Replacing Toilet Stop Valve

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palanzo
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Re: Replacing Toilet Stop Valve

Post by palanzo »

Kenkat wrote: Sun Aug 02, 2020 12:26 pm
mrmass wrote: Sun Aug 02, 2020 12:20 pm
Kenkat wrote: Sun Aug 02, 2020 12:08 pm This may not be of use, but I’ve found those oval shutoff handles tend to strip - so you turn then and they just spin, doing nothing. I’ve removed them by taking the screw off the front, then use a vise grip to grab the valve and turn off the water. Just something to possibly try before you start replacing the entire valve.
I was thinking of that too. I could do that without shutting of the water to the entire house I believe.
Yes. Just be reasonable about the amount of force you use. If the valve itself is frozen or locked up, you don’t want to break it off.
This is a better way to remove the compression fittings.

https://www.homedepot.com/p/Husky-Fauce ... /311493722
palanzo
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Re: Replacing Toilet Stop Valve

Post by palanzo »

Kobra wrote: Sun Aug 02, 2020 8:15 pm I just had to do the same repair a couple of months ago. I purchased a Brasscraft G2CR19X C1 1/4 turn angle valve from my local Home Depot. I was told by a plumber buddy that a drop of oil on the threads will make tightening easy but not to use any putty or Teflon tape on the threads. The only thing I noticed is the new valves have a plastic liner inside instead of being solid metal.

Mark
Did your plumber buddy explain why he recommended using a drop of oil rather than Teflon tape?
Last edited by palanzo on Mon Aug 03, 2020 3:12 pm, edited 1 time in total.
palanzo
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Re: Replacing Toilet Stop Valve

Post by palanzo »

Housedoc wrote: Sun Aug 02, 2020 1:57 pm I have reused the ferrel and nut many times. Get a new valve, coat threads with Teflon pipe dope. Unscrew old valve, install new valve. I use a small 6 inch paint roller tray to catch water.
I don't have the room to cut off the ferrule and start over. Have you ever had a leak or problem in reusing the ferrule and nut?
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Re: Replacing Toilet Stop Valve

Post by palanzo »

galawdawg wrote: Mon Aug 03, 2020 2:52 pm
palanzo wrote: Mon Aug 03, 2020 2:43 pm
galawdawg wrote: Sun Aug 02, 2020 8:38 am I'd suggest you save yourself a lot of time, money and aggravation and start small. It sounds like you may just need to replace the packing nut gasket and seat washer. The packing nut washer just slips on the valve stem, the seat washer screws onto the end of the stem. You can also buy a kit.

Here's a video from Ask This Old House that will show you how to "rebuild" a shut-off valve: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TI77VQPNuGY

I'd suggest you remove the valve stem from the valve and take it to Home Depot or Lowes to get the parts you need. This may work, depending on your valve brand: https://www.homedepot.com/p/BrassCraft- ... /204845385
I have the same problem as the OP. Thanks for the video from Ask This Old House.

Is there an advantage to using a brass stem? I notice that this part does include the stem washer.

https://www.homedepot.com/p/BrassCraft- ... 298165-_-N

Others have suggested repacking the stem with graphite rope. Is this really necessary? It seems like the stem washer is what seals the stem.
I don't know that there is a significant difference between the two. In fact, you don't have to use a repair kit with new stem, you could just replace the washers!

The repair kit I linked comes with everything you need. On the part you linked, you would also need to buy a packing nut washer. Those usually come in a multi-pack. I'd recommend you take your old stem including the packing washer with you to HD or Lowes to be sure you get the correct size.
Good point. The stems are probably just fine. I can just get a bulk pack of valve washers and packing washers. Thanks.
Chuck107
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Re: Replacing Toilet Stop Valve

Post by Chuck107 »

.....
Last edited by Chuck107 on Mon Oct 05, 2020 7:55 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Housedoc
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Re: Replacing Toilet Stop Valve

Post by Housedoc »

palanzo wrote: Mon Aug 03, 2020 3:08 pm
Housedoc wrote: Sun Aug 02, 2020 1:57 pm I have reused the ferrel and nut many times. Get a new valve, coat threads with Teflon pipe dope. Unscrew old valve, install new valve. I use a small 6 inch paint roller tray to catch water.
I don't have the room to cut off the ferrule and start over. Have you ever had a leak or problem in reusing the ferrule and nut?
Never had a leak, probably have done 10 or more this way. Crank down on nut while holding valve using another wrench. Valve has flat spots on opposite sides for the wrench.
Housedoc
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Re: Replacing Toilet Stop Valve

Post by Housedoc »

