Beware Citibank Bonus Promotion

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LadyIJ
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Beware Citibank Bonus Promotion

Post by LadyIJ » Wed May 10, 2017 5:26 pm

I put $50,000 for the $500 bonus. It was represented to me as 90 days. Upon reading the fine print, it's 60 days after you meet the 90 day requirement, which makes it a lower interest rate. Then I was told when I called the 800 number that I was disqualified because I did not sign up for paperless - which is not true, I told the banker I wanted paperless and indeed never received anything in the mail until this week (90 days up). I plan to Consumer Financial Protection Bureau if the girl that signed me up doesn't make it right in the next couple of weeks. They also did this to my brother. Wanted to spread the word . . .

Easy Rhino
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Re: Beware Citibank Bonus Promotion

Post by Easy Rhino » Wed May 10, 2017 6:35 pm

I also signed up for that same bonus. My 90 days isn't over yet, although I had read that the bonus may be delayed. I was able to sign up for estatements on account opening, I believe.

So i'm interested how this turns out for you because you may be a couple of months ahead of me.

Jack FFR1846
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Re: Beware Citibank Bonus Promotion

Post by Jack FFR1846 » Wed May 10, 2017 6:40 pm

Their terms are pretty wobbly. I did the $400 bonus with them last fall. The deal required $15k initial deposit that had to stay for 30 days (which I only knew from my call near my time to withdraw) then at least $10k for the following 60 days. They were very slow to credit the deposit and sent me forms at least 3 times because according to them my name didn't match my IRS name (I used my name as on my tax return). So it took them about 30 days from the initial "deposit" for my deposit to be ACH'd from my credit union. I did get a final date from them after which the bonus stuck. I checked and the money was in the account....waited 2 days then closed the account.
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Barefootgirl
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Re: Beware Citibank Bonus Promotion

Post by Barefootgirl » Wed May 10, 2017 6:58 pm

Interesting coincedence. I was on the phone with Citibank earlier tonight because my statement did not show up in the mail and they said it was because i recently changed to paperless statements.

I know for a fact that I did not..
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jeff1949
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Re: Beware Citibank Bonus Promotion

Post by jeff1949 » Thu May 11, 2017 11:15 am

Easy Rhino wrote:I also signed up for that same bonus. My 90 days isn't over yet, although I had read that the bonus may be delayed. I was able to sign up for estatements on account opening, I believe.

So i'm interested how this turns out for you because you may be a couple of months ahead of me.


Pretty much the same for me. The $50k has to stay in for 60 days (recently went past that) and then you have to wait "up to 90 days" for the bonus. So you need to keep the $50k in there to prevent the monthly service charge for another 90 days possibly. Not as great a deal as I had originally thought especially if they don't pay up the $500 bonus. I don't think I will be tempted by this deal in the future.

LadyIJ
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Re: Beware Citibank Bonus Promotion

Post by LadyIJ » Thu May 11, 2017 5:09 pm

BUT, they're saying I'm disqualified because I did not sign up for paperless, even though I'm sure I did, because I do everything paperless. So to keep the money in there another 60 days and not get anything when I can invest in the market, forget it. I'll be filing with CFPB, but even if they do pay in another 60 days, that totally changes the interest rate you get. Funny, I was paperless until this week, when I got some mail, and then was told I wasn't signed up for paperless. They are full of it, and although I think my brother is going to wait it out, I am too angry. I missed a sure deal at Chase having the $50K tied up.

LadyIJ
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Re: Beware Citibank Bonus Promotion

Post by LadyIJ » Fri May 12, 2017 8:27 am

I got my money yesterday, but I had to threaten to file with the Consumer Financial Protection Bureau. Would I do it again? I guess - but I will read all the fine print and make sure the banker dots every "i" and crosses every "t". I wonder how many people don't fight and pursue and just lose the promo bonus.

BW1985
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Re: Beware Citibank Bonus Promotion

Post by BW1985 » Fri May 12, 2017 8:43 am

Thanks for the heads up, Citi sounds like a real PITA to deal with and not worth the trouble for account bonuses.
"Squirrels figured out how to save eons ago. They buried acorns. Some, they dug up, for food. Others, they let to sprout, in new oak trees. We could learn from squirrels." -john94549

Jags4186
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Re: Beware Citibank Bonus Promotion

Post by Jags4186 » Fri May 12, 2017 9:27 am

I did the $400 for $15000 bonus for my wife and I last year. Surprise surprise, we both filed CFPB complaints to get them to pay.

