Has anyone actually used gold or silver coins for a purchase?

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Tamahome
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Has anyone actually used gold or silver coins for a purchase?

Post by Tamahome »

I often hear about people buying gold or silver coins with the idea of using them for a purchase or trade if everything goes to heck. In another post, someone said that silver coins had done well for him/her, but it made me think. If you did not sell the coins, they can still drop in value. If they were useful at some point, however, I would be interested to hear it.

I do not plan on investing in gold or silver coins as a part of my portfolio, but I would be interested in having a few eventually as an insurance policy of sorts. If something happened and currency was needed in a disaster scenario, how useful would they be? A gentleman wrote a book about the collapse in Argentina, and he indicated that gold or silver coins were useful in that situation.

Essentially, before buying a few coins along the way as insurance, I want to be sure that the coins would be useful. If no bad event happens (hopefully), would they be usable in an every-day trade/purchase situation?
I'm not a financial professional. Post is info only & not legal advice. No attorney-client relationship exists with reader. Scrutinize my ideas as if you spoke with a guy at a bar. I may be wrong.
gvsucavie03
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Re: Has anyone actually used gold or silver coins for a purchase?

Post by gvsucavie03 »

Dulocracy wrote: A gentleman wrote a book about the collapse in Argentina, and he indicated that gold or silver coins were useful in that situation.
I would love to know the name and author of this book as it would be the only example of a failed economy using gold as a means of exchange since the fall of the Roman Empire.

I would also never invest in gold or silver - I think you are on with this statement, but not as much when you said it is insurance. If you need insurance, get a liability umbrella policy, auto, home, life, etc. Gold would, IMO, be terrible investment "insurance."
sawhorse
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Re: Has anyone actually used gold or silver coins for a purchase?

Post by sawhorse »

I don't know if this counts as a purchase. When the government in my mother's country collapsed, gold was used for bribery.

Gold was the main form of payment during the Vietnam War for Vietnamese looking to get on a boat out of the country.

People who hold gold for doomsday scenarios don't necessarily plan to use it to purchase things. Rather, when the situation settles and they are in a new financial system, either in their own country or in a country they've fled to, they can exchange gold for that new currency.
Swampy
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Re: Has anyone actually used gold or silver coins for a purchase?

Post by Swampy »

When I was a kid it was commonplace to use a silver dime or quarter.

In retrospect I wish I had used paper singles and got silver quarters back. Then again, a buck was something to behold!

Who knew?
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fidobogo
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Re: Has anyone actually used gold or silver coins for a purchase?

Post by fidobogo »

If outside the US, *maybe*. In that case, in event of a currency collapse and general mayhem, I'd rather have wealth stashed in a safe other country to which to move. (If I wanted to be dramatic, a Rolex or gold ring to pay a private pilot to seaplane me out of there. Though I bet s/he also accepts US dollars.)

Since I live in the US, I'm not worried about a currency collapse. I've decided that gold and silver are more trouble than they're worth: more likely to lose you money, or to invite emergencies, than they are to be of any benefit in an emergency.

Instead, I live somewhere economically healthy that would be near the top of the list for federal aid in a disaster, and I try to gain enough wealth to be sustainably comfortable in this area. To get my family by in event of natural disaster, until aid arrives, I have a few things like bottled water, picnic supplies, and paper emergency cash at home.
sawhorse
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Re: Has anyone actually used gold or silver coins for a purchase?

Post by sawhorse »

gvsucavie03 wrote:
Dulocracy wrote: A gentleman wrote a book about the collapse in Argentina, and he indicated that gold or silver coins were useful in that situation.
I would love to know the name and author of this book as it would be the only example of a failed economy using gold as a means of exchange since the fall of the Roman Empire.
Zimbabwe in 2009.
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2009/f ... ecret-film

The use of gold to escape Vietnam is very well documented. A simple Google search came up with dozens of examples in newspaper articles and books. Here are some links from credible journalism sources. Some of them are old archived articles.

http://articles.chicagotribune.com/1985 ... th-vietnam
http://articles.latimes.com/1988-03-06/ ... ietnam-war
http://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2015/ ... and-rescue
http://www.nytimes.com/1986/07/11/world ... we-do.html
http://articles.chicagotribune.com/1993 ... e-new-year
http://www.dallasnews.com/news/metro/20 ... f-many.ece
http://articles.philly.com/1995-06-25/n ... le-vietnam
mevertsen
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Re: Has anyone actually used gold or silver coins for a purchase?

