Want a Safe Car, Feel Guilty

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Jelloanddon
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Want a Safe Car, Feel Guilty

Post by Jelloanddon » Tue Feb 06, 2018 10:38 am

I currently have a 2007 Lexus. As I get older and more nervous about driving, especially at night, I want to get a vehicle with more safety features, e,g, blind spot monitoring, pre-collision braking, etc. I need a sedan as my elderly parents would have difficulty getting into a SUV.

My dilemma is I have a problem with purchasing a brand new vehicle rather than used but I can’t find any used cars that fit my criteria. I’m looking at a 2018 Toyota Camry or Subaru Legacy. I admit I still want some options that raise the price a bit-leather seats, V6 (my husband’s request), navigation system. This places the price around $33k to $38k. I would pay for it outright but still makes my stomach churn.

Suggestions, recommendations on other vehicles? Are there any older models that have all my safety bells and whistles checklist?

chevca
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Re: Want a Safe Car, Feel Guilty

Post by chevca » Tue Feb 06, 2018 10:41 am

I have a tough time believing you can't find ANY 2016 vehicle that fit your wants and needs...

These things you want didn't just come out in 2018 models.

Jack FFR1846
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Re: Want a Safe Car, Feel Guilty

Post by Jack FFR1846 » Tue Feb 06, 2018 10:45 am

2016 Subaru Legacy 3.6R. Easily found with eyesight, automatic braking, etc. It has the 3.6L H6 (Subaru has never made a V6) in one of the safest non-Mercedes cars out there. This is a favorite of dealers as they get them off lease and price them well. Often CPO cars with a warranty better than a new car. These all have AWD, of course, which doesn't make the car drive any differently in normal situations and you wouldn't even know it was there.

On the high side of things, I still contend that the Mercedes S class is THE safest car built. Everything else is 2 levels below. But of course, cost and reliability (and depreciation) fit into real life.
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bloom2708
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Re: Want a Safe Car, Feel Guilty

Post by bloom2708 » Tue Feb 06, 2018 10:46 am

Which model Lexus do you have?

For ~$35k you could buy a beautiful LS, ES, GS or RX with 30,000 to 50,000 miles. Barely broken in.

Our LS has 14 air bags, including knee air bags. Do you feel "safer" in a big SUV?

Tough question to answer because "safe" is subjective.
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fposte
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Re: Want a Safe Car, Feel Guilty

Post by fposte » Tue Feb 06, 2018 10:50 am

What price would make you feel not guilty? Or is your guilt tied to buying a car new rather than used even if the model you're looking at has a lower price point?

Atgard
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Re: Want a Safe Car, Feel Guilty

Post by Atgard » Tue Feb 06, 2018 10:51 am

There is a lot of "don't buy that expensive new car!" advice around here, which is often good advice because many many people buy more car than they can afford, lease or buy new every few years, and are on a never-ending treadmill paying car payments & interest, which interferes with retirement savings.

If you are on track for retirement, have saved up enough to buy the car in cash, have enough in the budget (by earning enough or spending little enough) to afford the car, then that's what money is for: to buy things that are safer or more enjoyable for you & your family.

You haven't given your whole financial picture (nor do I think you need to), but if you can comfortably afford the car, I don't think you need to feel guilty. A Camry or Legacy are not extravagant, wasteful vehicles. I don't know enough about your exact criteria to know if there is a slightly cheaper car that checks all your boxes, or if a 2- or 3-year old version still would? (Or are the safety features you want only on 2018 models?)

In my experience, even buying a relatively expensive vehicle can work out pretty well if (a) you can afford it & still save for retirement as I said above, and (b) you keep it for a long time and have many years of $0 car payments. That can turn even a somewhat expensive new car into a reasonable expense when averaged over 10+ years. On the other hand, even buying/leasing a less expensive car every 3 years can end up costing more per year.

Good luck with your decision, I know sometimes when you're used to saving saving saving, it can be tough to let go on a large purchase. But maybe this is one of the reasons you've been saving, to have the cash to purchase a safer car?

delamer
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Re: Want a Safe Car, Feel Guilty

Post by delamer » Tue Feb 06, 2018 10:53 am

Reiterating what others have said, look at luxury vehicles that are a couple years old.

The high end cars generally get the latest in safety and technology first.

Check out the CarMax website. Even if there isn’t one near you, you can use the website to select for cars with certain safety (and other) features and so will get an idea of what models, years, and prices to get what you want.

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Alexa9
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Re: Want a Safe Car, Feel Guilty

Post by Alexa9 » Tue Feb 06, 2018 10:54 am

Accord/Camry are all new this year. You should get a deal on 2015-17 new or used.

