Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Questions on how we spend our money and our time - consumer goods and services, home and vehicle, leisure and recreational activities
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Doom&Gloom
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by Doom&Gloom »

bob60014 wrote: Tue Mar 03, 2020 6:43 pm The world is going crazy. None of this stocking up and shortages of stuff makes any sense. But I'm still glad I have a few old Sears catalogs laying around! ;)
LOL!

DW thought I was crazy about stocking up on Charmin, but I told her that she was welcome to my share of all the corncobs.
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F150HD
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by F150HD »

M.Lee wrote: Mon Mar 02, 2020 8:50 am Interesting about the Wegman's clerk. Wegman's is my favorite store but it's 20 miles away. I would 'guess' that products like TP and cleaning supplies cost more at Wegman's and there isn't a large selection of them. I am fortunately not on a budget when it comes to grocery shopping, so I shop in speciality type markets. I went yesterday and had no problem stocking up on TP, Paper Towels, Clorox, etc. I'm a retired senior and now I do not have to leave my property for a couple weeks, so I guess that makes me relatively safe from the virus.
unless the products you bought were shipped or stocked by someone w/ the virus. Or if you get any mail which is touched by any number of people. :D
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Cosmo
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by Cosmo »

petulant wrote: Tue Mar 03, 2020 7:00 pm
willthrill81 wrote: Tue Mar 03, 2020 6:58 pm
Cosmo wrote: Tue Mar 03, 2020 6:41 pm
KlangFool wrote: Sun Mar 01, 2020 4:37 pm
theplayer11 wrote: Sun Mar 01, 2020 4:34 pm don't get the toilet paper thing...does this virus give people diarrhea?
I see lots of over reaction. A few scramble to get certain supplies, others see the shelves getting a little low on certain things and they join in. Sort of like when everyone is seated comfortable at the airport waiting to board, but as soon as a few decide to stand up and start a line, the herd follows resulting in everyone standing for 20 minutes while everyone could have been sitting. :confused
theplayer11,

If you are quarantined for 1 month, do you have enough toilet paper to last you one month? If not, what do you plan to do after you are quarantined?

Don't hoard. Aka, buy more than you need. But, enough supply for one month is reasonable.

KlangFool
Who puts you in quarantine? Who enforces this? I have a difficult time believing there will be involuntary quarantines.
Governors can declare martial law and use that to enforce quarantines and other 'draconian' measures with perfect legality.
I am a lawyer and this is correct.
Please. lol
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Cosmo
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by Cosmo »

bob60014 wrote: Tue Mar 03, 2020 6:43 pm The world is going crazy. None of this stocking up and shortages of stuff makes any sense. But I'm still glad I have a few old Sears catalogs laying around! ;)
+1 And it's showing up in this thread. :)
nonfacebookuser365
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by nonfacebookuser365 »

Nothing too different:

Avoiding the coasts
Avoiding airports and those that travel
Avoiding interactions with foreigners
Reporting suspected carriers
expat
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by expat »

I am doing nothing. (except buying stocks at discount prices.)

I survived SARS, the West Nile Virus, various Swine flu, and the Avian flu.
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Tejfyy
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by Tejfyy »

Another hand raised for: I'm not.
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Doom&Gloom
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by Doom&Gloom »

nonfacebookuser365 wrote: Tue Mar 03, 2020 7:46 pm Nothing too different:

Avoiding the coasts
Avoiding airports and those that travel
Avoiding interactions with foreigners
Reporting suspected carriers
Wait. What?

Report suspected carriers? To whom? Who would you suspect? What would you expect to be done?
clip651
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by clip651 »

Doom&Gloom wrote: Tue Mar 03, 2020 8:17 pm
nonfacebookuser365 wrote: Tue Mar 03, 2020 7:46 pm Nothing too different:

Avoiding the coasts
Avoiding airports and those that travel
Avoiding interactions with foreigners
Reporting suspected carriers
Wait. What?

Report suspected carriers? To whom? Who would you suspect? What would you expect to be done?
Some state health departments have a phone number you can call to request information, or report suspected carriers. I would expect the health department would decide whether or not they wanted to contact that person for testing. I've no idea whether they would actually do it, or if they are just giving people the option to report to make the people reporting feel better that they have "done something".

I also suspect the phone number will be mostly swamped with people calling to get info.
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willthrill81
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by willthrill81 »

Cosmo wrote: Tue Mar 03, 2020 7:39 pm
petulant wrote: Tue Mar 03, 2020 7:00 pm
willthrill81 wrote: Tue Mar 03, 2020 6:58 pm
Cosmo wrote: Tue Mar 03, 2020 6:41 pm
KlangFool wrote: Sun Mar 01, 2020 4:37 pm

theplayer11,

If you are quarantined for 1 month, do you have enough toilet paper to last you one month? If not, what do you plan to do after you are quarantined?

Don't hoard. Aka, buy more than you need. But, enough supply for one month is reasonable.

