I'm Buying a Boat...

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techieguy
Posts: 12
Joined: Wed Nov 05, 2014 7:46 pm

I'm Buying a Boat...

Post by techieguy » Sun Jun 28, 2020 1:07 pm

I'm getting ready to buy a boat. I've made up my mind in terms of the purchase. This is a way of life for my family. It's what we do for recreation.

Financial Status:

Age: 35, Married, One Child

Desired Retirement Age: 55

Net Worth: 1 Million (80% Investments, 20% Equity)

Income: 250k Per Year

Average Yearly Savings: 33% Gross

Monthly Expenses: $3,750 give or take a bit

Debt: Primary Residence
11 Years Left on Mortgage @ 159k

Emergency Fund: 31k

Boat: 2008 Sea Ray, 21 ft Runabout, 300 hrs. Great shape.

Purchase Price: 24k

How should I buy the boat?

a. Use the cash in emergency fund, replenish through income?

b. Put down 9k from emergency fund take out 36 month loan at 5% for 15,000k?

c. Sell taxable investments and pay with cash?

d. A method I'm not thinking of?

Thanks TechieGuy

123
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Joined: Fri Oct 12, 2012 3:55 pm

Re: I'm Buying a Boat...

Post by 123 » Sun Jun 28, 2020 1:15 pm

techieguy wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 1:07 pm
...Purchase Price: 24k

How should I buy the boat?

a. Use the cash in emergency fund, replenish through income?

b. Put down 9k from emergency fund take out 36 month loan at 5% for 15,000k?

c. Sell taxable investments and pay with cash?

d. A method I'm not thinking of?...
Make the purchase contingent on a 0% loan from the current owner (or dealer) for 24 months ($1,000 a month) with the right to return the boat (for any/no reason in the same condition it was at purchase) at any time during the loan with the balance of the loan canceled. Make payments from current income.
The closest helping hand is at the end of your own arm.

tomd37
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Location: Middle Tennessee

Re: I'm Buying a Boat...

Post by tomd37 » Sun Jun 28, 2020 1:20 pm

Sounds like 123 has some experience in boat buying and results thereof! :wink:
Tom D.

IMO
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Re: I'm Buying a Boat...

Post by IMO » Sun Jun 28, 2020 1:37 pm

123 wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 1:15 pm
techieguy wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 1:07 pm
...Purchase Price: 24k

How should I buy the boat?

a. Use the cash in emergency fund, replenish through income?

b. Put down 9k from emergency fund take out 36 month loan at 5% for 15,000k?

c. Sell taxable investments and pay with cash?

d. A method I'm not thinking of?...
Make the purchase contingent on a 0% loan from the current owner (or dealer) for 24 months ($1,000 a month) with the right to return the boat (for any/no reason in the same condition it was at purchase) at any time during the loan with the balance of the loan canceled. Make payments from current income.
I'd never remotely sell my boat to you if that was the condition. You can't return a boat in the same condition if you use it, you just put hours on the engine which lowers it's value. Besides, what typical boat owner wouldn't want the full purchase price funds right away. Do boat dealers offer that type of financing (0%) and let you return the boat at any time?

Is this the condition you'd sell/buy a car? Just seems unreasonable.

But maybe I'm wrong and this is frequently done?

barnburner4444
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Re: I'm Buying a Boat...

Post by barnburner4444 » Sun Jun 28, 2020 1:57 pm

I am an member of a very big boating forum and always giggle a little when people come to it and ask finance questions. Glad yours is finance related haha. I have owned boats for last 25 or so years and they are a lot of work. My stance is this - I don’t want to finance one out of warranty. I don’t want to pay for repairs (there will be a lot), especially a repower on something I’m making payments on.

Coming from a coastal community, I’m not very familiar with Sea Ray but believe they are no longer in biz.

Globalviewer58
Posts: 557
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Re: I'm Buying a Boat...

Post by Globalviewer58 » Sun Jun 28, 2020 2:21 pm

I would pay cash. I see your AA 80 % Investments, 20% Equity but wonder if the 20% is actually Bonds. If so, take from your Emergency Fund and Bonds or Stocks.

seaRay continues to do well in the recreational marine segment but closed the yacht and sporting yacht biz.

Enjoy your boat!

TheDDC
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Re: I'm Buying a Boat...

Post by TheDDC » Sun Jun 28, 2020 2:24 pm

Pay cash. A boat is a toy. Don't go into debt, especially not for toys.

-TheDDC
Rules to wealth building: 90-100% VTSAX piled high and deep, 0-10% VIGAX tilt, 0% given away to banks, minimize amount given to medical-industrial complex

sailaway
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Re: I'm Buying a Boat...

Post by sailaway » Sun Jun 28, 2020 2:25 pm

Pay cash. Unless your spending is very high, and I suspect that with your age and net worth it is not, you can cash flow this, replenishing that EF quickly.

See username.

stan1
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Re: I'm Buying a Boat...

Post by stan1 » Sun Jun 28, 2020 2:26 pm

I'd do A (cash and replenish with income since you have a high income and savings rate). Surprised you've waited this long to buy one.

bstewie
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Re: I'm Buying a Boat...

Post by bstewie » Sun Jun 28, 2020 2:31 pm

123 wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 1:15 pm
techieguy wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 1:07 pm
...Purchase Price: 24k

How should I buy the boat?

a. Use the cash in emergency fund, replenish through income?

b. Put down 9k from emergency fund take out 36 month loan at 5% for 15,000k?

c. Sell taxable investments and pay with cash?

d. A method I'm not thinking of?...
Make the purchase contingent on a 0% loan from the current owner (or dealer) for 24 months ($1,000 a month) with the right to return the boat (for any/no reason in the same condition it was at purchase) at any time during the loan with the balance of the loan canceled. Make payments from current income.
Any self respecting seller would laugh you away at this request.

OP, make sure to save approx 20-25% of the value of the boat annually for maintenance. Boats need their own EF.

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eye.surgeon
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Location: California

Re: I'm Buying a Boat...

