Where to move? New job, considering Nevada...

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western_doc
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Where to move? New job, considering Nevada...

Post by western_doc » Wed Jul 26, 2017 3:01 pm

I am a relatively high income earner (physician) working in a very HCOL area. The HCOL has been wearing me down over the last several years. An opportunity has come up to do remote work for an east coast practice for their after hours coverage. There is an obvious benefit working from the pacific time zone given the 3 hours time difference so I wouldn't have to work quite so late. I am in the process of deciding whether to take the job or not. Pay is slightly higher with a bit more time off, so it seems like a good deal. Also have flexibility of where to work as this would be a home based office - comes with it's own set of issues (both positive and negative), but it's a good group and I know several docs in the group. Flexibility of where to live, not dealing with driving to work, financials/time off increase seems to outweigh the late hours and potential isolation of working from home.

Background: early 40's, single, no kids. Enjoy where I live (bay area CA), but not overly attached. Renting, so no home to sell (unfortunate as I would've made a killing!).

I am thinking of moving to Nevada and would love some input from the bogleheads. Obviously the big benefits are no state income tax, relatively low cost of living (can actually find an affordable place to buy/rent), staying in pacific time zone, close to CA. Here's my thinking:

Reno

Pros:
-4 seasons
-I don't think any season is too brutal, correct me if I'm wrong
-Great options for outdoors activities
-Big enough to have some things to do
-Traffic not bad
-Close to Tahoe/skiing
-Not too far from bay area (current location of residence)

Cons:
-Not a large city, might get boring?
-Not a big international airport
-Probably won't have many visitors outside of ski season
-Hard to make friends given smaller city?? Not sure about this, input would be great
-?lack of diversity? - not sure

Vegas

Pros:
-No harsh winter
-Big international airport
-Entertainment
-Many things open late/24 hours - could be helpful given late working hours
-Diversity - people, food etc.
-Outdoors activities - at least as far as I understand - lake, hiking etc. Not as good as Reno, but not terrible AFAIK. Also probably limited by temps in summer months
-Traffic not too bad?

Cons:
-Brutal summer (have lived in hot places before - this is less a negative for me than a long harsh winter), but will be an adjustment coming from coastal CA
-?Transient population? - maybe this could work against establishing friends/community? Have no idea here, input would be helpful
-?Crime?
-Economy driven by entertainment industry? Not sure if I care, but possible negative.
-?Healthcare? I understand it's not so great in Nevada in general

Obviously wouldn't live on/too near the strip. Heard Summerlin & Henderson are nice, know nothing about either. From what I understand, would lean towards Henderson - closer to airport and outdoors activities?

I couldn't care less about gambling (if anything, such an emphasis on casinos would be a negative for me, especially with the cigarette smoking).

Any help would be appreciated. Other big pros/cons for each place?

I'm open to other suggestions. I had considered PNW, but am unconvinced it's for me. Could do WA state across from Portland, but I find Portland a bit weird. Didn't seem all that diverse for such a size city. Traffic was way worse than I had thought - nearly as bad if not possibly worse than bay area. Was really surprised driving around the area. So many gloomy days. Being way up northwest, kind of a pain getting anywhere, but is a decent size airport. Living in Portland would be out though - back to high income taxes and would rather just stay in CA at that point. Seattle - HCOL minus state income tax. Don't really know Seattle at all. Similar issues (for me) as to Portland I would think.

Other options:
CA - could stay here (with or without new job) - bay area is nice. Cheaper area in CA? Maybe, but still have high taxes, COL would be lower, but still relatively high.
AZ - some income tax; relatively LCOL otherwise; hot;
CO - some income tax; LCOL?; cold winters
Both of these would entail losing an hour and working later

TX/FL - no state income tax; LCOL; hot; lose time benefit given time zones; really not inclined
AK? - no state income tax; LCOL; far far away; super cold; outdoors activities in summer would be interesting; time zone benefit; probably just too remote for me
Hawaii? - beautiful; beach weather year round; huge benefit of time zone (would be closer to normal working hours); high taxes, high COL; also very remote; would probably be more inclined to stay in CA

Have considered other spots with natural beauty (other parts of WA state for example), but given single status and nature of work I'm afraid I'd just feel too isolated without close access to a larger city. Plus I would need guaranteed very high speed internet access, which could be a problem outside a medium to large city.