Helo80
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Re: Want a Safe Car, Feel Guilty

Post by Helo80 » Tue Feb 06, 2018 10:57 am

Jelloanddon wrote:
Tue Feb 06, 2018 10:38 am
...V6 (my husband’s request)...


I understand that it's your husband's request, but why? The V6's of yesteryear are comparable to the 4 cylinder engines we have today. The advances in engineering, CAD, and fuel ignition visualization are producing the best engines we have ever seen. Honda has dropped the V6 from the Accord lineup.

Ford Mustang has dropped the V6... They have a 4 cylinder Ecoboost engine and then the GT V8 engine. What Ford found was people who did not want a V8, would drive the 4 cylinder Ecoboost and then a V6... and generally go with the 4 cylinder as they preferred the fuel savings and negligible loss of performance.

Elysium
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Re: Want a Safe Car, Feel Guilty

Post by Elysium » Tue Feb 06, 2018 10:59 am

Check out Toyota Avalon, a full size car which is pretty much a Lexus ES, but cheaper and with all the same features and comforts. It came to mind because you mentioned elderly parents, and it has plenty of room everywhere.

Rattlesnake
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Re: Want a Safe Car, Feel Guilty

Post by Rattlesnake » Tue Feb 06, 2018 11:15 am

The poster said "I need a sedan as my elderly parents would have difficulty getting into a SUV."

Our experience is the opposite.... We moved to the SUV space because they are easier to get in and out of.... Had a Chevy Equinox for 6 years and now have a Cadillac XT5....

Just my $0.02...

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chevca
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Re: Want a Safe Car, Feel Guilty

Post by chevca » Tue Feb 06, 2018 11:29 am

True, an SUV doesn't have to mean a massive Suburban. Some of the crossover types might be good for the OP to check out.

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eye.surgeon
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Re: Want a Safe Car, Feel Guilty

Post by eye.surgeon » Tue Feb 06, 2018 11:35 am

Even a cheap new corolla is safer than a 10 year old luxury car. Also agree with above that crossovers are easier for older people to get into/out of than sedans. Get into/out of a CRV and then an accord, you will see. My elderly parents really struggle with my Tesla model s and have no problems with my wife's Range Rover, which lowers itself to crossover height when parked.
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Watty
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Re: Want a Safe Car, Feel Guilty

Post by Watty » Tue Feb 06, 2018 11:37 am

For the safety features it would be good to at least consider a new Corolla too.

I am pretty sure that it has the same safety package as the Camry and the safety features are why just I bought one even though my old car had a lot of life left in it.

They tend to gradually make cars larger each year and the current Corolla is almost as large as a 2002 Camry that I had. Out of curiosity I looked it up and the Corolla is only about nine inches shorter than the current Camry. As I recall the reviews mentioned that it has pretty good back seats compared to cars that size and they seem like they would be fine for driving around town.

I bought one with the LE trim level and it cost a bit more than $17K including high sales tax and licence fees. The higher trim levels might have most of the features you are looking for except for the 6 cylinder (I think).

It is admittedly is not a real peppy car but I am retired now and don't really need a sports car for the driving I do and it seems to drive just fine.

Here is the post I did about my purchasing process.
viewtopic.php?f=11&t=239526&p=3746230&h ... a#p3746230

KT785
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Re: Want a Safe Car, Feel Guilty

Post by KT785 » Tue Feb 06, 2018 11:42 am

Jack FFR1846 wrote:
Tue Feb 06, 2018 10:45 am
2016 Subaru Legacy 3.6R. Easily found with eyesight, automatic braking, etc. It has the 3.6L H6 (Subaru has never made a V6) in one of the safest non-Mercedes cars out there. This is a favorite of dealers as they get them off lease and price them well. Often CPO cars with a warranty better than a new car. These all have AWD, of course, which doesn't make the car drive any differently in normal situations and you wouldn't even know it was there.

On the high side of things, I still contend that the Mercedes S class is THE safest car built. Everything else is 2 levels below. But of course, cost and reliability (and depreciation) fit into real life.
I'd be inclined to look for a 2017 Legacy with the same specs. Starting in '17 the Outback and Legacy included Reverse Automatic Braking (RAB) as part of the Eyesight suite . . . you'll want to double check that the model you look at has that feature. Getting a used 2017 may prove difficult but that added feature might be nice to have if safety is your overriding concern; I'm quite happy with my 2017 Outback--we plan on starting a family this year and safety (along with practicality) was the main reason for the selection.

Also, depending on your location, there are some large Subaru dealers in Illinois and Colorado that sell new models below invoice. I'm not well versed with the Colorado dealer, but if you're near-ish to the Chicagoland area, I'd check out Grand Subaru (Bensenville) and Gerald Subaru (Naperville). I'd contact both of them and ask to speak to their "Internet Sales Department" and see what price the quote you for a new model with the specs you want.

