I need advice on having 2 jobs.

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achen9291
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I need advice on having 2 jobs.

Post by achen9291 »

My current employer is a large IT company that provides IT services including Cyber Security to clients as a MSSP. (Multi security service provider). I am a security analyst and it was my first job in security for the past 1.5 years. They pay decently well at 71k and it is not stressful at all. The hours are from 6pm-2am. I find myself not doing much/learning or growing with this company because of the way they do business and they also don't give raises/bonuses. Basically I feel that I hit a wall with no future because nothing has really changed in all the time I've been here. Staying here I know I can max out the 401k easily just by riding it out through the years.

I got offered a job with another company that is one of the big 4 accounting firms. The role is to provide cyber as a service, basically doing the same thing as my current job to provide service to clients. I saw that there is future growth with this company and I can learn real security work. The schedule is basically 8-5. but the problem is the salary is 55k. I was able to negotiate and they ended up giving me a 5k bonus on top of that. I accepted the job offer already because I felt like I needed to pursue this for long term future growth. The good thing is I can get paid overtime for working more hours. I don't know how much overtime they will allow me to work to make up for the difference in pay. The job is located in downtown so having to pay for parking adds up on expenses even with pretax benefits. It's also most likely more stressful than my current job.

I've felt strongly to keep my current job as well as work the new one, because it is easy money at my current role without much work at all, and flexible since it is in the night time. If I just worked the new job I'd feel like I gave away a 401k for the year and then I would feel like I'm taking a step backwards with my savings goals. I don't remember if I signed a non-compete with my current job. But either way, both jobs would be considered competitors right? Since I'm doing the same thing by providing cyber services to other businesses. I would love to keep both jobs but at the same time if it's illegal I wouldn't want to risk getting in trouble for. How would they find out? I didn't want to mention it to new employer out of fear that they wouldn't view me well for considering keeping the other job. I don't really have any direct bosses at my current job because people quit and leave so we have temporary directors managing us that I almost never see.

Any advice is appreciated, I guess I just feel worried about the pay because it's less than what I ever made at any job I ever had.
student
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Re: I need advice on having 2 jobs.

Post by student »

My knee jerk reaction is when do you sleep? If you do pursue this, you have to make sure that such arrangement does not violate any company policies, as you have already noted. Personally, I think this is not feasible for the long term.
Topic Author
achen9291
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Re: I need advice on having 2 jobs.

Post by achen9291 »

student wrote: Fri May 25, 2018 1:19 pm My knee jerk reaction is when do you sleep? If you do pursue this, you have to make sure that such arrangement does not violate any company policies, as you have already noted. Personally, I think this is not feasible for the long term.
Due to the nature of my current job.. there are many days where many of us do less than 10 minutes of work. Most of the work was given to our india counterparts but they still require US employees to manage a few clients. Nothing really happens in their environments so most people will read, sleep, browse the web, etc. The whole organization and the surrounding teams we work with seem to be doing the same thing "taking money from the company" because there's really no work to do. and I would say alot of people take advantage of it, but also the turnover is high, people leave quick because there's just no growth. As of now, my job here is stable.

I was not planning to have it long term. I am single right now, my main focus on the money was to save enough to max out the 401k, and then meet my savings goals for a house/better vehicle.
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Pajamas
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Re: I need advice on having 2 jobs.

Post by Pajamas »

Could you outsource one of the positions?

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfr ... utsourcing
bloom2708
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Re: I need advice on having 2 jobs.

Post by bloom2708 »

All things equal, keep the $71k job. That is a big pay cut that you don't need to take.

Even if the hours do not overlap, both companies would likely have policies against moonlighting (working another job) in the same industry.
MtnTraveler
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Re: I need advice on having 2 jobs.

Post by MtnTraveler »

The 55k a year sounds beyond low for a cyber security position. With cyber security experience and certifications you should really be able to write your own ticket. I'd use the current job to study and get certs and then move on.
Loik098
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Re: I need advice on having 2 jobs.

