Vegan Raw Food Diet

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IPer
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Vegan Raw Food Diet

Post by IPer » Mon Nov 24, 2014 5:18 pm

I have eaten vegetarian for 14 years. I feel I am running into some road blocks and want to try raw vegan for 120 days
as recommended by some to see how things go. Anyone have any tips/pointers, thank you in advance!
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Mtn Hiker
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Re: Vegan Raw Food Diet

Post by Mtn Hiker » Mon Nov 24, 2014 7:05 pm

Hello IPer:
You may want to read "the Vegetarian Myth" by Lierre Keith. This may clear up some of the road blocks you have been experiencing. It helped me a great deal.
Good Luck

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Re: Vegan Raw Food Diet

Post by LadyGeek » Mon Nov 24, 2014 7:15 pm

FYI - The OP has arranged with the moderators to restart a previously locked thread, which was off-topic. The content has been revised; this thread is on-topic.
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Re: Vegan Raw Food Diet

Post by lululu » Mon Nov 24, 2014 7:35 pm

IPer wrote:I have eaten vegetarian for 14 years. I feel I am running into some road blocks and want to try raw vegan for 120 days
as recommended by some to see how things go. Anyone have any tips/pointers, thank you in advance!
Road blocks?

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Murray Boyd
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Re: Vegan Raw Food Diet

Post by Murray Boyd » Mon Nov 24, 2014 7:49 pm

The primatologist Richard Wrangham (who happens to a vegetarian as well) wrote a book called, "Catching Fire: How Cooking Made Us Human." He makes the case that humans have evolved to eat cooked food. Basically, we have soft teeth and don't digest raw food very well. He says that it's very difficult to get enough energy from raw food, even meat. Once when he was doing fieldwork he tried eating what chimps ate (I think it was chimps) for a while, and he basically had to eat all day and he still lost weight. If I remember correctly, Wrangham suspects moderns diets would be improved by eating a lot more raw food (since most people eat none), but that an all raw food diet is unsustainable.

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Raybo
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Re: Vegan Raw Food Diet

Post by Raybo » Mon Nov 24, 2014 7:56 pm

Can you be more specific about what "blocks" you are having? At my local library there are several books on eating a raw food diet.

One suggestion would be to get a food dehydrator.
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Re: Vegan Raw Food Diet

Post by IPer » Mon Nov 24, 2014 9:41 pm

Mtn Hiker wrote:Hello IPer:
You may want to read "the Vegetarian Myth" by Lierre Keith. This may clear up some of the road blocks you have been experiencing. It helped me a great deal.
Good Luck
Well right now I am not so concerned about belief systems which support a meat or non-meat diet, thank you. The arguments,
both ways, have been beaten with many sticks: https://www.indybay.org/uploads/2010/03 ... n_myth.pdf

I have really interested in tips to aid on my vegan raw path though I will entertain debate as a source of entertainment/inspiration!
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Re: Vegan Raw Food Diet

Post by IPer » Mon Nov 24, 2014 9:44 pm

lululu wrote:
IPer wrote:I have eaten vegetarian for 14 years. I feel I am running into some road blocks and want to try raw vegan for 120 days
as recommended by some to see how things go. Anyone have any tips/pointers, thank you in advance!
Road blocks?
Yeah, I won't go into too much detail yet as I want other inputs before jeopardizing the thread, I am very interested in the experience of the folk
on this board who I consider to be rational that have had experience with the post subject.
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Re: Vegan Raw Food Diet

Post by IPer » Mon Nov 24, 2014 9:45 pm

Murray Boyd wrote:The primatologist Richard Wrangham (who happens to a vegetarian as well) wrote a book called, "Catching Fire: How Cooking Made Us Human." He makes the case that humans have evolved to eat cooked food. Basically, we have soft teeth and don't digest raw food very well. He says that it's very difficult to get enough energy from raw food, even meat. Once when he was doing fieldwork he tried eating what chimps ate (I think it was chimps) for a while, and he basically had to eat all day and he still lost weight. If I remember correctly, Wrangham suspects moderns diets would be improved by eating a lot more raw food (since most people eat none), but that an all raw food diet is unsustainable.
Yeah, I heard about that, will let you all know if I ever get to this point! Meanwhile my blender and I will be cutting the rug so to speak!
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Re: Vegan Raw Food Diet

Post by IPer » Mon Nov 24, 2014 10:02 pm

Raybo wrote:Can you be more specific about what "blocks" you are having? At my local library there are several books on eating a raw food diet.