DavidW
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Re: Want a Safe Car, Feel Guilty

Post by DavidW » Tue Feb 06, 2018 11:46 am

Atgard wrote:
Tue Feb 06, 2018 10:51 am
There is a lot of "don't buy that expensive new car!" advice around here, which is often good advice because many many people buy more car than they can afford, lease or buy new every few years, and are on a never-ending treadmill paying car payments & interest, which interferes with retirement savings.

If you are on track for retirement, have saved up enough to buy the car in cash, have enough in the budget (by earning enough or spending little enough) to afford the car, then that's what money is for: to buy things that are safer or more enjoyable for you & your family.

You haven't given your whole financial picture (nor do I think you need to), but if you can comfortably afford the car, I don't think you need to feel guilty. A Camry or Legacy are not extravagant, wasteful vehicles. I don't know enough about your exact criteria to know if there is a slightly cheaper car that checks all your boxes, or if a 2- or 3-year old version still would? (Or are the safety features you want only on 2018 models?)

In my experience, even buying a relatively expensive vehicle can work out pretty well if (a) you can afford it & still save for retirement as I said above, and (b) you keep it for a long time and have many years of $0 car payments. That can turn even a somewhat expensive new car into a reasonable expense when averaged over 10+ years. On the other hand, even buying/leasing a less expensive car every 3 years can end up costing more per year.

Good luck with your decision, I know sometimes when you're used to saving saving saving, it can be tough to let go on a large purchase. But maybe this is one of the reasons you've been saving, to have the cash to purchase a safer car?
Agree. You can do better than a Camry if financially everything is in order. I bought a Toyota Avalon thinking that is a bit bigger but was I surprised with the quality of the ride. It makes the Camry look a lot less desirable (my kids are driving that now :).

I think the newer ones have other accident avoidance features which is worthwhile looking into.

Good luck with your final decision.

metalworking
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Re: Want a Safe Car, Feel Guilty

Post by metalworking » Tue Feb 06, 2018 11:49 am

what's the point of saving money if you are afraid to use it. By the way we love our new (gasp) 2018 camary. We got the 4 cylinder and it has enough pep for me.

sport
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Re: Want a Safe Car, Feel Guilty

Post by sport » Tue Feb 06, 2018 12:10 pm

Helo80 wrote:
Tue Feb 06, 2018 10:57 am
Jelloanddon wrote:
Tue Feb 06, 2018 10:38 am
...V6 (my husband’s request)...


I understand that it's your husband's request, but why? The V6's of yesteryear are comparable to the 4 cylinder engines we have today. The advances in engineering, CAD, and fuel ignition visualization are producing the best engines we have ever seen. Honda has dropped the V6 from the Accord lineup.

Ford Mustang has dropped the V6... They have a 4 cylinder Ecoboost engine and then the GT V8 engine. What Ford found was people who did not want a V8, would drive the 4 cylinder Ecoboost and then a V6... and generally go with the 4 cylinder as they preferred the fuel savings and negligible loss of performance.
This is all very true. In addition to the engines being better, the new Camry has an 8-speed transmission that further boosts acceleration. OP, have your husband test drive a 4-cylinder Camry before he decides that a V6 is really necessary. He will be pleasantly surprised.

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David Jay
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Re: Want a Safe Car, Feel Guilty

Post by David Jay » Tue Feb 06, 2018 12:15 pm

eye.surgeon wrote:
Tue Feb 06, 2018 11:35 am
Even a cheap new corolla is safer than a 10 year old luxury car.
Sorry, but as an engineer, this is just not true.

Vehicle mass is the single biggest factor in survivability, not fancy features that the marketing departments are selling. Look at the fatality rates: Highest are the econo-boxes (not saying a Corolla is an econobox, but it certainly isn't large), lowest are large pickups and SUVs. Mr. Newton doesn't care about your fancy electronics.
Last edited by David Jay on Tue Feb 06, 2018 12:16 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Radjob4me
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Re: Want a Safe Car, Feel Guilty

Post by Radjob4me » Tue Feb 06, 2018 12:16 pm

My suggestions: Volvo S60 inscription (my current car) - completely loaded with every option was about $40k. Could get one lightly used in the low 30s I'm sure. Awesome car. Safe, peppy. And as some have shared, it is "only" 4 cylinder but more than fast/powerful enough. The "inscription" part is the longer wheelbase, which is important for back seat room - the reuglar s60 is kind of crowded in the back seat. Volvo seats are the best!

