Take out food vs COVID 19

Questions on how we spend our money and our time - consumer goods and services, home and vehicle, leisure and recreational activities
M.Lee
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Joined: Tue Jun 25, 2019 8:26 am

Re: Take out food vs COVID 19

Post by M.Lee »

From the FDA.gov website:

Q: Can I get sick with COVID-19 from touching food, the food packaging, or food contact surfaces, if the coronavirus was present on it?
A: Currently there is no evidence of food or food packaging being associated with transmission of COVID-19.
smitcat
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Re: Take out food vs COVID 19

Post by smitcat »

M.Lee wrote: Tue Mar 17, 2020 9:21 am
smitcat wrote: Tue Mar 17, 2020 9:16 am
M.Lee wrote: Tue Mar 17, 2020 9:10 am I've been reading a lot, but have not yet come across anything that says the covid-19 virus can live inside food. If one of you have, please share the link. It may be on a carboard box (like for pizza), but not transferred to the pizza itself. I don't know about paper bags. But really, even in the super market, you are dealing with bags, boxes, glass, etc. Therefore, as far as this virus is concerned, I don't think it is any more harmful to get take out than go grocery shopping. That said, you may pick up ecoli and other things from unsanitary conditions.
"I've been reading a lot, but have not yet come across anything that says the covid-19 virus can live inside food."
I am not sure what you mean by "inside food".
There is enough data to know that the virus can survive on many surfaces for periods of time. If a food preparer is infected and has touched and/or contaminated parts of the containers or the food itself it could be transmitted. Is that what you are asking?
No, I am saying (really asking) that if an infected person even sneezed on the food, it can't be transferred by eating the food. If you think it can be, I'd like to see the source of the information. It can be transferred to hard surfaces, clothing, etc, but i have not heard food. If it can be in food, then it will be everywhere. Packaged bread...anything.
"No, I am saying (really asking) that if an infected person even sneezed on the food, it can't be transferred by eating the food."
The virus is transmitted by droplets from one person to another - this can easily be from a handshake, a doorknob, or any other surface.
It will survive for a period of time unless it comes into contact with the hundreds of very capable disinfectants or if the environment is non supportive.

One of your examples - packaged bread... baked at high temps and machine wrapped with a typically 'long' delivery and shelf life.
GCD
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Re: Take out food vs COVID 19

Post by GCD »

M.Lee wrote: Tue Mar 17, 2020 9:21 am
smitcat wrote: Tue Mar 17, 2020 9:16 am
M.Lee wrote: Tue Mar 17, 2020 9:10 am I've been reading a lot, but have not yet come across anything that says the covid-19 virus can live inside food. If one of you have, please share the link. It may be on a carboard box (like for pizza), but not transferred to the pizza itself. I don't know about paper bags. But really, even in the super market, you are dealing with bags, boxes, glass, etc. Therefore, as far as this virus is concerned, I don't think it is any more harmful to get take out than go grocery shopping. That said, you may pick up ecoli and other things from unsanitary conditions.
"I've been reading a lot, but have not yet come across anything that says the covid-19 virus can live inside food."
I am not sure what you mean by "inside food".
There is enough data to know that the virus can survive on many surfaces for periods of time. If a food preparer is infected and has touched and/or contaminated parts of the containers or the food itself it could be transmitted. Is that what you are asking?
No, I am saying (really asking) that if an infected person even sneezed on the food, it can't be transferred by eating the food. If you think it can be, I'd like to see the source of the information. It can be transferred to hard surfaces, clothing, etc, but i have not heard food. If it can be in food, then it will be everywhere. Packaged bread...anything.
They say to wash your hands to avoid brushing a droplet with your hand somewhere and then touching your face where it gets in your mouth. Do you want it explicitly stated by a medical authority that if a CV carrier sneezes on a pizza you shouldn't eat the pizza?

Your last 2 sentences seem dead on. Except the virus has a lifespan and if you buy food and stockpile it for a few days the virus would die. If you are getting fresh takeout prepared by a CV victim then the virus is still alive when you eat it.
M.Lee wrote: Tue Mar 17, 2020 9:25 am From the FDA.gov website:

Q: Can I get sick with COVID-19 from touching food, the food packaging, or food contact surfaces, if the coronavirus was present on it?
A: Currently there is no evidence of food or food packaging being associated with transmission of COVID-19.
OK, fair enough. I'll assume without checking that that's a true quote. That should be a good source. But I have to question it because it seems like they are dodging the issue to avoid panicking people. "Currently there is no evidence..." is a weak disclaimer. Grocery stores are going around wiping down cart handles, credit card self-service readers, etc. But not the can of tomato soup that got picked up, handled and placed back on the shelf? Or all the cans that the infected asymptomatic stockboy touched? It is utterly absurd to say that it can exist on all these other surfaces but that it can't exist on similar or same surfaces when they contain food.

