Safest way to get food

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Sandtrap
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Re: Safest way to get food

Post by Sandtrap » Sat Apr 04, 2020 10:48 am

JAZZISCOOL wrote:
Fri Apr 03, 2020 3:07 pm
The Governor of my state now requires a cloth face mask for everyone when they go to the store, etc. He says we can use bandanas or old t-shirts. :|
I don't understand the news saying that the N95 is not needed or counterproductive ?

Wouldn't one want to use the best protection available, given that one had the N95 masks?

For example:
A fellow senior recently told me that my use of N95 masks was "silly" and I shoudn't be using it in public to go shopping for food and TP.

Is this attitude a result of a successful information campaign or is it grounded in fact?


"jazziscool"(My ShadowCat, passed recently at age 18, used to look like your avatar when young.)
j :happy
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Sandtrap
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Re: Safest way to get food

Post by Sandtrap » Sat Apr 04, 2020 10:51 am

Blue456 wrote:
Thu Apr 02, 2020 9:20 am
InvestingGeek wrote:
Thu Apr 02, 2020 8:21 am
SimonJester wrote:
Thu Apr 02, 2020 8:05 am
There are no good studies on reusing N95 masks, as they were never designed to be reused. However my Wife an RN is reusing her one mask, she places it into large Ziptop bag, leaving the bag open so the mask can dry out. Doing this with gloves, not touching face, disposing of gloves afterwords, same for retrieving and re doning the mask.
But wouldn't any contamination just get onto the inside surface of the bag and eventually get onto the safe side of the mask when she pulls it out for her next reuse?
That is exactly how people get sick when reusing N95. Whoever is the hospital administrator that came up with the idea of placing the N95 in a bag (usually paper bag for some odd reason) has obviously no medical background. N95 can be cleaned via UV light or hot steam generated in microwave oven. Never re-use same N95 without decontamination. Never place it in a bag, unless it is clean.
Of course there are better solutions. . . however. . .

Wouldn't simply not using the N95 mask for a week or more cause whatever is living on it to die off?

Or maybe put it in a ziplock bag in the freezer for 2 weeks?
(not as good as other methods but likely effective)

j :happy
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JackoC
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Re: Safest way to get food

Post by JackoC » Sat Apr 04, 2020 10:54 am

absolute zero wrote:
Fri Apr 03, 2020 7:55 pm

<< You are free to ignore the data and professionals.>>

I’m ignoring data and professionals?? :confused

I’m not refuting the claim by experts (Fauci included) that while the virus is detectable for up to 3 days, it’s no longer viable after that period. I’m saying that it’s not that unlikely to pick up a package off the front door within hours or even minutes of it being delivered. Most of us are, after all, home all day.
All the statements by professionals are carefully couched, because *they do not know with any certainty*. The key issue, which is how it affects your chance of becoming infected to touch various stuff. That is not a simple question of 'the virus can be detected X hours after', but also critically involves the likelihood it's enough of a viable viral load to actually infect a given person. Plus, obviously, we're told to wash our hands frequently and not touch face so depends how closely you follow that instruction. I assume practically everyone concerned about this at all (which at one time excluded a lot of people, I guess still excludes a non-zero number, but a lot fewer now) would do that after going to the store and touching things there. It is more of a sneaky issue maybe that you forget to do this after touching a package you've brought in.

But I think it's quite possible they eventually strengthen their statements to saying you're really not practically going to get this disease from touching packages you bring in the house, that that turns out to account for a tiny % of transmissions if any. They tend to imply that now IMO. But if there was any chance that's wrong and you were a public expert would you say it strongly now? Of course you wouldn't.

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Re: Safest way to get food

Post by JAZZISCOOL » Sat Apr 04, 2020 12:17 pm

Sandtrap wrote:
Sat Apr 04, 2020 10:48 am
JAZZISCOOL wrote:
Fri Apr 03, 2020 3:07 pm
The Governor of my state now requires a cloth face mask for everyone when they go to the store, etc. He says we can use bandanas or old t-shirts. :|
I don't understand the news saying that the N95 is not needed or counterproductive ?

Wouldn't one want to use the best protection available, given that one had the N95 masks?

For example:
A fellow senior recently told me that my use of N95 masks was "silly" and I shoudn't be using it in public to go shopping for food and TP.

Is this attitude a result of a successful information campaign or is it grounded in fact?


"jazziscool"(My ShadowCat, passed recently at age 18, used to look like your avatar when young.)
j :happy
First, I'm so sorry you lost ShadowCat. :( Always so sad to lose a beloved pet. I lost my black tuxedo cat several years ago.

Re: N95 - Your logic seems valid to me. Based on what I have read, I think they offer the best protection to viruses. I don't see why it would be counterproductive.

But in my state, for example, the powers that be on the news want people to donate those to hospitals (same with regular surgical masks). This also seems quite reasonable since they are on the front line. But if one bought them for personal protection for times like this, why not have the ability to use them?

I find it frustrating to see the changing messages people get on masks. I never even knew about N95 masks until the pandemic had started so of course too late to try to purchase any. I ordered a cloth mask on Amazon so will see how that works. :|

SimonJester
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Re: Safest way to get food

Post by SimonJester » Sat Apr 04, 2020 12:46 pm

JAZZISCOOL wrote:
Sat Apr 04, 2020 12:17 pm
I find it frustrating to see the changing messages people get on masks. I never even knew about N95 masks until the pandemic had started so of course too late to try to purchase any. I ordered a cloth mask on Amazon so will see how that works. :|
Its my belief the changing message was intentional in order to try and preserve masks for health care workers and not increase cases of hording. Its about doing the most amount of good. Sure a N95 mask is better protection for you and me going out in public, but they are needed for health care workers more so. Without proper PPE health care workers, whom are young and healthy, will receive a huge viral load and will die. This is seen in China, Italy and other parts of the world. One we begin to lose mass numbers of health care workers we will have no one to deal with the pandemic at all.

The goal of the public wearing masks when going out is not to prevent you from getting infected, its to prevent your cough and breath from infecting others.

You still need to wash hands, not touch face and eyes and wash the mask when you get home...
"They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety." - Benjamin Franklin

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Sandtrap
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Re: Safest way to get food

Post by Sandtrap » Sat Apr 04, 2020 12:54 pm

JAZZISCOOL wrote:
Sat Apr 04, 2020 12:17 pm
Sandtrap wrote:
Sat Apr 04, 2020 10:48 am
JAZZISCOOL wrote:
Fri Apr 03, 2020 3:07 pm
The Governor of my state now requires a cloth face mask for everyone when they go to the store, etc. He says we can use bandanas or old t-shirts. :|
I don't understand the news saying that the N95 is not needed or counterproductive ?