KlangFool
Who puts you in quarantine? Who enforces this? I have a difficult time believing there will be involuntary quarantines.
Governors can declare martial law and use that to enforce quarantines and other 'draconian' measures with perfect legality.
I am a lawyer and this is correct.
Please. lol
Please what? Do you think that a declaration of martial law and quarantining is impossible?
“It's a dangerous business, Frodo, going out your door. You step onto the road, and if you don't keep your feet, there's no knowing where you might be swept off to.” J.R.R. Tolkien,The Lord of the Rings
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by abuss368 »

Staying the course.
John C. Bogle: “Simplicity is the master key to financial success."
kksmom
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by kksmom »

Cosmo wrote: Tue Mar 03, 2020 6:41 pm

Who puts you in quarantine? Who enforces this? I have a difficult time believing there will be involuntary quarantines.
https://www.cdc.gov/quarantine/aboutlaw ... ation.html

federal govt/CDC /state ...
Finridge
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by Finridge »

TomCat96 wrote: Wed Feb 19, 2020 2:07 pm
gtd98765 wrote: Wed Feb 19, 2020 1:49 pm
SevenBridgesRoad wrote: Wed Feb 12, 2020 9:35 pm
I can't remember the name of the cognitive bias that is at play here, throwing off our risk assessment because coronavirus is all over the news and other higher risks are not reported every hour. Maybe someone can remind me.
Availability bias: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Availability_heuristic
Frankly I see these two as more relevant.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Normalcy_bias

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cognitive_dissonance


1. Normalcy bias. People are biased because life goes on like usual, and its hard for them to perceive outside those boundaries.

2. Cognitive Dissonance. The idea that this is no worse than the flu, when there is very clear and obvious evidence that China's economic activity is paralyzed, over 1700 chinese doctors are infected, over 150 million people are in quarantine, and over 700 million people are on lockdown. Here the cognitive dissonance comes from embracing the flu comparison, when nation-state actors are simply not treating it like the flu. In fact they're losing quite a bit of money because of their "overreaction" to this "flu"
I think TomCat96 made some very astute observations about normalcy bias and cognitive dissonance being two key cognitive biases that are in effect here.

And I remembered this post when saw some voice incredulity that involuntary quarantines can be imposed. Of course, those of you who have been following the news will likely be aware that the government has already been detaining American citizens in mandatory (involuntary) quarantines. Hundreds of American citizens re-entering the U.S. from China have been kept in quarantine on military bases.

This was pursuant to quarantine orders issued by the CDC. It turns out that the CDC has full legal authority to issue quarantine orders. They've had this power for a long time, but the last time they used this power was over 50 years ago. And if this hasn't already gotten your attention, that should get your attention.

It's been over 50 years since we've seen a rapidly spreading contagious disease that is at lethal has this one. That's longer then the living memories of most of the people here on this forum. So this kind of thing is outside of our experience--we don't see it as something that can happen.

And I don't mean to digress regarding this. I know that this subforum is not intended to be a general discussion board to discuss current events or items of interest, but rather a place to discuss consumer issues - where we can discuss how we spend our money and our time. What we discuss here should be related to a consumer issue, personal and actionable. "By actionable, I mean whether you will potentially be able to use the information to better utilize your time or money. Personal means it must be directly connected to your (or your friend's or family's) life as a consumer."

I think that for anyone who has been following the news, the risk posed by COVID-19 to greatly impact our lives (including the potential premature termination of our lives itself) is a real enough issue, such that we should looking at how we can utilize our time or money to stop it. But of course, without awareness of the potential risks, we can't have any real discussion as to how we can spend our time and money to potentially mitigate them.

But what is clear is that many Americans have determined that it was worth their time and money to increase their supplies of home staples. In many areas, Costco, Trader Joe's, Smart and Final, Kroeger's, and the big grocery chain stores are seeing more traffic than they normally do before Christmas or other major holidays. The concern is that there may be quarantines, or just that they may wish to try to avoid going out to stores for a period in the future. Also, there is the possibility of disruptions to the supply chains.

Regarding quarantines, its not just the CDC that is authorize to issue quarantine orders. In many states, the state health department and also county health departments have the power to issue quarantine orders. As the CDC states on its web page: "States have police power functions to protect the health, safety, and welfare of persons within their borders. To control the spread of disease within their borders, states have laws to enforce the use of isolation and quarantine. These laws can vary from state to state and can be specific or broad. In some states, local health authorities implement state law. In most states, breaking a quarantine order is a criminal misdemeanor."

This may come to a shock to some people reading this. And, again, that is because we typically have not seen states and counties use these powers in over 50-60 years. That's because for the last 50+ years, they haven't needed to. But the COVID-19 pandemic has the potential to be the deadliest outbreak in over 50 years.

And the public health authorities, to do their jobs right, need to be looking forward at what is possible in the future. If they just sit on their hands and say, "This is nothing. Clearly. COVID-19 has only killed 9 people in the U.S. The flu kills many more people." -- If they were to just sit in their hands, saying that, and wait for it kill *more* people than the regular flu, then they would have not been doing their jobs. And at that point anything they would do would be too little too late. If in fact, COVID-19 kills fewer people than then the regular flu, then it will likely be PRECISELY BECAUSE they got ahead of the COVID-19 virus and took it seriously now, when it is possible to try to "nip it in the bud" without waiting for it to erupt into a widespread outbreak here in the U.S.

An analogy: Imagine if the fire department made serious attempts to contain a wildfire only after it became a major fire consuming tens of thousands of acres--if they did that, they wouldn't be doing their jobs.

This isn't meant to scare anyone--but the CDC has publicly announced that we should expect that COVID-19 will become widespread and that we should expect that it could cause "severe disruption" to the lives of ordinary Americans. The CDC has encouraged families and individuals to make preparations for this. As I mentioned earlier, some of their guidance in preparing for pandemics in the past included this: "Although the flu pandemic may last several months, buy and store at least 2-weeks' supplies of food, water, medicine, and facemasks. (Food and supplies may be hard to get during a pandemic.) When you have to stay home, these supplies will support your family and pets."

And that brings us back to discussing what we should think about doing to prepare. Myself, I checked the pantry and replinished any staples that we were low in. I didn't go crazy, but and for the most part, did not buy anything I don't expect will get used over the next year, pandemic or not. I bought only items that won't go bad and that we normally use.

