Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Questions on how we spend our money and our time - consumer goods and services, home and vehicle, leisure and recreational activities
HomeStretch
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by HomeStretch » Thu Mar 05, 2020 5:48 pm

iamlucky13 wrote:
Thu Mar 05, 2020 5:38 pm
In the same vein as my previous post, how long are people expecting to go without food as a result of this outbreak?

Is it really the expectation that authorities are going to cut off our access to food so that the 90% or more of people who don't have more than a couple days worth of food on hand starve to death in order to save us from a high end estimate of ~2% risk of death from illness?
My expectation is that I may want to avoid people/grocery stores in person and/or that stores/restaurants may have trouble stocking shelves or delivering food if employees don’t/can’t report for work.

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TomatoTomahto
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by TomatoTomahto » Thu Mar 05, 2020 5:52 pm

smitcat wrote:
Thu Mar 05, 2020 5:37 pm
TomatoTomahto wrote:
Thu Mar 05, 2020 4:13 pm
TheTimeLord wrote:
Wed Mar 04, 2020 9:37 pm
I bought water.
My wife and I kid each other that, aside from food, we are ready for a long duration confinement during a zombie apocalypse.

Washlet toilets
Well water
Septic
Geothermal heating and cooling
Electric car
Solar panels
32 kw Batteries
If grid is out, batteries drained, and sun doesn’t shine, 8kw propane generator can keep us limping along
Enough meds to last a long time, but not forever.

I think next year, I should grow food.
If you actually think this is necessary the next step is to be able to defend your position.
We didn’t do all this because of the corona virus (even if we had wanted to, it took over a year to implement our relatively self-sufficient home). It was a natural outgrowth of seeing that our home, while within commuting distance of Boston, is quite rural and has lost power at least 5 times in 2 years due to trees. While power plant workers would possibly still report to work, I don’t know if our home, easily taken off-grid by a single fallen tree, would be a priority. And, if a tree is down, an oil truck couldn’t deliver. That would affect propane deliveries also, but that’s a worry beyond our belt and suspenders preparedness.

We do have some defense of our property, but we probably should also increase those. Maybe soon. In addition to vegetables.
Okay, I get it; I won't be political or controversial. The Earth is flat.

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JoeRetire
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by JoeRetire » Thu Mar 05, 2020 5:53 pm

Broken Man 1999 wrote:
Thu Mar 05, 2020 5:47 pm
Back in the old days you had to stir the peanut butter because of the oil on the top.
That's a skill that might come in handy once the viral apocalypse hits.

Back to the good old days! When men were men and women were women, and peanut butter came with oil on top. That's the way it was... and we liked it!
It's the end of the world as we know it. | It's the end of the world as we know it. | It's the end of the world as we know it. | And I feel fine.

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TomatoTomahto
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by TomatoTomahto » Thu Mar 05, 2020 5:55 pm

Broken Man 1999 wrote:
Thu Mar 05, 2020 5:47 pm
I eat oatmeal 5 of 7 mornings, with a large spoonful of peanut butter...
Good reminder. We have plenty of peanut butter, but I should get another few cans of steel cut oats.
Okay, I get it; I won't be political or controversial. The Earth is flat.

JD2775
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by JD2775 » Thu Mar 05, 2020 6:01 pm

are you guys just sitting around waiting for it to hit? I mean, do you have an estimate in your head on when it may get "bad" in your area?

Few cases here in the Bay Area, CA but my gut feeling is the worst will hit 4-6 weeks from now. If it's not bad by then then it probably won't be.

But I am not a Dr. I didn't even stay at a Holiday Inn.

iamlucky13
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by iamlucky13 » Thu Mar 05, 2020 6:12 pm

I just received updated information from my employer (in Washington state).

Aside from the numerous recommendations about washing hands, touching your face, and monitoring for possibly related symptoms, this is some of the most useful and relevant information about preparing for the spread of COVID-19 that I've seen.

They're encouraging the use of telecommuting among employees who can do so effectively. They are instructing the use of Webex, etc. for meetings whenever possible.

They also sent clarification of the company policies for pay for numerous different scenarios, such as if you stay home voluntarily to avoid contact, are unable to return to work due restrictions enacted while on personal travel vs. business travel, or are directed by a health care provider to self-quarantine.

Perhaps relevant to the largest number of employees is the guidance regarding pay for those who can not attend not attend work due to childcare needs created by school closures.

stoptothink
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by stoptothink » Thu Mar 05, 2020 6:21 pm

Broken Man 1999 wrote:
Thu Mar 05, 2020 5:47 pm
halfnine wrote:
Thu Mar 05, 2020 5:07 pm
I don't think most people truly understand how fast your food stores disappear when you are eating them. For reference, in a month my family would go through 150 lbs of dry food (or 120 lbs of peanut butter).

And, I don't think people truly appreciate how heavy water really is until they have to carry it. But, that is a different story.
120 pounds of peanut butter? Good grief! That is a significant amount of peanut butter.

I eat oatmeal 5 of 7 mornings, with a large spoonful of peanut butter, some raisins, and cinnamon.

