a tremendous improvement. With them you get all the improvements over 20 years at a very reasonable clost:

Largeer sweet spot w driver. Carbon shaft instead of steel with more forgiving flex. Better impact -the new heads are a combo of foam, (space metals- tungsten, steel, etc, thst are thinned out for better impact). The old clubs were limited in metal types-heavier, less aerodynamic egc.

The irons are lighter. Same metal same strength but lighter. The cavity backs were traditionally less forgiving and now are even more so due to improved manufacturing.

With all that said I paid 500 for a new set including irons i need plus new driver at golfgalaxy. Callaway xr speed
wfrobinette
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Re: What can I expect from new golf clubs

Post by wfrobinette »

dodgy55 wrote: Sun Sep 20, 2020 10:17 am Several years ago when I retired I took up the game of golf. My brother-in-law had some clubs he never used and gave them to me. After playing for the past several years I find my game has not improved to the level I feel I should be at. I am 72 years old and in good health. My golf handicap is around 26, but I feel I should be around 18 to 20. Hitting for distance is not an issue, my biggest concern is accuracy and consistency. Some folks have suggested a new set of clubs might make a big difference. My current clubs I am guessing are around 20 years old or more. I try to play once or twice a week. Not sure if my problems are due to lack of sufficient playing time; my lack of ability; or the age of my clubs. Before I shell out a +$1,000 or so for new clubs, I am curious whether other golfers have found a significant difference (either good or bad) with new golf clubs.
The absolute best way to remove strokes is to take lessons. At 40 I went and took 1 lesson and it knocked 5 strokes off my game.

It was simply the proper way address the ball

1. Under no circumstance do you take a practice swing as you address the ball. It's behind the ball just like the pros.
2. Address properly including footing
3. your waggle
4. Then fire away.

It isn't your clubs unless they are inhibiting your swing speed but still that's not going to account for 6 to 8 strokes. The grips could be shot though and that will affect scores.

You goal is to hit the ball straight, stay out of trouble, know what to do when in trouble, chip and put. My guess is your short game isn't what it needs to be. How many 3 puts do you have in a round? How many 1 puts? How many puts after you chip?

Get at least 1 lesson before you do anything. Make sure the basic fundamentals of address, grip etc are down pat. This should help woods and iron play. Don't try to change your swing much. Then get a few more lessons on chipping, wedge play(inside 75 yards and getting out of the bunker, putting. (this is over 75% of your strokes).

You do this and hit the range at least 1 time a week i guarantee you'll hit your target.

I know 70+ yo men that cant hit the ball 200 yards probably not even 175. but hit straight as an arrow, chip very well and average less than 2.25 puts and routinely shoot in the low 80's. Same with the women.

I would absolutely not buy off the shelf clubs.

I would find a club maker and have him/her make a custom set of knockoffs. They will look at your swing set the angles right, get the shafts right etc.
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Sandtrap
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Re: What can I expect from new golf clubs

Post by Sandtrap »

New fitted clubs eliminate that aspect from a poor game. (can't blame miss shots on the clubs.
Take your time, work with a PGA pro and not a club salesman.
lst take lessons to establish a solid groove and rhythm.
Then go to a fitting center or any held at the local clubs like ping, callaway, titleist, etc.
They will have intercgangeable heads and shafts etc.
Theres no money better spent in golf than doing this because your clubs will be fitted to "you" and work for many years, much like a boglehead portfolio.

Go to severl fittings with different brands until you know your specs.

For example: (mine)
This was done by the Ping fitting center at their factory in Phoenix many decades ago. Also had a fiting from Titleist and it was consistent.
My specs have not changed over my lifetime, so far.

Irons:
Standard loft,lie.
Shafts:Dynamic Gold R300 (not lightweight) Regular flex. 1/2 " over length.
Swingweight: D3
Cord grips standard weight and thickness.
Etc.

Putter. (huge)
Try all styles from Callaway ball to line to Ping to Cameron until you find one that likes you then stick with it and practice it more than any other club.
I have had the same Ping putter for nearly 50 years.
And used the same style of Titleist Vokey wedges for many decades.

Tips:
If there is a driving range at your course, warm up before every round.
Practice 80-90% of your range time on approach and wedge shots until you can drop 5-10 balls aroundthe 100 yard sign.
Carry and use at least 4 wedges.
Think like "Sevi" around the greens until your golf buddies grumble. :shock: :shock:
Go to the practice greens before and after every round and also between rounds until you become a familiar face.

You're on deck.
Fore!
j :D
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Cruise
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Re: What can I expect from new golf clubs

Post by Cruise »

A few thoughts:

Hybrids.

Professional fitting of clubs.

Play with better players. You can see how they approach various shots and observe their decision-making. Occasionally, you ask them about a shot they successfully took and why they made the decision. [Don't pester them or they won't play with you!]

Hire a pro to play 3-9 holes with you.

And, as someone else mentioned, swing slower and shorten the swing.
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Bogle7
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Re: What can I expect from new golf clubs

Post by Bogle7 »

I think most new golf clubs are a terrible investment.
Most will do the BK within a decade.
The demographics of golfers are not encouraging.
Run away.
A militant atheist.
wfrobinette
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Re: What can I expect from new golf clubs

Post by wfrobinette »

Sandtrap wrote: Wed Sep 23, 2020 4:56 pm New fitted clubs eliminate that aspect from a poor game. (can't blame miss shots on the clubs.
Take your time, work with a PGA pro and not a club salesman.
lst take lessons to establish a solid groove and rhythm.
Then go to a fitting center or any held at the local clubs like ping, callaway, titleist, etc.
They will have intercgangeable heads and shafts etc.
Theres no money better spent in golf than doing this because your clubs will be fitted to "you" and work for many years, much like a boglehead portfolio.