Post by eye.surgeon » Sun Jun 28, 2020 2:34 pm

123 wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 1:15 pm
techieguy wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 1:07 pm
...Purchase Price: 24k

How should I buy the boat?

a. Use the cash in emergency fund, replenish through income?

b. Put down 9k from emergency fund take out 36 month loan at 5% for 15,000k?

c. Sell taxable investments and pay with cash?

d. A method I'm not thinking of?...
Make the purchase contingent on a 0% loan from the current owner (or dealer) for 24 months ($1,000 a month) with the right to return the boat (for any/no reason in the same condition it was at purchase) at any time during the loan with the balance of the loan canceled. Make payments from current income.
You forgot to demand that they wash and wax the boat for you monthly and pay for your gas. Seriously that's completely unrealistic you would never get those terms in a million years.

OP I'd use your emergency fund and replenish over a few months.
Last edited by eye.surgeon on Sun Jun 28, 2020 2:39 pm, edited 3 times in total.
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White Coat Investor
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Re: I'm Buying a Boat...

Post by White Coat Investor » Sun Jun 28, 2020 2:37 pm

techieguy wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 1:07 pm
I'm getting ready to buy a boat. I've made up my mind in terms of the purchase. This is a way of life for my family. It's what we do for recreation.

Financial Status:

Age: 35, Married, One Child

Desired Retirement Age: 55

Net Worth: 1 Million (80% Investments, 20% Equity)

Income: 250k Per Year

Average Yearly Savings: 33% Gross

Monthly Expenses: $3,750 give or take a bit

Debt: Primary Residence
11 Years Left on Mortgage @ 159k

Emergency Fund: 31k

Boat: 2008 Sea Ray, 21 ft Runabout, 300 hrs. Great shape.

Purchase Price: 24k

How should I buy the boat?

a. Use the cash in emergency fund, replenish through income?

b. Put down 9k from emergency fund take out 36 month loan at 5% for 15,000k?

c. Sell taxable investments and pay with cash?

d. A method I'm not thinking of?

Thanks TechieGuy
d. Save it up from earnings.

My second best choice would be c.

Emergency funds aren't for boats and credit isn't for boats either.

You make $250K. It's only a $24K boat. You should be able to save it up no problema in a couple of months.
1) Invest you must 2) Time is your friend 3) Impulse is your enemy | 4) Basic arithmetic works 5) Stick to simplicity 6) Stay the course

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White Coat Investor
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Re: I'm Buying a Boat...

Post by White Coat Investor » Sun Jun 28, 2020 2:39 pm

bstewie wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 2:31 pm


OP, make sure to save approx 20-25% of the value of the boat annually for maintenance. Boats need their own EF.
That's absolutely ridiculous. Maybe on a $4K boat, but certainly not on a $200K and I doubt on a $25K boat like the one the OP is considering. He can certainly afford the cost and ongoing costs of a $25K boat on a $250K income.
1) Invest you must 2) Time is your friend 3) Impulse is your enemy | 4) Basic arithmetic works 5) Stick to simplicity 6) Stay the course

sailaway
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Re: I'm Buying a Boat...

Post by sailaway » Sun Jun 28, 2020 2:47 pm

White Coat Investor wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 2:39 pm
bstewie wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 2:31 pm


OP, make sure to save approx 20-25% of the value of the boat annually for maintenance. Boats need their own EF.
That's absolutely ridiculous. Maybe on a $4K boat, but certainly not on a $200K and I doubt on a $25K boat like the one the OP is considering. He can certainly afford the cost and ongoing costs of a $25K boat on a $250K income.
I mean, we have probably averaged around 20-25%, but that includes upgrades and a refit on a liveaboard 30+yo boat, not maintenance on a low hour bow rider.

bstewie
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Re: I'm Buying a Boat...

Post by bstewie » Sun Jun 28, 2020 2:54 pm

White Coat Investor wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 2:39 pm
bstewie wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 2:31 pm


OP, make sure to save approx 20-25% of the value of the boat annually for maintenance. Boats need their own EF.
That's absolutely ridiculous. Maybe on a $4K boat, but certainly not on a $200K and I doubt on a $25K boat like the one the OP is considering. He can certainly afford the cost and ongoing costs of a $25K boat on a $250K income.
Not sure if he’s keeping it dry or slipped. Cheaper slipped boats + maintenance will still average 20-25%/yr where I’m located. One year in dry dock for a couple days + labor and you’re almost at 20% of 24k /shrug
Last edited by bstewie on Sun Jun 28, 2020 3:04 pm, edited 1 time in total.

bstewie
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Re: I'm Buying a Boat...

Post by bstewie » Sun Jun 28, 2020 2:56 pm

sailaway wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 2:47 pm
White Coat Investor wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 2:39 pm
bstewie wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 2:31 pm


OP, make sure to save approx 20-25% of the value of the boat annually for maintenance. Boats need their own EF.
That's absolutely ridiculous. Maybe on a $4K boat, but certainly not on a $200K and I doubt on a $25K boat like the one the OP is considering. He can certainly afford the cost and ongoing costs of a $25K boat on a $250K income.
I mean, we have probably averaged around 20-25%, but that includes upgrades and a refit on a liveaboard 30+yo boat, not maintenance on a low hour bow rider.
I’m mentally rolling slip fees in, if he’s keeping it dry it will be a lot less, agreed

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JonnyDVM
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Re: I'm Buying a Boat...

Post by JonnyDVM » Sun Jun 28, 2020 2:57 pm

Dude. You make 1/4 million a year. Buy the boat with cash. If you can’t do this you’re doing it wrong.
I’d trade it all for a little more | -C Montgomery Burns

randomguy
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Re: I'm Buying a Boat...

Post by randomguy » Sun Jun 28, 2020 3:16 pm

White Coat Investor wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 2:37 pm


d. Save it up from earnings.

My second best choice would be c.

Emergency funds aren't for boats and credit isn't for boats either.

You make $250K. It's only a $24K boat. You should be able to save it up no problema in a couple of months.
Sure and now he is buying a boat in September and for a good chunk of the country has missed out on the best boating months of the year. Paying taxes to fund the boat also seems stupid. Seems like A or B is the best choice. The interest doesn't matter much when you pay the loan off in 3 months. Obviously the best way would have been to decide to buy the boat back in Janaury and save up the 5k/month. But we don't have a time machine.

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Watty
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Re: I'm Buying a Boat...

