Who else hates choosing a car?

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livesoft
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Re: Who else hates choosing a car?

Post by livesoft » Mon Jul 14, 2014 8:52 am

WhyNotUs wrote:If you get really creative you can get a custom license plate holder that compliments your clever plate and that can be your flash.
My spouse did that with her old car. It's really pathetic that folks have to resort to that.
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sscritic
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Re: Who else hates choosing a car?

Post by sscritic » Mon Jul 14, 2014 8:55 am

livesoft wrote:
WhyNotUs wrote:If you get really creative you can get a custom license plate holder that compliments your clever plate and that can be your flash.
My spouse did that with her old car. It's really pathetic that folks have to resort to that.
Are you going to show her this post? :)

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tainted-meat
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Re: Who else hates choosing a car?

Post by tainted-meat » Mon Jul 14, 2014 8:57 am

The GMC Terrain or Ford Edge SUVs are nice.

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William4u
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Re: Who else hates choosing a car?

Post by William4u » Mon Jul 14, 2014 12:07 pm

Browser wrote:Hadn't heard this mention of transmission problems in V-6 Hondas before. But I have heard of problems with the variable-cylinder-management (VCM) system in V-6 Hondas, in which there have been complaints of oil use, plug fouling, noise, shudder related to the on/off of cylinders. Has anyone experienced this?
I have heard of the transmission issues, both online and from friends with Accords.

BigTom
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Re: Who else hates choosing a car?

Post by BigTom » Mon Jul 14, 2014 5:40 pm

grok87 wrote:I do.
We are gearing up to buy a new car and uggh boy do i hate the process.
We used to just buy hondas but have recently become aware of a number of reliability issues with honda (transmissions on odysseys, windows on accords) so again uggh. I guess hondas aren't what they used to be. thinking about buying a subaru...
The trans problems are pretty much only with the 6cyl cars , window issues aren't a reason to not buy a car . Honda IMO are the best cars . Subarus are great cars too . I might put Toyota in the middle and make that my top three , Nissan forth .

sscritic
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Re: Who else hates choosing a car?

Post by sscritic » Mon Jul 14, 2014 5:51 pm

livesoft wrote:
WhyNotUs wrote:If you get really creative you can get a custom license plate holder that compliments your clever plate and that can be your flash.
My spouse did that with her old car. It's really pathetic that folks have to resort to that.
And how do feel about those who replace the names and logos on the car with gold versions? Nothing says "I'm cool" like a gold Toyota logo, a gold Toyota, and a gold Camry on your car.
http://store.goldrushplating.com/2012-t ... e-lxe.html

mainiac
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Re: Who else hates choosing a car?

Post by mainiac » Mon Jul 14, 2014 6:24 pm

I have a 205K Camry which goes very nicely in the Maine winters with a good set of snow tires!

I also hate buying a new car, there are too many choices and dealing with sales people is not my idea of fun.

freddie
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Re: Who else hates choosing a car?

Post by freddie » Mon Jul 14, 2014 7:49 pm

sscritic wrote:
livesoft wrote:
WhyNotUs wrote:If you get really creative you can get a custom license plate holder that compliments your clever plate and that can be your flash.
My spouse did that with her old car. It's really pathetic that folks have to resort to that.
And how do feel about those who replace the names and logos on the car with gold versions? Nothing says "I'm cool" like a gold Toyota logo, a gold Toyota, and a gold Camry on your car.
http://store.goldrushplating.com/2012-t ... e-lxe.html
Those used to and maybe still are manufacturer options. They used to be cheaper than paint on German cars:) There are tons of fashion accessory's for cars. Look through a Porsche catelogue sometime:)

grok87
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Re: Who else hates choosing a car?

Post by grok87 » Mon Jul 14, 2014 10:40 pm

BigTom wrote:
grok87 wrote:I do.
We are gearing up to buy a new car and uggh boy do i hate the process.
We used to just buy hondas but have recently become aware of a number of reliability issues with honda (transmissions on odysseys, windows on accords) so again uggh. I guess hondas aren't what they used to be. thinking about buying a subaru...
The trans problems are pretty much only with the 6cyl cars , window issues aren't a reason to not buy a car . Honda IMO are the best cars . Subarus are great cars too . I might put Toyota in the middle and make that my top three , Nissan forth .
agree about the windows.
i've heard the ridgeline has a better transmission
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madbrain
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Re: Who else hates choosing a car?

Post by madbrain » Tue Jul 15, 2014 5:08 am

SilverDollars wrote:When it comes to the car you drive, where do you all draw the line in the battle between enjoying your car, and the car that makes the most financial sense?

Obviously there are a ton of factors, including, but not limited to:

- Fuel Efficiency
- Safety
- What your commute looks like
- How much space/size you need
- Weather where you live
- Cost
I also consider the environment impact very high on the list. This is usually closely coupled with fuel efficiency.

Polaris
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Re: Who else hates choosing a car?

Post by Polaris » Thu Jul 17, 2014 2:32 pm

I am currently driving a 2004 Honda Pilot while my wife drives the newer family car, so I found this post interesting. :D One thing I would be concerned about with a 2005 Pilot is the "dissimilar metal corrosion" problem at the joint where the ATF lines enter and exit the radiator that a few people have reported at piloteers.org (more info here). I proactively replaced my radiator last year as a precaution because I'm hoping to be driving this car for a few more years. I got rid of a fifteen year old Maxima last year when we bought my wife's car, so my hope is that my Pilot can hang in there a bit longer.

I look at my car as transportation so I don't particularly care what other people think about the brand, age, or condition. If they have a problem with it then that says a lot more about them then it does about me. I also paid a lot of money for this car eleven years ago and I fully intend to get my money's worth. Of course, YMMV.