To steal a line from My Cousin Vinny, "what are these, magic grits?"

Your FDA quote doesn't say it isn't or can't happen. It says they haven't dialed down to prove it.
smitcat
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Re: Take out food vs COVID 19

Post by smitcat »

GCD wrote: Tue Mar 17, 2020 9:37 am
M.Lee wrote: Tue Mar 17, 2020 9:21 am
smitcat wrote: Tue Mar 17, 2020 9:16 am
M.Lee wrote: Tue Mar 17, 2020 9:10 am I've been reading a lot, but have not yet come across anything that says the covid-19 virus can live inside food. If one of you have, please share the link. It may be on a carboard box (like for pizza), but not transferred to the pizza itself. I don't know about paper bags. But really, even in the super market, you are dealing with bags, boxes, glass, etc. Therefore, as far as this virus is concerned, I don't think it is any more harmful to get take out than go grocery shopping. That said, you may pick up ecoli and other things from unsanitary conditions.
"I've been reading a lot, but have not yet come across anything that says the covid-19 virus can live inside food."
I am not sure what you mean by "inside food".
There is enough data to know that the virus can survive on many surfaces for periods of time. If a food preparer is infected and has touched and/or contaminated parts of the containers or the food itself it could be transmitted. Is that what you are asking?
No, I am saying (really asking) that if an infected person even sneezed on the food, it can't be transferred by eating the food. If you think it can be, I'd like to see the source of the information. It can be transferred to hard surfaces, clothing, etc, but i have not heard food. If it can be in food, then it will be everywhere. Packaged bread...anything.
They say to wash your hands to avoid brushing a droplet with your hand somewhere and then touching your face where it gets in your mouth. Do you want it explicitly stated by a medical authority that if a CV carrier sneezes on a pizza you shouldn't eat the pizza?

Your last 2 sentences seem dead on. Except the virus has a lifespan and if you buy food and stockpile it for a few days the virus would die. If you are getting fresh takeout prepared by a CV victim then the virus is still alive when you eat it.
M.Lee wrote: Tue Mar 17, 2020 9:25 am From the FDA.gov website:

Q: Can I get sick with COVID-19 from touching food, the food packaging, or food contact surfaces, if the coronavirus was present on it?
A: Currently there is no evidence of food or food packaging being associated with transmission of COVID-19.
OK, fair enough. I'll assume without checking that that's a true quote. That should be a good source. But I have to question it because it seems like they are dodging the issue to avoid panicking people. "Currently there is no evidence..." is a weak disclaimer. Grocery stores are going around wiping down cart handles, credit card self-service readers, etc. But not the can of tomato soup that got picked up, handled and placed back on the shelf? Or all the cans that the infected asymptomatic stockboy touched? It is utterly absurd to say that it can exist on all these other surfaces but that it can't exist on similar or same surfaces when they contain food.

To steal a line from My Cousin Vinny, "what are these, magic grits?"

Your FDA quote doesn't say it isn't or can't happen. It says they haven't dialed down to prove it.
"Your FDA quote doesn't say it isn't or can't happen. It says they haven't dialed down to prove it."
Agreed - it is taken out of context and has little value without all of the other supporting guidelines.
M.Lee
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Re: Take out food vs COVID 19

Post by M.Lee »

Ok you guess, debating and arguing isn't my thing. Don't get take out then. Don't eat any produce or fresh fruit either.
helloeveryone
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Re: Take out food vs COVID 19

Post by helloeveryone »

btenny wrote: Mon Mar 16, 2020 3:59 pm I am in the over 70 group and have some health issues. So me for sure. My wife is only old. So yes we would like to avoid this stuff....

