LED bulb prices

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madbrain
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LED bulb prices

Post by madbrain »

I got no response in the "LED bulbs" thread last week, so I'm reposting this
madbrain wrote: I have about 10-20 CFLs out of my 230+ that failed early (at about 2.5 years) . These are R30 and R40 types (flood lights) that were putting out between 800 - 1000 lumens.
What's an affordable LED replacement ? I don't need them to be dimmable.
Are there better deals than these ?
http://www.costco.com/Feit-Electric-Dim ... 28843.html
http://www.costco.com/Feit-Electric-Dim ... 28842.html
I was also at a Costco store today in Milpitas.
They had these same bulbs sold individually. The BR30 were $13.69, and BR40 $18.89 .
That is a bit cheaper per bulb than the 4-packs sold online, but still about 3-4 times the price of comparable CFLs.
In my experience in the past at my former home, CFLs lasted about 5-7 years on average. But I had an order of magnitude fewer bulbs than I do now.
At 3-4x the price, the LEDs would have to last at least 20 years. The packages stated 22.8 years. I don't know if they are warrantied for that long.
I didn't buy any LED bulb today. There is still enough light in most rooms even with 20 overall dead bulbs.
I'm on the fence about contacting the manufacturer to get free replacements for the failed CFLs or going to LEDs.
gks
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Re: LED bulb prices

Post by gks »

madbrain,

It's a little apples/oranges, but the Menards site had the following information about those light bulbs. Plug in your electric cost and this should give you a rough cost comparison. I don't know if the lifetime ratings are accurate, and I have read that repeatedly turning fluorescents on and off shortens their life. YMMV.

60 watt incandescent 485 lumens $3.22 4,000 hours
15 watt fluorescent 720 lumens $6.00 6,000 hours
9.8 watt LED 800 lumens $10.97 25,000 hours

Greg

(Please forgive the formatting. It looked better before it was posted)
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noyopacific
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Re: LED bulb prices

Post by noyopacific »

gks wrote:madbrain,
Plug in your electric cost and this should give you a rough cost comparison. I don't know if the lifetime ratings are accurate, and I have read that repeatedly turning fluorescents on and off shortens their life. YMMV.
60 watt incandescent 485 lumens $3.22 4,000 hours
15 watt fluorescent 720 lumens $6.00 6,000 hours
9.8 watt LED 800 lumens $10.97 25,000 hours
Greg
You might want to add in the purchase cost of the bulbs and divide by the number of hours to get an accurate estimate of the cost over time. OP indicates $23.75 for the LED floods, I think I've paid around $5-6 each for exterior CFL flood lights. When you factor in that the LED's MAY last 4X longer than the CFL's it looks like a wash on the life of the bulbs cost assuming the LED's actually last. In my experience, if they work for a week or so, they seem to tend to keep on working, the same as with CFL's.

I use both CFL's and LED's depending on the application. I have been assuming that LED's were probably at least slightly more efficient than CFL's to operate. I am hoping that the prices on LED's will continue to come down. I started replacing some MR16 12 volt halogen track lights with LED's to reduce energy cost, heat, and because the halogens don't seem to tolerate our frequent power surges very well. I was replacing the halogens several times a year. After replacing 5 with LED's, I haven't had to replace any of them again.

One factor I've noticed is that you can't always trust the power consumption and brightness indicated by manufacturers. I like to test a few and see what I like.

I've found some inexpensive LED bulbs on eBay. Most are shipped from China so if there is any problem, I doubt the cost of return shipping would be a practical option. I stick with sellers that have had a large number of transactions (>1,000) and positive ratings of 99% or better. I have had good luck with Chinese vendors. Searching PAR30 LED on eBaby resulted in more than 5,000 returns. If you don't have some experience weeding through eBay listings, it cab be a bother to sift through all of the misleading listings (hint: the 99 cent LED bulbs advertized as PAR30's are not really for PAR30's) here is a $9 PAR30 for $9 delivered from China: http://www.ebay.com/itm/PAR30-104-LED-W ... 19e8b49de3 It appears to be 400 lux so may not be bright enough for your application. Some of the LED bulbs are rather odd looking too.

Good Luck!

Dave
The information contained herein, while not guaranteed by us, has been obtained from from sources which have not in the past proved particularly reliable.
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madbrain
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Re: LED bulb prices

Post by madbrain »

gks wrote:madbrain,

It's a little apples/oranges, but the Menards site had the following information about those light bulbs. Plug in your electric cost and this should give you a rough cost comparison. I don't know if the lifetime ratings are accurate, and I have read that repeatedly turning fluorescents on and off shortens their life. YMMV.