Seems I keep coming back to Nevada, but really not sure and would appreciate some input. Amount of time off would allow for significant travel, so could also look at this as a home base from which to work and leave town frequently. Have been traveling less in recent years, but might get back out there more with this situation. Thanks in advance! (and yes, I have searched the boglehead forum for similar posts, some of which were helpful).


West

runner3081
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Re: Where to move? New job, considering Nevada...

Post by runner3081 » Wed Jul 26, 2017 4:34 pm

A few comments...

1) We lived in WA State and wanted to move out for a variety of reasons (weather and cost of living). Took trips to Southern CA, Summerlin and Phoenix area to help make a decision. We ultimately decided on the Phoenix area.

Summerlin was nice, but we felt more comfortable with schools and the area with where we ended up in Scottsdale. Southern CA was sort of a pipe dream and simply too expensive to handle and be able to keep up with our high savings rate.

2) If you are going to practice in Vegas, there is a pretty bad reputation of doctors who do practice in Vegas. Down here in Phoenix, we have a large number of patients who flee Vegas due to the poor reputation for care. I hear this pretty frequently from patients.

qwertyjazz
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Re: Where to move? New job, considering Nevada...

Post by qwertyjazz » Wed Jul 26, 2017 4:38 pm

Is this a telemedicine job? There might be issues of taxation of state the service provided in.
G.E. Box "All models are wrong, but some are useful."

littlebird
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Re: Where to move? New job, considering Nevada...

Post by littlebird » Wed Jul 26, 2017 5:06 pm

I would second the suggestion above for Phoenix metro instead of anywhere in Nevada. Your list of negatives for both Nevada sites is spot on. The Phoenix metro has nearly everything an unattached single could want. The one negative - hot summers - shouldn't affect a work-from-home non-commuter very much, just as doesn't much bother that other large group of Phoenix metro non-commuters-retirees. :beer

western_doc
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Re: Where to move? New job, considering Nevada...

Post by western_doc » Wed Jul 26, 2017 5:08 pm

runner3081 wrote:A few comments...

1) We lived in WA State and wanted to move out for a variety of reasons (weather and cost of living). Took trips to Southern CA, Summerlin and Phoenix area to help make a decision. We ultimately decided on the Phoenix area.

Summerlin was nice, but we felt more comfortable with schools and the area with where we ended up in Scottsdale. Southern CA was sort of a pipe dream and simply too expensive to handle and be able to keep up with our high savings rate.

2) If you are going to practice in Vegas, there is a pretty bad reputation of doctors who do practice in Vegas. Down here in Phoenix, we have a large number of patients who flee Vegas due to the poor reputation for care. I hear this pretty frequently from patients.

Thanks for sharing. I don't have kids, so schools don't concern me. I would be practicing from Nevada (possibly Vegas), but it's telemedicine, so not a Vegas based practice. I have definitely heard medical care isn't great there though. I have heard Scottsdale is nice, although I would be losing an hour because of time zone and there are some state income taxes.

western_doc
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Re: Where to move? New job, considering Nevada...

Post by western_doc » Wed Jul 26, 2017 5:09 pm

qwertyjazz wrote:Is this a telemedicine job? There might be issues of taxation of state the service provided in.

Yes, this is telemedicine. My understanding is I would only have to pay taxes in the state I reside.

https://www.rapidtax.com/blog/work-remotely-pay-taxes/

western_doc
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Re: Where to move? New job, considering Nevada...

Post by western_doc » Wed Jul 26, 2017 5:11 pm

littlebird wrote:I would second the suggestion above for Phoenix metro instead of anywhere in Nevada. Your list of negatives for both Nevada sites is spot on. The Phoenix metro has nearly everything an unattached single could want. The one negative - hot summers - shouldn't affect a work-from-home non-commuter very much, just as doesn't much bother that other large group of Phoenix metro non-commuters-retirees. :beer

Ok, thanks. Sounds like AZ has it's supporters.

runner3081
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Re: Where to move? New job, considering Nevada...

Post by runner3081 » Wed Jul 26, 2017 5:11 pm

western_doc wrote:
runner3081 wrote:A few comments...

1) We lived in WA State and wanted to move out for a variety of reasons (weather and cost of living). Took trips to Southern CA, Summerlin and Phoenix area to help make a decision. We ultimately decided on the Phoenix area.

