Car Shopping, Seem to lose my Boglehead way each time help!!

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adam61
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Car Shopping, Seem to lose my Boglehead way each time help!!

Post by adam61 » Fri Sep 07, 2018 6:06 am

I do some things right when it comes to new cars, but fall far short of my expectations I hold myself to in every other major purchase area or savings rate.

Things I do Right:
-Pay Cash
-Buy highly rated cars
-Get reasonable value on trade-in or private sale
-Get very solid prices using either employee pricing or working dealerships against each other
-Keep Cars 9-10 years so the brutal depreciation isn't so jarring

Things I do Wrong:
-Always buy new (Mix of wanting the latest and greatest and not liking the idea of knowing how someone else used the vehicle as I am METICULOUS with maintenance, care, and usage.)
-Buy more car than I need (even if the base model is reasonable I usually load it up)
-Buy too much Horsepower 400-500 when I want some get up and go 200-300 would be just fine and cost less and have more MPG
-Get dazzled by tech/luxury features. I really utilize it, I love my heads up display, blind spot awareness, back up camera, smart cruise, etc.

Here's how I use my vehicles and what I've bought:

Newest: 2015 Genesis 5.0 Ultimate MSRP $59,500 (Paid $51,500) 21,000 Miles (5-6k/yr) Will be keeping until 2024
Looking to Replace in 6 months: 2011 Hyundai Genesis R-Spec MSRP $49,650 (Paid $41,000) 66,000 Miles (9k/yr)

We are in the market for a mid-size SUV (have had 1 child and maybe 1 more coming in 12-18 months) or a mid-size to large sedan. I would like 200-300 HP, a good selection of safety/luxury features, but a smarter overall choice. As I only drive 6k Miles/yr and my wife only 9k, it often seems a waste to have big engines and tons of features for a 2-4 mile commute. However, call me a snob, but when I rent a car I feel completely out of place without all my tech and features.

Sorry for the long post, but my goal here is to still have a little fun, but focus in better on what's important. I need to stop the cost creep from 30k to 40k to 50k I've had over the last 3 vehicles. But, it's difficult to trade-in a car and get one that's slower, less luxurious, and missing a lot of the tech I'm used to. Where should my head be and what type of vehicles represent a middle ground here?

Thanks in advance for the help and support!!

PFInterest
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Re: Car Shopping, Seem to lose my Boglehead way each time help!!

Post by PFInterest » Fri Sep 07, 2018 6:28 am

welcome to lifestyle creep.
a crv or rav4 is all you need. if you want to spend more go for it, just realize you wont have it for other spending or retirement or 529s...etc.

and since you crave the latest, why not a model X and be done with it? nothing better.....

adam61
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Re: Car Shopping, Seem to lose my Boglehead way each time help!!

Post by adam61 » Fri Sep 07, 2018 6:37 am

I think you are joking, what’s sad is I looked at a model 3, then realized a model X was only 18k more. At least they seem to hold their value!! There’s no help for me ;( Also don’t really get those gas savings at 6k/yr.

Nissanzx1
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Re: Car Shopping, Seem to lose my Boglehead way each time help!!

Post by Nissanzx1 » Fri Sep 07, 2018 6:42 am

Paying cash= awesome.

IMHO you are trading cars too frequently. The "value" segment of a cars lifecycle to the owner occurs about when you are trading them off. Keep until at least 150k. Enjoy the lower insurance and property taxes.

Hyundai makes great cars, but the depreciation on a new Genesis is one of the worst in the industry.

I'm still driving my 2003 so I can't tell you what small SUV to buy, but keep this one longer. You have a major leak in the car section of your budget. It's 100% ok as long as you can afford it and still meet other goals, but it's just so much money over a lifetime...

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Tamarind
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Re: Car Shopping, Seem to lose my Boglehead way each time help!!