Good Luck.
Don’t go. It’s safer. Suffer with home cooked food another two weeks to see where we are on the “curve” then reassess.
You both are being very cautious which is great.
fasteddie911
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Re: Take out food vs COVID 19

Post by fasteddie911 »

We'll keep doing takeout and support local businesses while also trying to avoid grocery stores here and there. Though, maybe we'll hold off on something like salads or foods that sit out. Certainly we're aware of the risks though we're not in a high risk category. I tend to have faith in our food service industry. I do think about the likelihood a worker actually being infected then actually contaminating our food, but then compare that to the risks of going out grocery shopping, or contamination of products I purchase and so on. I'm not sure how many folks have been thoroughly wiping down everything they buy in the store too. I'm not one to overthink things as it'll drive me nuts.
fru-gal
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Re: Take out food vs COVID 19

Post by fru-gal »

Ref Meals on Wheels mention above, a friend delivers MoW and he is continuing to do so but taking all the obvious precautions. I don't know what the elderly or disabled people who depend on these would do if they stopped.

Separate topic, two chain grocery stores near me have separate hours now for over 60s to shop.
smitcat
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Re: Take out food vs COVID 19

Post by smitcat »

M.Lee wrote: Tue Mar 17, 2020 9:42 am Ok you guess, debating and arguing isn't my thing. Don't get take out then. Don't eat any produce or fresh fruit either.
Simply washing your hands or fruit and produce with any soap is very effective with this virus - it is quite weak when it comes to many simple methods of disposal.
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lthenderson
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Re: Take out food vs COVID 19

Post by lthenderson »

carolinaman wrote: Tue Mar 17, 2020 8:39 am I get prepared soup from grocery store 2 or 3 times a week. The last one I got I brought it to a boil in the microwave before eating. Will that kill viruses?
The CDC recommends boiling water vigorously for at least one minute to make the water potable. That is for elevations under 2000 feet. Above that they recommend three minutes of vigorous boiling. I would follow those rules for soup.
michaeljc70
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Re: Take out food vs COVID 19

Post by michaeljc70 »

M.Lee wrote: Tue Mar 17, 2020 9:10 am I've been reading a lot, but have not yet come across anything that says the covid-19 virus can live inside food. If one of you have, please share the link. It may be on a carboard box (like for pizza), but not transferred to the pizza itself. I don't know about paper bags. But really, even in the super market, you are dealing with bags, boxes, glass, etc. Therefore, as far as this virus is concerned, I don't think it is any more harmful to get take out than go grocery shopping. That said, you may pick up ecoli and other things from unsanitary conditions.
If it can live on a counter, cardboard, stainless steel, etc. what makes you think it cannot live on lettuce or a garnish or something else not cooked? I would avoid takeout but if I did do it I would avoid anything uncooked or with uncooked elements. I would avoid sandwiches, tacos, salads and things like that. If Chipotle couldn't keep people from getting sick umpteen times when there was no pandemic....
BoggledHead2
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Re: Take out food vs COVID 19

Post by BoggledHead2 »

researcher wrote: Tue Mar 17, 2020 8:31 am
jabberwockOG wrote: Mon Mar 16, 2020 10:04 pm Everyone needs to stay inside, regardless of age, unless absolutely necessary...
This is a huge overreaction. It is not a zombie apocalypse. It is perfectly OK to go outside!
This really has gotten out of control

People acting like their flesh will melt off if they step foot outside. Absolutely insane.
BoggledHead2
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Re: Take out food vs COVID 19

Post by BoggledHead2 »

smitcat wrote: Tue Mar 17, 2020 9:51 am
M.Lee wrote: Tue Mar 17, 2020 9:42 am Ok you guess, debating and arguing isn't my thing. Don't get take out then. Don't eat any produce or fresh fruit either.
Simply washing your hands or fruit and produce with any soap is very effective with this virus - it is quite weak when it comes to many simple methods of disposal.
Thank you! This is not some superhuman world ender - you literally wash your hands and take extra precautions if not feeling well
TravelGeek
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Re: Take out food vs COVID 19

Post by TravelGeek »

dboeger1 wrote: Tue Mar 17, 2020 12:51 am
TravelGeek wrote: Mon Mar 16, 2020 10:57 pm
Standard way at Starbucks appears to be for the baristas to put the lid on drinks and push on it with their fingers where the mouth opening is.
Do they lick the spills off the side as well?
No,I believe the manual advises them to use a dirty dish rag that they also use yo wipe off the counter and the milk steaming wand ;)

In any case, I really have no need to visit a Starbucks or other coffee place at the moment. I can make espresso or coffee at home, and the social aspect is suspended in my state anyway.
Last edited by TravelGeek on Tue Mar 17, 2020 10:13 am, edited 1 time in total.
Seasonal
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Re: Take out food vs COVID 19

Post by Seasonal »

M.Lee wrote: Tue Mar 17, 2020 9:25 am From the FDA.gov website:

Q: Can I get sick with COVID-19 from touching food, the food packaging, or food contact surfaces, if the coronavirus was present on it?
A: Currently there is no evidence of food or food packaging being associated with transmission of COVID-19.
Also:

Q: Can I get COVID-19 from a food worker handling my food?

