Upgrading a PC, am I spending too much in too little time?

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BogleMelon
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Upgrading a PC, am I spending too much in too little time?

Post by BogleMelon »

I have just ordered a Samsung EVO SSD 1 Terabyte for my 7 years old desktop.
Before that, I got a new power supply ($80-ish) and anther 8GB ram ($35) (now the total is 16 GB ram)
I do games, and one day that used to be a gaming machine. Not anymore due to my outdated graphic card (Nvidia GTX 660 - 2GB Ram).

I already have a functioning 1 Terabyte HDD. So when the SSD arrives, I would clone everything over to the new SSD.

My questions:
- If I kept the HDD connecting while making the SSD the primary drive, would the connecting HDD slow down the entire machine just by being connecting?
- Is it really worth it to spend around $150 for a 1 Terabyte SSD, given that there were cheaper options (i.e: Crucial) in the market or lower capacity (i.e: 500GB) (But then I wouldn't be able to clone to a lower capacity drive)?
- Almost the majority saying this is the best upgrade one could do to a computer, would I really feel a difference that worth the $150 I paid? When I doubled the rams, I didn't find the change in speed noticeable. Only 1 game felt the difference.
- PC Gamers: Should I wait a bit for the services like Google Stadia to be out there and utilizing the new gaming platform generations? Or I should start considering upgrading the graphic card as well? I tried a game before on Google when it was experimental, and I liked playing that game on their servers so much. No issues, high quality always, fast to load..etc

ETA:
For those who ask about the rest of the specs:
- Intel Core i5 4670
- Gigabyte Z87-HD3 (Updated bios to F8 version)
- DDR3 Ram. 16GB as mentioned above
The rest was already mentioned.

Thank you!
Last edited by BogleMelon on Tue Aug 06, 2019 5:39 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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mighty72
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Re: Upgrading a PC, am I spending too much in too little time?

Post by mighty72 »

1. Install the OS on the SSD and use HDD for storage. You should see improvement in usage where you don't require a lot of data access. Your boot time will improve for sure.
2. What do you need 1 TB for? If you are going to use the HDD to store your media and data files, 500gb is enough
3. As I mentioned in 1, you would see improvement. How much depends on your usage.
adamthesmythe
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Re: Upgrading a PC, am I spending too much in too little time?

Post by adamthesmythe »

The big win is from installing the operating system AND applications on the SSD.

In most cases using the HD for data will not make much difference to the apparent speed of the system. Now if you regularly read multi-GB data files it could be a different story.

Most of us can fit the OS + applications on a 500 MB SSD.
megabad
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Re: Upgrading a PC, am I spending too much in too little time?

Post by megabad »

BogleMelon wrote: Tue Aug 06, 2019 4:06 pm My questions:
- If I kept the HDD connecting while making the SSD the primary drive, would the connecting HDD slow down the entire machine just by being connecting?
I am assuming you are going to format the HDD eventually and have WIndows and the page file and all your apps reside on the SSD? If so, you shouldn't much negative impact having the HDD attached as long as you aren't reading/writing to it. I had an old 5400 rpm HDD as an extra drive in my desktop and it runs super fast on my new SSD. I can't speak to games but Lightroom runs way faster.
- Is it really worth it to spend around $150 for a 1 Terabyte SSD, given that there were cheaper options (i.e: Crucial) in the market or lower capacity (i.e: 500GB) (But then I wouldn't be able to clone to a lower capacity drive)?
I am not sure why you want to clone the drive so I can't comment. However, I would say a modern gamer would need at least 1TB. My rather dated gaming library is about this size. I can't imagine if I had more modern games installed. In addition I have several terabytes of photos, video, music, and media. All this goes on my SSD when I work on it, and then back on my older HDDs when I store the final product. Basically I need at least 1TB personally.
- Almost the majority saying this is the best upgrade one could do to a computer, would I really feel a difference that worth the $150 I paid? When I doubled the rams, I didn't find the change in speed noticeable. Only 1 game felt the difference.
I would think in most games, by far the most noticeable change would be with a graphics card upgrade. I don't know of many games that really actively use all processor cores, full hard drive bandwidth, all memory, etc. The graphics card usually handles the most intense work (or at least it has in the past). Of course, a brand new graphics card really only benefits the games of its generation. So its usefulness is limited if you are running Oregon Trail.
- PC Gamers: Should I wait a bit for the services like Google Stadia to be out there and utilizing the new gaming platform generations? Or I should start considering upgrading the graphic card as well? I tried a game before on Google when it was experimental, and I liked playing that game on their servers so much. No issues, high quality always, fast to load..etc
It may date me to admit this but I have no idea what Stadia is. I am from the Doom/Halflife/Starcraft era where I had to lug a PC around and connect to LAN via CAT5. In the past 20 years or so, I haven't had much time to game but I am sure the latest games would amaze me.
nguy44
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Re: Upgrading a PC, am I spending too much in too little time?