Post by Watty » Sun Jun 28, 2020 3:29 pm

White Coat Investor wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 2:37 pm
Emergency funds aren't for boats and credit isn't for boats either.

You make $250K. It's only a $24K boat. You should be able to save it up no problema in a couple of months.
+1

Pay cash.

Either save it up over a few months or sell something in your taxable account.

tibbitts
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Re: I'm Buying a Boat...

Post by tibbitts » Sun Jun 28, 2020 3:43 pm

bstewie wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 2:31 pm
123 wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 1:15 pm
techieguy wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 1:07 pm
...Purchase Price: 24k

How should I buy the boat?

a. Use the cash in emergency fund, replenish through income?

b. Put down 9k from emergency fund take out 36 month loan at 5% for 15,000k?

c. Sell taxable investments and pay with cash?

d. A method I'm not thinking of?...
Make the purchase contingent on a 0% loan from the current owner (or dealer) for 24 months ($1,000 a month) with the right to return the boat (for any/no reason in the same condition it was at purchase) at any time during the loan with the balance of the loan canceled. Make payments from current income.
Any self respecting seller would laugh you away at this request.

OP, make sure to save approx 20-25% of the value of the boat annually for maintenance. Boats need their own EF.
I've had boats and they don't need 20-25% annually for maintenance unless you base it on current value after many years. Even after mine sank, which isn't the greatest thing for engines and electronics, it didn't need 20% for maintenance.

bstewie
Posts: 180
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Re: I'm Buying a Boat...

Post by bstewie » Sun Jun 28, 2020 3:47 pm

tibbitts wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 3:43 pm
bstewie wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 2:31 pm
123 wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 1:15 pm
techieguy wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 1:07 pm
...Purchase Price: 24k

How should I buy the boat?

a. Use the cash in emergency fund, replenish through income?

b. Put down 9k from emergency fund take out 36 month loan at 5% for 15,000k?

c. Sell taxable investments and pay with cash?

d. A method I'm not thinking of?...
Make the purchase contingent on a 0% loan from the current owner (or dealer) for 24 months ($1,000 a month) with the right to return the boat (for any/no reason in the same condition it was at purchase) at any time during the loan with the balance of the loan canceled. Make payments from current income.
Any self respecting seller would laugh you away at this request.

OP, make sure to save approx 20-25% of the value of the boat annually for maintenance. Boats need their own EF.
I've had boats and they don't need 20-25% annually for maintenance unless you base it on current value after many years. Even after mine sank, which isn't the greatest thing for engines and electronics, it didn't need 20% for maintenance.
Clarified above, accounting for slip fees as well. Not sure if op plans to keep it dry. If op keeps it dry definitely *way* less. My experience is based on larger boats. I’ve had friends with slightly larger boats with less severe incidents that were 50% repairs...

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Watty
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Re: I'm Buying a Boat...

Post by Watty » Sun Jun 28, 2020 4:01 pm

tibbitts wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 3:43 pm
I've had boats and they don't need 20-25% annually for maintenance unless you base it on current value after many years. Even after mine sank, which isn't the greatest thing for engines and electronics, it didn't need 20% for maintenance.
Did you have a sinking fund for expenses like that? :D

(Sorry, I could not help myself.)

Kagord
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Re: I'm Buying a Boat...

Post by Kagord » Sun Jun 28, 2020 4:13 pm

So you're asking, can I afford it? I think even Suze Orman would say, you go guy, go get your boat.

Just remember, it's very easy to buy a boat, you're in the winning negotiation position here. Selling a boat flat out sucks, it truly is the best day of one's life when you don't want one (or that one) anymore and the sale is complete.

JOEVANDAL
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Re: I'm Buying a Boat...

Post by JOEVANDAL » Sun Jun 28, 2020 4:29 pm

Pay cash for the boat and start having fun. In 2011 we purchased a 2005 Sea Ray Select 200 and have never had one bit of trouble. Just routine maintenance. Summerize it, put it in the water, then pull it out for the winter and have it winterized. Best depreciating asset we ever purchased. A great family toy and now that my wife and I are empty nesters, we still enjoy it immensely.

123
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Re: I'm Buying a Boat...

Post by 123 » Sun Jun 28, 2020 4:54 pm

bstewie wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 2:31 pm
123 wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 1:15 pm
techieguy wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 1:07 pm
...Purchase Price: 24k

How should I buy the boat?

a. Use the cash in emergency fund, replenish through income?

b. Put down 9k from emergency fund take out 36 month loan at 5% for 15,000k?

c. Sell taxable investments and pay with cash?

d. A method I'm not thinking of?...
Make the purchase contingent on a 0% loan from the current owner (or dealer) for 24 months ($1,000 a month) with the right to return the boat (for any/no reason in the same condition it was at purchase) at any time during the loan with the balance of the loan canceled. Make payments from current income.
Any self respecting seller would laugh you away at this request.

OP, make sure to save approx 20-25% of the value of the boat annually for maintenance. Boats need their own EF.
123 back
If the seller's spouse told the seller to effectivelly "get rid of that damn boat" there may be no end to the concessions available.
The closest helping hand is at the end of your own arm.

02nz
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Re: I'm Buying a Boat...

Post by 02nz » Sun Jun 28, 2020 5:08 pm

OP, congrats on the second happiest day of your life!

(Sorry, I couldn't resist.)

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White Coat Investor
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Re: I'm Buying a Boat...

Post by White Coat Investor » Sun Jun 28, 2020 5:13 pm

sailaway wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 2:47 pm
White Coat Investor wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 2:39 pm
bstewie wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 2:31 pm


OP, make sure to save approx 20-25% of the value of the boat annually for maintenance. Boats need their own EF.
That's absolutely ridiculous. Maybe on a $4K boat, but certainly not on a $200K and I doubt on a $25K boat like the one the OP is considering. He can certainly afford the cost and ongoing costs of a $25K boat on a $250K income.
I mean, we have probably averaged around 20-25%, but that includes upgrades and a refit on a liveaboard 30+yo boat, not maintenance on a low hour bow rider.
Over how many years? If you're spending 25% a year on maintenance why not just let it go to pot and buy a new one every 4 years. Same price!
1) Invest you must 2) Time is your friend 3) Impulse is your enemy | 4) Basic arithmetic works 5) Stick to simplicity 6) Stay the course

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White Coat Investor
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Re: I'm Buying a Boat...