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FelixTheCat
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Re: Who else hates choosing a car?

Post by FelixTheCat » Thu Jul 17, 2014 2:51 pm

I'm in that boat now.

Most sedans look a like to me.
Big trucks are too big for my garage.
Most SUVs today look like station wagons.

Ugh.

I wish I only cared about price and quality. I would've had a new car six months ago.
Felix is a wonderful, wonderful cat.

Rockies1978
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Re: Who else hates choosing a car?

Post by Rockies1978 » Thu Jul 17, 2014 3:32 pm

I wouldn't call myself a car enthusiast, but I do find cars interesting. I'm drawn to smaller cars. Stuff that other people find plain is appealing to me. I prefer Civics and Corollas, but I also am drawn to the Prius C, the Hyundai Veloster, the Mazda 3, the Honda Fit, the Fiat 500, and others.

I used to worry about the shopping experience because I'm fairly quiet by nature, I don't know a lot about cars, and I always feel like the dealers are out to bully me. But I've actually done extremely well in negotiating for a car the last two times I have purchased one (a new Odyssey this year, and its predecessor, a new CRV we bought in 2009).

I have come to learn that the ability to effectively negotiate is a product of four things which you can control:

1) Casting a wide search net geographically
2) Making dealers compete with one another
3) Willing to take time
4) Willing to walk off the lot

In my opinion, here's the best way to shop for cars. It works best if you're living near a major metro area.

1) Look up every dealership within a 30 mile radius that sells the model you want
2) Email all the internet sales managers to ask them for their "best price" <laugh> on XYZ car. Some won't put anything in writing, but some will. You only need one to start the process.
3) Once you get one offer in writing, start calling other dealerships to let them know that you have a quote for $XX,XXX from XYZ dealership and ask if they'll beat it. Tell them you'll come down to the dealership if you can get that in writing. Repeat this process if possible and try to get a few different dealerships to bit down.
4) Print out your lowest offer in writing and wander into whichever dealership seemed the most flexible looking stupid (I'm very good at this). Say you're interested in purchasing a car, and you'd like a trade in quote (assuming you have one).
5) Once you get the trade in quote, tell them there's too much of a gap between the price and the trade-in value. At this stage, do NOT ask them to change the price. Don't bring up the price. Sheepishly ask if they can do a little better on the trade in.
6) Assuming they increase the trade-in, AFTER that happens you pull out your printout with the lowest internet quote and say, "well, with that much in trade, if you can beat this price, I'll buy the car." If they balk, get up to leave. If they let you go, it's probably because they can't make enough on the deal. Try the same process at another dealership

But after you've wasted some of their time, they're more likely to want to make a transaction, even if it's not the biggest commission. They have sunk costs at that point and they're more likely to want something to compensate for that.

Anyhow, that's my method, not sure if it's the greatest but it works for me. I bought a 2014 Honda Odyssey LX for 24,800 this way (and I got significantly over blue book on my trade in). According to truecar.com's data, that seems like a really good deal.

I know I could do better by selling my old car private party, but I hate dealing with people, so it's worth it to me to just do the trade in.

MathWizard
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Re: Who else hates choosing a car?

Post by MathWizard » Thu Jul 17, 2014 3:36 pm

I real don't hate it.

I try to keep up on the used cars in the range of miles/age that is in my price range.
When it's time to change cars, I'm got a good feel for the market and can get one pretty quickly.
I test drive a few cars and rank them in order of desirability, start from the best deal, and offer
what I think the car is worth. I usually pull out my checkbook and say I'll write a check for this
amount right now. If not, then I say thanks for working with me, I'll keep you in mind when I
get my next car, and I leave. I walk out and go for the next best car at another dealer.

Color/style really doesn't matter to me. Comfortable ride, decent gas mileage, reliability,
decent price, able to last me at least 8 years, and I'm good to go.

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6miths
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Re: Who else hates choosing a car?

Post by 6miths » Thu Jul 17, 2014 4:04 pm

WhyNotUs wrote: If you get really creative you can get a custom license plate holder that compliments your clever plate and that can be your flash.
I saw the best vanity plate ever one day walking down Bay Street in Toronto. Was a red Honda Prelude, was a Kansas plate that said 'TOTO' and had a plate frame that said, wait for it, 'We're not in Kansas anymore'. My wife really likes a vanity plate that one of the hospital pathologist has: ICDEDPPL. She was a fan of the movie too.
'It ain't what you don't know that gets you into trouble. It's what you know for sure that just ain't so!' Mark Twain

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6miths
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Re: Who else hates choosing a car?

Post by 6miths » Thu Jul 17, 2014 4:10 pm

I love picking cars. Vehicle technology seems to change so fast. Interestingly, I wasn't aware of V6 Honda transmission problems but our 2010 Odyssey which has 130,000 miles on it is having transmission problems and is going to need a new transmission. I was stunned at this news, never having had any issue with Hondas over the years. So rather than do the repair, and a big service due, and new front shocks and fixing all the little bumps DW has put in it we decided to dump it and get a new one. Usually I don't really like the bargaining part but I seem to have mellowed a bit in old age and am not quite so ruthless when it comes time to make a deal.
'It ain't what you don't know that gets you into trouble. It's what you know for sure that just ain't so!' Mark Twain

BenBritt
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Re: Who else hates choosing a car?

Post by BenBritt » Fri Jul 18, 2014 8:20 am

2015 Subaru Forester, wife loves it. It took us three years to arrive at that decision! Time will tell if it
was a wise one.

tphp99
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Re: Who else hates choosing a car?