Post by mevertsen »

I paid to have a special necklace made out of a mountain lion claw and turquoise. I used silver to pay. This was at a rural trading post/ old style jewelry shop.

I wouldn't call it a purchase per se, more of a barter, but I know that still happens quite frequently in smaller shops like that.

I have made private barter trades with silver as well.

I am thinking about picking up a little since the price is down again.
Gropes & Ray
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Re: Has anyone actually used gold or silver coins for a purchase?

Post by Gropes & Ray »

I definitely see precious metals being a viable currency if the US dollar tanked but the rest of the world was still in pretty decent working order. I am somewhat skeptical that the US dollar could tank that much and have the rest of the world still be in decent working order, but I guess it's possible.
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Blueskies123
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Re: Has anyone actually used gold or silver coins for a purchase?

Post by Blueskies123 »

gvsucavie03 wrote:
Dulocracy wrote: A gentleman wrote a book about the collapse in Argentina, and he indicated that gold or silver coins were useful in that situation.
I would love to know the name and author of this book as it would be the only example of a failed economy using gold as a means of exchange since the fall of the Roman Empire.



Here is his website http://www.themodernsurvivalist.com/

The site shows a link to his book, it actually is fairly good book if you are interested in what was the closest thing we have had to a large scale (non-war) collapse in modern times. By the way he is not a big advocate of gold and points out many of its weaknesses in a disaster.
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Angst
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Re: Has anyone actually used gold or silver coins for a purchase?

Post by Angst »

Swampy wrote:When I was a kid it was commonplace to use a silver dime or quarter.
I'd find a Mercury dime or Buffalo Head nickel every now then too. Sure was fun as a kid.

I wonder what's fun for them these days... Pre-presidential quarters? The earlier Jefferson nickels? Wheatstraw pennies still? But there's nothing like the appearance and the patina of a worn silver coin, at least it seems to me.
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stratton
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Re: Has anyone actually used gold or silver coins for a purchase?

Post by stratton »

Yes, pre-1964 in the US for silver coins. :-)

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bberris
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Re: Has anyone actually used gold or silver coins for a purchase?

Post by bberris »

Swampy wrote:When I was a kid it was commonplace to use a silver dime or quarter.

In retrospect I wish I had used paper singles and got silver quarters back. Then again, a buck was something to behold!

Who knew?
I don't think this is what OP is referring to. Back then the value of a dime was more than the silver it contained. So it was just like a 1/10 dollar bill, printed on metal instead of paper. When the value of silver increased to make a dime worth more than a dime, it stopped being used as money. It ceased to be money. So the OP wants to use his silver dime to buy say a dollar's worth of goods, or whatever the silver in a dime is worth today.
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unclescrooge
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Re: Has anyone actually used gold or silver coins for a purchase?

Post by unclescrooge »

I like to think of gold as an insurance against fiscal/financial catastrophe.

We came close to a complete collapse of the financial system in 2008. If that had happened, everyone would be accepting gold/silver coins. And probably cigarettes/toilet paper/alcohol too!

And like all insurance products, you shouldn't look at it as an investment. Just something to have handy when you need to get the heck out of Dodge.

So holding several ounces in small coins should suffice. Or you could allocate a tiny portion of your portfolio to a gold ETF. I have a small allocation to commodities, and part of the that is gold ETF.
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Re: Has anyone actually used gold or silver coins for a purchase?

Post by LadyGeek »

This thread is now in the Personal Consumer Issues forum (coins).

Please stay focused on the coin aspect, not economic policy.
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John3754
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Re: Has anyone actually used gold or silver coins for a purchase?

Post by John3754 »

I've seen it claimed many times that gold is currency. Here's my problem...