One suggestion would be to get a food dehydrator.
Not yet, I don't want to jeopardize this thread. If I wanted dried food I would stick it out in the sun or buy it dehydrated though I am not sure
where that angle is heading? I have not researched the potential benefits of dried food, though I do use a few: Green tea (great non-roasted caffeine source, please
no flames from the Starbucks people, I love Starbucks but I'm on vacation!), dried stevia leaves (reported to balance sugar, tastes very sweet, not good if overused),
herbs (mainly for taste, could never consume enough Oregano, for example, to get the health benefits), and now you have me thinking about these large packs of \
dried mushroom which I saw a very old lady on a taxi cuddling on her way back from market a few months ago.
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Re: Vegan Raw Food Diet

Post by Raybo » Mon Nov 24, 2014 10:28 pm

So, you can't tell us what issues you are having with your diet but you want us to suggest ideas for your diet. Do I have that right?

Can you answer this question:

What non-vegan foods do you currently eat?

Instead of butter on toast, I use ripe avocado. Instead of yogurt, I use a silken tofu mixture that I make that takes its place. Instead of cheese, I can use nutritional yeast, though it isn't really much of a substitute.
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Re: Vegan Raw Food Diet

Post by IPer » Mon Nov 24, 2014 10:57 pm

Raybo wrote:So, you can't tell us what issues you are having with your diet but you want us to suggest ideas for your diet. Do I have that right?
Not yet, I don't want to jeopardize this thread.

Can you answer this question:

What non-vegan foods do you currently eat?
Today is Day 4 of Raw Vegan. Before this I was eating some dairy, cheese and some milk with coffee as well as eggs occasionally. But my main
source of food has been the Thai Vegan restaurants here in Thailand, which I cannot control what they use. So I think if I cut out everything (all non-vegan)
and go raw for now it will force me to eat only my food which has been prepped by me and answer the raw question as I have never really
explored that.

Instead of butter on toast, I use ripe avocado. Instead of yogurt, I use a silken tofu mixture that I make that takes its place. Instead of cheese, I can use nutritional yeast, though it isn't really much of a substitute.
Yeah, good suggestions. I am not much of a foodie so some of the obvious things just wouldn't occur to me. I throw some stuff in the blender in the morning, nibble
on stuff when I feel hungry, and chop up some stuff and throw it in a bowl in the late afternoon and sometimes use cold pressed olive oil and raw apple cider vinegar with
a pinch of himalayin raw salt.
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Re: Vegan Raw Food Diet

Post by lululu » Tue Nov 25, 2014 1:09 am

Murray Boyd wrote:The primatologist Richard Wrangham (who happens to a vegetarian as well) wrote a book called, "Catching Fire: How Cooking Made Us Human." He makes the case that humans have evolved to eat cooked food. Basically, we have soft teeth and don't digest raw food very well.
This reminds me of being told years ago by a doctor that humans were not supposed to be vegetarians because our teeth were adapted to eating meat. Yet, here I am :D a vegetarian for about forty years, and not starving.

If our teeth were as soft as Wrangham thinks, I'd think they'd wear down over the years, like beavers'.

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Re: Vegan Raw Food Diet

Post by stemikger » Tue Nov 25, 2014 1:18 am

My wife has tried several types of diets over the years and none of them made her feel good and she was unable to lose weight which along with feeling better was one of her goals.

