Sail boat budget

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daggerboard
Posts: 117
Joined: Tue Jan 24, 2012 2:16 pm

Sail boat budget

Post by daggerboard » Thu Jul 19, 2018 8:36 pm

Any sailors here who can share their annual budget for a sail boat? I assume motor boats are a different animal.

Looking in the $50-150k range, likely used, 3-5 years old.

Cruising, messing around, no serious racing (i.e. I dont need a new set of sails every season).

Curious what to assume as % of boat value for all the boat ownership line items...

Tks!

mikepru
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Re: Sail boat budget

Post by mikepru » Thu Jul 19, 2018 9:18 pm

How big of a sailboat are you thinking? Where will you be sailing--ocean, gulf, great lakes, etc? What kind of sailing--overnights, multi-day excursions, daysails, etc? Also, local markets are important--some areas have lots of options re: sales, marinas, etc,: other area less.

McCharley
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Re: Sail boat budget

Post by McCharley » Fri Jul 20, 2018 12:05 am

Well, I had a 27 foot boat moored in Seattle. It was about $350/mo. for the 30' slip. :moneybag

Boats always need something, and it's always expensive. They need to be hauled and painted, etc. My boat needed the mast varnished. (!) I'd count on $1500/yr. in maintenance if you do your own work. Triple it if you have others do it.

$50k to $150k is a huge range. Big boats are WAY more expensive than little ones. You should decide which exact used boat you want and then figure this out.

In your range, my favorite would be the bristol channel cutter. :D She's a classic, but she has a bowsprit which will count towards your slip length.

4nwestsaylng
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Re: Sail boat budget

Post by 4nwestsaylng » Fri Jul 20, 2018 12:22 am

I agree it depends what you are doing-cruising, overnight, etc.. You have a generous budget range, so I assume a large one. Seems if you can afford that range you shouldn't be worrying too much about annual expense. If you can add an estimated $15k annually for moorage ,painting, etc (this is probably too conservative) and not blink, then no worries.

I would rather have a trailerable Lightning or 505 dinghy-lots of action, very affordable. But sometimes you do get wet, in the 505....

smitcat
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Re: Sail boat budget

Post by smitcat » Fri Jul 20, 2018 9:50 am

daggerboard wrote:
Thu Jul 19, 2018 8:36 pm
Any sailors here who can share their annual budget for a sail boat? I assume motor boats are a different animal.

Looking in the $50-150k range, likely used, 3-5 years old.

Cruising, messing around, no serious racing (i.e. I dont need a new set of sails every season).

Curious what to assume as % of boat value for all the boat ownership line items...

Tks!
Please post size of boat, where you are located, salt or fresh water use, systems on the boat (power, diesel or gas, onboard electric, AC etc) whether the boat will be in or out of the water part year, what you intend to do with maintenance on the boat (all paid or self done).
It would be impossible to even guess a number based upon what is posted so far.

renue74
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Re: Sail boat budget

Post by renue74 » Fri Jul 20, 2018 10:17 am

Oh goodness. I have a little old 23' Oday and that thing costs me about $1500/year in maintenance. I can only imagine how much a $100K sailboat would cost.

I love sailing, but with most hobbies I have, they last a few long years and then my passions take me to other endeavors.

In the case of sailing, I sailed my little Oday for about 6 years. Family got older, it got harder to convince anybody to go with me....even though the boat was moored at a family lake house. Eventually, it broke it's mooring and I ended up selling the boat at a loss.

Good times.

Perhaps if maintenance is high in your area, you might want to look at fractional ownership or fractional rental of a boat.

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bligh
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Re: Sail boat budget

Post by bligh » Fri Jul 20, 2018 11:10 am

The rule of thumb that I have seen many people follow is that you budget 5% of the value of the boat for maintenance each year. Every 20 years you've basically re bought your boat. As others have posted, this will vary based on where the boat is (tropical vs cold water climates, fresh vs salt, etc.). Labor costs will vary by region and how much of the maintenance you will do yourself. Parts cost will vary based on how complex and high end the systems on your boat are.