Besides their Double Cash credit card I would avoid them like the plague.

Imbros
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Re: Beware Citibank Bonus Promotion

Post by Imbros » Fri May 12, 2017 10:55 am

I remember hearing about Citibank's extremely poor customer service several years ago and have never done business with them.

I guess I will keep it that way.
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BW1985
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Re: Beware Citibank Bonus Promotion

Post by BW1985 » Fri May 12, 2017 11:03 am

I hope I get my 50K American miles from their credit card. They said it could take up to 2 statements to post after the statement where I hit the spend for the bonus, what a joke. Chase points immediately on the same statement. I'm done with Citi.
"Squirrels figured out how to save eons ago. They buried acorns. Some, they dug up, for food. Others, they let to sprout, in new oak trees. We could learn from squirrels." -john94549

azurekep
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Re: Beware Citibank Bonus Promotion

Post by azurekep » Fri May 12, 2017 11:31 am

Good to hear that the CFPB -- or threats to use them --works as advertised. :sharebeer:

crake
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Re: Beware Citibank Bonus Promotion

Post by crake » Fri May 12, 2017 1:33 pm

Another data point for someone who had to use the CFPB to get a bonus from Citi. As soon as I opened the account I messaged Citi bank to get confirmation that I was signed up for the bonus. I received confirmation again after completing the requirements. After 60 more days and no bonus I called up and was told that I was not targeted for the bonus and thus not eligible. I've been a Citi customer for over 10 years, had two separate confirmations that I was eligible, and threatened to file a complaint with the CFPB. They still wouldn't budge.

A couple of weeks after filing the complaint I received the bonus. I don't understand the logic of treating long standing customers that way and then having to deal with the CFPB. It most have cost them more than just giving me the 40000 thank you points.

Coinsinthefountain
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Re: Beware Citibank Bonus Promotion

Post by Coinsinthefountain » Fri May 12, 2017 1:52 pm

I signed up for the $400 bonus on $15,000 and left the money there for the required time. When I went to have $15,400 transferred to my home bank account Citi would only let me do it in $2,000 increments. Five days ago, I phone customer service and was told I could have a check for the full amount mailed to me but that it would take maybe up to two weeks before I received it. I decided to go that route. I got another offer in the mail from Citi recently to earn $200 on $25,000 if I leave the money there three months. I probably won't do it as there's a $30 monthly service fee for accounts under $50,000. That eats into your earnings and I don't like the way it's hidden in the fine print.

kjvmartin
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Re: Beware Citibank Bonus Promotion

Post by kjvmartin » Fri May 12, 2017 1:56 pm

I had a nightmare customer experience with Citi during the Costco Amex migration.

I was without a Costco Rewards credit card for almost 3 months. I lost a chunk of money in rewards. I had to pay cash/debit.

For weeks I was on hold for no less than an hour several times trying to figure this out. My card finally came, but my wive's was even later. We'd moved, apparently on the wrong day. Even though I updated my address with Costco, Citi, USPS, and everywhere else BEFORE moving, they couldn't sort out my address and had to issue me around 4 or 5 new card numbers each time they marked one as "lost"

They refused to overnight a new card, even after all of my trouble with them. Policy dictated they had to snail mail it. I still can't believe Costco aligned themselves with this terrible company. Their website user interface is terrible & dated compared to my other financial institutions as well.

kjvm

ponyboy
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Re: Beware Citibank Bonus Promotion

Post by ponyboy » Fri May 12, 2017 2:02 pm

Jack FFR1846 wrote:Their terms are pretty wobbly. I did the $400 bonus with them last fall. The deal required $15k initial deposit that had to stay for 30 days (which I only knew from my call near my time to withdraw) then at least $10k for the following 60 days. They were very slow to credit the deposit and sent me forms at least 3 times because according to them my name didn't match my IRS name (I used my name as on my tax return). So it took them about 30 days from the initial "deposit" for my deposit to be ACH'd from my credit union. I did get a final date from them after which the bonus stuck. I checked and the money was in the account....waited 2 days then closed the account.


My wife and I also did the $400 bonus. We did receive it...took some time...had to call customer service a couple times. They sucked to deal with...I wouldnt do it again personally. Credit cards are a lot easier. Bonuses are better.