Post by White Coat Investor » Sun Jun 28, 2020 5:15 pm

randomguy wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 3:16 pm
White Coat Investor wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 2:37 pm


d. Save it up from earnings.

My second best choice would be c.

Emergency funds aren't for boats and credit isn't for boats either.

You make $250K. It's only a $24K boat. You should be able to save it up no problema in a couple of months.
Sure and now he is buying a boat in September and for a good chunk of the country has missed out on the best boating months of the year. Paying taxes to fund the boat also seems stupid. Seems like A or B is the best choice. The interest doesn't matter much when you pay the loan off in 3 months. Obviously the best way would have been to decide to buy the boat back in Janaury and save up the 5k/month. But we don't have a time machine.
I agree he should have started saving for it in March, but he didn't post here until June so I could tell him. :)
1) Invest you must 2) Time is your friend 3) Impulse is your enemy | 4) Basic arithmetic works 5) Stick to simplicity 6) Stay the course

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White Coat Investor
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Re: I'm Buying a Boat...

Post by White Coat Investor » Sun Jun 28, 2020 5:16 pm

Kagord wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 4:13 pm
So you're asking, can I afford it? I think even Suze Orman would say, you go guy, go get your boat.

Just remember, it's very easy to buy a boat, you're in the winning negotiation position here. Selling a boat flat out sucks, it truly is the best day of one's life when you don't want one (or that one) anymore and the sale is complete.
I don't buy it. Put it up for sale on Memorial Day and price it accurately. It'll go fast. I think mine sold in 2 days, for $1500 more than I paid for it 5 years earlier.

But sure, if you want to sell it in November in Minnesota for top dollar it might be a little trickier.
1) Invest you must 2) Time is your friend 3) Impulse is your enemy | 4) Basic arithmetic works 5) Stick to simplicity 6) Stay the course

michaeljc70
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Re: I'm Buying a Boat...

Post by michaeljc70 » Sun Jun 28, 2020 5:19 pm

I'd go with option A. Easy to cash flow with your income. Congratulations.

Another option, depending in your brokerage and how much you have in a taxable investment account is to use a low cost margin loan. IB has 1.6% now. I cannot imagine borrowing $24k at 5% with your income.

StarsandStripes
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Re: I'm Buying a Boat...

Post by StarsandStripes » Sun Jun 28, 2020 5:40 pm

Suze actually owns a 50 or 60 ft boat. At the moment I can not remember the brand. Must be a good investment!

bstewie
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Re: I'm Buying a Boat...

Post by bstewie » Sun Jun 28, 2020 5:42 pm

123 wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 4:54 pm
bstewie wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 2:31 pm
123 wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 1:15 pm
techieguy wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 1:07 pm
...Purchase Price: 24k

How should I buy the boat?

a. Use the cash in emergency fund, replenish through income?

b. Put down 9k from emergency fund take out 36 month loan at 5% for 15,000k?

c. Sell taxable investments and pay with cash?

d. A method I'm not thinking of?...
Make the purchase contingent on a 0% loan from the current owner (or dealer) for 24 months ($1,000 a month) with the right to return the boat (for any/no reason in the same condition it was at purchase) at any time during the loan with the balance of the loan canceled. Make payments from current income.
Any self respecting seller would laugh you away at this request.

OP, make sure to save approx 20-25% of the value of the boat annually for maintenance. Boats need their own EF.
123 back
If the seller's spouse told the seller to effectivelly "get rid of that damn boat" there may be no end to the concessions available.
true, you’re probably a better negotiator than me :beer

IMO
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Re: I'm Buying a Boat...

Post by IMO » Sun Jun 28, 2020 5:43 pm

White Coat Investor wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 5:16 pm
Kagord wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 4:13 pm
So you're asking, can I afford it? I think even Suze Orman would say, you go guy, go get your boat.

Just remember, it's very easy to buy a boat, you're in the winning negotiation position here. Selling a boat flat out sucks, it truly is the best day of one's life when you don't want one (or that one) anymore and the sale is complete.
I don't buy it. Put it up for sale on Memorial Day and price it accurately. It'll go fast. I think mine sold in 2 days, for $1500 more than I paid for it 5 years earlier.

But sure, if you want to sell it in November in Minnesota for top dollar it might be a little trickier.
Yeah, it's an interesting thing with wakeboard boats. The new models are so expensive that your boat can actually appreciate when it's a more moderate priced boat. Just looked up my boat out of curiosity (mine's over 10 yrs old), same model 4 years older than mine is selling for what I bought mine for new. Not sure where one gets 25% maintenance annually???

bstewie
Posts: 180
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Re: I'm Buying a Boat...

Post by bstewie » Sun Jun 28, 2020 5:48 pm

IMO wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 5:43 pm
White Coat Investor wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 5:16 pm
Kagord wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 4:13 pm
So you're asking, can I afford it? I think even Suze Orman would say, you go guy, go get your boat.

Just remember, it's very easy to buy a boat, you're in the winning negotiation position here. Selling a boat flat out sucks, it truly is the best day of one's life when you don't want one (or that one) anymore and the sale is complete.
I don't buy it. Put it up for sale on Memorial Day and price it accurately. It'll go fast. I think mine sold in 2 days, for $1500 more than I paid for it 5 years earlier.

But sure, if you want to sell it in November in Minnesota for top dollar it might be a little trickier.
Not sure where one gets 25% maintenance annually???
Liveaboard vs toy

lessismore22
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Re: I'm Buying a Boat...

Post by lessismore22 » Sun Jun 28, 2020 5:53 pm

OP, congrats on the boat. Pay cash. You won't have much bargaining power in the middle of summer, but who cares on a 24k boat.

FWIW, we upgraded our pontoon this year and it took less than 5 hours to sell our old one on FB Marketplace. It is very easy to sell a boat at the beginning of the season.

smitcat
Posts: 5818
Joined: Mon Nov 07, 2016 10:51 am

Re: I'm Buying a Boat...