Add in your slip/mooring costs, or storage on the hard in the off-season.. if you sail instead of motoring the fuel costs shouldn't add up to too much.

If you love sailing and charter often, don't forget to subtract those costs since you wont need to be doing that anymore. :) If these costs aren't significant, then you should probably do more chartering first instead of going straight to owning a boat.

One option many people take is to put their boat into a charter fleet to offset the maintenance/slip costs of the boat. Different programs give you different levels of control over how much your boat is chartered out and who gets to do it. Some of the larger charter companies let you charter in different locations for free in different locations in the world as an offset too. Take a look at this as an example : https://www.mooringsyachtownership.com/program-details

I am not affiliated with moorings nor do I have a boat out for charter. Just giving you options to offset the cost of owning a boat. Look at the numbers and see if it is a good deal or not. 12 weeks of sailing, with access to worldwide cruising grounds, seems like a good option over ownership if you charter a lot.

Whatever you choose. I wish you Fair winds! :sharebeer

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WestUniversity
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Re: Sail boat budget

Post by WestUniversity » Fri Jul 20, 2018 2:37 pm

McCharley wrote:
Fri Jul 20, 2018 12:05 am
Well, I had a 27 foot boat moored in Seattle. It was about $350/mo. for the 30' slip. :moneybag
That sounds about the same for us. We had a 31’. Slip fees, utilities, and insurance was about $250 to $300 per month. Maintenace was also a huge expense. Getting the boat hauled out for a bottom job, repacking the shaft seal on the propeller (inboard), and endless other expenses that always seemed to cost either $50 or $1000 and of course all the parts had to be rated “marine duty” i.e., $$$$.

If I were to do it again (and there is no way I would consider buying another big boat) but I would probably get a Beneteau. As I recall pricing was similar to Catalinas and Hunters but they seemed to hold their value better. Aside from that I really like their boats.

smitcat
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Re: Sail boat budget

Post by smitcat » Fri Jul 20, 2018 3:05 pm

WestUniversity wrote:
Fri Jul 20, 2018 2:37 pm
McCharley wrote:
Fri Jul 20, 2018 12:05 am
Well, I had a 27 foot boat moored in Seattle. It was about $350/mo. for the 30' slip. :moneybag
That sounds about the same for us. We had a 31’. Slip fees, utilities, and insurance was about $250 to $300 per month. Maintenace was also a huge expense. Getting the boat hauled out for a bottom job, repacking the shaft seal on the propeller (inboard), and endless other expenses that always seemed to cost either $50 or $1000 and of course all the parts had to be rated “marine duty” i.e., $$$$.

If I were to do it again (and there is no way I would consider buying another big boat) but I would probably get a Beneteau. As I recall pricing was similar to Catalinas and Hunters but they seemed to hold their value better. Aside from that I really like their boats.
But we do not know where is is to help him..... around here the costs for a slip alone are aorund $200/running foot a year or $6,200 for a 31" boat.
We have had many boats and would definatly do it again.

daggerboard
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Re: Sail boat budget

Post by daggerboard » Sat Jul 21, 2018 12:09 am

OP here

Sorry for the vague question.

Great lakes area (so fresh water but take out of water for off season)
Lets assume its a J105 or something similar, say $100k price point
Mostly day sailing and some light 2-3 night cruising
Occasional regatta but nothing serious, obviously would love to do the Mackinack once, which would require special outfitting (not what I am asking)


Mooring costs are easy enough to figure from city website

But what about:
Insurance
Typical maintenance (lets assume I pay $ vs doing self), parts etc
Modest sail replacement cycle
Club dues, fees
Other costs

I have sailed everything from optimists (was much younger obv) to transocean racers, and have spent months of my life at sea doing long-haul sailing. I have been around boats all my life with access via family, friends and clubs. But for the past few years, my access has ceased and I find myself considering taking the plunge. Buying a boat would be a financial drag - after all you can simulate it by standing in a cold water shower with your clothes on slowing tearing hundred dollar bills in half - but I would like to get a feel how big of drag above and beyond the cost of buying the boat itself. A recent visit to a West Marine store and browsing their sailing hardware section made it clear just how crazy expensive some of the simplest items are.