Can I walk into a supermarket and pay for groceries with gold bullion?
Can I go to a gas station and pay for a tank of gas with gold bullion?
Can I eat at a restaurant and pay for the meal with gold bullion?
Can I go to a car dealership and pay for a car with gold bullion?
Can I pay my mortgage with gold bullion?

Can I do any of these things without first selling my gold bullion for US dollars?

Is gold currency?
LoveMyDog
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Re: Has anyone actually used gold or silver coins for a purchase?

Post by LoveMyDog »

Image

It's a $50 coin essentially...

I don't see why you can't get $50 worth of groceries at a supermarket with an 1oz gold coin... 8-)
Last edited by LoveMyDog on Wed Aug 26, 2015 9:20 pm, edited 1 time in total.
John3754
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Re: Has anyone actually used gold or silver coins for a purchase?

Post by John3754 »

LoveMyDog wrote:Image

It's a $50 coin essentially...
That will cost you over $1,000 to purchase...
LoveMyDog
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Re: Has anyone actually used gold or silver coins for a purchase?

Post by LoveMyDog »

John3754 wrote:
LoveMyDog wrote:Image

It's a $50 coin essentially...
That will cost you over $1,000 to purchase...
I was trying to answer your question, whether it is a currency or not...
On the other hand, you get 181 pennies out of a pound of copper, which is worth $2.xx/lb right now.
gvsucavie03
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Re: Has anyone actually used gold or silver coins for a purchase?

Post by gvsucavie03 »

Hmm... I search Bogle, I search Ferri, I search Larimore, etc., etc.,

Not one recommendation for gold...

I search other, perhaps wiser, Bogleheads.... seem to turn the other cheek.

Hmm... I guess I'm glad I don't live in Argentina.
SimonJester
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Re: Has anyone actually used gold or silver coins for a purchase?

Post by SimonJester »

I do not see anyone in Walking Dead using gold. I do however see them using another precious metal PB (Lead).

I believe lead will be the most valuable metal should we ever get to a point where the us dollar is no longer the currency.

Also in 2008 we were no where near financial collapse. In 1930s people were boiling their leather shoes to drink the liquid as they had nothing else to eat. We were nowhere near that in 2008...
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texascat1
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Re: Has anyone actually used gold or silver coins for a purchase?

Post by texascat1 »

Yes. I have bought jewelry and more coins with coins before. I bought the jewelry with a random mix of silver dimes and I think a half dollar? I bought Walking Liberties(old silver half dollars) with buffalo nickles(no silver) and some terrible silver dimes(had holes). I tend to just upgrade my precious metals to something better to wear or something more "collector" grade. My father and I both have nice silver coin collections. He also has a few rolls of silver dimes as insurance. They are not good money in a collapsed anarchy but they are good at pawn shops and trade stores. You can trade silver coins for bullets today.
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Re: Has anyone actually used gold or silver coins for a purchase?

Post by Dimitri »

An interesting blog post (circa 2011) about an Oregon gas station that was selling as for $0.20 / gallon - if paid for in silver coinage (i.e. 1964 and before).

Link to blog post - http://www.blog.providentmetals.com/pro ... ayment.htm

I would be willing to wager good money that a person could walk into pretty much any pawn shop and buy something they have on offer with silver and/or gold without any problem.
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Re: Has anyone actually used gold or silver coins for a purchase?

Post by Dimitri »

John3754 wrote:I've seen it claimed many times that gold is currency. Here's my problem...

Can I walk into a supermarket and pay for groceries with gold bullion?
Can I go to a gas station and pay for a tank of gas with gold bullion?
Can I eat at a restaurant and pay for the meal with gold bullion?
Can I go to a car dealership and pay for a car with gold bullion?
Can I pay my mortgage with gold bullion?

Can I do any of these things without first selling my gold bullion for US dollars?

Is gold currency?
One of my late friends (may he rest in peace) used to own one of the local Nissan dealerships out here. I remember him telling a story about a gentlemen wanted to buy a new Z --- with chips from Caesars Palace. They called the cage, verified that the chips were good (casinos know who has their chocolate chips), and sold him the car. I can't ask him but I would be willing to wager good money that he would have taken gold just as quickly as long as he was satisfied that it was real. All gold may not be currency (US bullion coins are) but all gold is money.
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John3754
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Re: Has anyone actually used gold or silver coins for a purchase?