Fortunately I have an open 40oz jar, and two more 40oz jars in the pantry I picked up during a Costco run a couple of weeks ago. So I'm good for awhile if a run on peanut butter develops.

I had peanut butter and grape jam on toast for most of my youth for breakfast. Back in the old days you had to stir the peanut butter because of the oil on the top.

Still a favorite of mine, in fact I think I will have a peanut butter sandwich for dinner tonignt! Yum!

Broken Man 1999
We eat A LOT of PB in our house and I'll regularly order 50lbs.+ when my favorite (myprotein) goes on super sale. It is put in everything (oatmeal, protein shakes, at least 2 PB& fruit sandwiches per day), and my kids inhale it, and a single 40oz jar will easily last us 2 weeks. That reminds me, I only have 7-40oz. jars left, need to keep an eye out for deals.

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Geneyus
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by Geneyus » Thu Mar 05, 2020 9:09 pm

I work with and regularly come into contact with hundreds of people. I'm preparing to catch the disease, if it spreads rapidly across the U.S.

I'm in my 30's and healthy, so I don't think I should be alarmed, but I've been batting 1.000 on catching stomach virus and the flu this past year.

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Doom&Gloom
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by Doom&Gloom » Thu Mar 05, 2020 9:37 pm

Oddly enough, food is the one category that I am not so concerned about stockpiling.

If we are infected, neither of us will feel like cooking. In addition, neither of us eats a lot of the types of foods that can be stored indefinitely so as to ensure that they will not go to waste eventually if we don't become infected and quarantined.

If quarantined, once we plow through our normal supplies on hand I figure it should be easy enough to get delivery services to drop off meals on our doorstep or in our driveway if they have been paid and tipped in advance online. (That will not be the time that I will be looking to save a few bucks on food!) Failing that, we could almost certainly get friends or relatives to drop meals and/or food on our porch. If they are unable to do that, things will be so catastrophic that we will probably all perish anyway.

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sunny_socal
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by sunny_socal » Fri Mar 06, 2020 7:35 am

JD2775 wrote:
Thu Mar 05, 2020 6:01 pm
are you guys just sitting around waiting for it to hit? I mean, do you have an estimate in your head on when it may get "bad" in your area?

Few cases here in the Bay Area, CA but my gut feeling is the worst will hit 4-6 weeks from now. If it's not bad by then then it probably won't be.

But I am not a Dr. I didn't even stay at a Holiday Inn.
Even when it's "bad", it's not going to be bad.

Here's how it works:
- Elderly people in nursing homes with existing conditions (diabetes, heart trouble, pneumonia) are naturally at increased risk
- Children virtually unaffected!
- Everyone else who is reasonably healthy will experience a "flu"

What's missing from the news: How many people have died of the regular flu during this 'pandemic'

Seasonal
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by Seasonal » Fri Mar 06, 2020 7:47 am

sunny_socal wrote:
Fri Mar 06, 2020 7:35 am
What's missing from the news: How many people have died of the regular flu during this 'pandemic'
Missing? I've been inundated with this since coronavirus entered the news.

Also, as noted more than once, it has a much higher case fatality rate than the flu, an unclear transmission rate and much less familiarity with it, including how best to treat it.

sawhorse
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by sawhorse » Fri Mar 06, 2020 9:28 am

sunny_socal wrote:
Fri Mar 06, 2020 7:35 am
JD2775 wrote:
Thu Mar 05, 2020 6:01 pm
are you guys just sitting around waiting for it to hit? I mean, do you have an estimate in your head on when it may get "bad" in your area?

Few cases here in the Bay Area, CA but my gut feeling is the worst will hit 4-6 weeks from now. If it's not bad by then then it probably won't be.

But I am not a Dr. I didn't even stay at a Holiday Inn.
Even when it's "bad", it's not going to be bad.

Here's how it works:
- Elderly people in nursing homes with existing conditions (diabetes, heart trouble, pneumonia) are naturally at increased risk
- Children virtually unaffected!
- Everyone else who is reasonably healthy will experience a "flu"

What's missing from the news: How many people have died of the regular flu during this 'pandemic'
I take it you're relatively young and healthy? I'm immunosuppressed, and the coronavirus is much riskier than the regular flu if I were to catch it. I'm not particularly scared; my low quality of life due to medical problems has given me a nonchalant attitude toward my own death.

However, some people in my condition do care about living, and with viruses, they rely on others to be careful around them. Please don't take such a blase attitude and be like the patient in New Hampshire who was told to isolate and attended a crowded event anyway.

That said, I don't see the point in stocking up on things like peanut butter.
Last edited by sawhorse on Fri Mar 06, 2020 9:51 am, edited 1 time in total.

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TomatoTomahto
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by TomatoTomahto » Fri Mar 06, 2020 9:37 am

sawhorse wrote:
Fri Mar 06, 2020 9:28 am
However, some people in my condition do care about living, and with viruses, they rely on others to be careful around them. Please don't take such a blase attitude and be like the patient in New Hampshire who was told to isolate and attended a crowded event anyway.
The word “manslaughter” comes to mind.

My wife, through no fault of her own, takes medication that suppresses her immune function.

I, arguably through a fault of my own, have metabolic syndrome and well-regulated T2 diabetes (I call myself a “diabetic in remission.”)

