Sump pump recommendations
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Sump pump recommendations
I'm looking to replace my current sump pump. It was replaced by the seller when I bought the house back in 2008. I'm seeing Wayne and Zoeller as popular choices with good reviews. I currently have a Zoeller, submersible, cast iron and it seems to have held up well. I don't hear it go on that often and I check on it probably more often than it has run.
After some heavy rain today, I checked the pit and it had water at a decently amount of water but not alarming. I decided to pull up the float and have it pump water out but it didn't seem to go down more than an inch or so. The PVC pipe goes up the wall about 8-9 feet before making a 90 degree bend to go out the wall and then down toward the ground before it angles into the ground toward the middle of the yard.
I'm providing the additional detail above in case anyone has thoughts on the setup that could be causing the issue with the pump. I have an unfinished basement with a whole lot of "stuff" that I personally don't care for but I'm sure others do.
Thoughts and suggestions appreciated.
After some heavy rain today, I checked the pit and it had water at a decently amount of water but not alarming. I decided to pull up the float and have it pump water out but it didn't seem to go down more than an inch or so. The PVC pipe goes up the wall about 8-9 feet before making a 90 degree bend to go out the wall and then down toward the ground before it angles into the ground toward the middle of the yard.
I'm providing the additional detail above in case anyone has thoughts on the setup that could be causing the issue with the pump. I have an unfinished basement with a whole lot of "stuff" that I personally don't care for but I'm sure others do.
Thoughts and suggestions appreciated.
Re: Sump pump recommendations
Zoeller is a good brand.
Must do: add check valve to pump set-up, will help pump longevity.
Not a must do, but a good preparation step: around year 3-4 of your new pump, buy a replacement pump and have set up and ready to go.
Must do: add check valve to pump set-up, will help pump longevity.
Not a must do, but a good preparation step: around year 3-4 of your new pump, buy a replacement pump and have set up and ready to go.
Re: Sump pump recommendations
Does your pump run but not pump water? If there is a check valve but no weep hole drilled below it, you could have an airlock. A decade is a long time for a pump though, might be a good idea to replace it anyways.
After a ton of research, I just bought and installed the slightly nicer Zoeller model M63. It has a metal switch that is supposed to last longer and a 5 year warranty. It is way nicer than the previous no name we had. Our pump does a good deal of work and this one seems up to the task.
Check valve and drilling a weep hole below it is a must. Consensus is a separate float switch is a good idea and a backup pump is a great idea. I am thinking of setting up a city water powered backup but right now I am just happy with the new pump.
Found it on Amazon warehouse for $60 bucks off so maybe check there. Highly recommended.
After a ton of research, I just bought and installed the slightly nicer Zoeller model M63. It has a metal switch that is supposed to last longer and a 5 year warranty. It is way nicer than the previous no name we had. Our pump does a good deal of work and this one seems up to the task.
Check valve and drilling a weep hole below it is a must. Consensus is a separate float switch is a good idea and a backup pump is a great idea. I am thinking of setting up a city water powered backup but right now I am just happy with the new pump.
Found it on Amazon warehouse for $60 bucks off so maybe check there. Highly recommended.
Re: Sump pump recommendations
Get a pump that has a separate piggyback float switch. I need to replace the switch every 4 or 5 years but the pumps still work fine. I have a Zoeller ejector pump for sewage, and it is now at 16 years. My 2 Barnes VF33 sump pumps are probably 8 or 10 years old. Then I have a Wayne battery backup beside one of the Barnes in one of the pits.
Re: Sump pump recommendations
The
I second the post about having a replacement pump piped & ready to slide in. I have my replacement next to my working pump. For "the day"... If you don't know how to quickly replace a pump if needed, but would be willing to do so if needed, practice swapping them out. You'll realize one pipe is too long, one fitting needs to be smoothed out, etc...
I also have a municipal water powered sump pump. It's [blank-ing] fantastic.
Probably because the pit was not very full. ^^^ This doesn't worry me.
I second the post about having a replacement pump piped & ready to slide in. I have my replacement next to my working pump. For "the day"... If you don't know how to quickly replace a pump if needed, but would be willing to do so if needed, practice swapping them out. You'll realize one pipe is too long, one fitting needs to be smoothed out, etc...
I also have a municipal water powered sump pump. It's [blank-ing] fantastic.
$1 saved = >$1 earned. ✓
Re: Sump pump recommendations
Not sure if this applies for a primary pump.
We installed a water jet backup sump to protect during power outage. Outages were not uncommon in our previous home.
It worked beautifully but does require municipal water supply.
https://www.libertypumps.com/Product/SJ10-SumpJet
We installed a water jet backup sump to protect during power outage. Outages were not uncommon in our previous home.