Summerlin was nice, but we felt more comfortable with schools and the area with where we ended up in Scottsdale. Southern CA was sort of a pipe dream and simply too expensive to handle and be able to keep up with our high savings rate.

2) If you are going to practice in Vegas, there is a pretty bad reputation of doctors who do practice in Vegas. Down here in Phoenix, we have a large number of patients who flee Vegas due to the poor reputation for care. I hear this pretty frequently from patients.

Thanks for sharing. I don't have kids, so schools don't concern me. I would be practicing from Nevada (possibly Vegas), but it's telemedicine, so not a Vegas based practice. I have definitely heard medical care isn't great there though. I have heard Scottsdale is nice, although I would be losing an hour because of time zone and there are some state income taxes.
You would only lose an hour 1/2 of the year :)

Right now, we are the same time as Pacific.

western_doc
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Re: Where to move? New job, considering Nevada...

Post by western_doc » Wed Jul 26, 2017 5:19 pm

runner3081 wrote:
western_doc wrote:
runner3081 wrote:
Right now, we are the same time as Pacific.

Good point, forgot about that. Thanks :sharebeer

rooms222
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Re: Where to move? New job, considering Nevada...

Post by rooms222 » Wed Jul 26, 2017 6:27 pm

As noted in the comments of the article you posted, New York takes a very different view of those that work remotely in their state. http://www.biglawinvestor.com/new-york- ... x-penalty/

So does Delaware, Pennsylvania, Nebraska and New Jersey.

If you do work remotely for the benefit of an employer located in those states you will pay taxes for income generated there, unless there is a necessary business reason for you to have to be where you are located geographically that benefits the employer.

western_doc
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Re: Where to move? New job, considering Nevada...

Post by western_doc » Wed Jul 26, 2017 6:40 pm

Thanks for pointing that out. Luckily, it's not based in any of those states.

hicabob
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Re: Where to move? New job, considering Nevada...

Post by hicabob » Wed Jul 26, 2017 6:56 pm

Incline Village is interesting, but not inexpensive.
Carson City would seem to be a possibility. Not too fancy but Reno access w/out actually being in Reno?

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rocket354
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Re: Where to move? New job, considering Nevada...

Post by rocket354 » Wed Jul 26, 2017 7:22 pm

western_doc wrote: Vegas

Pros:
-No harsh winter
-Big international airport
-Entertainment
-Many things open late/24 hours - could be helpful given late working hours
-Diversity - people, food etc.
-Outdoors activities - at least as far as I understand - lake, hiking etc. Not as good as Reno, but not terrible AFAIK. Also probably limited by temps in summer months
-Traffic not too bad?

Cons:
-Brutal summer (have lived in hot places before - this is less a negative for me than a long harsh winter), but will be an adjustment coming from coastal CA
-?Transient population? - maybe this could work against establishing friends/community? Have no idea here, input would be helpful
-?Crime?
-Economy driven by entertainment industry? Not sure if I care, but possible negative.
-?Healthcare? I understand it's not so great in Nevada in general

Obviously wouldn't live on/too near the strip. Heard Summerlin & Henderson are nice, know nothing about either. From what I understand, would lean towards Henderson - closer to airport and outdoors activities?

I couldn't care less about gambling (if anything, such an emphasis on casinos would be a negative for me, especially with the cigarette smoking).
I lived in Las Vegas for years. To address a couple of your pros: you can get to anywhere from the airport, but it's actually delightfully small. I could get in and out very quickly. Traffic isn't bad compared to most big cities. It gets slow during rush hours but it's rarely ever gridlock and there are plenty of side street options if it gets bad, as well as multiple highway routes to most parts of the city. Traffic also clears out quickly after the peak times.

To address your cons: Population is transient overall. There is a growing tech industry, and some non-gambling related large companies around (Zappos, for example), and corporate offices for casinos all supplying long-term careers for people, but there are a lot of people who are there for a short period then gone. Gambling and its support industries are still king.

Crime is pretty prevalent. Mostly, it's petty crime: don't leave your car door unlocked or your garage door open for even a night. There are a few places where you'd find violent crime, but those areas are fairly easily avoided.