60 watt incandescent 485 lumens $3.22 4,000 hours
15 watt fluorescent 720 lumens $6.00 6,000 hours
9.8 watt LED 800 lumens $10.97 25,000 hours
My electric costs was $57.60 last year due to a solar system. I know the CFL bulbs are efficient enough.

The CFLs I have were FEIT from Costco which currently sells this :

---
BR30 size
http://www.costco.com/Feit-Electric-BR3 ... 29090.html .
These are 750 lumens and use 15W. Life is 9.1 years. They cost $4.08 per bulb (Costco online price).

Vs LED
http://www.costco.com/Feit-Electric-Dim ... 28843.html
These are also 750 lumens and use 13W. Life is 22.8 years. They cost $18.74 per bulb (Costco online price).
That's 4.6 times the cost of the CFL bulb for the same amount of light, with a rated life only 2.5 times.

---

BR40/R40 size
http://www.costco.com/Feit-Electric-R40 ... 29078.html .
These are 1300 lumens and use 23W. Life is 9.1 years. They cost $5 per bulb (Costco online price).

vs

http://www.costco.com/Feit-Electric-Dim ... 28842.html
These are 1065 lumens and use 17W. Life is 22.8 years. They cost $23.74 per bulb (Costco online price).

That's 4.75 times the cost of the CFL bulb for 82% of the light output, with a rated life only 2.5 times.

When buying the bulbs at the Costco store 2.5 years ago, they were being sold net of PG&E rebate, and I think it was slightly less, but it depended on the type of bulb. That may explain why my Costco retail store charges less per bulb than costco.com - but it could also just be the shipping.
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madbrain
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Re: LED bulb prices

Post by madbrain »

noyopacific wrote: In my experience, if they work for a week or so, they seem to tend to keep on working, the same as with CFL's.
Well, for some definition of "keep on working". I have a different experience with CFLs. don't remember ever having a single CFL bulb that failed as early as a week. The life does vary from one bulb to another, even for 2 bulbs of the same make and model, installed on the same day in 2 identical fixtures, plugged to the same electrical circuit, ie. the exact same number of hours put on each bulb, and some number of on/off. I can't really explain why some bulb fails and others don't. It just seems to be a crapshoot. A 10% failure rate at 2.5 years is not horrible if the other 90% of bulbs really last 9 years.
I use both CFL's and LED's depending on the application. I have been assuming that LED's were probably at least slightly more efficient than CFL's to operate. I am hoping that the prices on LED's will continue to come down. I started replacing some MR16 12 volt halogen track lights with LED's to reduce energy cost, heat, and because the halogens don't seem to tolerate our frequent power surges very well. I was replacing the halogens several times a year. After replacing 5 with LED's, I haven't had to replace any of them again.
My current house had halogen bulbs in almost all fixtures when we bought it. When I turned on all the lights in the house, the electrical meter was reading over 8000 watts. One of my first big projects was to replace all the bulbs with CFLs.
I've found some inexpensive LED bulbs on eBay. Most are shipped from China so if there is any problem, I doubt the cost of return shipping would be a practical option. I stick with sellers that have had a large number of transactions (>1,000) and positive ratings of 99% or better. I have had good luck with Chinese vendors. Searching PAR30 LED on eBaby resulted in more than 5,000 returns. If you don't have some experience weeding through eBay listings, it cab be a bother to sift through all of the misleading listings (hint: the 99 cent LED bulbs advertized as PAR30's are not really for PAR30's) here is a $9 PAR30 for $9 delivered from China: http://www.ebay.com/itm/PAR30-104-LED-W ... 19e8b49de3 It appears to be 400 lux so may not be bright enough for your application. Some of the LED bulbs are rather odd looking too.
Dave
I have to admit I didn't think of using Ebay for lightbulbs.

Searching for "BR40 LED" didn't find anything under $19.99 which was more than the store price at Costco which was $18.89 yesterday.
For "BR30 LED" the cheapest is $13.89 . But it's only 700 lumens . Costco retail store price was $13.69 for a 750 lumens.

