PC Games

Questions on how we spend our money and our time - consumer goods and services, home and vehicle, leisure and recreational activities
Post Reply
Topic Author
Thegame14
Posts: 1809
Joined: Mon May 07, 2018 11:53 am

PC Games

Post by Thegame14 »

I refuse to spend $500 plus on a gaming system to then pay $50 per game.

Anyone have any good recommendations for city building/war single player turn based strategy games. I mostly play Civ, I bought Civ 6 deluxe but haven't played it yet, I am stuck hooked on Civ beyond Earth. Also used to enjoy Command & Conquer but bought one like 3 years ago and literally couldn't get past the tutorial so would consider going back to that.

I am thinking of buying Dawn of Man, FrostPunk, The Raft, or The Forrest. Has anyone played these?

I have bought Sim city in the past but it gets boring just adding buildings and waiting for disasters to happen. Maybe a strategy where you build a business, I like strategy and building up games, mostly to conquer the world, but would look for other turn based strategy. absolutely no interest in teaming with anyone or complicated first person shooters.

Thanks
tj218
Posts: 445
Joined: Thu Dec 20, 2007 6:27 pm

Re: PC Games

Post by tj218 »

It's not turn-based, but Europa Universalis IV is a great strategy game. You can change the speed settings, the lowest setting is pretty much turn based. If you have ever played the Total War series, EUIV is like the map portion of that game (marriages/alliances/trade). Best way I can describe it is like Risk with a lot of complexity. I found it after getting bored with the Civ series and not having the twitch reflexes to do normal RTS style games.

I will caution you that the learning curve can be a bit steep. But it is an absolutely great game.
Barsoom
Posts: 390
Joined: Thu Dec 06, 2018 9:40 am

Re: PC Games

Post by Barsoom »

You might want to try the Geopolitical Simulator line of games. The latest is Power and Revolution (Geopolitical Simulator 4 from Eversim).

It's a resource hog, been called a spreadsheet game, can be slow, but you play the leader of any country on Earth that you want, and you have to rule the country for as long as you can.

You make budget decisions, tax decisions, trade decisions, political policy decisions, military decisions, election campaign decisions, etc.

-B
rich126
Posts: 2341
Joined: Thu Mar 01, 2018 4:56 pm

Re: PC Games

Post by rich126 »

XCOM is a turn based strategy game that is excellent. Been out for a while but I still play it on my iMac. I don’t do much gaming but play that and a baseball simulation (text, not Madden like) over at imaginesports.com.
User avatar
CyberBob
Posts: 3341
Joined: Tue Feb 20, 2007 2:53 pm

Re: PC Games

Post by CyberBob »

My favorite turn-based strategy game is The Battle for Wesnoth, even though I stink at it :D
alex_686
Posts: 7510
Joined: Mon Feb 09, 2015 2:39 pm

Re: PC Games

Post by alex_686 »

TripleAAA

It is a pretty good implementation of the board game Axis and Allies, a WW II simulator. It is turned based like Civ. And it is free.
Last edited by alex_686 on Mon Mar 11, 2019 10:46 am, edited 1 time in total.
Former brokerage operations & mutual fund accountant. I hate risk, which is why I study and embrace it.
mhalley
Posts: 8678
Joined: Tue Nov 20, 2007 6:02 am

Re: PC Games

Post by mhalley »

If you want to get some cheaper pc games, get a steam account.

https://store.steampowered.com/
User avatar
Salty
Posts: 5
Joined: Thu Apr 19, 2018 12:12 am

Re: PC Games

Post by Salty »

Here are a few games I can recommend that may be close to what you are looking for:

Shogun 2 total war
Capitalism series
Prison architect
Factorio
Cities skylines

- games are one of my main hobbies :beer
User avatar
oldcomputerguy
Moderator
Posts: 9909
Joined: Sun Nov 22, 2015 6:50 am
Location: In the middle of five acres of woods in East Tennessee

Re: PC Games

Post by oldcomputerguy »

Wow, I guess I'm old. The computer games I historically enjoyed the most were the Infocom text-based adventures. I never had any desire to play shoot-em-ups.
mpklub
Posts: 6
Joined: Sun Aug 10, 2014 3:29 pm

Re: PC Games

Post by mpklub »

Consoles retail at $300 or less now and I would recommend console gaming over PC gaming for most people. With consoles you don't have to worry about your specs being outdated on your PC or the game not being able to run because of outdated specs over time (if you buy something new). You just buy a game for that system and it works. If your PC is powerful enough then it doesn't matter. Personally I don't have the patience (or arguably the intelligence) to upgrade my PC.