Wouldn't one want to use the best protection available, given that one had the N95 masks?

For example:
A fellow senior recently told me that my use of N95 masks was "silly" and I shoudn't be using it in public to go shopping for food and TP.

Is this attitude a result of a successful information campaign or is it grounded in fact?


"jazziscool"(My ShadowCat, passed recently at age 18, used to look like your avatar when young.)
j :happy
First, I'm so sorry you lost ShadowCat. :( Always so sad to lose a beloved pet. I lost my black tuxedo cat several years ago.

Re: N95 - Your logic seems valid to me. Based on what I have read, I think they offer the best protection to viruses. I don't see why it would be counterproductive.

But in my state, for example, the powers that be on the news want people to donate those to hospitals (same with regular surgical masks). This also seems quite reasonable since they are on the front line. But if one bought them for personal protection for times like this, why not have the ability to use them?

I find it frustrating to see the changing messages people get on masks. I never even knew about N95 masks until the pandemic had started so of course too late to try to purchase any. I ordered a cloth mask on Amazon so will see how that works. :|
We use the N95 in the workshop for wood n welding and around the mini ranch as DW has allergies. So always had them around anyway. Assumed that most others had them as well. Oh well.
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JAZZISCOOL
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Re: Safest way to get food

Post by JAZZISCOOL » Sat Apr 04, 2020 1:05 pm

SimonJester:

Re: "Its my belief the changing message was intentional in order to try and preserve masks for health care workers and not increase cases of hording. Its about doing the most amount of good. Sure a N95 mask is better protection for you and me going out in public, but they are needed for health care workers more so."

Putting the N95 masks aside, even the recommendations on cloth face masks or bandanas have changed over time. Only this week did the CDC and the Governor in my state recommend these. Was this too late for the early spread? We may never know. But for a long time, we have seen videos and images of people in Asia and Europe wearing face masks among the general population. :|

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Re: Safest way to get food

Post by JAZZISCOOL » Sat Apr 04, 2020 1:18 pm

Sandtrap:

"We use the N95 in the workshop for wood n welding and around the mini ranch as DW has allergies. So always had them around anyway. Assumed that most others had them as well. Oh well.
j🌺"

I also have allergies and have used regular "procedure" masks in the past. When things have calmed down at some point in the future re: supplies, I will have to look into N95's for allergies/dust as well. I have an indoor air purifier that helps some. :happy

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Re: Safest way to get food

Post by InvisibleAerobar » Sat Apr 04, 2020 2:57 pm

justbpatient wrote:
Sat Apr 04, 2020 9:27 am

UV light has been shown to damage masks:
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4699414/

Most methods to sterilize masks also damage them and reduce their effectiveness, including alcohol and bleach although I don’t have the source for that right now. The material can be degraded and the electrostatic charge can be reduced.

Vaporized hydrogen sees to work:
https://medschool.duke.edu/about-us/new ... -shortages

And just leaving it sit for a number of days should allow the virus to become inactivated.

The paper bags aren’t perfect I’m sure, but they do allow the masks to dry and not potentially grow mold as in a sealed plastic bag - or as a poster above mentioned, keep the bag open.

Also - why are people wearing gloves? Is there concern for the virus going through intact skin? Or do you have broken skin such as cuts and scrapes? Or it is just help to remind you not to touch your face? Masks have some evidence they may reduce spread - gloves I’m not so sure. Either way washing your hands and not touching your face are good things to do, gloves or not.
Thanks for the link. I hadn't realized that the respirators used electret fibers for the filtering. I had thought that these masks filtered solely via physical exclusion, but that's not the case.

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Re: Safest way to get food

Post by Grt2bOutdoors » Sat Apr 04, 2020 8:28 pm

Sandtrap wrote:
Sat Apr 04, 2020 12:54 pm
JAZZISCOOL wrote:
Sat Apr 04, 2020 12:17 pm
Sandtrap wrote:
Sat Apr 04, 2020 10:48 am
JAZZISCOOL wrote:
Fri Apr 03, 2020 3:07 pm
The Governor of my state now requires a cloth face mask for everyone when they go to the store, etc. He says we can use bandanas or old t-shirts. :|
I don't understand the news saying that the N95 is not needed or counterproductive ?

Wouldn't one want to use the best protection available, given that one had the N95 masks?

For example:
A fellow senior recently told me that my use of N95 masks was "silly" and I shoudn't be using it in public to go shopping for food and TP.

Is this attitude a result of a successful information campaign or is it grounded in fact?


"jazziscool"(My ShadowCat, passed recently at age 18, used to look like your avatar when young.)
j :happy
First, I'm so sorry you lost ShadowCat. :( Always so sad to lose a beloved pet. I lost my black tuxedo cat several years ago.

Re: N95 - Your logic seems valid to me. Based on what I have read, I think they offer the best protection to viruses. I don't see why it would be counterproductive.

But in my state, for example, the powers that be on the news want people to donate those to hospitals (same with regular surgical masks). This also seems quite reasonable since they are on the front line. But if one bought them for personal protection for times like this, why not have the ability to use them?

I find it frustrating to see the changing messages people get on masks. I never even knew about N95 masks until the pandemic had started so of course too late to try to purchase any. I ordered a cloth mask on Amazon so will see how that works. :|
We use the N95 in the workshop for wood n welding and around the mini ranch as DW has allergies. So always had them around anyway. Assumed that most others had them as well. Oh well.
j🌺
+1. Exactly - if you had asked me what kind of breathing protection I’m using when working on a home project, my response would have been - the one on the shelf at Home Depot that said “for projects where filtering of fine particles is required”. Lo and behold this crisis hits and only after the fact do I find myself the owner of a couple of N95 masks that just happen to be the ones recommended to protect you from exposure to the virus in close quarters!

Dumb luck on my part that I happen to have one, but even if I didn’t have one, any covering is better than no covering especially in situations where people do not observe the 6 foot distancing both in front of you and behind you like the line I was in today waiting to enter the local Costco. :oops:
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jrbdmb
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Re: Safest way to get food

Post by jrbdmb » Sat Apr 04, 2020 8:39 pm

mhalley wrote:
Wed Apr 01, 2020 6:35 pm
The safest in order
1. No contact delivery
2. Pickup in parking lot
3. In store shopping
Tips on how to handle groceries once home
I am not recommending disinfecting your groceries,” Don Schaffner, a professor of food microbiology at Rutgers School of Environmental and Biological Sciences and host of the podcasts Food Safety Talk and Risky or Not?, told Vox. “This seems like being overly cautious. We don’t know of any cases of Covid-19 transmitted by food, nor of any cases transmitted by food packaging.”