LadyIJ
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Re: Beware Citibank Bonus Promotion

Post by LadyIJ » Fri May 12, 2017 5:10 pm

after hearing how many of you had similar problems, I'll go somewhere else. Chase is more reputable - I got my bonus no hassle. That is ridiculous on their part - spread the word I guess.

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catdude
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Re: Beware Citibank Bonus Promotion

Post by catdude » Fri May 12, 2017 6:10 pm

LadyIJ wrote:after hearing how many of you had similar problems, I'll go somewhere else. Chase is more reputable - I got my bonus no hassle. That is ridiculous on their part - spread the word I guess.


Chase is indeed easy to deal with. I set up accounts and got their bonus about a year ago... no trouble at all. I'll be keeping my accounts with them for the foreseeable future.
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Re: Beware Citibank Bonus Promotion

Post by cherijoh » Fri May 12, 2017 7:03 pm

Barefootgirl wrote:Interesting coincedence. I was on the phone with Citibank earlier tonight because my statement did not show up in the mail and they said it was because i recently changed to paperless statements.

I know for a fact that I did not..


Banks are using "Opt Out" campaigns for paperless now - that means you are agreeing to go paperless UNLESS you explicitly opt-out. So if you clicked through a splash a screen at sign on for online/mobile banking without reading it carefully, you may have indeed "signed up" for paperless.

JoeJohnson
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Re: Beware Citibank Bonus Promotion

Post by JoeJohnson » Sat May 13, 2017 10:22 am

Did the $400 bonus last fall and everything went smoothly. Experiences vary wildly.

Ron Ronnerson
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Re: Beware Citibank Bonus Promotion

Post by Ron Ronnerson » Sat May 13, 2017 11:28 am

LadyIJ wrote:I put $50,000 for the $500 bonus. It was represented to me as 90 days. Upon reading the fine print, it's 60 days after you meet the 90 day requirement, which makes it a lower interest rate.


jeff1949 wrote:The $50k has to stay in for 60 days (recently went past that) and then you have to wait "up to 90 days" for the bonus. So you need to keep the $50k in there to prevent the monthly service charge for another 90 days possibly.


So if I'm understanding this correctly, you have to keep $50k in there for 5 months. So the rate is a tad above 2%. My credit union gives 2.01% on up to $25k (can have multiple accounts). There is no minimum number of monthly debit card transactions required or minimum number of log ins to earn the rate. I just have it set to auto-charge my insurance bill to the debit card associated with the account to meet the minimum spending requirement of $300 per month. A monthly transfer from Ally Bank into the account (also done automatically) meets the direct deposit requirement. Everything is set on auto and the 2% rate is ongoing. There is no hassle involved at all to basically get the same rate as Citi.

I do the Chase offers, though, as their rate is much higher. You can get $300 for keeping $1500 in the account (minimum to avoid fees). The account has to be open for 6 months in order to not have the bonus rescinded. That's a 40% rate, compared to the 2% rate offered by Citi. Based on the accounts on this thread, Citi will let you have that 2% if you're willing to go to battle in order to yank it out of their clutches. Better offers are out there than 2% you may or may not get - which will be taxable if you are lucky enough to get it.

LadyIJ
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Re: Beware Citibank Bonus Promotion

Post by LadyIJ » Sun May 14, 2017 7:14 am

Ron Ronnerson wrote:
LadyIJ wrote:I put $50,000 for the $500 bonus. It was represented to me as 90 days. Upon reading the fine print, it's 60 days after you meet the 90 day requirement, which makes it a lower interest rate.


jeff1949 wrote:The $50k has to stay in for 60 days (recently went past that) and then you have to wait "up to 90 days" for the bonus. So you need to keep the $50k in there to prevent the monthly service charge for another 90 days possibly.


So if I'm understanding this correctly, you have to keep $50k in there for 5 months. So the rate is a tad above 2%. My credit union gives 2.01% on up to $25k (can have multiple accounts). There is no minimum number of monthly debit card transactions required or minimum number of log ins to earn the rate. I just have it set to auto-charge my insurance bill to the debit card associated with the account to meet the minimum spending requirement of $300 per month. A monthly transfer from Ally Bank into the account (also done automatically) meets the direct deposit requirement. Everything is set on auto and the 2% rate is ongoing. There is no hassle involved at all to basically get the same rate as Citi.