After watching a documentary which we saw on Amazon Prime called the Perfect Human Diet it really made us think. She did her research and found a diet called the Dukan diet and lost all of her weight and has never felt better. I must say she looks great. It's just something to think about before you go Raw. According to this documentary our bodies are not meat to eat raw foods.
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Re: Vegan Raw Food Diet

Post by IPer » Tue Nov 25, 2014 5:48 am

Yeah I heard one guy say if G-d had intended
for us to eat raw there would be no fire.
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UncleBen
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Re: Vegan Raw Food Diet

Post by UncleBen » Tue Nov 25, 2014 8:24 am

I am not vegan but usually do a raw vegan diet one month a year as a form of detox. You asked for tips so these would be my top 5:
1. Have a green smoothie everyday. If you can afford a Vitamix, get one it is worth it.
2. I use tons of websites, blogs, and cookbooks but my #1 source of consistently good recipes is "Oh She Glows". There are lots of recipes on the blog and she has an excellent cookbook.
3. This is a time consuming lifestyle. The best timesaver I have found is to make a week's worth of salads at a time and vacuum pack them in mason jars. You do not need an expensive Foodsaver. The little handheld one with the wide mouth jar attachment is ideal.
4. It's an expensive lifestyle, buy in bulk. Nuts and seeds can be vacuum packed. Greens, fruits, and veggies bought in bulk can be frozen for smoothies - no waste.
5. Make things from scratch such as almond milk or coconut milk. It is easy (especially if you have the Vitamix) and cheaper (especially if you buy in bulk).

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Re: Vegan Raw Food Diet

Post by IPer » Tue Nov 25, 2014 10:00 am

UncleBen wrote:I am not vegan but usually do a raw vegan diet one month a year as a form of detox. You asked for tips so these would be my top 5:
1. Have a green smoothie everyday. If you can afford a Vitamix, get one it is worth it.
2. I use tons of websites, blogs, and cookbooks but my #1 source of consistently good recipes is "Oh She Glows". There are lots of recipes on the blog and she has an excellent cookbook.
3. This is a time consuming lifestyle. The best timesaver I have found is to make a week's worth of salads at a time and vacuum pack them in mason jars. You do not need an expensive Foodsaver. The little handheld one with the wide mouth jar attachment is ideal.
4. It's an expensive lifestyle, buy in bulk. Nuts and seeds can be vacuum packed. Greens, fruits, and veggies bought in bulk can be frozen for smoothies - no waste.
5. Make things from scratch such as almond milk or coconut milk. It is easy (especially if you have the Vitamix) and cheaper (especially if you buy in bulk).
Good stuff, thanks much!
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Re: Vegan Raw Food Diet

Post by gatorking » Tue Nov 25, 2014 10:14 am

I would recommend adding sprouted beans to your diet. You could eat them raw or lightly steamed, if that is raw enough for you.
Most of all, I recommend being truthful to yourself about how you feel on any diet.
Good luck.

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Re: Vegan Raw Food Diet

Post by Chip Spoons » Tue Nov 25, 2014 11:06 am

If things aren't going well, I would recommend that you be careful.

1. People who are trying to lose weight (especially the last little bit of belly fat) and are eating well under maintenance can have low thyroid activity (a low carbohydrate diet even when eating well above maintenance will result in low T3, but that's different). If the thyroid is kind of the throttle, in a desire to lose weight people are throttling down their metabolism and they often run into road blocks. I've heard of people tracking their body temperature. Who knows?

2. Raw cruciferous vegetables contain gucosinolates, which impede iodine uptake. In an effort to be healthy, some people switch to sea salt, which is not iodised. Furthermore, some people don't like seafood, which is the principle source of dietary iodine (sea vegetables are very high in iodine too - dulse is a pretty tasty snack right out of the bag if people's palates aren't acclimated to processed food). Adequate iodine is critical for thyroid function.

