My 2017 CRV is a victim of the dreaded oil gas-dilution issue

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dknightd
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Re: My 2017 CRV is a victim of the dreaded oil gas-dilution issue

Post by dknightd » Wed Oct 23, 2019 12:49 pm

I have 50 crisp $100 notes I would trade for your crappy 2017 CRV. Actually, I'd have to go to the bank to get them ;)
If you value a bird in the hand, pay off the loan. If you are willing to risk getting two birds (or none) from the market, invest the funds.

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JPH
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Re: My 2017 CRV is a victim of the dreaded oil gas-dilution issue

Post by JPH » Tue Oct 29, 2019 5:31 pm

CULater wrote:
Wed Oct 23, 2019 9:53 am
Just received this information from Polaris Labs, oil analysis laboratory, discussing oil contamination.
FUEL DILUTION
It is normal to see low levels of fuel in engine oils as a byproduct of the combustion/ignition process. When fuel levels start to exceed 1%, the lubricant's viscosity will begin to decrease. As the percent of fuel in oil increases the lubricant's ability maintain a full fluid film and protect against boundary wear is decreased. Fuel in oil will also dilute additives which could lead to other wear and performance issues. Some engines are more prone to high fuel dilution, but this does not mean that the fuel will not harm the engine.
I just received my latest report from Blackstone concerning my Honda 1.5L DI Turbo engine. This time I waited until the Maintenance Minder showed only 10% remaining oil life. My thinking was that this sample would give me a data point for the worst case scenario. That was 7,001 miles on the oil (Honda synthetic 0W/20). My previous specimens had shown 4.5% fuel at 1,989 miles and 4.8% at 4,952 miles. Surprisingly, the fuel was only 0.8% in this sample despite a lot more miles driven. According to the report, <2% is normal, so I am well within the normal range. Wear metals were closer to the upper end of the normal range, but only silicon (+1 point), sodium (+1 point), and magnesium (+176 points) actually exceeded the upper limit. The technician wrote, "wear metals increased, but that's no big deal. This oil was run longer, so more metal is expected just from normal accumulation."

I cannot explain why fuel dilution is absent after driving more miles. I'm happy for those good results, but am now a bit confused about scheduling future oil changes.
While the moments do summersaults into eternity | Cling to their coattails and beg them to stay - Townes Van Zandt

smitcat
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Re: My 2017 CRV is a victim of the dreaded oil gas-dilution issue

Post by smitcat » Tue Oct 29, 2019 5:42 pm

JPH wrote:
Tue Oct 29, 2019 5:31 pm
CULater wrote:
Wed Oct 23, 2019 9:53 am
Just received this information from Polaris Labs, oil analysis laboratory, discussing oil contamination.
FUEL DILUTION
It is normal to see low levels of fuel in engine oils as a byproduct of the combustion/ignition process. When fuel levels start to exceed 1%, the lubricant's viscosity will begin to decrease. As the percent of fuel in oil increases the lubricant's ability maintain a full fluid film and protect against boundary wear is decreased. Fuel in oil will also dilute additives which could lead to other wear and performance issues. Some engines are more prone to high fuel dilution, but this does not mean that the fuel will not harm the engine.
I just received my latest report from Blackstone concerning my Honda 1.5L DI Turbo engine. This time I waited until the Maintenance Minder showed only 10% remaining oil life. My thinking was that this sample would give me a data point for the worst case scenario. That was 7,001 miles on the oil (Honda synthetic 0W/20). My previous specimens had shown 4.5% fuel at 1,989 miles and 4.8% at 4,952 miles. Surprisingly, the fuel was only 0.8% in this sample despite a lot more miles driven. According to the report, <2% is normal, so I am well within the normal range. Wear metals were closer to the upper end of the normal range, but only silicon (+1 point), sodium (+1 point), and magnesium (+176 points) actually exceeded the upper limit. The technician wrote, "wear metals increased, but that's no big deal. This oil was run longer, so more metal is expected just from normal accumulation."

I cannot explain why fuel dilution is absent after driving more miles. I'm happy for those good results, but am now a bit confused about scheduling future oil changes.
Thank you for a detailed report on the 1.5 engine.
Maybe you can answer some other related questions:
- what was the mileage on the engine at the start of that 7,001 miles?
- did you have the Honda software 'fix' installed at any time before or during this oil life test?
- has any other work been performed on the cars engine or cooling systems?
- Did you get the TBN number? Do you know what the Honda 0W/20 TBN is when new?
- Who extracted the sample and how?
- had anyone removed any oil from the engine during your 7,001 miles driven?