I guess the types of bulbs I need for my recessed cans cost more, probably because of the higher light output.
rallycobra
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Re: LED bulb prices

Post by rallycobra »

I have had excellent success with Cree bulbs from Home Depot. Additionally, Cree makes the bulbs for the home depot brand 'ecosmart'. The ecosmart bulbs are 1/3 the price of the cree bulb, and when you open the home depot brand box the bulb has 2 labels, one with the cree model number and the other with a home depot ecosmart label. The 2700k bulbs are very soft, just like incandescent.
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runner9
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Re: LED bulb prices

Post by runner9 »

For Cree at HD, haven't tried, but I believe they are made in the USA by a company based near here and get lots of good press.
http://www.homedepot.com/s/cree?NCNI-5

That said, we've looked at switching and decide every time that LEDs still are too expensive. We use these CFLs, and are happy with them. Just $1.24 a piece, can't beat it. (we like the 5000K look, but they also have the more yellow kind) I believe Consumer Reports rated them highly a few years ago, which is why we tried them.

http://www.homedepot.com/p/EcoSmart-60W ... /100687001
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madbrain
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Re: LED bulb prices

Post by madbrain »

rallycobra wrote:I have had excellent success with Cree bulbs from Home Depot. Additionally, Cree makes the bulbs for the home depot brand 'ecosmart'. The ecosmart bulbs are 1/3 the price of the cree bulb, and when you open the home depot brand box the bulb has 2 labels, one with the cree model number and the other with a home depot ecosmart label. The 2700k bulbs are very soft, just like incandescent.
I just looked up the ecosmart bulbs on home depot.

Ecosmart BR30
http://www.homedepot.com/p/EcoSmart-65W ... /203914624
This is 650 lumens. And $19.97 . That's the cost of 4.8 BR30 CFLs at Costco, which put out 750 lumens, or 15% more light.

Ecosmart BR40
http://www.homedepot.com/p/EcoSmart-90W ... /203914616
This is only 900 lumens. And It's $27.97 for one bulb ! That's the cost of 5.6 BR40 CFLs at Costco, which put out 1300 lumens, or 45% more light.
This one BR40 hardly seems worth it, not enough light output regardless of price.
Gecko10x
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Re: LED bulb prices

Post by Gecko10x »

We have been using these for a while in our flood fixtures and are very happy with them: $13 770 Lumen HitLights Afford.
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madbrain
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Re: LED bulb prices

Post by madbrain »

runner9 wrote: That said, we've looked at switching and decide every time that LEDs still are too expensive. We use these CFLs, and are happy with them. Just $1.24 a piece, can't beat it. (we like the 5000K look, but they also have the more yellow kind) I believe Consumer Reports rated them highly a few years ago, which is why we tried them.

http://www.homedepot.com/p/EcoSmart-60W ... /100687001
When I clicked your link it showed a price of $8.97 for that 4-pack, making it $2.24 per bulb, not $1.24.
Still not a bad deal for 800 lumens of light output. But spirals are not appropriate for my recessed cans which are the vasty majority of the 200+ light fixtures.
But I don't mind paying $4 - $5 for CFLs with the right form factor.

Now if the LEDs could come down anywhere close to that range ...
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runner9
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Re: LED bulb prices

Post by runner9 »

Must be based on zip code or something, it's 4.97 both online and at my local store (Ohio)

Understand about recessed cans, was just throwing out what we use in general, we have no recessed cans.
dbr
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Re: LED bulb prices

Post by dbr »

Amazon seems to have competitive pricing on bulbs. If you do enough business there you can justify a prime account with 2-day free shipping.
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madbrain
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Re: LED bulb prices

Post by madbrain »

runner9 wrote:Must be based on zip code or something, it's 4.97 both online and at my local store (Ohio)
Yes, undoubtedly a zip code thing, but this item is in store-only, even per your image.
Understand about recessed cans, was just throwing out what we use in general, we have no recessed cans.
I do have a couple spirals and one went out. They spirals are generally much more affordable than the flood lights needed for recessed cans.
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madbrain
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Re: LED bulb prices

Post by madbrain »

dbr wrote:Amazon seems to have competitive pricing on bulbs. If you do enough business there you can justify a prime account with 2-day free shipping.
A friend added me to their Prime account a few months ago. Just looked up the BR40 there.

http://www.amazon.com/Feit-Electric-Con ... s=BR40+LED
This is the exact same one that was in store at Costco retail store yesterday, except it's $22.83 on Amazon vs $18.89 at Costco retail store.
Same packaging, I took pictures with my cell phone at Costco.