I would regard anyone who knowingly does not quarantine and puts themselves in our presence as guilty of at least attempted manslaughter if not attempted murder.
Okay, I get it; I won't be political or controversial. The Earth is flat.

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lthenderson
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by lthenderson » Fri Mar 06, 2020 9:52 am

sunny_socal wrote:
Fri Mar 06, 2020 7:35 am
- Children virtually unaffected!
- Everyone else who is reasonably healthy will experience a "flu"
What worries me the most is being sidelined with "flu" like symptoms with unaffected children bouncing off the walls for days on end while their school is closed. That is pretty much a nightmare scenario in my book!

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Kenkat
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by Kenkat » Fri Mar 06, 2020 10:24 am

One positive thing is I have not heard of widespread nightmare stories out of infected areas such as China or Italy. By nightmare, I mean bodies stacking up in the streets, basic services breaking down, civil unrest, etc. Yes, people are getting sick and people are dying and it is time to take action to mitigate the spread. It’s not going to be contained completely at this point in the interconnected world. Exactly how this all plays out is still unknown - regardless of whether you are a layman, reporter, health expert or disease expert. It could be similar to a really bad flu season like H1N1 in 2009, it could be similar to a 1918 pandemic, it could flare quickly and then slow as it (maybe?) is doing in China for reasons we can speculate on but not really know for sure. No one knows. No one. The most responsible thing to do is to say we don’t know what will happen but it could be bad and we need to prepare to prevent or lessen the chance.

People are dying from this - regardless of the exact percentage - so if there things we can do to mitigate this, we should do them. If we are asked to alter our lifestyles by the authorities, we should follow their instructions as best we are able.

For some context, there will be approximately 140 million new people added to the planet this year; another 60 million will depart it. I don’t want to see anyone unnecessarily added to the departure list for any reason, but those are some big numbers in comparison to deaths so far at least.

fru-gal
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by fru-gal » Fri Mar 06, 2020 10:38 am

petulant wrote:
Tue Mar 03, 2020 7:00 pm
willthrill81 wrote:
Tue Mar 03, 2020 6:58 pm
Cosmo wrote:
Tue Mar 03, 2020 6:41 pm
KlangFool wrote:
Sun Mar 01, 2020 4:37 pm
theplayer11 wrote:
Sun Mar 01, 2020 4:34 pm
don't get the toilet paper thing...does this virus give people diarrhea?
I see lots of over reaction. A few scramble to get certain supplies, others see the shelves getting a little low on certain things and they join in. Sort of like when everyone is seated comfortable at the airport waiting to board, but as soon as a few decide to stand up and start a line, the herd follows resulting in everyone standing for 20 minutes while everyone could have been sitting. :confused
theplayer11,

If you are quarantined for 1 month, do you have enough toilet paper to last you one month? If not, what do you plan to do after you are quarantined?

Don't hoard. Aka, buy more than you need. But, enough supply for one month is reasonable.

KlangFool
Who puts you in quarantine? Who enforces this? I have a difficult time believing there will be involuntary quarantines.
Governors can declare martial law and use that to enforce quarantines and other 'draconian' measures with perfect legality.
I am a lawyer and this is correct.
The state has really draconian powers. When I was a young woman decades ago, in my state they could forcibly examine anyone named as a sexual contact by someone with a sexually transmitted disease. There were horror stories of not sexually active young women being subjected to this.

Ybsybs
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by Ybsybs » Fri Mar 06, 2020 11:36 am

I've got about two weeks worth of food in the pantry and freezer. We will keep grocery shopping as normal and rotate foods to maintain that stash.

If someone in our household gets sick, we will do our best to not leave the house for a couple weeks to avoid being part of the problem.

So far there are no confirmed cases of the virus in my area. But the public health officials also admit that they have no test kits either. We have family in assisted living who we usually visit every weekend. This past weekend we did a videochat instead since one of the kids was sick (not with COVID19).

We got our relatives set up with two different videochat systems so we've got a backup option. We may be doing a lot more of that over the coming weeks or months.

While we aren't sick, we will make a point of ordering food even if it's just takeout from our favorite restaurants to increase the chances that they are still in business when this is all over.

psteinx
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by psteinx » Fri Mar 06, 2020 1:59 pm

sunny_socal wrote:
Fri Mar 06, 2020 7:35 am
Even when it's "bad", it's not going to be bad.

Here's how it works:
- Elderly people in nursing homes with existing conditions (diabetes, heart trouble, pneumonia) are naturally at increased risk
- Children virtually unaffected!
- Everyone else who is reasonably healthy will experience a "flu"

What's missing from the news: How many people have died of the regular flu during this 'pandemic'
So, it's not BAD as long as only old people die?

That's perhaps not spectacularly reassuring to those who are old themselves or have loved ones who are.

And it's not a question of how many have died of this, SO FAR, versus deaths from the regular flu, but rather, what will the death rate be, particularly if folks DON'T take the extraordinary measures that are increasingly being taken.