Post by Tamarind » Fri Sep 07, 2018 6:59 am

I agree you are trading too quickly. 9-10 years would be impressive if you drove more, but you don't, so from my POV that 2011 is nearly new. I also buy new, but I don't care about trade-in or resale value, because I want to get all but the scrap value out of each car. Keep them until 150k+. If they become uneconomical to maintain before 150k, think twice about that make/model in future.

If I were you, I'd wait to replace the 2011 at least until until you actually have more kids than will fit. Doesn't appear to me that you need an SUV at this time and both cars are new enough to have stability and traction features which are the key safety improvements of the last decade.

If regularly getting a newer car is really more important, you're going to have to step down a price level or three to preserve your BH card. Elantra, perhaps? :wink:

go_mets
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Re: Car Shopping, Seem to lose my Boglehead way each time help!!

Post by go_mets » Fri Sep 07, 2018 7:11 am

the subject line should be Car Shopping Way too Often !


As a person with a 2004 Honda Accord with nearly 215,000 miles I totally do not understand the churn !


.

adam61
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Re: Car Shopping, Seem to lose my Boglehead way each time help!!

Post by adam61 » Fri Sep 07, 2018 7:15 am

I thought 9-10 years was a solid time table, but maybe that’s where one of my largest leaks is.

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jabberwockOG
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Re: Car Shopping, Seem to lose my Boglehead way each time help!!

Post by jabberwockOG » Fri Sep 07, 2018 7:47 am

Be aware that the latest cars are very different from cars just a few years ago. Cars have become sensor laden computers on wheels and are theoretically much safer and easier to drive. The downside is that all the electronics and sensors loaded into a car/truck are items that can and will fail over time and most are going to be expensive to extremely expensive to repair/replace. In addition every year going forward for next at least 10 years the safety and autonomous driving systems built into latest model cars will likely be significantly upgraded (faster, more features/capabilities, and hopefully less bugs) each year over the previous year's model. So car model obsolescence will happen even faster than in previous times. In addition the hybridization and/or full electrification of every car model is in progress and will continue to advance for at least next 10-15 model years. My personal plan is to hold off buying any new car as long as possible (3-5 years) and also to avoid buy any brand new redesign/model year until at least the 2cd or 3rd year of production.

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Cyclesafe
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Re: Car Shopping, Seem to lose my Boglehead way each time help!!

Post by Cyclesafe » Fri Sep 07, 2018 8:11 am

Your eyes are finally opening to the marketing juggernaut that has been grooming you from when you were a child. Zoom zoom. A blossoming adolescent under tented bedcovers breathlessly caressing glossy flashlight-illuminated photos of bright shiny sports cars that offer airbrushed fantasies of riches, popularity, envy, access to an unstoppable flood of.... MUST RESIST.

Spoiler alert. As the owner of a Porsche for the past three years I can tell you that none of the above has happened. The car is certainly more fun to drive, but this is tempered by the anxiety I feel when I leaved it parked. The $25k depreciation I have suffered in this interim has made it - by far - my stupidest overt financial mistake ever. Of course, I'm looking at the new 992's when they come out later this year.....

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Watty
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Re: Car Shopping, Seem to lose my Boglehead way each time help!!

Post by Watty » Fri Sep 07, 2018 8:36 am

adam61 wrote:
Fri Sep 07, 2018 7:15 am
I thought 9-10 years was a solid time table, but maybe that’s where one of my largest leaks is.
My basic car buying plan is buy new cars for and keep them about that long and sell them when they have in the ballpark of 100k miles on them and it works for me. A big difference is that I buy cars like Toyotas and Hondas that hold their value well and a well maintained car like that which is in great condition will sell for a surprising amount. This makes the yearly cost of non-routine maintenance and depreciation fairly reasonable even though it is not the cheapest way to own a car.

I did not look it up but from one of the prior comments I would assume that a ten year old Hyundai does not have a great resale value.