A: Currently, there is no evidence of food or food packaging being associated with transmission of COVID-19. However, the virus that causes COVID-19 is spreading from person-to-person in some communities in the U.S. The CDC recommends that if you are sick, stay home until you are better and no longer pose a risk of infecting others.

Anyone handling, preparing and serving food should always follow safe food handling procedures, such as washing hands and surfaces often.

https://www.fda.gov/emergency-preparedn ... tions#food

We're not changing our food ordering habits.
carolinaman
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Re: Take out food vs COVID 19

Post by carolinaman »

lthenderson wrote: Tue Mar 17, 2020 9:51 am
carolinaman wrote: Tue Mar 17, 2020 8:39 am I get prepared soup from grocery store 2 or 3 times a week. The last one I got I brought it to a boil in the microwave before eating. Will that kill viruses?
The CDC recommends boiling water vigorously for at least one minute to make the water potable. That is for elevations under 2000 feet. Above that they recommend three minutes of vigorous boiling. I would follow those rules for soup.
Thanks for the advice
michaeljc70
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Re: Take out food vs COVID 19

Post by michaeljc70 »

M.Lee wrote: Tue Mar 17, 2020 9:25 am From the FDA.gov website:

Q: Can I get sick with COVID-19 from touching food, the food packaging, or food contact surfaces, if the coronavirus was present on it?
A: Currently there is no evidence of food or food packaging being associated with transmission of COVID-19.
So, if you cannot get it from food packaging then you cannot get it from other surfaces like store shelves, shopping carts, desks, gym equipment, etc. and all this extra work places are doing cleaning that stuff is pointless?
GeoffD
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Re: Take out food vs COVID 19

Post by GeoffD »

JAZZISCOOL wrote: Tue Mar 17, 2020 8:17 am
GeoffD wrote: Mon Mar 16, 2020 11:38 pm On the microwave thing, I doubt most people would nuke takeout food long enough to create the temperature that would kill a virus.


I would think takeout pizza reheated in a 425 oven would be fine.

We’re mostly sticking to cooked homemade food. Blueberries are the only thing in the fridge where it’s merely washed.
Thanks. I was thinking pizza might be an option. :happy
If the molten cheese can take out the roof of your mouth, it probably kills any virus. :) I'd wash my hands thoroughly after touching the box and be careful disposing of the box, though. If you're really doing the full germ-o-phobe thing, you have to treat anything someone else has touched as contaminated.

Now I want pizza. Grrrrr. LOL
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jabberwockOG
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Re: Take out food vs COVID 19

Post by jabberwockOG »

Ron wrote: Tue Mar 17, 2020 8:58 am
jabberwockOG wrote: Tue Mar 17, 2020 8:18 amAnd you, and others that refuse to stay home except for emergencies for 2-3 weeks, will likely prolong their pain for many months. Everybody needs to stay home including restaurant workers. We could send them all on luxury all expense paid stay-vacations for far less than the cost of prolonging this pandemic.
It's one thing to be aware of the situation and take the proper precautions; it's another to be in a completely panic mode.

My wife/me are in our 70's. We're well aware of the situation at hand and currently don't take (what we consider) risky chances. We've given up going to church, to exercise classes, to movies, and to all other public events where many folks are in close quarters.

However, we each still volunteer several times a week delivering meals to elderly (sometimes younger than us) and the disabled via our local Meals on Wheels organization Without that lifeline, many of our "customers" would cease to function, since often we're the only one they see on a daily basis and we're there to ensure that they are still alive (seriously).

