Microsoft : Edge Being Replaced by Chromium

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ubermax
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Microsoft : Edge Being Replaced by Chromium

Post by ubermax » Sat Dec 08, 2018 12:22 pm

For various reasons I just read that Microsoft is replacing Edge with Chromium - does anyone know when and how ? via Windows Update ??

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Kenkat
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Re: Microsoft : Edge Being Replaced by Chromium

Post by Kenkat » Sat Dec 08, 2018 12:29 pm

It’s still going to be called Edge; Chromium is just the rendering engine under the hood. This is still a significant step, but you’ll probably just get a new version Edge at some point in an update.

Many browsers are built on engines like this - for example, Safari uses the Webkit rendering engine. It’s still an admission by Microsoft that they’ve been outclassed by Google and others in this space.

bondsr4me
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Re: Microsoft : Edge Being Replaced by Chromium

Post by bondsr4me » Sat Dec 08, 2018 1:14 pm

ubermax wrote:
Sat Dec 08, 2018 12:22 pm
For various reasons I just read that Microsoft is replacing Edge with Chromium - does anyone know when and how ? via Windows Update ??
I recall reading somewhere it won't be until next year.
You can become an insider by going to www. microsoftedgeinsider.com

IMO Microsoft has done well under Satya Nadella....much better and forward-looking than under Ballmer.

Yes, they like Apple have made some miscues.
But they are winning my respect (and business) again.
Our household has been majority Apple since 2006.
But, I must say I really like our SurfacePro 4's.

Things will be interesting as time rolls along.

cutterinnj
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Re: Microsoft : Edge Being Replaced by Chromium

Post by cutterinnj » Sat Dec 08, 2018 1:16 pm

ubermax wrote:
Sat Dec 08, 2018 12:22 pm
For various reasons I just read that Microsoft is replacing Edge with Chromium - does anyone know when and how ? via Windows Update ??
This is essentially Microsoft granting google a monopoly on browser technology.
Really bad for everyone. (Except google.)

TravelGeek
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Re: Microsoft : Edge Being Replaced by Chromium

Post by TravelGeek » Sat Dec 08, 2018 1:31 pm

cutterinnj wrote:
Sat Dec 08, 2018 1:16 pm
This is essentially Microsoft granting google a monopoly on browser technology.
Really bad for everyone. (Except google.)
Yes, agreed.

https://www.engadget.com/2018/12/07/moz ... -chromium/

I am planning to do more of my browsing with Firefox. And send them and the Thunderbird team a small year-end donation.

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Kenkat
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Re: Microsoft : Edge Being Replaced by Chromium

Post by Kenkat » Sat Dec 08, 2018 1:40 pm

cutterinnj wrote:
Sat Dec 08, 2018 1:16 pm
ubermax wrote:
Sat Dec 08, 2018 12:22 pm
For various reasons I just read that Microsoft is replacing Edge with Chromium - does anyone know when and how ? via Windows Update ??
This is essentially Microsoft granting google a monopoly on browser technology.
Really bad for everyone. (Except google.)
Microsoft had a monopoly on browser technology for a long time after they killed off Netscape Navigator. IE 5, anyone? We will see if Google loses their edge at some point. Pun is intended...

Iridium
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Re: Microsoft : Edge Being Replaced by Chromium

Post by Iridium » Sat Dec 08, 2018 1:42 pm

cutterinnj wrote:
Sat Dec 08, 2018 1:16 pm
ubermax wrote:
Sat Dec 08, 2018 12:22 pm
For various reasons I just read that Microsoft is replacing Edge with Chromium - does anyone know when and how ? via Windows Update ??
This is essentially Microsoft granting google a monopoly on browser technology.
Really bad for everyone. (Except google.)
At minimum, it is good for web developers, as they have one fewer layout engine to test. It will also likely increase competition between Edge and Chrome. Both will render pages equally well, so it will be all about the other features that wrap around the layout engine.

Chromium (unlike Chrome) is open-source, so there is a limit on how much control Google has. If Google makes a selfish decision with Chromium, Microsoft always has the option to build their own version of Chromium. The Oracle aquisition of Sun was an example of this. Oracle had not even necessarily done anything wrong yet but reputation alone caused OpenOffice to fork off into LibreOffice (so successful that Oracle all but gave up on OpenOffice), MySQL was forked off into MariaDB, and Hudson was forked off into Jenkins.

mariezzz
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Re: Microsoft : Edge Being Replaced by Chromium

Post by mariezzz » Sat Dec 08, 2018 1:47 pm

Kenkat wrote:
Sat Dec 08, 2018 1:40 pm
cutterinnj wrote:
Sat Dec 08, 2018 1:16 pm
ubermax wrote:
Sat Dec 08, 2018 12:22 pm
For various reasons I just read that Microsoft is replacing Edge with Chromium - does anyone know when and how ? via Windows Update ??