I do the Chase offers, though, as their rate is much higher. You can get $300 for keeping $1500 in the account (minimum to avoid fees). The account has to be open for 6 months in order to not have the bonus rescinded. That's a 40% rate, compared to the 2% rate offered by Citi. Based on the accounts on this thread, Citi will let you have that 2% if you're willing to go to battle in order to yank it out of their clutches. Better offers are out there than 2% you may or may not get - which will be taxable if you are lucky enough to get it.


Yes, that's the real offer and it makes the rate "meh"; however I got the money from them in the 90 day time frame because I kicked up a big fuss with the threats, but I would be very wary going forward - especially with Citi. I'll do Chase next. No muss, no fuss.

heybro
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Re: Beware Citibank Bonus Promotion

Post by heybro » Tue May 16, 2017 4:37 am

I'll pay ya $500 to endure aggravation for 6 months.

Not worth it!

schachtw
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Re: Beware Citibank Bonus Promotion

Post by schachtw » Tue May 16, 2017 6:30 am

I'm a Citibank customer, and got suckered into one of their promotions last May. It was advertised as their 10X program, 10 times the normal interest being offered. As previously discussed, the money had to remain on deposit for at least 90 days.

I deposited 200K, thinking that in 90 days I would be credited with approximately $500.00.

90 days passes, with no credit to the account. As others have mentioned, the credit isn't applied for another 90 days. Which I found out after the fact.

6 months from the of the initial deposit still nothing. I spoke with the branch manager, and the bank opened an investigation. I finally got $400.00 out of the promo. I inquired as to why the amount was so little, and they stated that was the maximum allowable.

Suffice it to say, no more CB promos for me. I promptly moved the money to an online bank.

nolapepper
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Re: Beware Citibank Bonus Promotion

Post by nolapepper » Thu Jun 15, 2017 3:31 pm

I did the $50K deposit in March. Just got off the phone with them and I was told that it takes up to 90 days from the day the requirement was met (May 14) to get my $500 bonus. Or, I pay $30 service fee per month for the package until I get my bonus. The rep says she put me on the priority list for the cash bonus. Not sure if I should get my money out of there.

Chase gives you the bonus the day your requirement meets automatically. I guess I will not get citi's banking promotion again.

kaneohe
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Re: Beware Citibank Bonus Promotion

Post by kaneohe » Thu Jun 15, 2017 4:43 pm

Coinsinthefountain wrote:I signed up for the $400 bonus on $15,000 and left the money there for the required time. When I went to have $15,400 transferred to my home bank account Citi would only let me do it in $2,000 increments. Five days ago, I phone customer service and was told I could have a check for the full amount mailed to me but that it would take maybe up to two weeks before I received it. I decided to go that route. I got another offer in the mail from Citi recently to earn $200 on $25,000 if I leave the money there three months. I probably won't do it as there's a $30 monthly service fee for accounts under $50,000. That eats into your earnings and I don't like the way it's hidden in the fine print.
Wasn't this for a checking account? Couldn't you have written a check to yourself and deposited it elsewhere?

SlowMovingInvestor
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Re: Beware Citibank Bonus Promotion

Post by SlowMovingInvestor » Fri Jun 16, 2017 4:44 am

I'm in the same situation -- signed up over 3 months back ($500 bonus). I sent Citi a message and they responded with a rather incoherent message saying that I had fulfilled the eligibility requirements. The message then had a garbled paragraph (in bad English) saying that their promotion team would review it and if I was eligible and fulfilled the required activities then the cash bonus would be credited within 90 calendar days from the date when I completed all offer requirements. It also mentioned the date the requirements were completed (mid May), and rather idiotically said 90 days from that date would be sometime in mid October.