It worked beautifully but does require municipal water supply.
https://www.libertypumps.com/Product/SJ10-SumpJet
Re: Sump pump recommendations
I've got nothing bad to say about Zoeller, have used them numerous times in the past, and that's what my ejector pump is. Excellent quality and very durable.
That said, my current sump setup is a Nexpump, and I am very happy with it. Instead of a large AC primary pump and a dinky DC backup pump, this has two identical and powerful DC pumps, with an intelligent controller that includes a high-current charger, and two independent float switches. Both pumps self-test twice a day, it sends me status update emails on my schedule (have it set for every two weeks), and alerts me if anything happens--power out, float switch failed, impending pump failure, etc.
Their service is also excellent. A few weeks ago one of the pumps got significantly louder than it had been. It still worked just fine, but was not silent anymore. Traded a few emails with support, they sent me a new pump, which I replaced in under 5 minutes. It wasn't raining when I replaced it, but even if it had been, my basement wouldn't have been at risk because either pump by itself evacuates water at about twice the rate of the fastest it has ever come in.
That said, my current sump setup is a Nexpump, and I am very happy with it. Instead of a large AC primary pump and a dinky DC backup pump, this has two identical and powerful DC pumps, with an intelligent controller that includes a high-current charger, and two independent float switches. Both pumps self-test twice a day, it sends me status update emails on my schedule (have it set for every two weeks), and alerts me if anything happens--power out, float switch failed, impending pump failure, etc.
Their service is also excellent. A few weeks ago one of the pumps got significantly louder than it had been. It still worked just fine, but was not silent anymore. Traded a few emails with support, they sent me a new pump, which I replaced in under 5 minutes. It wasn't raining when I replaced it, but even if it had been, my basement wouldn't have been at risk because either pump by itself evacuates water at about twice the rate of the fastest it has ever come in.
Re: Sump pump recommendations
We just put one of these in two weeks ago. Hopefully, we won't have a need for the backup anytime soon.musicmom wrote: ↑Fri Apr 10, 2020 7:46 am Not sure if this applies for a primary pump.
We installed a water jet backup sump to protect during power outage. Outages were not uncommon in our previous home.
It worked beautifully but does require municipal water supply.
https://www.libertypumps.com/Product/SJ10-SumpJet
Re: Sump pump recommendations
Depending on needs, a battery backup for the pump can be useful. Of course if you have the house on a backup generator then you wouldn't need it. I lived in MD where we had some nasty storms (including a 6" downpour in 30 minutes), when everything was working I never had any issues since my house was partly on a hill. One time when the power went out for a few hours, I did get a few wet spots on the basement floor so I got the battery backup to help. If I had stayed there, I probably would have gotten a gas generator due to all of the outages we had.
I've resigned myself to a few things:
1. Basement will always flood at least once so don't put anything valuable on the floor and put stuff in plastic bins. (Ditto for garages)
2. Buy houses on a hill and not in flat/low spots.
3. If I house has a history of flooding don't buy it. Dealing with water issues is a costly and painful process.
And even when I do everything and move to a dry area, I still have issues. I had my house partially flooded in Arizona because the landscape guy turned a hose on in a window well to water some plants and forgot about it. I came home and my front 2 bedrooms were flooded. Fortunately the guy had insurance and after first denying it, he admitted it was his fault (I think his wife had some influence there). And yeah, afterwards I got rid of him (apparently his wife did as well).
So water issues have haunted me.
I've resigned myself to a few things:
1. Basement will always flood at least once so don't put anything valuable on the floor and put stuff in plastic bins. (Ditto for garages)
2. Buy houses on a hill and not in flat/low spots.
3. If I house has a history of flooding don't buy it. Dealing with water issues is a costly and painful process.
And even when I do everything and move to a dry area, I still have issues. I had my house partially flooded in Arizona because the landscape guy turned a hose on in a window well to water some plants and forgot about it. I came home and my front 2 bedrooms were flooded. Fortunately the guy had insurance and after first denying it, he admitted it was his fault (I think his wife had some influence there). And yeah, afterwards I got rid of him (apparently his wife did as well).
So water issues have haunted me.
----------------------------- |
If you think something is important and it doesn't involve the health of someone, think again. Life goes too fast, enjoy it and be nice.
Re: Sump pump recommendations
I considered putting in a water powered backup pump but my utility insists that I install a backflow preventer and pay to have a technician come out and test it annually. I declined.
I have a 36 year old Zoeller pedestal pump. Last year I thought the switch failed in on position and they sent me a new switch out free of charge. After the unit cooled down, the old switch worked fine and I determined that the problem was that the rod was slightly rubbing on lid to sump which had been recently replaced by radon mitigation outfit.