This is essentially Microsoft granting google a monopoly on browser technology.
Really bad for everyone. (Except google.)

Microsoft had a monopoly on browser technology for a long time after they killed off Netscape Navigator. IE 5, anyone? We will see if Google loses their edge at some point. Pun is intended...
I really don't understand why people prefer Chrome over Firefox. Chrome is bloated and I think the interface is less user-friendly than Firefox.
I don't like Edge, either.
TravelGeek wrote:
Sat Dec 08, 2018 1:31 pm
cutterinnj wrote:
Sat Dec 08, 2018 1:16 pm
This is essentially Microsoft granting google a monopoly on browser technology.
Really bad for everyone. (Except google.)

Yes, agreed.
https://www.engadget.com/2018/12/07/moz ... -chromium/
I am planning to do more of my browsing with Firefox. And send them and the Thunderbird team a small year-end donation.
+1 on the donations.

TravelGeek
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Re: Microsoft : Edge Being Replaced by Chromium

Post by TravelGeek » Sat Dec 08, 2018 3:00 pm

Iridium wrote:
Sat Dec 08, 2018 1:42 pm
Chromium (unlike Chrome) is open-source, so there is a limit on how much control Google has. If Google makes a selfish decision with Chromium, Microsoft always has the option to build their own version of Chromium. The Oracle aquisition of Sun was an example of this. Oracle had not even necessarily done anything wrong yet but reputation alone caused OpenOffice to fork off into LibreOffice (so successful that Oracle all but gave up on OpenOffice), MySQL was forked off into MariaDB, and Hudson was forked off into Jenkins.
How many non-Google employees are working on Chromium? In other words, how independent of Google is Chromium? (not a rhetorical question, I don't know the answer)

At least in the case of Hudson->Jenkins it was basically the main developer leaving the project and starting his own company to do the Jenkins fork independently of Oracle, leaving Oracle with a bunch of code and not really much knowledge about it. Not sure if Microsoft would have the developers familiar enough with the Chromium code base to just do its own fork, unless they are planning to shift the current Edge rendering engine engineers over to work on Chromium.

cutterinnj
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Re: Microsoft : Edge Being Replaced by Chromium

Post by cutterinnj » Sat Dec 08, 2018 4:25 pm

Kenkat wrote:
Sat Dec 08, 2018 1:40 pm
cutterinnj wrote:
Sat Dec 08, 2018 1:16 pm
ubermax wrote:
Sat Dec 08, 2018 12:22 pm
For various reasons I just read that Microsoft is replacing Edge with Chromium - does anyone know when and how ? via Windows Update ??
This is essentially Microsoft granting google a monopoly on browser technology.
Really bad for everyone. (Except google.)
Microsoft had a monopoly on browser technology for a long time after they killed off Netscape Navigator. IE 5, anyone? We will see if Google loses their edge at some point. Pun is intended...
Those were the old days, and through a series of steps over the past decade, MS were "good guys", as they were one of only a handful of companies providing an alternative to Google.

Microsoft's plan back in the day was to have the web become monopolized. Their plan has worked, except the monopolizing company is Google.

cutterinnj
Posts: 285
Joined: Wed Jun 01, 2011 10:08 pm

Re: Microsoft : Edge Being Replaced by Chromium

Post by cutterinnj » Sat Dec 08, 2018 4:29 pm

Iridium wrote:
Sat Dec 08, 2018 1:42 pm
cutterinnj wrote:
Sat Dec 08, 2018 1:16 pm
ubermax wrote:
Sat Dec 08, 2018 12:22 pm
For various reasons I just read that Microsoft is replacing Edge with Chromium - does anyone know when and how ? via Windows Update ??
This is essentially Microsoft granting google a monopoly on browser technology.
Really bad for everyone. (Except google.)
At minimum, it is good for web developers, as they have one fewer layout engine to test. It will also likely increase competition between Edge and Chrome. Both will render pages equally well, so it will be all about the other features that wrap around the layout engine.

Chromium (unlike Chrome) is open-source, so there is a limit on how much control Google has. If Google makes a selfish decision with Chromium, Microsoft always has the option to build their own version of Chromium. The Oracle aquisition of Sun was an example of this. Oracle had not even necessarily done anything wrong yet but reputation alone caused OpenOffice to fork off into LibreOffice (so successful that Oracle all but gave up on OpenOffice), MySQL was forked off into MariaDB, and Hudson was forked off into Jenkins.
This effectively destroys competition; Edge will now just be a UI, and UI's are commodities.
The ENGINE is what matters, and Chromium is now monopolized.
Take the backlash of Chrome 71, for instance; they are forcing Autoplay on everyone. Not to mention the sites they have whitelisted (which happen to be owned by Google.)

