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Mr400meterdash
Posts: 54
Joined: Wed Dec 13, 2017 10:24 am

Job Search

Post by Mr400meterdash » Tue Aug 21, 2018 3:50 pm

Hello all,

A little background on me.

I am 23 years old, my wife is 21. I graduated college in 2017 and she still has one year left of undergrad and then on to grad school. She is going to be a physicians assistant.

I graduated with a major in kinesiology as I wanted to be a physical therapist. I did a 10 week internship at the end and realized that was not what I wanted to do. (I had volunteered already for about 500 hours or so before the internship but the internship is what made me realize it).

I want to be a fee only financial advisor and give people advice on finance for a fee but I understand that is not a great full time job, at least not at first. I work at a bank right now as a personal banker making not a lot of money. I would like to begin my process towards becoming an advisor but our bank has an advisor so I can't do it on the side due to a conflict of interest. I have talked to the bank about getting me a job as an advisor for them but I would have to do it their way which is not what I want.

I do not want to stay where I am at for a lot longer as it is hard to sustain a living wage for 2 off of one low salary. I live in Iowa and there are not a lot of big firms unless you work in Des Moines.. which I cannot go to with my wife in school.

Do any of you have any suggestions on job careers that pay decent in the finance world that would not be a conflict of interest? If you have any questions, please feel free to ask and I will make an edit on my post.

Thanks!!

JoeRetire
Posts: 1681
Joined: Tue Jan 16, 2018 2:44 pm

Re: Job Search

Post by JoeRetire » Tue Aug 21, 2018 4:01 pm

Mr400meterdash wrote:
Tue Aug 21, 2018 3:50 pm
I am 23 years old, my wife is 21. I graduated college in 2017 and she still has one year left of undergrad and then on to grad school. She is going to be a physicians assistant.

I graduated with a major in kinesiology as I wanted to be a physical therapist. I did a 10 week internship at the end and realized that was not what I wanted to do. (I had volunteered already for about 500 hours or so before the internship but the internship is what made me realize it).

I want to be a fee only financial advisor and give people advice on finance for a fee but I understand that is not a great full time job, at least not at first. I work at a bank right now as a personal banker making not a lot of money. I would like to begin my process towards becoming an advisor but our bank has an advisor so I can't do it on the side due to a conflict of interest. I have talked to the bank about getting me a job as an advisor for them but I would have to do it their way which is not what I want.

I do not want to stay where I am at for a lot longer as it is hard to sustain a living wage for 2 off of one low salary. I live in Iowa and there are not a lot of big firms unless you work in Des Moines.. which I cannot go to with my wife in school.

Do any of you have any suggestions on job careers that pay decent in the finance world that would not be a conflict of interest? If you have any questions, please feel free to ask and I will make an edit on my post.
You don't have the education or training yet to become a well-paid fee only financial adviser. And you don't want to do it "their way". That leaves few choices.

Keep the bank job and add a second (perhaps part-time) job so that you can pay the bills. Stay at these jobs at least until your wife graduates and gets a good job with a good salary.

Then, start your education and your path toward being a fee only financial adviser "your way" (whatever that is).

Mr400meterdash
Posts: 54
Joined: Wed Dec 13, 2017 10:24 am

Re: Job Search

Post by Mr400meterdash » Tue Aug 21, 2018 4:30 pm

I need to take the series 65 to start giving out advice. That is all the training that is required. I have been studying on my own but haven't taken the steps toward the test because I would need to get licensed and start being an advisor within a year. That would be foolish of me to just quit and try to be an advisor without my wife having a job. I was only looking for another job besides the bank that would not have the conflict of interest that would still be in the finance world so that I could keep learning.

I won't explain my way on here but it would be very similar to other fee only advisors around the US. Fee for advice and if they want me to hold and manage assets, charge a monthly fee that does not come out of their retirement. That would be the basics of it

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CyclingDuo
Posts: 1836
Joined: Fri Jan 06, 2017 9:07 am

Re: Job Search

Post by CyclingDuo » Tue Aug 21, 2018 11:20 pm

Mr400meterdash wrote:
Tue Aug 21, 2018 3:50 pm
I am 23 years old, my wife is 21. I graduated college in 2017 and she still has one year left of undergrad and then on to grad school. She is going to be a physicians assistant.

I graduated with a major in kinesiology as I wanted to be a physical therapist. I did a 10 week internship at the end and realized that was not what I wanted to do. (I had volunteered already for about 500 hours or so before the internship but the internship is what made me realize it).

I want to be a fee only financial advisor and give people advice on finance for a fee but I understand that is not a great full time job, at least not at first. I work at a bank right now as a personal banker making not a lot of money. I would like to begin my process towards becoming an advisor but our bank has an advisor so I can't do it on the side due to a conflict of interest. I have talked to the bank about getting me a job as an advisor for them but I would have to do it their way which is not what I want.