Sales between Sony and Microsoft are insane when it comes to games. There is never a reason to pay full price for a game in my opinion. Even new stuff usually goes on sale within a few weeks of release and $60 games can be picked up within 3 months of release for $40 or less. Collecting games is a bad habit/hobby of mine and I have built a ridiculous library that I will probably never get through. It's probably my biggest financial faux paux when it comes to my frugal/boglehead nature. But even despite that the reason I've been able to do that is because I very rarely pay full price for a game. I've acquired most games digitally for less than $10. Majority of them I have gotten for less than $5 including major releases. I picked up a digital copy of Deus Ex: Human Revolution for $1.99. I picked up a digital copy of The Witcher 2 for $3. Physical copies are cheap through amazon as well (most I have picked up under $10 except for some rare older games).

Point being that it is easier than ever to get into gaming at a price point far lower than what you are quoting. Especially if you are willing to play games a generation behind (i.e. play Xbox 360/PS3 games now and then PS4/Xbox One games when the next round of consoles comes out), which is largely what I do. When the PS5 inevitably comes out PS4 games will likely start seeing huge discounts over the next 3 or 4 years. That's when I will stock up on the games I have missed out on. In many ways video games are like cars. They lose a ton of value after their initial release. As long as you are okay waiting to play games a few months after release you should be able to get them at least 50% off. More if you wait longer. For someone like me this is perfect because I have a library of games to choose from. Very rarely do I feel the urge to buy something at release.

If you are dead set against console gaming and truly want to only game on PC I'd second whoever recommended getting a steam account. Steam sales offer massive discounts on all types of games. While I have primarily a console gamer I am getting closer and closer to building a gaming rig if only because I think it may ultimately be the best value in gaming long-term.

Sorry for the ramble, but gaming is probably my favorite hobby to I love chiming in on stuff like this.
dsmclone
Posts: 466
Joined: Fri Oct 25, 2013 8:50 am

Re: PC Games

Post by dsmclone »

I have both a PS4 and a Gaming PC. Some thing are just better on PC's and some are better on consoles. I like shooting games more on the PC, I like racing games more on the PS4, and I like strategy games like Cities/Skylines more on the PC. Really it comes down to the mouse just being better than a controller for some things otherwise I'd play everything on the PS4, which is hoked to a 120" 4k projector.
teamDE
Posts: 323
Joined: Tue Jun 28, 2016 9:16 pm

Re: PC Games

Post by teamDE »

Indeed, consoles are around $300 now and both playstation and xbox have "PS Plus" and "Gold" memberships that are pretty much required, but also provide a lot of free and discounted games.

That said, based on what you said, PC is probably where its at. Steam is the biggest marketplace has everything you can imagine. Far more strategy and simulation games than the consoles.

I've also heard that Civ6 is very good on iPad. It's the full PC game and properly ported so they say.

If you want a unique "build/sim" type game, check out Factorio on Steam. It's a game where you mine resources and build factories to automate production of more and more advanced things, eventually launching a rocket to space.
poor & ignorant soul
Posts: 9
Joined: Mon Nov 12, 2018 8:44 am

Re: PC Games

Post by poor & ignorant soul »

I'll add "They are Billions" to the list. It is part city building sim and part tower defense. It should have low system requirements.

Most of the other game recommendations here are good as well. You should look into the "4X" genera, as it matches closely with what you talked about.

The games you mentioned are usually best played on the PC, stay away from consoles unless you want to get into action games, platformers or really want that "couch experience".
Topic Author
Thegame14
Posts: 1809
Joined: Mon May 07, 2018 11:53 am

Re: PC Games

Post by Thegame14 »

poor & ignorant soul wrote: Mon Mar 11, 2019 10:11 am I'll add "They are Billions" to the list. It is part city building sim and part tower defense. It should have low system requirements.

Most of the other game recommendations here are good as well. You should look into the "4X" genera, as it matches closely with what you talked about.

The games you mentioned are usually best played on the PC, stay away from consoles unless you want to get into action games, platformers or really want that "couch experience".
what is the 4X genera?