JohnF
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Re: My 2017 CRV is a victim of the dreaded oil gas-dilution issue

Post by JohnF » Wed Oct 30, 2019 9:35 am

JPH wrote:
Tue Oct 29, 2019 5:31 pm
CULater wrote:
Wed Oct 23, 2019 9:53 am
Just received this information from Polaris Labs, oil analysis laboratory, discussing oil contamination.
FUEL DILUTION
It is normal to see low levels of fuel in engine oils as a byproduct of the combustion/ignition process. When fuel levels start to exceed 1%, the lubricant's viscosity will begin to decrease. As the percent of fuel in oil increases the lubricant's ability maintain a full fluid film and protect against boundary wear is decreased. Fuel in oil will also dilute additives which could lead to other wear and performance issues. Some engines are more prone to high fuel dilution, but this does not mean that the fuel will not harm the engine.
I just received my latest report from Blackstone concerning my Honda 1.5L DI Turbo engine. This time I waited until the Maintenance Minder showed only 10% remaining oil life. My thinking was that this sample would give me a data point for the worst case scenario. That was 7,001 miles on the oil (Honda synthetic 0W/20). My previous specimens had shown 4.5% fuel at 1,989 miles and 4.8% at 4,952 miles. Surprisingly, the fuel was only 0.8% in this sample despite a lot more miles driven. According to the report, <2% is normal, so I am well within the normal range. Wear metals were closer to the upper end of the normal range, but only silicon (+1 point), sodium (+1 point), and magnesium (+176 points) actually exceeded the upper limit. The technician wrote, "wear metals increased, but that's no big deal. This oil was run longer, so more metal is expected just from normal accumulation."

I cannot explain why fuel dilution is absent after driving more miles. I'm happy for those good results, but am now a bit confused about scheduling future oil changes.
Were most of the miles put on during the hot summer months?

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JPH
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Re: My 2017 CRV is a victim of the dreaded oil gas-dilution issue

Post by JPH » Wed Oct 30, 2019 10:28 am

smitcat wrote:
Tue Oct 29, 2019 5:42 pm
Thank you for a detailed report on the 1.5 engine.
Maybe you can answer some other related questions:
- what was the mileage on the engine at the start of that 7,001 miles? 14799
- did you have the Honda software 'fix' installed at any time before or during this oil life test? No
- has any other work been performed on the cars engine or cooling systems? No
- Did you get the TBN number? Do you know what the Honda 0W/20 TBN is when new? Did not
- Who extracted the sample and how? Mechanic during drain for oil change
- had anyone removed any oil from the engine during your 7,001 miles driven? No
While the moments do summersaults into eternity | Cling to their coattails and beg them to stay - Townes Van Zandt

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JPH
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Re: My 2017 CRV is a victim of the dreaded oil gas-dilution issue

Post by JPH » Wed Oct 30, 2019 10:34 am

JohnF wrote:
Wed Oct 30, 2019 9:35 am
Were most of the miles put on during the hot summer months?
February to November in South Texas. Never very cold here. Lots of short trips.
While the moments do summersaults into eternity | Cling to their coattails and beg them to stay - Townes Van Zandt

smitcat
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Re: My 2017 CRV is a victim of the dreaded oil gas-dilution issue

Post by smitcat » Wed Oct 30, 2019 10:39 am

JPH wrote:
Wed Oct 30, 2019 10:28 am
smitcat wrote:
Tue Oct 29, 2019 5:42 pm
Thank you for a detailed report on the 1.5 engine.
Maybe you can answer some other related questions:
- what was the mileage on the engine at the start of that 7,001 miles? 14799
- did you have the Honda software 'fix' installed at any time before or during this oil life test? No
- has any other work been performed on the cars engine or cooling systems? No
- Did you get the TBN number? Do you know what the Honda 0W/20 TBN is when new? Did not
- Who extracted the sample and how? Mechanic during drain for oil change
- had anyone removed any oil from the engine during your 7,001 miles driven? No
This sounds really good at 15,000 miles.
As far as how long you can run between oil changes one of the key ingredients is the remaining TBN # - if enough additives remain then its no problem.
By knowing the original base TBN of the new 'unused' oil and the remaining TBN at the 7,000 miles you are in great shape to make the call.
Generally sounds like going about 7K miles and/or to 10% left on oil life meter is a good plan.

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simplesimon
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Re: My 2017 CRV is a victim of the dreaded oil gas-dilution issue

Post by simplesimon » Sun Nov 03, 2019 8:55 am

We took our new baby seat to CarMax to see which small SUV's it would fit in the best while allowing for the front seats not be pushed way forward (I'm 6'3" and my wife is 5'11") and the CRV was the winner by a mile. I don't know why the CRV's spacing is so different from the RAV4 and CX-5. We are likely going to pull the trigger on the 2019 model soon and hope for the best...