I have a 36 year old Zoeller pedestal pump. Last year I thought the switch failed in on position and they sent me a new switch out free of charge. After the unit cooled down, the old switch worked fine and I determined that the problem was that the rod was slightly rubbing on lid to sump which had been recently replaced by radon mitigation outfit.
Re: Sump pump recommendations
Zoeller's are great. I used a liberty pump for mine but both companies offer quality products. My choice was only to match one that i had in a different location if I needed to swap for some reason. I installed a levelguard electronic float switch as well. Got all of my stuff online from sump pumps direct. If it's been long enough than you can remember, swap the float valve as well, some of the cheap ones go bad pretty quick.
Re: Sump pump recommendations
I've had my eye on this one, anyone ever used it?
Basement Watchdog - 1/2 HP Big Combination Unit with Special Backup Sump Pump System
Basement Watchdog - 1/2 HP Big Combination Unit with Special Backup Sump Pump System
Re: Sump pump recommendations
I had a previous version of that unit, and it was absolute rubbish. The primary pump failed after three years, and then the backup unit killed the battery in a matter of hours. The charger is only 19 watts (essentially an iPad charger), so it can't keep up with any kind of usage.
We saved our basement by throwing a utility pump into the sump pit and running a garden hose over to our ejector pit. That couldn't quite keep up with the water, but gave us ~20 minute windows in which we could re-charge the battery (using an automotive fast charger) enough to run the backup pump for another cycle. Rinse and repeat for 6 hours until the storm was over, after which point the utility pump could keep up, and we just hooked it to the BW's float switch until we got the whole unit replaced with a NexPump.
Re: Sump pump recommendations
I have 2 separate big AC sump pumps in a twin-pit setup (the pits are connected below the floor level so if one sump dies, the other will still pump out both pitslazydavid wrote: ↑Fri Apr 10, 2020 11:48 amI had a previous version of that unit, and it was absolute rubbish. The primary pump failed after three years, and then the backup unit killed the battery in a matter of hours. The charger is only 19 watts (essentially an iPad charger), so it can't keep up with any kind of usage.
We saved our basement by throwing a utility pump into the sump pit and running a garden hose over to our ejector pit. That couldn't quite keep up with the water, but gave us ~20 minute windows in which we could re-charge the battery (using an automotive fast charger) enough to run the backup pump for another cycle. Rinse and repeat for 6 hours until the storm was over, after which point the utility pump could keep up, and we just hooked it to the BW's float switch until we got the whole unit replaced with a NexPump.
Then in one of the pits I also have this, separately joined up to the outflow PVC through another wye
https://www.amazon.com/Wayne-ESP25-Upgr ... B07GJXRZ1V
I have one largish AGM 12V battery, and I swapped out the little float charger that comes with the Wayne for a better NOCO Genius charger that keeps it all charged and topped off. https://www.amazon.com/NOCO-G3500-Ultra ... B004LWVEKS
We have a portable generator and I had a transfer switch installed so I could run various circuits if I need to. Basically a poor-man's whole house generator. Luckily our uptime from the utility has gotten a LOT better than it was about 10 years ago, so we have only had one power outage in past few years and that was when a tree limb cracked and pulled down the line in a neighbors backyard down the street.
Re: Sump pump recommendations
Thank you for this, I was close to buying it. I have a bilge pump like what's used on boats and a hose sitting next to it. That's my backup plan for the primary Zoeller metal pump if the power goes out, I'll run it into the utility drain or the bathtub...but that's not a solution if we are on vacation (some sunny day) and away from the house.lazydavid wrote: ↑Fri Apr 10, 2020 11:48 amI had a previous version of that unit, and it was absolute rubbish. The primary pump failed after three years, and then the backup unit killed the battery in a matter of hours. The charger is only 19 watts (essentially an iPad charger), so it can't keep up with any kind of usage.
We saved our basement by throwing a utility pump into the sump pit and running a garden hose over to our ejector pit. That couldn't quite keep up with the water, but gave us ~20 minute windows in which we could re-charge the battery (using an automotive fast charger) enough to run the backup pump for another cycle. Rinse and repeat for 6 hours until the storm was over, after which point the utility pump could keep up, and we just hooked it to the BW's float switch until we got the whole unit replaced with a NexPump.
- ClevrChico
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Re: Sump pump recommendations
Liberty makes a great pump, and I believe it is far better than Zoeller.
The weak points of a Zoeller are the flat gaskets and switches.
Liberty uses o-rings and has a magnetic switch. Much, much more reliable!