That’s pretty much what the FDA is saying, too. In a statement on March 24, Frank Yiannas, the FDA’s deputy commissioner for food policy and response, noted that “there is no evidence of human or animal food or food packaging being associated with transmission of the coronavirus that causes Covid-19.”

“I’m doing the same things I’ve always done in terms of washing my produce,” says Petrie. “I’m not wiping down my packaging, or leaving it outside for three days, like I’ve seen in some stories.”
https://www.vox.com/the-goods/2020/3/30 ... safe-empty
The same people that said we didn't need to wear masks for two months, who now suddenly decided that we should have been using masks all along. Sorry if I find the current advice rather suspect.

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Re: Safest way to get food

Post by Turbo29 » Sat Apr 04, 2020 8:45 pm

Supposedly the new recommendation for masks is not so much to protect the person wearing the mask as it is to protect others if the person is infected but asymptomatic. I can see this making things worse (just as gloves can if not handled properly) as most people don't know how to handle the mask. A person could put one on, sneeze in it and send droplets of spit into it, take it off when they get in their car touching the spit and snot, and then go to the next store and put it back on touching the contaminated areas again. Then they enter the store and touch various surfaces contaminating them.
It is by the goodness of God that in our country we have those three unspeakably precious things: freedom of speech, freedom of conscience, and the prudence never to practice either of them. --M. Twain

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Sandtrap
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Re: Safest way to get food

Post by Sandtrap » Sat Apr 04, 2020 8:51 pm

JAZZISCOOL wrote:
Sat Apr 04, 2020 1:18 pm
Sandtrap:

"We use the N95 in the workshop for wood n welding and around the mini ranch as DW has allergies. So always had them around anyway. Assumed that most others had them as well. Oh well.
j🌺"

I also have allergies and have used regular "procedure" masks in the past. When things have calmed down at some point in the future re: supplies, I will have to look into N95's for allergies/dust as well. I have an indoor air purifier that helps some. :happy
I've been on construction job sites and inside apartment building renovations for many many decades. Interior commercial construction and renovations can be highly toxic places. Especially if there all day.
So, the N95's help me protect what lungs I have left.
At this point I have chemical allergies and all sorts of wonderful things left from the days when there were no stringent regulations on toxins in construction. I remember helping the crews tear up asbestos floor tiles. Nobody knew it was toxic back then.

It seems "common sense" given the even fractional percent of catching this awful virus, that folks would take the most protection measures available to them in public despite what anyone says, the news says, the experts say, or what stigma it might bring.

There is no price for safety and health of self and loved one's and family.

If it ever came to that as far as getting food and supplies, I'd use disposable Tyvek shop coveralls as well. :shock: Yes. I'd look like a member of a Hazmat Team. That's okay. :shock:

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3504PIR
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Re: Safest way to get food

Post by 3504PIR » Sun Apr 05, 2020 1:13 am

It really comes down to where you live on a number of levels doesn’t it? I went shopping for our family yesterday and had latex gloves on when I went into the store, as I have for the past three weeks. I disinfected my cart with a wipe I brought in. Took my gloves off as I left the store as if I was coming out of mop 4. Unloaded my bags into car, disinfected my hands. Drove home and wiped everything down outside and took off my shoes also outside.. Took a shower and washed clothes. Put wiped down items away. Now required to wear a mask of some sort and will although everyone keeping their distance here. Where I live we have had one case in the county. Governor had to issue an additional order to expedite the shopping process as whole extended families were using the grocery trip as their leisure activity for the day. I’ve honestly been amazed at how slow people have been reacting and how slow state governments have been reacting.

My home has been essentially locked down since 9 March, which is when I started telling my wife every day that each day nothing happened was another day we would be in this situation. It’s been very frustrating to watch unfold but fortunately we live on a small farm and while we are still having an occasional frost, all my seeds have come in out in the greenhouse and are ready to plant and we have some asparagus coming in, as well as I’ve expanded the run for the chicken coop to add a few more layers to the flock. Good that turkey season starts in a couple weeks too! Been busy on the old farm living my retirement dream except going out to eat and on vacation. Getting a hell of a lot done though.

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Re: Safest way to get food

Post by bryansmile » Sun Apr 05, 2020 7:59 am

Turbo29 wrote:
Sat Apr 04, 2020 8:45 pm
Supposedly the new recommendation for masks is not so much to protect the person wearing the mask as it is to protect others if the person is infected but asymptomatic. I can see this making things worse (just as gloves can if not handled properly) as most people don't know how to handle the mask. A person could put one on, sneeze in it and send droplets of spit into it, take it off when they get in their car touching the spit and snot, and then go to the next store and put it back on touching the contaminated areas again. Then they enter the store and touch various surfaces contaminating them.
Good point. That's why wearing gloves (as well as masks) is going to protect you and others in the stores. You put them on before entering store and take them off coming out. It's another kind of mask.
The one lesson I learned is to take what the government authority says with a grain of salt. They can recommend something today and reverse it tomorrow and always have an excuse. It's up to me to make the best decision to protect my family. Use common sense. Like another poster said, look at the recent pictures from other Asian countries with early infections, people nowadays always wear masks when out.

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Re: Safest way to get food

Post by SimonJester » Sun Apr 05, 2020 9:06 am

bryansmile wrote:
Sun Apr 05, 2020 7:59 am
You put them on before entering store and take them off coming out. It's another kind of mask.
Dont touch your cell phone, your face, your purse /wallet, your credit card, car keys with your gloved hands after running through the store. And throw away your gloves in the TRASH can when leaving the store. Already seeing gloves thrown on the parking lot...
"They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety." - Benjamin Franklin

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Re: Safest way to get food

Post by JackoC » Sun Apr 05, 2020 9:29 am

Turbo29 wrote:
Sat Apr 04, 2020 8:45 pm
Supposedly the new recommendation for masks is not so much to protect the person wearing the mask as it is to protect others if the person is infected but asymptomatic. I can see this making things worse (just as gloves can if not handled properly) as most people don't know how to handle the mask. A person could put one on, sneeze in it and send droplets of spit into it, take it off when they get in their car touching the spit and snot, and then go to the next store and put it back on touching the contaminated areas again. Then they enter the store and touch various surfaces contaminating them.
I think in general you have to take various recommendations by the public experts with some caution. Because they are often influenced by things like assuming people are idiots, as in your scenario. Which quite a lot of people are. But quite a lot of people aren't. You have to decide for yourself, and I don't think it's wise to assume all instructions are always the straight down the middle objective truth as best known. The advice can be skewed by what the advice givers truly believe is the 'common good', but that's the not the same as absolute unbiased best estimate of fact. Same goes with 'N95's won't help the public', which has been said by officials and private experts via media even about those masks not just weaker masks. 'N95's should be prioritized for health workers and first responders'. OK, that statement IMO is a straight up *value judgement* which individual members of the public can evaluate for themselves in terms of their own situations and values. But some previous statements have gone further to 'N95's won't help ordinary people' as if that's a fact but I've always found that suspect.