Go to severl fittings with different brands until you know your specs.

For example: (mine)
This was done by the Ping fitting center at their factory in Phoenix many decades ago. Also had a fiting from Titleist and it was consistent.
My specs have not changed over my lifetime, so far.

Irons:
Standard loft,lie.
Shafts:Dynamic Gold R300 (not lightweight) Regular flex. 1/2 " over length.
Swingweight: D3
Cord grips standard weight and thickness.
Etc.

Putter. (huge)
Try all styles from Callaway ball to line to Ping to Cameron until you find one that likes you then stick with it and practice it more than any other club.
I have had the same Ping putter for nearly 50 years.
And used the same style of Titleist Vokey wedges for many decades.

Tips:
If there is a driving range at your course, warm up before every round.
Practice 80-90% of your range time on approach and wedge shots until you can drop 5-10 balls aroundthe 100 yard sign.
Carry and use at least 4 wedges.
Think like "Sevi" around the greens until your golf buddies grumble. :shock: :shock:
Go to the practice greens before and after every round and also between rounds until you become a familiar face.

You're on deck.
Fore!
j :D
Excellent advice here.
TN_Boy
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Re: What can I expect from new golf clubs

Post by TN_Boy »

Bogle7 wrote: Wed Sep 23, 2020 8:50 pm I think most new golf clubs are a terrible investment.
Most will do the BK within a decade.
The demographics of golfers are not encouraging.
Run away.
My new golf clubs last year were not an investment -- they have no capital gains or dividends!

But they helped my golf game. Which was all I wanted.

I confess to not understanding the rest of your post (what is "BK"?).
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Sandtrap
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Re: What can I expect from new golf clubs

Post by Sandtrap »

Golf Tip:
How to record round statistics for every round, easily.

Take a course scorecard. No need for an extra booklet or distracting phone app, etc, so one can focus on playing golf vs stat tracking.

Every scorecard has 4 score rows for a foursome.
Keep one in your pocket for yourself (if someone else in a 4some is keeping score.
(Always record your own rounds).

Then, label each row like this. (in the box that is the name of the player).

Green In (enter in this box per hole as number of strokes before you finally get on the green) This tracks how well you do from tee to green.
Up n Downs (chip n putts, greenside, etc. As one putt greens) This tracks your short game accuracy and consistency.
Putts (putts per green IE: 3 putts, 4 putts) This tracks if you are a lousy putter, lag putter, etc.
Hazard/Penalties (enter as OB, etc. A Number) This is great to be conscious of course management/strategy.

The great thing about this tracking scorecard is it takes seconds once you get used to it. Fits in your pocket. And makes one focus on how you play vs the score, the drive length, the magic shot, etc.

Keep all these scorecards. Large sharpie on the upper left and right. Course and date.
You can store these things up in stacks with rubber bands for years and see a pattern of game strengths and weaknesses.
And, even if you never look at them ever after a round, it functioned to keep you focused during the round, on "your game", not what others are doing, etc.

Finally, realize that lowest consistent score is different for everyone based on physical ability, natural talent and coordination etc, time constraints to play and practice, budget constraints to engage a monthly "coach" vs an occasional pro bandaid lesson, course restrictions by budget, location, quality, slope (difficulty), and who one regularly plays with since every group has different focuses and harassment levels. . . . . especially seniors. And, on a personal note that's different for everyone, think about what gambling on the course does for you and your game, positive or negative.

And, if anyone says, I don't care about what I score, I'm here to have fun. That's a lie. Isn't an eagle more fun than a blowout survival hole at 5 over? :shock: :shock:

j :happy
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MDfan
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Re: What can I expect from new golf clubs

Post by MDfan »

S4C5 wrote: Tue Sep 22, 2020 3:58 am I have played golf off and on my whole life and have been using the same clubs for 20+ years.

I just went to a custom clubfitter and ended up with a set up custom Callaway Mavrik clubs. The total cost was around $2300.

The difference is phenomenal. I am hitting each club at least 20 yards longer and carrying my drives 300.

I'd highly recommend finding the best clubfitter in your area (ideally who fits all major brands) and having them select the best gear for you.

Expect to spend $2000-$2500 on a good full set. Don't cheap out on old or off-brand stuff. $1000 is not reasonable if you want new gear. When a round of golf costs $100, it doesn't make sense to try and save a few bucks on gear if you play a lot.

There are many guys on the PGA Tour who don't carry their drives 300 yards. And where do you live that a round of golf costs $100? I play a lot of very nice courses around DC/Baltimore area and never pay more than $60-65.
blastoff
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Re: What can I expect from new golf clubs

Post by blastoff »

How crappy are your current clubs?
If they are really bad or old, something new might help a bit.

Otherwise, I think you can expect to be mad you aren't hitting the ball any better even though you spent $1000 : )

I would try some out. And if you aren't hurting for money, maybe get fitted.

The cheaper option is that there are a lot of people that buy new golf clubs so there is a tremendous used market.

I have a fairly nice swing but I am pretty inconsistent. You could see one shot and think I am a 6 handicap and another and think I shoot 110. The latter is closer to the truth than the former. My clubs have nothing to do with my good or bad outcomes.

I do always hit a couple clubs well (one is a high quality but cheaply acquired used wedge). Don't know why, but I just like the feel and look of it and I tend to hit it well. You might wind up finding some clubs like that that work well for you.
TN_Boy
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Re: What can I expect from new golf clubs

Post by TN_Boy »

MDfan wrote: Thu Sep 24, 2020 11:18 am
S4C5 wrote: Tue Sep 22, 2020 3:58 am I have played golf off and on my whole life and have been using the same clubs for 20+ years.

I just went to a custom clubfitter and ended up with a set up custom Callaway Mavrik clubs. The total cost was around $2300.