And thank you all for the suggestions.
LiterallyIronic
Posts: 1483
Joined: Sat Dec 05, 2015 10:36 am

Re: PC Games

Post by LiterallyIronic »

Thegame14 wrote: Sun Mar 10, 2019 7:04 pm I refuse to spend $500 plus on a gaming system to then pay $50 per game.

Anyone have any good recommendations for city building/war single player turn based strategy games. I mostly play Civ, I bought Civ 6 deluxe but haven't played it yet, I am stuck hooked on Civ beyond Earth. Also used to enjoy Command & Conquer but bought one like 3 years ago and literally couldn't get past the tutorial so would consider going back to that.

I am thinking of buying Dawn of Man, FrostPunk, The Raft, or The Forrest. Has anyone played these?

I have bought Sim city in the past but it gets boring just adding buildings and waiting for disasters to happen. Maybe a strategy where you build a business, I like strategy and building up games, mostly to conquer the world, but would look for other turn based strategy. absolutely no interest in teaming with anyone or complicated first person shooters.

Thanks
I don't know what consoles you're buying. I bought a PS4 last year for $199 and it included Spiderman. I also have an NES, SNES, Nintendo64, GameCube, Wii, Wii U, Switch, Genesis, Xbox, PS1, PS2, NES Classic, and SNES Classic. And a gaming PC. The computer was, by far, the most expensive.

For city building, Sim City is the big name, but you didn't really like that one, so maybe Cities XL might have more depth to it. Or Banished, which is a city-builder set a couple hundred years ago, as it's more complex than Sim City. Age of Empires II is real-time strategy instead of turn-based, but it is more of a "building up to conquer the world" kind of game. I tried Raft a little bit, but I'm not sure how fun it would be by yourself - I think it would be better played multiplayer. But maybe that's just me. I've looked into The Forest, but it seems like it's probably inferior to 7 Days To Die. There is also The Long Dark, which is single-player man vs nature. But you can turn off the zombies in 7 Days To Die (don't know if you can in The Forest) and it becomes man vs nature.

I'm not familiar with Dawn of Man or FrostPunk.

A turn-based strategy game that gets generally favorable reviews is Xcom. I enjoyed the turn-based part of the game, but I wasn't personally a fan of the base-building part.

For building a business, there are things like Theme Hospital and the recently-released Two Point Hospital. Or Game Dev Tycoon, in which you're in charge of a game development studio. Of course, there are also the theme park builders, such as Parkitect, or there is also Prison Architect.

Just some options to look into.
Liberty1100
Posts: 254
Joined: Fri Nov 21, 2014 12:36 pm
Contact:

Re: PC Games

Post by Liberty1100 »

My recommendations:

Offworld Trading Company (economy)
Cities Skylines (city building)
Victoria II (2) (complex economy and politics)
The Tropico Series (city building with unique goals and events)
xb7
Posts: 235
Joined: Sat Jun 09, 2018 6:13 pm
Location: WA State, USA

Re: PC Games

Post by xb7 »

I've enjoyed games in the "Total War" series. You might consider getting something that's not the very latest game out via Steam. If you search for them, you might just turn up the recent ones that are indeed $50 - $60. But some of the older ones I like quite well; for example, the original Total War Rome is $10, Total War Empire is $25.

That approach in general might keep your cost down if current game prices are too offensive --- best of luck!
User avatar
Earl Lemongrab
Posts: 7270
Joined: Tue Jun 10, 2014 1:14 am

Re: PC Games

Post by Earl Lemongrab »

If you'd like a space-themed strategy game, I recommend FreeOrion. It's open-source (so the price is right :) ). It's in constant development.

https://www.freeorion.org/index.php/Main_Page
User avatar
Earl Lemongrab
Posts: 7270
Joined: Tue Jun 10, 2014 1:14 am

Re: PC Games

Post by Earl Lemongrab »

oldcomputerguy wrote: Mon Mar 11, 2019 4:45 am Wow, I guess I'm old. The computer games I historically enjoyed the most were the Infocom text-based adventures. I never had any desire to play shoot-em-ups.
Ah. Interactive Fiction went through a renaissance some years ago. Many new and innovative games were created using dedicated development systems. Many are in Z-code, the old Infocom system. If you're still interested, you can find interpeters for most computers and loads of free games.

