Living with Windows 8

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tadamsmar
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Living with Windows 8

Post by tadamsmar » Thu Feb 20, 2014 9:47 am

I bought an HP computer with Windows 8. I discovered that the hardware might not be compatible with Windows 7, so I decided to stick it out. In particular, I needed to make it easier for my wife to use.

Here are a few pointers for dealing with Windows 8:

1. I upgraded to Windows 8.1 immediately. It's suppose to be more desktop user friendly

2. Configure it to boot to the desktop, that is tip 2 here:

http://howto.cnet.com/8301-11310_39-576 ... ng-tweaks/

3. You will still sometimes have trouble finding the desktop. I posted this list of ways to get the the desktop on
your computer:

Ways to get back to the desktop:
1. the Windows button on the keypad once or twice (Assuming you have a Windows button)
2. Alt-F4
3. Click in the upper left corner of the screen

The obvious way to get back is to hit the Windows button in the lower left corner of the screen, but that does not always work, and the button may or may not be there easy to find.

4. If you buy Window apps like Office 2013, they will not show up as icons on the desktop. You need to find them on the apps display (so you will need to find the apps display). It is possible to make them show up on the Desktop task bar at the bottom, but I still can't get them to show up as icons on the desktop.

5. If you open a PDF file, it's not clear how to close it, no X in the corner of the window, you have to use Alt-F4. You can download the Adobe PDF reader that works just like it does on XP. In general, you might want to find substitutes for the default apps. But then, you might like the features of the default apps, and I suppose security might be better if you stick with the default apps. You have to hit the Windows button to get to the Metro display, and then hit a down arrow to get to the apps display.

6. For security, set up one admin account and set up non-admin accounts for everyday work. You have to use a Window Store password as the password fro your admin account, no way around it as far as I can tell.

But some of you may have better ideas about how the make Window 8 more tolerable.

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iceport
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Re: Living with Windows 8

Post by iceport » Thu Feb 20, 2014 10:12 am

Tolerable? I find it thoroughly enjoyable!

Have you tried Classic Shell?
tadamsmar wrote:I bought an HP computer with Windows 8. I discovered that the hardware might not be compatible with Windows 7, so I decided to stick it out. I particular, I needed to make it easier for my wife to use.

Here are a few pointers for dealing with Windows 8:

1. I upgraded to Windows 8.1 immediately. It's suppose to be more desktop user friendly. Well, it gets you #2...

2. Configure it to boot to the desktop, that is tip 2 here:

http://howto.cnet.com/8301-11310_39-576 ... ng-tweaks/

YES!

3. You will still sometimes have trouble finding the desktop. I posted this list of ways to get the the desktop on
your computer:

Ways to get back to the desktop:
1. the Windows button on the keypad once or twice (Assuming you have a Windows button)
2. Alt-F4
3. Click in the upper left corner of the screen
4. Windows Key + "D"
5. Right-click the Classic Shell start button and select "Desktop"
6. Right-click the taskbar and select "show the desktop"


4. If you buy Window apps like Office 2013, they will not show up as icons on the desktop. You need to find them on the apps display (so you will need to find the apps display). It is possible to make them show up on the Desktop task bar at the bottom, but I still can't get them to show up as icons on the desktop. So install Classic Shell and drag the shortcuts from the start button to the desktop, if you must.

5. If you open a PDF file, it's not clear how to close it, no X in the corner of the window, you have to use Alt-F4. Or, you can place the cursor near the top middle of the screen, then click and drag with the "hand" icon towards the bottom of the screen, which "throws away" the window/app. Or you can use the hot corner navigation to open the side bar, then right-click and close the app. You can download the Adobe PDF reader that works just like it does on XP. Yes. In general, you might want to find substitutes for the default apps. But then, you might like the features of the default apps, and I suppose security might be better if you stick with the default apps. You have to hit the Windows button to get to the Metro display, and then hit a down arrow to get to the apps display.