The difference is phenomenal. I am hitting each club at least 20 yards longer and carrying my drives 300.

I'd highly recommend finding the best clubfitter in your area (ideally who fits all major brands) and having them select the best gear for you.

Expect to spend $2000-$2500 on a good full set. Don't cheap out on old or off-brand stuff. $1000 is not reasonable if you want new gear. When a round of golf costs $100, it doesn't make sense to try and save a few bucks on gear if you play a lot.

There are many guys on the PGA Tour who don't carry their drives 300 yards. And where do you live that a round of golf costs $100? I play a lot of very nice courses around DC/Baltimore area and never pay more than $60-65.
In my area you can easily spend $100 playing on the weekend riding a cart. Or you can play during the week (obviously not an option for everyone) and walk (also not an option for everyone) and spend $25 to $60 depending on the course.

A 300 yard carry on level ground is pro length if that was measured accurately :-)
nguy44
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Re: What can I expect from new golf clubs

Post by nguy44 »

This is a very useful thread for me. I am in a similar situation as the Topic Author. I have a low end set of clubs (Callaway Strata) I bought 7 years ago brand new. I had only been playing golf for a few years with clubs purchased at Goodwill. before that. Since retiring 2 years ago, the biggest factor in my improved handicap has been more frequent playing - from 1-2 times a week to 3-4 times a week. Most times I play with friends who are better than me. On weeks when I cannot get out more than 2 times I will usually go to the driving range. At age 62, I tend to hit the ball straight but feel I should be getting more distance -a tee shot over 160 yards is very good for me, and I can't seem to hit more than 130 yards with my lowest iron (6) or 150 yards with my 4h and 5h hybrids. The distances include both flight and ground travel. Maybe too much baseball/softball when I was younger, :happy so I am working on fixing that.

So now, because I have money to burn (yay retirement! :happy ), I have been considering treating myself to a new set of clubs. I am of average height and weight(5' 10", 170 lbs). I am a lefty golfer, which seems to have challenges both in the available scope of good clubs and fitters with experience with left handed golfers. The are "big box" stores like Dicks, 2nd Swing, and Golf Galaxy within 30 minutes of me that I have been considering, but it is still a matter of trust that I need to mentally deal with, that they are not just trying to sell me new clubs. This thread has been helpful in that regard as it not just the clubs I might want, but a look at my swing as well. Even if I choose to by non-fitted clubs, it looks likes the fitting process should be worthwhile.
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FrankLUSMC
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Re: What can I expect from new golf clubs

Post by FrankLUSMC »

I haven't seen it posted yet, so I will make my recommendation.
I have been playing off and on for over 50 years. I played my very best in my whole life after I attended a 5 day golf camp. Your instructors will get to know your game and what you need to improve. They will also take you out for 3-4 holes at the end of the day for course instruction.
The mental game is also covered especially when having to carry hazards or needing to get up and down from bunkers.
After my 5 day camp I halved my handicap from 12 to 6. It blew my mind. And I am thinking of doing it again now that I am retired.
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Re: What can I expect from new golf clubs

Post by Barkingsparrow »

FrankLUSMC wrote: Thu Sep 24, 2020 4:20 pm I haven't seen it posted yet, so I will make my recommendation.
I have been playing off and on for over 50 years. I played my very best in my whole life after I attended a 5 day golf camp. Your instructors will get to know your game and what you need to improve. They will also take you out for 3-4 holes at the end of the day for course instruction.
The mental game is also covered especially when having to carry hazards or needing to get up and down from bunkers.
After my 5 day camp I halved my handicap from 12 to 6. It blew my mind. And I am thinking of doing it again now that I am retired.
I did a golf camp a long time ago and I improved quite a bit, but not as dramatically as you. However - the camp was on a college campus and run by the coach of the golf team, and long since discontinued.

Could you share which golf camp you went to? Or golf camps you may recommend?
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Re: What can I expect from new golf clubs

Post by Barkingsparrow »

nguy44 wrote: Thu Sep 24, 2020 3:23 pm This is a very useful thread for me. I am in a similar situation as the Topic Author. I have a low end set of clubs (Callaway Strata) I bought 7 years ago brand new. I had only been playing golf for a few years with clubs purchased at Goodwill. before that. Since retiring 2 years ago, the biggest factor in my improved handicap has been more frequent playing - from 1-2 times a week to 3-4 times a week. Most times I play with friends who are better than me. On weeks when I cannot get out more than 2 times I will usually go to the driving range. At age 62, I tend to hit the ball straight but feel I should be getting more distance -a tee shot over 160 yards is very good for me, and I can't seem to hit more than 130 yards with my lowest iron (6) or 150 yards with my 4h and 5h hybrids. The distances include both flight and ground travel. Maybe too much baseball/softball when I was younger, :happy so I am working on fixing that.
I'm also 62, just getting back into hitting after 2 years off due to injury and even with shortening my swing and swinging much slower to hopefully alleviate the stress on my body I'm easily getting about 200 in the air with my driver. I used to be more in the 250 range 10 years ago before a series of nagging injuries caused me to sometimes have to quit for a few years and rehab.

I'm not an expert by any means on the swing - but 160? Are you popping it up real high? Or you are releasing way too early.
TN_Boy
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Re: What can I expect from new golf clubs

Post by TN_Boy »

Barkingsparrow wrote: Thu Sep 24, 2020 4:34 pm
nguy44 wrote: Thu Sep 24, 2020 3:23 pm This is a very useful thread for me. I am in a similar situation as the Topic Author. I have a low end set of clubs (Callaway Strata) I bought 7 years ago brand new. I had only been playing golf for a few years with clubs purchased at Goodwill. before that. Since retiring 2 years ago, the biggest factor in my improved handicap has been more frequent playing - from 1-2 times a week to 3-4 times a week. Most times I play with friends who are better than me. On weeks when I cannot get out more than 2 times I will usually go to the driving range. At age 62, I tend to hit the ball straight but feel I should be getting more distance -a tee shot over 160 yards is very good for me, and I can't seem to hit more than 130 yards with my lowest iron (6) or 150 yards with my 4h and 5h hybrids. The distances include both flight and ground travel. Maybe too much baseball/softball when I was younger, :happy so I am working on fixing that.
I'm also 62, just getting back into hitting after 2 years off due to injury and even with shortening my swing and swinging much slower to hopefully alleviate the stress on my body I'm easily getting about 200 in the air with my driver. I used to be more in the 250 range 10 years ago before a series of nagging injuries caused me to sometimes have to quit for a few years and rehab.