Seasonal
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by Seasonal » Fri Mar 06, 2020 2:26 pm

psteinx wrote:
Fri Mar 06, 2020 1:59 pm
And it's not a question of how many have died of this, SO FAR, versus deaths from the regular flu, but rather, what will the death rate be, particularly if folks DON'T take the extraordinary measures that are increasingly being taken.
It amazes me how many appear not to recognize this point, even when it's repeatedly made.

Johnny Thinwallet
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by Johnny Thinwallet » Fri Mar 06, 2020 3:28 pm

There haven't been any confirmed cases in my area yet, but as my dad and I discussed, it's just a matter of time. If not this week, then probably next week or the week after. I'll probably head out this weekend to stock up on a few basic items. I won't go crazy, but really this will be just advance purchasing things that we'd buy over time anyway. Some of the grocery items I'm eyeing are on sale this weekend anyway. That way if the worst does not come to pass, we'd slowly use all those items over time and nothing would go to waste.

That said, there's disagreement on this in my own household. I'm concerned about this virus and am willing to take some easy steps to be at least a little bit prepared, but my wife has her head in the sand about it. It'll take a shock to her system to recognize the risk that we may face, something such as her employer closing, a loved one coming down with it, etc.

We have a wedding coming up in a few weeks here locally. I'm fine attending ... as of now, but that may change. Nevertheless, there will be 300+ guests, plus the event staff, in this one venue. People will be flying in from all over to attend. All it takes is one person bringing that virus in to the venue and all bets are off for everyone else who's there that night.

sil2017
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by sil2017 » Fri Mar 06, 2020 4:00 pm

I am going to be cautious. I am definitely not going to be scare. Flu kills more people than the coronavirus.

I have toilet paper, paper towel, Clorox and lysol wipes, water and other drinks handy in my house. This is not newly bought items but I usually have a surplus so I don't need to shop all the time.

I have several international trips planned b4 the outbreak. I intend to travel to Canada, Croatia , and New Zealand. Unless the airline cancels my flight, I will continue to live and enjoy my retirement life.

Seasonal
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by Seasonal » Fri Mar 06, 2020 4:08 pm

sil2017 wrote:
Fri Mar 06, 2020 4:00 pm
I am going to be cautious. I am definitely not going to be scare. Flu kills more people than the coronavirus so far.
The new language is the real issue.

lazydavid
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by lazydavid » Fri Mar 06, 2020 4:32 pm

Seasonal wrote:
Fri Mar 06, 2020 4:08 pm
sil2017 wrote:
Fri Mar 06, 2020 4:00 pm
I am going to be cautious. I am definitely not going to be scare. Flu kills more people than the coronavirus so far.
The new language is the real issue.
Agreed. It's amazing how many people don't understand the difference between statistical models of a virus that has had a worldwide footprint for almost 2,500 years, as opposed to incomplete and constantly-changing data about a brand-new virus that has had just over two months to start fanning out from its initial patient zero. It's such early days, we still don't have much of any idea of what the transmission rate or mortality will be.

But I do know one thing--I don't recall there ever being an influenza outbreak on a cruise ship that killed six people. If you want to compare COVID-19 to the flu, that's currently the most complete (from a data perspective) scenario we have. It's far from perfect, but several orders of magnitude better than trying to compare the current worldwide numbers to annual stats for influenza.

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JoeRetire
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by JoeRetire » Fri Mar 06, 2020 4:39 pm

Geneyus wrote:
Thu Mar 05, 2020 9:09 pm
I work with and regularly come into contact with hundreds of people. I'm preparing to catch the disease, if it spreads rapidly across the U.S.

I'm in my 30's and healthy, so I don't think I should be alarmed, but I've been batting 1.000 on catching stomach virus and the flu this past year.
Did you get vaccinated for the flu?
It's the end of the world as we know it. | It's the end of the world as we know it. | It's the end of the world as we know it. | And I feel fine.

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JoeRetire
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by JoeRetire » Fri Mar 06, 2020 4:45 pm

sunny_socal wrote:
Fri Mar 06, 2020 7:35 am

Even when it's "bad", it's not going to be bad.
Unless you die. Some people might think that would be bad.
It's the end of the world as we know it. | It's the end of the world as we know it. | It's the end of the world as we know it. | And I feel fine.

Colorado13
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by Colorado13 » Fri Mar 06, 2020 5:07 pm

There's one confirmed case in the county where I reside. As of Wednesday of this week (before the case was confirmed) my local grocery store had bottled water, tp, soap, wet wipes, etc. and didn't seem to be running low on stock, at least not that I could discern. I did not check to see if they have had hand sanitizer however.

I am preparing by taking my laptop home from work every day in case there becomes a need to work from home. Most of my exposure to other people is at work and at the gym; I've not yet reduced time spent at either location. My employer is an international company, so is monitoring the situation and updating us every couple of days regarding best practices for staying healthy.

iamlucky13
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by iamlucky13 » Fri Mar 06, 2020 5:29 pm

lazydavid wrote:
Fri Mar 06, 2020 4:32 pm
Seasonal wrote:
Fri Mar 06, 2020 4:08 pm
sil2017 wrote:
Fri Mar 06, 2020 4:00 pm
I am going to be cautious. I am definitely not going to be scare. Flu kills more people than the coronavirus so far.
The new language is the real issue.
Agreed. It's amazing how many people don't understand the difference between statistical models of a virus that has had a worldwide footprint for almost 2,500 years, as opposed to incomplete and constantly-changing data about a brand-new virus that has had just over two months to start fanning out from its initial patient zero. It's such early days, we still don't have much of any idea of what the transmission rate or mortality will be.