Also on a semi side note, I've witnessed zero people outside my home sneezing or coughing since this started. Of course many are, as many are normally. But the chance of it happening right as I pass or briefly interact (with a cashier, say) is generally low and I haven't seen it once. If you can get a viral load large to enough to likely generate a severe case (see link from today's NYT, severity is probably linked to viral load, not just the chance of binary infected/not infected) from being fairly close to somebody when they *talk*, that's probably the leading risk to infection via people outside your household, it might be the overwhelming risk. Being sneezed or coughed on might be much more dangerous, but how often does that actually happen? Touching stuff which infected people touched with their hands...I'm not letting down my guard but it seems fairly possible that presents a remote risk of high viral load infection, again not counting stuff in your house a symptomatic infected person in your household is coughing/sneezing on repeatedly...they're also coughing sneezing on you directly, probably. I don't know the particulars of those risks, but I don't think the experts do either. Somebody can be a bona fide expert, that doesn't mean they are able to give you the information you really need, even assuming they are not filtering their statements under the assumption you're an idiot, or some conception of the public good they honestly believe is a higher priority to promote than giving you the 100% straight facts.
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/opinion/ ... r-BB122vLd

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Sandtrap
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Re: Safest way to get food

Post by Sandtrap » Sun Apr 05, 2020 9:32 am

3504PIR wrote:
Sun Apr 05, 2020 1:13 am
It really comes down to where you live on a number of levels doesn’t it? I went shopping for our family yesterday and had latex gloves on when I went into the store, as I have for the past three weeks. I disinfected my cart with a wipe I brought in. Took my gloves off as I left the store as if I was coming out of mop 4. Unloaded my bags into car, disinfected my hands. Drove home and wiped everything down outside and took off my shoes also outside.. Took a shower and washed clothes. Put wiped down items away. Now required to wear a mask of some sort and will although everyone keeping their distance here. Where I live we have had one case in the county. Governor had to issue an additional order to expedite the shopping process as whole extended families were using the grocery trip as their leisure activity for the day. I’ve honestly been amazed at how slow people have been reacting and how slow state governments have been reacting.

My home has been essentially locked down since 9 March, which is when I started telling my wife every day that each day nothing happened was another day we would be in this situation. It’s been very frustrating to watch unfold but fortunately we live on a small farm and while we are still having an occasional frost, all my seeds have come in out in the greenhouse and are ready to plant and we have some asparagus coming in, as well as I’ve expanded the run for the chicken coop to add a few more layers to the flock. Good that turkey season starts in a couple weeks too! Been busy on the old farm living my retirement dream except going out to eat and on vacation. Getting a hell of a lot done though.
Great protocols.!
Good location👍

j🌺
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Sandtrap
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Re: Safest way to get food

Post by Sandtrap » Sun Apr 05, 2020 9:42 am

Maximizing safety protocols reflects an awareness that even the smallest percentage of getting infected and dying is not acceptable. There’s no room for interpretation here.

However, awareness and interpretation are open to infinite interpretation .......

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Will do good
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Re: Safest way to get food

Post by Will do good » Sun Apr 05, 2020 9:43 am

Cycle wrote:
Fri Apr 03, 2020 7:29 pm
I shop in a target grocery store that is incredibly busy and used by a lot of people that do not practice social distancing and use the local shelters. I've gone twice in the last three weeks.

I wore nitrile gloves and a p100 respirator mask inside, and I work with cadavers at work so I know how to use the gloves

Wife had a pounding headache for a couple days and a light cough. I've recently developed a light cough. Unfortunately there's no way to tell in our state if we have covid bc no one is getting tested.

My wife's co-worker was presumptive positive and did not quarantine in her house, as her doctor didn't tell her to. She was told there are no test kits available here unless u go to the ER with advanced pneumonia and need to be admitted. Her husband who has no symptoms is still going to work with the national guard, where he is presumptively spreading it to the hundreds of people working there.

Hard to say where we got our current symptoms, but I'd avoid going inside any grocery stores and let the groceries quarantine for 3 days.

I've started wearing a cloth buff over my face, as many others have as well.
Sorry to read about your wife's work place and both of your coughs, hope it's nothing and you will be better soon.

bryansmile
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Re: Safest way to get food

Post by bryansmile » Sun Apr 05, 2020 10:23 am

I've also read somewhere that if you have homemade masks, cover the outside with Kleenex anti-viral tissue (by glue, tape..) which is disposable.

EnjoyIt
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Re: Safest way to get food

Post by EnjoyIt » Sun Apr 05, 2020 10:54 am

stoptothink wrote:
Thu Apr 02, 2020 10:13 am
squirm wrote:
Thu Apr 02, 2020 10:04 am
how are gloves going to protect you? the virus just gets on the gloves and then on whatever you touch. why not just wash your hands afterwards, or use wipes? or bring a container of warm water with soap and just wash your hands in the parking lot afterwards.
Unless you take some other precautions and be absolutely sure to take them off correctly, they likely are not doing anything. In places like a grocery store, the use of gloves may actually increase the risk for the virus being spread.
I 100% agree that gloves are not needed and actually give the wearer a false sense of security. The virus will not get you sick when it is on your hands. It will get you sick if it touches any of your mucous membranes.

In the hospitals we use gloves when we touch patients but still wash or sanitize our hands afterwards each and every time.
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Re: Safest way to get food

Post by Corsair » Sun Apr 05, 2020 11:15 am

Cycle wrote:
Fri Apr 03, 2020 7:29 pm
I shop in a target grocery store that is incredibly busy and used by a lot of people that do not practice social distancing and use the local shelters. I've gone twice in the last three weeks.

I wore nitrile gloves and a p100 respirator mask inside, and I work with cadavers at work so I know how to use the gloves

Wife had a pounding headache for a couple days and a light cough. I've recently developed a light cough. Unfortunately there's no way to tell in our state if we have covid bc no one is getting tested.

My wife's co-worker was presumptive positive and did not quarantine in her house, as her doctor didn't tell her to. She was told there are no test kits available here unless u go to the ER with advanced pneumonia and need to be admitted. Her husband who has no symptoms is still going to work with the national guard, where he is presumptively spreading it to the hundreds of people working there.

Hard to say where we got our current symptoms, but I'd avoid going inside any grocery stores and let the groceries quarantine for 3 days.