I'm not an expert by any means on the swing - but 160? Are you popping it up real high? Or you are releasing way too early.
nguy44 may have the wrong clubs -- for example, if not senior flex that's probably wrong -- but surely you realize that different people have different swing speeds -- some of this is genetics, some of it conditioning, some of it swing efficiency.

There are lots of 60+ golfers that cannot carry their drive 200 yards. There are in fact a non-trivial number of under 60 golfers that cannot carry their drive 200 yards. A true 250 yard carry like you could do 10 years ago is not that common (it's not super rare either).
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Sandtrap
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Re: What can I expect from new golf clubs

Post by Sandtrap »

Barkingsparrow wrote: Thu Sep 24, 2020 4:34 pm
nguy44 wrote: Thu Sep 24, 2020 3:23 pm This is a very useful thread for me. I am in a similar situation as the Topic Author. I have a low end set of clubs (Callaway Strata) I bought 7 years ago brand new. I had only been playing golf for a few years with clubs purchased at Goodwill. before that. Since retiring 2 years ago, the biggest factor in my improved handicap has been more frequent playing - from 1-2 times a week to 3-4 times a week. Most times I play with friends who are better than me. On weeks when I cannot get out more than 2 times I will usually go to the driving range. At age 62, I tend to hit the ball straight but feel I should be getting more distance -a tee shot over 160 yards is very good for me, and I can't seem to hit more than 130 yards with my lowest iron (6) or 150 yards with my 4h and 5h hybrids. The distances include both flight and ground travel. Maybe too much baseball/softball when I was younger, :happy so I am working on fixing that.
I'm also 62, just getting back into hitting after 2 years off due to injury and even with shortening my swing and swinging much slower to hopefully alleviate the stress on my body I'm easily getting about 200 in the air with my driver. I used to be more in the 250 range 10 years ago before a series of nagging injuries caused me to sometimes have to quit for a few years and rehab.

I'm not an expert by any means on the swing - but 160? Are you popping it up real high? Or you are releasing way too early.
Perhaps.......lessons with a PGA certified Professional. They all teach 6-8 positions, proper angles (not like a baseball swing, read "The Golfing Machine",
and a release within those angles. An arm swing which many have has a speed limit because of lack of angles and no release thru the impact zone. Think snapping a whip vs swinging a sledge hammer. This is why senior pros still get the ball out.

Also lack of angles and timing and release = low swing speed so the ball has less spin which is what keeps it in the air. Rock over water vs hydroplane.

Many have heavy spinal and torque stress from muscling a swing rotation (baseball).

Many average golfers IMHO would do better emulating a LPGA swing, especially seniors, vs a PGA 300 yard drive. (swing like a girl).

Notice how short a swing Fuzzy and other senior tour players have.

As for 200 yard carries off the tee. Tee off from the senior tees for a realistic game as Palmer says. Leave the Black macho tees for the Scratch "players".

Hope this helps to seek lessons.
OP: lessons. not a lesson.

Fore!
j :D
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Barkingsparrow
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Re: What can I expect from new golf clubs

Post by Barkingsparrow »

Sandtrap wrote: Thu Sep 24, 2020 7:32 pm Many average golfers IMHO would do better emulating a LPGA swing, especially seniors, vs a PGA 300 yard drive. (swing like a girl).

Notice how short a swing Fuzzy and other senior tour players have.
That is a good point. PGA players typically have a talent and athleticism that us duffers can not come close to matching. I've always felt that watching the LPGA players swing was a more effective study - especially their tempo. I've been to a few LGPA tournaments, especially the Solheim Cup, and was struck by their smooth, slow tempo.

Speaking of Fuzzy - as part of a grand-opening of a golf course he designed - he had this private event where he played the course and a select group of people were able to walk with him and listen to his commentary. My friend and I got wind of it and sort of crashed the party but no one said anything or asked for any sort of ID. There were oh, only about 20-25 people. I cannot state how amazing it was to actually walk with a PGA legend like Fuzzy and watch him play, from right up close. Likewise - we once were part of a very small crowd following (had to keep a short distance away)- wait for it - none other than Jack Nicklaus at his Memorial Course for some made for TV golf event (3-tour tournament?). I went to the restroom for a quick break, and who came in right next to me? Jack Nicklaus.
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FrankLUSMC
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Re: What can I expect from new golf clubs

Post by FrankLUSMC »

Barkingsparrow wrote: Thu Sep 24, 2020 4:25 pm
FrankLUSMC wrote: Thu Sep 24, 2020 4:20 pm I haven't seen it posted yet, so I will make my recommendation.
I have been playing off and on for over 50 years. I played my very best in my whole life after I attended a 5 day golf camp. Your instructors will get to know your game and what you need to improve. They will also take you out for 3-4 holes at the end of the day for course instruction.
The mental game is also covered especially when having to carry hazards or needing to get up and down from bunkers.
After my 5 day camp I halved my handicap from 12 to 6. It blew my mind. And I am thinking of doing it again now that I am retired.
I did a golf camp a long time ago and I improved quite a bit, but not as dramatically as you. However - the camp was on a college campus and run by the coach of the golf team, and long since discontinued.