Also if you are moving around elderly folks, the Toyota Avalon +/- hybrid is a great car too. Lots of room and look nice. They tend to not be super popular so you can get a great deal. We got one with most of the options you want for low 30s. They have a completely loaded one for upper to mid 30s.

inbox788
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Re: Want a Safe Car, Feel Guilty

Post by inbox788 » Tue Feb 06, 2018 12:39 pm

Jelloanddon wrote:
Tue Feb 06, 2018 10:38 am
I currently have a 2007 Lexus. As I get older and more nervous about driving, especially at night, I want to get a vehicle with more safety features, e,g, blind spot monitoring, pre-collision braking, etc. I need a sedan as my elderly parents would have difficulty getting into a SUV.

My dilemma is I have a problem with purchasing a brand new vehicle rather than used but I can’t find any used cars that fit my criteria. I’m looking at a 2018 Toyota Camry or Subaru Legacy. I admit I still want some options that raise the price a bit-leather seats, V6 (my husband’s request), navigation system. This places the price around $33k to $38k. I would pay for it outright but still makes my stomach churn.

Suggestions, recommendations on other vehicles? Are there any older models that have all my safety bells and whistles checklist?
Coming from a Lexus, a loaded Camry may not appear like much of an upgrade. Check out the ES, let your stomach churn some more when you see the price tag, and when you get back to the Camry, you'll be fine. Or you may like the upgrade.

Sounds like you're financially sound, so if that's the case, enjoy the fruits of your labor.

Who says there's no inflation? I hadn't kept track, but you're just buying an average priced new car.
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eye.surgeon
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Re: Want a Safe Car, Feel Guilty

Post by eye.surgeon » Tue Feb 06, 2018 1:05 pm

David Jay wrote:
Tue Feb 06, 2018 12:15 pm
eye.surgeon wrote:
Tue Feb 06, 2018 11:35 am
Even a cheap new corolla is safer than a 10 year old luxury car.
Sorry, but as an engineer, this is just not true.

Vehicle mass is the single biggest factor in survivability, not fancy features that the marketing departments are selling. Look at the fatality rates: Highest are the econo-boxes (not saying a Corolla is an econobox, but it certainly isn't large), lowest are large pickups and SUVs. Mr. Newton doesn't care about your fancy electronics.
Completely agree that, all things being equal, mass wins. I was referring more to all the crash mitigation tech that's available now on cheap cars-- things like emergency braking, lane-keep assist, multi-stage airbags, stability control, etc. These things keep you of of an accident (well, multi-stage airbags don't but you get my drift), rather than relying on mass to survive one.
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Jack FFR1846
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Re: Want a Safe Car, Feel Guilty

Post by Jack FFR1846 » Tue Feb 06, 2018 1:41 pm

KT785 wrote:
Tue Feb 06, 2018 11:42 am

Also, depending on your location, there are some large Subaru dealers in Illinois and Colorado that sell new models below invoice. I'm not well versed with the Colorado dealer, but if you're near-ish to the Chicagoland area, I'd check out Grand Subaru (Bensenville) and Gerald Subaru (Naperville). I'd contact both of them and ask to speak to their "Internet Sales Department" and see what price the quote you for a new model with the specs you want.
Heuberger is in Colorado and is the largest Subaru dealer in the US. I know on the enthusiast forums, members fly out there from either coast and drive home because the deal is that much better than they can get locally.
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Helo80
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Re: Want a Safe Car, Feel Guilty

Post by Helo80 » Tue Feb 06, 2018 1:52 pm

inbox788 wrote:
Tue Feb 06, 2018 12:39 pm
Coming from a Lexus, a loaded Camry may not appear like much of an upgrade. Check out the ES, let your stomach churn some more when you see the price tag, and when you get back to the Camry, you'll be fine. Or you may like the upgrade.


Agreed --- A top of the line '18 Camry (with V6, leather, nav, etc.) comes in at roughly the same price (maybe slightly cheaper) than the starting MSRP of a Lexus ES ( all rough estimates). But, Lexus ES goes up quickly in price to get one nicely equipped and comparable to a Camry. You're paying a lot for the Lexus brand name though you do get one year/14k miles more in warranty.

Basically, what has always bothered me about Lexus ES, while a great car, they bait you on price like Ford F-150/F-250, but by the time you get one with decent and reasonable options you would want, there's another $5 or $10 grand on the price.

michaeljc70
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Re: Want a Safe Car, Feel Guilty

Post by michaeljc70 » Tue Feb 06, 2018 2:00 pm

chevca wrote:
Tue Feb 06, 2018 10:41 am
I have a tough time believing you can't find ANY 2016 vehicle that fit your wants and needs...

These things you want didn't just come out in 2018 models.
Exactly what I thought!

Dottie57
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Re: Want a Safe Car, Feel Guilty

Post by Dottie57 » Tue Feb 06, 2018 2:04 pm

My next car will have all of those features for the same reasons. I will buy new and forget about depreciation.

I never want to hurst another person through my driving.