The weak points of a Zoeller are the flat gaskets and switches.
Liberty uses o-rings and has a magnetic switch. Much, much more reliable!
Re: Sump pump recommendations
Lots of those "Basement watchdog" type backup pumps have tiny little plastic pumps. If they have to life the water about 3 feet they might work, but at least in my case, my basement is 9 feet ceilings so it is 10 feet from the floor up to the joist where the discharge line goes horizontal, plus about 3 to 4 feet further down below the floor to the water level. That becomes a sizeable "head" that the pump needs to overcome, and a wussy little pump the size of a softball will often struggle to actually move water. Especially once the battery isn't 100% fresh anymore.epicahab wrote: ↑Fri Apr 10, 2020 12:25 pmThank you for this, I was close to buying it. I have a bilge pump like what's used on boats and a hose sitting next to it. That's my backup plan for the primary Zoeller metal pump if the power goes out, I'll run it into the utility drain or the bathtub...but that's not a solution if we are on vacation (some sunny day) and away from the house.lazydavid wrote: ↑Fri Apr 10, 2020 11:48 amI had a previous version of that unit, and it was absolute rubbish. The primary pump failed after three years, and then the backup unit killed the battery in a matter of hours. The charger is only 19 watts (essentially an iPad charger), so it can't keep up with any kind of usage.
We saved our basement by throwing a utility pump into the sump pit and running a garden hose over to our ejector pit. That couldn't quite keep up with the water, but gave us ~20 minute windows in which we could re-charge the battery (using an automotive fast charger) enough to run the backup pump for another cycle. Rinse and repeat for 6 hours until the storm was over, after which point the utility pump could keep up, and we just hooked it to the BW's float switch until we got the whole unit replaced with a NexPump.
Re: Sump pump recommendations
When we installed our water jet backup sump, the town code officer did require we install a backflow prevention thing.
But we didnt need any annual inspection. I guess that's town specific.
Once installed, we would test the water jet every few months to make sure it kicked on if primary was disabled.
Worked fine every time.
We liked that it didnt have a battery that we would have to monitor. We're bad at keeping up on stuff sometimes.
We liked that we could be away during a storm and not worry if power went out.
But we didnt need any annual inspection. I guess that's town specific.
Once installed, we would test the water jet every few months to make sure it kicked on if primary was disabled.
Worked fine every time.
We liked that it didnt have a battery that we would have to monitor. We're bad at keeping up on stuff sometimes.
We liked that we could be away during a storm and not worry if power went out.
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Re: Sump pump recommendations
I installed this one by Wayne a year ago. It is an integrated two-pump unit (main a/c and battery-powered backup). Looks like a well-built unit. Time will tell if it is any good; haven't had a major power failure since then to know how this will perform in back-up mode.
The install took about an hour. (I bought the recommended matching Wayne battery, too.)
Re: Sump pump recommendations
Not to rain on your parade but really for others doing the research, I would suggest that it would be better to do a standalone battery backup (like the Wayne ESP25) rather than this unit. Just eyeballing that one you linked, while it is nice and compact with the two pumps nestled in with each other, the backup pump shares the float switch with the primary pump. This means that every time the primary pump is cycling, the switch in the secondary pump is probably clicking too. That could mean it wears out faster. You also have no redundancy with a single pump switch, and the switches are usually what fails rather than the actual pump. If you are DIY-able at all it is easy to cut some PVC and buy a wye and a 45 degree bend and put together a section of pipe to link together a normal sump pump and the backup, and then you will truly have an independent backup that only turns on if the water level gets well above the AC one (because the AC one stops working). You can spend $200 on the backup rather than $400 for the all in one. If something breaks you will be spending $400 for another all in one. Get a primary AC with a piggyback float switch, and most likely you will then spend $25 every 5 years when the float switch breaks and the pump itself will last for 20 or more years. And then with the backup, you'll just need to check the battery every few years and probably replace it every 5-6 years if it gets weak so it doesn't really pump water. The pump may whirr but it may not really be strong enough to lift water.investor4life wrote: ↑Sun Apr 12, 2020 11:20 pmI installed this one by Wayne a year ago. It is an integrated two-pump unit (main a/c and battery-powered backup). Looks like a well-built unit. Time will tell if it is any good; haven't had a major power failure since then to know how this will perform in back-up mode.
The install took about an hour. (I bought the recommended matching Wayne battery, too.)
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Re: Sump pump recommendations
You make some great points; thanks! For me it was a question of getting something that I could quickly "drop" into the sump basket and not have to re-do existing plumbing. (I was leaving town soon and didn't have time for any re-do.) Incidentally, this unit does have a separate float switch for the backup pump. In the figure it's the black cup-like thingy to the left of the vertical discharge pipe.