Post by John3754 »

Dimitri wrote:
John3754 wrote:I've seen it claimed many times that gold is currency. Here's my problem...

Can I walk into a supermarket and pay for groceries with gold bullion?
Can I go to a gas station and pay for a tank of gas with gold bullion?
Can I eat at a restaurant and pay for the meal with gold bullion?
Can I go to a car dealership and pay for a car with gold bullion?
Can I pay my mortgage with gold bullion?

Can I do any of these things without first selling my gold bullion for US dollars?

Is gold currency?
One of my late friends (may he rest in peace) used to own one of the local Nissan dealerships out here. I remember him telling a story about a gentlemen wanted to buy a new Z --- with chips from Caesars Palace. They called the cage, verified that the chips were good (casinos know who has their chocolate chips), and sold him the car. I can't ask him but I would be willing to wager good money that he would have taken gold just as quickly as long as he was satisfied that it was real. All gold may not be currency (US bullion coins are) but all gold is money.
I knew people would point out the nominal face value of U.S. bullion coins and come up with anecdotes about people bartering for things with gold. However, the fact remains that I can't walk into my local shoprite and pay for a cart full of groceries with gold nuggets, and I can't pay for clothes at a department store with a gold chain. If that's currency, it's not a very good one.
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Re: Has anyone actually used gold or silver coins for a purchase?

Post by Spirit Rider »

I would question the practical aspects of trying to use gold or silver coins to make purchases in such severe circumstances. Only an infinitesimal percentage of the average population would have the ability to make purchases in such a manner. It could be very likely that information could leak out that you have such means available. I think this would bring unwanted attention and could represent significant danger to you and your family.
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Re: Has anyone actually used gold or silver coins for a purchase?

Post by HurdyGurdy »

A relative lives in Venezuela. I asked him if people would use gold coins for trade. He said that while some people could use small pieces of jewelry for that, it would not be safe to be seen with coins. Such person would be targeted for home invasion and kidnapping. (These are middle and working class Venezuelans. No idea about what is done by people with more muscle. They seem to like watches: http://www.relojesdelchavismo.blogspot.com/)
LoveMyDog
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Re: Has anyone actually used gold or silver coins for a purchase?

Post by LoveMyDog »

John3754 wrote:I knew people would point out the nominal face value of U.S. bullion coins and come up with anecdotes about people bartering for things with gold. However, the fact remains that I can't walk into my local shoprite and pay for a cart full of groceries with gold nuggets, and I can't pay for clothes at a department store with a gold chain. If that's currency, it's not a very good one.
I think you forgot about the reason why we have currencies. Someone, be it the government or the bank, guarantees the value of my piece of paper, or in this case, gold coin. It is the legal form of transaction. You don't bring a stack of US cash overseas and expect stores to accept them at the current going rate, do you?

To accept gold, store owners have to have certain knowledge of precious metal. 24k vs 14k, weight, current price, fake or not... Why would anyone want to go through all these troubles?
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Re: Has anyone actually used gold or silver coins for a purchase?

Post by Grt2bOutdoors »

LoveMyDog wrote:Image

It's a $50 coin essentially...

I don't see why you can't get $50 worth of groceries at a supermarket with an 1oz gold coin... 8-)
I have some goods to sell you. :wink: :moneybag :greedy :moneybag
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Re: Has anyone actually used gold or silver coins for a purchase?

Post by Grt2bOutdoors »

LoveMyDog wrote:
I was trying to answer your question, whether it is a currency or not...
On the other hand, you get 181 pennies out of a pound of copper, which is worth $2.xx/lb right now.
Problem is pennies today are copper-clad zinc, you'd have to go back to pre 1982 for real copper pennies. I'm especially fond of the old "wheat" pennies.
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Dimitri
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Re: Has anyone actually used gold or silver coins for a purchase?