Also, keep all faucets closed while removing stop valve. Minimal water flow as there is no vent to assist water flow. Turn off MAIN water valve of course.
palanzo
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Re: Replacing Toilet Stop Valve

Post by palanzo »

Chuck107 wrote: Mon Aug 03, 2020 5:10 pm
palanzo wrote: Mon Aug 03, 2020 2:17 pm Sharkbite

Has anyone replaced the multi-turn stop valves with Sharkbites? I have about a 1 inch copper stub. Will the Sharkbite work if there is a depression in the copper pipe due the the ferrule? I just don't have the room to cut the copper pipe back to the ferrule and still have 1 inch for the Sharkbite.
I would NOT use a sharkbite type fitting over any imperfection in the pipe, especially a depression from a ferrule.

If there is not enough pipe sticking out you will have to try one of the other methods suggested.
Start with repairing the valve if that doesn't work reuse the old ferrule and nut with a new valve.
If that doesn't work, they sell ferrule pullers (amazon) $15 or so.
https://www.amazon.com/Armour-Line-RP77 ... 173&sr=8-4
Then use a new nut and new ferrule.
If that doesn't work call a plumber for soldering work, if you don't know how to solder.
Thank you for confirming that about the Sharkbites. This is really helpful advice. Can a new ferrule and nut be used even if there is a depression from the old ferrule? Hopefully I won't need to go that far but it would be good to know.

I have not soldered for years. I will solder on copper extensions if needed but I think one of the other steps will work.
palanzo
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Re: Replacing Toilet Stop Valve

Post by palanzo »

Housedoc wrote: Mon Aug 03, 2020 6:03 pm
palanzo wrote: Mon Aug 03, 2020 3:08 pm
Housedoc wrote: Sun Aug 02, 2020 1:57 pm I have reused the ferrel and nut many times. Get a new valve, coat threads with Teflon pipe dope. Unscrew old valve, install new valve. I use a small 6 inch paint roller tray to catch water.
I don't have the room to cut off the ferrule and start over. Have you ever had a leak or problem in reusing the ferrule and nut?
Never had a leak, probably have done 10 or more this way. Crank down on nut while holding valve using another wrench. Valve has flat spots on opposite sides for the wrench.
Yup. I am familiar with using two wrenches. The earlier video suggested only half a turn and then a bit more if there is a leak.
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Tubes
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Re: Replacing Toilet Stop Valve

Post by Tubes »

palanzo wrote: Mon Aug 03, 2020 2:43 pm Others have suggested repacking the stem with graphite rope. Is this really necessary? It seems like the stem washer is what seals the stem.
Nope, not if the washer holds. It is just an alternative, especially useful on very old valves.
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Re: Replacing Toilet Stop Valve

Post by palanzo »

Tubes wrote: Tue Aug 04, 2020 8:19 am
palanzo wrote: Mon Aug 03, 2020 2:43 pm Others have suggested repacking the stem with graphite rope. Is this really necessary? It seems like the stem washer is what seals the stem.
Nope, not if the washer holds. It is just an alternative, especially useful on very old valves.
Thanks Tubes.
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Re: Replacing Toilet Stop Valve

Post by Sandtrap »

OP
You can also replace the angle stop valve with a 1/4 turn shutoff. High quality. Get the best one you can.

EDIT:
(this is just a representative picture I could find.)
Intention is solid brass body valves and fixtures.

Image

j :D
Last edited by Sandtrap on Wed Aug 05, 2020 10:12 am, edited 1 time in total.
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mptness
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Re: Replacing Toilet Stop Valve

Post by mptness »

palanzo wrote: Mon Aug 03, 2020 3:07 pm
Kobra wrote: Sun Aug 02, 2020 8:15 pm I just had to do the same repair a couple of months ago. I purchased a Brasscraft G2CR19X C1 1/4 turn angle valve from my local Home Depot. I was told by a plumber buddy that a drop of oil on the threads will make tightening easy but not to use any putty or Teflon tape on the threads. The only thing I noticed is the new valves have a plastic liner inside instead of being solid metal.

Mark
Did your plumber buddy explain why he recommended using a drop of oil rather than Teflon tape?
I am not Mark or his plumber buddy but thread sealants such as joint compound (pipe dope or thread seal tape such as PTFE tape) are unnecessary on compression fitting threads, as it is not the thread that seals the joint but rather the compression of the ferrule between the nut and pipe
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Re: Replacing Toilet Stop Valve

Post by RudyS »

mptness wrote: Tue Aug 04, 2020 3:34 pm
palanzo wrote: Mon Aug 03, 2020 3:07 pm
Kobra wrote: Sun Aug 02, 2020 8:15 pm I just had to do the same repair a couple of months ago. I purchased a Brasscraft G2CR19X C1 1/4 turn angle valve from my local Home Depot. I was told by a plumber buddy that a drop of oil on the threads will make tightening easy but not to use any putty or Teflon tape on the threads. The only thing I noticed is the new valves have a plastic liner inside instead of being solid metal.