Between Summerlin and Henderson, it's a toss-up for which you might prefer. Summerlin is older and more established; Henderson has been quickly growing. Henderson is closer to the airport, but I used to live in Summerlin and it was still just a 20-25 min drive since I was off the highway. You can be in parts of Henderson not too close to a highway and have it take much longer than that. (You can also, of course, be considerably closer, whereas you'll never be closer than about 15 mins from the airport in Summerlin.) I think Summerlin is closer to most outdoor activities. Red Rock Canyon is practically your back yard, Mt Charleston is 30-45 min drive north, and Valley of Fire is about 45 mins away. Add 30-45 mins to those times from Henderson; maybe only 15 additional for VoF.

Other positives you might not think of: PLENTY to do. You could go to a different restaurant practically every night. There's a lot of sight-seeing to do, and concerts and shows to see with nice locals discounts. The larger strip casinos are absolutely stunning with some amazing pools and clubs. I hate cigarette smoke, and the larger casinos are generally very well ventilated to the point you might not even notice the smoking unless someone were right next to you.

The Grand Canyon is only a few hours away, Hoover Dam is 30-45 mins away, Death Valley a couple of hours, Los Angeles is 3-4 hour drive (< 1 hr flight), Phoenix is 4-5 hours (~1 hour flight), Reno/Tahoe is 8 hours drive (1-1.5 hr flight).

And the final positive: you won't have to travel often to visit out of town friends or family. They'll all be itching to come see you! Give them a bedroom for the weekend, accept their offer to pay for your dinner at a new restaurant in return, rinse and repeat as often as you'd like.

So in short, it is definitely a service-industry dominated town with lots of petty crime, but you can find a nice area (especially on a doctor's salary) and there is plenty for a single guy to do. Your friends might come and go a little more often than in other cities, but you'll pay no additional income tax and can have plenty of your remote friends come visit you. It's also a very unique and well-known city, so anywhere you do go when you mention you live in Las Vegas you have an instant conversation starter.

Hope this helps!

western_doc
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Re: Where to move? New job, considering Nevada...

Post by western_doc » Wed Jul 26, 2017 7:31 pm

hicabob wrote:Incline Village is interesting, but not inexpensive.
Carson City would seem to be a possibility. Not too fancy but Reno access w/out actually being in Reno?
I know very little about either. I understand that incline village can get snowed in at times. Any experience living in either?

western_doc
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Re: Where to move? New job, considering Nevada...

Post by western_doc » Wed Jul 26, 2017 7:33 pm

Thanks rocket, very helpful and the type of info I was looking for. When I tell people I'm considering vegas I usually get a somewhat negative reaction. But it's always from people who have never lived there and all they know is the strip.

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Jazztonight
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Re: Where to move? New job, considering Nevada...

Post by Jazztonight » Wed Jul 26, 2017 8:17 pm

littlebird wrote:I would second the suggestion above for Phoenix metro instead of anywhere in Nevada. Your list of negatives for both Nevada sites is spot on. The Phoenix metro has nearly everything an unattached single could want. The one negative - hot summers - shouldn't affect a work-from-home non-commuter very much, just as doesn't much bother that other large group of Phoenix metro non-commuters-retirees. :beer
Is this the same Phoenix that hit 120F not long ago?

I live in the SF Bay Area. The taxes you pay here = one of the prices you pay to live here. I left once for 7 years and regretted it from day one. I moved back 7 years later. I was lucky to be able to do so.
"What does not destroy me, makes me stronger." Nietzsche

littlebird
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Re: Where to move? New job, considering Nevada...

Post by littlebird » Wed Jul 26, 2017 8:37 pm

Jazztonight wrote:
littlebird wrote:I would second the suggestion above for Phoenix metro instead of anywhere in Nevada. Your list of negatives for both Nevada sites is spot on. The Phoenix metro has nearly everything an unattached single could want. The one negative - hot summers - shouldn't affect a work-from-home non-commuter very much, just as doesn't much bother that other large group of Phoenix metro non-commuters-retirees. :beer
Is this the same Phoenix that hit 120F not long ago?

I live in the SF Bay Area. The taxes you pay here = one of the prices you pay to live here. I left once for 7 years and regretted it from day one. I moved back 7 years later. I was lucky to be able to do so.
The OP didn't ask if s/he should move, but "Where to move". I, too would prefer to live in the SF Bay area if I could afford it, but that wasn't the question asked or answered.

