Car Navigation System Update

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ucla-engineer
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Car Navigation System Update

Post by ucla-engineer » Wed Feb 27, 2019 11:48 pm

I recently received a notice from Ford that I should update my car's navigation system with the latest map update for $149. The SD card with the maps would be shipped to me for free.

I'd be interested to know of anyone who purchased a similar upgrade and their reasons for doing so. My guess is that this is a 95+% gross profit product from Ford so they send it out and see who will bite.

badger42
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Re: Car Navigation System Update

Post by badger42 » Wed Feb 27, 2019 11:53 pm

Turn off navigation system, buy $20 phone mount, use smartphone instead?

Built-in navigation is a huge waste of $$. Cars last 10+ years, who wants to use 10 year old electronics anyway?

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serbeer
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Re: Car Navigation System Update

Post by serbeer » Thu Feb 28, 2019 12:07 am

I updated my Acura's Navi twice, with intervals of about 2-3 years each. New DVD costs ~$150 as I recall and I resell old DVD on Ebay for around $60--80 every time, since Navi DVD disks are very sensitive and do not copy well.

Does not make sense IMO to update every year, changes are very minor especially in major metopolitan areas. On the other hand, database of businesses, etc, is updated quite a bit and this is important to me since I do not own smart phone, so when on the road, I use Navi all the time. Also, IMO, in-dash Navi is vastly superior to phone-based one, based on my observation of friends using their phones to navigate.

Housedoc
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Re: Car Navigation System Update

Post by Housedoc » Thu Feb 28, 2019 6:12 am

On a recent trip, I used Toyota Highlander Nav and Waze app on my phone simultaneously, Waze a far better product. Dont waste money on Nav update.

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JMacDonald
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Re: Car Navigation System Update

Post by JMacDonald » Thu Feb 28, 2019 6:15 am

I have a Garmin for that price that gets updated for free.
https://www.bestbuy.com/site/garmin-dri ... Id=5715643
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RickBoglehead
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Re: Car Navigation System Update

Post by RickBoglehead » Thu Feb 28, 2019 6:19 am

Most people never update their car navigation as their smart phone has always- current navigation. Android Auto means your car does also, on the big screen.
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Ostentatious
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Re: Car Navigation System Update

Post by Ostentatious » Thu Feb 28, 2019 6:29 am

Car navigation isn’t a waste. It usually gives you a bigger screen than the portable ones would give you. Just don’t update the maps but rather use CarPlay and android play on your phone connected to the navigation, assuming you have the right cables to take advantage of the relatively big navigation screen in your car.

lazydavid
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Re: Car Navigation System Update

Post by lazydavid » Thu Feb 28, 2019 6:56 am

Ostentatious wrote:
Thu Feb 28, 2019 6:29 am
Car navigation isn’t a waste. It usually gives you a bigger screen than the portable ones would give you. Just don’t update the maps but rather use CarPlay and android play on your phone connected to the navigation, assuming you have the right cables to take advantage of the relatively big navigation screen in your car.
The good news is some manufacturers are finally starting to uncouple the big screens and AA/CP from Navigation. For example, in the new Accord, only the very top Touring trim comes with Navigation. But every trim except the bottom LX comes with the same larger 8" screen and supports AA/CP.

My wife's Q7 comes with a really slick-looking Google Earth-based maps (navigation is actually by a company called Here that Audi, BMW, and Daimler jointly own) with a cellular connection for real-time data. This is one of the best factory navigation systems available. She tried it once or twice, declared it terrible, and now uses Waze via AA. The built-in one requires a subscription at $200/6 mos or $500/18 mos. We let it lapse after the free trial.

OnceARunner
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Re: Car Navigation System Update

Post by OnceARunner » Thu Feb 28, 2019 7:15 am

serbeer wrote:
Thu Feb 28, 2019 12:07 am
Also, IMO, in-dash Navi is vastly superior to phone-based one, based on my observation of friends using their phones to navigate.
This may be the first time I’ve ever heard someone say this. I’ve used Toyota, Lexus, and Acura’s built in navigation and they all paled in comparison to using apple maps, google maps, or waze in my opinion. To each their own for sure. I wonder what phones and apps your friends were using.

Jack FFR1846
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Re: Car Navigation System Update

Post by Jack FFR1846 » Thu Feb 28, 2019 7:28 am

I drive around with sales people for my job. I am constantly amused by them attempting to set new destinations by voice. As they argue with their car, I'll interrupt and say "take a right at the next light" using Google maps from the passenger seat.