Jelloanddon
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Re: Want a Safe Car, Feel Guilty

Post by Jelloanddon » Tue Feb 06, 2018 2:08 pm

Thanks for all the suggestions. Yes, we are financially sound- receiving a pension, healthy 401k, no need to collect SS for a few years. Let me just say I am a nervous driver and as my night vision gets worse, anxiety gets higher. In a perfect world I would have a full time driver at my disposal or a Google Car, but I digress.

My 90 year old parents cannot climb up anything so that why I ruled out even a small SUV; they have pretty bad backs.

Hubby is open to 4 cyl cars if they have enough power. It will be my main car but the one we will use for trips and he drives then.

I bought my 2007 Lexus IS 350 when it was 5 years old. Prior to that I had a used Infinity. And in my younger days I bought a brand new Avalon. At some point I realized buying new isn’t necessarily better. Ok, and I admit I still want somewhat of a “sexy” car. . .

Dottie57
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Re: Want a Safe Car, Feel Guilty

Post by Dottie57 » Tue Feb 06, 2018 2:09 pm

David Jay wrote:
Tue Feb 06, 2018 12:15 pm
eye.surgeon wrote:
Tue Feb 06, 2018 11:35 am
Even a cheap new corolla is safer than a 10 year old luxury car.
Sorry, but as an engineer, this is just not true.

Vehicle mass is the single biggest factor in survivability, not fancy features that the marketing departments are selling. Look at the fatality rates: Highest are the econo-boxes (not saying a Corolla is an econobox, but it certainly isn't large), lowest are large pickups and SUVs. Mr. Newton doesn't care about your fancy electronics.


But fancy equipment may keep me from hurting someone else.

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Re: Want a Safe Car, Feel Guilty

Post by mouses » Tue Feb 06, 2018 2:27 pm

Rattlesnake wrote:
Tue Feb 06, 2018 11:15 am
The poster said "I need a sedan as my elderly parents would have difficulty getting into a SUV."

Our experience is the opposite.... We moved to the SUV space because they are easier to get in and out of.... Had a Chevy Equinox for 6 years and now have a Cadillac XT5....

Just my $0.02...

Peace....
I don't understand that. Every so often I get a ride in someone's SUV and I have to throw myself up into the seat.

Helo80
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Re: Want a Safe Car, Feel Guilty

Post by Helo80 » Tue Feb 06, 2018 2:36 pm

Jelloanddon wrote:
Tue Feb 06, 2018 2:08 pm
I bought my 2007 Lexus IS 350 when it was 5 years old. Prior to that I had a used Infinity. And in my younger days I bought a brand new Avalon. At some point I realized buying new isn’t necessarily better. Ok, and I admit I still want somewhat of a “sexy” car. . .

Look at the '18 Camry and Legacy. See which one you like better. The new Camry's are very good looking and a complete redesign and rebuild from top to bottom compared to 2017's -- it really is an all new Camry, not simply a refreshed design.

I think Subaru takes pride in their safety features, so Subs may have the slight edge. But, you do pay a slight premium for some of the upgrades safety packages/components on Subs. Totally worth it if safety is your concern.

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Re: Want a Safe Car, Feel Guilty

Post by sport » Tue Feb 06, 2018 3:12 pm

mouses wrote:
Tue Feb 06, 2018 2:27 pm
Rattlesnake wrote:
Tue Feb 06, 2018 11:15 am
The poster said "I need a sedan as my elderly parents would have difficulty getting into a SUV."

Our experience is the opposite.... We moved to the SUV space because they are easier to get in and out of.... Had a Chevy Equinox for 6 years and now have a Cadillac XT5....

Just my $0.02...

Peace....
I don't understand that. Every so often I get a ride in someone's SUV and I have to throw myself up into the seat.
It may depend on how tall you are. I am short and find entering and exiting an SUV difficult. Someone with longer legs may have less difficulty.

dbr
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Re: Want a Safe Car, Feel Guilty

Post by dbr » Tue Feb 06, 2018 5:17 pm

mouses wrote:
Tue Feb 06, 2018 2:27 pm
Rattlesnake wrote:
Tue Feb 06, 2018 11:15 am
The poster said "I need a sedan as my elderly parents would have difficulty getting into a SUV."

Our experience is the opposite.... We moved to the SUV space because they are easier to get in and out of.... Had a Chevy Equinox for 6 years and now have a Cadillac XT5....

Just my $0.02...

Peace....
I don't understand that. Every so often I get a ride in someone's SUV and I have to throw myself up into the seat.
No. A compact sport utility vehicle such as CRV, Outback, etc. is at about perfect step in height. The easiest rated entry for step in height and door frame clearance is the Subaru Forrester. Cars like Camry, Accord, etc. are relatively terrible. Old style SUVs like Expedition etc. are terrible. Also Forrester and after that Outback have the highest ease of visibility to the outside of the car.