You seem to value the large engine and tech features a lot but it could be that your wife would be happy without them. When buying her next car watch out for spending a lot for features you like that she does not value.
adam61 wrote:
Fri Sep 07, 2018 6:06 am
Where should my head be and what type of vehicles represent a middle ground here?
Going with a brand that holds its value better would be a good place to start if you want to replace your cars more often. For example a 2011 Toyota or Honda with only 66k miles that is in excellent condition would sell for a lot higher price than the Hyundai you are planning on selling.

If you want the Hyundai then getting a three year old used or CPO car instead of new would be ideal for you since you don't drive a lot of miles. By this I mean that if you buy a car with 25k then drive it 6 or 9k miles per year it will still take a long time to get to 100k miles.
adam61 wrote:
Fri Sep 07, 2018 6:06 am
However, call me a snob, but when I rent a car I feel completely out of place without all my tech and features.
A big problem with tech and features in a rental car is that how to use them often not obvious. Even if the rental car had them you likely would not use them.

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Blueskies123
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Re: Car Shopping, Seem to lose my Boglehead way each time help!!

Post by Blueskies123 » Fri Sep 07, 2018 8:48 am

Tens of thousands of the brightest students go to the most expensive schools every year to study how to manipulate you to buy stuff you do not need. Some of those kids make millions of dollars spending 100's of millions of dollars on advertising designed to trick you to buy junk you will be getting rid of in a few years.

Run when you hear the words: "you deserve" "the best" and other mind control phrases and pictures.

I call these people Marketing Geniuses. The way I fight them is to think of it as a war and I have to tune out advertising, keeping up with Jones's, and comparisons. I also ask myself what do I need vs what do I want.

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wabbajack
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Re: Car Shopping, Seem to lose my Boglehead way each time help!!

Post by wabbajack » Fri Sep 07, 2018 8:51 am

adam61 wrote:
Fri Sep 07, 2018 6:06 am
Sorry for the long post, but my goal here is to still have a little fun, but focus in better on what's important. I need to stop the cost creep from 30k to 40k to 50k I've had over the last 3 vehicles. But, it's difficult to trade-in a car and get one that's slower, less luxurious, and missing a lot of the tech I'm used to. Where should my head be and what type of vehicles represent a middle ground here?
Why is this a problem? Can you afford the cars or not? If yes, then congratulations - your money has bought you happiness. If not, then go buy a CRV/RAV4/other boring appliance vehicle. Some people don't care for nicer cars and that's fine. But since you do (and I relate to that), I wouldn't worry about it unless you are in financial trouble - which doesn't sound like it since you're paying cash. If you're paying cash on new, you're also using your money inefficiently, but that's a whole other topic.

If you don't need the horsepower but want the luxury and tech, look at certified Range Rovers. They make no pretensions about being sporty, and the warranty should cover the inevitable reliability issues that come up.

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lthenderson
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Re: Car Shopping, Seem to lose my Boglehead way each time help!!

Post by lthenderson » Fri Sep 07, 2018 9:02 am

adam61 wrote:
Fri Sep 07, 2018 6:06 am
Things I do Right:
-Keep Cars 9-10 years so the brutal depreciation isn't so jarring

Things I do Wrong:
-Always buy new

As I only drive 6k Miles/yr and my wife only 9k,

If you are selling cars you purchased new with only 60k to 90k miles on the odometer, you definitely are giving away a lot of money. I think it is a perfectly financially responsible thing to buy new but with modern cars and longevity, you need to drive them twice as many miles as you do before thinking about selling them. Many people can't stand driving the same car that long and I understand that. For those people, you need to buy used, drive them for two or three years and sell them before repeating.

I've done both. My first vehicle I bought new 20 years ago and I still have it and drive it. It isn't too far off the mark cost wise from the next two or three vehicles I have owned which were all used ones that I bought with more than 100k miles on the odometer and put another 100k miles on them with little maintenance issues. The most expensive vehicle I have owned was one that I bought brand new and drove it for ten years before a freak hail storm totaled it out.