But I do know one thing--I don't recall there ever being an influenza outbreak on a cruise ship that killed six people. If you want to compare COVID-19 to the flu, that's currently the most complete (from a data perspective) scenario we have. It's far from perfect, but several orders of magnitude better than trying to compare the current worldwide numbers to annual stats for influenza.
In fact, instances where ANY disease has led officials to forcibly healthy people to stay in close proximity to ill people such as aboard a cruise ship have been rare. If they were trying to spread the disease, they chose a great tactic.

softwaregeek
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by softwaregeek » Fri Mar 06, 2020 5:48 pm

I live in SF Bay Area and there are well over a dozen confirmed cases in my county. In addition to that, there are many suspected cases which, due to the test shortage, have not been confirmed and have not made the national news. The rumor mill is EXTREMELY active here, but much is fact, not rumor.

I am of the opinion that we are going to see a huge explosion in cases once we begin testing.

For example, an older gentleman who had been on the SF Bay Cruise in the last voyage, dropped dead of respiratory issues and the cop who gave him CPR is now quarantined. This is fact and the local PD issued a statement on twitter. It did not make national news.

But ultimately, I am increasingly convinced there is nothing I can do. I have kids, and they catch everything at school. Unless I take my kids out of school, I'm pretty much gonna get everything.

BH_RedRan
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by BH_RedRan » Fri Mar 06, 2020 7:32 pm

Somewhere in the thread it was implied that coffee stock-up was not that important. I find that opinion groundless.

Being near "ground" zero in WA, I have to disagree completely. We Washingtonians without our "vitamin C" can be an irritable bunch. Best to keep us caffeinated and calm so there are no TP fights at Costco or sanitizer wars at Krogers.

I just got my new supply of Dilano's in the mail today, so I'm set. I'm now fully "prepped".

Jackson12
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by Jackson12 » Fri Mar 06, 2020 11:05 pm

sil2017 wrote:
Fri Mar 06, 2020 4:00 pm
I am going to be cautious. I am definitely not going to be scare. Flu kills more people than the coronavirus.

I have toilet paper, paper towel, Clorox and lysol wipes, water and other drinks handy in my house. This is not newly bought items but I usually have a surplus so I don't need to shop all the time.

I have several international trips planned b4 the outbreak. I intend to travel to Canada, Croatia , and New Zealand. Unless the airline cancels my flight, I will continue to live and enjoy my retirement life.
Flu kills more people than the Coronavirus? That is true so far ButThe World Health Organization epidemiologists stressed, in a recent briefing, that this is a developing situation and the overall mortality rate as well as the mortality rate for a specific country will only be known as the situation evolves..and after the flu cases decrease, as has been the case in China .
For example, how will mortality rates be affected by the way each country handles testing, diagnoses and treatment? What about countries with many more elderly than another country? .

Jackson12
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by Jackson12 » Fri Mar 06, 2020 11:13 pm

Doom&Gloom wrote:
Thu Mar 05, 2020 9:37 pm
Oddly enough, food is the one category that I am not so concerned about stockpiling.

If we are infected, neither of us will feel like cooking. In addition, neither of us eats a lot of the types of foods that can be stored indefinitely so as to ensure that they will not go to waste eventually if we don't become infected and quarantined.

If quarantined, once we plow through our normal supplies on hand I figure it should be easy enough to get delivery services to drop off meals on our doorstep or in our driveway if they have been paid and tipped in advance online. (That will not be the time that I will be looking to save a few bucks on food!) Failing that, we could almost certainly get friends or relatives to drop meals and/or food on our porch. If they are unable to do that, things will be so catastrophic that we will probably all perish anyway.
We have had 1 confirmed case in our city and already food delivery services are asking if customers want deliveries left in their doorsteps, limiting customer and driver exposure to each other. Many grocery delivery businesses can’t guarantee that any item showing up as “in stock” online will be truly available and delivered. And the deliveries often occur the next day. They are too backed up for same day delivery.

Sockpuppet
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by Sockpuppet » Sat Mar 07, 2020 12:21 am

softwaregeek wrote:
Fri Mar 06, 2020 5:48 pm

But ultimately, I am increasingly convinced there is nothing I can do. I have kids, and they catch everything at school. Unless I take my kids out of school, I'm pretty much gonna get everything.
Children are very low risk for this disease. No one under the age of 10 has died (which is insane). Only 1% of cases involve children suggesting a lower infection rate. And it *appears* the disease is not easily spread without symptoms (although there is some debate on this).

So unlike with the flu, your children shouldn’t be the germ magnets they usually are.

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Random Musings
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by Random Musings » Sat Mar 07, 2020 12:24 am

Have our preps mostly ready, so did some standard grocery shopping tonight. Noticed that our Costco has limit of five items for certain products. TP was almost gone and one other item as well. No Clorox wipes since last Sat, a worker I have known since our store has opened told me.