Post by tphp99 » Fri Jul 18, 2014 9:04 am

semperlux wrote:
VictoriaF wrote:I don't understand the concept of "boring" with respect to cars. .... Boredom is not even a part of my selection criteria.

Victoria
Hate to say it, but "it's a guy thing." =)
Or more accurately - it's a car nut thing.

If you can't tell the difference between driving a Honda Accord vs say... a 911 GT2, well... Good news, your "car nut" diagnostic test: negative.

freddie
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Re: Who else hates choosing a car?

Post by freddie » Fri Jul 18, 2014 9:17 am

6miths wrote:I love picking cars. Vehicle technology seems to change so fast. Interestingly, I wasn't aware of V6 Honda transmission problems but our 2010 Odyssey which has 130,000 miles on it is having transmission problems and is going to need a new transmission. I was stunned at this news, never having had any issue with Hondas over the years. So rather than do the repair, and a big service due, and new front shocks and fixing all the little bumps DW has put in it we decided to dump it and get a new one. Usually I don't really like the bargaining part but I seem to have mellowed a bit in old age and am not quite so ruthless when it comes time to make a deal.
I am scared to ask but how do you put 130k miles on a 2010?:) Problem with reliability is that you can never buy the reliable car. You have to buy the model which has had who knows how many changes since then.

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tadamsmar
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Re: Who else hates choosing a car?

Post by tadamsmar » Fri Jul 18, 2014 10:58 am

It would be a mistake to buy a 2005 Honda Pilot without ESC. Vehicles without ESC have a 50% higher fatality rate, worse for an SUV. ESC is optional on the 2005 Honda Pilot

See this on getting a used car with ESC:

http://epicurusgarden.blogspot.com/2011 ... h-esc.html

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Tozmo
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Re: Who else hates choosing a car?

Post by Tozmo » Fri Jul 18, 2014 1:02 pm

I was heavily looking at subaru's, but I live in coastal virginia where snow isn't too rampant. I question if I need awd for driving around sprawl-mart, which is what my area is.

harikaried
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Re: Who else hates choosing a car?

Post by harikaried » Fri Jul 18, 2014 1:41 pm

Tozmo wrote:I was heavily looking at subaru's, but I live in coastal virginia where snow isn't too rampant
A quick search says Norfolk has above average number of days of precipitation, although I'm not really sure how hard it rains when it does rain. AWD is useful whenever you need to accelerate in slippery situation (e.g., turning at an intersection).

swaption
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Re: Who else hates choosing a car?

Post by swaption » Fri Jul 18, 2014 2:31 pm

Understand where you are coming from. When we moved to the suburbs, I drove a 1991 Camry for a while, mostly used to go back and forth to train station. But then I went to a corporate golf outing, and when my wife suggested I might consider renting a car, I realized my existing car had gotten a bit long in the tooth. So I bought a pre-owned Audi, which got totaled, and now have a BMW. Love the BMW.

A couple of cars I will throw out as alternatives if I were in your shoes. First is a Hyundai Genesis, which I understand is now available with all wheel drive (or maybe will be soon). Genesis might be on the pricey side. Perhaps less expensive is the Ford Fusion, which is available in all wheel drive. Of a similar ilk as Accord and Altima, but I don't think the styling is boring at all. I'm kind of a car guy and really like the Fusion. It is really impressive how much is packed into the cars that occupy that very competitive segment of the market. I just had a Passat rental for a week. Also a great car. Not sure if the CC trim is available in all-wheel drive (or if it even exists anymore), but that also has a really cool look.

Rodc
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Re: Who else hates choosing a car?

Post by Rodc » Fri Jul 18, 2014 3:27 pm

Fortunately I only desire a mid level car that is reasonably cost effective, safe and comfortable and goes from point A to point B. Family wants one that is largish, 4WD, for hauling camping gear, yard waste, ski trips, etc. Other can be a mid sized car. I am more comfortable buying Japanese brands.

At that price point the potential cars are more or less interchangeable so no point spending a ton of time worrying about just which one.

I just might look into a used Lexus next time to see what turns up based on livesoft's comments as our location might be similar.
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Tozmo
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Re: Who else hates choosing a car?

Post by Tozmo » Fri Jul 18, 2014 4:05 pm

harikaried wrote:
Tozmo wrote:I was heavily looking at subaru's, but I live in coastal virginia where snow isn't too rampant
A quick search says Norfolk has above average number of days of precipitation, although I'm not really sure how hard it rains when it does rain. AWD is useful whenever you need to accelerate in slippery situation (e.g., turning at an intersection).
Sure it rains (we get hurricanes), but I don't think it is bad enough to warrant awd. I associate awd more with snow. I don't want to run into the advanced wear/tear from awd if it isn't needed. If anyone in the sunny south have any comments I would love to hear them, because I'm leaning toward a ford focus/fusion for my next car. I have two toddler kids, so safety is important. That is what got me onto the Subaru kick in the first place.

epilnk
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Re: Who else hates choosing a car?

Post by epilnk » Fri Jul 18, 2014 9:53 pm

Hate choosing a car. Hate it. None is ever exactly what I want - I'd happily pay extra to get exactly what I want but it never seems to exist. I posted a question on bogleheads about choosing a new car, saying I'd decided to replace mine. FIVE YEARS LATER I finally replaced it and I'm still not entirely happy with my choice.

And now my husband's minvan - bought used 10 years ago - needs replacing and he's been way overworked and time crunched lately, so guess who gets to choose the next car? I hate it.

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Re: Who else hates choosing a car?

Post by shashi » Thu Sep 18, 2014 12:33 am

Cars are diehards fav topic and I need to pitch in.