Could you share which golf camp you went to? Or golf camps you may recommend?
My last camp was in 2002 in the Dulles VA area. But if I had to choose now I would take a vacationa t any one of these:

https://www.golfdigest.com/story/best-g ... -academies
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Re: What can I expect from new golf clubs

Post by TonyDAntonio »

Note, I haven't read all the posts in this thread so this may have been covered.

I have been playing golf since I was 10. I'm 61. Played tournament golf during my teens.

No substitute for getting better. New clubs won't help nearly as much.

With that said here is what I've experienced with new clubs:

1. New drivers make the most difference assuming you are replacing one that is reasonably old. Eg. 10 years old

2. Hybrids make a huge difference over long irons. You hardly even have to get them fitted correctly for that to be the case.

3. A new putter will probably be much better than an old heel shafted one that has terrible weighting. With that said you still have to read greens and be able to consistently start the ball on line.

4. New wedges will give you great spin over old ones but you have to be a decent player and play the right ball to take advantage.

5. New irons won't make a huge difference if you are not that good. You have to make decent swings with any iron no matter how good the technology.

My two cents.
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Re: What can I expect from new golf clubs

Post by S4C5 »

TN_Boy wrote: Thu Sep 24, 2020 2:42 pm

A 300 yard carry on level ground is pro length if that was measured accurately :-)
Yes, I was carrying them in the 280-300 range when getting fitted for my new clubs. It was amazing. I couldn't even get that on rollout with my old driver. Accuracy is a different story. (I am not a good golfer and don't play a lot, but I know how to swing).

There's a segment of the sport of golf that is purely focused on long drive. Instead of playing 18 holes, these "players" do long drive competitions. I know someone who does this. His hobby/sport isn't golf. It's driving. He can regularly drive 400 yards.
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Re: What can I expect from new golf clubs

Post by S4C5 »

MDfan wrote: Thu Sep 24, 2020 11:18 am
There are many guys on the PGA Tour who don't carry their drives 300 yards. And where do you live that a round of golf costs $100? I play a lot of very nice courses around DC/Baltimore area and never pay more than $60-65.
I mean, I'm an anonymous internet poster, so of course I could be lying and you could call me a liar all you want, but what's the point of going back and forth trying to prove the unproveable? There's not a lot of skill in driving the ball 300 yards. You need good equipment (point of my post), strength/mass to generate the necessary clubhead speed (I'm in my mid 30s with decent core strength), and a reasonable enough swing for the club to impact the ball squarely at speed. The last item can be generated in all sorts of awful ways. In my case, I will hit every other shot thin, fat, or hooked, but 50% of the time I make good contact and get good distance usually not on target. I'd say probably only about 10% of my drives have good contact and are reasonably straight. I'm not a consistent golfer. If I said I was carrying 300 yard drives every time straight down the fairway, that would be a different story!

Bottom line is it's not uncommon for there to be people like me who occasionally knock the ball very far off the tee but still put up a triple digit score. 300+ yard drives don't help your score a lot when you knock your second shot in the lake, skull your dropped shot over the green, chunk your chip onto the green, and four putt.

Regarding the courses, it's not hugely about where you live but rather than quality of the course. There's excellent courses that cost a lot in low COL areas!
I live in the middle of nowhere and have one course that sucks and costs about what you say.
But last time I travelled to Scottsdale, I paid over $200 for a round at Grayhawk (think the cart+greens fees were $200 and rental clubs were $60 or so).
$100 is a typical rate for 18 with a cart at a "nice" course in most places.
And yes there are definitely good courses in the $60-$70 range you mention. But there's a big difference between those and the ones that cost double that. Like most things, you get what you pay for.
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Re: What can I expect from new golf clubs

Post by jibantik »

There ain't no material in the world that can fix double bogey golf on its own.
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Re: What can I expect from new golf clubs

Post by MDfan »

S4C5 wrote: Fri Sep 25, 2020 11:10 am
TN_Boy wrote: Thu Sep 24, 2020 2:42 pm

A 300 yard carry on level ground is pro length if that was measured accurately :-)
Yes, I was carrying them in the 280-300 range when getting fitted for my new clubs. It was amazing. I couldn't even get that on rollout with my old driver. Accuracy is a different story. (I am not a good golfer and don't play a lot, but I know how to swing).

There's a segment of the sport of golf that is purely focused on long drive. Instead of playing 18 holes, these "players" do long drive competitions. I know someone who does this. His hobby/sport isn't golf. It's driving. He can regularly drive 400 yards.

Those guys are fun to watch. There's a kid from our neighborhood in Maryland who has recently won a number of the professional long drive events. He almost comes off the ground when he swings. He has a video where he hits a golf ball 300 yards with a putter.
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Re: What can I expect from new golf clubs

Post by Murgatroyd »

Sandtrap wrote: Thu Sep 24, 2020 10:41 am Golf Tip:
How to record round statistics for every round, easily.

Take a course scorecard. No need for an extra booklet or distracting phone app, etc, so one can focus on playing golf vs stat tracking.

Every scorecard has 4 score rows for a foursome.
Keep one in your pocket for yourself (if someone else in a 4some is keeping score.
(Always record your own rounds).

Then, label each row like this. (in the box that is the name of the player).

Green In (enter in this box per hole as number of strokes before you finally get on the green) This tracks how well you do from tee to green.
Up n Downs (chip n putts, greenside, etc. As one putt greens) This tracks your short game accuracy and consistency.
Putts (putts per green IE: 3 putts, 4 putts) This tracks if you are a lousy putter, lag putter, etc.
Hazard/Penalties (enter as OB, etc. A Number) This is great to be conscious of course management/strategy.