We have moved our meal pickups from a church basement to having everything in the parking lot (plenty of distance between all the volunteers). We also have copious use of hand sanitizers along with using doggie dropping bags as substitute gloves, as required. Not as good as washing hands between deliveries (don't have a bathroom in my SUV), but still well within guidance given. BTW, we also take our own temperature several times a day to ensure we don't have and existing problem. The only challenge we do have is that our sneezing may upset some folks (we live in one of the highest pollen areas of the country), but sneezing is not an indicator of the virus.

Do we put ourselves at risk by our volunteer work? Quite possibly. However, we do think we provide a critical service to a portion of our community that really needs it. If we don't do it, who will?

You are lucky/blessed if you can sit at home a few weeks without repercussions to your lifestyle. Not everybody has that option.

- Ron


At this point due to community spreading in literally every state in the US, a mass and well synchronized "shelter in place event" is the only thing that will stop Covid-19 pandemic in its tracks.

Those refusing to stay home except for exception situations is likely to prolong and make the situation much worse for many months. Although my guess is that the governors in all states will step in and force the issue on those few that think they are special and that refuse to cooperate for the common good.
neilpilot
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Re: Take out food vs COVID 19

Post by neilpilot »

BoggledHead2 wrote: Tue Mar 17, 2020 10:05 am
Thank you! This is not some superhuman world ender - you literally wash your hands and take extra precautions if not feeling well

....and take extra precautions even if you are feeling well
GeoffD
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Re: Take out food vs COVID 19

Post by GeoffD »

michaeljc70 wrote: Tue Mar 17, 2020 10:15 am
M.Lee wrote: Tue Mar 17, 2020 9:25 am From the FDA.gov website:

Q: Can I get sick with COVID-19 from touching food, the food packaging, or food contact surfaces, if the coronavirus was present on it?
A: Currently there is no evidence of food or food packaging being associated with transmission of COVID-19.
So, if you cannot get it from food packaging then you cannot get it from other surfaces like store shelves, shopping carts, desks, gym equipment, etc. and all this extra work places are doing cleaning that stuff is pointless?
I'm going to start licking doorknobs again!
TravelGeek
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Re: Take out food vs COVID 19

Post by TravelGeek »

michaeljc70 wrote: Tue Mar 17, 2020 10:15 am
M.Lee wrote: Tue Mar 17, 2020 9:25 am From the FDA.gov website:

Q: Can I get sick with COVID-19 from touching food, the food packaging, or food contact surfaces, if the coronavirus was present on it?
A: Currently there is no evidence of food or food packaging being associated with transmission of COVID-19.
So, if you cannot get it from food packaging then you cannot get it from other surfaces like store shelves, shopping carts, desks, gym equipment, etc. and all this extra work places are doing cleaning that stuff is pointless?
I think the CDC is saying there is no evidence probably because it hasn’t been sufficiently studied yet. They don’t say you can safely ignore surface contamination:

https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-nc ... ction.html

“There is much to learn about the novel coronavirus that causes coronavirus disease 2019 (COVID-19). Based on what is currently known about the novel coronavirus and similar coronaviruses that cause SARS and MERS, spread from person-to-person with these viruses happens most frequently among close contacts (within about 6 feet). This type of transmission occurs via respiratory droplets. On the other hand, transmission of novel coronavirus to persons from surfaces contaminated with the virus has not been documented. Transmission of coronavirus occurs much more commonly through respiratory droplets than through fomites. Current evidence suggests that novel coronavirus may remain viable for hours to days on surfaces made from a variety of materials. Cleaning of visibly dirty surfaces followed by disinfection is a best practice measure for prevention of COVID-19 and other viral respiratory illnesses in households and community settings.”

(my holding)

Also:

https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-nc ... ssion.html

“ COVID-19 is a new disease and we are still learning how it spreads, the severity of illness it causes, and to what extent it may spread in the United States.”

(their bolding)
Last edited by TravelGeek on Tue Mar 17, 2020 10:40 am, edited 1 time in total.
smitcat
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Re: Take out food vs COVID 19

Post by smitcat »

BoggledHead2 wrote: Tue Mar 17, 2020 10:05 am
smitcat wrote: Tue Mar 17, 2020 9:51 am
M.Lee wrote: Tue Mar 17, 2020 9:42 am Ok you guess, debating and arguing isn't my thing. Don't get take out then. Don't eat any produce or fresh fruit either.
Simply washing your hands or fruit and produce with any soap is very effective with this virus - it is quite weak when it comes to many simple methods of disposal.
Thank you! This is not some superhuman world ender - you literally wash your hands and take extra precautions if not feeling well
Thank you - the well described methods to deal with this virus are easy to read and mostly common sense.
There is an increasing possibility that common sense is not all that common.
michaeljc70
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Re: Take out food vs COVID 19