Costco and Walmart are the hardest hit, other stores tend to have more supplies, except masks. You may pay a little extra, but there are also less people around you.

I was talking to a endocrinologist team earlier this week, a nurse, who is very senior, said "wash your hands like you have never washed your hands before". Plus, the usual don't touch your face, keep some social distance and such. We wash up in the basement after taking off coats and shoes before going upstairs. Still are risks, but trying to minimize. Keep mini bottles of sanitizer in the car as well.

Stay safe.

RM
I figure the odds be fifty-fifty I just might have something to say. FZ

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Random Musings
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by Random Musings » Sat Mar 07, 2020 12:32 am

Sockpuppet wrote:
Sat Mar 07, 2020 12:21 am
softwaregeek wrote:
Fri Mar 06, 2020 5:48 pm

But ultimately, I am increasingly convinced there is nothing I can do. I have kids, and they catch everything at school. Unless I take my kids out of school, I'm pretty much gonna get everything.
Children are very low risk for this disease. No one under the age of 10 has died (which is insane). Only 1% of cases involve children suggesting a lower infection rate. And it *appears* the disease is not easily spread without symptoms (although there is some debate on this).

So unlike with the flu, your children shouldn’t be the germ magnets they usually are.
But the cavalier 20-40 year old crowd may be germ magnets for older people. Their personal risk is low, but they may still be shedding the virus to the older crowd. The older crowd will be spreading it amongst themselves as well. The R(0) factor, if over 2 as has been claimed, assures that.

Supposedly, the immune system is not completely mature yet for young children which is a benefit for some reason. At least there is something to be thankful for.

RM
I figure the odds be fifty-fifty I just might have something to say. FZ

multiham
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by multiham » Sat Mar 07, 2020 1:44 am

Maybe someone can explain this to me. The company I work for just put in a policy that says we can't attend any meetings where there are 50 or more people present. Of course, people are already saying they will just cut the invite to 45 and therefore they are within policy. Is there something "magic" about groups of 50 or more? I understand that the more people together, the better the odds that someone has been exposed to the virus. But does reducing from 50 to 40 really make any significant difference?

PDX_Traveler
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by PDX_Traveler » Sat Mar 07, 2020 1:47 am

iamlucky13 wrote:
Fri Mar 06, 2020 5:29 pm
lazydavid wrote:
Fri Mar 06, 2020 4:32 pm
Seasonal wrote:
Fri Mar 06, 2020 4:08 pm
sil2017 wrote:
Fri Mar 06, 2020 4:00 pm
I am going to be cautious. I am definitely not going to be scare. Flu kills more people than the coronavirus so far.
The new language is the real issue.
[..]
But I do know one thing--I don't recall there ever being an influenza outbreak on a cruise ship that killed six people. If you want to compare COVID-19 to the flu, that's currently the most complete (from a data perspective) scenario we have. It's far from perfect, but several orders of magnitude better than trying to compare the current worldwide numbers to annual stats for influenza.
In fact, instances where ANY disease has led officials to forcibly healthy people to stay in close proximity to ill people such as aboard a cruise ship have been rare. If they were trying to spread the disease, they chose a great tactic.
^
|___ This. The spectacular cluelessness, if not outright callousness of our "leadership" opining on preferring to forcibly keep people bottled up in a cruise ship offshore is something to behold.

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Noobvestor
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by Noobvestor » Sat Mar 07, 2020 2:33 am

M.Lee wrote:
Thu Mar 05, 2020 2:37 pm
I'm looking for suggestions on what kinds of food to stock up on. I don't care about toilet paper and stuff like that. Only food that isn't perishable. I have enough frozen vegetables and frozen fruit. I have cereal, crackers, cheese, canned tuna. But that stuff goes fast. If I'm stuck here for a month, I don't know if I can buy enough to last.
Campbell's Chunk Soups line is my go-to - lots of calories, easy prep, all-in-one, a mix of flavors, pretty hearty all around - makes for a good meal. I haven't eaten them as much in recent years, but bought a few dozen the other day. Figure it's good prep for disasters in general and probably overdue to have a shelf of those anyway. Back in college they were my go-to quick meal.

https://www.campbells.com/campbell-soup/chunky/

At the other extreme, you have boring stuff like Soylent and other calorie-dense drinkable meals and bars and such. Probably will get boring pretty fast, but doesn't take up much space and not horrible once in a while (already eat some Soylent bars for on-the-go calories in a pinch).

https://soylent.com/pages/squared

I also read (but didn't check the numbers) that Campbell's stock has gone up with the virus (equity, I mean, not soup stock - sorry, horrible play on words). I did have to promised my SO, too, that yes, I will eat them one way or another, even if we don't end up quarantined :beer
"In the absence of clarity, diversification is the only logical strategy" -= Larry Swedroe

quantAndHold
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by quantAndHold » Sat Mar 07, 2020 2:39 am

multiham wrote:
Sat Mar 07, 2020 1:44 am
Maybe someone can explain this to me. The company I work for just put in a policy that says we can't attend any meetings where there are 50 or more people present. Of course, people are already saying they will just cut the invite to 45 and therefore they are within policy. Is there something "magic" about groups of 50 or more? I understand that the more people together, the better the odds that someone has been exposed to the virus. But does reducing from 50 to 40 really make any significant difference?
51 vs 49? No, it’s just an arbitrary cutoff. They had to cut it somewhere. But you have 50+ person meetings regularly? Never mind the disease potential, that sounds like a huge waste of time and money for the company.
Yes, I’m really that pedantic.