The great thing about this tracking scorecard is it takes seconds once you get used to it. Fits in your pocket. And makes one focus on how you play vs the score, the drive length, the magic shot, etc.

Keep all these scorecards. Large sharpie on the upper left and right. Course and date.
You can store these things up in stacks with rubber bands for years and see a pattern of game strengths and weaknesses.
And, even if you never look at them ever after a round, it functioned to keep you focused during the round, on "your game", not what others are doing, etc.

Finally, realize that lowest consistent score is different for everyone based on physical ability, natural talent and coordination etc, time constraints to play and practice, budget constraints to engage a monthly "coach" vs an occasional pro bandaid lesson, course restrictions by budget, location, quality, slope (difficulty), and who one regularly plays with since every group has different focuses and harassment levels. . . . . especially seniors. And, on a personal note that's different for everyone, think about what gambling on the course does for you and your game, positive or negative.

And, if anyone says, I don't care about what I score, I'm here to have fun. That's a lie. Isn't an eagle more fun than a blowout survival hole at 5 over? :shock: :shock:

j :happy
Or, you can have technology do all of the above and much more, including really knowing your distance with every club for $120. https://shotscope.com/us/
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Re: What can I expect from new golf clubs

Post by TN_Boy »

S4C5 wrote: Fri Sep 25, 2020 11:10 am
TN_Boy wrote: Thu Sep 24, 2020 2:42 pm

A 300 yard carry on level ground is pro length if that was measured accurately :-)
Yes, I was carrying them in the 280-300 range when getting fitted for my new clubs. It was amazing. I couldn't even get that on rollout with my old driver. Accuracy is a different story. (I am not a good golfer and don't play a lot, but I know how to swing).

There's a segment of the sport of golf that is purely focused on long drive. Instead of playing 18 holes, these "players" do long drive competitions. I know someone who does this. His hobby/sport isn't golf. It's driving. He can regularly drive 400 yards.
I'm not going to doubt you :-), but it is unusual. Someone that can carry a drive 300 yards on level ground with no wind is swinging at the same speed as the longish guys on the PGA. Which is a very fast swing (did they tell you your swing speed?). I have seen "non good" golfers that are pretty long, but a 300 carry is really long.

You should practice up and try to get better -- length is a weapon and you could get pretty good. With that power you might consider gearing down and hitting 3 wood :-) You'll still be way down there! Especially if you play from the right tees (the fact a person can hit it a long way doesn't mean they should be playing from the back tees .....back tees are for people who are both long and good).

Any skepticism, of course, is because most people tend to estimate wrong. It's easy for example, to forget that while the scorecard says the hole is 400 yards, the tees are up and the hole is playing about 390. And it hit the fairway and rolled thirty yards. But the golfer gets up there, sees he is 100 yards from the hole, and says "I carried the ball 300 yards!" The actual carry in this example was only 260 (which by the way is still really good).

Same thing for irons. I know my iron distances because I shoot the flag with a rangefinder, and then see where the ball mark is on the green.
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Re: What can I expect from new golf clubs

Post by Peculiar_Investor »

jibantik wrote: Fri Sep 25, 2020 11:34 am There ain't no material in the world that can fix double bogey golf on its own.
Don't follow a bad shot with a stupid one. Play smart and within your skills, don't play the hero shot.
Normal people… believe that if it ain’t broke, don’t fix it. Engineers believe that if it ain’t broke, it doesn’t have enough features yet. – Scott Adams
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Re: What can I expect from new golf clubs

Post by tm3 »

Sandtrap wrote: Thu Sep 24, 2020 10:41 am Golf Tip:
How to record round statistics for every round, easily.
Nice tip -- thanks for posting it!
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Re: What can I expect from new golf clubs

Post by Sandtrap »

Peculiar_Investor wrote: Sat Sep 26, 2020 8:43 am
jibantik wrote: Fri Sep 25, 2020 11:34 am There ain't no material in the world that can fix double bogey golf on its own.
Don't follow a bad shot with a stupid one. Play smart and within your skills, don't play the hero shot.
+1
OP:
Two lines I've heard from fellow players and coaches that were memorable for life.

(from a retired Stanford Golf Team coach) "Swing like a girl"

(from a retired PGA pro) "Play boring golf", Look at Jim Furyk's style of play (not his swing).

Some examples:
Par 5
180 yards to a tight green, 1 shot penalty or over already, 5 iron or 4 hybrid depending on your game?
How about 9 iron or PW to a perfect approach position, then a 50-60 yard lob wedge to a perfect green spot setting you up for an uphill putt.

Par 4 (short and challenging, lot's of hazards off the tee)
3 buddies on a senior 4some pull out drivers off the tee (as usual on every non par 3 hole).
How about accepting a bogey on this difficult (high slope) hole.
Take a hybrid off the tee and layup to a strategic open spot with the least hazards (fairway sand/water/dogleg).
Short or Medium iron to a half swing lob wedge to that tight small green. Stay out of trouble.
Get your bogey, while others might get double or far worse, out of sand, out of water, out of rough, or lost balls.

*Play for bogeys, let the pars happen as they will for a sub 90 round.
j :D
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Re: What can I expect from new golf clubs

Post by Peculiar_Investor »

Another great wisdom I learned long ago. For a course you play regularly, stand on the green and look backwards to the tee. What shot would you want to play into the green? How do you get to that place from the tee? Often that results in a different approach to a hole than just blasting driver off the tee. Course architects put bunkers and hazards for a reason and looking at the hole backwards can often unlock how to play a hole successfully.

If you do record some statistics on your play, take a look at the holes where you often have high scores. Could you play the hole differently to increase your chances of a better score?