Post by nguy44 »

1. The OS on your SSD is better, since it will be accessed more than your data. I would also install your frequently used programs on the SSD as well, but keep your data on the HDD.
2. $150 for a 1TB SSD seems high, Amazon has it for $139 (free shipping of prime), and other good brands (Crucial, Sandisk, etc.) are a lot less. I assuming this is 2.5 inch form factor and not M.2?
3. Given the age of your machine (you did not mention the processor type) and already being at 16GB RAM, this is the best option for improving performance, other than a processor/MB upgrade.
4. Not a gamer, I cannot answer this one.
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jimmyq
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Re: Upgrading a PC, am I spending too much in too little time?

Post by jimmyq »

For gaming, the SSD will really speed up load times of new levels. I had one game (can't remember which) that would show game tips whenever a new level loaded, but the level loaded so quickly that I didn't have the time to read the tip before the screen went away. That's a good problem to have, in my book.
02nz
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Re: Upgrading a PC, am I spending too much in too little time?

Post by 02nz »

An SSD is the single biggest upgrade you can make. Going from an HDD to SSD It makes a much bigger difference in perceived speed/responsiveness than even, say, going from a 5-year-old Core i3 processor to the latest and greatest Core i7.

I agree with another poster about using the SSD for the OS (C Drive) and putting all your photos, videos, music, etc. on the HDD. No, it won't make the system slower (except when the system is waiting on the HDD to retrieve the file you stored there).

The sweet spot for SSDs right now is 500/512GB. You can get a fast one (PCIe NVME are the fastest, but your motherboard needs to have an M.2 slot that supports NVME, not all do) for about $60-70. I recommend Western Digital SN500 and HP EX920. Samsung 970 EVO will be a bit faster, but not noticeable except in benchmarks, and the price premium is significant.

If you choose a 2.5-inch SATA SSD, there's even less difference in performance, the bottleneck is the SATA interface. In that case paying a premium for Samsung makes even less sense. Crucial and Western Digital are cheaper and perfectly reliable.
KlangFool
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Re: Upgrading a PC, am I spending too much in too little time?

Post by KlangFool »

OP,

I have no idea why you spend all those extra money on upgrading an old computer. Did you calculate how much it costs to buy a new computer instead? It seems like you had spent too much upgrading your old computer.

KlangFool
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BogleMelon
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Re: Upgrading a PC, am I spending too much in too little time?

Post by BogleMelon »

KlangFool wrote: Tue Aug 06, 2019 4:56 pm OP,

I have no idea why you spend all those extra money on upgrading an old computer. Did you calculate how much it costs to buy a new computer instead? It seems like you had spent too much upgrading your old computer.

KlangFool
Let me see.. I spent so far around $270 to upgrade it.
Now I have a semi-gaming machine (runs all 2019 games on medium graphic settings) with a good quality power supply, and Samsung 1 T SSD.
How much would a semi-gaming machine cost today? If you are talking about those built by Walmart, they are poorly built. You will get sluggish power supply (had this before and caused me issues, so no thanks) and HDD. If you are talking about good ones, they would cost for sure more than $270
"One of the funny things about stock market, every time one is buying another is selling, and both think they are astute" - William Feather
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BogleMelon
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Re: Upgrading a PC, am I spending too much in too little time?

Post by BogleMelon »

nguy44 wrote: Tue Aug 06, 2019 4:48 pm
2. $150 for a 1TB SSD seems high, Amazon has it for $139 (free shipping of prime)
Thank you. I got it for that price indeed. I needed a mount, then paid taxes.
I was about to buy Crucial but the reviews on their customer service if warranty was needed wasn't so encouraging.
"One of the funny things about stock market, every time one is buying another is selling, and both think they are astute" - William Feather
mhalley
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Re: Upgrading a PC, am I spending too much in too little time?