Mark
Did your plumber buddy explain why he recommended using a drop of oil rather than Teflon tape?
I am not Mark or his plumber buddy but thread sealants such as joint compound (pipe dope or thread seal tape such as PTFE tape) are unnecessary on compression fitting threads, as it is not the thread that seals the joint but rather the compression of the ferrule between the nut and pipe
Good point, and any tape may actually wind up interfering with the seal to the ferrule.
Housedoc
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Re: Replacing Toilet Stop Valve

Post by Housedoc »

Plumbing is a lot like investing, many ways to go about it. Many plumbers use a little dope on every threaded connection. If you never have had a problem with it, brush on a bit. Kinda like Dollar average or lump sum buying. 20yrs down the road all will be good.
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Re: Replacing Toilet Stop Valve

Post by palanzo »

Housedoc wrote: Tue Aug 04, 2020 4:41 pm Plumbing is a lot like investing, many ways to go about it. Many plumbers use a little dope on every threaded connection. If you never have had a problem with it, brush on a bit. Kinda like Dollar average or lump sum buying. 20yrs down the road all will be good.
I've exchanged a couple of emails with Brasscraft and they do not recommend anything on the threads except a drop of oil to make it easier to tighten. Brasscraft customer support is fantastic.
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Re: Replacing Toilet Stop Valve

Post by palanzo »

Sandtrap wrote: Tue Aug 04, 2020 2:35 pm OP
You can also replace the angle stop valve with a 1/4 turn shutoff. High quality. Get the best one you can.
Image

j :D
The current version is the Brasscraft KTCR19X. I'm going to redo all the stop valves in the house. Tired of the multi turn valves not shutting off completely or leaking drops past the stem.
palanzo
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Re: Replacing Toilet Stop Valve

Post by palanzo »

I am going to replace the multi turn valves with 1/4 turn valves.

Can a new ferrule and compression nut be used even if there is a depression in the copper pipe from the old ferrule? Or should one just use the old ferrule and compression nut with the new 1/4 turn valve?
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Re: Replacing Toilet Stop Valve

Post by Sandtrap »

palanzo wrote: Tue Aug 04, 2020 6:01 pm I am going to replace the multi turn valves with 1/4 turn valves.

Can a new ferrule and compression nut be used even if there is a depression in the copper pipe from the old ferrule? Or should one just use the old ferrule and compression nut with the new 1/4 turn valve?
Sometimes they drip and ooze, sometimes using the same spot works out fine. Have to try and see.

j :happy
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Re: Replacing Toilet Stop Valve

Post by galawdawg »

Why replace them if they don't need replacement? I've never had to replace a shut off valve in my thirty years of home ownership nor on the rental properties I used to own. Just a washer here and there and good as new.

If you do decide to swap them out, just be aware that working on a short plumbing line behind a commode and often next to a close wall, cabinet or tub isn't much fun and if you mess something up with replacement, you'll probably end up paying a plumber.

Have you tried replacing the washers?
palanzo
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Re: Replacing Toilet Stop Valve

Post by palanzo »

galawdawg wrote: Tue Aug 04, 2020 6:20 pm Why replace them if they don't need replacement? I've never had to replace a shut off valve in my thirty years of home ownership nor on the rental properties I used to own. Just a washer here and there and good as new.

If you do decide to swap them out, just be aware that working on a short plumbing line behind a commode and often next to a close wall, cabinet or tub isn't much fun and if you mess something up with replacement, you'll probably end up paying a plumber.

Have you tried replacing the washers?
I have several that won't shut off completely. I replaced the cartridge and two O rings in the kitchen faucet today as it was leaking and had to shut off the water to the house. I have several others that leak a bit through the stem.

I have been in touch with Brasscraft and they do not sell washer sets. They do sell a kit with stem and washers.

I have hard water in this area so that may be part of the problem.