Post by Dimitri »

John3754 wrote:
Dimitri wrote:
John3754 wrote:I've seen it claimed many times that gold is currency. Here's my problem...

Can I walk into a supermarket and pay for groceries with gold bullion?
Can I go to a gas station and pay for a tank of gas with gold bullion?
Can I eat at a restaurant and pay for the meal with gold bullion?
Can I go to a car dealership and pay for a car with gold bullion?
Can I pay my mortgage with gold bullion?

Can I do any of these things without first selling my gold bullion for US dollars?

Is gold currency?
One of my late friends (may he rest in peace) used to own one of the local Nissan dealerships out here. I remember him telling a story about a gentlemen wanted to buy a new Z --- with chips from Caesars Palace. They called the cage, verified that the chips were good (casinos know who has their chocolate chips), and sold him the car. I can't ask him but I would be willing to wager good money that he would have taken gold just as quickly as long as he was satisfied that it was real. All gold may not be currency (US bullion coins are) but all gold is money.
I knew people would point out the nominal face value of U.S. bullion coins and come up with anecdotes about people bartering for things with gold. However, the fact remains that I can't walk into my local shoprite and pay for a cart full of groceries with gold nuggets, and I can't pay for clothes at a department store with a gold chain. If that's currency, it's not a very good one.
If I can't walk into my local shoprite and pay for it with X then X isn't currency.
I can't walk into my local shoprite and pay with Euros.
Euros aren't currency.

Just because you can't use it at your local shoprite doesn't mean it isn't currency.
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Guest9876
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Re: Has anyone actually used gold or silver coins for a purchase?

Post by Guest9876 »

In a failed economy with civil unrest it's not as if gold and silver have stable values. It's more like the person who can get you out will "gouge" you for whatever you have. Every single commodity or currency stores value only based on future expectations of societal continuity / repeat interactions.

I don't buy gold and silver because I believe their value is too unpredictable and tied to marketing campaigns, social movements, and massive reserves held by huge investors that I have no control over. It's like the diamond market on steroids. At least with diamonds there are only a few players with an interest in keeping long-term profits up. With gold--- a country could unload at any time, or initiate a huge buy-up. It's just too volatile for me.
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Re: Has anyone actually used gold or silver coins for a purchase?

Post by Dimitri »

Guest9876 wrote:In a failed economy with civil unrest it's not as if gold and silver have stable values. It's more like the person who can get you out will "gouge" you for whatever you have. Every single commodity or currency stores value only based on future expectations of societal continuity / repeat interactions.

I don't buy gold and silver because I believe their value is too unpredictable and tied to marketing campaigns, social movements, and massive reserves held by huge investors that I have no control over. It's like the diamond market on steroids. At least with diamonds there are only a few players with an interest in keeping long-term profits up. With gold--- a country could unload at any time, or initiate a huge buy-up. It's just too volatile for me.
It didn't necessarily get much attention this week with all the activity in the stock markets but there was a major price cut on diamonds.

De Beers, the world's largest producer of rough diamonds by value, reduced prices for its diamonds by as much as 9 percent, Bloomberg reported, citing people familiar with the matter. ... Russian diamond miner Alrosa, the world's largest miner of rough diamonds by carats produced, said in June it lowered diamond prices by 6 percent since the start of the year.
Read the full article at http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/08/ ... VL20150824
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Guest9876
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Re: Has anyone actually used gold or silver coins for a purchase?

Post by Guest9876 »

Ha! Well, I don't buy diamonds as an investment either.

When a monopolist decreases prices, it's a marketing strategy designed to bulk up demand---- after the global crash sales went way down and I imagine deBeers sees an opportunity to reignite demand.

But the long-term goal of the company is to maximize profits, so if I owned diamonds as an investment I would lose on the individual sale, but deBeers' strategy would benefit me potentially by making my diamonds more liquid--- more sellers available and greater perception of resale potential.
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Re: Has anyone actually used gold or silver coins for a purchase?

Post by goodlifer »

I read FerFAL's book, too. It was a long time ago and I don't remember a lot of it.