I will say that turn-based strategy games as the OP requested are not "shoot-em-ups". Those are real-time games.
lightheir
Posts: 2546
Joined: Mon Oct 03, 2011 11:43 pm

Re: PC Games

Post by lightheir »

I think you should first go with what you have and take a deep dive (and it will be DEEP) into Civ6. It's refined, polished, balanced, and looks simplish up front but gets devilish complex once you start playing for more than a few hours.

I actually play Civ6 on a Nintendo Switch, which works remarkably well. I'm sure it's not as 'fast' running between turns as a big PC, but I've had no problems finishing long games with it.

I will also mention that despite the fact that I love videogames as an adult grown man who has played them all throughout my life (I love all of 'em - shooters, strategy, RPG, adventure, racing, fighting), I would be remiss to mention the #1 strategy game for me (by farrrrrr) that transcends all of the others, hands down:

CHESS

I suspect you'd be the type of person who would enjoy this great game a lot, as if you're running a $500 PC, you're clearly not just in it for the graphics hype.

I will note that you can't just 'play' a bunch of chess games and enjoy it right off the bat - the learning curve is steep, and you will have to watch a fair amount of youtube videos by chess experts explaining the game before you even get a clue what is going on.

However, after that:
1. It NEVER obsoletes. No 'Civ 12' to render all your hard work from learning Civ3 moot.
2. Nearly endless amounts of super-high quality literature and now video, about mastery of the game.
3. You can play fast (blitz games are under 5 minutes per side, often 1 minute per side!) or slow (weeks per game in correspondence chess)
4. Really good statistical chess ratings online and live
5. Endless online competition
6. Amazing chess computer analysis tools to see where you went wrong
7. You can go hi-tech with a powerful chess computer, or lo-tech with a board and pieces, or in between like playing/analyzing on an phone (which works incredibly well)

Can't say enough good things about chess - I listen to gaming podcasts as well, and it almost makes me sad when the reviewers rave over the latest and greatest strategy game, and when they list all the wonderful thing this new game gets right, it's pretty clear to me most of them are literally describing chess, which does most of the things they describe a lot better than that new game itself.
penguindance49
Posts: 41
Joined: Thu Aug 23, 2018 8:52 am

Re: PC Games

Post by penguindance49 »

I do agree with some posters above that a decent gaming pc set up will be more expensive than a console. I lasted ~5 years on a pre-built Dell that ran min specs on most games, and even that was ~$450 at the time. I have a cheaper gaming pc now that cost me ~$1300. I love it and I get a lot of use out of it, so it's worth it to me. I'll be able to switch out components when things start to get crappier for less than a new computer. I like pc gaming more, but purely from a cost perspective, it definitely isn't cheaper. You do get a wider variety of games though. A big name title will cost $60 on release regardless of the platform, but there are definitely a lot more smaller indie games that are well worth playing. Another vote to a Steam account... though be careful what you put on your wishlist, because you'll get emails when they're on sale, and you'll get tempted all over again.

The Forest was a great game (I watched a YouTuber play it when it was early access). It isn't a turn based, city building game like you mentioned, but there's definitely the ability to do some cool building. I thought the story was interesting and had a good twist at the end.

City Skylines is a great city builder game and gets difficult later on. Planet Coaster is a whole lotta fun, especially if you're the creative type - you can just have pre-built rides, try your hand at constructing a roller coaster, or go nuts and design every rock, plant, and bit of scenery. Start Up Company and Game Corp DX (the latter which I got on sale for like, $2) are both business tycoons I've spent a fair bit of time on. I feel like I "beat" Start Up Company fairly quickly (~10 hours) and got repetitive, but worth the ~$10 I paid. Project Highrise is another good one - puts you in charge of a building you can turn commercial or residential (or both! but it's way harder that way). Banished has you build up a village (and have you survive winters) and is incredibly difficult and I never mastered, but is still super fun. Two Point Hospital leans more towards time management, having you build up a hospital (with incredibly funny/crude humor, depending on your sense of humor). The Rebuild Series (I have Rebuild 3 on Steam, and I think I had the first one on my old Kindle) is a turn based game where you try to reclaim various cities during a zombie apocalypse. I've heard fantastic things about Darkest Dungeon, which I believe is turn based as you make your way through dungeons, but I've yet to play it myself.