Also, I have come across some articles that I personally thought were helpful and insightful in providing actionable advice with regard to preparation. And I thought that some of you might find this helpful and actionable as well.

+++++++++++++

I found this interesting. And the article goes on to discuss specific consumer items and specific actions we can take. But I particularly liked this opening:
https://www.theatlantic.com/health/arch ... ak/607369/


"For now, most American schools and offices are open, and few public gatherings have been canceled. Life goes on for most people, but with more push alerts and uncertainty about what to do. Hopefully, the virus will hit various areas in waves, scattering disease over a longer period of time, so that people can be treated and society remains functional. A less preferable scenario would be that too many people in a given area are out of commission and in need of medical care. If this happens, cities and states may go into shutdown modes to block further viral spread, disrupting the economy and everyday life.

Everyone can help in the effort to prevent this from happening. Unlike many global-health issues that depend on orchestration at the highest levels of government, individual behaviors matter in an immediate sense. The demographic most likely to survive an infection—the young and healthy—may need to pay the closest attention to preventive measures. These are the people who will spread the disease while believing that they have only a cold. They can infect the elderly, or people who have chronic diseases or immune conditions, who are less likely to survive."
I do think that is something we tend to lose sight of. That a lot of what we can do should be geared not just for ourselves, but also with consideration to how it impacts others, including family, friends, neighbors, and strangers.

++++++++++

And I also thought that this article made some great points. And if you read the full article, you will see that it also gets into specifics about what you can do.

https://blogs.scientificamerican.com/ob ... e-the-u-s/

As the new human coronavirus spreads around the world, individuals and families should prepare—but are we? The Centers for Disease Control has already said that it expects community transmission in the United States, and asked families to be ready for the possibility of a “significant disruption to our lives.”

Be ready? But how? It seems to me that some people may be holding back from preparing because of their understandable dislike of associating such preparation with doomsday or “prepper” subcultures. Another possibility is that people may have learned that for many people the disease is mild, which is certainly true, so they don’t think it’s a big risk to them. Also, many doomsday scenarios advise extensive preparation for increasingly outlandish scenarios, and this may seem daunting and pointless (and it is). Others may not feel like contributing to a panic or appearing to be selfish.

Forget all that. Preparing for the almost inevitable global spread of this virus, now dubbed COVID-19, is one of the most pro-social, altruistic things you can do in response to potential disruptions of this kind.

We should prepare, not because we may feel personally at risk, but so that we can help lessen the risk for everyone. We should prepare not because we are facing a doomsday scenario out of our control, but because we can alter every aspect of this risk we face as a society.

That’s right, you should prepare because your neighbors need you to prepare—especially your elderly neighbors, your neighbors who work at hospitals, your neighbors with chronic illnesses, and your neighbors who may not have the means or the time to prepare because of lack of resources or time.
quantAndHold
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by quantAndHold »

Costco in central San Diego today...

Lines were significantly longer than normal for a Tuesday morning. Longer than typical weekend lines. Plenty of stock of everything except hand sanitizer, which they were completely out of.

They also had plenty of beach towels and sunscreen. Beach season is coming...
Yes, I’m really that pedantic.
sawhorse
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by sawhorse »

fru-gal wrote: Tue Mar 03, 2020 5:51 pm
iamlucky13 wrote: Tue Mar 03, 2020 2:06 pm
fru-gal wrote: Tue Mar 03, 2020 1:29 pm
vested1 wrote: Mon Mar 02, 2020 11:25 am I'll put my trust in the CDC, WHO, and medical experts who specialize in infectious diseases. I'd much rather be over-prepared than underprepared.
The CDC has been amazingly stupid, restricting tests to a very small number of people, so the coronavirus can spread widely undetected. Everything I hear from medical people is they are very upset about this. I looked on the CDC website and the top people are doctors, so I am baffled. I assumed some political appointee was messing stuff up.

I read that they are going to really amp up the number of testing kits available, but I have not seen any indication that they have done this,
This isn't about "stupid." It's about creating a reliable test for a new disease and producing it quickly in large numbers.

I don't know the background on China's testing kit. The CDC has provided information about theirs.

The CDC was working for several months on a test kit that could be used by most laboratories and provide quick results. In the meantime, I believe health care providers were sending samples to the CDC directly, as the existing procedure for confirming the presence of the virus was more complicated.

They completed development and requested an emergency exemption to FDA approval requirements on February 3.

The exemption was issued February 4.

Shipping started February 5. As far as I understand it, the manufacturers producing the CDC test kit are shipping it as fast as they can make it.

A quality problem with one of the components of the test kit was identified shortly afterwards. Since then, they determined that the test is reasonably reliable without that component, and have updated the testing instructions for labs that received kits with a the bad component.
My understanding is that there is a perfectly fine testing kit available and widely used in other countries.
That is correct. German scientists developed an accurate test that was officially endorsed by the WHO. Some countries have been conducting tens of thousands of the tests every day. Instead of using the WHO test, the CDC tried to develop its own test, and their initial version turned out to not be that accurate. Their new version seems to be more accurate, but it seems their testing capacity is limited to 400 a day.