I worked in a gas station for several years. It wasn't an every day occurrence, but people often would trade their silver coins for gas just to get to work. My father would be happy to do it. No, he wasn't the owner. He would pay for the gas with his cash so it was more of a trade, but I did see the owner sell gas for PM more than once. Gold was not seen a lot and they would want more than a tank of gas for their jewelry, so it wasn't traded as often. I'm willing to bet that if you talked to a store manager and he/she was a collector (or prepper), they would trade groceries for PM. You probably wouldn't get a fair trade, though. I used to be pretty active on Craigslist trading PM for items or vice versa. A lot of people do it now. Practically anything you see in the barter section of CL can be bought with silver or gold. Some even trade for copper now, but I don't understand why. I know that pennies are not made of it anymore but I still do not see the attraction to copper. I have a raccoon-like attraction to shiny gold and silver, though!
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Re: Has anyone actually used gold or silver coins for a purchase?

Post by Abe »

I got this from a Forbes article titled: Solving A Serious Mystery: Why Don't Gold And Silver Coins Circulate?

"Suppose a restaurant wants to be paid in silver and you agree to buy a steak dinner with an Eagle. The IRS treats this trade as a sale of the silver at the current market price. You must pay tax based on the gain in the silver price from when you bought it."

http://www.forbes.com/sites/realspin/20 ... circulate/
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Re: Has anyone actually used gold or silver coins for a purchase?

Post by Faith20879 »

I've heard secondhand stories from co-workers and friends who used gold to buy a seat on the last boat or plane leaving town when their motherland totally collapsed.

The only firsthand story I know was told by my mother. In the 1930s, when Japanese invaded China, my mother at the tender age of 16, had to be set loose by my grandma to go into hiding because their home village had become too dangerous. Grandma sewed two small pieces of gold into my mother's shirt hem. My mother traveled over thousand miles on foot to safety on the food she traded the gold for along the way. I am guessing the peasant farmers must’ve been using gold as their currency at the time.

Everything I heard about gold having purchasing power were all related to a collapsing society. That is not a good relation. I am hoping I don't have to face it during my lifetime.
Riverstwo
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Re: Has anyone actually used gold or silver coins for a purchase?

Post by Riverstwo »

I purchase pre-1964 silver. I've lost 1/2 of my investment doing so. But I keep it hidden in a safe place for a time when we may go to war or get trounced upon by another means and everything is gone and my fishing rod is broken. I may be able to buy some food with it. I love to eat.
psteinx
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Re: Has anyone actually used gold or silver coins for a purchase?

Post by psteinx »

As Faith20879's story in particular alludes to, the value of gold and silver is not when society is in good order, but rather the opposite.

I can take my little green pieces of paper/cloth to the local grocery store and trade them for food, or to the gas station for gas, because of the good order of the US society, and the confidence of those I'm using them with that they, in turn, can use them for their own purposes.

The scenario where gold and silver have currency-like insurance value is one where society is near collapse or has collapsed, or, where the government has so abused it's ability to issue paper money that the local currency has become essentially worthless.

For examples of the former (collapsing society) - look at those countries that have suffered devastating wars in the last century (external or internal) - Russia, Germany, China, Vietnam, etc.

Examples of the latter (paper currency rendered nearly worthless by inflation/money printing), look at Germany, Zimbabwe, and a few others.

So such things could never happen in the USA? Well, one only has to go back another century, to the 1860s, to find that a large portion of our country (the Confederacy), suffered a devastating military loss combined with inflation and economic distress that basically destroyed the value of the local currency.

====

OK, so is it particularly likely that in the next 20-40 years the US will suffer massive economic disorder and/or military defeat on the scale of, say, what Germany went through in the first half of the 20th century? In my opinion, no, it's not very likely.

Am I sure that a cache of gold and/or silver would have greatly eased the pressure of someone living in one of the aforementioned scenarios? No. Many folks died or suffered, and gold was likely not absolute insurance against ill effects.

Anyways, OP asked for examples, and while my examples are at a macro level rather than a personal level, perhaps they will be useful.
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Re: Has anyone actually used gold or silver coins for a purchase?