Google long ago dropped its "Don't be evil" moniker for good reason.

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Kenkat
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Re: Microsoft : Edge Being Replaced by Chromium

Post by Kenkat » Sat Dec 08, 2018 5:08 pm

@mariezzz -

One thing that really holds Firefox back is that they don’t really have a way to promote the Firefox browser.

Microsoft was able to bundle theirs with the Windows OS. Once Internet Explorer got good enough, people started using it instead of Netscape Navigator. Back when I was still writing code, we would test with Netscape and IE. Sometime around Netscape 4 and IE 5, Netscape started to fall behind and IE 6 was effectively the end. As IE became more bloated (can I say pig here), Firefox really did make some pretty good inroads on IE. However, Google Chrome also came along and, combined with being a good browser plus Google’s ability to promote it through Google Search, it became the primary alternate to IE. Firefox and Microsoft made a few more mis-steps and here we are.

It will be interesting to see what happens next. Something will probably change at some point. Maybe we will have an Amazon browser; what they’ve done with AWS (which I understand is completely different) is pretty amazing.

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Kenkat
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Re: Microsoft : Edge Being Replaced by Chromium

Post by Kenkat » Sat Dec 08, 2018 5:08 pm

cutterinnj wrote:
Sat Dec 08, 2018 4:25 pm
Kenkat wrote:
Sat Dec 08, 2018 1:40 pm
cutterinnj wrote:
Sat Dec 08, 2018 1:16 pm
ubermax wrote:
Sat Dec 08, 2018 12:22 pm
For various reasons I just read that Microsoft is replacing Edge with Chromium - does anyone know when and how ? via Windows Update ??
This is essentially Microsoft granting google a monopoly on browser technology.
Really bad for everyone. (Except google.)
Microsoft had a monopoly on browser technology for a long time after they killed off Netscape Navigator. IE 5, anyone? We will see if Google loses their edge at some point. Pun is intended...
Those were the old days, and through a series of steps over the past decade, MS were "good guys", as they were one of only a handful of companies providing an alternative to Google.

Microsoft's plan back in the day was to have the web become monopolized. Their plan has worked, except the monopolizing company is Google.
True that.

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oldcomputerguy
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Re: Microsoft : Edge Being Replaced by Chromium

Post by oldcomputerguy » Sat Dec 08, 2018 6:47 pm

cutterinnj wrote:
Sat Dec 08, 2018 1:16 pm
ubermax wrote:
Sat Dec 08, 2018 12:22 pm
For various reasons I just read that Microsoft is replacing Edge with Chromium - does anyone know when and how ? via Windows Update ??
This is essentially Microsoft granting google a monopoly on browser technology.
Really bad for everyone. (Except google.)
As I understand it, Chrome is the Google browser, while Chromium is the open-source version.
It’s taken me a lot of years, but I’ve come around to this: If you’re dumb, surround yourself with smart people. And if you’re smart, surround yourself with smart people who disagree with you.

cutterinnj
Posts: 285
Joined: Wed Jun 01, 2011 10:08 pm

Re: Microsoft : Edge Being Replaced by Chromium

Post by cutterinnj » Sat Dec 08, 2018 6:52 pm

oldcomputerguy wrote:
Sat Dec 08, 2018 6:47 pm
cutterinnj wrote:
Sat Dec 08, 2018 1:16 pm
ubermax wrote:
Sat Dec 08, 2018 12:22 pm
For various reasons I just read that Microsoft is replacing Edge with Chromium - does anyone know when and how ? via Windows Update ??
This is essentially Microsoft granting google a monopoly on browser technology.
Really bad for everyone. (Except google.)
As I understand it, Chrome is the Google browser, while Chromium is the open-source version.
Chrome is the browser which uses Chromium as the engine (which just about everything does these days .)
Chromium is “open source” but essentially controlled and manipulated by google as they see fit.

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Ged
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Re: Microsoft : Edge Being Replaced by Chromium

Post by Ged » Sat Dec 08, 2018 7:02 pm

Iridium wrote:
Sat Dec 08, 2018 1:42 pm

At minimum, it is good for web developers, as they have one fewer layout engine to test. It will also likely increase competition between Edge and Chrome. Both will render pages equally well, so it will be all about the other features that wrap around the layout engine.
Yes, it is good for developers. At one point in my life I had to deal with the hot mess that was IE. A stinking hot mess. With a terrible layout engine only vaguely standards compliant.

Even now that I am retired I still know several people that will send me email expressing their joy with this news.

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