Post by smitcat » Sun Jun 28, 2020 6:12 pm

bstewie wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 3:47 pm
tibbitts wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 3:43 pm
bstewie wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 2:31 pm
123 wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 1:15 pm
techieguy wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 1:07 pm
...Purchase Price: 24k

How should I buy the boat?

a. Use the cash in emergency fund, replenish through income?

b. Put down 9k from emergency fund take out 36 month loan at 5% for 15,000k?

c. Sell taxable investments and pay with cash?

d. A method I'm not thinking of?...
Make the purchase contingent on a 0% loan from the current owner (or dealer) for 24 months ($1,000 a month) with the right to return the boat (for any/no reason in the same condition it was at purchase) at any time during the loan with the balance of the loan canceled. Make payments from current income.
Any self respecting seller would laugh you away at this request.

OP, make sure to save approx 20-25% of the value of the boat annually for maintenance. Boats need their own EF.
I've had boats and they don't need 20-25% annually for maintenance unless you base it on current value after many years. Even after mine sank, which isn't the greatest thing for engines and electronics, it didn't need 20% for maintenance.
Clarified above, accounting for slip fees as well. Not sure if op plans to keep it dry. If op keeps it dry definitely *way* less. My experience is based on larger boats. I’ve had friends with slightly larger boats with less severe incidents that were 50% repairs...
We have had many larger boats and none of them were near 50% - not even near 20%. Please keep me away from your friends.

bstewie
Posts: 180
Joined: Wed Oct 04, 2017 8:16 pm

Re: I'm Buying a Boat...

Post by bstewie » Sun Jun 28, 2020 6:20 pm

smitcat wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 6:12 pm
bstewie wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 3:47 pm
tibbitts wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 3:43 pm
bstewie wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 2:31 pm
123 wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 1:15 pm

Make the purchase contingent on a 0% loan from the current owner (or dealer) for 24 months ($1,000 a month) with the right to return the boat (for any/no reason in the same condition it was at purchase) at any time during the loan with the balance of the loan canceled. Make payments from current income.
Any self respecting seller would laugh you away at this request.

OP, make sure to save approx 20-25% of the value of the boat annually for maintenance. Boats need their own EF.
I've had boats and they don't need 20-25% annually for maintenance unless you base it on current value after many years. Even after mine sank, which isn't the greatest thing for engines and electronics, it didn't need 20% for maintenance.
Clarified above, accounting for slip fees as well. Not sure if op plans to keep it dry. If op keeps it dry definitely *way* less. My experience is based on larger boats. I’ve had friends with slightly larger boats with less severe incidents that were 50% repairs...
We have had many larger boats and none of them were near 50% - not even near 20%. Please keep me away from your friends.
Our definitions of maintenance are probably quite far apart. 50% incident was a driveshaft failure.

smitcat
Posts: 5818
Joined: Mon Nov 07, 2016 10:51 am

Re: I'm Buying a Boat...

Post by smitcat » Sun Jun 28, 2020 6:25 pm

bstewie wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 6:20 pm
smitcat wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 6:12 pm
bstewie wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 3:47 pm
tibbitts wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 3:43 pm
bstewie wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 2:31 pm


Any self respecting seller would laugh you away at this request.

OP, make sure to save approx 20-25% of the value of the boat annually for maintenance. Boats need their own EF.
I've had boats and they don't need 20-25% annually for maintenance unless you base it on current value after many years. Even after mine sank, which isn't the greatest thing for engines and electronics, it didn't need 20% for maintenance.
Clarified above, accounting for slip fees as well. Not sure if op plans to keep it dry. If op keeps it dry definitely *way* less. My experience is based on larger boats. I’ve had friends with slightly larger boats with less severe incidents that were 50% repairs...
We have had many larger boats and none of them were near 50% - not even near 20%. Please keep me away from your friends.
Our definitions of maintenance are probably quite far apart. 50% incident was a driveshaft failure.
We have owned numerous used boats sometimes more than one at a time for over 25 years - not even close to 20% maintenance on any of them. Typically under 10% or less ...a few of them were twice the size that the OP is contemplating buying.
I do not know which boats you have owned or how many but perhaps you can more clearly explain how your boat(s) cost over 25% and sometime 50% of value per year in maintenance.

michaeljc70
Posts: 6704
Joined: Thu Oct 15, 2015 3:53 pm

Re: I'm Buying a Boat...

Post by michaeljc70 » Sun Jun 28, 2020 6:28 pm

To counteract all the "best day of a boat owner" and it is so expensive comments...I had a cabin cruiser I bought 1 year old. I only had minor repairs in 10 years and sold it after 10 years for 70% of what I paid. All that being said, it not all laughs but can be exceptionally enjoyable.

Housedoc
Posts: 611
Joined: Thu May 24, 2018 4:25 pm
Location: Alabama

Re: I'm Buying a Boat...

Post by Housedoc » Sun Jun 28, 2020 6:32 pm

02nz wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 5:08 pm
OP, congrats on the second happiest day of your life!

(Sorry, I couldn't resist.)
Hell you stole my joke, now he just has to wait on the day he sells it to be ultra happy.

bstewie
Posts: 180
Joined: Wed Oct 04, 2017 8:16 pm

Re: I'm Buying a Boat...

Post by bstewie » Sun Jun 28, 2020 6:35 pm

smitcat wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 6:25 pm
bstewie wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 6:20 pm
smitcat wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 6:12 pm
bstewie wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 3:47 pm
tibbitts wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 3:43 pm