If I use 1/4 turn brass ball valves I don't think I will have a problem again. I wish I had longer stubs in the house so I could cut off a bit of the copper pipe, deburr and use new ferrules and compression nuts.
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Re: Replacing Toilet Stop Valve

Post by MathIsMyWayr »

Sandtrap wrote: Tue Aug 04, 2020 2:35 pm OP
You can also replace the angle stop valve with a 1/4 turn shutoff. High quality. Get the best one you can.
Image

j :D
Is a Brasscraft 1/4 turn shutoff valve of high quality? I buy them at Home Depot and they are made of stainless steel, not brass.
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galawdawg
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Re: Replacing Toilet Stop Valve

Post by galawdawg »

palanzo wrote: Tue Aug 04, 2020 8:06 pm
galawdawg wrote: Tue Aug 04, 2020 6:20 pm Why replace them if they don't need replacement? I've never had to replace a shut off valve in my thirty years of home ownership nor on the rental properties I used to own. Just a washer here and there and good as new.

If you do decide to swap them out, just be aware that working on a short plumbing line behind a commode and often next to a close wall, cabinet or tub isn't much fun and if you mess something up with replacement, you'll probably end up paying a plumber.

Have you tried replacing the washers?
I have several that won't shut off completely. I replaced the cartridge and two O rings in the kitchen faucet today as it was leaking and had to shut off the water to the house. I have several others that leak a bit through the stem.

I have been in touch with Brasscraft and they do not sell washer sets. They do sell a kit with stem and washers.

I have hard water in this area so that may be part of the problem.

If I use 1/4 turn brass ball valves I don't think I will have a problem again. I wish I had longer stubs in the house so I could cut off a bit of the copper pipe, deburr and use new ferrules and compression nuts.
If you don't want to purchase the Brasscraft rebuilt kit (with stem and washers), if you take one of the stems with washers to HD or Lowes you should be able to purchase packages of each type and size of washer you need, they are usually made in very common sizes. For example, Lowes sells Danco packages of ten (10) washers for $2.48 each.

If you decide to replace the valves instead, best of luck! I am certain that if I tried replacing a handful of those with compression fittings in confined spaces with a small stub of pipe to work with, I'd be having to call a plumber for sure! :happy
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Re: Replacing Toilet Stop Valve

Post by Sandtrap »

MathIsMyWayr wrote: Tue Aug 04, 2020 10:51 pm
Sandtrap wrote: Tue Aug 04, 2020 2:35 pm OP
You can also replace the angle stop valve with a 1/4 turn shutoff. High quality. Get the best one you can.
Image

j :D
Is a Brasscraft 1/4 turn shutoff valve of high quality? I buy them at Home Depot and they are made of stainless steel, not brass.
Agree.
That was the only pic I could find.
Brass body valves and fixtures are generally high quality

good catch
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galawdawg
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Re: Replacing Toilet Stop Valve

Post by galawdawg »

Even the commonly used Brasscraft multi-turn valve is brass, it is just chrome plated for appearance.

Image

Here is a PDF showing the parts of the multi-turn valve: https://pdfhost.io/edit?doc=e91dfc98-97 ... a639634440
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mrmass
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Re: Replacing Toilet Stop Valve *Fixed*

Post by mrmass »

galawdawg wrote: Sun Aug 02, 2020 8:51 am
mrmass wrote: Sun Aug 02, 2020 8:46 am
galawdawg wrote: Sun Aug 02, 2020 8:38 am I'd suggest you save yourself a lot of time, money and aggravation and start small. It sounds like you may just need to replace the packing nut gasket and seat washer. The packing nut washer just slips on the valve stem, the seat washer screws onto the end of the stem. You can also buy a kit.

Here's a video from Ask This Old House that will show you how to "rebuild" a shut-off valve: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TI77VQPNuGY

I'd suggest you remove the valve stem from the valve and take it to Home Depot or Lowes to get the parts you need. This may work, depending on your valve brand: https://www.homedepot.com/p/BrassCraft- ... /204845385
Nice video. could be my issue. I'll buy everything. 1/4 turn shutoff valve, and a rebuild kit. Paint tray to catch the water. Thank you. I might not do it today, as if the crap hits the fan from some unplanned reason, I won't need an emergency plumber to come.
I suspect so. You likely have the shut-off valve equivalent of a dripping faucet. Most folks don't replace the entire faucet when it starts to drip....unless they want to upgrade to a different style.

If the problem is just the rubber washer and gasket, you should be able to fix it in just a few minutes, not counting the trip to the store.

Good luck!
I did it this way. I shut off the water, btw about 10 gallons came out. Anyway, I removed the packing nut, unscrewed the plastic valve, and saw that there was no washer, so I took the fast way out and put the new valve in.

Now for the tank filler thing-I've done those before but you know what f'd me up, The supply line didn't seem to "fit in" nicely to the new filler valve I undid, redid 3 times all 3 times leaked from that f'n thing.

So a quick run to HD, and got the braided type, and bam. No leaks first try.