Murgatroyd
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Re: Car Shopping, Seem to lose my Boglehead way each time help!!

Post by Murgatroyd » Fri Sep 07, 2018 9:07 am

Adam, while not quite as fastidious or enthusiast as you, I also have always enjoyed driving a, let’s say, higher end car. And over recent years as I’ve driven less expensive cars as rentals, I’ve remarked how much better they are and conceivably closer in quality to more expensive options.

So as I approached retirement about 18 months ago and needing new wheels, I bought the highly rated Toyota Highlander. I like the idea of not worrying about it when parked in odd places, which is common for us due to our photography hobby. And I totally get why this vehicle is highly rated and popular.

But here’s what’s happening to me. I do not ENJOY it. And even though it does exactly what it’s supposed to it does nothing else. I honestly thought this would work and did not go into it lightly because I always try to be financially prudent. I have simply found it hard to move down the auto chain. This at a time of total FI. I think in a few years I’ll get a 2-3 year old “higher end” car again.

This is no disrespect for others. Just my experience.

mx711yam
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Re: Car Shopping, Seem to lose my Boglehead way each time help!!

Post by mx711yam » Fri Sep 07, 2018 9:08 am

At the dealership picking up a new truck now. I have an opposition to paying more than 30k for a new car but don't like used so I found a new f150 bare bones xlt for 28,700. Considering used go for about the same price may as well buy new. Don't be suckered into the features you don't need!

Texanbybirth
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Re: Car Shopping, Seem to lose my Boglehead way each time help!!

Post by Texanbybirth » Fri Sep 07, 2018 9:16 am

What's the problem here? You obviously have the money. You're not keeping your cars 10 years, though you're trying to convince yourself you're keeping them "long enough". Just admit you like nice, techy cars, and you want a new one every 7 years instead of 10 years. Yeah you're going to be giving up a lot of value by not driving them much, but who cares? You're not here complaining about not having enough money, you're just a sucker for new car marketing like so many other Americans. That's okay, and you're giving somebody else a great value on a trade-in. :happy

go_mets
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Re: Car Shopping, Seem to lose my Boglehead way each time help!!

Post by go_mets » Fri Sep 07, 2018 9:31 am

Watty wrote:
Fri Sep 07, 2018 8:36 am
adam61 wrote:
Fri Sep 07, 2018 6:06 am
However, call me a snob, but when I rent a car I feel completely out of place without all my tech and features.
A big problem with tech and features in a rental car is that how to use them often not obvious. Even if the rental car had them you likely would not use them.
I am curious what tech and features are in a high-end car that isn't found in a mid-end car like the Accord?
And I means ones that are obvious and not the safety-related ones under the hood which are important.
I am not being snide about this.
The only thing that I wish I had in my Accord that I don't have is a working radio --- the amplifier board in the Accord broke.
It is a known problem but my Accord isn't eligible for free replacement.

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wabbajack
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Re: Car Shopping, Seem to lose my Boglehead way each time help!!

Post by wabbajack » Fri Sep 07, 2018 10:26 am

Texanbybirth wrote:
Fri Sep 07, 2018 9:16 am
What's the problem here? You obviously have the money. You're not keeping your cars 10 years, though you're trying to convince yourself you're keeping them "long enough". Just admit you like nice, techy cars, and you want a new one every 7 years instead of 10 years. Yeah you're going to be giving up a lot of value by not driving them much, but who cares? You're not here complaining about not having enough money, you're just a sucker for new car marketing like so many other Americans. That's okay, and you're giving somebody else a great value on a trade-in. :happy
Pretty much what I said.
Except the sucker part. Depending on whether you believe that cars are an efficient market, the depreciation on cars may or may not be justified. You just have to come up with your own internal calculus of how much driving new is worth to you, and compare that with the market.

Texanbybirth
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Re: Car Shopping, Seem to lose my Boglehead way each time help!!