I've had boats and they don't need 20-25% annually for maintenance unless you base it on current value after many years. Even after mine sank, which isn't the greatest thing for engines and electronics, it didn't need 20% for maintenance.
Clarified above, accounting for slip fees as well. Not sure if op plans to keep it dry. If op keeps it dry definitely *way* less. My experience is based on larger boats. I’ve had friends with slightly larger boats with less severe incidents that were 50% repairs...
We have had many larger boats and none of them were near 50% - not even near 20%. Please keep me away from your friends.
Our definitions of maintenance are probably quite far apart. 50% incident was a driveshaft failure.
We have owned numerous used boats sometimes more than one at a time for over 25 years - not even close to 20% maintenance on any of them. Typically under 10% or less ...a few of them were twice the size that the OP is contemplating buying.
I do not know which boats you have owned or how many but perhaps you can more clearly explain how your boat(s) cost over 25% and sometime 50% of value per year in maintenance.
- are you slipped? do you consider that part of annual maintenance? is it a desirable slip or do you have it the cheapest place possible and you count fuel separately from maintenance and have to compensate to enjoy time out with fuel? depending on size of boat and storage location this significantly changes baseline % i would consider annual maintenance / operating costs
- how often do you clean your boat? what do you consider clean? an annual cleaning vs monthly or bi weekly cleanings depending on use might be a contributing factor based on size and cost of boat (being broad here with cleaning)
- how often do you inspect your engine and replace worn parts? most people wait for a part to fail, if you’re on a day trip on a lake or close to shore this isn’t a big deal and you probably don’t spend $ on preventative maintenance
- how much exterior space are you maintaining? how frequently are you replacing exterior upholstery, repairing fiber, replacing canvas? again, depends on size of boat and your preference and use. some folks will never incur these costs because they don’t own the boat long enough or don’t care

michaeljc70
Posts: 6704
Joined: Thu Oct 15, 2015 3:53 pm

Re: I'm Buying a Boat...

Post by michaeljc70 » Sun Jun 28, 2020 6:37 pm

bstewie wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 6:35 pm
smitcat wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 6:25 pm
bstewie wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 6:20 pm
smitcat wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 6:12 pm
bstewie wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 3:47 pm


Clarified above, accounting for slip fees as well. Not sure if op plans to keep it dry. If op keeps it dry definitely *way* less. My experience is based on larger boats. I’ve had friends with slightly larger boats with less severe incidents that were 50% repairs...
We have had many larger boats and none of them were near 50% - not even near 20%. Please keep me away from your friends.
Our definitions of maintenance are probably quite far apart. 50% incident was a driveshaft failure.
We have owned numerous used boats sometimes more than one at a time for over 25 years - not even close to 20% maintenance on any of them. Typically under 10% or less ...a few of them were twice the size that the OP is contemplating buying.
I do not know which boats you have owned or how many but perhaps you can more clearly explain how your boat(s) cost over 25% and sometime 50% of value per year in maintenance.
- are you slipped? do you consider that part of annual maintenance? is it a desirable slip or do you have it the cheapest place possible and you count fuel separately from maintenance and have to compensate to enjoy time out with fuel? depending on size of boat and storage location this significantly changes baseline % i would consider annual maintenance / operating costs
- how often do you clean your boat? what do you consider clean? an annual cleaning vs monthly or bi weekly cleanings depending on use might be a contributing factor based on size and cost of boat
- how often do you inspect your engine and replace worn parts? most people wait for a part to fail, if you’re on a day trip on a lake or close to shore this isn’t a big deal and you probably don’t spend $ on preventative maintenance
- how much exterior space are you maintaining? how frequently are you replacing exterior upholstery, repairing fiber, replacing canvas? again, depends on size of boat and your preference and use. some folks will never incur these costs because they don’t own the boat long enough or don’t care
A slip is NOT part of maintenance. Do you count property tax as maintenance on your house??

bstewie
Posts: 180
Joined: Wed Oct 04, 2017 8:16 pm

Re: I'm Buying a Boat...

Post by bstewie » Sun Jun 28, 2020 6:38 pm

michaeljc70 wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 6:37 pm
bstewie wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 6:35 pm
smitcat wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 6:25 pm
bstewie wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 6:20 pm
smitcat wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 6:12 pm


We have had many larger boats and none of them were near 50% - not even near 20%. Please keep me away from your friends.
Our definitions of maintenance are probably quite far apart. 50% incident was a driveshaft failure.
We have owned numerous used boats sometimes more than one at a time for over 25 years - not even close to 20% maintenance on any of them. Typically under 10% or less ...a few of them were twice the size that the OP is contemplating buying.
I do not know which boats you have owned or how many but perhaps you can more clearly explain how your boat(s) cost over 25% and sometime 50% of value per year in maintenance.
- are you slipped? do you consider that part of annual maintenance? is it a desirable slip or do you have it the cheapest place possible and you count fuel separately from maintenance and have to compensate to enjoy time out with fuel? depending on size of boat and storage location this significantly changes baseline % i would consider annual maintenance / operating costs
- how often do you clean your boat? what do you consider clean? an annual cleaning vs monthly or bi weekly cleanings depending on use might be a contributing factor based on size and cost of boat
- how often do you inspect your engine and replace worn parts? most people wait for a part to fail, if you’re on a day trip on a lake or close to shore this isn’t a big deal and you probably don’t spend $ on preventative maintenance
- how much exterior space are you maintaining? how frequently are you replacing exterior upholstery, repairing fiber, replacing canvas? again, depends on size of boat and your preference and use. some folks will never incur these costs because they don’t own the boat long enough or don’t care
A slip is NOT part of maintenance. Do you count property tax as maintenance on your house??
if i consider the slip a requirement for proper enjoyment in use of the boat, it’s a maintenance / operating cost

see above where i specifically stated we probably have differing opinions of what is considered maintenance

smitcat
Posts: 5818
Joined: Mon Nov 07, 2016 10:51 am

Re: I'm Buying a Boat...

Post by smitcat » Sun Jun 28, 2020 6:42 pm

bstewie wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 6:35 pm
smitcat wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 6:25 pm
bstewie wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 6:20 pm
smitcat wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 6:12 pm
bstewie wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 3:47 pm


Clarified above, accounting for slip fees as well. Not sure if op plans to keep it dry. If op keeps it dry definitely *way* less. My experience is based on larger boats. I’ve had friends with slightly larger boats with less severe incidents that were 50% repairs...
We have had many larger boats and none of them were near 50% - not even near 20%. Please keep me away from your friends.
Our definitions of maintenance are probably quite far apart. 50% incident was a driveshaft failure.
We have owned numerous used boats sometimes more than one at a time for over 25 years - not even close to 20% maintenance on any of them. Typically under 10% or less ...a few of them were twice the size that the OP is contemplating buying.
I do not know which boats you have owned or how many but perhaps you can more clearly explain how your boat(s) cost over 25% and sometime 50% of value per year in maintenance.
- are you slipped? do you consider that part of annual maintenance? is it a desirable slip or do you have it the cheapest place possible and you count fuel separately from maintenance and have to compensate to enjoy time out with fuel? depending on size of boat and storage location this significantly changes baseline % i would consider annual maintenance / operating costs
- how often do you clean your boat? what do you consider clean? an annual cleaning vs monthly or bi weekly cleanings depending on use might be a contributing factor based on size and cost of boat (being broad here with cleaning)
- how often do you inspect your engine and replace worn parts? most people wait for a part to fail, if you’re on a day trip on a lake or close to shore this isn’t a big deal and you probably don’t spend $ on preventative maintenance
- how much exterior space are you maintaining? how frequently are you replacing exterior upholstery, repairing fiber, replacing canvas? again, depends on size of boat and your preference and use. some folks will never incur these costs because they don’t own the boat long enough or don’t care

Which boat make and model and what dollars have your expended to come up with your rule of thumbs?

michaeljc70
Posts: 6704
Joined: Thu Oct 15, 2015 3:53 pm

Re: I'm Buying a Boat...