Post by mhalley »

You don’t give the specs on the rest of the pc, so hard to say if it is worthwhile to upgrade. Even the cheapest pc you could buy right now will probably outperform the old one, unless maybe it was top tier when you bought it. It used to be you really had to upgrade or get a new pc every 2-3 years, but I think that stopped being the case about 8 yrs ago. You can probably get a couple more years out of it. That being said, I upgraded my old one several years ago and it still runs great. I haven’t tried any of the latest games tho.
I switched from pc to console gaming several years ago. I still miss the mouse and keyboard, but I don’t miss trying to trouble shoot why my game isn’t working on my hardware. I also miss the higher graphics you can get on a pc. If yo7 got a new graphics card now, you could move it to a new pc in a couple years, but I don’t think I would throw any more money at the old one. You could prbly get a very nice gaming rig for 700 or so.
The new Xbox and ps will be out next year, so I don’t think I would buy one of those now, but the stadia looks interesting if you have a robust internet.
Last edited by mhalley on Tue Aug 06, 2019 5:42 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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BogleMelon
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Re: Upgrading a PC, am I spending too much in too little time?

Post by BogleMelon »

For those who ask about the rest of the specs:
- Intel Core i5 4670
- Gigabyte Z87-HD3 (Updated bios to F8 version)
- DDR3 Ram. 16GB as mentioned above
The rest was already mentioned.
"One of the funny things about stock market, every time one is buying another is selling, and both think they are astute" - William Feather
ipabrewer
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Re: Upgrading a PC, am I spending too much in too little time?

Post by ipabrewer »

If you add an ssd to your system, the computer performance will improve a lot. Definitely worth it the upgrade, but like other said, probably don't need 1 Tb, and you can use the HD as storage without impacting system's performance. Video card might be a more important upgrade for you, since you said you are a gamer, but if you were not gaming ssd would be the best upgrade for an old system. I upgraded all my computers to ssd's, and the performance boost is huge. Definitely a necessary upgrade nowadays, if you ask me. Good luck.
bloom2708
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Re: Upgrading a PC, am I spending too much in too little time?

Post by bloom2708 »

Isn't the processor, RAM, motherboard (and fatherboard) and graphics card all 7 years old as well? That is 14 internet years old.

If you are a PC builder, just keep updating all the components. I know form factors change, cases, case fans change and are quieter.

I guess try each incremental upgrade and see the effect. If this is a primary hobby, spend as much as you want to spend.
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HEDGEFUNDIE
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Re: Upgrading a PC, am I spending too much in too little time?

Post by HEDGEFUNDIE »

I would not spend a single penny on on-prem HW, even for personal gaming.

Google Stadia is already following proven tech (look up “OnLive”). In 5 years the majority of games will be streamed. Gaming is simply following the same evolution that video and music went through.

Invest your money in a Fiber connection instead.
BlueCable
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Re: Upgrading a PC, am I spending too much in too little time?

Post by BlueCable »

You might be able to spend another $70 or so to buy a used GTX 960 or similar on eBay. That would probably increase your graphics capability about 50%. Any more GPU would be bottlenecked by your CPU.
ernieM
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Re: Upgrading a PC, am I spending too much in too little time?

Post by ernieM »

The SSD is certainly a worthwhile upgrade.....games will load much faster, as should everything else. My first thought looking at the specs was the (as you noted) outdated graphics card......that's certainly worth an upgrade as well, but (as the poster above noted) determine your bottleneck before deciding how far to upgrade.
Momus
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Re: Upgrading a PC, am I spending too much in too little time?

Post by Momus »

Just get this, it will last at least another 5-7 years for 4k gaming... About $1550 after 8% cash back with befrugal + 5% back with discover. Sell your old parts at eBay.

https://slickdeals.net/share/android_app/t/13291042

Deal will be gone quick, less than 24h, I bet...

660 vs 2080ti
https://gpu.userbenchmark.com/Compare/N ... 4027vs2162
bob60014
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Re: Upgrading a PC, am I spending too much in too little time?

Post by bob60014 »

I'm willing to bet the motherboard is creating the main bottleneck in the system. I wouldnt be dumping any money into this.
froman118
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Re: Upgrading a PC, am I spending too much in too little time?