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Re: Want a Safe Car, Feel Guilty

Post by bloom2708 » Tue Feb 06, 2018 5:22 pm

The IS is the entry level Lexus.

Going to a Camry, Avalon, ES or LS may all feel like steps up.

Best to set a price point and drive a few. New is not a requirement. You can get some very nice cars with low miles. Used cars (and new) are everywhere.
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Jelloanddon
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Re: Want a Safe Car, Feel Guilty

Post by Jelloanddon » Tue Feb 06, 2018 5:30 pm

sport wrote:
Tue Feb 06, 2018 3:12 pm
mouses wrote:
Tue Feb 06, 2018 2:27 pm
Rattlesnake wrote:
Tue Feb 06, 2018 11:15 am
The poster said "I need a sedan as my elderly parents would have difficulty getting into a SUV."

Our experience is the opposite.... We moved to the SUV space because they are easier to get in and out of.... Had a Chevy Equinox for 6 years and now have a Cadillac XT5....

Just my $0.02...

Peace....
I don't understand that. Every so often I get a ride in someone's SUV and I have to throw myself up into the seat.
It may depend on how tall you are. I am short and find entering and exiting an SUV difficult. Someone with longer legs may have less difficulty.
Yes, they are short. We have a Toyota Sienna van and they have a lot of problems getting in and out.

Jelloanddon
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Re: Want a Safe Car, Feel Guilty

Post by Jelloanddon » Tue Feb 06, 2018 5:37 pm

bloom2708 wrote:
Tue Feb 06, 2018 5:22 pm
The IS is the entry level Lexus.

Going to a Camry, Avalon, ES or LS may all feel like steps up.

Best to set a price point and drive a few. New is not a requirement. You can get some very nice cars with low miles. Used cars (and new) are everywhere.

Perfectly fine with used but finding one with everything on my safety checklist on a used car is harder. And I’m more concerned about hurting others than myself so want the collision avoidance, lane assist, blindspot detection, etc. I’ve been checking on CarMax for possible considerations.

Thank you

WalterMitty
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Re: Want a Safe Car, Feel Guilty

Post by WalterMitty » Tue Feb 06, 2018 6:01 pm

I know you said sedan, but have you considered the Lexus RX?

Many falsely assume getting into a sedan is absolutely easier than all other types. My pops is 79 and drives a minivan, and it's much easier for him to get into than a sedan...sedans are too low. With the van (and many smaller SUVs), the seat is about butt height, you simply step/slide in...with the seat greeting your backside with very little change in height. On exit, you just spin 90 degrees, and drop your feet and then just stand.

Jelloanddon
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Re: Want a Safe Car, Feel Guilty

Post by Jelloanddon » Tue Feb 06, 2018 6:07 pm

WalterMitty wrote:
Tue Feb 06, 2018 6:01 pm
I know you said sedan, but have you considered the Lexus RX?

Many falsely assume getting into a sedan is absolutely easier than all other types. My pops is 79 and drives a minivan, and it's much easier for him to get into than a sedan...sedans are too low. With the van (and many smaller SUVs), the seat is about butt height, you simply step/slide in...with the seat greeting your backside with very little change in height. On exit, you just spin 90 degrees, and drop your feet and then just stand.
How tall is your dad? My folks are under 5’4 with pretty bad mobility issues. We have access to a mini-van and it’s a struggle.

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Re: Want a Safe Car, Feel Guilty

Post by WalterMitty » Tue Feb 06, 2018 6:11 pm

David Jay wrote:
Tue Feb 06, 2018 12:15 pm
eye.surgeon wrote:
Tue Feb 06, 2018 11:35 am
Even a cheap new corolla is safer than a 10 year old luxury car.
Sorry, but as an engineer, this is just not true.

Vehicle mass is the single biggest factor in survivability, not fancy features that the marketing departments are selling. Look at the fatality rates: Highest are the econo-boxes (not saying a Corolla is an econobox, but it certainly isn't large), lowest are large pickups and SUVs. Mr. Newton doesn't care about your fancy electronics.
While I would never disagreed with Newtonian physics, you would also have to control for the types of drivers in each vehicle. I would guess that the typical driver of the econoboxes might not be as skilled a drivers as the truck/suv driver. Zero facts to support my guess...just a hypothesis based on random observations of the typical driver of each type of vehicle.

WalterMitty
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Re: Want a Safe Car, Feel Guilty

Post by WalterMitty » Tue Feb 06, 2018 6:16 pm

Jelloanddon wrote:
Tue Feb 06, 2018 6:07 pm
WalterMitty wrote:
Tue Feb 06, 2018 6:01 pm
I know you said sedan, but have you considered the Lexus RX?