Car1- Acura integra bought 3yr old, kept for 13 yrs
Car2- Brand new Accord2003, still running at 185k miles. Had to change engine at 160k after it started consuming huge engine oil. Replaced with 2006 engine, runs perfect, had to spend $2k for engine, worth it now.
Car3- New odyssey 2010, brand new, touchwood no issues, planning on keeping another 5 yrs.

Was heartbroken after accord started oil consumption but accepted and moved on. But probably will buy another Honda again :)

JLJL
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Re: Who else hates choosing a car?

Post by JLJL » Thu Sep 18, 2014 3:47 am

I also hate it. And I'll be in the unfortunate position of needing to buy 2 soon (think his and hers, or his and theirs) after we move to a new location.

Are there smoking deals to be had if you buy 2 new cars at once? I'm much more prone to buying used vehicles, but my normal "sweet spot" for a car purchase is a few year old Honda/Toyota which is not well discounted from new any more it seems. I was hoping to stick to a $30K budget (yes, for both) and am leaing heavily toward a Toyota Sienna (I'm told Leather is a must) for one. Quick pricing check and the new 2014s are deeply discounted while used 2012-2014 seem too high.

So it is looking like 1@ $27.8K, and 1@ $2.2K. <<<--- This option is to defer some pain all at once and perhaps pick up the 2nd in a couple years. Hoping to do most of my commute via my Giant Bike.

New Camry's do look pretty nice though.

There is also the option of a few year old van and a few year old car and I can work hard to get it to $30K (an arbitrary number I'll admit).

Yes, I do hate it.

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Re: Who else hates choosing a car?

Post by Beck49 » Thu Sep 18, 2014 6:04 am

I split the difference. I buy high end European cars, for the safety, performance and looks, but buy very close to the base models and keep them 10 years at least. No premium packages. No navigation systems when you can get a portable GPS with twice the functionality at half the price and plug it in when you need it.

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Re: Who else hates choosing a car?

Post by Browser » Thu Sep 18, 2014 6:52 am

Beck49 wrote:I split the difference. I buy high end European cars, for the safety, performance and looks, but buy very close to the base models and keep them 10 years at least. No premium packages. No navigation systems when you can get a portable GPS with twice the functionality at half the price and plug it in when you need it.
Have been shopping brands and yesterday drove a 2015 Volvo XC60 and Acura RDX. I was less than underwhelmed by the navs on both of these. It feels like taking a trip in the wayback machine. To enter destination address you basically have to select one letter or number at time and peck it in. No touchscreen operation and no real voice control except to speak certain fixed commands. My Google maps on my smartphone is light years ahead of this stuff. Found it ironic that when I was trying to find the Volvo dealership all I had to do was speak "Volvo" to my smartphone and up comes the map and spoken directions. If I'd been using the Volvo nav, I would have had to pull off the road and spend 15 minutes pecking in the destination and trying to find it with the nav. Total kraap. I was also put off by the sheer amount of electronics, especially in the Volvo. Even the speedometer is a virtual image. The emergency brake is basically a little electronic switch and the only way to tell it's set is to look for a status light somewhere on the dash. There was a whole panel of little buttons on the dash that looked like the space shuttle. I can see the $$$ flying out of my wallet to fix all this stuff as soon as the warranty runs out. I think you are correct that these options should all be avoided.
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mbk734
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Re: Who else hates choosing a car?

Post by mbk734 » Thu Sep 18, 2014 7:02 am

Cars depreciate quickly and become dated with all of the new advances in technology. IMO this is a reason to buy an inexpensive car more frequently (or even lease) rather than buying a late model luxury car less frequently.

Car commercials brainwash us (particularly men) into thinking that we need a luxury vehicle or sports car. Do we want a luxury vehicle to keep up with the Jones or to inflate our egos? A luxury car and other material things will not improve our lives. It may make us happy but it is a false sense of narcissistic pride. Take the money you save by buying an average car and take a vacation with your family or towards your hobbies. That will make you happy.

Also, people that have sports cars can't even use them to their full potential. There's nothing like driving a Porsche to work stuck in rush hour traffic everyday! Driving fast on the streets puts yourself and others in danger. If you have a need for speed, see if there is a track nearby and splurge and rent a Ferrari for a day or learn to drive a motorcycle! Most supersport bikes rival the fastest car you can buy for under 15k. 8-)
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Re: Who else hates choosing a car?

Post by livesoft » Thu Sep 18, 2014 7:09 am

@mbk734, I think you have to admit that a Lexus RX is really a mom-mobile and not a guy's macho luxury vehicle or sports car. :)
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Re: Who else hates choosing a car?

Post by Beck49 » Thu Sep 18, 2014 7:31 am

@mbk734, I might well be brainwashed. :shock: However, I also find that the high end European cars often come with not just new technology, but the most advanced "safety" technology. I remember buying one in 1999, and it came with stability control. Few if any other cars came with that technology. 7-8 years later it was showing up as a standard feature. My understanding is that stability control is considered one of the most important safety features ever added to a car, much like the value of seat belts. This is what I am personally willing to pay extra for.

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Re: Who else hates choosing a car?

Post by VictoriaF » Thu Sep 18, 2014 7:42 am

semperlux wrote:
VictoriaF wrote:I don't understand the concept of "boring" with respect to cars. .... Boredom is not even a part of my selection criteria.

Victoria
Hate to say it, but "it's a guy thing." =)

Guys have their real wives, & sometimes a "work" wife. Well, I see my car as my "commute wife." I want her to be aesthetically pleasing, have some pep in her, fit me like a glove when I slide into her seat, reliably there for me whenever I need her, & one that I can show off to my other guy friends =P Sometimes they can make up for some of the traits we're missing from our real wives, so they "complete" us haha.