Post by michaeljc70 »

TravelGeek wrote: Tue Mar 17, 2020 10:29 am
michaeljc70 wrote: Tue Mar 17, 2020 10:15 am
M.Lee wrote: Tue Mar 17, 2020 9:25 am From the FDA.gov website:

Q: Can I get sick with COVID-19 from touching food, the food packaging, or food contact surfaces, if the coronavirus was present on it?
A: Currently there is no evidence of food or food packaging being associated with transmission of COVID-19.
So, if you cannot get it from food packaging then you cannot get it from other surfaces like store shelves, shopping carts, desks, gym equipment, etc. and all this extra work places are doing cleaning that stuff is pointless?
I think the CDC is saying there is no evidence probably because it hasn’t been sufficiently studied yet. They don’t say you can safely ignore surface contamination:

https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-nc ... ction.html

“There is much to learn about the novel coronavirus that causes coronavirus disease 2019 (COVID-19). Based on what is currently known about the novel coronavirus and similar coronaviruses that cause SARS and MERS, spread from person-to-person with these viruses happens most frequently among close contacts (within about 6 feet). This type of transmission occurs via respiratory droplets. On the other hand, transmission of novel coronavirus to persons from surfaces contaminated with the virus has not been documented. Transmission of coronavirus occurs much more commonly through respiratory droplets than through fomites. Current evidence suggests that novel coronavirus may remain viable for hours to days on surfaces made from a variety of materials. Cleaning of visibly dirty surfaces followed by disinfection is a best practice measure for prevention of COVID-19 and other viral respiratory illnesses in households and community settings.”

(my holding)

Also:

https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-nc ... ssion.html

“ COVID-19 is a new disease and we are still learning how it spreads, the severity of illness it causes, and to what extent it may spread in the United States.”

(their bolding)
Exactly. They don't know everything about coronavirus but we can look at how similar viruses are transmitted. It is hard to know where just about anyone got it. People can transmit it without symptoms or knowing they have it. It could have been in the air somewhere for hours and you never even saw the person that you got it from. I'd be very surprised if someone infected sneezed on a counter (or object) and you touched it and then touched your eyes/nose/mouth you couldn't get it. Now, it may be harder to get it that way. You can get the common flu that way.
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btenny
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Re: Take out food vs COVID 19

Post by btenny »

Well everyone thanks for all the comments. Here is what wife and I know and plan to do...

She has to go out today to vote (no early ballot) so she will have some contact. I got a mail ballot so all I have to do is drop that off.

I think I will order Mexican take out soon. Home made Mexican food is just not as good as store bought. Plus I do not want this store to close. Our Mexican food place has a dedicated take out food prep station and room behind the cash register and front room. The same guys have been working there for years. This take out store and separate restaurant next door has been owned by the same person for decades. The food prep guy makes each order in a separate tin foil container. He then puts that metal container in a very hot ultra violet oven for 3-5 minutes to make the whole meal real hot. Then he takes it out and puts it in a new paper sack. He repeats this for each meal in the order. He then gives this order to the customer. So the food is blistering hot and handed right to me for take out. There is a separate bin for chips but I will forgo this for now. I will also ask then to delete the lettuce garnish and cold sides that are added after cooking. So I am pretty sure no germs can survive this cooking. And I am also sure we are taking little risk with the single paper bag to carry the whole order.

The Italian place has a closed kitchen and is food prep is unknown. So I will forgo that take out for now....

And regarding Meals on Wheels. I am very grateful for all you volunteers. Please keep up this work. Many people need this service. I am sure there is some added risk but life is like that when you go out the front door. My neighbor in Tahoe has MS and depends on this help a lot. She only gets out when it is clear and has real issues when the weather is bad. I help her when I am in town but I am not there much in the winter.

Thanks all for the comments. Good Luck.
GaryA505
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Re: Take out food vs COVID 19

Post by GaryA505 »

Some of the people preparing and delivering your food ARE infected.
UpperNwGuy
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Re: Take out food vs COVID 19

Post by UpperNwGuy »

OP, does your wife know that you started this thread? And, if so, did you tell her that most of the replies favored her opinion?
dboeger1
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Re: Take out food vs COVID 19

Post by dboeger1 »

btenny wrote: Tue Mar 17, 2020 12:02 pm Well everyone thanks for all the comments. Here is what wife and I know and plan to do...