Post by Stonebr »

Blueskies123 wrote:
gvsucavie03 wrote:
Dulocracy wrote: A gentleman wrote a book about the collapse in Argentina, and he indicated that gold or silver coins were useful in that situation.
I would love to know the name and author of this book as it would be the only example of a failed economy using gold as a means of exchange since the fall of the Roman Empire.



Here is his website http://www.themodernsurvivalist.com/

The site shows a link to his book, it actually is fairly good book if you are interested in what was the closest thing we have had to a large scale (non-war) collapse in modern times. By the way he is not a big advocate of gold and points out many of its weaknesses in a disaster.
I've read Ferfal's book and his blog. He actually says that gold coins were pretty useless for anything short of buying a house or car. Silver coins were common currency, and small bits of gold jewelry were useful for barter. The big gold coins were not something you'd want to carry around for buying groceries -- no way to make change, and with crime rampant gold just makes you a target.
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SmileyFace
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Re: Has anyone actually used gold or silver coins for a purchase?

Post by SmileyFace »

The US is hardly where Argentina ever was. I find it hard to believe you could walk into any grocery store and expect a common clerk to be able to price out gold and silver coins for you regardless of the state of the economny.
If we had some type of collapse I'd think there might be worse problems (like availability of items in stores, etc.).

Perhaps if this type of thing concerns you a better investment would be a survival shelter stocked with canned goods and bottled water :wink:
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Re: Has anyone actually used gold or silver coins for a purchase?

Post by Blueskies123 »

Exactly, if you have a $1000 gold coin and go to buy a loaf of bread do you really think you are going to get change back. Gold and silver will not be a currency in some kind of disaster scenario.
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Re: Has anyone actually used gold or silver coins for a purchase?

Post by sawhorse »

Blueskies123 wrote:Exactly, if you have a $1000 gold coin and go to buy a loaf of bread do you really think you are going to get change back. Gold and silver will not be a currency in some kind of disaster scenario.
Which is why it's absurd that people hold gold bars.

In the Zimbabwe video I linked to above, people were using shavings (can't think of a better word) of gold as currency to buy bread and food. In Vietnam, to escape you gave a few ounces to this person, a few ounces to the next person, then the next. You don't give everything to one person. You need small units.
DaftInvestor wrote:Perhaps if this type of thing concerns you a better investment would be a survival shelter stocked with canned goods and bottled water :wink:
In situations like Vietnam a few decades ago, staying put in a survival shelter was about the most dangerous thing you could do. You needed to get out. And you paid for escape using gold.

The chaos and turmoil in these circumstances cannot be overstated. It's beyond anything a lifelong American can conceive of. And it's probably not anything anyone currently living in the United States will ever have to experience, fortunately.
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Re: Has anyone actually used gold or silver coins for a purchase?

Post by sawhorse »

I did some research on this as it relates to the United States and was surprised.

A few years ago Utah passed a bill to allow gold and silver to be used as legal tender. http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/04/2 ... 40171.html

Oklahoma has since done the same. http://www.edmondsun.com/news/business/ ... 43df0.html

There are recent bills in Arizona and Texas about the issue.
http://ktar.com/story/96999/bill-making ... committee/

http://www.dallasnews.com/news/politics ... pieces.ece
TMCD75
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Re: Has anyone actually used gold or silver coins for a purchase?

Post by TMCD75 »

I stack gold\silver as an investment. Gold has been a tremendous investment the last fifteen or so years, quadrupling itself during this period of time. People say that gold and silver flatlined from 1980-2000, but those were totally different times.

It's easy to imagine an economy moving forward, where volatility plays a huge role in our portfolios/investments simply because we are a Global Economy. The economy we are investing in now days isn't anything like the economies of the later 20th century.

Here's how good gold really is. A couple found around 5-10 million in buried gold coins last year in their backyard in California. The gold was worth 27k when buried in the 1890s and was worth MILLIONS when found. Now take 27k in fiat money and bury it, then come back 100 years later and what's it worth? Enuff said. Gold not only appreciates but is clearly a nice long term investment/inflation hedge.
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Re: Has anyone actually used gold or silver coins for a purchase?