Post by michaeljc70 » Sun Jun 28, 2020 6:45 pm

bstewie wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 6:38 pm
michaeljc70 wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 6:37 pm
bstewie wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 6:35 pm
smitcat wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 6:25 pm
bstewie wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 6:20 pm


Our definitions of maintenance are probably quite far apart. 50% incident was a driveshaft failure.
We have owned numerous used boats sometimes more than one at a time for over 25 years - not even close to 20% maintenance on any of them. Typically under 10% or less ...a few of them were twice the size that the OP is contemplating buying.
I do not know which boats you have owned or how many but perhaps you can more clearly explain how your boat(s) cost over 25% and sometime 50% of value per year in maintenance.
- are you slipped? do you consider that part of annual maintenance? is it a desirable slip or do you have it the cheapest place possible and you count fuel separately from maintenance and have to compensate to enjoy time out with fuel? depending on size of boat and storage location this significantly changes baseline % i would consider annual maintenance / operating costs
- how often do you clean your boat? what do you consider clean? an annual cleaning vs monthly or bi weekly cleanings depending on use might be a contributing factor based on size and cost of boat
- how often do you inspect your engine and replace worn parts? most people wait for a part to fail, if you’re on a day trip on a lake or close to shore this isn’t a big deal and you probably don’t spend $ on preventative maintenance
- how much exterior space are you maintaining? how frequently are you replacing exterior upholstery, repairing fiber, replacing canvas? again, depends on size of boat and your preference and use. some folks will never incur these costs because they don’t own the boat long enough or don’t care
A slip is NOT part of maintenance. Do you count property tax as maintenance on your house??
if i consider the slip a requirement for proper enjoyment in use of the boat, it’s a maintenance / operating cost

see above where i specifically stated we probably have differing opinions of what is considered maintenance
Now you added a slash and included operating cost. :oops:

Operating costs are not the same as maintenance.

bstewie
Posts: 180
Joined: Wed Oct 04, 2017 8:16 pm

Re: I'm Buying a Boat...

Post by bstewie » Sun Jun 28, 2020 6:49 pm

smitcat wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 6:42 pm
bstewie wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 6:35 pm
smitcat wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 6:25 pm
bstewie wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 6:20 pm
smitcat wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 6:12 pm


We have had many larger boats and none of them were near 50% - not even near 20%. Please keep me away from your friends.
Our definitions of maintenance are probably quite far apart. 50% incident was a driveshaft failure.
We have owned numerous used boats sometimes more than one at a time for over 25 years - not even close to 20% maintenance on any of them. Typically under 10% or less ...a few of them were twice the size that the OP is contemplating buying.
I do not know which boats you have owned or how many but perhaps you can more clearly explain how your boat(s) cost over 25% and sometime 50% of value per year in maintenance.
- are you slipped? do you consider that part of annual maintenance? is it a desirable slip or do you have it the cheapest place possible and you count fuel separately from maintenance and have to compensate to enjoy time out with fuel? depending on size of boat and storage location this significantly changes baseline % i would consider annual maintenance / operating costs
- how often do you clean your boat? what do you consider clean? an annual cleaning vs monthly or bi weekly cleanings depending on use might be a contributing factor based on size and cost of boat (being broad here with cleaning)
- how often do you inspect your engine and replace worn parts? most people wait for a part to fail, if you’re on a day trip on a lake or close to shore this isn’t a big deal and you probably don’t spend $ on preventative maintenance
- how much exterior space are you maintaining? how frequently are you replacing exterior upholstery, repairing fiber, replacing canvas? again, depends on size of boat and your preference and use. some folks will never incur these costs because they don’t own the boat long enough or don’t care

Which boat make and model and what dollars have your expended to come up with your rule of thumbs?
Call it ~36’-42’ liveaboards - including slip fees - that are 15+yr old. More than moderate use by recreational standards (500+ h/yr)

PS - we are derailing from OP but I am happy to continue to explain my position

bstewie
Posts: 180
Joined: Wed Oct 04, 2017 8:16 pm

Re: I'm Buying a Boat...

Post by bstewie » Sun Jun 28, 2020 6:50 pm

michaeljc70 wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 6:45 pm
bstewie wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 6:38 pm
michaeljc70 wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 6:37 pm
bstewie wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 6:35 pm
smitcat wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 6:25 pm


We have owned numerous used boats sometimes more than one at a time for over 25 years - not even close to 20% maintenance on any of them. Typically under 10% or less ...a few of them were twice the size that the OP is contemplating buying.
I do not know which boats you have owned or how many but perhaps you can more clearly explain how your boat(s) cost over 25% and sometime 50% of value per year in maintenance.
- are you slipped? do you consider that part of annual maintenance? is it a desirable slip or do you have it the cheapest place possible and you count fuel separately from maintenance and have to compensate to enjoy time out with fuel? depending on size of boat and storage location this significantly changes baseline % i would consider annual maintenance / operating costs
- how often do you clean your boat? what do you consider clean? an annual cleaning vs monthly or bi weekly cleanings depending on use might be a contributing factor based on size and cost of boat
- how often do you inspect your engine and replace worn parts? most people wait for a part to fail, if you’re on a day trip on a lake or close to shore this isn’t a big deal and you probably don’t spend $ on preventative maintenance
- how much exterior space are you maintaining? how frequently are you replacing exterior upholstery, repairing fiber, replacing canvas? again, depends on size of boat and your preference and use. some folks will never incur these costs because they don’t own the boat long enough or don’t care
A slip is NOT part of maintenance. Do you count property tax as maintenance on your house??
if i consider the slip a requirement for proper enjoyment in use of the boat, it’s a maintenance / operating cost

see above where i specifically stated we probably have differing opinions of what is considered maintenance
Now you added a slash and included operating cost. :oops:

Operating costs are not the same as maintenance.
my point is money is fungible and boat use is % / yr depending on preferences and use, get over the semantics.

michaeljc70
Posts: 6704
Joined: Thu Oct 15, 2015 3:53 pm

Re: I'm Buying a Boat...