Post by froman118 »

If you upgrade your video card you'll have a very capable 1080p gaming machine. CPU is on the older side, but for less serious gaming or cpu intensive workloads you're fine. I'm running an older i7 4790 with 8GB. Just upgraded to a Nvidia 1660 Ti and I should be good for another 4-5 years. Maybe CPU/Mobo/Memory upgrade in 2 years would put me at a 7 year refresh cycle on those core components.
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mmmodem
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Re: Upgrading a PC, am I spending too much in too little time?

Post by mmmodem »

If the goal was to increase gaming performance, you'd have been better off getting a new video card like an Radeon RX 580 or Geforce GTX 1060 and a 250 or 500 GB SSD for the same money. If absolute gaming performance is what you seek, then for <$270, you can get a GTX 1660 and that would be all you need. The SSD only improves loading times and won't help much for gaming.

Likewise, 16 GB of RAM doesn't really help you much because the bottleneck is on the GPU and not memory. 8 gb is all you need for this system. If you had a faster CPU paired with a faster GPU, then 16 GB may make a difference.

Google Stadia uses up too much data. You will easily exceed your data cap if your ISP imposes one unless you choose 720p.

The HDD won't slow down your system.

Ignore comments on your system being old. If you intend to game at 1080p, your system has lots of life left in it.
seppatown
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Re: Upgrading a PC, am I spending too much in too little time?

Post by seppatown »

I see some good answers, some bad answers, and some unanswered questions.

1. If you clone your HDD onto your SSD and set the SSD as the new boot drive, your old HDD will NOT slow down your system as long as you are accessing files from the SSD. Under your new setup, your new SSD will be used for the OS, apps, and frequently accessed files. Your old HDD will be used for storage - primarily of large media files. Most media files won't benefit from the higher read speed.

2. You really don't need a 1tb SSD. 512gb (or even 256gb) will be enough, depending on how many games you want to keep on hand at any time. Remember, you'll be realizing the bulk of the benefits by booting OS and apps from the SSD - not media. Loading a 4gb compressed movie from your SSD will be no different than loading it from your HDD, except cost/gb is much higher on one than another. Speaking of costs - no need to go with the evo 860. The crucial mx500 1tb is only $100 and you won't notice any difference.

3. Your RAM upgrade was a good idea. RAM is cheap right now, your antiquated DDR3 RAM will only get more expensive, and 8gb -> 16gb does yield benefits in modern games and browser usage.

4. GPUs prices are reasonable right now, and as many others have pointed out, you can get a lot out of a low cost upgrade. If you are playing old games, don't bother. But if you are experiencing frame-rate issues anywhere, the GTX 970 is only $100 used right now and can't be beat on dollar-for-dollar value. Don't buy the 1660 or 1060 - they are double the cost for equivalent performance on most games. The 970 draws the same amount of power and is 2x as fast as your 660.

5. Why did you upgrade your power supply? CPUs and GPUs are getting more and more power-efficient, and nothing else in your build indicated a need to upgrade. If you were sitting at anything >=400w previously, you were 100% okay. Switching to a higher capacity PSU can actually increase your electric costs since an underloaded PSU is less efficient. Manufacturers want consumers to go for the 1000W beasts but there's rarely any use case that justifies the expense. Smaller is better.

6. Don't worry about comments telling you to upgrade your CPU. Yes - it's old. No - it's not outdated. It's 4 cores with a high clock rate. On sustained loads, it will outperform 99.9% of 2019 laptops. Your CPU will serve you wonderfully for most applications into the next 10 years.
rj342
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Re: Upgrading a PC, am I spending too much in too little time?

Post by rj342 »

FWIW the SSD does NOT have to be the same size as the HDD you are cloning. The cloning software now is smart enough to clone based on the amount of data on the HDD (if it is less than the size of the target SSD). I have done it.
Copy photos, videos, music, games. etc, all the sort of stuff you would keep on the HDD just fine, to an external drive or DVDs, whatever to get the data size down, so that drive mostly has just Windows itself and installed applications.
Clone that to the SSD, and have it be the new boot drive. Once satisfied (keep the original HDD as-is a while for backup), then add the HDD back as 2nd disk, wipe it, and restore your backed up data to it.

re CPU -- Don't sweat trying to get an older i7 that can work in your old motherboard. Assuming similar clock speed to you i5, the i7 just adds some more virtual cores --but they both have 4 *real* cores. And most games can only use a single core anyway.