Post by Loik098 »

achen9291 wrote: Fri May 25, 2018 1:32 pm
student wrote: Fri May 25, 2018 1:19 pm My knee jerk reaction is when do you sleep? If you do pursue this, you have to make sure that such arrangement does not violate any company policies, as you have already noted. Personally, I think this is not feasible for the long term.
Due to the nature of my current job.. there are many days where many of us do less than 10 minutes of work. Most of the work was given to our india counterparts but they still require US employees to manage a few clients. Nothing really happens in their environments so most people will read, sleep, browse the web, etc. The whole organization and the surrounding teams we work with seem to be doing the same thing "taking money from the company" because there's really no work to do. and I would say alot of people take advantage of it, but also the turnover is high, people leave quick because there's just no growth. As of now, my job here is stable.
Perhaps it's just me, but this statement, combined with your statement that your supervisors aren't present and turnover is high, suggests that your position is ripe for termination. Such a golden goose of a job doesn't usually last long: the company will eventually go bankrupt, be taken over, or figure out it's grossly overpaying its employees for their work and terminate/outsource.
Last edited by Loik098 on Fri May 25, 2018 3:51 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Jack FFR1846
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Re: I need advice on having 2 jobs.

Post by Jack FFR1846 »

Go for it!
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sailaway
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Re: I need advice on having 2 jobs.

Post by sailaway »

Have you read the non compete and moonlighting clauses of your contracts?
seashell
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Re: I need advice on having 2 jobs.

Post by seashell »

I second the advice on looking into company policy. I think a lot of employers do have rules against this. Better to be safe and look into this. Good luck
Good Listener
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Re: I need advice on having 2 jobs.

Post by Good Listener »

How do you get from the job ending at 5 pm to the one starting at 6pm? Doesn't that effectively rule out overtime from the first job?
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cheese_breath
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Re: I need advice on having 2 jobs.

Post by cheese_breath »

Good Listener wrote: Fri May 25, 2018 6:04 pm How do you get from the job ending at 5 pm to the one starting at 6pm? Doesn't that effectively rule out overtime from the first job?
Similar to what I was going to ask. Which job takes priority if the first job wants you to work overtime?
The surest way to know the future is when it becomes the past.
Kywildcat
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Re: I need advice on having 2 jobs.

Post by Kywildcat »

I work for a big 4 firm (salaried) and I know that my agreement says that I can’t have another job (or business) doing services that the employer provides.
Topic Author
achen9291
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Re: I need advice on having 2 jobs.

Post by achen9291 »

So I went ahead and emailed their independence department on if my current job is in conflict with their business (which I'm sure it is in my opinion).
Once I get the response early next week I will put in my notice at my current job. I don't want to deal with the risk of being sued, etc.

If I kept both jobs I wouldn't be able to work the overtime. I was going to consider the new job as primary. But if I kept only the new job I would be able to try to make up for the difference by working as much overtime as I can. At this point, keeping my current job only is not an option. I just have to prove myself and work hard in the next year or so to get myself in a position that pays more... I just hope I don't regret leaving my current job.
evestor
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Re: I need advice on having 2 jobs.

Post by evestor »

Read your employment agreements very carefully. Zero doubt in my mind you have to disclose each to the other. And even if you don't have to I would advise it. It is always better to take the high road.
If everyone is on board it's a discussion. If not, then it isn't and you have to make hard choices.
gotester2000
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Re: I need advice on having 2 jobs.

Post by gotester2000 »

Find something else that will help you grow and pays well. Doing 2 jobs for 17hr/day is sureshot health disaster in the waiting. Also move away from 6pm-2am crazy timing.
runner540
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Re: I need advice on having 2 jobs.

Post by runner540 »

Take the Big 4 job and the pay cut, and quit your overnight, dead end job. This is not a close call: big 4 will give you way more growth potential inside and outside the firm. They (Big 4) very reasonably expects you to be available to travel for clients and training, and is not going to approve a second job like yours.

The extra $16k between salaries is only a short term difference: you'll gain way more in employability and skills, but you will have to work and learn. You can't be falling asleep at the Big 4 or looking at your watch. Everyone else there has ONE full time job and is fully dedicated to it.
jminv
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Re: I need advice on having 2 jobs.

Post by jminv »

I would move jobs. 60 all in, in a position with income growth potential above inflation, promotions, and overtime vs 71 with no growth potential is not a big difference particularly since part of the difference could be considered a night shift differential.

You only have 1.5 years with current employer, silly to stay somewhere where you’ll be doing the same thing for same pay forever (and not day shift) when you have something available that will change your career trajectory and lead to greater total career earnings over time.

You won’t be able to do second job with big 4. Even if you had time, it’s seriously unlikely that you’re allowed to work for a company offering the same services ie a competitor at the same time. Focus on moving up the big 4 career ladder which is reason for the switch not a second job. Put everything into the new job to move up quickly.
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achen9291
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Re: I need advice on having 2 jobs.