I use a Garmin in my car (cost about what your update costs) and use google maps when traffic might be an issue. We have nav in one of our cars and have never activated it. (used car, it happened to be in it).
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THY4373
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Re: Car Navigation System Update

Post by THY4373 » Thu Feb 28, 2019 9:31 am

OnceARunner wrote:
Thu Feb 28, 2019 7:15 am
serbeer wrote:
Thu Feb 28, 2019 12:07 am
Also, IMO, in-dash Navi is vastly superior to phone-based one, based on my observation of friends using their phones to navigate.
This may be the first time I’ve ever heard someone say this. I’ve used Toyota, Lexus, and Acura’s built in navigation and they all paled in comparison to using apple maps, google maps, or waze in my opinion. To each their own for sure. I wonder what phones and apps your friends were using.
+1. Also traffic is a further added monthly cost in my car and from what I see when I get it randomly for free it pales in comparison to Google's traffic information.

rich126
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Re: Car Navigation System Update

Post by rich126 » Thu Feb 28, 2019 10:09 am

My previous car had a navigational system but it didn't include any form of real-time traffic information. Since I had to get a new car, I bypassed on the extra cost with the navigational system. Turned out to be a great thing since the car has ApplePlay and I can connect my phone to it and use Waze with it. So instead of viewing things on the small phone display it is now on the touch screen, uses real-time traffic information to route me to my destinations.

I definitely would not do it any other way going forward. I get real time traffic info for free, the maps are updated whenever Google does it (they own Waze), and there aren't any other costs. Personally I much prefer the interface of Waze and its routing compared to Google Maps (not sure of all of the differences but Waze just seems to work better).

dsmclone
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Re: Car Navigation System Update

Post by dsmclone » Thu Feb 28, 2019 10:36 am

When brand new maps come out for my BMW they are usually about 3 years behind when it comes to businesses. Like others, I just use Waze/Google Maps. My wife's VW has a very good looking nav system that also shows up in the instrument panel. Only problem is that when you use Android Auto or Carplay, that map is disabled. Car makers that only carry either android auto or apple carplay and not both are idiots when the market is about 50/50.

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serbeer
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Re: Car Navigation System Update

Post by serbeer » Thu Feb 28, 2019 11:35 am

OnceARunner wrote:
Thu Feb 28, 2019 7:15 am
serbeer wrote:
Thu Feb 28, 2019 12:07 am
Also, IMO, in-dash Navi is vastly superior to phone-based one, based on my observation of friends using their phones to navigate.
This may be the first time I’ve ever heard someone say this. I’ve used Toyota, Lexus, and Acura’s built in navigation and they all paled in comparison to using apple maps, google maps, or waze in my opinion. To each their own for sure. I wonder what phones and apps your friends were using.
Well, I also have personal experience. 2 years ago I attended wedding in NY, got car rental there. My wife was suggesting to use her Iphone 6 for navigation, but luckily I also borrowed older Garmin Navi from my dad who upgraded to the newer version. I found it very difficult to follow phone navigation on traffic-filled NY streets. Especially when one is in a hurry. Garmin really saved my sanity there, especially on 2 hour way to the airport in morning traffic, I just know I would miss the plane if I was trying to use phone navi. I cannot tell you exactly what made phone navy bad. It could be that we did not have a windshield holder for it, so I could not have it in front of my eye at all times and switch lines in time in heavy traffic, but it was also a matter of presentation for sure, the way garmin would show you upcoming turns scrolling smoothly, changing scale of the map automatically as turns were approaching, etc. Not 100% sure but after this trip I swore not to try to rely on phone for major trips in major metro areas.

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midareff
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Re: Car Navigation System Update

Post by midareff » Thu Feb 28, 2019 11:49 am

Mine gets updated (no charge) at the vehicle's annual services. Easy voice commands and much better than any phone app I have seen to-date.

Barsoom
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Re: Car Navigation System Update

Post by Barsoom » Thu Feb 28, 2019 11:54 am

I have a 2013 Ford with navigation. It came with an A4 card. I waited until the A7 before replacing it. My home is in an area with new development, but most of new roads were not in the update.

You should go onto the Ford site and check out the map that shows where the updates are to see if any changes were made to your frequent driving areas. Chances are that, depending on how old your current SD card is, that you won't benefit from the update.

The reason I bought the navigation system instead of using a phone system is that the onboard system works when you are out of cellphone range. Also, many cellphones drop data connections when on a call.

-B

Broken Man 1999
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Re: Car Navigation System Update

Post by Broken Man 1999 » Thu Feb 28, 2019 12:02 pm

Our Garmin unit stays up to date. It is part of my Kenwood head unit. It is nearly 10 years old, still works fine.