Re video card, I got a great deal on a 1050 Ti SC a year or so ago. Usually sweet spot IMO for a video card is $100-$150. Any more and you really start hitting diminishing returns on added performance vs added $$. Your old motherboards PCI Express slot, 2x or 3x, may limit what you can get out of a newer video card anyway. DO pay attention whether or not the replacement card needs the supplemental power connector. Usually the half slot cards don't.
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BogleMelon
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Re: Upgrading a PC, am I spending too much in too little time?

Post by BogleMelon »

rj342 wrote: Wed Aug 07, 2019 2:06 pm FWIW the SSD does NOT have to be the same size as the HDD you are cloning. The cloning software now is smart enough to clone based on the amount of data on the HDD (if it is less than the size of the target SSD). I have done it.
Copy photos, videos, music, games. etc, all the sort of stuff you would keep on the HDD just fine, to an external drive or DVDs, whatever to get the data size down, so that drive mostly has just Windows itself and installed applications.
Clone that to the SSD, and have it be the new boot drive. Once satisfied (keep the original HDD as-is a while for backup), then add the HDD back as 2nd disk, wipe it, and restore your backed up data to it.

re CPU -- Don't sweat trying to get an older i7 that can work in your old motherboard. Assuming similar clock speed to you i5, the i7 just adds some more virtual cores --but they both have 4 *real* cores. And most games can only use a single core anyway.

Re video card, I got a great deal on a 1050 Ti SC a year or so ago. Usually sweet spot IMO for a video card is $100-$150. Any more and you really start hitting diminishing returns on added performance vs added $$. Your old motherboards PCI Express slot, 2x or 3x, may limit what you can get out of a newer video card anyway. DO pay attention whether or not the replacement card needs the supplemental power connector. Usually the half slot cards don't.
What software that you can use to clone to a smaller drive while deselecting the folders that you don't need to clone?!
"One of the funny things about stock market, every time one is buying another is selling, and both think they are astute" - William Feather
rj342
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Re: Upgrading a PC, am I spending too much in too little time?

Post by rj342 »

Cant select that way. Just need to get those folder moved on to something else so total disk used is smaller than the SSD, say by 30%. Presumably new photos etc, stuff likely to grow, going foward would go to the HDD as drive D., where you would put back the folders you moved off up above.
Note if a bunch of data files in My Documents, you need to leave that folder where it is for the clone, just move out some of its contents if needed.
Garfieldthecat
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Re: Upgrading a PC, am I spending too much in too little time?

Post by Garfieldthecat »

As a few other people mentioned, a SSD HD will make your system faster, for things like launching programs and switching active applications. It will also help with most games, but only for game loading times. It will not make your fps any faster when you are playing.

16Gig RAM is more then enough. What OS are you running? Just to make sure, is it a 64-bit OS?

Since you are keeping your old HD for storage, what are you storing on it, and how important is it to you? HD's can and will fail, so keeping important pictures or other personal files (finance, school, etc) on this HD without backing them up is dangerous.

Don't know anything about the new upcoming game streaming, but I would hold off since it is vaporware at the moment.

For gaming, that encompasses a lot of things. What games do you play, and what resolution (what is your monitor size)? The latest and greatest shooter game on a 4k monitor will need way more GPU power then playing a 10 year old RPG.
6Pack
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Re: Upgrading a PC, am I spending too much in too little time?

Post by 6Pack »

nguy44 wrote: Tue Aug 06, 2019 4:48 pm 1. The OS on your SSD is better, since it will be accessed more than your data. I would also install your frequently used programs on the SSD as well, but keep your data on the HDD.
2. $150 for a 1TB SSD seems high, Amazon has it for $139 (free shipping of prime), and other good brands (Crucial, Sandisk, etc.) are a lot less. I assuming this is 2.5 inch form factor and not M.2?
3. Given the age of your machine (you did not mention the processor type) and already being at 16GB RAM, this is the best option for improving performance, other than a processor/MB upgrade.
4. Not a gamer, I cannot answer this one.
Amazon prices seem to change daily. I got the same exact drive (Samsung EVO 1TB) on Amazon for $129 just last week. As a rule of thumb, I add stuff I want to my cart, click “Save for Later” and revisit the cart daily. Amazon will tel you of the price changed since you last looked.