I've started wearing a cloth buff over my face, as many others have as well.
Hope you both are feeling better.

Could be something else too since you had PPE

Looks like your area has a lower positive rate than ours, only 3% positive of all tests where ours is 9%.
All posts are my own opinions and are not financial advice.

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iceport
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Re: Safest way to get food

Post by iceport » Sun Apr 05, 2020 12:51 pm

I just went to the local mom & pop grocery store where I like to get fresh meat, and even that small store has evolved to improve safety.

— They finally stopped using a separate bagger.
— They installed plexiglass between the cashier and customer.

Those two things are big improvements. And it wasn't crowded, so I was able to maintain physical separation.

I also went out in public for the first time wearing a homemade mask. This one is amazingly easy to make, and surprisingly effective:

How To Make A Safety Mask From A T-Shirt

One improvement I made wast to use a T-shirt with a hem, and I wore the hem the top, over the nose. Then I took one of those wide metal-and-plastic straps from the top of a coffee bag and slipped it into the hem. When pinched over the nose, it makes a decent seal (but it's not perfect).

Two more improvements I envision for the next ones:

— Cut a double-width, so the mask will provide two layers of fabric over the face.
— Place a piece of vacuum cleaner bag in between the layers

Effectiveness of various fabrics is shown here:

What Are The Best Materials for Making DIY Masks?
Last edited by iceport on Sun Apr 05, 2020 1:11 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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dukeblue219
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Re: Safest way to get food

Post by dukeblue219 » Sun Apr 05, 2020 1:02 pm

JoMoney wrote:
Wed Apr 01, 2020 6:35 pm
Delivered to your house. Auto accidents will top most other hazards.
I agree that delivery is safest, but the daily auto accident fatality rate is far lower than Covid-19. This isn't one of those times when we can dismiss something as being irrelevant compared to the danger of driving. (or perhaps I misinterpreted you)

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JoMoney
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Re: Safest way to get food

Post by JoMoney » Sun Apr 05, 2020 1:54 pm

dukeblue219 wrote:
Sun Apr 05, 2020 1:02 pm
JoMoney wrote:
Wed Apr 01, 2020 6:35 pm
Delivered to your house. Auto accidents will top most other hazards.
I agree that delivery is safest, but the daily auto accident fatality rate is far lower than Covid-19. This isn't one of those times when we can dismiss something as being irrelevant compared to the danger of driving. (or perhaps I misinterpreted you)
Yes, dismissing deaths as "irrelevant" would be a misinterpretation.
No, the auto accident fatality rate is not "far lower than Covid-19", or at least it's yet to be seen, we're still in the thick of this, but we should hope it doesn't reach the level of auto fatalities, of roughly 1.3 million a year world wide and about 35,000 a year in the U.S.
The current Covid-19 fatalities are at approximately 68,000 globally and 9,200 in the U.S.
https://www.covidtracker.com/

Regardless, compounding the risks you're exposed to isn't the way to "safety"
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Sandtrap
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Re: Safest way to get food

Post by Sandtrap » Sun Apr 05, 2020 2:13 pm

A "head scarf" called a "Shemagh" is a handy protection against sandstorms while camel riding as well as getting food in town.
https://www.amazon.com/Maddog-Sports-Sh ... RydWU&th=1
However, the appearance, depending on whether a tactical pattern and such, might be disconcerting to others depending on what area of the country you're in and prevailing attitudes towards things.
Image

j :happy
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1130Super
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Re: Safest way to get food

Post by 1130Super » Sun Apr 05, 2020 2:56 pm

Safeway

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Re: Safest way to get food

Post by abuss368 » Sun Apr 05, 2020 2:58 pm

Sandtrap wrote:
Wed Apr 01, 2020 8:00 pm
Brings to mind the movie, "Outbreak" (Dustin Hoffman, etc).
j :happy
Of course Netflix has the movie back in under new releases! That does not help the general public!
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Re: Safest way to get food

Post by mrspock » Sun Apr 05, 2020 3:09 pm

Sandtrap wrote:
Sun Apr 05, 2020 2:13 pm
A "head scarf" called a "Shemagh" is a handy protection against sandstorms while camel riding as well as getting food in town.
https://www.amazon.com/Maddog-Sports-Sh ... RydWU&th=1
However, the appearance, depending on whether a tactical pattern and such, might be disconcerting to others depending on what area of the country you're in and prevailing attitudes towards things.
Image

j :happy
For those who live in less.... open minded locals, I would suggest the mid-western winter equivalent:

Image

And when in doubt, if you have a water jug handy, there's also this:
Image


:D I've also heard of many busting out their favorite halloween costumes during all this. Turns out nearly all super hero costumes have masks... and let's face it, even Batman needed to get food to eat.

dukeblue219
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Re: Safest way to get food

Post by dukeblue219 » Sun Apr 05, 2020 4:36 pm

JoMoney wrote:
Sun Apr 05, 2020 1:54 pm
the auto accident fatality rate is not "far lower than Covid-19", or at least it's yet to be seen, we're still in the thick of this, but we should hope it doesn't reach the level of auto fatalities, of roughly 1.3 million a year world wide and about 35,000 a year in the U.S.
The current Covid-19 fatalities are at approximately 68,000 globally and 9,200 in the U.S.
https://www.covidtracker.com/

Regardless, compounding the risks you're exposed to isn't the way to "safety"
For what it's worth, we're at the level of 1400+ fatalities per day from COVID which is a good bit above the average American traffic deaths (950/day),and it's growing quickly.

But agreed, driving is always a risk we underappreciate.

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Re: Safest way to get food

Post by finite_difference » Sun Apr 05, 2020 5:10 pm

mhalley wrote:
Wed Apr 01, 2020 6:35 pm
The safest in order
1. No contact delivery
2. Pickup in parking lot
3. In store shopping
Tips on how to handle groceries once home
I am not recommending disinfecting your groceries,” Don Schaffner, a professor of food microbiology at Rutgers School of Environmental and Biological Sciences and host of the podcasts Food Safety Talk and Risky or Not?, told Vox. “This seems like being overly cautious. We don’t know of any cases of Covid-19 transmitted by food, nor of any cases transmitted by food packaging.”

That’s pretty much what the FDA is saying, too. In a statement on March 24, Frank Yiannas, the FDA’s deputy commissioner for food policy and response, noted that “there is no evidence of human or animal food or food packaging being associated with transmission of the coronavirus that causes Covid-19.”

“I’m doing the same things I’ve always done in terms of washing my produce,” says Petrie. “I’m not wiping down my packaging, or leaving it outside for three days, like I’ve seen in some stories.”
https://www.vox.com/the-goods/2020/3/30 ... safe-empty
Wear a mask if you go with #2 or #3.