Re: Sump pump recommendations
Ok that's better then....(separate float switches). So basically it is just a regular pump and a backup pump mounted together into one discharge pipe. Not a bad thing I guess except less "modular" so you may have trouble replacing one pump vs having to replace the whole unit.investor4life wrote: ↑Mon Apr 13, 2020 3:37 pm You make some great points; thanks! For me it was a question of getting something that I could quickly "drop" into the sump basket and not have to re-do existing plumbing. (I was leaving town soon and didn't have time for any re-do.) Incidentally, this unit does have a separate float switch for the backup pump. In the figure it's the black cup-like thingy to the left of the vertical discharge pipe.
Good luck!
Re: Sump pump recommendations
It depends on the amount of water that would get recycled. Check valves prevent water from getting recycled, so in that sense they reduce the amount of work that your pump must do, thereby helping with its longevity. If we are not talking about much water that would get recycled though, a check valve introduces another failure point. If it gets stuck closed, the pump won't be able to discharge water from the sump pit and you'll end up with a flood.
A check valve getting stuck closed is of particular concern in situations where the sump pump only sees occasional and/or seasonal use. This means that the check valve doesn't get much use and water just sits on it, which increases the likelihood that it won't open when it needs to.
Re: Sump pump recommendations
True but I would think in most cases there is a LOT of water that would come back down without a check valve. In my case, the pipe runs up at least 12 to 14 feet from the bottom, and it is 2" PVC so that is a fair amount of water that would come down into the pit every time the sump stops. I've not heard of check valves getting stuck closed, but you don't want your pump to burn out because it is quick cycling over and overUALflyer wrote: ↑Tue Apr 14, 2020 6:37 pmIt depends on the amount of water that would get recycled. Check valves prevent water from getting recycled, so in that sense they reduce the amount of work that your pump must do, thereby helping with its longevity. If we are not talking about much water that would get recycled though, a check valve introduces another failure point. If it gets stuck closed, the pump won't be able to discharge water from the sump pit and you'll end up with a flood.
A check valve getting stuck closed is of particular concern in situations where the sump pump only sees occasional and/or seasonal use. This means that the check valve doesn't get much use and water just sits on it, which increases the likelihood that it won't open when it needs to.
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Re: Sump pump recommendations
Hogan773: volume of 12ft of 2" diameter pipe = 2 gal.Hogan773 wrote: ↑Wed Apr 15, 2020 3:03 pmTrue but I would think in most cases there is a LOT of water that would come back down without a check valve. In my case, the pipe runs up at least 12 to 14 feet from the bottom, and it is 2" PVC so that is a fair amount of water that would come down into the pit every time the sump stops. I've not heard of check valves getting stuck closed, but you don't want your pump to burn out because it is quick cycling over and overUALflyer wrote: ↑Tue Apr 14, 2020 6:37 pmIt depends on the amount of water that would get recycled. Check valves prevent water from getting recycled, so in that sense they reduce the amount of work that your pump must do, thereby helping with its longevity. If we are not talking about much water that would get recycled though, a check valve introduces another failure point. If it gets stuck closed, the pump won't be able to discharge water from the sump pit and you'll end up with a flood.
A check valve getting stuck closed is of particular concern in situations where the sump pump only sees occasional and/or seasonal use. This means that the check valve doesn't get much use and water just sits on it, which increases the likelihood that it won't open when it needs to.
UALflyer is correct regarding recommending carefully consider adding a check valve.
Check valves do add another potential single point vulnerability, and check valves absolutely can and do fail.
During my career, there were many check valve failures in the dozens of sumps in our facility.
Check valves will either fail open or shut, resulting in back-flow or no flow.
A perimeter french drain feeds my sump. Back-flow from 10' of 1.5" diameter discharge pipe (1gal vol) results in negligible level rise.
As UALflyer said -if a sump runs very intermittently (ie: only during springtime high water table), the check valve getting no exercise for many months is a failure precursor. Therefore, sump operation should be tested annually before normal expected cycling (good advice for any sump).
Unless a very long discharge run and/or very small sump, the KISS method is best -check valves CAN be trouble, based on my experience!
Re: Sump pump recommendations
I recently put in a Campbell Hausfeld, 1/2 HP.
It seems well built and is very quiet. Reviews online were good. I get about 5-7 years with a full basement and high usage.
It was ~$130.
It seems well built and is very quiet. Reviews online were good. I get about 5-7 years with a full basement and high usage.
It was ~$130.
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Re: Sump pump recommendations
Thanks for all the great suggestions!