Post by Texanbybirth » Fri Sep 07, 2018 10:32 am

wabbajack wrote:
Fri Sep 07, 2018 10:26 am
Texanbybirth wrote:
Fri Sep 07, 2018 9:16 am
What's the problem here? You obviously have the money. You're not keeping your cars 10 years, though you're trying to convince yourself you're keeping them "long enough". Just admit you like nice, techy cars, and you want a new one every 7 years instead of 10 years. Yeah you're going to be giving up a lot of value by not driving them much, but who cares? You're not here complaining about not having enough money, you're just a sucker for new car marketing like so many other Americans. That's okay, and you're giving somebody else a great value on a trade-in. :happy
Pretty much what I said.
Except the sucker part. Depending on whether you believe that cars are an efficient market, the depreciation on cars may or may not be justified. You just have to come up with your own internal calculus of how much driving new is worth to you, and compare that with the market.
You're right, didn't see your post at first but we both even started off with a question!

The nice thing about driving a practically bottom-of-the-line car is that when we rent cars I'm always floored about how nice they are. :beer

bloom2708
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Re: Car Shopping, Seem to lose my Boglehead way each time help!!

Post by bloom2708 » Fri Sep 07, 2018 10:32 am

With 2 kids on the horizon, car needs change.

Based on your post I think you should get an Audi Q SUV that is big enough for future expansion. Probaby a Q7 (maybe Q5 although it might be too small).

It will give you the flair/features, feel like a luxury car and provide the space. I like Lexus sedans, but their SUV above the RX are meh. It won't look silly next to your Genesis like a CRV might. :x :(

You clearly can afford it. Kids add a whole new dimension. :wink: :shock:
"We are not here to please, but to provoke thoughtfulness." --Unknown Boglehead

adam61
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Re: Car Shopping, Seem to lose my Boglehead way each time help!!

Post by adam61 » Fri Sep 07, 2018 12:30 pm

So my best options to be a bit more boglehead are to
A) buy used about 3 years old and get over my proclivity for new
B) Keep them closer to 15 years then 9-10 allowing for 120-140k miles and more years for the deprecitation to amortize over.

Either way I’m wasting some money, but I can likely halve it this way.

Murgatroyd
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Re: Car Shopping, Seem to lose my Boglehead way each time help!!

Post by Murgatroyd » Fri Sep 07, 2018 1:14 pm

You may be stunned at how nice 2-3 year old cars are. At huge savings. Lots of low mileage leased vehicles turned in. Pull up one of the websites and search for under 20,000 miles on 2016’s.

researcher
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Re: Car Shopping, Seem to lose my Boglehead way each time help!!

Post by researcher » Fri Sep 07, 2018 1:28 pm

adam61 wrote:
Fri Sep 07, 2018 12:30 pm
So my best options to be a bit more boglehead are to
A) buy used about 3 years old and get over my proclivity for new
B) Keep them closer to 15 years then 9-10 allowing for 120-140k miles and more years for the deprecitation to amortize over.
not liking the idea of knowing how someone else used the vehicle as I am METICULOUS with maintenance, care, and usage
This is a no-brainer. Go with option B.

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Will do good
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Re: Car Shopping, Seem to lose my Boglehead way each time help!!

Post by Will do good » Fri Sep 07, 2018 1:33 pm

OP- What's your income, savings rate and Networth?
Maybe you can easily afford it or not.

mmmodem
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Re: Car Shopping, Seem to lose my Boglehead way each time help!!

Post by mmmodem » Fri Sep 07, 2018 1:48 pm

adam61 wrote:
Fri Sep 07, 2018 12:30 pm
So my best options to be a bit more boglehead are to
A) buy used about 3 years old and get over my proclivity for new
B) Keep them closer to 15 years then 9-10 allowing for 120-140k miles and more years for the deprecitation to amortize over.