Wiping things down / leaving nonperishables outside for 3 days seems like not a bad idea. A month ago they said to wash your hands. Then they said don’t touch your face. Then they said 6 feet. Now they’re saying wear masks.

So let’s just say that I think it doesn’t hurt to be cautious.
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absolute zero
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Re: Safest way to get food

Post by absolute zero » Sun Apr 05, 2020 5:30 pm

finite_difference wrote:
Sun Apr 05, 2020 5:10 pm
mhalley wrote:
Wed Apr 01, 2020 6:35 pm
The safest in order
1. No contact delivery
2. Pickup in parking lot
3. In store shopping
Tips on how to handle groceries once home
I am not recommending disinfecting your groceries,” Don Schaffner, a professor of food microbiology at Rutgers School of Environmental and Biological Sciences and host of the podcasts Food Safety Talk and Risky or Not?, told Vox. “This seems like being overly cautious. We don’t know of any cases of Covid-19 transmitted by food, nor of any cases transmitted by food packaging.”

That’s pretty much what the FDA is saying, too. In a statement on March 24, Frank Yiannas, the FDA’s deputy commissioner for food policy and response, noted that “there is no evidence of human or animal food or food packaging being associated with transmission of the coronavirus that causes Covid-19.”

“I’m doing the same things I’ve always done in terms of washing my produce,” says Petrie. “I’m not wiping down my packaging, or leaving it outside for three days, like I’ve seen in some stories.”
https://www.vox.com/the-goods/2020/3/30 ... safe-empty
Wear a mask if you go with #2 or #3.

Wiping things down / leaving nonperishables outside for 3 days seems like not a bad idea. A month ago they said to wash your hands. Then they said don’t touch your face. Then they said 6 feet. Now they’re saying wear masks.

So let’s just say that I think it doesn’t hurt to be cautious.
Good point - it has definitely been a gradual escalation. Apparently we should have been doing all these things a month ago, but weren’t told to do so.

I agree that extra caution is good, and would even say that a touch of skepticism of what experts are claiming is also healthy. They are experts, but their goals may not be perfectly aligned with ours.

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iceport
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Re: Safest way to get food

Post by iceport » Sun Apr 05, 2020 5:39 pm

absolute zero wrote:
Sun Apr 05, 2020 5:30 pm
I agree that extra caution is good, and would even say that a touch of skepticism of what experts are claiming is also healthy. They are experts, but their goals may not be perfectly aligned with ours.
Their goals could be perfectly aligned with ours collectively, even if not individually.
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JackoC
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Re: Safest way to get food

Post by JackoC » Mon Apr 06, 2020 8:56 am

iceport wrote:
Sun Apr 05, 2020 5:39 pm
absolute zero wrote:
Sun Apr 05, 2020 5:30 pm
I agree that extra caution is good, and would even say that a touch of skepticism of what experts are claiming is also healthy. They are experts, but their goals may not be perfectly aligned with ours.
Their goals could be perfectly aligned with ours collectively, even if not individually.
Good way of putting it. IOW I take their statements with some skepticism personally because they are not necessarily aligned with my interests personally and it's me personally who is listening. :happy Also I agree their possible shading of information *could* be aligned with the net collective interest. I assume they *believe* it is. But there's so much uncertainty.

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Re: Safest way to get food

Post by LadyGeek » Mon Apr 06, 2020 8:58 am

I removed an off-topic post regarding coronavirus death rate, several others regarding N95 masks. The discussion was derailed.

Please stay on-topic, which is a safe way to get food.

Other comments should be made here: Bogleheads community discussion - Coronavirus
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Sandtrap
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Re: Safest way to get food

Post by Sandtrap » Mon Apr 06, 2020 9:18 am

Heading into town today for a quick grocery and TP run.
All safety gear ready.
Protocols in place.
Routes planned.
Exit strategy confirmed.

Feels like going on a military OP??😬😬

j👍
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iceport
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Re: Safest way to get food

Post by iceport » Mon Apr 06, 2020 9:23 am

Sandtrap wrote:
Mon Apr 06, 2020 9:18 am
Heading into town today for a quick grocery and TP run.
All safety gear ready.
Protocols in place.
Routes planned.
Exit strategy confirmed.

Feels like going on a military OP??😬😬

j👍
:thumbsup

Good luck, Sandtrap!

It does take some planning now, doesn't it?
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3504PIR
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Re: Safest way to get food

Post by 3504PIR » Wed Apr 08, 2020 2:00 am

Sandtrap wrote:
Sun Apr 05, 2020 9:32 am
3504PIR wrote:
Sun Apr 05, 2020 1:13 am
It really comes down to where you live on a number of levels doesn’t it? I went shopping for our family yesterday and had latex gloves on when I went into the store, as I have for the past three weeks. I disinfected my cart with a wipe I brought in. Took my gloves off as I left the store as if I was coming out of mop 4. Unloaded my bags into car, disinfected my hands. Drove home and wiped everything down outside and took off my shoes also outside.. Took a shower and washed clothes. Put wiped down items away. Now required to wear a mask of some sort and will although everyone keeping their distance here. Where I live we have had one case in the county. Governor had to issue an additional order to expedite the shopping process as whole extended families were using the grocery trip as their leisure activity for the day. I’ve honestly been amazed at how slow people have been reacting and how slow state governments have been reacting.

My home has been essentially locked down since 9 March, which is when I started telling my wife every day that each day nothing happened was another day we would be in this situation. It’s been very frustrating to watch unfold but fortunately we live on a small farm and while we are still having an occasional frost, all my seeds have come in out in the greenhouse and are ready to plant and we have some asparagus coming in, as well as I’ve expanded the run for the chicken coop to add a few more layers to the flock. Good that turkey season starts in a couple weeks too! Been busy on the old farm living my retirement dream except going out to eat and on vacation. Getting a hell of a lot done though.
Great protocols.!
Good location👍

j🌺
Thank you my friend, hope you are well. Never thought I’d say this but I am happy we are no longer in our beautiful Kailua. Strange times!

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Re: Safest way to get food

Post by Sandtrap » Wed Apr 08, 2020 8:56 am

3504PIR wrote:
Wed Apr 08, 2020 2:00 am
Sandtrap wrote:
Sun Apr 05, 2020 9:32 am
3504PIR wrote:
Sun Apr 05, 2020 1:13 am
It really comes down to where you live on a number of levels doesn’t it? I went shopping for our family yesterday and had latex gloves on when I went into the store, as I have for the past three weeks. I disinfected my cart with a wipe I brought in. Took my gloves off as I left the store as if I was coming out of mop 4. Unloaded my bags into car, disinfected my hands. Drove home and wiped everything down outside and took off my shoes also outside.. Took a shower and washed clothes. Put wiped down items away. Now required to wear a mask of some sort and will although everyone keeping their distance here. Where I live we have had one case in the county. Governor had to issue an additional order to expedite the shopping process as whole extended families were using the grocery trip as their leisure activity for the day. I’ve honestly been amazed at how slow people have been reacting and how slow state governments have been reacting.