Many falsely assume getting into a sedan is absolutely easier than all other types. My pops is 79 and drives a minivan, and it's much easier for him to get into than a sedan...sedans are too low. With the van (and many smaller SUVs), the seat is about butt height, you simply step/slide in...with the seat greeting your backside with very little change in height. On exit, you just spin 90 degrees, and drop your feet and then just stand.
How tall is your dad? My folks are under 5’4 with pretty bad mobility issues. We have access to a mini-van and it’s a struggle.
My dad is about 5'11. But even for short folks, it should be.....use the grab handle, small step up, and boom. Obviously, you have first hand knowledge of your specific issues, but I still see sedans as something harder to get in and out of based on the lowering and moving into movement. As some said before, maybe a smaller SUV might fit the bill.

My boss is barely 5 feet...if that, and she drives a Lexus NX (won't have the V6 you want) and it's great for her.

dbr
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Re: Want a Safe Car, Feel Guilty

Post by dbr » Tue Feb 06, 2018 6:20 pm

WalterMitty wrote:
Tue Feb 06, 2018 6:11 pm
David Jay wrote:
Tue Feb 06, 2018 12:15 pm
eye.surgeon wrote:
Tue Feb 06, 2018 11:35 am
Even a cheap new corolla is safer than a 10 year old luxury car.
Sorry, but as an engineer, this is just not true.

Vehicle mass is the single biggest factor in survivability, not fancy features that the marketing departments are selling. Look at the fatality rates: Highest are the econo-boxes (not saying a Corolla is an econobox, but it certainly isn't large), lowest are large pickups and SUVs. Mr. Newton doesn't care about your fancy electronics.
While I would never disagreed with Newtonian physics, you would also have to control for the types of drivers in each vehicle. I would guess that the typical driver of the econoboxes might not be as skilled a drivers as the truck/suv driver. Zero facts to support my guess...just a hypothesis based on random observations of the typical driver of each type of vehicle.
In any case physics of collisions is just unavoidable fact on top of which everything else lies. It is true in accident statistics that for certain makes and models of vehicles driver behavior is the single largest contributor to the outcome, but those cases are really outliers. Driver population characteristics on average do affect outcomes and not insignificantly but also not so as to completely reverse large effects from mass. Population characteristics do not mean skill so much as habits of drinking, time of day for driving, speeding and aggressive driving, distracted driving and so on. I also have no specific facts about the skills of pick-up and suv drivers compared to corolla and civic drivers, but would not see why one would assume suv drivers at least are more skilled at all. In fact I suggest rather the opposite.

Jelloanddon
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Re: Want a Safe Car, Feel Guilty

Post by Jelloanddon » Tue Feb 06, 2018 6:46 pm

WalterMitty wrote:
Tue Feb 06, 2018 6:16 pm
Jelloanddon wrote:
Tue Feb 06, 2018 6:07 pm
WalterMitty wrote:
Tue Feb 06, 2018 6:01 pm
I know you said sedan, but have you considered the Lexus RX?

Many falsely assume getting into a sedan is absolutely easier than all other types. My pops is 79 and drives a minivan, and it's much easier for him to get into than a sedan...sedans are too low. With the van (and many smaller SUVs), the seat is about butt height, you simply step/slide in...with the seat greeting your backside with very little change in height. On exit, you just spin 90 degrees, and drop your feet and then just stand.
How tall is your dad? My folks are under 5’4 with pretty bad mobility issues. We have access to a mini-van and it’s a struggle.
My dad is about 5'11. But even for short folks, it should be.....use the grab handle, small step up, and boom. Obviously, you have first hand knowledge of your specific issues, but I still see sedans as something harder to get in and out of based on the lowering and moving into movement. As some said before, maybe a smaller SUV might fit the bill.

My boss is barely 5 feet...if that, and she drives a Lexus NX (won't have the V6 you want) and it's great for her.
That’s the problem- small step up is a struggle. They are so bent over, they practically need to fall into a seat. But I’ll take a look at a few just to be sure. Thanks.

jebmke
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Re: Want a Safe Car, Feel Guilty

Post by jebmke » Tue Feb 06, 2018 6:53 pm

Spouse just bought a 2018 Camry Hybrid. Quite peppy when it needs to be. More road noise than I expected - probably a lot more than you are used to in Lexus. If I drove it regularly I would certainly shut down the display - lots of distraction.
When you discover that you are riding a dead horse, the best strategy is to dismount.

jeffG
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Re: Want a Safe Car, Feel Guilty