Either way I’m wasting some money, but I can likely halve it this way.
Nope, I'd choose C. Continue doing what you have been doing. You can afford cash for your cars. You can afford cash for your cars. I wrote that twice for emphasis. Let that sink in a little... Why save money if not to buy things with it? What's the point in being a Boglehead if all you do is scrimp and save?

I have also succumbed to lifestyle creep in terms of automobiles. I must have power windows, keyless entry, backup cameras, and push button start. When I was in college, all I wanted was something that reliably moved. Do I feel guilty buying the higher trim model that includes Apple car play and a panoramic sunroof? Absolutely not! Because I am a Boglehead, I can afford these luxuries.

Being a Boglehead doesn't necessarily mean I buy used or I drive my car 15 years until it falls apart. Being a Boglehead means I purchase my vehicle for thousands less than the other guy because I purchased a year end model on clearance in an unpopular color that sat on the lot for months.

ssquared87
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Re: Car Shopping, Seem to lose my Boglehead way each time help!!

Post by ssquared87 » Fri Sep 07, 2018 1:50 pm

go_mets wrote:
Fri Sep 07, 2018 9:31 am
Watty wrote:
Fri Sep 07, 2018 8:36 am
adam61 wrote:
Fri Sep 07, 2018 6:06 am
However, call me a snob, but when I rent a car I feel completely out of place without all my tech and features.
A big problem with tech and features in a rental car is that how to use them often not obvious. Even if the rental car had them you likely would not use them.
I am curious what tech and features are in a high-end car that isn't found in a mid-end car like the Accord?
And I means ones that are obvious and not the safety-related ones under the hood which are important.
I am not being snide about this.
The only thing that I wish I had in my Accord that I don't have is a working radio --- the amplifier board in the Accord broke.
It is a known problem but my Accord isn't eligible for free replacement.
It’s less about the features and check boxes on the order sheet than it is about how the car drives. The accord is a spectacular car and has most of the features you’d get in a bmw or Mercedes. But the Accord is front wheel drive so the handling isn’t as good, the materials on the interior are nice quality but nowhere near the quality of the woods and leathers in the German cars, and the engine is not as powerful or as smooth. The infotainment system in the Honda does most of what my BMW does, but the BMW system is less distracting and is more snappy.

The accord is one of my favorite cars for the price so I don’t mean this to sound harsh. It’s an awesome car and I’ve had one myself, along with an Acura TSX which is the European Accord

That said, I got a BMW instead of an accord because I like the way it drives, appreciate the much more comfortable seats, and like the quality and design of the interior. I could have gotten an Accord for half the price, but for me the improved driving experience was worth the extra money. The only way to understand these differences is to test drive the car for yourself. No amount of reading specs or reading reviews can answer your question as the differences are more than just check boxes on an option sheet

adam61
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Re: Car Shopping, Seem to lose my Boglehead way each time help!!

Post by adam61 » Fri Sep 07, 2018 2:10 pm

Income is $150k in LCOL area
Only debt is 5 years remaining at 3.6% on 1st mortgage
Max both 401k @$37,000
Max both ROTH @$11,000
$5,000/yr going into 529
$5,900 to HSA
12 month emergency fund that gets bigger closer to car buying time
NW ~$1MM with the higher stock market
M37/F40

ncbill
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Re: Car Shopping, Seem to lose my Boglehead way each time help!!

Post by ncbill » Fri Sep 07, 2018 2:19 pm

adam61 wrote:
Fri Sep 07, 2018 12:30 pm
So my best options to be a bit more boglehead are to
A) buy used about 3 years old and get over my proclivity for new
B) Keep them closer to 15 years then 9-10 allowing for 120-140k miles and more years for the deprecitation to amortize over.

Either way I’m wasting some money, but I can likely halve it this way.
Or you could lease every 3 years if you really want "that new car smell."

And in month 35 get an offer for it from Carmax/Carvana/etc. - given your low mileage you might pocket a couple thousand bucks over the residual.

daveydoo
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Re: Car Shopping, Seem to lose my Boglehead way each time help!!