My home has been essentially locked down since 9 March, which is when I started telling my wife every day that each day nothing happened was another day we would be in this situation. It’s been very frustrating to watch unfold but fortunately we live on a small farm and while we are still having an occasional frost, all my seeds have come in out in the greenhouse and are ready to plant and we have some asparagus coming in, as well as I’ve expanded the run for the chicken coop to add a few more layers to the flock. Good that turkey season starts in a couple weeks too! Been busy on the old farm living my retirement dream except going out to eat and on vacation. Getting a hell of a lot done though.
Great protocols.!
Good location👍

j🌺
Thank you my friend, hope you are well. Never thought I’d say this but I am happy we are no longer in our beautiful Kailua. Strange times!
+1
880,000 folks on an island about 30 x 40 miles.😬😬
j🌺
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ScubaHogg
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Re: Safest way to get food

Post by ScubaHogg » Wed Apr 08, 2020 11:17 am

PSA: If anyone is trying to get a time to pick up groceries from Walmart, but have been unable to get a "slot", we just got confirmation that the new day's slots are released at midnight. Unclear if that is midnight local time or midnight Walmart headquarters (central) time. So if you can try and get a slot at or shortly after midnight you will likely have more luck. We managed to get a slot for Friday this morning by logging on at 2:30am.
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nascar090210
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Re: Safest way to get food

Post by nascar090210 » Wed Apr 08, 2020 11:50 am

1. Select store or restaurant of interest.
2. Travel to store or restaurant of interest.
3. Select food items of interest.
4. Pay for food items
5. Enjoy food items.

InvisibleAerobar
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Re: Safest way to get food

Post by InvisibleAerobar » Thu Apr 09, 2020 8:07 pm

Sandtrap wrote:
Mon Apr 06, 2020 9:18 am
Heading into town today for a quick grocery and TP run.
All safety gear ready.
Protocols in place.
Routes planned.
Exit strategy confirmed.

Feels like going on a military OP??😬😬

j👍
You sure got that right.

I feel like I could have improved what I did in the latest round of grocery shopping. The previous time, I didn't think too much about virus on food packaging. That changed this latest time.

The plan was to use only store-provided bags and cardboard containers to hold the various items (we traditionally bring our own bags). After I returned home, I would unload the items in the garage, separating the items into immediate needs and items not immediately needed.

The packaged immediate need food gets a wipe down using isopropyl alcohol (e.g. ice cream and a bag of carrots) and are subsequently placed into a plastic crate. Those not in packaging are placed in a separate container, to be washed individually with soap and water.

All others are placed into more crates. Those that are perishable go in for "quarantine" of one week in our downstairs fridge (which we normally don't use). The non-perishable items are placed in another plastic crate. After one week, we would presume the items to be largely germ free and will not handle them any differently from how they were handled before.

Before I actually bring the filled crates into the house, I would take off the clothes I wore while shopping and then wipe down parts of the crates I have touched and will touch while carrying (using dilute bleach). After I'm done unloading, I would again wipe down the outside of the crates with dilute bleach.

I think next time, I'll just bring the crates and fill them while I'm at the store. Would appear to save the sorting

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iceport
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Re: Safest way to get food

Post by iceport » Sun Apr 12, 2020 1:55 pm

InvisibleAerobar wrote:
Thu Apr 09, 2020 8:07 pm
I feel like I could have improved what I did in the latest round of grocery shopping. The previous time, I didn't think too much about virus on food packaging. That changed this latest time.
InvisibleAerobar,

Many of your measures are clever and effective. I especially like the "quarantine" method, which is what I predominantly use. I do think it's possible to get carried away with grocery disinfection, though. Some measures may not be warranted. This new article discusses the risks of infection from groceries, and appropriate, practical measures to prevent infection:

No, You Don't Need To Disinfect Your Groceries. But Here's How To Shop Safely

The outline:

Know the dangers — focus on the people, not the food

Avoid crowds and shop quickly

Wear a face covering

Go alone

Sanitize carts and hands

Skip the gloves

Give the cashier some space

Choose no-touch payment when you can

Don't drive yourself crazy disinfecting your groceries

If you really want to wash your groceries, don't use disinfecting spray or wipes

Rinse fresh produce in plain water — and eat your veggies!

Should you shower or change clothes after shopping? It depends

Still anxious? Order online

A word about frozen food

~~~~~~~~~~

On my last trip, the big chain store (Stop & Shop) was still using a bagger in addition to the cashier, and several employees — including a bagger! — were not wearing facemasks. And this, despite the published store policy for all associates to wear masks. That lack of masks presented — by far — the biggest risk of the entire grocery run.
"Discipline matters more than allocation.” ─William Bernstein

EnjoyIt
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Re: Safest way to get food

Post by EnjoyIt » Sun Apr 12, 2020 2:31 pm

iceport wrote:
Sun Apr 12, 2020 1:55 pm
InvisibleAerobar wrote:
Thu Apr 09, 2020 8:07 pm
I feel like I could have improved what I did in the latest round of grocery shopping. The previous time, I didn't think too much about virus on food packaging. That changed this latest time.
InvisibleAerobar,

Many of your measures are clever and effective. I especially like the "quarantine" method, which is what I predominantly use. I do think it's possible to get carried away with grocery disinfection, though. Some measures may not be warranted. This new article discusses the risks of infection from groceries, and appropriate, practical measures to prevent infection:

No, You Don't Need To Disinfect Your Groceries. But Here's How To Shop Safely

The outline:

Know the dangers — focus on the people, not the food

Avoid crowds and shop quickly

Wear a face covering

Go alone

Sanitize carts and hands

Skip the gloves

Give the cashier some space

Choose no-touch payment when you can

Don't drive yourself crazy disinfecting your groceries

If you really want to wash your groceries, don't use disinfecting spray or wipes

Rinse fresh produce in plain water — and eat your veggies!

Should you shower or change clothes after shopping? It depends

Still anxious? Order online

A word about frozen food

~~~~~~~~~~

On my last trip, the big chain store (Stop & Shop) was still using a bagger in addition to the cashier, and several employees — including a bagger! — were not wearing facemasks. And this, despite the published store policy for all associates to wear masks. That lack of masks presented — by far — the biggest risk of the entire grocery run.
That is a great link and a really nice list of tips with a logical description.