But to comment on op's post, I hate the traditional ordeal of haggling for a car at a dealership, more than the process of choosing the car.
Good point. Are all your cars over 18?

Victoria
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mbk734
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Re: Who else hates choosing a car?

Post by mbk734 » Thu Sep 18, 2014 8:10 am

@Livesoft
Lexus is a great company. I would definitely go for a sedan over a soccer mom SUV! Although BMW would be my first choice (they are rated biggest @$$ on the road though). I must admit that if you can easily afford it, a luxury car is not the worst thing you can buy and I can appreciate someone wanting a nice car. If I could afford one, I would probably buy one too. But until I can, I am a humble (slightly jealous) Honda owner. :mrgreen:

@Beck49
I completely agree. Buy the safest car you can afford.

This is a funny list of car stereotypes (not written by me).

Subaru - Outdoorsy granola types who go camping biweekly and cover their car with social justice bumper stickers.

Subaru [WRX/STi] - 20something who thinks they're a rally car driver but mods their turbo motor to 400whp for straight line speed. Hates Mitsubishis

BMW - Aggressive yuppie prick who thinks they're an awesome driver. "I'm in a BMW therefore this lane is MINE!"

Geo - cheapskates who bothered to be fuel efficient when gas was $1.10 a gallon and paid the price with 14 second 0-60 times

smart - SF dweller who wants a car that sticks out even more than a Prius although it's smaller and gets worse gas mileage.

Buick - Old people you mistake for unmarked police since only they drive large American sedans

Honda [Civic/Integra] - Asian dude with spiky hair ricing out their hatchback Civics with fart cannons, body kits, claiming their car is hella JDM and their giant spoiler makes them go faster. Gives you a lesson on driving straight from The Fast & The Furious.

Lexus - Boring fallback luxury for yuppies who've made enough money and now want to live in comfort.

Mercedes - Rich people who can't handle BMW and need their cars softened up and served on a silver platter. Always buy a Mercedes in silver or black.

Mitsubishi - Hardcore tuner who lives paycheck-to-paycheck buying mods and fixing everything that breaks. Hates Subaru

Hummer - IDGAF about your global warming BS, I want to look badass

Volvo - I'm a vampire. Or care too much about safety.

Toyota - I'm boring.

Toyota [Prius] - Under normal circumstances I would not own a 3000 pound destructor of the American urban landscape, but since circumstances dictate that an automobile is convenient in this suburban wasteland, I have decided to go with the least impactful vehicle. I will now proceed to conserve energy by never fixing my 2' off parking and never signaling.

Toyota [white pickup] - in LA, day laborer with construction or gardening tools in the back playing Spanish music

Acura - I'm even more boring! Unless you have an NSX RSX or Integra.

Pontiac - I had to drive a rental car reject

Audi - Yuppie who likes LED headlights. In China, government official. Always yield to black Audis, you don't know who you're messing with.

VW [New Beetle | Cabrio | Jetta] - I'm a girl trying to be stylish. Aren't the headlights cute?

VW [Van] - Aging hippie, van saw Woodstock 1969 and Vietnam protests with its own two headlights.

Ford - Buy American, Chevy sucks! I only need 4 liters of displacement to make 210 horsepower, live rear axle technology is totally 21st century.

Ford [SUVs/Truck] - See below, except hates Chevy.

Chevrolet - Red blooded American who applauds "This is our country" ads, hates Ford. Brags all day about the Corvette but has never driven one and can never afford one.

Chevrolet [SUVs] - Official car of the suburban (heh) Republican voter

Chevrolet [Truck] - Dirt-loving hillbilly who battles alcohol and possibly meth addictions. In the South, proudly flies the Confederate flag
You can't stop the waves, but you can learn to surf

dave8274
Posts: 20
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Re: Who else hates choosing a car?

Post by dave8274 » Thu Sep 18, 2014 8:38 am

We shopped for cars recently, and we looked at the Accord Hybrid. I felt the same way about it. Here are a few cars in at least a similar price range I liked a lot better:

Ford Fusion Hybrid (LOVE this car - it's far from boring)
Acura ILX or TLX
Camry Hybrid (great car, my mom has one and loves it)
Lexus CT200h (I love this car as well, but the back seat is a little small and my wife drives clients around so it wasn't practical. It's the Lexus version of the Prius, but isn't nearly as roomy)

If it had been my decision, and if we stuck with new, I would have gone for the Fusion Hybrid for looks and the interior, and probably the Camry for longevity. The car was for my wife though, she's a Realtor and spends a lot of time in the car. She's mistrustful of American cars, so unfortunately the Fusion was out. She had her eye on some cars that were closer to the 40k price range, which I didn't feel comfortable with. In the end, we compromised and ended up purchasing a CPO 2011 BMW 328ix. It's a lot of fun to drive, gas mileage is at least decent, and it's AWD (we live in Utah). I worry about the maintenance in the long term, so we probably will end up selling it closer to 100k miles than 150k.

We also have a 2012 Prius though (by the way take a look at the higher end Prius models as well, with leather and all the toys it was less than 30k). That's my daily car and I LOVE it. Gas mileage is insane, it drives extremely well, is surprisingly good in the snow, at least with the bigger wheels on the Prius 5 we have). We use the Prius for any longer drives, and when my wife has a day where she'll be driving more than usual we'll trade cars. Hopefully that keeps the mileage on the BMW down and adds some years to our time with it.

polybius
Posts: 1
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Re: Who else hates choosing a car?