We don't wander very far away from our home any longer, and I really don't want DW fussing with her cell phone for navigation. So, I am the navigator on any trips requiring location/direction assistance, and she is the pilot.

The head unit has CD/DVD/GPS/Bluetooth/backup camera/HD radio/Sirius access. Not bad for ten years ago.

Today I would think much of those options would be found already in a new vehicle. Though it seems infotainment systems from some auto companies aren't issue free.

Broken Man 1999
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neilpilot
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Re: Car Navigation System Update

Post by neilpilot » Thu Feb 28, 2019 12:05 pm

Barsoom wrote:
Thu Feb 28, 2019 11:54 am
I have a 2013 Ford with navigation. It came with an A4 card. I waited until the A7 before replacing it. My home is in an area with new development, but most of new roads were not in the update.

You should go onto the Ford site and check out the map that shows where the updates are to see if any changes were made to your frequent driving areas. Chances are that, depending on how old your current SD card is, that you won't benefit from the update.

The reason I bought the navigation system instead of using a phone system is that the onboard system works when you are out of cellphone range. Also, many cellphones drop data connections when on a call.

-B
Barsoom - cell phone navigation also works without reception. You simply loose traffic info. I use my cellphone all the time, when driving in the USA and Europe. I always have my data switched off in the USA, and in Europe it's usually in airplane mode when I drive. All the maps are in memory and don't need cell reception.

Barsoom
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Re: Car Navigation System Update

Post by Barsoom » Thu Feb 28, 2019 2:17 pm

I guess I was thinking of Google Navigation. Do you still get the maps if you drive out of range from the last map cache?

-B

neilpilot
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Re: Car Navigation System Update

Post by neilpilot » Thu Feb 28, 2019 2:43 pm

Barsoom wrote:
Thu Feb 28, 2019 2:17 pm
I guess I was thinking of Google Navigation. Do you still get the maps if you drive out of range from the last map cache?

-B
I use HERE. I can't say what happens, since I have the entire USA. That plus the map of Spain is less that 10G of the 25G memory chip in my phone.

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Doom&Gloom
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Re: Car Navigation System Update

Post by Doom&Gloom » Thu Feb 28, 2019 2:57 pm

Broken Man 1999 wrote:
Thu Feb 28, 2019 12:02 pm
Our Garmin unit stays up to date. It is part of my Kenwood head unit. It is nearly 10 years old, still works fine.

We don't wander very far away from our home any longer, and I really don't want DW fussing with her cell phone for navigation. So, I am the navigator on any trips requiring location/direction assistance, and she is the pilot.

The head unit has CD/DVD/GPS/Bluetooth/backup camera/HD radio/Sirius access. Not bad for ten years ago.

Today I would think much of those options would be found already in a new vehicle. Though it seems infotainment systems from some auto companies aren't issue free.

Broken Man 1999
I have a Kenwood head unit in my car also and really like it. The installed maps are approaching four years old. When I feel updating the maps will be beneficial to me, I will check into doing that. As for points of interest, we rely on DW to find their location on her cell phone as the information is more current. (If we are in my car, she can input the address into my GPS. If we are in her car, we must navigate to it via her phone as the car's GPS will not allow inputting an address while moving.) Finding yourself in an unfamiliar city at the location of a restaurant that has been closed for three years is a real bummer. I rarely need a location "on the fly" when she is not with me.

I absolutely despise everything about the GPS that came as part of her Subaru Outback's infotainment system. After seeing those things mentioned as a big problem here and elsewhere, I suppose we should feel lucky that it isn't much worse than it is designed to be. It is so aggravating to me that if it were my vehicle and I intended to keep it, I would replace the head unit.

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GoldStar
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Re: Car Navigation System Update

Post by GoldStar » Thu Feb 28, 2019 3:01 pm

How many years old are the current maps? Have you gotten lost or found them to be dated?

I updated one of my cars that my kids use as they find the in-car Nav better than Google/Waze/etc. and I felt it was safer for them to use (bigger screen, etc.). But I didn't do it until after one of them got lost because the system was 8 years old and maps had really changed.
If you use it perhaps upgrade but only after 5 or 6 years (roads don't change that frequently).

Additionally - I've heard you can buy the version prior to the latest version on E-Bay for cheap for most cars (some folks upgrade every year and sell prior year on E-Bay for $20 or so). So provided you don't mind being one version behind - you may want to look into that.

BanditKing
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Re: Car Navigation System Update

Post by BanditKing » Thu Feb 28, 2019 3:12 pm

You can buy the Ford map card off Amazon for about $75. No need to pay the stupid $150 price to Ford.