Post by achen9291 »

I read through the policies and yes it was quite obvious that it would be a conflict of interest. Based on all of your advice, I will quit my current job and drain my PTO until the start date on June 11th. I will tell my current company I quit on June 9th, right before I start.
totallystudly
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Re: I need advice on having 2 jobs.

Post by totallystudly »

Am I the only one that thinks getting paid 71k to sleep is a sweet deal? I'd ride that pony as long as I could or at least stash my entire paycheck in retirement accounts for a few years...
Topic Author
achen9291
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Re: I need advice on having 2 jobs.

Post by achen9291 »

totallystudly wrote: Sat May 26, 2018 3:54 pm Am I the only one that thinks getting paid 71k to sleep is a sweet deal? I'd ride that pony as long as I could or at least stash my entire paycheck in retirement accounts for a few years...
It is a nice deal, that's why I was so convinced to keep the second job. a 71k bonus for 10 mins or less worth of work. I could have easily just maxed out the retirement accounts, and still would have been fine. But I think alot of people also are designed to want purpose, most people are driven towards actually doing something with their lives.
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Watty
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Re: I need advice on having 2 jobs.

Post by Watty »

I don't have a clue how this might work but it would be sweet if you could work it so that the Big 4 firm took on your current employer as a client and you would do your old job as a highly paid consultant, or you might get a big bonus for bringing in new business.
MtnTraveler wrote: Fri May 25, 2018 3:06 pm The 55k a year sounds beyond low for a cyber security position. With cyber security experience and certifications you should really be able to write your own ticket. I'd use the current job to study and get certs and then move on.


+1000

Even of a low cost of living area I would think that would easily be over $100K, but you might need to study to get some better certification.
gotester2000
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Re: I need advice on having 2 jobs.

Post by gotester2000 »

achen9291 wrote: Sat May 26, 2018 4:50 pm
totallystudly wrote: Sat May 26, 2018 3:54 pm Am I the only one that thinks getting paid 71k to sleep is a sweet deal? I'd ride that pony as long as I could or at least stash my entire paycheck in retirement accounts for a few years...
It is a nice deal, that's why I was so convinced to keep the second job. a 71k bonus for 10 mins or less worth of work. I could have easily just maxed out the retirement accounts, and still would have been fine. But I think alot of people also are designed to want purpose, most people are driven towards actually doing something with their lives.
Your human capital is your biggest asset. If you are learning nothing from the job but browsing/chatting then it is a very bad deal. Once out of this 71k for 10 minutes position it will be difficult to be employed in better positions again.
totallystudly
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Re: I need advice on having 2 jobs.

Post by totallystudly »

But I think alot of people also are designed to want purpose, most people are driven towards actually doing something with their lives
Financial independence is a worthy goal to me. An extra 71k helps tremendously with that
FireSekr
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Re: I need advice on having 2 jobs.

Post by FireSekr »

You were low-balled by the big-4. I haven't even heard them offering that much to 1st year college grads and I graduated almost 10 years ago...back then big 4 offers started at $60k and in cyber they were higher. These days for a starting position in cyber at a big-4 I'd expect around 80k minimum.

That said, you will have better opportunities with this job on your resume, and you will learn and grow way more. There is no way you'll be able to work 2 jobs if you're working at a big 4.

I also work in consulting, and the best advice I can give you is to do your absolute best, and focus on learning and growth. Get at least one promotion under your belt, maybe even 2 before you consider leaving. You will get countless offers along the way from your clients if they like working with you, but the growth potential in consulting is great.

Also keep in mind that the Big 4 are not the Top 4....they are the biggest, but far from the best. Work hard, learn as much as you can and try to get promoted. If you enjoy consulting, after 3-4 years try to move over to a higher quality firm. There are more prestigious consultancies and they generally treat their people better than the big 4 aside from having even better growth potential.
MathWizard
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Re: I need advice on having 2 jobs.

Post by MathWizard »

The pay is comparable if you assume a 30% shift differential, which is not unusual going from regular business hours to the graveyard shift.

I would go with the lower salary for now working in the daytime.
You will be working with the best co-workers. ( The top people rarely want to work overnight, and can get good pay. )

Going to daytime hours will be better long-term, not just for your career, but probably for your health and social life.
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