Thank you all. Sure I took the quick way but I now know the process and it's repeatable
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mrmass
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Re: Replacing Toilet Stop Valve

Post by mrmass »

Odd thing about the water, On my main, I have 2 handles, one before and one after the meter. I turned off after the meter, and water just kept flowing. after about 10 or so gallons (maybe more) I turn off the handle before the meter and bam Water instantly stopped. Odd but just wanted to report back.

Thank you again everyone.
Chuck107
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Re: Replacing Toilet Stop Valve

Post by Chuck107 »

.....
Last edited by Chuck107 on Mon Oct 05, 2020 7:55 am, edited 1 time in total.
Alas, I find moderation of this forum too restrictive for my tastes, farewell.
palanzo
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Re: Replacing Toilet Stop Valve

Post by palanzo »

galawdawg wrote: Wed Aug 05, 2020 5:31 am
palanzo wrote: Tue Aug 04, 2020 8:06 pm
galawdawg wrote: Tue Aug 04, 2020 6:20 pm Why replace them if they don't need replacement? I've never had to replace a shut off valve in my thirty years of home ownership nor on the rental properties I used to own. Just a washer here and there and good as new.

If you do decide to swap them out, just be aware that working on a short plumbing line behind a commode and often next to a close wall, cabinet or tub isn't much fun and if you mess something up with replacement, you'll probably end up paying a plumber.

Have you tried replacing the washers?
I have several that won't shut off completely. I replaced the cartridge and two O rings in the kitchen faucet today as it was leaking and had to shut off the water to the house. I have several others that leak a bit through the stem.

I have been in touch with Brasscraft and they do not sell washer sets. They do sell a kit with stem and washers.

I have hard water in this area so that may be part of the problem.

If I use 1/4 turn brass ball valves I don't think I will have a problem again. I wish I had longer stubs in the house so I could cut off a bit of the copper pipe, deburr and use new ferrules and compression nuts.
If you don't want to purchase the Brasscraft rebuilt kit (with stem and washers), if you take one of the stems with washers to HD or Lowes you should be able to purchase packages of each type and size of washer you need, they are usually made in very common sizes. For example, Lowes sells Danco packages of ten (10) washers for $2.48 each.

If you decide to replace the valves instead, best of luck! I am certain that if I tried replacing a handful of those with compression fittings in confined spaces with a small stub of pipe to work with, I'd be having to call a plumber for sure! :happy
galawdawg you've convinced me. I will get the Brasscraft rebuild kit (with stem and washers). That's the low risk solution. I've checked and I can do curbside pickup at HD. I don't want to go inside the HD store if at all possible.

If Brasscraft sold the washers separately I would get them. If I go to HD they may have the correct washer size but maybe not the correct materials. Brasscraft is rather particular on the materials and I trust them on this.

https://d2cl5to9q9oami.cloudfront.net/d ... op_DIA.pdf

I sure don't want to call a plumber in the midst of a pandemic.
Last edited by palanzo on Wed Aug 05, 2020 3:04 pm, edited 1 time in total.
palanzo
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Re: Replacing Toilet Stop Valve

Post by palanzo »

mrmass wrote: Wed Aug 05, 2020 12:23 pm Odd thing about the water, On my main, I have 2 handles, one before and one after the meter. I turned off after the meter, and water just kept flowing. after about 10 or so gallons (maybe more) I turn off the handle before the meter and bam Water instantly stopped. Odd but just wanted to report back.

Thank you again everyone.
The valve is likely bad. When you replace it makes sure you get a high quality all brass gate valve.
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mrmass
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Re: Replacing Toilet Stop Valve

Post by mrmass »

palanzo wrote: Wed Aug 05, 2020 3:00 pm
galawdawg wrote: Wed Aug 05, 2020 5:31 am
palanzo wrote: Tue Aug 04, 2020 8:06 pm
galawdawg wrote: Tue Aug 04, 2020 6:20 pm Why replace them if they don't need replacement? I've never had to replace a shut off valve in my thirty years of home ownership nor on the rental properties I used to own. Just a washer here and there and good as new.

If you do decide to swap them out, just be aware that working on a short plumbing line behind a commode and often next to a close wall, cabinet or tub isn't much fun and if you mess something up with replacement, you'll probably end up paying a plumber.

Have you tried replacing the washers?
I have several that won't shut off completely. I replaced the cartridge and two O rings in the kitchen faucet today as it was leaking and had to shut off the water to the house. I have several others that leak a bit through the stem.

I have been in touch with Brasscraft and they do not sell washer sets. They do sell a kit with stem and washers.

I have hard water in this area so that may be part of the problem.