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/03/02/heal ... g-cdc.html
M.Lee
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by M.Lee »

F150HD wrote: Tue Mar 03, 2020 7:34 pm
M.Lee wrote: Mon Mar 02, 2020 8:50 am Interesting about the Wegman's clerk. Wegman's is my favorite store but it's 20 miles away. I would 'guess' that products like TP and cleaning supplies cost more at Wegman's and there isn't a large selection of them. I am fortunately not on a budget when it comes to grocery shopping, so I shop in speciality type markets. I went yesterday and had no problem stocking up on TP, Paper Towels, Clorox, etc. I'm a retired senior and now I do not have to leave my property for a couple weeks, so I guess that makes me relatively safe from the virus.
unless the products you bought were shipped or stocked by someone w/ the virus. Or if you get any mail which is touched by any number of people. :D
I still think there is a lesser chance of getting this virus in certain areas. Also, according to the 'experts', the risk is low insofar as getting it from objects and things through the mail. There is always risk, but I like to minimize it.
iamlucky13
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by iamlucky13 »

sawhorse wrote: Tue Mar 03, 2020 11:56 pm That is correct. German scientists developed an accurate test that was officially endorsed by the WHO. Some countries have been conducting tens of thousands of the tests every day. Instead of using the WHO test, the CDC tried to develop its own test, and their initial version turned out to not be that accurate. Their new version seems to be more accurate, but it seems their testing capacity is limited to 400 a day.

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/03/02/heal ... g-cdc.html
Is this part of the NYT article actually correct?
And the C.D.C. essentially ensured that Americans would be tested in very few numbers by imposing stringent and narrow criteria, critics say.
I saw the CDC testing guidelines (and if I remember correctly, they were similar to the WHO guidelines). I saw nothing imposed to prevent testing above and beyond the guidelines. I saw no requirements to only use the CDC test, and some of the other reporting indeed indicated many state health departments are using tests developed elsewhere.

I also note multiple outlets are quoting a specific doctor's criticisms whose comments haven't actually been about specific policies, but seems more like general disillusioned griping: "It's just a very American approach to say, 'We're the U.S., the major U.S. public health lab, and we're going to not follow the leader'" (verbatim). The only part he left out was to blame either Trump or Obama, depending which way his views lean. It's not useful criticism. It's an epidemiologist using the attention the current situation gets him as a way to get people listen to him on his soapbox.

I get that the CDC has been slow to produce their own test. That is disappointing, but there seems to be an inflated level of criticism based on only 80 cases confirmed so far, with a very low likelihood that different testing guidelines such as the WHO's or more rapid test availability would have identified significantly more.
KlangFool
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by KlangFool »

Folks,

https://www.aljazeera.com/ajimpact/indi ... 49028.html

<<India, the world's main supplier of generic drugs, has restricted the export of 26 pharmaceutical ingredients and the medicines made from them, including Paracetamol - a common pain reliever also sold as acetaminophen - as the coronavirus outbreak plays havoc with supply chains.>>

Refill your essential prescription if you can.

KlangFool
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TheTimeLord
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by TheTimeLord »

I bought water.
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sawhorse
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by sawhorse »

KlangFool wrote: Wed Mar 04, 2020 9:35 pm Folks,

https://www.aljazeera.com/ajimpact/indi ... 49028.html

<<India, the world's main supplier of generic drugs, has restricted the export of 26 pharmaceutical ingredients and the medicines made from them, including Paracetamol - a common pain reliever also sold as acetaminophen - as the coronavirus outbreak plays havoc with supply chains.>>

Refill your essential prescription if you can.

KlangFool
I'm confused. I thought there was no drug to treat the virus.
KlangFool
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by KlangFool »

sawhorse wrote: Wed Mar 04, 2020 9:48 pm
KlangFool wrote: Wed Mar 04, 2020 9:35 pm Folks,

https://www.aljazeera.com/ajimpact/indi ... 49028.html

<<India, the world's main supplier of generic drugs, has restricted the export of 26 pharmaceutical ingredients and the medicines made from them, including Paracetamol - a common pain reliever also sold as acetaminophen - as the coronavirus outbreak plays havoc with supply chains.>>

Refill your essential prescription if you can.

KlangFool
I'm confused. I thought there was no drug to treat the virus.
This is about your normal prescription drug. Aka, supply chain disruption.

KlangFool
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TheTimeLord
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by TheTimeLord »

sawhorse wrote: Wed Mar 04, 2020 9:48 pm
KlangFool wrote: Wed Mar 04, 2020 9:35 pm Folks,

https://www.aljazeera.com/ajimpact/indi ... 49028.html

<<India, the world's main supplier of generic drugs, has restricted the export of 26 pharmaceutical ingredients and the medicines made from them, including Paracetamol - a common pain reliever also sold as acetaminophen - as the coronavirus outbreak plays havoc with supply chains.>>

Refill your essential prescription if you can.

KlangFool
I'm confused. I thought there was no drug to treat the virus.
This is a supply chain issue where India is restricting the amount the amount of specific compounds to be exported. The compounds are used in drugs for treating things other than Corona virus.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/ ... ntibiotics
On Tuesday, concerns over supply chain shortages led the Indian government to place limits on the export of 26 pharmaceutical ingredients and the medicines and vitamins made from them.

The restricted drugs include paracetamol, antibiotics such as tinidazole and erythromycin, the hormone progesterone, which is used in the contraceptive pill, and and vitamins B12, B1 and B6. The drugs account for 10% of all India’s pharmaceutical exports.