She has to go out today to vote (no early ballot) so she will have some contact. I got a mail ballot so all I have to do is drop that off.

I think I will order Mexican take out soon. Home made Mexican food is just not as good as store bought. Plus I do not want this store to close. Our Mexican food place has a dedicated take out food prep station and room behind the cash register and front room. The same guys have been working there for years. This take out store and separate restaurant next door has been owned by the same person for decades. The food prep guy makes each order in a separate tin foil container. He then puts that metal container in a very hot ultra violet oven for 3-5 minutes to make the whole meal real hot. Then he takes it out and puts it in a new paper sack. He repeats this for each meal in the order. He then gives this order to the customer. So the food is blistering hot and handed right to me for take out. There is a separate bin for chips but I will forgo this for now. I will also ask then to delete the lettuce garnish and cold sides that are added after cooking. So I am pretty sure no germs can survive this cooking. And I am also sure we are taking little risk with the single paper bag to carry the whole order.

The Italian place has a closed kitchen and is food prep is unknown. So I will forgo that take out for now....

And regarding Meals on Wheels. I am very grateful for all you volunteers. Please keep up this work. Many people need this service. I am sure there is some added risk but life is like that when you go out the front door. My neighbor in Tahoe has MS and depends on this help a lot. She only gets out when it is clear and has real issues when the weather is bad. I help her when I am in town but I am not there much in the winter.

Thanks all for the comments. Good Luck.
OP, I know you probably just forgot to mention it since you were focusing on the food part, but perhaps the single best thing you can add to that is washing and/or disinfecting your hands before and after both picking up the food and eating. In combination with all of the things you said, even the slight chance that you touch an infected surface such as the paper bag can be effectively mitigated by disinfecting and avoiding touching your face to the extent possible. It may seem unnecessary, but this really is kind of a fight against the virus, and complacency is risky. Consider the full ritual an interesting way to spice up dinner, haha.
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Re: Take out food vs COVID 19

Post by dodecahedron »

Wonderful Italian family restaurant near me (owned and operated by same family since 1913, over 100 years ago) has an option where you place a to-go order ahead of time by phone half an hour before you want to pick it up.

Then you drive into their parking lot and call them from your cell to let them know you are there. Stay in your car and an employee comes out with your order, you pop open your trunk, employee puts it in and closes the trunk. You drive away.
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Re: Take out food vs COVID 19

Post by ResearchMed »

M.Lee wrote: Tue Mar 17, 2020 9:25 am From the FDA.gov website:

Q: Can I get sick with COVID-19 from touching food, the food packaging, or food contact surfaces, if the coronavirus was present on it?
A: Currently there is no evidence of food or food packaging being associated with transmission of COVID-19.
So the "food packaging" is some magic material?

Other cardboard/paper/etc., (e.g., even the bag or box) *can* support the virus for at least enough time to get it home.

But if it's used for food, it can't be?

RM
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Re: Take out food vs COVID 19

Post by GCD »

M.Lee wrote: Tue Mar 17, 2020 9:42 am Ok you guess, debating and arguing isn't my thing. Don't get take out then. Don't eat any produce or fresh fruit either.
I can't wash Chinese food, or pizza or any other prepared food. I can, and always have, washed fruit and vegetables before preparing them.
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Re: Take out food vs COVID 19

Post by TravelGeek »

ResearchMed wrote: Tue Mar 17, 2020 2:19 pm
M.Lee wrote: Tue Mar 17, 2020 9:25 am From the FDA.gov website:

Q: Can I get sick with COVID-19 from touching food, the food packaging, or food contact surfaces, if the coronavirus was present on it?
A: Currently there is no evidence of food or food packaging being associated with transmission of COVID-19.
So the "food packaging" is some magic material?

Other cardboard/paper/etc., (e.g., even the bag or box) *can* support the virus for at least enough time to get it home.

But if it's used for food, it can't be?

RM
Agreed, it isn’t magic material.