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MP123
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Re: Sail boat budget

Post by MP123 » Sun Jul 22, 2018 11:25 am

One of the cardinal rules of boat ownership is that you never add up all the associated costs. And if by some chance you do under no circumstances should you share info that with your spouse. :happy

Having owned a 35' sailboat for many years I'd guess your annual expenses would be in the $10-15k/yr range all things considered. Maybe a little more at first.

J105 is a nice boat. A good set of racing sails that will last a few seasons is $15k. Maybe you want a dinghy and outboard to do some cruising? $10k. Slip fees, haulout, bottom paint, engine work, insurance, running rigging, winch handles (overboard!), flares, fire extinguishers, dock lines, fenders, PFDs, foulies, navigation, electronics, radios, and so on.

Nothing lasts long when it's floating on top of the water. The wind might be free but everything else on a sailboat costs a lot of money, even doing most of the work yourself you still need to buy the parts.

The initial cost of the boat is just the beginning. Worth every cent of course...

vveat
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Re: Sail boat budget

Post by vveat » Sun Jul 22, 2018 1:03 pm

I can give you numbers for a smaller one - a 24' Seawind catamaran, it's old so more maintenance but husband is DIY type
Pretty steady $6500-$7500 a year (not including new sails), of which $3000 are the club fees (incl. food), the rest is maintenance.

satoriboat
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Re: Sail boat budget

Post by satoriboat » Sun Jul 22, 2018 1:40 pm

I have owned various sailboats one after another since 1976. Our home waters are San Francisco Bay and the furthest we have cruised is to the Sea of Cortez for several years. Owning a sailboat will cost you more than you think in ways that you cannot even imagine. The obvious expenses like slip, insurance, taxes, fuel and routine maintence are just the tip of the iceberg. Gear grows old and needs to be replaced. Gear becomes out dated and needs to be replaced. New gear comes along. We sailed from San Francisco to Cabo San Lucas and way up into the Sea of Cortez. No GPS, no radar, no windlass, no outboard on our tender,,, you get the idea. Eventually we had all these things. All cost money and all break. So your budget will be more than you think. Most sailors don't really want to add it all up cause it is too much, OWNING A SAILBOAT IS THE MOST UNBOGLEHEAD THING YOU CAN DO.
We own a Freedom 32,,, she is old. I do lots of work myself. I think I spend about $ 700.00 a month but who knows. And we paid cash,,, no payment. If you own the boat long enough major stuff will go,,, sails and the diesel. The numbers are staggering. Here is the worst of it. Try to get a rough idea how much you spend a year and divide that number by the number of hours you spend at sea. Oh my god....... You could increase your hours at sea to reduce your hourly cost but you might have kids who play soccer or join a swim team. And here on San Francisco Bay the support system you need to keep you going to disappearing. Wrenches retireing, boat yards closing,,,,Don't get me wrong,,,,, I don't regret any of it. BUT if you don't own a boat now and I suspect you don't or you wouldn't be asking,,,,,,, start with a smaller, cheaper boat ,,, learn what boat ownership is all about. I would even go so far as to say get an outboard powered boat with minimal systems. Have a boat but keep your life too.

blastoff
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Re: Sail boat budget

Post by blastoff » Mon Jul 23, 2018 10:58 am

Others have chimed in with cost.

Serious racing will blow through money.

And depends how much work you want to do. Painting bottom isn't hard.

Some boat ideas.

Beneteau first 10r isn't horrible deal if like assyn.

J109 may be within reach and has a nice class.

Benetaue 36.7 and 40.7 also have many boats on great lakes.

Otherwise, a mix of stuff out there for less money.

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