Post by michaeljc70 » Sun Jun 28, 2020 6:56 pm

bstewie wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 6:50 pm
michaeljc70 wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 6:45 pm
bstewie wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 6:38 pm
michaeljc70 wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 6:37 pm
bstewie wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 6:35 pm


- are you slipped? do you consider that part of annual maintenance? is it a desirable slip or do you have it the cheapest place possible and you count fuel separately from maintenance and have to compensate to enjoy time out with fuel? depending on size of boat and storage location this significantly changes baseline % i would consider annual maintenance / operating costs
- how often do you clean your boat? what do you consider clean? an annual cleaning vs monthly or bi weekly cleanings depending on use might be a contributing factor based on size and cost of boat
- how often do you inspect your engine and replace worn parts? most people wait for a part to fail, if you’re on a day trip on a lake or close to shore this isn’t a big deal and you probably don’t spend $ on preventative maintenance
- how much exterior space are you maintaining? how frequently are you replacing exterior upholstery, repairing fiber, replacing canvas? again, depends on size of boat and your preference and use. some folks will never incur these costs because they don’t own the boat long enough or don’t care
A slip is NOT part of maintenance. Do you count property tax as maintenance on your house??
if i consider the slip a requirement for proper enjoyment in use of the boat, it’s a maintenance / operating cost

see above where i specifically stated we probably have differing opinions of what is considered maintenance
Now you added a slash and included operating cost. :oops:

Operating costs are not the same as maintenance.
my point is money is fungible and boat use is % / yr depending on preferences and use, get over the semantics.
Yeah, specifics don't matter. We can know the slip fees, pretty well estimate gas usage, winter storage (if applicable) and things like that. Maintenance/repairs is more unknowable.

bstewie
Posts: 180
Joined: Wed Oct 04, 2017 8:16 pm

Re: I'm Buying a Boat...

Post by bstewie » Sun Jun 28, 2020 6:57 pm

michaeljc70 wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 6:56 pm
bstewie wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 6:50 pm
michaeljc70 wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 6:45 pm
bstewie wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 6:38 pm
michaeljc70 wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 6:37 pm


A slip is NOT part of maintenance. Do you count property tax as maintenance on your house??
if i consider the slip a requirement for proper enjoyment in use of the boat, it’s a maintenance / operating cost

see above where i specifically stated we probably have differing opinions of what is considered maintenance
Now you added a slash and included operating cost. :oops:

Operating costs are not the same as maintenance.
my point is money is fungible and boat use is % / yr depending on preferences and use, get over the semantics.
Yeah, specifics don't matter. We can know the slip fees, pretty well estimate gas usage, winter storage (if applicable) and things like that. Maintenance/repairs is more unknowable.
Yes, in that light my %s are wrong. I guess my original estimates are more in line with average annual cost of ownership.

smitcat
Posts: 5818
Joined: Mon Nov 07, 2016 10:51 am

Re: I'm Buying a Boat...

Post by smitcat » Sun Jun 28, 2020 7:01 pm

bstewie wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 6:49 pm
smitcat wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 6:42 pm
bstewie wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 6:35 pm
smitcat wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 6:25 pm
bstewie wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 6:20 pm


Our definitions of maintenance are probably quite far apart. 50% incident was a driveshaft failure.
We have owned numerous used boats sometimes more than one at a time for over 25 years - not even close to 20% maintenance on any of them. Typically under 10% or less ...a few of them were twice the size that the OP is contemplating buying.
I do not know which boats you have owned or how many but perhaps you can more clearly explain how your boat(s) cost over 25% and sometime 50% of value per year in maintenance.
- are you slipped? do you consider that part of annual maintenance? is it a desirable slip or do you have it the cheapest place possible and you count fuel separately from maintenance and have to compensate to enjoy time out with fuel? depending on size of boat and storage location this significantly changes baseline % i would consider annual maintenance / operating costs
- how often do you clean your boat? what do you consider clean? an annual cleaning vs monthly or bi weekly cleanings depending on use might be a contributing factor based on size and cost of boat (being broad here with cleaning)
- how often do you inspect your engine and replace worn parts? most people wait for a part to fail, if you’re on a day trip on a lake or close to shore this isn’t a big deal and you probably don’t spend $ on preventative maintenance
- how much exterior space are you maintaining? how frequently are you replacing exterior upholstery, repairing fiber, replacing canvas? again, depends on size of boat and your preference and use. some folks will never incur these costs because they don’t own the boat long enough or don’t care

Which boat make and model and what dollars have your expended to come up with your rule of thumbs?
Call it ~36’-42’ liveaboards - including slip fees - that are 15+yr old. More than moderate use by recreational standards (500+ h/yr)

PS - we are derailing from OP but I am happy to continue to explain my position
You are a full time liveaboard and are comparing those costs to a 21' runaround recreational boat?
Why would you even post such a comparison?
Even with that comparison why are you spending up to 50% of value each year in costs?
What is a drive shaft on a 40' powerboat? Are you referring to the shafts on a straight drive inboard? Shafting, cutlass bearings, props, and struts are all fairly easy to avoid problems and/or handle in larger boats but in any case we are talking about average costs per season not one poor year.

We have had 3 used boats above 45' - all with twin diesels that traveled more than 1,000 nmiles per year and often towing a 19 or 24' larger RIB. These boats also had another RIB on the boat deck and we typically would have slept on the boat more than 60 nights per season.
We do not calculate vacations, food, drinks,and entertainment in our boats maintenance categories which we have always kept in quickbooks.

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