I'll also throw out Stardew Valley, not because it's anything like you said you wanted but it's my absolute favorite game and I'm always eager to spread the word.
User avatar
Earl Lemongrab
Posts: 7270
Joined: Tue Jun 10, 2014 1:14 am

Re: PC Games

Post by Earl Lemongrab »

Turn-based strategy games generally don't require the kind of power that real-time first-person games with intensive graphics do.
Mister A
Posts: 132
Joined: Tue Oct 21, 2014 4:17 pm

Re: PC Games

Post by Mister A »

tj218 wrote: Sun Mar 10, 2019 7:54 pm It's not turn-based, but Europa Universalis IV is a great strategy game. You can change the speed settings, the lowest setting is pretty much turn based. If you have ever played the Total War series, EUIV is like the map portion of that game (marriages/alliances/trade). Best way I can describe it is like Risk with a lot of complexity. I found it after getting bored with the Civ series and not having the twitch reflexes to do normal RTS style games.

I will caution you that the learning curve can be a bit steep. But it is an absolutely great game.
Seconded. If you like Civ, the Paradox games (Crusader Kings II, Europa Universalis IV, Stellaris) will ruin your life.

If you enjoy the building aspect, I would also recommend RimWorld. Independent game with a cult following, gets quite dark, but tons of fun and replay value because of the variety of randomly-generated scenarios.
Trader Joe
Posts: 2097
Joined: Fri Apr 25, 2014 6:38 pm

Re: PC Games

Post by Trader Joe »

Thegame14 wrote: Sun Mar 10, 2019 7:04 pm I refuse to spend $500 plus on a gaming system to then pay $50 per game.

Anyone have any good recommendations for city building/war single player turn based strategy games. I mostly play Civ, I bought Civ 6 deluxe but haven't played it yet, I am stuck hooked on Civ beyond Earth. Also used to enjoy Command & Conquer but bought one like 3 years ago and literally couldn't get past the tutorial so would consider going back to that.

I am thinking of buying Dawn of Man, FrostPunk, The Raft, or The Forrest. Has anyone played these?

I have bought Sim city in the past but it gets boring just adding buildings and waiting for disasters to happen. Maybe a strategy where you build a business, I like strategy and building up games, mostly to conquer the world, but would look for other turn based strategy. absolutely no interest in teaming with anyone or complicated first person shooters.

Thanks
Asteroids, Galaga, etc. are always good.
User avatar
Quirkz
Posts: 466
Joined: Mon Jan 14, 2019 5:32 pm

Re: PC Games

Post by Quirkz »

If you like fantasy and don't mind an older game, the Heroes of Might and Magic series (especially 2 and 3, and then 4 and 5 if you like them) scratched a similar itch for me. I played the heck out of both those and Civ 2 back in the day.

Since the price of games was mentioned, I highly recommend GOG.com as a source. They've got a ton of DRM-free material, and if you don't mind going older, it can be extremely inexpensive to load up on games. They'll also do some recommendations, I think.
iamlucky13
Posts: 2217
Joined: Sat Mar 04, 2017 5:28 pm
Location: Western Washington

Re: PC Games

Post by iamlucky13 »

I haven't kept up with the Civilization series, because in the past, it has taken up more of my time than I can allow myself to spare, so I can't comment much on turn based strategy.

On the real-time strategy side, if you liked at least some of the Command and Conquer series, you may like Star Craft. It's been out for a while now, so the system requirements are pretty low by current standards. It can be cheesy at times, but the plot isn't bad, and I think the gameplay is really good, although can be challenging.

Another older real time strategy that I think is under-appreciated is Homeworld, which takes real-time strategy to a truly 3-D environment, along with an engaging story line similar to that of Battlestar Galactica. It came out way back in 1999 (several years before the Battlestar Galactica reboot), but was remastered in 2015.

Keep in mind, a $50 game that you play for 2 hours a week for a year has a cost to you of $0.50 an hour. It can be cheaper entertainment than renting a movie.

I'm looking at this from the perspective of a person who buys few games, but replays them a lot.
User avatar
stilts1007
Posts: 144
Joined: Fri Jan 25, 2013 12:46 pm
Location: Chicago IL

Re: PC Games

Post by stilts1007 »

I bought Civ 6 a few months ago when it was on sale on Steam & have been enjoying it. There are a bunch of fun & shorter scenarios to play when you don't feel like committing to a brand new from-scratch Civ game.