India is one of the world’s largest producers and exporters of drugs, with the US and Europe heavily reliant on the supply.
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Watty
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by Watty »

sawhorse wrote: Wed Mar 04, 2020 9:48 pm I'm confused. I thought there was no drug to treat the virus.
Several OTC drugs can be used to treat the fever.
Available OTC antipyretics include acetaminophen and the nonsteroidal anti-inflammatory drugs aspirin, ibuprofen, and naproxen. Acetaminophen and ibuprofen are the 2 most widely used antipyretics.2,4 Ibuprofen is only approved for fever reduction in patients 6 months and older, however.2 These products are available as single-entity or combination products in extendedrelease versions and come in a variety of forms, including tablets, capsules, gel capsules, liquid gels, enteric coated, liquids, suspensions, and chewable tablets for adult and pediatric patients.


https://www.pharmacytimes.com/publicati ... tipyretics
OpenMinded1
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by OpenMinded1 »

I picked up a little extra hand sanitizer, and attempted to get three months worth of two of my prescriptions instead of the usual one month supply. They gave me three months of one, but said I didn't have enough refills prescribed to do that for the other. Did this with supply chain interruptions in mind. Noted over the last few days that nothing has changed at the local supermarkets. They still are out of sanitizing wiped for the shopping carts most of the time.
Kennedy
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by Kennedy »

ResearchMed wrote: Sun Mar 01, 2020 7:48 pm
Doom&Gloom wrote: Sun Mar 01, 2020 7:18 pm My (not very good) local nightly TV news reported several nights ago a partial list of subsidiaries of one megacorp whose supply from China might be disrupted. One on the list that surprised me was Charmin. I can't imagine that we would not be able to get toilet paper at all, but it is far easier for me to buy a ****load of Charmin now than to risk having to use an inferior (imo) product for a period of time. In fact, it was easier to buy a bunch of it now than it was to use Google to verify the news report I saw. The Charmin now in my house will certainly be used this year. Hardly any extra effort, no downside, and one less concern for me.
This morning, one major store was entirely out of TP. None available at all, including "in the back".

But not much later, at another major store, TP was easily available, and Charmin, in particular, was on a major sale. So we got lots of what we usually use - on sale. We may not have been looking just now. Win! :happy

We usually keep extras of "the regular items we use", in case of hurricanes or blizzards, etc., or... epidemics/pandemics. Or whatever...
But because of a serious illness during the past two months*, we had been using those stockpiles (convenient, yes!).
So, time to replenish anyway. We're just getting a bit extra, which we *will* use, no matter what. Only the "how soon" is not quite certain, of course.

* This was something eerily like the novel corona virus. On our return from a holiday in NZ/Australia, and after an overnight and change in planes in Hong Kong (!), at the end of our looong flight, I was carried off the plane by EMTs, into an ambulance, and to a local hospital. This was just before all the publicity about COVID-19/etc. And they diagnosed a different virus, one not that common in adults (I was negative for Flu A or B). I was hospitalized for a week, on oxygen, an assortment of fluids, and various monitors. I was in a "contagion precaution" room.
I'm still recovering, having difficulty walking still. I may need physical therapy, I was *so* weakened.
--> This has indeed made us VERY uneasy about COVID-19. I was MISERABLE. DH was also a wreck, with worry and lack of sleep, etc.
We are NOT happy about the possibility of going through anything even vaguely similar in the near future.

NOTE: The medical/hospital staff all wore disposable gowns, and the *medical* face masks, not the N95 respirators. Presumably, they did not want to catch what I had...
We have not seen any medical/hospital staff using N95 respirators, only the "medical masks".

RM
RM,
I haven't read all the replies here, so forgive me if I'm repeating someone else's question. However, do you suspect you may have actually had the novel coronavirus? The timing of it, your stop in Asia and the symptoms all sound somewhat suspect.
NotTooDeepLearning
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by NotTooDeepLearning »

I attempted to buy extra hand sanitizer, but my regular grocery store was out so I gave up. Other than that, I am not doing anything special for corona virus. I'm also in my twenties, so I'm apparently at little to no risk even if everyone gets it.
Jackson12
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by Jackson12 »

CalcHP12c wrote: Wed Feb 12, 2020 8:53 pm Never been a preppier before, bud admittedly refilling medications and toilet paper. Will probably buy some pantry staples too. I usually keep our cupboards fairly bare, and I’m less comfortable with that now.
I feel comfortable with our level of prep. A couple of my neighbors were frantically searching the stores for hand sanitizer and necessities just the other day. Sanitizer was all sold out, of course, as it is in many areas.
. Now they’re saying things like” We haven’t had a lot of cases in the U.S overnight” and “This is just going to blow over” .” It’s not as big a deal in the news any more so it’s no big deal ”. I don’t think they understand how diseases spread and rates of transmission, etc but I’m no epidemiologist or medical expert so I’m just waiting and watching, like so many others, to see how things develop in the days and weeks ahead.

Whatever happens, we’ve done what we can and, being in a higher risk age group, we feel better for having purchased extra meds and supplies and come up with a game plan if cases soar in our city.
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by Jack FFR1846 »

I've told my wife she can quit her job as a nurse in a rehab/nursing facility.
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alfaspider
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by alfaspider »

nonfacebookuser365 wrote: Tue Mar 03, 2020 7:46 pm Nothing too different:

Avoiding the coasts
Avoiding airports and those that travel
Avoiding interactions with foreigners
Reporting suspected carriers
So it's come to denouncing our neighbors :shock:

So are you calling up the CDC everytime you see someone cough? They don't even have enough tests available to test the folks who directly returned from Italy and China recently, and you think ratting out your neighbors is helpful? Let's get a grip people.This disease has infected less than .01% of Chinese residents and the new cases there have slowed to a trickle. Maybe it will truly get bad, but we are a LONG way from the disease itself infecting a significant number of Americans.