Mr. Rumples
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by Mr. Rumples » Sat Mar 07, 2020 6:39 am

Woke up this morning to an email from my retirement lunch group; the guy who is organizing it said this one may be the last for a while; he linked the notice to the news that the CDC is asking 60+ and some other groups to avoid large crowds.

My neighbor is a retired head surgical nurse in her 70's (very handy when I fell and got a nail in my scalp, but I digress...); the hospital she retired from has asked her to apply to reinstate her nursing license which involves some classroom hours...its unclear whether she can complete them in time and even then as being in a high risk group whether she is willing to work again in a hospital if there is a pandemic locally.

Meanwhile, there is contradictory information coming from local health authorities. On the one hand, they are saying not to worry, on the other, the Medical College of VA, is saying they need to open satellite testing stations outside of physician's offices so hospitals and doctors are not overwhelmed.

https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-nc ... tions.html

Seasonal
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by Seasonal » Sat Mar 07, 2020 7:16 am

multiham wrote:
Sat Mar 07, 2020 1:44 am
Maybe someone can explain this to me. The company I work for just put in a policy that says we can't attend any meetings where there are 50 or more people present. Of course, people are already saying they will just cut the invite to 45 and therefore they are within policy. Is there something "magic" about groups of 50 or more? I understand that the more people together, the better the odds that someone has been exposed to the virus. But does reducing from 50 to 40 really make any significant difference?
There does not appear to be anything magic about 50. France banned public gatherings of 5,000 in confined spaces. The idea, as you say, is to avoid large gatherings and everyone has their own threshold.

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JoeRetire
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by JoeRetire » Sat Mar 07, 2020 7:39 am

BH_RedRan wrote:
Fri Mar 06, 2020 7:32 pm
Somewhere in the thread it was implied that coffee stock-up was not that important. I find that opinion groundless.
I see what you did there... and I liked it!
It's the end of the world as we know it. | It's the end of the world as we know it. | It's the end of the world as we know it. | And I feel fine.

mmcmonster
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by mmcmonster » Sat Mar 07, 2020 7:44 am

TomCat96 wrote:
Wed Feb 12, 2020 2:56 pm
What if anything are you doing to prepare?
Exercise regularly.
Eat healthy.
Keep well hydrated.
Wash my hands regularly.
Don't lick people's eye balls. (see: https://xkcd.com/2277/ and https://www.cbsnews.com/news/japanese-e ... ness-risk/ )

Remember: Flu kills more people per hour than COVID-19 has so far this year.
Last edited by mmcmonster on Sat Mar 07, 2020 7:47 am, edited 1 time in total.

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JoeRetire
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by JoeRetire » Sat Mar 07, 2020 7:45 am

multiham wrote:
Sat Mar 07, 2020 1:44 am
But does reducing from 50 to 40 really make any significant difference?
No. There's no magic in any specific number. But if they want to help avoid "large groups" and still have meetings, they apparently felt the need to come up with some number.

They could have just said "avoid large group meetings" and left the number to everyone's imagination. But that might have resulted in some teams deciding on their own that "large" means 1000, 100, or 2.
It's the end of the world as we know it. | It's the end of the world as we know it. | It's the end of the world as we know it. | And I feel fine.

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JoeRetire
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by JoeRetire » Sat Mar 07, 2020 7:47 am

Noobvestor wrote:
Sat Mar 07, 2020 2:33 am
At the other extreme, you have boring stuff like Soylent and other calorie-dense drinkable meals and bars and such. Probably will get boring pretty fast, but doesn't take up much space and not horrible once in a while (already eat some Soylent bars for on-the-go calories in a pinch).
Remember to avoid the Soylent Green, though. :mrgreen:
It's the end of the world as we know it. | It's the end of the world as we know it. | It's the end of the world as we know it. | And I feel fine.

corysold
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by corysold » Sat Mar 07, 2020 8:10 am

PDX_Traveler wrote:
Sat Mar 07, 2020 1:47 am
iamlucky13 wrote:
Fri Mar 06, 2020 5:29 pm
lazydavid wrote:
Fri Mar 06, 2020 4:32 pm
Seasonal wrote:
Fri Mar 06, 2020 4:08 pm
sil2017 wrote:
Fri Mar 06, 2020 4:00 pm
I am going to be cautious. I am definitely not going to be scare. Flu kills more people than the coronavirus so far.
The new language is the real issue.
[..]
But I do know one thing--I don't recall there ever being an influenza outbreak on a cruise ship that killed six people. If you want to compare COVID-19 to the flu, that's currently the most complete (from a data perspective) scenario we have. It's far from perfect, but several orders of magnitude better than trying to compare the current worldwide numbers to annual stats for influenza.
In fact, instances where ANY disease has led officials to forcibly healthy people to stay in close proximity to ill people such as aboard a cruise ship have been rare. If they were trying to spread the disease, they chose a great tactic.
^
|___ This. The spectacular cluelessness, if not outright callousness of our "leadership" opining on preferring to forcibly keep people bottled up in a cruise ship offshore is something to behold.
It isn't just "this leadership". It's happened plenty of times before, including in Japan just recently.