I do not want to stay where I am at for a lot longer as it is hard to sustain a living wage for 2 off of one low salary. I live in Iowa and there are not a lot of big firms unless you work in Des Moines.. which I cannot go to with my wife in school.

Do any of you have any suggestions on job careers that pay decent in the finance world that would not be a conflict of interest? If you have any questions, please feel free to ask and I will make an edit on my post.
It's not easy to make a living wage that is high enough to support one, let alone two right out of college in most fields. That's why many are dual income households and literally forced to live on the super cheap in the early going years. Marrying before one is even out of college puts a tremendous amount of strain on a young relationship due to the finances. It's going to take some sacrifices to pay the bills on one low salary income, so hopefully you have chosen housing and a lifestyle that is within your means for this point in your young life. Can your wife pick up a part-time job as well between her classes and studies?

Average salary of a PT is not much different than that of a Financial Advisor (both are around $86-90K per year in the US). You have the basic training and one internship under your belt for the PT career path which you could pursue, but have decided not to at this time. You have none under your belt for the FA. Have you really studied that career path to know if it is a dying breed, or is it a career path that shows there is industry growth? At least here at BH.org, we'd probably all claim it's a dying breed since most of us are the DIY crowd.

It's not unheard of to want to explore several career path options, but if you feel the calling to work in finance, you might ask around in (Ames/Iowa City - where are you?) for possible entry level positions at some of the firms (TIAA, EJ, Farm Bureau, private firms, independent firms, etc...) to see what path somebody right of school your age would be able to take to pursue that career and get a foot in the door. Check within the insurance industry as well. Then find out what type of income you realistically could make in the early years while you are building a base and how long it takes to get a clientele going. I don't know how many clients would seek out a 22-30 year old "financial advisor" as I would imagine it takes a good decade to build the skills, experience, and expertise to start to offer clients something of value (most of that experience gained working for other firms in your early years). Too bad you were not able to do a paid internship or two in finance while an undergraduate. You still should seek some of those opportunities out. Have you thought about getting a master's degree to specialize a bit more for a specific field (business, finance, economics, etc...)?

Attend as many job fairs as possible and test the market to see what is out there that might pay more than your bank job pays at the moment that you are qualified to do with the training that you have, or the training a company would be willing to provide for you if hired. Iowa Work Force Development (Iowa Works) offers job fairs, additional training and help for you to pursue jobs in your area. I would check with them for some guidance and help. Assuming you are still living in the town where you went to school, utilize your school's career guidance center as well.

In the meantime, sounds like making ends meet with your current job and budget may be solved if you take on a second job to bring in more income while your wife finishes her undergraduate degree, and her graduate degree. If she could also take on a part-time job to bring in a little money between classes and study, that would be beneficial to both of your finances as well. It will also create an additional level of strain (long hours, not seeing each other very much, being tired, etc...). However, those are the types of sacrifices adults make to be successful and build careers to pay the bills.

Tough spot to be in being so young, but we certainly wish you both all the best.
"Everywhere is within walking distance if you have the time." ~ Steven Wright

Mr400meterdash
Posts: 54
Joined: Wed Dec 13, 2017 10:24 am

Re: Job Search

Post by Mr400meterdash » Wed Aug 22, 2018 9:02 am

CyclingDuo:

A little bit more information for me would be that yes I don't make a ton of money but she and I are/were both D1 athletes and have no debt plus she gets a stipend for living which brings an extra $800 or so in plus my salary. We do alright for the 3 of us but we are on the low end. We can put away a little savings every month but I have had to stop my IRA contributions for a little bit. We live in a small apartment and are very frugal with our money. She cannot pick up a job because she is a full time student and practices 20+ hours a week for her sport.

And for the PT, I would have to go at least a minimum of 60 grand in debt for PT school. I would have been a decent PT but I was not passionate about it in the end.. I am passionate about helping people with their money though. And here on the BH website, I would say its a dying breed as well but outside of BH's there are millions of people out there that are clueless.

I know that this is what I would like to do as I study and research it in my free time. I know that this isn't something that won't happen in the next couple years but I want to start building towards it. I was wondering if it was a good idea to join a big firm even if they do things differently than what I would like just so that I could get experience.

I appreciate everything you said as it gives me a lot to think about.

IRT
Posts: 45
Joined: Mon Dec 11, 2017 1:38 pm

Re: Job Search

Post by IRT » Wed Aug 22, 2018 9:34 am

To build a client base you'll need credentials. The standard way of doing that is to get some education in the field, which can lead to a job in the field, which can lead to lead to other business opportunities.

The folks I know who run fee-only part-time advisor gigs all got their start in finance and rose up through the ranks until they had the credibility to make the moonlighting work worth their time. Believe it or not there are folks in finance who adhere to Boglehead philosophies.