If I use 1/4 turn brass ball valves I don't think I will have a problem again. I wish I had longer stubs in the house so I could cut off a bit of the copper pipe, deburr and use new ferrules and compression nuts.
If you don't want to purchase the Brasscraft rebuilt kit (with stem and washers), if you take one of the stems with washers to HD or Lowes you should be able to purchase packages of each type and size of washer you need, they are usually made in very common sizes. For example, Lowes sells Danco packages of ten (10) washers for $2.48 each.

If you decide to replace the valves instead, best of luck! I am certain that if I tried replacing a handful of those with compression fittings in confined spaces with a small stub of pipe to work with, I'd be having to call a plumber for sure! :happy
galawdawg you've convinced me. I will get the Brasscraft rebuild kit (with stem and washers). That's the low risk solution. I've checked and I can do curbside pickup at HD. I don't want to go inside the HD store if at all possible.

If Brasscraft sold the washers separately I would get them. If I go to HD they may have the correct washer size but maybe not the correct materials. Brasscraft is rather particular on the materials and I trust them on this.

https://d2cl5to9q9oami.cloudfront.net/d ... op_DIA.pdf

I sure don't want to call a plumber in the midst of a pandemic.
This is what I used. I bought a few of these. Image
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Re: Replacing Toilet Stop Valve

Post by neilpilot »

palanzo wrote: Wed Aug 05, 2020 3:03 pm
mrmass wrote: Wed Aug 05, 2020 12:23 pm Odd thing about the water, On my main, I have 2 handles, one before and one after the meter. I turned off after the meter, and water just kept flowing. after about 10 or so gallons (maybe more) I turn off the handle before the meter and bam Water instantly stopped. Odd but just wanted to report back.

Thank you again everyone.
The valve is likely bad. When you replace it makes sure you get a high quality all brass gate valve.
Why replace it? I’d only consider replacing the valve if the meter needed to be replaced.
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Re: Replacing Toilet Stop Valve

Post by palanzo »

mrmass wrote: Wed Aug 05, 2020 3:09 pm
palanzo wrote: Wed Aug 05, 2020 3:00 pm
galawdawg wrote: Wed Aug 05, 2020 5:31 am
palanzo wrote: Tue Aug 04, 2020 8:06 pm
galawdawg wrote: Tue Aug 04, 2020 6:20 pm Why replace them if they don't need replacement? I've never had to replace a shut off valve in my thirty years of home ownership nor on the rental properties I used to own. Just a washer here and there and good as new.

If you do decide to swap them out, just be aware that working on a short plumbing line behind a commode and often next to a close wall, cabinet or tub isn't much fun and if you mess something up with replacement, you'll probably end up paying a plumber.

Have you tried replacing the washers?
I have several that won't shut off completely. I replaced the cartridge and two O rings in the kitchen faucet today as it was leaking and had to shut off the water to the house. I have several others that leak a bit through the stem.

I have been in touch with Brasscraft and they do not sell washer sets. They do sell a kit with stem and washers.

I have hard water in this area so that may be part of the problem.

If I use 1/4 turn brass ball valves I don't think I will have a problem again. I wish I had longer stubs in the house so I could cut off a bit of the copper pipe, deburr and use new ferrules and compression nuts.
If you don't want to purchase the Brasscraft rebuilt kit (with stem and washers), if you take one of the stems with washers to HD or Lowes you should be able to purchase packages of each type and size of washer you need, they are usually made in very common sizes. For example, Lowes sells Danco packages of ten (10) washers for $2.48 each.

If you decide to replace the valves instead, best of luck! I am certain that if I tried replacing a handful of those with compression fittings in confined spaces with a small stub of pipe to work with, I'd be having to call a plumber for sure! :happy
galawdawg you've convinced me. I will get the Brasscraft rebuild kit (with stem and washers). That's the low risk solution. I've checked and I can do curbside pickup at HD. I don't want to go inside the HD store if at all possible.

If Brasscraft sold the washers separately I would get them. If I go to HD they may have the correct washer size but maybe not the correct materials. Brasscraft is rather particular on the materials and I trust them on this.

https://d2cl5to9q9oami.cloudfront.net/d ... op_DIA.pdf

I sure don't want to call a plumber in the midst of a pandemic.
This is what I used. I bought a few of these. Image
Thanks. I'm getting the same item. Brasscraft rebuild set.
palanzo
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Re: Replacing Toilet Stop Valve

Post by palanzo »

neilpilot wrote: Wed Aug 05, 2020 3:13 pm
palanzo wrote: Wed Aug 05, 2020 3:03 pm
mrmass wrote: Wed Aug 05, 2020 12:23 pm Odd thing about the water, On my main, I have 2 handles, one before and one after the meter. I turned off after the meter, and water just kept flowing. after about 10 or so gallons (maybe more) I turn off the handle before the meter and bam Water instantly stopped. Odd but just wanted to report back.