Post by polybius » Thu Sep 18, 2014 8:49 am

The extra fun factor I have when choosing a vehicle is that I am 6'8" with a 40" inseam. Some vehciles are just not doable, for example my brother has a 2011 Prius and my knees hit the dashboard with the seat all the way back. There's no way I'd mess with moving the seat rails. Sometimes I find that the luxury vehicles are worse as they seem to want to preserve space in the back. NIssan Maxima has less driver side room than the Altima. Another vehcile feature that beocmes a factor is the 4" stripe of tint at the top of the windshield. In some vehicles this ends up cutting halfway through my field of view which is especially annoying at night.

Velodon
Posts: 17
Joined: Tue Jul 29, 2014 10:28 am

Re: Who else hates choosing a car?

Post by Velodon » Thu Sep 18, 2014 9:00 am

I don't understand the concept of "boring" with respect to cars. People can be boring. Places can be boring. Books can be boring. But cars? For me, the main characteristics of cars in the order of priorities are:
1. Reliability
2. Price
3. Safety
4. Comfort

In practice, I choose on the first two. Boredom is not even a part of my selection criteria.
Victoria[/quote]

Both of my cars have a "soul" hence using the adjective boring is hard to comprehend.

inbox788
Posts: 6699
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Re: Who else hates choosing a car?

Post by inbox788 » Thu Sep 18, 2014 2:28 pm

SilverDollars wrote:I currently drive a 2005 Honda Pilot. It was formerly the "family car", with 3 young children who didn't exactly keep the car squeaky clean (I tend to keep my car clean).
...
How do you all handle this?
I was in your situation 3 years ago, and I'm still suffering from analysis paralysis. Today, the mini van is 3 years older, and potential for major problems increases every year, but so far only a couple of minor issues (cross finger, knock on wood, pour salt, etc.). I have additional requirements, and keep adding them, so I've come to the conclusion I need 3-4 cars to optimize all my needs/wants. Even trying to find a couple of important criteria often go opposing and compromise. When all is said and done, often the answer is a new minivan, which isn't very exciting, so I chug along with the old van.

I don't like the current Pilot styling and larger size, but the one you have 2 gen ago is very nice. I hope the next year model is a little smaller and more like the MDX than last years Pilot, and it would make my short list. That 3rd row seat is a two edge sword. Nice to have when you carry an extra passenger or two, but the child size of most of those 3rd row seats makes it less and less desirable as the kids get to adult size. Large storage/transport and ability to move 7-8 people are occasionally desirable and very convenient to have in the driveway/garage. Once in a while, moving stuff is better with a truck, and the towing abilities are without comparison. Then there's the sport/sporty/performance wish list, and some of these can tow. And if I give up the desire to tow, and the large cargo/people capacity, I can get by 80-90% of the time with a small cheap fuel efficient sedan.

Sometimes I wish there weren't so many choices.

http://www.ted.com/talks/barry_schwartz ... _of_choice

As far as pricing, the efficient market hypothesis is at play and the ability to meet the needs of consumers is directly linked to the price you pay. While there are some exceptions, for the most part, you get what you pay for. Luxury cars include additional features and added prestige that's valuable to their owners. Used cars have decreased desirability, additional risks and costs that offset depreciation of new/newer cars. Most mispricings get corrected fairly quickly. So don't let price be a primary determinant.

So, do you have other cars on your short list besides the Accord Hybrid? What's the value case vs. regular Accord?

http://www.money-zine.com/calculators/a ... alculator/

bloom2708
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Location: Fargo, ND

Re: Who else hates choosing a car?

Post by bloom2708 » Thu Sep 18, 2014 3:10 pm

BigTom wrote:
grok87 wrote:I do.
We are gearing up to buy a new car and uggh boy do i hate the process.
We used to just buy hondas but have recently become aware of a number of reliability issues with honda (transmissions on odysseys, windows on accords) so again uggh. I guess hondas aren't what they used to be. thinking about buying a subaru...
The trans problems are pretty much only with the 6cyl cars , window issues aren't a reason to not buy a car . Honda IMO are the best cars . Subarus are great cars too . I might put Toyota in the middle and make that my top three , Nissan forth .
I had a 2007 Honda Odyssey and the transmission issues are not just with the cars. This van had the worst transmission I ever have driven. When you slightly let off the accelerator it would do these little surges. It drove me crazy. I had it in many times. They said it was just the transmission. I just learned to live with it until the front middle spark plug fell out. It exploded and chunks of the plug fell into the engine ruining the cylinder head, small block and other parts. It required a complete engine rebuild. Honda covered all but about $700 in related parts that they recommended I replace.

I sold the van with 60k miles. First and last Honda for this family. I know I am one of a "few". It is surprising how many of these issues are much broader than you know once you know what the problem is.

Car buying is very personal. Never boring for me. I'm sticking with Fords. Staying in a trusted brand helps make the car selection process easier.
"People want confirmation, not advice" Unknown | "We are here to provoke thoughtfulness, not agree with you" Unknown | Four words: Whole food, plant based

Jim85
Posts: 185
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Re: Who else hates choosing a car?

Post by Jim85 » Fri Sep 19, 2014 9:19 am

Have a 2012 Ford Fusion. My first non-Toyota in 25 years, no regrets, great car. 4cyl, fuel efficiency is good 28mpg on mostly back roads very limited highway driving. Rented the newer model Fusion this summer and liked it even more. It had a 4cyl "ecobooost" engine (whatever that is, but not a hybrid). We got around 38mpg (lots of highway driving) on a lengthy driving vacation out west.

Still like the Corolla's - wife drives a 2012 (bought used with low mileage). Two of my (adult) children have Corollas too. One a 2014 Corolla which is quite a nice change, interior and exterior.

If the 30 mile commute is mostly highway, not sure a Hybrid is cost effective.

sambb
Posts: 2699
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Re: Who else hates choosing a car?