For BR30 LED, the search seems somewhat broken, bringing up lots of non-LED bulbs even if I select the category of "LED bulbs".
I did find this one
http://www.amazon.com/Feit-Electric-Dim ... s=BR30+LED
Same as at Costco, except it's $19.97 on Amazon and was $13.69 at Costco.
blackstone
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Re: LED bulb prices

Post by blackstone »

Here in the north east, nstar is currently offering discounts on the costco bulbs. The BR30 CFLs are $4.99 / 4 pack ( these are not dimmable though). The BR30 leds are $7.99 each ( dimmable & very bright ) while the BR40 leds are $6.99 courtesy nstar.
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englishgirl
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Re: LED bulb prices

Post by englishgirl »

I have been buying the Costco LED bulbs when I need to replace CFLs, as Costco seems to be a good deal on the bulbs. I don't know how one really assesses what the best deal is, as bulb life really does seem to be a crap shoot, so you have no way of knowing how many will really get to the claimed lifetime.

Most of my CFLs are lasting just fine, so I think bulb replacement is going to be a slow process, as I am far too cheap to replace everything all at once. I will say that I was initially worried that mixing LED and CFL bulbs in the same room would look terrible in terms of the light color and bulb shape, but it actually looks fine as long as you don't use them in the same fixture (for example, in a lamp /light fixture with multiple bulbs right next to one another).

So far I've got one dimmable recessed can light in the kitchen. It definitely doesn't dim as smoothly as the CFL, as it flickers at low power. Yes if you look closely at the ceiling you can tell that one bulb looks a bit different, but I really don't notice most of the time. I've got a couple of regular LED bulbs, one in an exterior light and one in a floor lamp indoors. I did also buy some "Tived" LED table lamps from Ikea, so perhaps that has changed the light color in the living room enough that the floor lamp LED bulb fits right in. In my boyfriend's house I put some globe-shaped LED bulbs in the bathrooms and they look awesome.
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Re: LED bulb prices

Post by MnD »

10 bucks for CREE BR30 LED - 50% off.

http://www.homedepot.com/p/Cree-65W-Equ ... =5yc1vZbol
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runner9
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Re: LED bulb prices

Post by runner9 »

MnD wrote:10 bucks for CREE BR30 LED - 50% off.

http://www.homedepot.com/p/Cree-65W-Equ ... =5yc1vZbol
Must be another zip code thing. Your link shows 16.97 each for me, in Ohio.
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jeffyscott
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Re: LED bulb prices

Post by jeffyscott »

englishgirl wrote:I have been buying the Costco LED bulbs when I need to replace CFLs, as Costco seems to be a good deal on the bulbs.
Following the same strategy, may consider other sources for some if necessary.

My first LED purchases were from Menards, but they were too harsh. Learned about color temperature after that. Also learned that some cheaper bulbs are directional even though they are the normal "A" style bulbs, but in some applications these would be better...in overhead bare basement lights for example (which is where stuck the Menards bulbs, rather than return them).
So far I've got one dimmable recessed can light in the kitchen. It definitely doesn't dim as smoothly as the CFL, as it flickers at low power.
That is interesting, our CFLs always seemed to flicker with any dimming at all. Only ever had them in one lamp that had a built in dimmer, though. The LEDs don't dim like an incandescent but do not see any flicker. LEDs just seem more sensitive than incandescent, move the switch a little and light output changes a lot and does not change smoothly and seem to have to go up then down to get them on at lower power.

I even changed the switch for our kitchen cans to a dimmer after changing from CFL to LED (Costco, Feit BR40). This was after seeing that a dimmer worked pretty well on another fixture with "A" style LEDs, where we'd previously used incandescents.
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skatterZ
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Re: LED bulb prices

Post by skatterZ »

When buying expensive bulbs that last 20 years, don't forget most people don't stay in their house 20 years. We are going to either lose these nice bulbs or will have to replace them with something cheaper.and, of course, pack up all those fragile bulbs.
dbr
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Re: LED bulb prices

Post by dbr »

jeffyscott wrote: That is interesting, our CFLs always seemed to flicker with any dimming at all. Only ever had them in one lamp that had a built in dimmer, though. The LEDs don't dim like an incandescent but do not see any flicker. LEDs just seem more sensitive than incandescent, move the switch a little and light output changes a lot and does not change smoothly and seem to have to go up then down to get them on at lower power.