Post by daveydoo » Fri Sep 07, 2018 2:26 pm

adam61 wrote:
Fri Sep 07, 2018 6:06 am
As I only drive 6k Miles/yr and my wife only 9k, it often seems a waste to have big engines and tons of features for a 2-4 mile commute. However, call me a snob, but when I rent a car I feel completely out of place without all my tech and features.
You do most things right, imo. And Genesis is a lot of "value," although they don't necessarily prioritize the things I would.

But you could get a lot more mileage (no pun intended) out of your horsepower needs if you just bought smaller vehicles. Nothing in your post about needing a kid-hauler -- seems like it's mostly you on a quick commute. Get a GTI. A big car needs 400 hp to "feel" quick. You can get away with a lot less engine and cost in a smaller car -- and most high trim lines are pretty similar, features-wise (unless you must have heating and cooling seats, etc.)
"I mean, it's one banana, Michael...what could it cost? Ten dollars?"

inbox788
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Re: Car Shopping, Seem to lose my Boglehead way each time help!!

Post by inbox788 » Fri Sep 07, 2018 5:35 pm

adam61 wrote:
Fri Sep 07, 2018 6:06 am
Things I do Wrong:
-Buy too much Horsepower 400-500 when I want some get up and go 200-300 would be just fine and cost less and have more MPG

...it's difficult to trade-in a car and get one that's slower, less luxurious, and missing a lot of the tech I'm used to. Where should my head be and what type of vehicles represent a middle ground here?
You have many good options:

1) get a minivan
2) Wait an extra year, save up and get a loaded Genesis GV80
3) Don't buy something on this list, and feel good about not going overboard on the HP: https://cars.usnews.com/cars-trucks/hig ... power-suvs

Seems like you can afford to splurge a little, so indulge yourself, just a bit though.

RickBoglehead
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Re: Car Shopping, Seem to lose my Boglehead way each time help!!

Post by RickBoglehead » Fri Sep 07, 2018 5:54 pm

Discipline. If you don't think you have to have it, don't buy it.

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Re: Car Shopping, Seem to lose my Boglehead way each time help!!

Post by cdu7 » Fri Sep 07, 2018 6:24 pm

Ok, the first thing I’ll tell you is that Minivans are literally the single most useful vehicle that exist period. They are also typically less costly than their large SUV cousins and get better mileage to boot. That said I have two kids and drive 05 and 12 Toyota Camrys. So honestly I don’t think you need new cars until your old ones fall apart. But if you must, get a minivan.

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Watty
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Re: Car Shopping, Seem to lose my Boglehead way each time help!!

Post by Watty » Fri Sep 07, 2018 6:33 pm

go_mets wrote:
Fri Sep 07, 2018 9:31 am
Watty wrote:
Fri Sep 07, 2018 8:36 am
adam61 wrote:
Fri Sep 07, 2018 6:06 am
However, call me a snob, but when I rent a car I feel completely out of place without all my tech and features.
A big problem with tech and features in a rental car is that how to use them often not obvious. Even if the rental car had them you likely would not use them.
I am curious what tech and features are in a high-end car that isn't found in a mid-end car like the Accord?
And I means ones that are obvious and not the safety-related ones under the hood which are important.
I am not being snide about this.
The only thing that I wish I had in my Accord that I don't have is a working radio --- the amplifier board in the Accord broke.
It is a known problem but my Accord isn't eligible for free replacement.
I was thinking about things that that are hard to find like when there are not simple knobs and switches to change the AC temperature. I have been in a rental car where I had to pull over to figure out how to change the AC.

go_mets
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Joined: Wed Oct 21, 2015 11:49 am

Re: Car Shopping, Seem to lose my Boglehead way each time help!!