With my new computer (i5-8250u CPU, 12GB of RAM and the SSD) I can load Windows in about 10 seconds from pressing the power button. Word barely shows the splash screen when loading documents from my home server.
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Re: Upgrading a PC, am I spending too much in too little time?

Post by Smoke »

6Pack wrote: Wed Aug 07, 2019 6:12 pm
nguy44 wrote: Tue Aug 06, 2019 4:48 pm 1. The OS on your SSD is better, since it will be accessed more than your data. I would also install your frequently used programs on the SSD as well, but keep your data on the HDD.
2. $150 for a 1TB SSD seems high, Amazon has it for $139 (free shipping of prime), and other good brands (Crucial, Sandisk, etc.) are a lot less. I assuming this is 2.5 inch form factor and not M.2?
3. Given the age of your machine (you did not mention the processor type) and already being at 16GB RAM, this is the best option for improving performance, other than a processor/MB upgrade.
4. Not a gamer, I cannot answer this one.
Amazon prices seem to change daily. I got the same exact drive (Samsung EVO 1TB) on Amazon for $129 just last week. As a rule of thumb, I add stuff I want to my cart, click “Save for Later” and revisit the cart daily. Amazon will tel you of the price changed since you last looked.

With my new computer (i5-8250u CPU, 12GB of RAM and the SSD) I can load Windows in about 10 seconds from pressing the power button. Word barely shows the splash screen when loading documents from my home server.
I use camelcamelcamel with amazon to set price points, when an item meets my low price point they send me an email.
https://camelcamelcamel.com/
Arguing for the sake of arguing is something I am not going to engage in.
seppatown
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Re: Upgrading a PC, am I spending too much in too little time?

Post by seppatown »

BogleMelon wrote: Wed Aug 07, 2019 2:33 pm What software that you can use to clone to a smaller drive while deselecting the folders that you don't need to clone?!
Use the free version of EaseUS Partition Manager here -

https://www.easeus.com/partition-manager/epm-free.html
naha66
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Re: Upgrading a PC, am I spending too much in too little time?

Post by naha66 »

rj342 wrote: Wed Aug 07, 2019 2:06 pm FWIW the SSD does NOT have to be the same size as the HDD you are cloning. The cloning software now is smart enough to clone based on the amount of data on the HDD (if it is less than the size of the target SSD). I have done it.
Copy photos, videos, music, games. etc, all the sort of stuff you would keep on the HDD just fine, to an external drive or DVDs, whatever to get the data size down, so that drive mostly has just Windows itself and installed applications.
Clone that to the SSD, and have it be the new boot drive. Once satisfied (keep the original HDD as-is a while for backup), then add the HDD back as 2nd disk, wipe it, and restore your backed up data to it.

re CPU -- Don't sweat trying to get an older i7 that can work in your old motherboard. Assuming similar clock speed to you i5, the i7 just adds some more virtual cores --but they both have 4 *real* cores. And most games can only use a single core anyway.

Re video card, I got a great deal on a 1050 Ti SC a year or so ago. Usually sweet spot IMO for a video card is $100-$150. Any more and you really start hitting diminishing returns on added performance vs added $$. Your old motherboards PCI Express slot, 2x or 3x, may limit what you can get out of a newer video card anyway. DO pay attention whether or not the replacement card needs the supplemental power connector. Usually the half slot cards don't.
Wow i don't know where to begin.
1. most games only use 1 core. For gaming 4 core 8 threads is required for AAA games for high or ultra settings
2. A GTX 1050 ti is now a entry level card for 1080p gaming it not a big leap in performance from your GTX 660 I would get at least a GTX 1660
3. Any more than and you start hitting diminishing returns(gtx 1050 ti) I would get at least a GTX 1660 ti or the new AMD RX 5800 8gb they have DDR6 vram.
4. Your old motherboards PCI Express slot, 2x or 3x, may limit what you can get out of a newer video card anyway. All intel motherboard still have 3.0 PCI slots, the only board that have 4.0 is AMD's new zen 2 board and they just came out last month.

Bottom line upgrade your video card,power supply and add a ssd . The good thing about those 3 item if at a later time you want a build a new PC you can use them in a new build.
mmcmonster
Posts: 502
Joined: Sun Jan 12, 2014 1:18 pm

Re: Upgrading a PC, am I spending too much in too little time?

Post by mmcmonster »

As others have mentioned, you will see a dramatic increase in overall performance by getting the SSD and putting OS and all applications on it. Any swap space and application data files (for instance, any files created by lightroom or similar programs while indexing your photos) should also be on the SSD.