If I take the answer literally, no one has evidence that covid-19 has been transmitted via food or food packaging. Even if I ordered takeout today and was sick tomorrow, I don’t know that the health department would consider that evidence. Even if I still had the packaging sitting on my kitchen counter and they found virus on it, would that be evidence (vs perhaps getting infected by the door handle of the restaurant)? My gut feel is that they wouldn’t even have the bandwidth to investigate.
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Re: Take out food vs COVID 19

Post by frugalmama »

lthenderson wrote: Mon Mar 16, 2020 4:32 pm I would not risk it if I were in your shoes. Like a poster above, restaurant workers tend to need the paycheck and push the envelope of working while sick.
+1 If I did risk it, I would want to be able to watch them prepare it from start to finish (How do you know they sneezed in their elbow? etc.). Personally, we aren't risking it. We just are not going out to restaurants during this time.
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Re: Take out food vs COVID 19

Post by J45 »

It unclear but the likelihood is that it would spread if the person cooking had symptoms. The only thing I have read so far is that some thing, the cruises likely may have spread it through food prep.

I know its extremely difficult but I would resist and wait till more data is available. This is new lifestyle for at least 3 months or the worst for 12-18 months.

How about read and learn new recipes :D
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Re: Take out food vs COVID 19

Post by ballons »

btenny wrote: Mon Mar 16, 2020 3:59 pm I am in the over 70 group and have some health issues. So me for sure. My wife is only old. So yes we would like to avoid this stuff....

Good Luck.
Maybe from a food truck, where everything is boiling hot/baked/grilled, and you can see all employees wearing masks.
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Re: Take out food vs COVID 19

Post by LadyGeek »

This thread has run its course and is locked (derailed to discuss medical advice). See: Medical Issues
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Are you comfortable eating carry outs from a restaurant at this time?

Post by CobraKai »

[Thread merged into here, see below. --admin LadyGeek]

My first thought was no, I wouldn't - what if the cook is sick (or someone else handling the food or packaging)?

OTOH reheating or microwaving the food would kill any germs in the unlikely event that they were to make their way into the food.

Are you still supporting your favorite restaurants by purchasing food to go, or are you steering clear for now?

If it's the latter, one way to support them is to purchase gift certificates (and hope they don't go out of business!).
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Re: Are you comfortable eating carry outs from a restaurant at this time?

Post by bluebolt »

Yes. Ordering delivery from our favorite restaurants. We transfer the food to our own containers, throw away the packaging, then wash our hands.
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Re: Are you comfortable eating carry outs from a restaurant at this time?

Post by BrownEyedGirl_27 »

Yeah, I don't mind supporting local businesses here and I love trying out new restaurants. They're in a tough place and I want to enjoy yummy food twice a month. I throw out the containers and wash hands before and after going for carry-out.
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Re: Are you comfortable eating carry outs from a restaurant at this time?

Post by TravelGeek »

Yes, I am. See viewtopic.php?f=11&t=307854&start=50 for many replies on the same topic.
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Re: Are you comfortable eating carry outs from a restaurant at this time?

Post by chevca »

We just had pizza delivered tonight... and it was delicious. :happy
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Re: Are you comfortable eating carry outs from a restaurant at this time?

Post by birdog »

We cut back but are still getting carry out once a week.
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Re: Are you comfortable eating carry outs from a restaurant at this time?

Post by oldfort »

CobraKai wrote: Thu Mar 26, 2020 7:41 pm My first thought was no, I wouldn't - what if the cook is sick (or someone else handling the food or packaging)?

OTOH reheating or microwaving the food would kill any germs in the unlikely event that they were to make their way into the food.
If you're relying on the microwave to kill germs, make sure the internal temperature reaches 165F.
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Re: Are you comfortable eating carry outs from a restaurant at this time?

Post by RJC »

Why take unnecessary risks when you don't have to? You have to go to the grocery store, but take carryout? Not so much.
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Re: Are you comfortable eating carry outs from a restaurant at this time?

Post by livesoft »

Yes, I am. I might feel differently if my county had a lot of reported coronavirus cases.
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Re: Take out food vs COVID 19

Post by LadyGeek »

I merged CobraKai's thread into the on-going discussion.

The thread remains locked. See: Personal Consumer Issues
Note that this subforum has a much lower threshold for locking or removing posts than the financial and investing subforums. In general, controversial, offensive, pointless, divisive or mean-spirited posts or topics may be locked, edited or deleted (with or without notice) at the discretion of the moderating staff even if they do not otherwise violate forum policies.
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