Post by go_mets » Fri Sep 07, 2018 6:37 pm

Watty wrote:
Fri Sep 07, 2018 6:33 pm
go_mets wrote:
Fri Sep 07, 2018 9:31 am
Watty wrote:
Fri Sep 07, 2018 8:36 am
adam61 wrote:
Fri Sep 07, 2018 6:06 am
However, call me a snob, but when I rent a car I feel completely out of place without all my tech and features.
A big problem with tech and features in a rental car is that how to use them often not obvious. Even if the rental car had them you likely would not use them.
I am curious what tech and features are in a high-end car that isn't found in a mid-end car like the Accord?
And I means ones that are obvious and not the safety-related ones under the hood which are important.
I am not being snide about this.
The only thing that I wish I had in my Accord that I don't have is a working radio --- the amplifier board in the Accord broke.
It is a known problem but my Accord isn't eligible for free replacement.
I was thinking about things that that are hard to find like when there are not simple knobs and switches to change the AC temperature. I have been in a rental car where I had to pull over to figure out how to change the AC.
I think I misquoted.
I meant to ask the OP what "tech and features" are in high end cars that are not found in an Accord thus making him feel "out of place".


.

delamer
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Re: Car Shopping, Seem to lose my Boglehead way each time help!!

Post by delamer » Fri Sep 07, 2018 7:27 pm

Murgatroyd wrote:
Fri Sep 07, 2018 1:14 pm
You may be stunned at how nice 2-3 year old cars are. At huge savings. Lots of low mileage leased vehicles turned in. Pull up one of the websites and search for under 20,000 miles on 2016’s.
We buy luxury cars that are 2-3 years old. Itis easy to find them with low mileage and in excellent condition.

But we live in a HCOL area.

The market might be different for the OP who lives in a LCOL.

NextMil
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Re: Car Shopping, Seem to lose my Boglehead way each time help!!

Post by NextMil » Fri Sep 07, 2018 7:57 pm

delamer wrote:
Fri Sep 07, 2018 7:27 pm
Murgatroyd wrote:
Fri Sep 07, 2018 1:14 pm
You may be stunned at how nice 2-3 year old cars are. At huge savings. Lots of low mileage leased vehicles turned in. Pull up one of the websites and search for under 20,000 miles on 2016’s.
We buy luxury cars that are 2-3 years old. Itis easy to find them with low mileage and in excellent condition.

But we live in a HCOL area.

The market might be different for the OP who lives in a LCOL.
Count me in this cohort as well. One of the vehicles I am looking at right now is 3 years old and it’s half the $50k new price with an engine that is barely broken in, and still under warranty.

tim1999
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Re: Car Shopping, Seem to lose my Boglehead way each time help!!

Post by tim1999 » Sat Sep 08, 2018 8:40 am

I really like the Genesis with the V8. Great cars. But they have horrible depreciation in the first 3 years compared to other cars. Dealer lots around me have a ton of off-lease 2015's with the V8 and low mileage for $25-$28k asking prices that have been sitting for months, half or less of what they were priced new. A lot of car for the money at that price.

Keep your cars but consider buying slightly used for your next Genesis if you go with another one.

adam61
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Joined: Sat Nov 08, 2008 6:10 pm

Re: Car Shopping, Seem to lose my Boglehead way each time help!!

Post by adam61 » Mon Sep 10, 2018 5:31 pm

Lots of help here thanks again. I think my plan is to get the luxury I want, but lose some of the depreciation is to buy 3 year old Entry Level Luxury vehicles like the Genesis/Audi/Lexus, but let the first owner eat most of that cost. However, one final hurdle, my wife is not keen on driving the 2011 til 2026 or so when it will have 130k-140k miles and be in our target range for replacement. She has the feeling once completely out of warranty we will spend a lot on upkeep and maintenance and stuck on the side of the road. Where can I point her to show newer cars don't tend to have these problems from 100-150k miles and even if there are 1-2 it's still cheaper than our current purchase method? I thought I was a bit snobby with luxury but she considers a 12-15 year old car a "beater" whether it's a Mercedes or a Toyota.

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