The mechanical hard drive should be for photos, .mp3 files, videos, etc. Basically any data you create. Also backups of the system can go here (ie: Time Machine (if you are using MacOS)).

Do NOT create a RAID system between your SSD and mechanical hard drive. You will lose all the benefits of the SSD.
rj342
Posts: 726
Joined: Tue Apr 30, 2019 12:21 pm

Re: Upgrading a PC, am I spending too much in too little time?

Post by rj342 »

naha66 wrote: Fri Aug 09, 2019 4:13 am
rj342 wrote: Wed Aug 07, 2019 2:06 pm FWIW the SSD does NOT have to be the same size as the HDD you are cloning. The cloning software now is smart enough to clone based on the amount of data on the HDD (if it is less than the size of the target SSD). I have done it.
Copy photos, videos, music, games. etc, all the sort of stuff you would keep on the HDD just fine, to an external drive or DVDs, whatever to get the data size down, so that drive mostly has just Windows itself and installed applications.
Clone that to the SSD, and have it be the new boot drive. Once satisfied (keep the original HDD as-is a while for backup), then add the HDD back as 2nd disk, wipe it, and restore your backed up data to it.

re CPU -- Don't sweat trying to get an older i7 that can work in your old motherboard. Assuming similar clock speed to you i5, the i7 just adds some more virtual cores --but they both have 4 *real* cores. And most games can only use a single core anyway.

Re video card, I got a great deal on a 1050 Ti SC a year or so ago. Usually sweet spot IMO for a video card is $100-$150. Any more and you really start hitting diminishing returns on added performance vs added $$. Your old motherboards PCI Express slot, 2x or 3x, may limit what you can get out of a newer video card anyway. DO pay attention whether or not the replacement card needs the supplemental power connector. Usually the half slot cards don't.
Wow i don't know where to begin.
1. most games only use 1 core. For gaming 4 core 8 threads is required for AAA games for high or ultra settings
2. A GTX 1050 ti is now a entry level card for 1080p gaming it not a big leap in performance from your GTX 660 I would get at least a GTX 1660
3. Any more than and you start hitting diminishing returns(gtx 1050 ti) I would get at least a GTX 1660 ti or the new AMD RX 5800 8gb they have DDR6 vram.
4. Your old motherboards PCI Express slot, 2x or 3x, may limit what you can get out of a newer video card anyway. All intel motherboard still have 3.0 PCI slots, the only board that have 4.0 is AMD's new zen 2 board and they just came out last month.

Bottom line upgrade your video card,power supply and add a ssd . The good thing about those 3 item if at a later time you want a build a new PC you can use them in a new build.
His motherboard and CPU are SEVEN years old. Doubt hes going to be tearing it up with latest greatest AAA titles on ultra.
naha66
Posts: 198
Joined: Sun Jul 14, 2013 6:02 pm

Re: Upgrading a PC, am I spending too much in too little time?

Post by naha66 »

I said high or ultra and he said he plays on medium now with a gtx 660 so i'm sure he'll be happy with high. I just bult a new Ryzen R5 3600 system last month. I old system was I5-2500 and with a Nvidia GTX 1070 and i was able to run almost everything on 1080p high with at least 60 FPS and a i5-4670 is 20% better at gaming than a I5-2500. :sharebeer Go to youtube and you can see what a i5-4670 will do with a good card.
Last edited by naha66 on Fri Aug 09, 2019 10:34 am, edited 2 times in total.
LiterallyIronic
Posts: 1483
Joined: Sat Dec 05, 2015 10:36 am

Re: Upgrading a PC, am I spending too much in too little time?

Post by LiterallyIronic »

BogleMelon wrote: Tue Aug 06, 2019 4:06 pm
My questions:
- If I kept the HDD connecting while making the SSD the primary drive, would the connecting HDD slow down the entire machine just by being connecting?
- Is it really worth it to spend around $150 for a 1 Terabyte SSD, given that there were cheaper options (i.e: Crucial) in the market or lower capacity (i.e: 500GB) (But then I wouldn't be able to clone to a lower capacity drive)?
- Almost the majority saying this is the best upgrade one could do to a computer, would I really feel a difference that worth the $150 I paid? When I doubled the rams, I didn't find the change in speed noticeable. Only 1 game felt the difference.
- PC Gamers: Should I wait a bit for the services like Google Stadia to be out there and utilizing the new gaming platform generations? Or I should start considering upgrading the graphic card as well? I tried a game before on Google when it was experimental, and I liked playing that game on their servers so much. No issues, high quality always, fast to load..etc
1. No. I use an SSD for my boot drive and have three 2TB HDDs for data.