And yes, it's very hot in the Phoenix metro summer - although beautiful in the winter - but if you don't have to commute, or take kids to school and back, and you're not a tourist in town, you simply stay inside in the middle of the hottest days, and do what must be done outside in the mornings and evenings.

When you do go out on those days, you don't need to scrape the heat off the windshield, or shovel it out of the driveway, or risk skidding on it. You don't have to pull heavy wet clothing on and off or wear boots against it. Cars have excellent air-conditioning, as does everyplace you need to go. So to those of us not lucky enough to live in SF, or who want to leave because of the HCOL, it's probably as good as anywhere else in the continental U.S., and better than many. Which is why it's now the 5th largest metro in the U.S..

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Watty
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Re: Where to move? New job, considering Nevada...

Post by Watty » Wed Jul 26, 2017 8:40 pm

You might want to just just stay where you are for six months to make sure that the new position works out well. When you are ready to move you could just rent a place for a few months at a time to try out several different cities.

Even if the new job does work out well then you need to consider that you may get tired of working remotely and want to start working in a more conventional environment again in a few years. An important factor could be what the future job opportunities will be where you relocate to.

Reno is a actually a pretty small town since there is not in a large metropolitan area around it. It has been a long time since I have been in Reno but as I recall in most directions once you get about ten miles from the downtown area you are basically out in the country.

Taxes and the cost of housing is important but I would be cautious about picking a location mainly based on that since just moving to a medium cost of living area would be a huge improvement.

In addition to the time zones also look a when when the sun rises and sets. Being farther north makes a lot more difference than many people realize especially around the longest and shortest days of the year. For example on the shortest day of the year Portland has about an hours less daylight than San Francisco.

Being located in the far eastern or western edge of the time also makes a big difference in when the sun rises and sets. For example the time the sun rises and sets will be a lot earlier in Las Vegas than in San Francisco even though they are in the same time zone.

They are a bit different and smaller but since you mentioned skiing you could also look into Boise and Bend Oregon both of which often rank well in places rated lists for smaller cities.

letsgobobby
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Re: Where to move? New job, considering Nevada...

Post by letsgobobby » Thu Jul 27, 2017 12:24 am

Eventually you may marry and/or have children. Think about which community offers you the best chance to meet a future life partner (or just friends) - think politics, culture, how welcoming the city is to outsiders and new arrivals, how and where people socialize, etc. For instance in our area, socializing is typically done in a brewpub (ncluding with kids) or on a trail (biking or hiking).
Last edited by letsgobobby on Sat Aug 05, 2017 8:56 am, edited 1 time in total.

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patriciamgr2
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Re: Where to move? New job, considering Nevada...

Post by patriciamgr2 » Thu Jul 27, 2017 2:05 am

Since Tesla plant, Reno/Sparks & surrounding areas are changing IMO. Higher prices, but possibly a more interesting group of neighbors. Reno always had higher prices than Vegas (I think due to tax refugees from Cali). I lived there & in Incline Village briefly; enjoyed them both. IMO 4WD or AWD is mandatory in Tahoe area.

I loved living in Summerlin. Red Rock is just a short drive away; at one time I could bicycle there, but now there's too much traffic. Lots of upscale entertainment as well. Be careful not to rent/buy "Summerlin adjacent"--there is a drop-off in quality/safety. There are shuttles as well as Uber to airport--not significantly longer commute than Henderson IME. Both Henderson & Summerlin have housing stock oriented towards families; public transport is shockingly sparse. Summerlin has pathetic poseurs like a lot of places (people petitioned in my old neighborhood for valet service for our local grocery store parking lot). Pluses to Vegas: Smith Center; lounge act music at casinos; Summerlin Ballet company; etc. I'd suggest renting for 1 year just to make sure you like the area. Weather & electric bills are brutal in the summer.

Good Luck & Best Wishes.

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gunn_show
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Re: Where to move? New job, considering Nevada...

Post by gunn_show » Thu Jul 27, 2017 12:56 pm

western_doc wrote:I am a relatively high income earner (physician) working in a very HCOL area.

Background: early 40's, single, no kids. Enjoy where I live (bay area CA), but not overly attached. Renting, so no home to sell (unfortunate as I would've made a killing!).