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RootSki
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Re: My 2017 CRV is a victim of the dreaded oil gas-dilution issue

Post by RootSki » Mon Nov 11, 2019 10:29 am

In 2018, the Honda CR-V was the third best selling vehicle in America that wasn't a truck, and only the Civic sells better for Honda globally. However, the American arm of Honda has recently been served with two separate lawsuits in relation to the popular crossover. One is regarding a possible structural defect, and the second is over malfunctioning infotainment screens. According to the lawsuits, the complaints are from owners of 2017-2019 Honda CR-Vs.
https://carbuzz.com/news/angry-honda-cr ... tic-action

Someone needs to tell these folks about the oil dilution problem.

prd1982
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Re: My 2017 CRV is a victim of the dreaded oil gas-dilution issue

Post by prd1982 » Mon Nov 11, 2019 1:11 pm

Not surprising that several folks are complaining about <put component name here>. What is interesting is how the lawyers are trying to say that the failures are safety related and therefore require a recall. Of course, that would also mean a LOT more money for the lawyers

Joel
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Re: My 2017 CRV is a victim of the dreaded oil gas-dilution issue

Post by Joel » Tue Mar 17, 2020 12:08 am

Did anyone else get a notice in the mail about the class action lawsuit against Honda in the State of Minnesota?
My investment policy statement: https://www.bogleheads.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=190093

prd1982
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Re: My 2017 CRV is a victim of the dreaded oil gas-dilution issue

Post by prd1982 » Tue Mar 17, 2020 9:03 am

Joel wrote:
Tue Mar 17, 2020 12:08 am
Did anyone else get a notice in the mail about the class action lawsuit against Honda in the State of Minnesota?
Yes. I'm in CT. I'm taking the default choice: extended warranty plus software fix, and giving up opportunity to sue. No noticeable problems with my CRV so far.

Joel
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Re: My 2017 CRV is a victim of the dreaded oil gas-dilution issue

Post by Joel » Wed Mar 18, 2020 12:29 am

prd1982 wrote:
Tue Mar 17, 2020 9:03 am
Joel wrote:
Tue Mar 17, 2020 12:08 am
Did anyone else get a notice in the mail about the class action lawsuit against Honda in the State of Minnesota?
Yes. I'm in CT. I'm taking the default choice: extended warranty plus software fix, and giving up opportunity to sue. No noticeable problems with my CRV so far.
Same here. I didn’t expect to be the first to post in this thread about it though!
My investment policy statement: https://www.bogleheads.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=190093

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CULater
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Re: My 2017 CRV is a victim of the dreaded oil gas-dilution issue

Post by CULater » Wed Mar 18, 2020 8:26 am

Joel wrote:
Tue Mar 17, 2020 12:08 am
Did anyone else get a notice in the mail about the class action lawsuit against Honda in the State of Minnesota?
What does it say?
On the internet, nobody knows you're a dog.

prd1982
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Re: My 2017 CRV is a victim of the dreaded oil gas-dilution issue

Post by prd1982 » Wed Mar 18, 2020 9:47 am

CULater wrote:
Wed Mar 18, 2020 8:26 am
What does it say?
Gives you 4 options:

1. Submit claim for reimbursement for Towing Expenses, Oil Change Expenses and Past Diagnostic Costs. Also get warranty extension and product update.

2. Get out of lawsuit, but no warranty extension or reimbursement. Can sue yourself.

3. Comment in writing about the settlement. Remain member of Settlement Class

4. Do nothing. Get warranty extension and product update. Cannot sue separately.

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CULater
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Re: My 2017 CRV is a victim of the dreaded oil gas-dilution issue

Post by CULater » Wed Mar 18, 2020 10:09 am

prd1982 wrote:
Wed Mar 18, 2020 9:47 am
CULater wrote:
Wed Mar 18, 2020 8:26 am
What does it say?
Gives you 4 options:

1. Submit claim for reimbursement for Towing Expenses, Oil Change Expenses and Past Diagnostic Costs. Also get warranty extension and product update.

2. Get out of lawsuit, but no warranty extension or reimbursement. Can sue yourself.

3. Comment in writing about the settlement. Remain member of Settlement Class

4. Do nothing. Get warranty extension and product update. Cannot sue separately.
How about reimbursement for pain and suffering? And being kicked to the curb by Honda?
On the internet, nobody knows you're a dog.