3. Vegetarians/Vegans can rely on nuts. Unsprouted nuts have anti-nutrients.

4. Vegetarians/Vegans rely on soy. Soy has phytoestrogens.

5. What is stress? Not eating enough is stress. Running is stress. Lifting weights is stress. Not sleeping is stress. Poor diet is stress. Then all of the things people consider stressful (work, relationships, traffic) are stress. High stress raises cortisol.

What's great is there are doctors who can measure this stuff (cortisol, TSH, T3, T4, fT3, fT4, rT3).

[OT comments removed by admin LadyGeek]

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Re: Vegan Raw Food Diet

Post by lululu » Tue Nov 25, 2014 5:30 pm

Chip Spoons wrote:[OT comments removed by admin LadyGeek]
[Response to OT comments removed by admin LadyGeek]

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Re: Vegan Raw Food Diet

Post by IPer » Wed Nov 26, 2014 5:59 am

Uh oh, sorry I missed those comments, please pm me if they were any good.
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Re: Vegan Raw Food Diet

Post by LadyGeek » Wed Nov 26, 2014 2:08 pm

I removed one further reply (not by IPer). IPer, I sent you a PM.

Anyone can PM me directly and ask for clarification, please don't post in the thread. See: Forum Policy ("Member Rights in a Dispute", 2nd paragraph)
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Re: Vegan Raw Food Diet

Post by nibble » Thu Nov 27, 2014 3:48 pm

Hi IPer... I'd like to toss a few suggestions your way for raw cooking websites that we enjoy at my house. Just like lululu, I've been vegetarian for forty years, and am definitely a "foodie." I also agree with UncleBen and think that Oh She Glows is great. I am a vegan cook, and often migrate into raw cooking because it tastes so freakin' good!

YouTube is such a great resource... see if any of these choices of mine catch your interest:
-Ani Phyo (fantastic stuff)
-Dan MacDonald (easy recipes, including great raw tacos). See Insider's Club.
-OKraw (informative videos about raw)
-Jennifer Cornbleet
-Mimi Kirk (I don't particularly follow her, but she's been around for a long time, and is very good)

Most of all, have fun with your food adventures. You will do great! :wink:

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Re: Vegan Raw Food Diet

Post by IPer » Thu Nov 27, 2014 5:05 pm

I just want to say thanks for all the good suggestions that have come to this thread!
Please feel free to continue, best all!
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Re: Vegan Raw Food Diet

Post by IPer » Sat Nov 29, 2014 11:53 pm

fyi I went to http://www.okraw.com and his approach seems to be my approach, very interesting!
It seems like the simplest approaches work best. Thanks for that suggestion!
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Re: Vegan Raw Food Diet

Post by Dude2 » Sun Nov 30, 2014 11:28 pm

I am reminded of a documentary I saw about how elephants have been domesticated to help with all sorts of labor -- basically used as a bulldozer. To get this to work, instead of allowing the elephants to graze all day long (which is necessary because they have to eat about 200 kg of plants a day), they figured out how to crunch down bread, fruit, and rice into these gigantic elephant "pills" that they pop into their mouths while they are working. In this way, the elephant can do the labor and only has to eat 50 kg of food per day.

I find grazing all day on low-carb vegetables very tiresome. Our diet needs to be appropriate for our labor. Perhaps the OP is having energy issues.

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Re: Vegan Raw Food Diet

Post by IPer » Sun Nov 30, 2014 11:43 pm

Dude2 wrote:I am reminded of a documentary I saw about how elephants have been domesticated to help with all sorts of labor -- basically used as a bulldozer. To get this to work, instead of allowing the elephants to graze all day long (which is necessary because they have to eat about 200 kg of plants a day), they figured out how to crunch down bread, fruit, and rice into these gigantic elephant "pills" that they pop into their mouths while they are working. In this way, the elephant can do the labor and only has to eat 50 kg of food per day.