Other options:
CA - could stay here (with or without new job) - bay area is nice. Cheaper area in CA? Maybe, but still have high taxes, COL would be lower, but still relatively high.
Why no consideration for Southern California? Sure it is still considered "HCOL" but definitely not SF-level "VHCOL" and definitely 10x better weather. Only con really is same high tax liability. But I bet you could find a place to live 25-50% cheaper than in SF, especially if you don't need a 3BR SFH (I scanned your OP and don't really see your desired housing parameters). You could rent a studio or 1BR in Pacific Beach or Encinitas and walk to the main beach strip for a pretty affordable price. (I live in SD, work for bay area company, so I monitor housing prices up there frequently, so I know SD is much cheaper)

But for a single dude making your income, I would have San Diego pretty damn high on my list (certainly leaps higher than Reno... for a single guy? Meh). Amazing weather, big airport, a million cool areas to live (buy or rent, you could Airbnb month to month in different beach towns to find one you like best), gaslamp downtown district, pacific beach, mission beach, theme parks, boating, north park, Padres games at Petco Park, tons of activity at the convention center, amazing food and restaurants, on and on.

2nd option for me would probably be PHX / Scottsdale as many others have offered. Great area for single folks, and very affordable. PHX is a great airport to travel in/out of.
"The best life hack of all is to just put the work in and never give up." Bas Rutten

rterickson
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Re: Where to move? New job, considering Nevada...

Post by rterickson » Thu Jul 27, 2017 3:05 pm

hicabob wrote: Carson City would seem to be a possibility. Not too fancy but Reno access w/out actually being in Reno?
Minden is also quite nice.

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corwin
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Re: Where to move? New job, considering Nevada...

Post by corwin » Thu Jul 27, 2017 4:27 pm

I am trying to convince my wife that we should move to Nevada from Chicago once we are empty-nesters. We love CA but it is one of the few places with a worse tax environment than IL. Las Vegas is close to many good things like National Parks and is a short drive to SoCal. Our daughter wants to go to school in Los Angeles. We would be close enough to visit but not close enough to tempt her to come home every weekend.

I am concerned about time zones as well. Most of my clients are in Europe or East Coast. I would have to get up at 4:00 AM to have enough overlap.

Good luck with your decision.

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Re: Where to move? New job, considering Nevada...

Post by Cyclone » Thu Jul 27, 2017 8:13 pm

Two points:

- If you are considering Phoenix, you might also think about Tucson. It is smaller and a little cooler (because of higher elevation). There are other small cities in Arizona (such as Flagstaff, Prescott, or Payson) that are not hot at all.

- I believe the Big Island of Hawaii can be a cheaper place to live than Oahu, but it is more than a little remote.

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Pajamas
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Re: Where to move? New job, considering Nevada...

Post by Pajamas » Fri Jul 28, 2017 1:51 am

western_doc wrote: I am thinking of moving to Nevada and would love some input from the bogleheads. Obviously the big benefits are no state income tax, relatively low cost of living (can actually find an affordable place to buy/rent), staying in pacific time zone, close to CA. Here's my thinking:

Reno

Pros:
-4 seasons. Yes, but none of them are very green, or at least not for long.
-I don't think any season is too brutal, correct me if I'm wrong No, they can be extreme, but not too extreme or for too long. However, there are a lot of fires, floods, occasional snowstorm (even during the summer!), etc. Summer is hot but dry and is comfortable even into the upper 90s as long as you take precautions not to get sunburnt or dehydrated. The weather can also vary a lot across the area.
-Great options for outdoors activities Yes, definitely. I know someone who moved there and that was one of their top reasons. They especially like to bicycle, hike, snow ski, and swim.
-Big enough to have some things to do Yes, and there are some decent shows and performances because of the casinos.
-Traffic not bad Not really, but people in Reno think it is bad. Seems like there has been a lot of road construction everywhere and also traffic jams on the expressways.
-Close to Tahoe/skiing Yes, and there is snow skiing very close by, halfway to Tahoe at Mt. Rose Ski Resort.
-Not too far from bay area (current location of residence) Yes, not a bad drive.