Even assuming the CSR really meant mid August, a 90 day wait for bonus is ridiculous.I can see 'next statement cycle', but 90 days ?

simmias
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Re: Beware Citibank Bonus Promotion

Post by simmias » Fri Jun 16, 2017 5:01 am

kaneohe wrote:
Coinsinthefountain wrote:I signed up for the $400 bonus on $15,000 and left the money there for the required time. When I went to have $15,400 transferred to my home bank account Citi would only let me do it in $2,000 increments. Five days ago, I phone customer service and was told I could have a check for the full amount mailed to me but that it would take maybe up to two weeks before I received it. I decided to go that route. I got another offer in the mail from Citi recently to earn $200 on $25,000 if I leave the money there three months. I probably won't do it as there's a $30 monthly service fee for accounts under $50,000. That eats into your earnings and I don't like the way it's hidden in the fine print.
Wasn't this for a checking account? Couldn't you have written a check to yourself and deposited it elsewhere?
I was thinking the same thing. I never initiate the ACH from these banks. They always have fees or stupid limits. Write a check, or use an intermediary like Ally to initiate the pull.

kaneohe
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Re: Beware Citibank Bonus Promotion

Post by kaneohe » Fri Jun 16, 2017 8:46 am

Just to add another data point and some balance.......I signed up for the 15K $400 bonus from Citi and bonus was in the account a week or 2 before I expected it .........no poking or prodding required.

Now I'm wondering about a similar offer from HSBC who seems to get even worse ratings for their local operations......not necessarily their bonus.

munemaker
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Re: Beware Citibank Bonus Promotion

Post by munemaker » Fri Jun 16, 2017 9:35 am

LadyIJ wrote:I put $50,000 for the $500 bonus. It was represented to me as 90 days. Upon reading the fine print, it's 60 days after you meet the 90 day requirement, which makes it a lower interest rate. Then I was told when I called the 800 number that I was disqualified because I did not sign up for paperless - which is not true, I told the banker I wanted paperless and indeed never received anything in the mail until this week (90 days up). I plan to Consumer Financial Protection Bureau if the girl that signed me up doesn't make it right in the next couple of weeks. They also did this to my brother. Wanted to spread the word . . .
I did this same bonus last year. Signed up online. It all went smoothly and I received the bonus in accordance with the offer.

The devil in these offers is in the details. If you are going to do bank account bonuses, it is a good idea to review with the doctor first. www.doctorofcredit.com There are a lot of tips there and others share their experiences.

ponyboy
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Re: Beware Citibank Bonus Promotion

Post by ponyboy » Fri Jun 16, 2017 9:41 am

I received my $500 bonus. Would I do it again...absolutely not. Easier ways to make money...like signing up for credit cards.

Citi was rough dealing with over the phone...never again. That account is closed!

SlowMovingInvestor
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Re: Beware Citibank Bonus Promotion

Post by SlowMovingInvestor » Fri Jun 16, 2017 3:24 pm

ponyboy wrote:I received my $500 bonus. Would I do it again...absolutely not. Easier ways to make money...like signing up for credit cards.

Citi was rough dealing with over the phone...never again. That account is closed!
How long did it take you in total from account opening ? And did you get the feeling that CIti would have delayed even more without your calling them ?

SlowMovingInvestor
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Re: Beware Citibank Bonus Promotion

Post by SlowMovingInvestor » Fri Jun 16, 2017 4:12 pm

kaneohe wrote: Now I'm wondering about a similar offer from HSBC who seems to get even worse ratings for their local operations......not necessarily their bonus.
Is this the HSBC bonus you're referring to ?

https://www.us.hsbc.com/1/2/home/personal-banking/share

The individual you referred will receive a $500 referral bonus to their new qualifying HSBC Premier checking account, a $250 referral bonus to their new qualifying HSBC Advance checking account, or a $50 referral bonus to their new qualifying HSBC Choice Checking account within 8 weeks from the date their new account is fully funded.

100K is required for the Premier $500 bonus (since it says the account has to be fully funded I assume you can't just get away with paying the $50/month fee without depositing anything), 10K for the Advance 250 bonus. Assume 2 months of interest. So that is around 3% for Premier (OK), 15% for the Advance account (excellent). But $250 is a small amount to go to a lot of hassle over.

kaneohe
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Re: Beware Citibank Bonus Promotion

Post by kaneohe » Fri Jun 16, 2017 5:52 pm

SlowMovingInvestor wrote:
kaneohe wrote: Now I'm wondering about a similar offer from HSBC who seems to get even worse ratings for their local operations......not necessarily their bonus.
Is this the HSBC bonus you're referring to ?

https://www.us.hsbc.com/1/2/home/personal-banking/share

The individual you referred will receive a $500 referral bonus to their new qualifying HSBC Premier checking account, a $250 referral bonus to their new qualifying HSBC Advance checking account, or a $50 referral bonus to their new qualifying HSBC Choice Checking account within 8 weeks from the date their new account is fully funded.