I find grazing all day on low-carb vegetables very tiresome. Our diet needs to be appropriate for our labor. Perhaps the OP is having energy issues.
Well today is Day 9. I definitely was not tired from grazing all day before. I am thinking I was having issues with the amount of rice I was eating, cooked rice, and in combination with the veggies (cooked) and high salt (and perhaps processed soy stuff), though I am not able to pinpoint that. Today my energy has increased a bit, my breathing a bit deeper, I am judging by how my daily exercise is going. In addition I started monitoring my heart rate using the Samsung S Health app with weight levels and so forth. My initial plan is to ride the Raw Vegan Diet for another 3+ months (to 120 days) and then get a comprehensive checkup regardless of how I am feeling. At this point I get full before I would be tired from "grazing" on veggies, all that could change and most likely will in the course of the next 3 months, we'll see. Thanks for all your input!
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Re: Vegan Raw Food Diet

Post by Dutch » Mon Dec 01, 2014 1:18 am

You definitely need a blender

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Re: Vegan Raw Food Diet

Post by IPer » Mon Dec 01, 2014 4:41 am

Dutch wrote:You definitely need a blender
Um, as I previously posted, I do. Here I am with my knife/cutting board, blender, juicer and other such items.
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Re: Vegan Raw Food Diet

Post by lululu » Mon Dec 01, 2014 5:22 am

Dude2 wrote: I find grazing all day on low-carb vegetables very tiresome. Our diet needs to be appropriate for our labor.
I don't graze all day on low carb vegetables, but then again I am not working as a bulldozer.

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Re: Vegan Raw Food Diet

Post by IPer » Mon Dec 01, 2014 5:27 am

lululu wrote:
Dude2 wrote: I find grazing all day on low-carb vegetables very tiresome. Our diet needs to be appropriate for our labor.
I don't graze all day on low carb vegetables, but then again I am not working as a bulldozer.
+2 (where is that like button when I need it?!)
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Re: Vegan Raw Food Diet

Post by Dude2 » Mon Dec 01, 2014 11:35 am

lululu wrote:
Dude2 wrote: I find grazing all day on low-carb vegetables very tiresome. Our diet needs to be appropriate for our labor.
I don't graze all day on low carb vegetables, but then again I am not working as a bulldozer.
I'm just saying that people can get "run down" despite eating all the time. You could find yourself in a mode where all you do is eat and still feel crappy. A possible alternative might be to eat less of higher-energy foods versus a large amount of low-energy foods. (and to regulate your blood sugar through exercise).

I think we are still in the dark as to what the issue is, so I took a shot. I am fishing for more information. Is it an energy issue? Is it a digestive issue? Perhaps going to raw vegan is the exact opposite of what you should do. I'm not sure if the thread is meant to be a raw vegan thread or I'm having some kind of health issue due to diet thread.

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Re: Vegan Raw Food Diet

Post by IPer » Mon Dec 01, 2014 8:43 pm

Good fishing!

Due to the potency of some of the great inputs so far I am more interested to know right now if anyone has used an Android based health app, like Health S
from Samsung, that allows yoga and swimming and other forms of exercise as inputs and/or has vegan/vegetarian food (raw) on the menu. Best regards!
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Re: Vegan Raw Food Diet

Post by SamB » Tue Dec 02, 2014 1:50 pm

There are plenty of places to look on this one, but I would bench mark the relevant medical biomarkers and periodically check to see how they change. Also, independent of how you end up weighting your diet, it would be very good to learn something about nutrition, especially as it relates to cooked and uncooked foods. It is all about the chemistry, and how you handle the things that are toxic, which also of course depends on the quantity and the capacity of your liver. Goitrogens come to mind, but there are plenty of plant enzymes that are useless or even toxic to the human body that are broken down by cooking, or even soaking.

Raw may be better for you, but you will only know if you track your relevant biomarkers. 120 days is not a very long period. To see what is really happening I would consider tracking for a couple of years. The human body has a huge capacity to adapt under just about any kind of abuse, but only up to a point. Denise Minger is a former raw vegan. You might want to look her up. She has an interesting story to tell, and she is very quantitative.

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