I even changed the switch for our kitchen cans to a dimmer after changing from CFL to LED (Costco, Feit BR40). This was after seeing that a dimmer worked pretty well on another fixture with "A" style LEDs, where we'd previously used incandescents.
It does depend on the dimmer switch and some work way better than others. It is definitely possible to dim LED's between full and nothing with the right switch. An example would be this one:

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B004DZ ... UTF8&psc=1

This is not a recommendation for this switch or a recommendation to buy at Amazon, but rather for information. The key technical feature is that the switch has an adjustment for the lowest setting that can be used to dial in the low level for the bulb you are using whether CFL or LED. You can see the adjustment paddle in the lower left hand corner of the switch. It should still be remembered that neither CFL nor LED change color spectrum with dimming so that incandescent effect is still not achieved.
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madbrain
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Re: LED bulb prices

Post by madbrain »

runner9 wrote:
MnD wrote:10 bucks for CREE BR30 LED - 50% off.

http://www.homedepot.com/p/Cree-65W-Equ ... =5yc1vZbol
Must be another zip code thing. Your link shows 16.97 each for me, in Ohio.
My browser is showing $19.97 for these !
I wonder if this is due to gouging by zip code going by Home Depot, or if there are some local utility rebates in play.
swaption
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Re: LED bulb prices

Post by swaption »

I needed Par 30 short neck to replace Halogens in my kitchen. Very hard to find a cost effective replacement. But finally found a new brand Sunsun at a site Earth LED. Apparently a new Chinese company funded by some venture capital money. Really nice bulbs, and dim much better than other CREE bulbs I have. Will order some BR 30 bulbs as well. There is a bulk discount.
PS241
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Re: LED bulb prices

Post by PS241 »

I have been buying Philips 423798 LED bulbs on amazon. Look to be a little more expensive than the ones your suggesting, but I am very happy with the quality of color and distribution of light from them.
programmer
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Re: LED bulb prices

Post by programmer »

I go with Cree.
Light bulb geek video of the build of their regular bulbs:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n6DDFRBrSas

I'd bet that the floods are made equally well. I have one of their floods operating 24x7 for around a year now.
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GerryL
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Re: LED bulb prices

Post by GerryL »

I'm gradually switching over to LEDs. Never really liked the CFLs in many situations. And the LED prices are coming down. When my brother had his remodel done a couple of years ago, he was paying about $70 each for LED ceiling cans. When my remodel was being planned a little over a year ago the contractor told me they'd be about $50 each. When I went out shopping, the ones at Home Depot had just been put out on the shelf for under $25 each. Less than a year later I am finding them for under $20. Loving my LEDs. (The ones in the kitchen are can inserts with built-in light diffuser.)
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Re: LED bulb prices

Post by Slowmaha »

I just bought 11 of the Phillips R30s from amazon. The light is still a touch whiter than the incandents but nothing i can't get used to. They are 13W vs 75W. Over the nearly decade advertised lifespan my breakeven is supposedly about 6 months. I suspect it will probably be more like a year but my wife is home all day and she likes to leave the lights on. Either way I'm confident it was a good investment.
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serbeer
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Re: LED bulb prices

Post by serbeer »

Just purchased 4 (40W-equivalent) LED bulbs at less than $3.50 per bulb with tax and free shipping from Staples:
http://dealnews.com/Brighton-Profession ... 97920.html

I am nearly done with converting all my regular light bulbs in the house to LEDs, including ones on driveway and garage. On average, 40W equivalents were $3-4 from various sales, and 60W equivalents were $5-6 each.

The problem is, 30-40% in the house are halogen GU-10 fixtures, and the ones in the basement are tube bulbs so cannot do much about those...
Keep It Simple
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Re: LED bulb prices

Post by Keep It Simple »

I'm surprised no one has mentioned the GE led bulbs released last year in the Walmart and Sams Club stores. Their price is a few dollars less than the equivalent Cree bulb and it is made by one of the most reliable brands in the business. Anyone have any experience with these?

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Re: LED bulb prices

Post by Easy Rhino »

Our house has a ton of recessed can lights (around 30), all BR30. And almost all are on dimmer switches.

i'd be okay with CFLs, except dimmable CFLs seem to be quite expensive. Approaching LED level price. Anyone seen a good deal on them?

Otherwise I'm looking at LEDs. Which I'd probably have to buy en masse so price is important.
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Re: LED bulb prices

Post by Valuethinker »

Easy Rhino wrote:Our house has a ton of recessed can lights (around 30), all BR30. And almost all are on dimmer switches.

i'd be okay with CFLs, except dimmable CFLs seem to be quite expensive. Approaching LED level price. Anyone seen a good deal on them?

Otherwise I'm looking at LEDs. Which I'd probably have to buy en masse so price is important.
If LEDs have cracked the dimmer switch problem I predict you will be far happier with LEDs. Buy 1 from each of 2-3 different brands and try them out.