CorduroyGivenToFly
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Re: My 2017 CRV is a victim of the dreaded oil gas-dilution issue

Post by CorduroyGivenToFly » Sat May 16, 2020 5:43 pm

I have a 2018 CRV and believe my car suffers from this. I never took it in for that alone. Check engine light (and all the others) came on just past 40,000 miles. Took it in to the dealer and they put in a software update and the lights went off. The next day, they lights came on again and they diagnosed it with a bad fuel injector kit based on the cylinder misfire code. Hondacare (which I bought) paid for it. I asked them if they thought this was related to the oil dilution and they said no because I mostly drove it on non-short trips in California. Haven’t had any other issues with the car before or since then, although haven’t driven it much during the shut down and this isssue happened just before that. None of the oil shops I’ve taken the car to for oil changes said my oil looked or smelled like anything unusual, and I asked a couple of them about it.

CorduroyGivenToFly
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Re: My 2017 CRV is a victim of the dreaded oil gas-dilution issue

Post by CorduroyGivenToFly » Sat May 16, 2020 5:44 pm

I have a 2018 CRV and believe my car suffers from this because I smell gas in the cabin when the a/c is pulling in air from outside. As a result of this, i always use recirculate, which works well.

Check engine light (and all the others) came on just past 40,000 miles. Took it in to the dealer and they put in a software update and the lights went off. The next day, they lights came on again and they diagnosed it with a bad fuel injector kit based on the cylinder misfire code. Hondacare (which I bought) paid for it. I asked them if they thought this was related to the oil dilution and they said no because I mostly drove it on non-short trips in California. Haven’t had any other issues with the car before or since then, although haven’t driven it much during the shut down and this isssue happened just before that. None of the oil shops I’ve taken the car to for oil changes said my oil looked or smelled like anything unusual, and I asked a couple of them about it.

BeachPerson
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Re: My 2017 CRV is a victim of the dreaded oil gas-dilution issue

Post by BeachPerson » Sat May 16, 2020 6:27 pm

CorduroyGivenToFly wrote:
Sat May 16, 2020 5:44 pm
I have a 2018 CRV and believe my car suffers from this because I smell gas in the cabin when the a/c is pulling in air from outside. As a result of this, i always use recirculate, which works well.

Check engine light (and all the others) came on just past 40,000 miles. Took it in to the dealer and they put in a software update and the lights went off. The next day, they lights came on again and they diagnosed it with a bad fuel injector kit based on the cylinder misfire code. Hondacare (which I bought) paid for it. I asked them if they thought this was related to the oil dilution and they said no because I mostly drove it on non-short trips in California. Haven’t had any other issues with the car before or since then, although haven’t driven it much during the shut down and this isssue happened just before that. None of the oil shops I’ve taken the car to for oil changes said my oil looked or smelled like anything unusual, and I asked a couple of them about it.

I was all so lucky. I was ready to trade my 2013 Honda Accord for the Honda CRV. I am glad that I found this threat two years ago. I bought a RAV4 and it is super!!!!
From Jack Brennan's "Straight Talk on Investing", page 23 "Living below your means is the ultimate financial strategy"

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CULater
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Re: My 2017 CRV is a victim of the dreaded oil gas-dilution issue

Post by CULater » Sat May 16, 2020 6:46 pm

BeachPerson wrote:
Sat May 16, 2020 6:27 pm
CorduroyGivenToFly wrote:
Sat May 16, 2020 5:44 pm
I have a 2018 CRV and believe my car suffers from this because I smell gas in the cabin when the a/c is pulling in air from outside. As a result of this, i always use recirculate, which works well.

Check engine light (and all the others) came on just past 40,000 miles. Took it in to the dealer and they put in a software update and the lights went off. The next day, they lights came on again and they diagnosed it with a bad fuel injector kit based on the cylinder misfire code. Hondacare (which I bought) paid for it. I asked them if they thought this was related to the oil dilution and they said no because I mostly drove it on non-short trips in California. Haven’t had any other issues with the car before or since then, although haven’t driven it much during the shut down and this isssue happened just before that. None of the oil shops I’ve taken the car to for oil changes said my oil looked or smelled like anything unusual, and I asked a couple of them about it.

I was all so lucky. I was ready to trade my 2013 Honda Accord for the Honda CRV. I am glad that I found this threat two years ago. I bought a RAV4 and it is super!!!!
Good move. I started the thread to give prospective buyers a "heads up" about the CRV and hopefully save at least one person the headaches I've experienced with the vehicle. Mission Accomplished!
On the internet, nobody knows you're a dog.

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