I am doing precisely nothing I wouldn't do already during cold and flu season. I wash my hands regularly with regular soap and water. As far as I know, soap isn't being hoarded yet :beer
surfstar
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by surfstar »

alfaspider wrote: Thu Mar 05, 2020 1:22 pm
nonfacebookuser365 wrote: Tue Mar 03, 2020 7:46 pm Nothing too different:

Avoiding the coasts
Avoiding airports and those that travel
Avoiding interactions with foreigners
Reporting suspected carriers
So it's come to denouncing our neighbors :shock:

So are you calling up the CDC everytime you see someone cough? They don't even have enough tests available to test the folks who directly returned from Italy and China recently, and you think ratting out your neighbors is helpful? Let's get a grip people.
I see a specific "lean" based on "avoiding the coasts" and "foreigners", which leads one to have a good suspicion of what is meant by "reporting suspected carriers" and it sounds racist to anyone who can read between the lines.
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by abuss368 »

We are simply tuning out the noise.
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iamlucky13
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by iamlucky13 »

surfstar wrote: Thu Mar 05, 2020 2:04 pm
alfaspider wrote: Thu Mar 05, 2020 1:22 pm
nonfacebookuser365 wrote: Tue Mar 03, 2020 7:46 pm Nothing too different:

Avoiding the coasts
Avoiding airports and those that travel
Avoiding interactions with foreigners
Reporting suspected carriers
So it's come to denouncing our neighbors :shock:

So are you calling up the CDC everytime you see someone cough? They don't even have enough tests available to test the folks who directly returned from Italy and China recently, and you think ratting out your neighbors is helpful? Let's get a grip people.
I see a specific "lean" based on "avoiding the coasts" and "foreigners", which leads one to have a good suspicion of what is meant by "reporting suspected carriers" and it sounds racist to anyone who can read between the lines.
I try not to make presumptions about people's motives, but I do see the concern.

As a counterexample of the similar action with clearly a different motive: I was a bit surprised a few weeks ago when a Chinese coworker of mine told me he is avoiding Chinese restaurants due to the virus. His response is myopically reactionary with national or ethnic origin as a basis, but it's not racist in the sense of being a general bias based on racial or ethnic heritage.
M.Lee
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by M.Lee »

I'm looking for suggestions on what kinds of food to stock up on. I don't care about toilet paper and stuff like that. Only food that isn't perishable. I have enough frozen vegetables and frozen fruit. I have cereal, crackers, cheese, canned tuna. But that stuff goes fast. If I'm stuck here for a month, I don't know if I can buy enough to last.
jacksonm
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by jacksonm »

iamlucky13 wrote: Thu Mar 05, 2020 2:16 pm As a counterexample of the similar action with clearly a different motive: I was a bit surprised a few weeks ago when a Chinese coworker of mine told me he is avoiding Chinese restaurants due to the virus. His response is myopically reactionary with national or ethnic origin as a basis, but it's not racist in the sense of being a general bias based on racial or ethnic heritage.
If you had lived in South America when the Spanish explorers/conquistadors arrived, it would have been prudent, in hindsight, to avoid contact with the foreigners at all costs. Unfortunately, the way that diseases spread was still a mystery back then and the whole continent was decimated by smallpox and other diseases.

Didn't necessarily have anything to do with race though it's easy to see why people would believe that. I'm pretty sure viruses don't have any knowledge of the race of their victim and don't care. They only care whether the host has developed immunity or not and since races tend to clump together in groups it shouldn't be surprising to see racial differences when it comes to immunity to disease.

Having said that, we have a lot more knowledge today and avoiding Chinese or any other ethnic type restaurants in America sure sounds like an ignorant over-reaction.

Now, going on a cruise right now? Count me out.
KlangFool
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by KlangFool »

M.Lee wrote: Thu Mar 05, 2020 2:37 pm I'm looking for suggestions on what kinds of food to stock up on. I don't care about toilet paper and stuff like that. Only food that isn't perishable. I have enough frozen vegetables and frozen fruit. I have cereal, crackers, cheese, canned tuna. But that stuff goes fast. If I'm stuck here for a month, I don't know if I can buy enough to last.
A bag of rice lasts forever.

KlangFool
Irisheyes
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by Irisheyes »

M.Lee wrote: Thu Mar 05, 2020 2:37 pm I'm looking for suggestions on what kinds of food to stock up on. I don't care about toilet paper and stuff like that. Only food that isn't perishable. I have enough frozen vegetables and frozen fruit. I have cereal, crackers, cheese, canned tuna. But that stuff goes fast. If I'm stuck here for a month, I don't know if I can buy enough to last.
Peanut butter. Dried beans. Milk powder. Pancake mix. Maple syrup. Canned tomatos. Pasta. Garlic bulbs (gotta have something with flavor).

And lots of wine (which is what the medieval nuns drank because it was far more sanitary than the water)

No word on what they substituted for TP though :happy
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by stoptothink »

KlangFool wrote: Thu Mar 05, 2020 2:50 pm
M.Lee wrote: Thu Mar 05, 2020 2:37 pm I'm looking for suggestions on what kinds of food to stock up on. I don't care about toilet paper and stuff like that. Only food that isn't perishable. I have enough frozen vegetables and frozen fruit. I have cereal, crackers, cheese, canned tuna. But that stuff goes fast. If I'm stuck here for a month, I don't know if I can buy enough to last.
A bag of rice lasts forever.