Even paying USD 30 a pop, I figured payback in less than 2 years (over halogens). My electricity price is high by your standards though (about 23 cents/ kwhr).
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frugaltype
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Re: LED bulb prices

Post by frugaltype »

madbrain wrote: I have about 10-20 CFLs out of my 230+ that failed early (at about 2.5 years) .
Unable to resist asking, how big is your house? I just did a rough estimate, and I have twelve light bulbs upstairs (two bedrooms, one small office, attic, bathroom), twelve downstairs (living/dining room, bedroom, entryway, bathroom, laundry closet.) I guess I should count the garage (four), and outside lights (six). One in the crawl space. For a total of 35. Total house area is about 1200 sq ft.

Update: I have found Phillips incandescent light bulbs to be fairly undependable. They burn out quickly. Also they are the only bulbs that have ever broken off in a socket when I tried to remove them.
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madbrain
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Re: LED bulb prices

Post by madbrain »

frugaltype wrote:
madbrain wrote: I have about 10-20 CFLs out of my 230+ that failed early (at about 2.5 years) .
Unable to resist asking, how big is your house? I just did a rough estimate, and I have twelve light bulbs upstairs (two bedrooms, one small office, attic, bathroom), twelve downstairs (living/dining room, bedroom, entryway, bathroom, laundry closet.) I guess I should count the garage (four), and outside lights (six). One in the crawl space. For a total of 35. Total house area is about 1200 sq ft.

Update: I have found Phillips incandescent light bulbs to be fairly undependable. They burn out quickly. Also they are the only bulbs that have ever broken off in a socket when I tried to remove them.
It's a bit over 4600 sq ft. The 230 bulbs include some fixtures outside on the 2 balconies and porch, patio and the garage. All bulbs were replaced around October 2010 when we moved in.
That's how I know the count. There are also 97 switches, many on 3/4 way setups. Most were dimmers which we took out because they didn't work with CFLs (not even so-called "dimmable CFLs") and put in "vacancy sensor" switches which turn off lights automatically after 30 mins if no motion is detected.

I'm still on the fence about replacing any of the failed bulbs with LEDs yet.
If I could buy the LEDs for $10 like Home depot seems to sell in some localities, I would get LEDs.
But not at $20 a bulb in the quantities I need. The prices are still too high.
I will probably contact FEIT and have them replace the CFLs that failed early, until the LED prices drop some more.
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Re: LED bulb prices

Post by cherijoh »

madbrain wrote:
runner9 wrote:
MnD wrote:10 bucks for CREE BR30 LED - 50% off.

http://www.homedepot.com/p/Cree-65W-Equ ... =5yc1vZbol
Must be another zip code thing. Your link shows 16.97 each for me, in Ohio.
My browser is showing $19.97 for these !
I wonder if this is due to gouging by zip code going by Home Depot, or if there are some local utility rebates in play.
I think the local utility rebate is a real possibility. In my area, Duke Energy has been really putting out the stops to get customers to use more efficient light bulbs - going as far as to send out coupons with our bill for bulbs at retail stores like Home Depot or a link to a website where you could order free compact fluorescent bulbs. I haven't seen similar activity for LEDs though.
swaption
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Re: LED bulb prices

Post by swaption »

serbeer wrote:Just purchased 4 (40W-equivalent) LED bulbs at less than $3.50 per bulb with tax and free shipping from Staples:
http://dealnews.com/Brighton-Profession ... 97920.html
Thanks for this. Out of stock online, but have few pack on hold at my local store. Sale ends today. Not dimmable, but still a few places where this will work. Find me a similar sale for dimmable BR30 bulbs, and then I'm backing up the truck...
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serbeer
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Re: LED bulb prices

Post by serbeer »

swaption wrote:
serbeer wrote:Just purchased 4 (40W-equivalent) LED bulbs at less than $3.50 per bulb with tax and free shipping from Staples:
http://dealnews.com/Brighton-Profession ... 97920.html
Thanks for this. Out of stock online, but have few pack on hold at my local store. Sale ends today. Not dimmable, but still a few places where this will work. Find me a similar sale for dimmable BR30 bulbs, and then I'm backing up the truck...
The cheapest BR30s LEDs I've seen on sale were $12 still. Was in Best Buy btw.
Valuethinker
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Re: LED bulb prices

Post by Valuethinker »

madbrain wrote:
frugaltype wrote:
madbrain wrote: I have about 10-20 CFLs out of my 230+ that failed early (at about 2.5 years) .
Unable to resist asking, how big is your house? I just did a rough estimate, and I have twelve light bulbs upstairs (two bedrooms, one small office, attic, bathroom), twelve downstairs (living/dining room, bedroom, entryway, bathroom, laundry closet.) I guess I should count the garage (four), and outside lights (six). One in the crawl space. For a total of 35. Total house area is about 1200 sq ft.