You're young-- you've got plenty of time to make this happen, just understand that success will take time.

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CyclingDuo
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Re: Job Search

Post by CyclingDuo » Wed Aug 22, 2018 11:13 am

Mr400meterdash wrote:
Wed Aug 22, 2018 9:02 am
CyclingDuo:

A little bit more information for me would be that yes I don't make a ton of money but she and I are/were both D1 athletes and have no debt plus she gets a stipend for living which brings an extra $800 or so in plus my salary. We do alright for the 3 of us but we are on the low end. We can put away a little savings every month but I have had to stop my IRA contributions for a little bit. We live in a small apartment and are very frugal with our money. She cannot pick up a job because she is a full time student and practices 20+ hours a week for her sport.

And for the PT, I would have to go at least a minimum of 60 grand in debt for PT school. I would have been a decent PT but I was not passionate about it in the end.. I am passionate about helping people with their money though. And here on the BH website, I would say its a dying breed as well but outside of BH's there are millions of people out there that are clueless.

I know that this is what I would like to do as I study and research it in my free time. I know that this isn't something that won't happen in the next couple years but I want to start building towards it. I was wondering if it was a good idea to join a big firm even if they do things differently than what I would like just so that I could get experience.

I appreciate everything you said as it gives me a lot to think about.
Yes, that helps give a clearer picture. I'm glad you are passionate about helping people with their money. The trick is to turn that passion into a sustainable income and career. Not every passion leads to sustainable household income, so my suggestion was simply to keep several passions alive and continue your research on which passion(s) can realistically be used to leverage a lifetime of earnings.

Sounds like you are being frugal and making ends meet at the moment while still being able to save a little bit. Your wife's scholarship and to maintain it through her training and performance is certainly a form of "work" as it is. A+ for all of that. I've been advising college students for 15 years, and one item I always point out to students who are in fear of the dreaded student loan debt is for them to study the ROI of a college degree(s). The latest data I use in class is the excellent research and data from this document: https://www2.ed.gov/policy/highered/reg ... payoff.pdf

My father-in-law was a PT and certainly telegraphed to us how that particular industry adapted and changed over the decades. He had his own PT business with partners. Their advanced degrees all made "the college payoff" well worth it and their careers and business flourished. I graduated with my advanced degree in 1985 with the equivalent of $42K in student loan debt (in today's dollars) at double digit interest rates. I've been working for 33 years to date since then and the ROI on the advanced degree has been totally worth it. Not saying you have to pursue PT, but look at the data in the above PDF to take a look at fields/careers and what various degrees lead to for a lifetime of earnings. Although it may sound cavalier, $60K for an advanced degree is chump change compared to the ROI that advanced degree will bring you over a lifetime of earnings. There is a good chance you are going to need some additional schooling to pursue something in finance as it is, so spending money on more education/training to make more money is the ROI equation for financial advising as well.

My fear for pursuing that industry is that if you study what is already happening in the industry this decade, the continuation of financial advising that is available through apps, on the internet, robo-tech, etc....is that the technology will just continue to decrease the amount of people that ever actually go visit a financial advisor. (That number as a percentage is and was already low.) I don't think it is confined only to astute BH forum members, but it has been rapidly growing over the past decade to infiltrate a healthy portion of households.

Investment management is becoming so easy and fully automated by technology that is already saving investors lots of fees and taxes. Those already in the industry are scrambling to adapt as fast as they can to escape extinction, so I just think it is worth pointing out what is going on within the industry. Those of us who have been clients and investors for several decades have experienced this first hand - especially since 2000 and it seems to ramp up every year with what is easily available these days. It is always difficult to map out and predict the future of any industry, but is very important when considering career longevity.

My guess is a lot of advisors get their training and background working for larger firms like Fidelity, Schwab, Wells Fargo, BofA Merrill, Edward Jones, Farm Bureau, Voya, Ameritrade, etc.... before branching out to be a fee only private firm. At least that's what I see in terms of running into the younger people working in the industry. They seem to be doing the entry level grunt jobs at these larger firms while they are working their way up in the larger firms - whether they stay there or branch off to smaller, private firms later. You may have a good opportunity to utilize your D1 athletic status to target those you know in sports and similar interests in the early going to build clientele once you get all of the training you need to pursue it. In addition to your current job at the bank, anything in customer service, sales, retail, credit bureau, consumer counseling services, accounting, taxes would be good background experience for an eventual goal of financial advising. Trying to get some job shadowing in with a fee only financial advisor in your area would be crucial to pick their brains and observe what they do. A few calls and handshakes go a long way to uncover some potential relationships in that regard where you might be able to do some shadowing. TIAA has an office in Ames and Coralville and is the financial firm that handles most college and university professors retirement plans. You may want to check in with the office where you live as some possible shadowing or employment options. At the very least, they can all tell you exactly the training/schooling path needed to become a successful financial advisor. Although TIAA faced a bit of a speed bump pushing products and fees in the past few years, they have a long history of being one of the good companies for their clients and they are scrambling to earn that trust back at the moment. I wouldn't hesitate to check it out.