An 18 handicap has bogey as their 'par' for the hole, so play the hole appropriately and with than knowledge in hand and you'll probably score better.
Normal people… believe that if it ain’t broke, don’t fix it. Engineers believe that if it ain’t broke, it doesn’t have enough features yet. – Scott Adams
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Re: What can I expect from new golf clubs

Post by TN_Boy »

Peculiar_Investor wrote: Sat Sep 26, 2020 9:42 am Another great wisdom I learned long ago. For a course you play regularly, stand on the green and look backwards to the tee. What shot would you want to play into the green? How do you get to that place from the tee? Often that results in a different approach to a hole than just blasting driver off the tee. Course architects put bunkers and hazards for a reason and looking at the hole backwards can often unlock how to play a hole successfully.

If you do record some statistics on your play, take a look at the holes where you often have high scores. Could you play the hole differently to increase your chances of a better score?

An 18 handicap has bogey as their 'par' for the hole, so play the hole appropriately and with than knowledge in hand and you'll probably score better.
It didn't always help my scores, but once I realized that for me, bogey WAS par, I relaxed a bit. And just like pros may struggle to make par on a particularly difficult (for them) hole, I might struggle to make bogey on that one long par 4 with the small green.
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Re: What can I expect from new golf clubs

Post by Sandtrap »

TN_Boy wrote: Sat Sep 26, 2020 10:21 am
Peculiar_Investor wrote: Sat Sep 26, 2020 9:42 am Another great wisdom I learned long ago. For a course you play regularly, stand on the green and look backwards to the tee. What shot would you want to play into the green? How do you get to that place from the tee? Often that results in a different approach to a hole than just blasting driver off the tee. Course architects put bunkers and hazards for a reason and looking at the hole backwards can often unlock how to play a hole successfully.

If you do record some statistics on your play, take a look at the holes where you often have high scores. Could you play the hole differently to increase your chances of a better score?

An 18 handicap has bogey as their 'par' for the hole, so play the hole appropriately and with than knowledge in hand and you'll probably score better.
It didn't always help my scores, but once I realized that for me, bogey WAS par, I relaxed a bit. And just like pros may struggle to make par on a particularly difficult (for them) hole, I might struggle to make bogey on that one long par 4 with the small green.
+10000
yes!
play bogey golf reliably
then hone a short game razor sharp until people either envy or despise you
and you will shoot in the mid 80's all year long

Youre on deck....
Fore!
j :D
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Re: What can I expect from new golf clubs

Post by drdrgolf »

Much like putting lipstick on a pig. Same pig looking better. Your game is your game excep-t with dedication to improving.
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Re: What can I expect from new golf clubs

Post by michaelingp »

Sandtrap wrote: Tue Sep 22, 2020 12:06 pm An elder retiree fellow once joined our 3some. He smoked a fat cigar and it never left his mouth (no comment). Did not hit very far but stayed in the fairway all day. And, on nearly every green, he chipped once from greenside and putted "once". Displayed incredible touch from 20-30 yards out to the cup. And, never landed in a sand trap or hazard.
This is a great way to lower scores. (cigar optional).

j :happy
Haha! I was going to say something to this effect. Back when my kid was in his teens (with the nicest golf swing you ever saw), we went on one of those Myrtle Beach golf vacations where you play 2 different courses a day for a week. We would sometimes get paired up with elderly golfers. I will never forget, they didn't hit the ball very far, but straight down the fairway, sometimes hardly in the air. But by the time they got to the green their score was way lower than mine because they made zero mistakes, no balls in the woods or traps or water. In golf, less is more.
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Re: What can I expect from new golf clubs

Post by StevieG72 »

I tried to pick up golf but never did well and did not have time to practice enough, lost interest.

I spent maybe $300 max for a name brand driver, set of hybrid clubs ( bought online) and a golf bag. The hybrid clubs seemed more foregiving with my awful form, but maybe it was in my head.

If you are serious about the game it makes sense to get a set of clubs.
Fools think their own way is right, but the wise listen to others.
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Re: What can I expect from new golf clubs

Post by rotorhead »

This is a great thread, OP. Lots of good advice here.

There’s no question you need newer clubs, not necessarily new clubs; & most likely senior shafts. The technology has improved dramatically in the past 20 years. Lots of good, used clubs for sale – Ebay is good source. The bigger golf stores have used clubs for sale. My favorite is Callaway Pre Owned. Other sites have been mentioned.

Being fitted for clubs is good idea, but not totally necessary. Are you taller than normal? Are your arms longer than normal? Are your hands larger or smaller than normal? All these things affect your club (& grips) selection. If there’s a PGA Superstore, or Edwin Watts, etc., near you, go to them for a fitting. Then get the clubs that fit you. Don’t have to be a new set.

I worked in a golf store part time for 3 years after retirement. Was a great experience; and really helped me get back into the game. And I can’t tell you how many times we would sell a set of the “latest & greatest” to someone in the morning; only to have them return in the afternoon, saying they hated these clubs! Restocking fee; and they left with their old clubs. You cannot buy a better golf game. It only comes with dedicated, disciplined practice.

My own experience: I played golf as young man, then got too busy in my work to practice; so gave it up until I retired. Golf is a frustrating sport. You can hit the perfect shot, then follow that with a total screw up. To play consistently well (and have fun) you have to play often; or at least practice often. If you can’t do that you will never achieve the consistency that gives you the satisfaction of playing a good round.

When I retired in 2003, Dave Peltz was on the Golf Channel a lot; and his advice on chipping & putting improved my game dramatically. “Play for 90” was one of his axioms. Don’t obsess with paring every hole. If you play every hole for bogey, then you will shoot 90; & you will get the occasional par, & even birdie, that will put you in the 80’s; and make you feel good.