Post by sambb » Fri Sep 19, 2014 9:27 am

I don't mind picking cars. I also don't mind the sales people. I am not in a situation where I will worry about $500 in transaction costs, for anything of this magnitude that I would keep for awhile. I think the new tech in cars is great.

Lynette
Posts: 1898
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Re: Who else hates choosing a car?

Post by Lynette » Fri Sep 19, 2014 9:32 am

......
Last edited by Lynette on Wed Dec 06, 2017 6:48 am, edited 1 time in total.

Johno
Posts: 1883
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Re: Who else hates choosing a car?

Post by Johno » Fri Sep 19, 2014 1:59 pm

I go with 'like choosing, hate actually buying'. I don't think I'm too bad at haggling with car dealers, but I think it's the relatively rare person who actual likes it. OTOH especially in the earlier phases, it's fun to check out what's new with cars. There can be a dilemma in the final stages if you seriously value a variety of different virtues. For example if you're just focused on reliability and safety within a given budget, it's easier than if you also care about low fatigue on long drives, performance, etc. And in general some people are more insistent optimizers and others 'satisficers' (good enough). Some of the former even like to scold the latter on web forums. :wink:

Last car was easy because my wife said she always wanted it, so we got it, Lexus GX. It's been superb at everything it's supposed to do well, and you know up front a vehicle like that has relatively high gas costs (it's gotten right around its EPA rating 14/19mpg on premium), and isn't a sports car handling-wise. I know some would say that buying a car like that is being a puppet of consumerism or some such, but that's curmudgeonly horsecrap IMHO. :D If you can afford it and like it, buy it. Prior to that we had an MB E-class which didn't turn out as well, 2000 model year, lots of buggy little problems in electrical/electronic components, glad to get rid of it in 2005 for the Lexus. But I'm not sorry I tried it. I really did enjoy it at first. It would have been worth it *to me* had it been reliable. And the Lexus has definitely been worth it, to us. Now it's coming up on 10 yrs old and one of our kids wants to buy it, and the field is wider open for replacement. And I have found it a little hard but not don't hate the process. I'd like to try BMW, but the optimizer in me is bugged by the average (at best) reliability record of BMW's, and (the 3 series I'd most consider) basically flunked the new small overlap frontal crash test (as many cars have). Leading candidate now is Acura TLX, once there's a little more time for good pricing data to emerge.

inbox788
Posts: 6699
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Re: Who else hates choosing a car?

Post by inbox788 » Fri Sep 19, 2014 3:12 pm

epilnk wrote:Hate choosing a car. Hate it. None is ever exactly what I want - I'd happily pay extra to get exactly what I want but it never seems to exist. I posted a question on bogleheads about choosing a new car, saying I'd decided to replace mine. FIVE YEARS LATER I finally replaced it and I'm still not entirely happy with my choice.

And now my husband's minvan - bought used 10 years ago - needs replacing and he's been way overworked and time crunched lately, so guess who gets to choose the next car? I hate it.
Five years? I thought was bad. Maybe I'm just an average procrastinator.

epilnk
Posts: 2653
Joined: Wed Apr 18, 2007 7:05 pm

Re: Who else hates choosing a car?

Post by epilnk » Fri Sep 19, 2014 4:02 pm

inbox788 wrote:
epilnk wrote:Hate choosing a car. Hate it. None is ever exactly what I want - I'd happily pay extra to get exactly what I want but it never seems to exist. I posted a question on bogleheads about choosing a new car, saying I'd decided to replace mine. FIVE YEARS LATER I finally replaced it and I'm still not entirely happy with my choice.

And now my husband's minvan - bought used 10 years ago - needs replacing and he's been way overworked and time crunched lately, so guess who gets to choose the next car? I hate it.
Five years? I thought was bad. Maybe I'm just an average procrastinator.
Based on your earlier post you sound more like me than anyone else here. I'd get another minivan but my husband is the primary driver for the larger vehicle; he was willing to suck it up for the last 10 years so I think it's his turn to be indulged in wanting to leave minivan parenting behind. I'm considering the Acura MDX because while it goes against the grain to pay that much for a stupid car, we can afford it and I'm so done with being stuck with this decision that I'm willing to throw money at the problem to make it go away. I was hoping the Pilot would be close enough but I'm not very comfortable with larger vehicles and unfortunately I really hated the Pilot; the MDX doesn't feel nearly so bad to me.

That third row in the MDX is definitely tight and my boys are entering their teens. But you know what? I figure that's not my problem - I never ride back there anyway. It's only for carpooling teens who should consider themselves lucky to have a ride at all and if they don't like it they can get out and walk. Teens can suck up a little discomfort, and we thought nothing of cramming 4 teens in the back seat an old VW bug back in my day. Good thing we didn't feel a need for seat belts.

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SilverDollars
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Re: Who else hates choosing a car?

Post by SilverDollars » Wed Apr 01, 2015 4:05 pm

SilverDollars wrote: I can probably drive this thing for another 2-3 years ... continue getting 17 MPG (hundreds of dollars per month more than smaller sedans in gas) and pay minor maintenance, lower insurance, and so forth. But man, it would be nice to enjoy my ride to and from work every day.

One car I considered was the newer 2014 Honda Accord Hybrid. It's boring looking ... but it does get 47 MPG (supposedly). That right there would be a $2500 per year gas savings.
Well, in the end, patience and indecision won out. I didn't buy anything. I'm still driving the 2005 Pilot. I had to replace all of the brakes, and a belt.

On the bright side, I took a new job that reduced my driving time from 60 miles per day, to 10 miles each way (10 minutes, highway cruising). So my commute is over before I am even sick of my car. Also, gas prices have come way down, where the SUV prices aren't as bad. I'll keep on keeping on for right now.