Update: I have found Phillips incandescent light bulbs to be fairly undependable. They burn out quickly. Also they are the only bulbs that have ever broken off in a socket when I tried to remove them.
It's a bit over 4600 sq ft. The 230 bulbs include some fixtures outside on the 2 balconies and porch, patio and the garage. All bulbs were replaced around October 2010 when we moved in.
That's how I know the count. There are also 97 switches, many on 3/4 way setups. Most were dimmers which we took out because they didn't work with CFLs (not even so-called "dimmable CFLs") and put in "vacancy sensor" switches which turn off lights automatically after 30 mins if no motion is detected.

I'm still on the fence about replacing any of the failed bulbs with LEDs yet.
If I could buy the LEDs for $10 like Home depot seems to sell in some localities, I would get LEDs.
But not at $20 a bulb in the quantities I need. The prices are still too high.
I will probably contact FEIT and have them replace the CFLs that failed early, until the LED prices drop some more.
Since I view replacing lightbulbs as a horrible and unpleasant thing to do (depending upon location) or at the very least, annoying, in your shoes I'd probably go for LEDs. On the grounds that *eventually* they would pay off. As long as I wasn't cash constrained.

Given how many bulbs you have yes in the future the prices will be lower, but you will be able to use cheaper LEDs to replace those bulbs, too, when the time comes.

I realize that's not entirely economically rational, but I would value the hassle factor as significant. Plus the subjective improvement in light quality.
dbr
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Re: LED bulb prices

Post by dbr »

Valuethinker wrote: Since I view replacing lightbulbs as a horrible and unpleasant thing to do (depending upon location) or at the very least, annoying, in your shoes I'd probably go for LEDs. On the grounds that *eventually* they would pay off. As long as I wasn't cash constrained.

Given how many bulbs you have yes in the future the prices will be lower, but you will be able to use cheaper LEDs to replace those bulbs, too, when the time comes.

I realize that's not entirely economically rational, but I would value the hassle factor as significant. Plus the subjective improvement in light quality.
My whole venture into LED bulbs this year was provoked by needing to replace "that" bulb that is located so that mountaineering skill is needed to deal with it no matter what variety of ladders are available to help. So I was able to find a dimmable, enclosable, sufficiently bright, acceptable color appearance bulb that will not have to be changed out for years, at least hopefully. I would pay any reasonable price for that, but actually did just fine with the bulb I found. The other thing I accomplished was getting rid of every last d--d CFL bulb in the house, including tubes in fixtures. For these advantages cost is not the major consideration.
Angelus359
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Re: LED bulb prices

Post by Angelus359 »

Ignoring cost, I found my LED bulbs (I forgot which brand) to be a nicer and cleaner light than what I have found in CFLs
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madbrain
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Re: LED bulb prices

Post by madbrain »

I bought 4 BR30 bulbs at Costco yesterday. The model is BPCEBR30/927/LED . They are FEIT Electric / Conserv-Energy, made in China. Costco item 823920 .
Sold individually, UPC bar code 0 17801 43511 5 . They consume 13W, and light output is 750 lumens. 2700K color temperature.

They are rated for 25,000 hours which they claim is 22.8 hours at 3 hours/day. They only have a 5 year warranty, which is equivalent to 13.6 hours per day for those 5 years. These were $12.99 each, less $3 PG&E utility rebate for each, which came to $44.51 for the set of 4 after the 8.75% sales tax. Costco charged tax on the pre-rebate price, sadly.

I marked the date on each bulb. I hope they last longer than the 3.5 year old FEIT CFLs they replaced. The reviews of the very similar bulb below (sold in 4-pack) are fairly negative for longevity. I am scanning my Costco receipt and saving it with the rest of my documents in case I have to make a warranty claim later.
http://www.costco.com/Feit-Electric-Dim ... reId=10301

I have learned that the California Energy Commission has set has a higher standard on LED bulbs than other states. It is called the "Voluntary California Quality LED Lamp Specification". Only bulbs that meet those specs are eligible for utility rebates in California.
See http://www.gc-lighting.com/led-education/cec/ . These specs requires a minimum color rendering index (CRI) of 90, among other things.

The reason why I couldn't find rebated bulbs earlier appears to be that there were no bulbs available that met those specs yet. But now the BR30 at Costco meet this standard, and have the instant rebate.