KlangFool
...and is sold out EVERYWHERE. I didn't realize people eat a whole lot of rice, but it was indeed sold out when I went grocery shopping yesterday (along with bottled water, TP, and a lot of canned goods) and I've heard similar from several other people.
KlangFool
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by KlangFool »

stoptothink wrote: Thu Mar 05, 2020 3:24 pm
KlangFool wrote: Thu Mar 05, 2020 2:50 pm
M.Lee wrote: Thu Mar 05, 2020 2:37 pm I'm looking for suggestions on what kinds of food to stock up on. I don't care about toilet paper and stuff like that. Only food that isn't perishable. I have enough frozen vegetables and frozen fruit. I have cereal, crackers, cheese, canned tuna. But that stuff goes fast. If I'm stuck here for a month, I don't know if I can buy enough to last.
A bag of rice lasts forever.

KlangFool
...and is sold out EVERYWHERE. I didn't realize people eat a whole lot of rice, but it was indeed sold out when I went grocery shopping yesterday (along with bottled water, TP, and a lot of canned goods) and I've heard similar from several other people.
stoptothink,

No, people do not eat a lot of rice. Hence, a bag of rice can feed a family for a very long time. And, no refrigeration is required. And, it can be kept for a very long time.

KlangFool
stoptothink
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by stoptothink »

KlangFool wrote: Thu Mar 05, 2020 3:36 pm
stoptothink wrote: Thu Mar 05, 2020 3:24 pm
KlangFool wrote: Thu Mar 05, 2020 2:50 pm
M.Lee wrote: Thu Mar 05, 2020 2:37 pm I'm looking for suggestions on what kinds of food to stock up on. I don't care about toilet paper and stuff like that. Only food that isn't perishable. I have enough frozen vegetables and frozen fruit. I have cereal, crackers, cheese, canned tuna. But that stuff goes fast. If I'm stuck here for a month, I don't know if I can buy enough to last.
A bag of rice lasts forever.

KlangFool
...and is sold out EVERYWHERE. I didn't realize people eat a whole lot of rice, but it was indeed sold out when I went grocery shopping yesterday (along with bottled water, TP, and a lot of canned goods) and I've heard similar from several other people.
stoptothink,

No, people do not eat a lot of rice. Hence, a bag of rice can feed a family for a very long time. And, no refrigeration is required. And, it can be kept for a very long time.

KlangFool
I don't think I've ever actually purchased rice. My kids may have never even eaten it.
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Watty
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by Watty »

M.Lee wrote: Thu Mar 05, 2020 2:37 pm I'm looking for suggestions on what kinds of food to stock up on. I don't care about toilet paper and stuff like that. Only food that isn't perishable. I have enough frozen vegetables and frozen fruit. I have cereal, crackers, cheese, canned tuna. But that stuff goes fast. If I'm stuck here for a month, I don't know if I can buy enough to last.
The best things to get are what you normally eat but you would want to check the expiration date so that it does not expire too soon. Other than dairy products in your refrigerator most dates on foods are really just "best by" dates and the food will still be safe to eat long after the "best by date" but the texture and flavor might not be as good. You can use Google to get more information on how long food will really last.

Your electricity is unlikely to go out so you can stock up your freezer too.

You might want to consider taking a daily multivitamin and check to see that it provides Vitamin C since you not not be getting much fresh fruit or vegetables. Also make sure that you have any normal over the counter medicines that you normally use especially Tylenol and Ibuprofen that may help with a fever. Make sure that you have a working thermometer too.

Non-instant oatmeal will last a long time so that is one thing to consider getting some since it is inexpensive and if you have the right toppings it tastes good.

Brown rice is better for you but it does not have a long shelf life if you just keep in the pantry so get other types of rice.

Getting enough calories is not that hard but also plan on getting some protein from things like beans, canned tuna, canned chicken, peanut butter, canned ham, etc.

While not a real necessity having things like coffee, chocolate, brownie mix, cookie mix, etc are also good to have to help keep your moral up. Read the ingredients since some of these may require eggs and butter but you can find some that don't.
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TomatoTomahto
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by TomatoTomahto »

TheTimeLord wrote: Wed Mar 04, 2020 9:37 pm I bought water.
My wife and I kid each other that, aside from food, we are ready for a long duration confinement during a zombie apocalypse.

Washlet toilets
Well water
Septic
Geothermal heating and cooling
Electric car
Solar panels
32 kw Batteries
If grid is out, batteries drained, and sun doesn’t shine, 8kw propane generator can keep us limping along
Enough meds to last a long time, but not forever.

I think next year, I should grow food.
Okay, I get it; I won't be political or controversial. The Earth is flat.
Caduceus
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by Caduceus »

I haven't prepared at all compared to people on this thread. I bought a couple bottles of normal hand-wash (I read that it really doesn't matter if it's anti-bacterial since it's a virus) and some Clorox wipes. That's it. No extra toilet paper, or canned food or bottled water, or anything like that.

I've been spending every spare minute I have frantically studying annual reports trying to decide which stocks to pick up on the cheap.

It's my first experience watching money evaporate shortly after you put it in, and it's strangely exciting.

I can't help feeling that if not for the deaths that would be caused by the virus, mass quarantines would be a little fun. Communicating with your neighbors using flash-light signals. Living in the dark on candle-light because electricity is out. Rationing water and food because you can't go out. I read that in China, people would organize online gatherings where they'd dance together via webcam or play games together with new online friends.
ponyboy
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by ponyboy »

I said it when coronavirus was first announced, and ill say it again. Everyone is tough when they're in the comfort of their protected bubble. When this virus gets inside the bubble of your town/city...we'll see how people react then. I love the human psychology of all of this. Brings out the best/worst of our species.