Post by jeffG » Tue Feb 06, 2018 7:56 pm

I just bought a new Pacifica Touring L, my wife loves minivans and we have owned 5 in a row starting in 1984 (Chrysler, dodge and Plymouth versions). Sliding rear doors make getting old people and kids in and out a breeze. The advanced safetytec comes with lane monitoring, adaptive cruise, blind spot, and enough cameras to make your own movie. We’ve always had good luck with minivans and just sold our old one with 177,000 still running fine with just a few rattles to show its age. Never even changed sparkplugs! There is a dealer in Cuyahoga Falls, Ohio almost giving them away.

tibbitts
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Re: Want a Safe Car, Feel Guilty

Post by tibbitts » Tue Feb 06, 2018 8:24 pm

Well, the Sienna van's Toyota Mobility access seat pretty much solves the problem for one old person. The second old person would require adding a similar aftermarket front passenger seat, I believe that's an additional $10k or so.

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Re: Want a Safe Car, Feel Guilty

Post by nisiprius » Tue Feb 06, 2018 8:38 pm

Jelloanddon wrote:
Tue Feb 06, 2018 10:38 am
I currently have a 2007 Lexus. As I get older and more nervous about driving, especially at night, I want to get a vehicle with more safety features, e,g, blind spot monitoring, pre-collision braking, etc.
We had a 2005 car. As we got older and more nervous about driving, we wanted to get a vehicle with more safety features. We decided to take the plunge early in 2016. We could only find what we wanted in the high trim line of the car we were looking at.

So we shrugged, and paid something like $33,000.

We could afford it. We'd gotten more than ten years and more than 100,000 miles out of the old car. There were rational reasons for the purchase, it wasn't essential but it wasn't frivolous. We didn't have much guilt or much stomach churning.

So far, we fortunately haven't had the opportunity to find out whether the vehicle stability control, or the pre-collision braking work. I love the parking warnings that tell us when we're getting close to something, I love the blind spot monitor, I love the new LED headlights, I love the adaptive cruise control. And the adaptive cruise control is a kind of safety feature because it is clear that the car's radar is better at judging speed differences than I am. Furthermore, there is a definite reduction in marital friction because I can quit backseat passenger-seat driving. I can shut my yap: the car doesn't think she's following too close, and if it does the car will put on the brakes.
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cantos
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Re: Want a Safe Car, Feel Guilty

Post by cantos » Tue Feb 06, 2018 8:42 pm

Time to answer OP's question. A 2-4 year old Ford Fusion Energi Titanium often comes packaged w the safety features (lane-keeping, blind spot light, adaptive cruise control, collision warning) - not necessarily, so do your research. But it worked for me and it's very affordable!

golfCaddy
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Re: Want a Safe Car, Feel Guilty

Post by golfCaddy » Tue Feb 06, 2018 8:43 pm

I wouldn't mind paying more for a safer car in theory. However, most of the latest features don't protect me from I consider the highest risk, the idiotic behavior of the other drivers on the road. If you insist on always having the latest safety bells and whistles, then get a lease. The semi-autonomous driving features will be a lot more advanced in 3-4 years.

dbr
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Re: Want a Safe Car, Feel Guilty

Post by dbr » Tue Feb 06, 2018 9:42 pm

nisiprius wrote:
Tue Feb 06, 2018 8:38 pm
Furthermore, there is a definite reduction in marital friction because I can quit backseat passenger-seat driving. I can shut my yap: the car doesn't think she's following too close, and if it does the car will put on the brakes.
That's funny. We were car shopping a couple of years ago and as the salesman went through the spiel on all the devices and warnings I could only comment that the car was going to take away her job. I don't know if she has been pleased or not.

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Re: Want a Safe Car, Feel Guilty

Post by bloom2708 » Tue Feb 06, 2018 9:43 pm

My father in law turned off his lane departure warning. The car kept beeping at him and pretty soon it was "the beep that cried wolf". :shock:

I'm not sure what that says about his driving at 75+.
"We are not here to please, but to provoke thoughtfulness." --Unknown Boglehead

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Re: Want a Safe Car, Feel Guilty

Post by CULater » Tue Feb 06, 2018 9:51 pm

Like most older folks, I am more challenged by night driving. The IIHS is now testing and reporting on headlight performance for current and recent vehicles. For example, here's the page for the 2016 Camry.

http://www.iihs.org/iihs/ratings/vehicl ... sedan/2016

For my recent purchase of a Honda CRV, I went to the top trim Touring model, particularly because this model had better rated headlights than the lower trim models. Also, it has automatic switching between low and high beams. This helps night visibility because it quickly goes back and forth as needed, more quickly than you can do it manually. I would recommend looking for this option as well. I thought this kind of stuff was just unnecessary frills but I've found it really seems worth having if you are night-driving challenged.
May you have the hindsight to know where you've been, The foresight to know where you're going, And the insight to know when you've gone too far. ~ Irish Blessing

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