Cons:
-Not a large city, might get boring? Maybe. Area has about 350,000 people, and it seems smaller than it is in many ways.
-Not a big international airport No. My friends who live there have to fly through SFO and LAX a lot to get somewhere. For Europe they also seem to fly through YVR a lot, but I'm not sure why. Many cities you can fly to directly have limited service. There is only one airline that flies directly to NYC, for instance, and with only one flight each way every day.
-Probably won't have many visitors outside of ski season There a lot of summer activities and sightseeing in the area that people will be willing to make the trip for: Yosemite, Tahoe, the many state and national parks within a day's drive, fossils & petroglyphs, ghost towns, stargazing in the dark desert, etc.
-Hard to make friends given smaller city?? Not sure about this, input would be great Seems to be relatively easy to make friends there as there are a lot of newcomers as the region has grown, but also a lot of transient people. People are generally very friendly. The medical community must be a good size but is probably not too big, either.
-?lack of diversity? - not sure It appears to me to have good diversity with the noticeable exception of African-Americans, but the statistics don't seem to support that observation. That may be because I visit there, so I am around other visitors a lot.

fasteddie911
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Re: Where to move? New job, considering Nevada...

Post by fasteddie911 » Sat Jul 29, 2017 9:40 am

Interesting discussion as I'm in a similar situation where I'm considering where I'd want to settle down and I too have similar concerns (cost of living). I'm considering the same places as you, except for AK and FL, and as an outdoors person I'm also considering UT and ID (as well as eastern WA). I've lived in some of the areas you've mentioned, and have family/friends in all of those areas and have visited all of them as well. It's so subjective and there's so much to consider (COL, lifestyle, etc.). California would suit me well on a personal level, but I could be easily convinced it's not worth it based on COL and some lifestyle aspects, but lots of people think it's all worth it. I've lived in the PNW and I think the dreariness and shorter Winter days would get to me, but it is beautiful there. Texas has a lot going for it but I find it wouldn't suit my recreational interests well. Similar to you, Phoenix and Vegas have gained my attention more as they seem to check off a lot of boxes for me. For Hawaii, you might as well stay in California for the same cost of living and taxes, but with more amenities and things going on, while visiting the islands whenever you want. I have come to appreciate the differences in living somewhere vs. visiting it, and how mixing the two perspectives can be a mistake. In your situation, I'd just run the numbers, what your costs would be in each city with housing, expenses, etc. and how it would affect your savings rate and retirement goals and weigh that against the subjective non-financial aspects of each city, and decide whether it's worth it.

runner3081
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Re: Where to move? New job, considering Nevada...

Post by runner3081 » Sat Jul 29, 2017 10:14 am

fasteddie911 wrote:Interesting discussion as I'm in a similar situation where I'm considering where I'd want to settle down and I too have similar concerns (cost of living). I'm considering the same places as you, except for AK and FL, and as an outdoors person I'm also considering UT and ID (as well as eastern WA).
I really like the Ellensburg/Cle Elum area, especially if you don't need to work or can do so remotely. Rural feel with some good vibes from CWU and the college students. Yakima, a bigger city with all of the amenities is within 30 minutes.

TheAncientOne
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Re: Where to move? New job, considering Nevada...

Post by TheAncientOne » Sat Jul 29, 2017 10:39 am

Once you've lived in the Bay Area, going somewhere else can be difficult if you've gotten used to the climate. I know two people who moved to Seattle who came back within a couple of years due to those gray, rainy and endless winters.

You're fortunate that you can pick whichever area you think you'd enjoy most (and not mind least). I wouldn't overemphasize traffic because you're working at home and can choose whichever location in a metro area that you like best. From a cost of living perspective, n o place is better for a high income professional than Nevada. And now that Vegas has a metro population of close to 2 million, is it really possible that the state of medicine is measurably worse than other similarly sized areas?

Given my own prejudices (I travel throughout the west for business), I'd go with Denver first, then SLC. Both are large enough to have the usual big city amenities, although not the complete range you're getting in SF or would get in NYC or LA. The climates are great. Yes, Denver gets a couple of large snowstorms, usually late in the winter but you also get days in the 60s or even the 70s in midwinter so it's not like there's slush there for the rest of the winter. Both are great places if you like nearby outdoor recreation, especially SLC where you get to world class skiing in less time than the average Bay Area resident spends commuting every day. While housing is more expensive than Vegas, and probably Phoenix as well, it's still reasonable and the state income taxes will seem minor compared to your time in CA.

knick17
Posts: 81
Joined: Sun Jul 02, 2017 9:39 am

Re: Where to move? New job, considering Nevada...

Post by knick17 » Fri Aug 04, 2017 10:59 pm

Have you thought abour going abroad? from Australia or Europe, or maybe Japan!which i recommend!

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