None of us “old guys” are going to hit it like the pros on tour do; so you have to find “your game” & play to your strengths. And don’t obsess over distance. Hitting it 300 yards doesn’t necessarily make your male member grow any bigger! So swallow your pride, and move up to the Green tees. Hit your tee shot into the middle of the fairway, plan your second shot according to what’s in front of you, give yourself a reasonable shot into the green; and make your putt. Sounds simple doesn’t it. But it takes discipline & playing/practice to make it happen. Spend lots of time chipping & putting; those are the “money” shots. I rarely make the green in regulation; but I one-putt a lot.

The fundamentals are most important: Have a good grip, & develop a “repeatable” swing. The rest is practice & play. In my own case, I broke 80 for the first time in June this year. Felt great, I shot a solid 77; I was on fire that day. Three days later, was 3 over after 11 holes; and then just couldn’t hold it together – fatigue, anxiety, whatever. Finished with 85. Haven’t been below 85 since. But I will, I’m sure. Still looking for the first hole-in-one!

It’s a great sport! The main thing is to play well enough so that you enjoy the round; and don’t leave every time frustrated. Oh, & wear a good, properly fitting glove; and use a good ball. You will notice the difference.
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Re: What can I expect from new golf clubs

Post by Sandtrap »

michaelingp wrote: Sat Sep 26, 2020 10:42 am
Sandtrap wrote: Tue Sep 22, 2020 12:06 pm An elder retiree fellow once joined our 3some. He smoked a fat cigar and it never left his mouth (no comment). Did not hit very far but stayed in the fairway all day. And, on nearly every green, he chipped once from greenside and putted "once". Displayed incredible touch from 20-30 yards out to the cup. And, never landed in a sand trap or hazard.
This is a great way to lower scores. (cigar optional).

j :happy
Haha! I was going to say something to this effect. Back when my kid was in his teens (with the nicest golf swing you ever saw), we went on one of those Myrtle Beach golf vacations where you play 2 different courses a day for a week. We would sometimes get paired up with elderly golfers. I will never forget, they didn't hit the ball very far, but straight down the fairway, sometimes hardly in the air. But by the time they got to the green their score was way lower than mine because they made zero mistakes, no balls in the woods or traps or water. In golf, less is more.
+1

Lesson story for OP:

I was a teenager with a PGA grooved swing. Set of brand "new" mixed clubs from Salvation Army and a "new" canvas bag. 3 "woods" with steel shafts. Mixed set of Titleist and Tommy Amour irons (blades). A brass blade putter that I shined up with car polish.
Thought I could hussle up a game. One day I met a senior in the public clubhouse at a local par 3 course which was one of my favorites. Got challenged. 25 cent skins. After 18 holes I owed that guy 18 bucks and that was all I had, and I had to pay up. Left a rotten taste in my mouth and kept me humble for a lifetime.

That senior player never left the fairway and nearly one putted every green.
Sneaky fellows!

Drive for show. . . putt for dough.
j :D
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Re: What can I expect from new golf clubs

Post by carolinaman »

I am a lifelong golfer age 76. Properly fitted clubs will make a difference but you will benefit more from lessons at this time. You said your problems begin after you leave the tee which sounds like your irons and fairway clubs are your biggest issue. A pro will focus on your fundamentals, grip/stance/alignment/swing. A few lessons can improve your mechanics and your game. The pro does not have to follow you around the course to fix your swing and mechanics. You will be amazed at the difference lessons can make.

After taking some lessons, new properly fitted clubs will definitely improve your game, but you need to fix your swing mechanics first.

If you do get new clubs, I recommend graphite shafts for all your clubs. It will be much easier on your body.

Best wishes.
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Re: What can I expect from new golf clubs

Post by ladders11 »

Buy used or last year's models
Have more fun
Driver
Hybrids
Game improvement style irons
Lessons (can also video yourself, use YouTube)
Tracking your game (e.g. Arccos)
Graphite shafts
Senior flex

I put these in ranked order IMHO
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Re: What can I expect from new golf clubs

Post by tm3 »

Sandtrap wrote: Sat Sep 26, 2020 9:10 am
(from a retired PGA pro) "Play boring golf", Look at Jim Furyk's style of play (not his swing).
Good advice, and IMO a great way to practice it is to play your buddies for a small bet. I like match play 18 holes for $5. One of the great things about golf is the handicap system provides a way to have a fair match regardless of skill level, whether I am giving strokes or getting strokes.

Forking over $5 every round is a great way to reinforce the penalty for not playing smart.
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Re: What can I expect from new golf clubs

Post by Dogbreath650 »

I like the recommendations for buying used clubs (from a financial sense) but how does one get fitted correctly for a club you're buying on line?
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Re: What can I expect from new golf clubs

Post by mac808 »

Dogbreath650 wrote: Mon Sep 28, 2020 11:13 am I like the recommendations for buying used clubs (from a financial sense) but how does one get fitted correctly for a club you're buying on line?
There's a company called Curated(.com) that will match people online with golf pros for 1:1 chats to help advise them on what to buy. I don't know what it's like for golf, but I did it for another purchase (snowboarding) and it was fantastic. Good timing for a service like this since a lot of these specialty retail shops are closed down and the experts who used to work there are sitting on their hands with not much to do.
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Re: What can I expect from new golf clubs

Post by J295 »

Dogbreath650 wrote: Mon Sep 28, 2020 11:13 am I like the recommendations for buying used clubs (from a financial sense) but how does one get fitted correctly for a club you're buying on line?
Great question. At OP’s age and skill level, the range of options will be pretty straightforward in terms of fitting. He/she should be able to figure that out online. Might try using the ping online fitting system. Or, just visit with a couple of knowledgeable players and they can get you pointed in the right direction. In the circumstance I really don’t think it will be too difficult to get fitted reasonably well, and certainly have a better set of tools then the 20-year-olds that he/she is using now.

Take a look at global golf. Good return policy with a good supply of used clubs. Some of the manufacturers also have their own used clubs for sale. You could also go through eBay.
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