Thank you again everyone.
The valve is likely bad. When you replace it makes sure you get a high quality all brass gate valve.
Why replace it? I’d only consider replacing the valve if the meter needed to be replaced.
Because one day you may need to shut off the water in an emergency and the other valve may fail as well. The fact that the main shut off valve does not shut off is a concern. I doubt they are gate valves. I had the same problem because the builder took the cheap option. One day I had to call a professional plumber who advised me only to use a gate valve which he did. I forget the type of valve the builder used but it was not a gate valve.
neilpilot
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Location: Memphis area

Re: Replacing Toilet Stop Valve

Post by neilpilot »

palanzo wrote: Wed Aug 05, 2020 3:23 pm
neilpilot wrote: Wed Aug 05, 2020 3:13 pm
palanzo wrote: Wed Aug 05, 2020 3:03 pm
mrmass wrote: Wed Aug 05, 2020 12:23 pm Odd thing about the water, On my main, I have 2 handles, one before and one after the meter. I turned off after the meter, and water just kept flowing. after about 10 or so gallons (maybe more) I turn off the handle before the meter and bam Water instantly stopped. Odd but just wanted to report back.

Thank you again everyone.
The valve is likely bad. When you replace it makes sure you get a high quality all brass gate valve.
Why replace it? I’d only consider replacing the valve if the meter needed to be replaced.
Because one day you may need to shut off the water in an emergency and the other valve may fail as well. The fact that the main shut off vale does not shut off is a concern. I doubt they are gate valves.
You might consider adding a 3rd shut off valve, just in case. :beer

BTW my post-meter shutoff is a gate valve.
palanzo
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Re: Replacing Toilet Stop Valve

Post by palanzo »

neilpilot wrote: Wed Aug 05, 2020 3:26 pm
palanzo wrote: Wed Aug 05, 2020 3:23 pm
neilpilot wrote: Wed Aug 05, 2020 3:13 pm
palanzo wrote: Wed Aug 05, 2020 3:03 pm
mrmass wrote: Wed Aug 05, 2020 12:23 pm Odd thing about the water, On my main, I have 2 handles, one before and one after the meter. I turned off after the meter, and water just kept flowing. after about 10 or so gallons (maybe more) I turn off the handle before the meter and bam Water instantly stopped. Odd but just wanted to report back.

Thank you again everyone.
The valve is likely bad. When you replace it makes sure you get a high quality all brass gate valve.
Why replace it? I’d only consider replacing the valve if the meter needed to be replaced.
Because one day you may need to shut off the water in an emergency and the other valve may fail as well. The fact that the main shut off vale does not shut off is a concern. I doubt they are gate valves.
You might consider adding a 3rd shut off valve, just in case. :beer

BTW my post-meter shutoff is a gate valve.
Good idea. Have you added a third valve?
neilpilot
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Location: Memphis area

Re: Replacing Toilet Stop Valve

Post by neilpilot »

palanzo wrote: Wed Aug 05, 2020 3:58 pm
neilpilot wrote: Wed Aug 05, 2020 3:26 pm
palanzo wrote: Wed Aug 05, 2020 3:23 pm
neilpilot wrote: Wed Aug 05, 2020 3:13 pm
palanzo wrote: Wed Aug 05, 2020 3:03 pm

The valve is likely bad. When you replace it makes sure you get a high quality all brass gate valve.
Why replace it? I’d only consider replacing the valve if the meter needed to be replaced.
Because one day you may need to shut off the water in an emergency and the other valve may fail as well. The fact that the main shut off vale does not shut off is a concern. I doubt they are gate valves.
You might consider adding a 3rd shut off valve, just in case. :beer

BTW my post-meter shutoff is a gate valve.
Good idea. Have you added a third valve?
I didn’t need to, and haven’t felt the need for a 4th.