Post by needtosave »

LoveMyDog wrote: You don't bring a stack of US cash overseas and expect stores to accept them at the current going rate, do you?
Anecdotally, I knew a pilot for private jets and some of his clients traveled to some less developed countries. They kept stacks of US $100 bills in case they were forced to refuel or conduct repairs in some place that didn't take AmEx.
LoveMyDog
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Re: Has anyone actually used gold or silver coins for a purchase?

Post by LoveMyDog »

needtosave wrote:
LoveMyDog wrote: You don't bring a stack of US cash overseas and expect stores to accept them at the current going rate, do you?
Anecdotally, I knew a pilot for private jets and some of his clients traveled to some less developed countries. They kept stacks of US $100 bills in case they were forced to refuel or conduct repairs in some place that didn't take AmEx.
I didn't say you can't use Greenback overseas. If US$1 is worth X$10. If you pay with a US$10 there, what are the chances that you would receive exactly X$100 worth of goods?
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Re: Has anyone actually used gold or silver coins for a purchase?

Post by TradingPlaces »

I have lived through a doomsday scenario, and the most useful thing to have was US Dollars.

However, the rapid collapse of the economic system resulted in dramatic decline in quality of life.

Thus, having purchased resources and assets would have been better than having kept dollars.

Gold was not that useful because as medium of currency, gold is very hard to use. E.g., if you have a single mass of gold that is worth $3K, and 1 loaf of bread is 50 cents, and you are concerned with the basics, then how are you going to use that $3K worth of gold to buy bread? Surely, someone will "provide you with liquidity" by taking the gold from you at a discount, but what are they going to give you? Dollars!

Gold may be difficult to use, and even absolutely useless in doomsday scenarios.

But if you are really worried about a doomsday scenario, buy a large house on a large and isolated piece of land, somewhere in a state that begins with M, away from the coasts. You need a lot of resources: (a) water supply, (b) generators, (c) fuel to last several months, maybe years, (d) medicine, (e) canned food and ability to grow fresh food, (f) livestock, (h) guns and ammo, (i) cars.
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Re: Has anyone actually used gold or silver coins for a purchase?

Post by TradingPlaces »

There is 7-10 trillion dollars worth of gold sitting, collecting dust, and adding absolutely no value.

There is more gold than silver.

Both are absolutely useless, junk metals, tied to some sentimental and momentual values.
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Re: Has anyone actually used gold or silver coins for a purchase?

Post by kevinpet »

Dulocracy wrote:A gentleman wrote a book about the collapse in Argentina, and he indicated that gold or silver coins were useful in that situation.
I think the book is an expansion of this blog post (which may have started as a discussion forum comment) http://ferfal.blogspot.com/2008/10/thou ... -2005.html It's a fascinating read. The relevant section on gold and silver to me is this:
But where I live, in my local area small time dealers will only pay you the value of junk gold, no matter what kind of gold you have. So, I’d have to say that if TSHTF bad, gold jewelry is a better trade item than gold coins.
Pathologyguy
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Re: Has anyone actually used gold or silver coins for a purchase?

Post by Pathologyguy »

sawhorse wrote:
Blueskies123 wrote:Exactly, if you have a $1000 gold coin and go to buy a loaf of bread do you really think you are going to get change back. Gold and silver will not be a currency in some kind of disaster scenario.
Which is why it's absurd that people hold gold bars.

In the Zimbabwe video I linked to above, people were using shavings (can't think of a better word) of gold as currency to buy bread and food. In Vietnam, to escape you gave a few ounces to this person, a few ounces to the next person, then the next. You don't give everything to one person. You need small units.
DaftInvestor wrote:Perhaps if this type of thing concerns you a better investment would be a survival shelter stocked with canned goods and bottled water :wink:
In situations like Vietnam a few decades ago, staying put in a survival shelter was about the most dangerous thing you could do. You needed to get out. And you paid for escape using gold.

The chaos and turmoil in these circumstances cannot be overstated. It's beyond anything a lifelong American can conceive of. And it's probably not anything anyone currently living in the United States will ever have to experience, fortunately.
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