"BBC News reportsVenezuela has quarantined the ship following an outbreak of swine flu on board. More than 1,200 passengers and crew will be kept on board the vessel, which has docked at the Venezuelan island of Margarita. They were stopped from disembarking at previous stops in Barbados and Grenada after three crew members were diagnosed with the flu virus. Eleven more crew members are reported to have symptoms. "The virus was detected in three crew members and the boat must now stay in quarantine until June 24," said Venezuelan health official Jorge Alchaer."

"Grenada Broadcasting Network reports the ship, which was scheduled to visit Grenada on Monday, was turned away by health authorities. Passengers were prohibited from coming ashore by the Ministry of Health because some crew members were exhibiting flu like symptoms. Geo. F. Huggins & Co. (G'da) ltd; local agents for the ship, confirm that the company was informed by the vessel that approximately forty (40) crew members onboard were found to be exhibiting flu-like symptoms. As a precautionary measure, the Ministry of Health prohibited the disembarkation of any passenger or crew member."

"The Daily Mail reports the ship was turned away from St. Lucia today over worries the vessel was carrying the H1N1 swine flu virus. The line says another island, Antigua, also has told the ship not to visit as scheduled on Thursday. The islands' decisions came after the line reported two crew members and a passenger on the ship had been experiencing flu-like symptoms. The ship departed San Juan, Puerto Rico Sunday on a seven-night Southern Caribbean cruise and has stopped only at Bridgetown, Barbados. It is scheduled to visit Philipsburg, St. Maarten and St. Croix, Virgin Islands later this week. There's no word yet on whether the two islands will allow the ship to dock."

"Officials from the Carribean island of St. Lucia quarantined a U.S. cruise ship following a confirmed case of measles onboard.
"We thought it prudent that we quarantine the ship" considering the highly infectious nature of measles, Dr. Merlene Fredericks-James, the country's chief medical officer, said in a video statement. As such, the nearly 300 passengers and crew aboard were not allowed to disembark on the island."

Who knows what the right answer is. Keeping people on board isn't best, but neither is allowing 1,000's of potentially infected people to leave for home.

RobLyons
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by RobLyons » Sat Mar 07, 2020 8:35 am

Stocking up on food, water, N95 masks? The media hype has really driven fear into a lot of people!

How to prepare?
Wash hands (why is this new to some people?)
Avoid fear
Continue on with life
Stay home if sick

Seriously. It's a virus! Nothing "cures" viruses. Vaccines prepare your immune system to fight the virus if you get it, helping to cut down on the severity and duration of said virus. Which is seems more Americans are opting not to get the flu shot in the first place so why suddenly do they fear not having a vaccine for COVID-19? Even antivirals are not a cure, they simply inhibit the development of the virus you already have.
"Great parenting sets the foundation for a better world"

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Watty
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by Watty » Sat Mar 07, 2020 8:40 am

multiham wrote:
Sat Mar 07, 2020 1:44 am
Maybe someone can explain this to me. The company I work for just put in a policy that says we can't attend any meetings where there are 50 or more people present. Of course, people are already saying they will just cut the invite to 45 and therefore they are within policy. Is there something "magic" about groups of 50 or more? I understand that the more people together, the better the odds that someone has been exposed to the virus. But does reducing from 50 to 40 really make any significant difference?
I agree that 50 is an arbitrary number but if everyone who attended a meeting has to self quarenteein and work from home for two weeks then going from 50 to 40 would leave 10 more people in the office to hold things together.

SocalLiving
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by SocalLiving » Sat Mar 07, 2020 9:16 am

We are always prepared for a big disruptive earthquake, so didn't really have to do anything for Coronavirus. A quarantine at home with running water, electricity, and internet seems manageable compared to an earthquake that takes out all those things and more.

A lot of our neighbors are much older than us and have medical conditions. So I did leave a note in all their mailboxes with my cell number and email telling them I would be more than happy to run errands for them if they did not feel comfortable going to crowded places for a few weeks. And offered them supplies if they need it. I don't want our older more vulnerable neighbors running around trying to find toilet paper!

SimonJester
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by SimonJester » Sat Mar 07, 2020 10:30 am

The local Costco was a mad house yesterday, completely out of paper towels, toilet paper, all cleaning supplies. Talking to a few employees they said they are getting semi trailers full of nothing but toilet paper every morning and they are sold out in 1 hour.

I think the media is fueling all of this, they report on people running out to store to get a certain item, and it stirs the massed to all run out to get that same item before its gone.
"They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety." - Benjamin Franklin

HawkeyePierce
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by HawkeyePierce » Sat Mar 07, 2020 11:09 am

Psst, install a bidet attachment and stop worrying about TP. ;)

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