Home came complete with 3 shut offs. There are valves in front yard on each side of meter, and another gate valve on main line (past irrigation takeoff) where it comes up from slab.
Lee_WSP
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Location: Arizona

Re: Replacing Toilet Stop Valve

Post by Lee_WSP »

palanzo wrote: Mon Aug 03, 2020 3:00 pm
Kenkat wrote: Sun Aug 02, 2020 12:26 pm
mrmass wrote: Sun Aug 02, 2020 12:20 pm
Kenkat wrote: Sun Aug 02, 2020 12:08 pm This may not be of use, but I’ve found those oval shutoff handles tend to strip - so you turn then and they just spin, doing nothing. I’ve removed them by taking the screw off the front, then use a vise grip to grab the valve and turn off the water. Just something to possibly try before you start replacing the entire valve.
I was thinking of that too. I could do that without shutting of the water to the entire house I believe.
Yes. Just be reasonable about the amount of force you use. If the valve itself is frozen or locked up, you don’t want to break it off.
This is a better way to remove the compression fittings.

https://www.homedepot.com/p/Husky-Fauce ... /311493722
Pulling it off could deform the pipe even further, it's better to cut them off if you can.
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galawdawg
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Re: Replacing Toilet Stop Valve

Post by galawdawg »

neilpilot wrote: Wed Aug 05, 2020 4:13 pm Home came complete with 3 shut offs. There are valves in front yard on each side of meter, and another gate valve on main line (past irrigation takeoff) where it comes up from slab.
That's how ours is set up as well. Two at the meter at the street and one in the basement.
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mrmass
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Location: MA

Re: Replacing Toilet Stop Valve

Post by mrmass »

Here are my two shutoffs at the main. Left after the meter, right before the meter.

I initially used the left one thinking the water was shutoff. I didn't hear anything but then again the taps were open above me in the house. I waited and waited. Then figured I'd try the right one and bam off. I assume I need a plumber to replace what might be the broken one.

Image
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galawdawg
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Re: Replacing Toilet Stop Valve

Post by galawdawg »

mrmass wrote: Thu Aug 06, 2020 7:43 am Here are my two shutoffs at the main. Left after the meter, right before the meter.

I initially used the left one thinking the water was shutoff. I didn't hear anything but then again the taps were open above me in the house. I waited and waited. Then figured I'd try the right one and bam off. I assume I need a plumber to replace what might be the broken one.

Image
You likely also have a shut-off in your yard close to the street under a small round or rectangular cover. Usually it looks like this:

Image

Those holes are so the water utility can padlock the valve closed after someone has service disconnected for non-payment! :o
Chuck107
Posts: 507
Joined: Tue Sep 04, 2012 11:47 pm

Re: Replacing Toilet Stop Valve

Post by Chuck107 »

.....
Last edited by Chuck107 on Mon Oct 05, 2020 7:54 am, edited 1 time in total.
Alas, I find moderation of this forum too restrictive for my tastes, farewell.
Topic Author
mrmass
Posts: 444
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Location: MA

Re: Replacing Toilet Stop Valve

Post by mrmass »

Chuck107 wrote: Thu Aug 06, 2020 9:26 am
mrmass wrote: Thu Aug 06, 2020 7:43 am Here are my two shutoffs at the main. Left after the meter, right before the meter.

I initially used the left one thinking the water was shutoff. I didn't hear anything but then again the taps were open above me in the house. I waited and waited. Then figured I'd try the right one and bam off. I assume I need a plumber to replace what might be the broken one.



Image
SharkBite 22186-0000LF 3/4" Push-To-Connect x Fnpt Ball Valve, 3/4-Inch, Brass $12.50
https://www.amazon.com/SharkBite-22187- ... r=1-8&th=1

SharkBite U016LFA Straight Coupling Plumbing 3/4 In, PEX Fittings, Push-to-Connect, Single-Pack $7.95
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B002SU46IM/ref=emc_b_5_t?th=1

Pex cutter $7.85
https://www.amazon.com/Pex-Tubing-Cutte ... hi&sr=1-11

5' pex pipe Home depot $3.86
https://www.homedepot.com/p/SharkBite-3 ... /202687982

GOCHANGE Mini Tube Cutter Slice Copper Aluminum Tubing Pipe Cutting Tool 3-22mm 1/8inch-7/8inch $9.99
https://www.amazon.com/GOCHANGE-Cutter- ... =hi&sr=1-9

Rectorseal 1.75 oz. #5 Pipe Thread Sealant
https://www.homedepot.com/p/RectorSeal- ... /100144191 $3.98

$46.13 + tax Assuming all 3/4"

Edit.... and a bucket to catch water :beer

EDIT... IF female fitting at the meter is 1" ...
Change the ball valve to a 1"
Change the pex pipe to 1"
change the sharkbite straight coupling to a 1" x 3/4" reducer
Wow, nice. Thank you. I'm gonna guess you've done this before. Either way, Thank you.
Chuck107
Posts: 507
Joined: Tue Sep 04, 2012 11:47 pm

Re: Replacing Toilet Stop Valve

Post by Chuck107 »

.....
Alas, I find moderation of this forum too restrictive for my tastes, farewell.
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