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gunn_show
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Re: Who else hates choosing a car?

Post by gunn_show » Wed Apr 01, 2015 6:15 pm

livesoft wrote:I just buy used Lexuses. They are really inexpensive around where I live. Everybody else has a new one, so finding a used one is a piece of cake. I have found a Lexus very practical in terms of gas (20 mpg in city) and maintenance (don't maintain it). They just go and go.

Then again, I live about 3 miles from my work, so commuting is inexpensive anyways.
+1 CPO (or even new) Lexus. Based on OP's comments and amount of driving.

Now, I myself have a 2005 Honda Pilot, but only 64000 miles, so I am partial to keeping it :P :P however mine is a nice pearl black on black rims, so it has a 'Terminator' blacked out look to it, so I think it's "cool" .. but when I see old dirty standard-issue Pilots on the road, I agree with you, they can be very boring if not soccer mom-ish.

I also have a new work car, so I guess I am somewhat biased. However, prior to getting the work vehicle this year, I was going to ride out the Pilot till death. Now the lady drives it to work.
"The best life hack of all is to just put the work in and never give up." Bas Rutten

Topic Author
SilverDollars
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Re: Who else hates choosing a car?

Post by SilverDollars » Sun Apr 24, 2016 10:30 am

SilverDollars wrote:When it comes to the car you drive, where do you all draw the line in the battle between enjoying your car, and the car that makes the most financial sense?

Obviously there are a ton of factors, including, but not limited to:

- Fuel Efficiency
- Safety
- What your commute looks like
- How much space/size you need
- Weather where you live
- Cost

I currently drive a 2005 Honda Pilot. It was formerly the "family car", with 3 young children who didn't exactly keep the car squeaky clean (I tend to keep my car clean).

Pros:
- Great in the snow (I live in CT)
- Plenty of space (room for 8, or large furniture)
- I don't feel like a runt on the road in an SUV
- It's a Honda, has 150K miles, runs awesome and always has, maintenance is minimal

Cons:
- Condition: 10 years old now, 150K miles, and a little older than it should be in terms of wear/tear as a result of being a family/kid car for 7 years.
- 150k miles. I've had no issues (knocking on wood), but the odds aren't great that it will get 180, 200, 225 without some larger issues.
- Poor gas mileage. While we have horrific Winters here, that only accounts for 25% of the year. The other 75% I am getting 17 MPG
- Zero curbside appeal. As a 10 year old car, and a family SUV, there are times where I am not proud to be seen in it with peers, co-workers.

I know the last item above may irk some ... but that is what I want to ask here: Does everyone drive a used Corolla with 200K miles on it since that is the most financially smart move? Or do some of you really care about enjoying your driving experience? I spend anywhere from 2 to 3 hours per day commuting (30 miles each way, can be bad traffic). I cancelled XM Radio to save some money, but I'm sick of my in car options. My wife's newer family vehicle has a back-up camera, which I think is fantastic. My car is the "beater" among my peers at work.

I have found myself longing for a nicer car the last 8-12 months, but every time I look at cars, there seems to be no such thing as an affordable luxury car with the fancy interior, low costs on service/maintenance, great gas mileage, and AWD in the winter. Some cars capture some of those (Subaru, for example), but I don't have interest in them aesthetically. The cars I like aesthetically are not practical (Audi, BMW, Lexus), especially in terms of reliability and maintenance costs.

I can probably drive this thing for another 2-3 years ... continue getting 17 MPG (hundreds of dollars per month more than smaller sedans in gas) and pay minor maintenance, lower insurance, and so forth. But man, it would be nice to enjoy my ride to and from work every day.

One car I considered was the newer 2014 Honda Accord Hybrid. It's boring looking ... but it does get 47 MPG (supposedly). That right there would be a $2500 per year gas savings.

How do you all handle this?
So almost 2 more years have gone by since I wrote this originally ... and I am still driving the same 2005 Pilot. Still runs great, and now has about 175K miles on it. So if nothing else, I have spent two more years spending the minimum to own a vehicle (low insurance because it's old, low property tax on the car because it's old, and I've only had to replace tires and break pads).

I had always said I was looking for a car that didn't really exist, I wanted AWD, plus gas mileage, plus style. Cars like the Subaru met several of the requirements, but not the style (and they are notoriously a small fit inside for a lrger guy like me). Lexus style didn't sell me either. Cars like the Audi meet most of the requirements, except the fact they are very expensive to maintain and not very good on fuel.

So ... I actually found a car I think I like. The Tesla Model 3. Has the AWD option, EV so the fuel efficiency is off the charts, very minimal maintenance costs without the combustion engine, and has the style. I would have to wait until likely early 2018 to get one as they will be backed up for a while ... and that gives me motivation to try to stretch my ownership of this Pilot out to 14 years by that time, making it a very low TCO over that period for the 28K I paid for it.

I put down a $1K deposit with Tesla, and it's refundable if I decide later I changed my mind. Tesla cars do have some problems ... especially the newer Model X, so if the same situation is happening with the 3, I may back out. I also will want to see it and sit in it before I buy it. But for the first time, I see a car I like for all of the right reasons, and not compromising on areas I care about.

amd2135
Posts: 201
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Re: Who else hates choosing a car?

Post by amd2135 » Sun Apr 24, 2016 11:18 am

I agree that the Model 3 is a very attractive vehicle from many angles. I'm saving to buy one or something similar about 8-10 years from now.

Until then, I've got my Mazda6. It's a safe, reliable vehicle I love to drive even just for the sake of driving. It gets great gas mileage (33 mpg for me at worst). I swap winter tires on when there's snow and I get around better than I did in my old 4WD GMC Envoy (with all seasons). It's a great vehicle.

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