I had left these 4 R30 recessed cans dark for a while, I don't remember exactly when they failed. The hallways look brighter now, and these bulbs come on instantly. After a couple of minutes once all the older CFLs next to the LEDs reach max brightness, it becomes very hard to tell one which one is which.

I have many dark R40 cans, though, I think about 8 between the master bedroom and living room. The BR40 bulbs weren't for sale at Costco yesterday. Hopefully the rebated bulbs will come out soon.
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bottlecap
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Re: LED bulb prices

Post by bottlecap »

noyopacific wrote:In my experience, if they work for a week or so, they seem to tend to keep on working, the same as with CFL's.
I've probably had a 15 or 20% failure rate with CFLs, but they usually last about a year before quitting.

I just replaced 2 one year old bulbs and 1 two year old bulbs with the Costco brand. Hoping for better results there - we'll see.

JT
lightheir
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Re: LED bulb prices

Post by lightheir »

I don't have any LED bulbs yet, but I will say that there are about 5 hard-to-reach halogen bulbs in my home that I would gladly pay $100/bulb for a long-lasting LED replacement so I would never have to climb up there again. Unfortunately, they don't seem to make an LED in the size of the halogen bulb I need.
Valuethinker
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Re: LED bulb prices

Post by Valuethinker »

bottlecap wrote:
noyopacific wrote:In my experience, if they work for a week or so, they seem to tend to keep on working, the same as with CFL's.
I've probably had a 15 or 20% failure rate with CFLs, but they usually last about a year before quitting.

I just replaced 2 one year old bulbs and 1 two year old bulbs with the Costco brand. Hoping for better results there - we'll see.

JT
I suspect it is a different sort of problem.

LEDs are the 'bathtub curve' all electronic components follow-- unreliable if there is a (statistical) manufacturing flaw, then last a very long time.

CFLs the life seems to be partly determined by outside temperature and by how many times they are turned on/ off.

As I have said elsewhere in these threads, in 5 years I reckon CFLs will be a niche technology only-- 90% of everything will be LEDs.
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Re: LED bulb prices

Post by Jack FFR1846 »

My house has been a museum of lighting for years. I bought my first Philips cfl with a coupon in the mid 80's for $27 or so. As with any cfl, it starts very bright white and slowly dims and yellows with time and use. It made its way to my garage into a work light. It then met its untimely demise aroung 2005 when I dropped the light, breaking it. 30 years isn't bad. Other bulbs throughout the house are totated into the basement or garage as they dim with age.

These days, I try to go LED for replacement as they interfere less with each other on the same circuit, are smaller and should last longer. If I just want basement or garage lights, I get discontinued multipacks at Lowes or Home Depot for well under $1 per bulb. I think the last one I bought was a pack of 10 for $2.95. Usually 2 out of the 10 don't work right out of the box.

LED bulbs at Lowes seem to always be available for under $10.
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WhyNotUs
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Re: LED bulb prices

Post by WhyNotUs »

I bought a 4 pack of felt LED floods at Lowes a couple months ago for $50. Utility gave me rebate for 50% so net was $6.25. They fit in the track fixtures that I had, are dimmable and, are in the 2700-3000 k range that I like. So far, so good. It will take 20 years to know whether they will last.
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kcb203
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Re: LED bulb prices

Post by kcb203 »

I figure in a couple years, LED prices will be much lower so it doesn't pay to replace incandescent or CFL with LED yet. Even though the long-term payback is there now, the ROI will be even greater in a couple years.
wesef
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Re: LED bulb prices

Post by wesef »

Dimmable BR30 LEDs were on sale for about $5 each at my Costco a few days ago.
Angelus359
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Re: LED bulb prices

Post by Angelus359 »

kcb203 wrote:I figure in a couple years, LED prices will be much lower so it doesn't pay to replace incandescent or CFL with LED yet. Even though the long-term payback is there now, the ROI will be even greater in a couple years.
Even given that, if a bulb burns out, I still think it's better to replace it with LED.

Replace them as they burn out.
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WhyNotUs
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Re: LED bulb prices

Post by WhyNotUs »

If you primary concern is cost-benefit, CFLs will probably make the most sense for a while.
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Easy Rhino
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Re: LED bulb prices

Post by Easy Rhino »

wesef wrote:Dimmable BR30 LEDs were on sale for about $5 each at my Costco a few days ago.
Serious? I just installed 20 br30s that I thought we're a good deal at almost $11 each /groan
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