2. It really depends on what you want to put on that SSD. Mine's only 256GB. Has the OS, browser, Visual Studio, and my two most-played games.

3. Agreed that putting getting an SSD is the best upgrade you can do for your computer. It will boot much faster. Obviously if your objective is to upgrade "gaming" rather than "the computer", then video card is the place to throw your money. Doubling RAM from 8GB to 16GB isn't going to do a whole lot for you in most cases. 8GB is getting long-in-the-tooth, but it's still what's recommended for most games - though some are 12GB or even 16GB.

4. I would never be interested in streaming games. Internet connection goes down and now you can't play your games? No thanks. Same reason I buy physical copies of movies instead of using Netflix and use Office 2016 instead of Office 365. Gotta reduce dependencies.

My machine (built in 2016, and still has plenty of legs left):
i7 6700k
32GB DDR4-3200
GTX 1080
256GB SSD
3x 2TB HDD
850w PSU
Blu-ray drive
Win7

I play everything on ultra settings.

Why 6TB of HDD you might ask? One of the 2TB drives is for my documents, songs, etc. The other two drives are for my games. I keep all of my games installed. Hundreds of them. It's terabytes of games.
seppatown wrote: Wed Aug 07, 2019 12:58 pm 5. Why did you upgrade your power supply? CPUs and GPUs are getting more and more power-efficient, and nothing else in your build indicated a need to upgrade. If you were sitting at anything >=400w previously, you were 100% okay. Switching to a higher capacity PSU can actually increase your electric costs since an underloaded PSU is less efficient. Manufacturers want consumers to go for the 1000W beasts but there's rarely any use case that justifies the expense. Smaller is better.
Could be due to age. I wouldn't want a seven-year-old PSU powering my machine.
rj342
Posts: 726
Joined: Tue Apr 30, 2019 12:21 pm

Re: Upgrading a PC, am I spending too much in too little time?

Post by rj342 »

naha66 wrote: Fri Aug 09, 2019 9:45 am I said high or ultra and he said he plays on medium now with a gtx 660 so i'm sure he'll be happy with high. I just bult a new Ryzen R5 3600 system last month. I old system was I5-2500 and with a Nvidia GTX 1070 and i was able to run almost everything on 1080p high with at least 60 FPS and a i5-4670 is 20% better at gaming than a I5-2500. :sharebeer
Last PC I built for myself almost 2 years ago was actually first time I had ever built an Intel system. I always was an AMD guy for bang for the buck, but got convinced to get an i5 instead of paying just a bit less for an AMD cpu with more but less powerful cores. Been a great machine and still has some life (modest $$ but gets me 60fps at 1080p on about everything Im interested in at high), but with Ryzen looks like my next will be an AMD again.

Will probably do one video upgrade on current box - want to do VR for some flying/space games.
Laika
Posts: 50
Joined: Sat Jul 14, 2018 1:49 pm

Re: Upgrading a PC, am I spending too much in too little time?

Post by Laika »

BogleMelon wrote: Tue Aug 06, 2019 4:06 pm My questions:
- If I kept the HDD connecting while making the SSD the primary drive, would the connecting HDD slow down the entire machine just by being connecting?
- Is it really worth it to spend around $150 for a 1 Terabyte SSD, given that there were cheaper options (i.e: Crucial) in the market or lower capacity (i.e: 500GB) (But then I wouldn't be able to clone to a lower capacity drive)?
The only problem with having a spinning hard drive in an otherwise-SSD system is that many operating systems insist on spinning up idle hard disks when anything is being accessed anywhere. Thus, you may find yourself waiting for the disk to spin up even when you are not directly using it. I absolutely hated this and have moved to SSD-only for this reason. (You can set the spinner to just spin all the time to avoid this, but at the expense of more wear and tear, power, noise and vibration.)

Typical SSD's are faster, and it's worth it, but you quickly habituate to their speeds and subsequently decide that it's just "normal." For real speed, you want an NVMe SSD. :happy
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