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rustymutt
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Re: Car Navigation System Update

Post by rustymutt » Thu Feb 28, 2019 3:34 pm

I did this with a Ford product of year 2006, and the new map was worse than the one it had replaced. I complained to Ford officials, and never heard back. Won't be buying a Ford product again.
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lthenderson
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Re: Car Navigation System Update

Post by lthenderson » Thu Feb 28, 2019 4:09 pm

The navigation system in my Sienna has an app you install on your phone and periodically, it downloads and updates the system through the bluetooth connection. Doesn't cost a dime.

Although I don't like the interface as much as I did my Garmin, I do like being able to input destinations and find things using the integrated voice commands. Any negative differences between the built in Navigation and the Garmin are more than made up by not having to bring along the Garmin and having to fuss with dangling cords and mounts that come detached. I have long since tossed my Garmin into the glove box of my old car without navigation and I don't miss it at all.

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jabberwockOG
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Re: Car Navigation System Update

Post by jabberwockOG » Thu Feb 28, 2019 4:32 pm

Inbuilt OEM navigation systems in cars is pretty much obsolete klunky low res junk when it is released. Add a few years and the inbuilt NAV in general willbe laughably out of date even with the silly expense map updates. Use a dash mount and buy a Garmin with lifetime traffic and map updates or use Waze on phone for much better up to date NAV while driving.

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Re: Car Navigation System Update

Post by athan » Thu Feb 28, 2019 4:45 pm

Also, IMO, in-dash Navi is vastly superior to phone-based one, based on my observation of friends using their phones to navigate
Come on now...you think your DVD is better than Google Maps?

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wander
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Re: Car Navigation System Update

Post by wander » Thu Feb 28, 2019 4:48 pm

Get a stereo with Apple and Android plays. You will get bigger screen with up-to-date maps.

Hockey10
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Re: Car Navigation System Update

Post by Hockey10 » Thu Feb 28, 2019 6:02 pm

I have cars that are 6 and 7 years old, both with Nav systems that have not been updated since I purchased cars. I have not used the car Nav systems in the past 2 years since my kids got me hooked on Waze. Here is my summary:

Advantage of car Nav:

- bigger screen


Advantages of Waze:
- real time traffic
- shows you speed limit and what speed you are traveling - turns red if going over limit
- roadkill alerts
- voice commands from Waze are more detailed compared to car Nav. Waze: "turn right in 0.5 miles onto Market St". Car Nav: "Turn right in .5 miles"
- pothole alerts
- red light camera alerts
- "police reported ahead" alerts (usually a speed trap)
- will automatically re-route you if traffic conditions change
- easier to program in destination (If I type "We" it correctly predicts "Wells Fargo Center")

Disadvantages of Waze:

- GPS uses a lot of battery, so I always keep Iphone plugged in on long trips. Wire can be a minor nuisance.
- Where to put the phone? In one of my cars I have a small rubber stand that holds the phone in front of the big screen. My other car has a camera on the passenger side mirror which activates when I turn on right turn signal. So that I can still see the big screen, I prop up phone on dashboard directly in front of steering wheel. This covers up part of the speedometer and trip odometer. Not a big deal, but a minor nuisance. I have so far avoided buying one of the mounts that goes in a vent or sticks to dash.

Conclusion: a strong vote for Waze

krafty81
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Re: Car Navigation System Update

Post by krafty81 » Thu Feb 28, 2019 6:41 pm

I update my Ford nav every few years. The voice functionality of the ford nav is actually pretty good. I like having all my points saved. What I don't like is that they have suspended many features I liked, such as sending a google map point directly to the car. They also disabled their Destinations app, which allowed the same thing from a mobile phone. If I was buying a car, I would get as big a screen as possible that would support Apple CarPlay or whatever they are calling it. If traffic is an issue, I always use Waze anyway.

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lthenderson
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Re: Car Navigation System Update

Post by lthenderson » Fri Mar 01, 2019 10:24 am

jabberwockOG wrote:
Thu Feb 28, 2019 4:32 pm
Use a dash mount and buy a Garmin with lifetime traffic and map updates
Perhaps things have changed since the last time I bought a Garmin with lifetime map updates. I think I was able to install exactly two updates before the internal memory ran out of room and from then on, I had to start dropping states to allow new updates to fit on the thing.

dsmclone
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Re: Car Navigation System Update