We all survived our 20's and you will as well. Most of us would love to do it all over again just for the sake of youthful exploration. However, thinking back on the finances, the strain and struggle of living on lower incomes and rising through the ranks always balances out any fantasy of reliving that period of our lives again. The closest we get to that is via our children (we have two in their twenties).

:sharebeer
Last edited by CyclingDuo on Wed Aug 22, 2018 11:40 am, edited 5 times in total.
"Everywhere is within walking distance if you have the time." ~ Steven Wright

Thegame14
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Re: Job Search

Post by Thegame14 » Wed Aug 22, 2018 11:16 am

he talked about wife and himself, then said the three of us do all right for ourselves.... Did I miss something?

Sounds like the best plan is to stay the course and then interview with a big firm in Des Moines when she approaches graduation.

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market timer
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Re: Job Search

Post by market timer » Wed Aug 22, 2018 11:32 am

The job of fee-only financial advisor seems like it won't survive the roboadvisors like Wealthfront. You studied toward a career that should be relatively immune from automation. I'd suggest sticking with that and applying your interest in finance to managing your own investments.

Mr400meterdash
Posts: 54
Joined: Wed Dec 13, 2017 10:24 am

Re: Job Search

Post by Mr400meterdash » Wed Aug 22, 2018 1:56 pm

Thegame14 wrote:
Wed Aug 22, 2018 11:16 am
he talked about wife and himself, then said the three of us do all right for ourselves.... Did I miss something?

Sounds like the best plan is to stay the course and then interview with a big firm in Des Moines when she approaches graduation.
nope, just a mistype!

Keenobserver
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Re: Job Search

Post by Keenobserver » Wed Aug 22, 2018 9:20 pm

Physical Therapy is a great career. Flexible hours, many different settings, and can work anywhere in the country. Needs are projected to increase natioanaly. I cant believe you would turn it down and indulge in becoming a " financial advisor". Do you realize hoe hard it is to get people to pay you to give them financial advise? Do you know you will be competing with MBAs and other fancy degrees? What makes you so sure you will be happy with it? Get your PT degree choose the hrs, location, and setting you want to work. Dont be naive. A job is a job and PT is flexible anf lucrative then many. What if your wife also foesnt like being a PA and quits? Just my 2 cents.

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tennisplyr
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Re: Job Search

Post by tennisplyr » Thu Aug 23, 2018 7:35 am

Keenobserver wrote:
Wed Aug 22, 2018 9:20 pm
Physical Therapy is a great career. Flexible hours, many different settings, and can work anywhere in the country. Needs are projected to increase natioanaly. I cant believe you would turn it down and indulge in becoming a " financial advisor". Do you realize hoe hard it is to get people to pay you to give them financial advise? Do you know you will be competing with MBAs and other fancy degrees? What makes you so sure you will be happy with it? Get your PT degree choose the hrs, location, and setting you want to work. Dont be naive. A job is a job and PT is flexible anf lucrative then many. What if your wife also foesnt like being a PA and quits? Just my 2 cents.
+1
Those who move forward with a happy spirit will find that things always work out.

Mr400meterdash
Posts: 54
Joined: Wed Dec 13, 2017 10:24 am

Re: Job Search

Post by Mr400meterdash » Thu Aug 23, 2018 8:44 am

Keenobserver wrote:
Wed Aug 22, 2018 9:20 pm
Physical Therapy is a great career. Flexible hours, many different settings, and can work anywhere in the country. Needs are projected to increase natioanaly. I cant believe you would turn it down and indulge in becoming a " financial advisor". Do you realize hoe hard it is to get people to pay you to give them financial advise? Do you know you will be competing with MBAs and other fancy degrees? What makes you so sure you will be happy with it? Get your PT degree choose the hrs, location, and setting you want to work. Dont be naive. A job is a job and PT is flexible anf lucrative then many. What if your wife also foesnt like being a PA and quits? Just my 2 cents.
It really is a great career IF you want to go into it. I definitely don't and I dont think you want a PT working on you that hates their job. Life isn't all about the money. It is also about quality of life. I may retire with a couple less million but if I am happy, who cares. And I do realize how hard it is to get people to pay you for financial advise and thats why I want to do it on the side at first and if I can get something built up, then great! But the whole point of my first post was to find jobs that I could do that were in the finance field that would not interfere with giving advice on the side.

And about my wife, she wants to go into the medical field whether it be a nurse, a NP, or a PA. She has multiple options and she can go any route you want. Nursing is just a broad title as you can specialize in anything. And if she doesn't like it, then we find something else. Life moves on and we can adapt.

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