As far as turn-based strategy games, there are a lot of good RPGs out there that scratch the same itch for me as games like Civ. Divinity: Original Sin is the one I played the last few years that comes to mind immediately; there is a 2nd game in the series that I have yet to play (they're still working on a Mac-friendly version).

I have recently played a few really enjoyable games that I guess would be classified as "interactive narrative adventures?" Kind of reliving a first-person story, almost like a choose-your-own-adventure game, or an interactive movie. No fighting, some puzzles/mysteries, and when done right, they do a great job of telling a story by letting you put all the pieces together. Hard to explain, I know. The few that game to mind are Tacoma, Firewatch, and Gone Home. Not much replay value but they're reasonably priced, and really engrossing.
poor & ignorant soul
Posts: 9
Joined: Mon Nov 12, 2018 8:44 am

Re: PC Games

Post by poor & ignorant soul »

Thegame14 wrote: Mon Mar 11, 2019 10:27 am
poor & ignorant soul wrote: Mon Mar 11, 2019 10:11 am I'll add "They are Billions" to the list. It is part city building sim and part tower defense. It should have low system requirements.

Most of the other game recommendations here are good as well. You should look into the "4X" genera, as it matches closely with what you talked about.

The games you mentioned are usually best played on the PC, stay away from consoles unless you want to get into action games, platformers or really want that "couch experience".
what is the 4X genera?

And thank you all for the suggestions.
Sorry I mis-spelled "genre". 4x is a genre of game, I guess it is a subset of strategy games, Civilization in part of this genre. Here is the wikipedia entry

There is actually a Humble Bundle sale on strategy games currently. You can pick up a few games already mentioned here for cheap. (https://www.humblebundle.com/games/strategy-bundle-2019)
User avatar
Earl Lemongrab
Posts: 7270
Joined: Tue Jun 10, 2014 1:14 am

Re: PC Games

Post by Earl Lemongrab »

4X == eXplore, eXpand, eXploit, eXterminate.

The one I mentioned, FreeOrion, you start out with one planetary system and a few connections. You move out, find what's there, try to establish colonies, build ships and technology, research, meet and greet the neighbors (usually with warships).
geekpryde
Posts: 93
Joined: Mon Jun 01, 2009 2:37 pm

Re: PC Games

Post by geekpryde »

I also love the CIV series, and have a recommendation. This game is not turn based, but you can play it at your pace, single player, has a great story, extremely well reviewed, open world, has great mini-game called Gwent (which is turn based), and I personally put a few hundred hours into it and can strongly recommend it.

Witcher 3

https://thewitcher.com/en/witcher3

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Witcher_3:_Wild_Hunt

https://www.metacritic.com/game/playsta ... -wild-hunt
User avatar
queso
Posts: 987
Joined: Thu Jan 07, 2016 3:52 pm

Re: PC Games

Post by queso »

..and here I was thinking I was the only person who liked Gwent so much. I haven't finished the two expansion packs yet and it took me over a year to finish the main game because I spent so much time playing Gwent. :happy
jharkin
Posts: 2685
Joined: Mon Mar 28, 2016 7:14 am
Location: Boston suburbs

Re: PC Games

Post by jharkin »

Civ 6 should run on any moderately spec' machine. I dont have 6, but I have 5 running on a 10 year old i7 and it does just fine.... cant image 6 is that much more demanding.


On another note... I remember saving up my summer job money to buy games at $30-50 a pop... in the 90s! And the first rig I bough with my own hard earned money (a Pentium 100Mhz) in college cost something like $2800..... Personally I think all this gear is dirt cheap today.
FLSte
Posts: 7
Joined: Fri Sep 16, 2016 9:19 pm

Re: PC Games

Post by FLSte »

Endless Space is a good game similar to the Civ series. X-Com:Enemy Unknown already mentioned is a great turn based game, I haven't played X-Com 2 yet, still waiting for the price to come down. Banished I thought was OK but struggled to get really into, it is however very highly reviewed on steam so I'm in a minority there. The Tropico series is fun for a more light-hearted city builder.

Age of Empires II & III for more command & conquer type games.
Post Reply