I stocked up on a couple random things, nothing major. Its going to be widespread and im guessing this whole "quarantine" thing will be pointless since most of us will have it.
halfnine
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by halfnine »

I don't think most people truly understand how fast your food stores disappear when you are eating them. For reference, in a month my family would go through 150 lbs of dry food (or 120 lbs of peanut butter).

And, I don't think people truly appreciate how heavy water really is until they have to carry it. But, that is a different story.
iamlucky13
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by iamlucky13 »

TomatoTomahto wrote: Thu Mar 05, 2020 4:13 pm If grid is out, batteries drained, and sun doesn’t shine, 8kw propane generator can keep us limping along
On the one hand, this is an superb level of general catastrophic disaster preparedness. If there's a supervolcano, a giant tsunami, solar storm exceeding at least the last 150 years of precedence, or an asteroid impact, you're well within the 99th percentile for readiness.

On the other hand, the grid is not susceptible to coronavirus.

If the 2% death rate holds even as we gain enough surveillance to understand how many people have minor or no symptoms, the potential grid impacts would be the quarantines. That 2% is heavily biased towards those who are past working age - the mortality observed so far is 8% of patients older than 70, and 3.6% of those from 60-70, but 1.3% from 50-60 and less than 0.5% for everyone younger.

Even should countries like the US enact extremely severe quarantines, I guarantee there will be exceptions to ensure those who provide critical services like operating power plants and the electrical grid (not to mention health care providers, emergency responders, and at least a portion of transportation industry) can do their jobs.
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JoeRetire
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by JoeRetire »

F150HD wrote: Tue Mar 03, 2020 7:34 pm
M.Lee wrote: Mon Mar 02, 2020 8:50 am Interesting about the Wegman's clerk. Wegman's is my favorite store but it's 20 miles away. I would 'guess' that products like TP and cleaning supplies cost more at Wegman's and there isn't a large selection of them. I am fortunately not on a budget when it comes to grocery shopping, so I shop in speciality type markets. I went yesterday and had no problem stocking up on TP, Paper Towels, Clorox, etc. I'm a retired senior and now I do not have to leave my property for a couple weeks, so I guess that makes me relatively safe from the virus.
unless the products you bought were shipped or stocked by someone w/ the virus. Or if you get any mail which is touched by any number of people. :D
We shouldn't touch any mail? :shock:

I guess I need to watch a few Walking Dead episodes for pointers...
It's the end of the world as we know it. | It's the end of the world as we know it. | It's the end of the world as we know it. | And I feel fine.
smitcat
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by smitcat »

TomatoTomahto wrote: Thu Mar 05, 2020 4:13 pm
TheTimeLord wrote: Wed Mar 04, 2020 9:37 pm I bought water.
My wife and I kid each other that, aside from food, we are ready for a long duration confinement during a zombie apocalypse.

Washlet toilets
Well water
Septic
Geothermal heating and cooling
Electric car
Solar panels
32 kw Batteries
If grid is out, batteries drained, and sun doesn’t shine, 8kw propane generator can keep us limping along
Enough meds to last a long time, but not forever.

I think next year, I should grow food.
If you actually think this is necessary the next step is to be able to defend your position.
iamlucky13
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by iamlucky13 »

halfnine wrote: Thu Mar 05, 2020 5:07 pm I don't think most people truly understand how fast your food stores disappear when you are eating them. For reference, in a month my family would go through 150 lbs of dry food (or 120 lbs of peanut butter).

And, I don't think people truly appreciate how heavy water really is until they have to carry it. But, that is a different story.
Water is definitely a different story, unless coronavirus evolves to learn how to sabotage our water supplies.

In the same vein as my previous post, how long are people expecting to go without food as a result of this outbreak?

Is it really the expectation that authorities are going to cut off our access to food so that the 90% or more of people who don't have more than a couple days worth of food on hand starve to death in order to save us from a high end estimate of ~2% risk of death from illness?
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Watty
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by Watty »

iamlucky13 wrote: Thu Mar 05, 2020 5:38 pm In the same vein as my previous post, how long are people expecting to go without food as a result of this outbreak?

Is it really the expectation that authorities are going to cut off our access to food so that the 90% or more of people who don't have more than a couple days worth of food on hand starve to death in order to save us from a high end estimate of ~2% risk of death from illness?
My concern is not so much that there will not be food that would be available to purchase, it is that by going out to buy the food maybe twice a week you would have a lot more risk of exposure to the virus.

There is also some risk that the supply chain will have problems if people like truck drivers, store clerks, and warehouse people are either out sick or not going into work.
Last edited by Watty on Thu Mar 05, 2020 5:48 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Broken Man 1999
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by Broken Man 1999 »

halfnine wrote: Thu Mar 05, 2020 5:07 pm I don't think most people truly understand how fast your food stores disappear when you are eating them. For reference, in a month my family would go through 150 lbs of dry food (or 120 lbs of peanut butter).

And, I don't think people truly appreciate how heavy water really is until they have to carry it. But, that is a different story.
120 pounds of peanut butter? Good grief! That is a significant amount of peanut butter.

I eat oatmeal 5 of 7 mornings, with a large spoonful of peanut butter, some raisins, and cinnamon.

Fortunately I have an open 40oz jar, and two more 40oz jars in the pantry I picked up during a Costco run a couple of weeks ago. So I'm good for awhile if a run on peanut butter develops.

I had peanut butter and grape jam on toast for most of my youth for breakfast. Back in the old days you had to stir the peanut butter because of the oil on the top.

Still a favorite of mine, in fact I think I will have a peanut butter sandwich for dinner tonignt! Yum!

Broken Man 1999
“If I cannot drink Bourbon and smoke cigars in Heaven then I shall not go. " -Mark Twain
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