Post by dsmclone » Fri Mar 01, 2019 10:29 am

lthenderson wrote:
Fri Mar 01, 2019 10:24 am
jabberwockOG wrote:
Thu Feb 28, 2019 4:32 pm
Use a dash mount and buy a Garmin with lifetime traffic and map updates
Perhaps things have changed since the last time I bought a Garmin with lifetime map updates. I think I was able to install exactly two updates before the internal memory ran out of room and from then on, I had to start dropping states to allow new updates to fit on the thing.
Same here, total scam.

neilpilot
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Re: Car Navigation System Update

Post by neilpilot » Fri Mar 01, 2019 10:35 am

lthenderson wrote:
Fri Mar 01, 2019 10:24 am
jabberwockOG wrote:
Thu Feb 28, 2019 4:32 pm
Use a dash mount and buy a Garmin with lifetime traffic and map updates
Perhaps things have changed since the last time I bought a Garmin with lifetime map updates. I think I was able to install exactly two updates before the internal memory ran out of room and from then on, I had to start dropping states to allow new updates to fit on the thing.
After a trip to Majorca a few years ago, I stopped using my Garmin and now only use my phone or iPad. When the Garmin (with a recent map update) couldn't find the entrance to our resort, I switched to the phone and it was flawless. In fact, I recently sold my Garmin on eBay. Reasons I prefer the phone over the Garmin:

[1] phone map updates are free
[2] I carry my phone anyway, and also have my iPad for most trips away from home. Why also carry a separate GPS?
[3] if I want more map detail when driving, I can switch from my phone to the iPad and use the same program (HERE)
[3] my phone consistently maintains GPS position better than the Garmin, especially when walking in an urban environment (and that is with the phone in airplane mode).

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Ged
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Re: Car Navigation System Update

Post by Ged » Fri Mar 01, 2019 5:17 pm

I have a 2012 Acura with in dash Nav. I update the Nav every 2 years with a DVD. I think the updates are useful as they pick up changes in the long distance routes I take from time to time. The traffic information is useless.

I could not see myself fumbling with a dash mounted phone. The screen is too small and it is more of distraction from keeping eyes front than the large easier to see screen.

I like the idea of Android Auto and understand it's now offered on new Acuras, and infotainment units.

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Re: Car Navigation System Update

Post by THY4373 » Fri Mar 01, 2019 6:04 pm

BanditKing wrote:
Thu Feb 28, 2019 3:12 pm
You can buy the Ford map card off Amazon for about $75. No need to pay the stupid $150 price to Ford.
It depends on the Ford. At least my 2010 appears to require a key/encryption code that the third-party map distributors cannot deal with. That said I didn't try looking very hard because I just use my phone most of the time so I am not sure I would pay $75 never mind the $150-300 Ford wants.

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jabberwockOG
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Re: Car Navigation System Update

Post by jabberwockOG » Fri Mar 01, 2019 7:18 pm

dsmclone wrote:
Fri Mar 01, 2019 10:29 am
lthenderson wrote:
Fri Mar 01, 2019 10:24 am
jabberwockOG wrote:
Thu Feb 28, 2019 4:32 pm
Use a dash mount and buy a Garmin with lifetime traffic and map updates
Perhaps things have changed since the last time I bought a Garmin with lifetime map updates. I think I was able to install exactly two updates before the internal memory ran out of room and from then on, I had to start dropping states to allow new updates to fit on the thing.
Same here, total scam.
As maps get bigger and more detailed you can run out of room of inbuilt memory space with an older Garmin. In most cases add on memory can be added easily by inserting an inexpensive add on SIM memory card into the Garmin's memory card port. Cost is usually less than $15 and takes 2 minutes to do. With technology it always pays to RTFM.

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JMacDonald
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Re: Car Navigation System Update

Post by JMacDonald » Fri Mar 01, 2019 8:09 pm

jabberwockOG wrote:
Fri Mar 01, 2019 7:18 pm
dsmclone wrote:
Fri Mar 01, 2019 10:29 am
lthenderson wrote:
Fri Mar 01, 2019 10:24 am
jabberwockOG wrote:
Thu Feb 28, 2019 4:32 pm
Use a dash mount and buy a Garmin with lifetime traffic and map updates
Perhaps things have changed since the last time I bought a Garmin with lifetime map updates. I think I was able to install exactly two updates before the internal memory ran out of room and from then on, I had to start dropping states to allow new updates to fit on the thing.
Same here, total scam.
As maps get bigger and more detailed you can run out of room of inbuilt memory space with an older Garmin. In most cases add on memory can be added easily by inserting an inexpensive add on SIM memory card into the Garmin's memory card port. Cost is usually less than $15 and takes 2 minutes to do. With technology it always pays to RTFM.
I have had my Garmin for several years now with updates and no problems. It works well.
Best Wishes, | Joe

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