100K is required for the Premier $500 bonus (since it says the account has to be fully funded I assume you can't just get away with paying the $50/month fee without depositing anything), 10K for the Advance 250 bonus. Assume 2 months of interest. So that is around 3% for Premier (OK), 15% for the Advance account (excellent). But $250 is a small amount to go to a lot of hassle over.
It seems to be somewhat different......not a referral type deal; targeted by mail......$350 for 10K, 5 mos . Must be truckloads of scavengers showing up.......they said I would need an appointment and the bankers would not be available to take appointments until 4PM (when the bank closes).

LadyIJ
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Re: Beware Citibank Bonus Promotion

Post by LadyIJ » Sat Jun 17, 2017 7:06 am

heybro wrote:I'll pay ya $500 to endure aggravation for 6 months.

Not worth it!
ha ha - not aggravation for ONE month (the last one)!

LadyIJ
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Re: Beware Citibank Bonus Promotion

Post by LadyIJ » Sat Jun 17, 2017 7:14 am

To reiterate - once I called and threatened to file with the Consumer Fraud Protection Bureau, and had them open an "investigation" I DID get my money in a few weeks - so that was a few weeks after the initial couple of months - not bad, but I had to do that. I had to do the same threatening call for my brother's account (actually my MOM's) and then they received the money in a few more weeks (again after an "investigation"). So the threat is all important. Too bad, but all ended well. The problem is, once you are not working, it is difficult to find institutions that have these deals without automatic deposits (and I'm not collecting ss). I might do the Citi again when I qualify but use a more reliable banker in my neighborhood and read all the fine print, and be "on it" the day the offer is supposed to pay out.

madbrain
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Re: Beware Citibank Bonus Promotion

Post by madbrain » Sun Jun 18, 2017 5:07 am

LadyIJ wrote:
heybro wrote:I'll pay ya $500 to endure aggravation for 6 months.

Not worth it!
ha ha - not aggravation for ONE month (the last one)!
Just wait until you get your 1099 from Citi next year, that's when the real fun will begin !

My husband and myself got our checking bonus of $400 and $600 respectively. The 2016 1099s we received were all wrong.
Like $800 and $1000 wrong, respectively, and with the wrong name/gender. They still haven't gotten them right, but at least now the amount is less than what we received. I have given up hope that they can fix them correctly. I went to the branch manager 3 times, and made many phone calls.
The employee who had signed us for the accounts left the branch. Our checking accounts are both closed, at this point.

EricBackus
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Re: Beware Citibank Bonus Promotion

Post by EricBackus » Sun Jun 18, 2017 5:44 am

LadyIJ wrote:I put $50,000 for the $500 bonus. It was represented to me as 90 days. Upon reading the fine print, it's 60 days after you meet the 90 day requirement, which makes it a lower interest rate.
I did one of these last year. I did get the money eventually, but it required a couple calls to Citibank before it showed up. Also note that (unlike credit card bonuses) you'll pay income taxes on the bonus. My conclusion in the end was that it was slightly too much hassle for the money, and I wouldn't do it again.

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vinvedi
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Re: Beware Citibank Bonus Promotion

Post by vinvedi » Sun Jun 18, 2017 1:53 pm

Another 'thumbs-up' for Chase. Just did $600 bonus (new checking with direct deposit + 15 K saving 90 days). The entire process went well.

LadyIJ
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Re: Beware Citibank Bonus Promotion

Post by LadyIJ » Tue Jul 18, 2017 7:52 pm

madbrain wrote:
LadyIJ wrote:
heybro wrote:I'll pay ya $500 to endure aggravation for 6 months.

Not worth it!
ha ha - not aggravation for ONE month (the last one)!
Just wait until you get your 1099 from Citi next year, that's when the real fun will begin !

My husband and myself got our checking bonus of $400 and $600 respectively. The 2016 1099s we received were all wrong.
Like $800 and $1000 wrong, respectively, and with the wrong name/gender. They still haven't gotten them right, but at least now the amount is less than what we received. I have given up hope that they can fix them correctly. I went to the branch manager 3 times, and made many phone calls.
The employee who had signed us for the accounts left the branch. Our checking accounts are both closed, at this point.
thanks for the heads up - I'll be on the look out for errors!

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