I am a physician who takes care of COVID patients. My grocery shopping practice is very similar to what is described in that link. I honestly have little fear of contracting the virus because I am very neurotic at work and when I am out in public like the grocery store. My only wish is that everyone wore masks and stopped wearing gloves.
A time to EVALUATE your jitters. | https://www.bogleheads.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=79939&start=400#p5275418

JackoC
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Re: Safest way to get food

Post by JackoC » Sun Apr 12, 2020 2:42 pm

iceport wrote:
Sun Apr 12, 2020 1:55 pm
InvisibleAerobar wrote:
Thu Apr 09, 2020 8:07 pm
I feel like I could have improved what I did in the latest round of grocery shopping. The previous time, I didn't think too much about virus on food packaging. That changed this latest time.
InvisibleAerobar,

Many of your measures are clever and effective. I especially like the "quarantine" method, which is what I predominantly use. I do think it's possible to get carried away with grocery disinfection, though. Some measures may not be warranted.

Know the dangers — focus on the people, not the food
Seems highly likely actually that being near people is pretty much *the* risk, and it's fairly speculative to think getting it from food or packages somebody touched is a real risk at all, assuming any kind of conscientiousness on hand washing. But since nobody can gtee that, the experts are not going to say that. And of course I don't know that for sure either.

Also far out in the tail of the distribution of getting COVID, stuff you do that avoids a several 'sigma' event of some exposure to the virus, you'd have to consider that a slight exposure to a low viral load from touching a package 'only' a day in the house might stimulate your immune system with little chance of a serious infection (though depending your risk group, and also still shrouded in the unknown). Those antibodies could help you in a future situation beyond your control where you couldn't avoid getting a high viral load despite your best efforts and preparations. So I'm not 100% sure that going overboard countering infection from contact with things is very slightly in your best interest, or could actually end up very slightly against your best interest. I think that's unknown, again at the extreme.

But a lot of dealing with this whole situation in psychological. If it reduces your stress to eg. wash your clothes and take a shower after coming back from the store, then that's probably best for you.

halfnine
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Re: Safest way to get food

Post by halfnine » Sun Apr 12, 2020 3:24 pm

JackoC wrote:
Sun Apr 12, 2020 2:42 pm
iceport wrote:
Sun Apr 12, 2020 1:55 pm
InvisibleAerobar wrote:
Thu Apr 09, 2020 8:07 pm
I feel like I could have improved what I did in the latest round of grocery shopping. The previous time, I didn't think too much about virus on food packaging. That changed this latest time.
InvisibleAerobar,

Many of your measures are clever and effective. I especially like the "quarantine" method, which is what I predominantly use. I do think it's possible to get carried away with grocery disinfection, though. Some measures may not be warranted.

Know the dangers — focus on the people, not the food
Seems highly likely actually that being near people is pretty much *the* risk, and it's fairly speculative to think getting it from food or packages somebody touched is a real risk at all, assuming any kind of conscientiousness on hand washing. But since nobody can gtee that, the experts are not going to say that. And of course I don't know that for sure either.

Also far out in the tail of the distribution of getting COVID, stuff you do that avoids a several 'sigma' event of some exposure to the virus, you'd have to consider that a slight exposure to a low viral load from touching a package 'only' a day in the house might stimulate your immune system with little chance of a serious infection (though depending your risk group, and also still shrouded in the unknown). Those antibodies could help you in a future situation beyond your control where you couldn't avoid getting a high viral load despite your best efforts and preparations. So I'm not 100% sure that going overboard countering infection from contact with things is very slightly in your best interest, or could actually end up very slightly against your best interest. I think that's unknown, again at the extreme.

But a lot of dealing with this whole situation in psychological. If it reduces your stress to eg. wash your clothes and take a shower after coming back from the store, then that's probably best for you.
While getting exposed to a low viral load might help you it would do little to help others in your household when you expose them to a higher viral load.

BHUser27
Posts: 651
Joined: Mon Jan 18, 2016 3:07 pm
Location: A Midwestern Town

Re: Safest way to get food

Post by BHUser27 » Sun Apr 12, 2020 3:34 pm

Sorry if this has been posted, I cannot keep up with the rate of excellent responses.
Please look through the videos from Dr. VanWingen with practical tips on how to treat grocery and food deliveries.
I love his analogy about assuming everything is covered in "COVID glitter" that self destructs in 3 days - your job is to get what you need into use without a single spec of glitter on it. Good thing is that "COVID glitter" can be destroyed with microwave, sanitizer, disinfectant, and time.
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCldCyQ ... XEsF5-oRFg

nascar090210
Posts: 23
Joined: Mon Mar 16, 2020 4:06 pm

Re: Safest way to get food

Post by nascar090210 » Sun Apr 12, 2020 4:30 pm

nascar090210 wrote:
Wed Apr 08, 2020 11:50 am
1. Select store or restaurant of interest.
2. Travel to store or restaurant of interest.
3. Select food items of interest.
4. Pay for food items
5. Enjoy food items.
Shorts, tank top and flip flops continues to be attire for grocery shopping.

rj49
Posts: 556
Joined: Wed Feb 23, 2011 12:22 am

Re: Safest way to get food

Post by rj49 » Sun Apr 12, 2020 5:20 pm

My practice lately has been to go with stores that limit traffic and enforce social distancing. Trader Joe's is my first option, but Fred Meyer is also a good option for me, since it's a huge store without crowding, and I can get non-food items and use a self-checkout line to avoid cashier contacts. I simply wear gloves, carry a plastic bag or something to hold the cart handle with, and wash my hands in their restroom before I leave (holding paper towels to avoid door handle contact). In any case, I go to stores close to closing time, when there are few people and few seniors. I avoid Costco and Walmart like the plague (so to speak), since there's more hoarding and panic-shopping and bigger crowds and more seniors. I feel much more relaxed and comfortable at Trader Joe's, since the employees and customers have a good attitude and I can experiment with different foods and they only allow 20 or so shoppers at a time in my store, so I don't feel exposed or stressed, and even the cashiers keep a 6-foot distance most of the time.

At the same time, I'm also trying to help keep local restaurants alive by ordering take-out, with several offering discounts now, and since I live alone it's another way to get relatively safe social interactions and feel part of my community. I don't feel comfortable closing myself off in a bubble by ordering groceries or food online for delivery, or sitting outside a store because I'm afraid to go in, or burdening Amazon for ordering groceries online. By following guidelines but not closing myself off completely, it also makes it easier to re-integrate when the rules are relaxed.

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