6. For security, set up one admin account and set up non-admin accounts for everyday work. You have to use a Window Store password as the password fro your admin account, no way around it as far as I can tell. So far, I've only set up an admin account, and the password is my own. (Not sure what a "Window Store password" is.)

But some of you may have better ideas about how the make Window 8 more tolerable.
I now operate my Windows 8.1 OS almost exactly like I operated Windows XP Pro. I rarely -- if ever -- find the need to open a Metro app, so I have no need to ever see the Metro Start page unless I'm curious. You can set program defaults to use the desktop versions, if available. So sure, by all means download the latest desktop version PDF viewer you like and set that to be the default.

--Peter
"Discipline matters more than allocation.” ─William Bernstein

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vectorizer
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Re: Living with Windows 8

Post by vectorizer » Thu Feb 20, 2014 10:19 am

I use the free Classic Shell to make Win8 seem very much like Win7 , including booting directly to desktop even with 8.0. Configuration just takes a couple clicks.

Wife is comfortable with it, which is a good test because she has even less tolerance of learning new PC stuff than I do. We never have to use the new style "apps".

For PDFs, I installed the free Foxit reader, then associate PDF files with that desktop app instead of the built-in new style PDF reader.

Classic Shell would good also for people who should move off of XP to Win7 or 8, because there are options for making the Start button and menus work like XP.

[There are several alternatives for the two installable tools I mentioned.]

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Re: Living with Windows 8

Post by sreynard » Thu Feb 20, 2014 1:33 pm

No thanks

Jack FFR1846
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Re: Living with Windows 8

Post by Jack FFR1846 » Thu Feb 20, 2014 1:37 pm

Format disk.

Load windows 7

Everybody happy
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sls239
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Re: Living with Windows 8

Post by sls239 » Thu Feb 20, 2014 1:43 pm

I think you have 2 options:

1) Put a lot of effort in trying to avoid the Metro interface
2) Take the time to customize the Metro interface so that it is useful to you

I'll agree the Microsoft screwed it up a little by putting their own "reader" standard instead of Adobe's, but it isn't like Apple and Adobe cooperate so well either is it? They are competitors.

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G-Money
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Re: Living with Windows 8

Post by G-Money » Thu Feb 20, 2014 1:55 pm

tadamsmar wrote:Here are a few pointers for dealing with Windows 8:

. . .

But some of you may have better ideas about how the make Window 8 more tolerable.
Well, there's always:

7. Buy a Mac. :)
Don't assume I know what I'm talking about.

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tadamsmar
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Re: Living with Windows 8

Post by tadamsmar » Thu Feb 20, 2014 2:01 pm

sls239 wrote:I think you have 2 options:

1) Put a lot of effort in trying to avoid the Metro interface
2) Take the time to customize the Metro interface so that it is useful to you.
I am mainly trying to keep my wife happy at this point. I don't want to have to maintain a separate Windows 7 system for her, she was making noises in that direction.

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iceport
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Re: Living with Windows 8

Post by iceport » Thu Feb 20, 2014 2:12 pm

sls239 wrote:I think you have 2 options:

1) Put a lot of effort in trying to avoid the Metro interface
2) Take the time to customize the Metro interface so that it is useful to you
I'm confused. What effort does it take to avoid the metro interface? Boot to desktop... use Classic Shell... why would you ever need to see the metro interface if you don't choose to?

--Peter
"Discipline matters more than allocation.” ─William Bernstein

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Re: Living with Windows 8

Post by chaz » Thu Feb 20, 2014 2:14 pm

tadamsmar wrote:
sls239 wrote:I think you have 2 options:

1) Put a lot of effort in trying to avoid the Metro interface
2) Take the time to customize the Metro interface so that it is useful to you.
I am mainly trying to keep my wife happy at this point. I don't want to have to maintain a separate Windows 7 system for her, she was making noises in that direction.
Do keep your wife happy. Put 7 on the computer. Or wait for 9.
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tadamsmar
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Re: Living with Windows 8

Post by tadamsmar » Thu Feb 20, 2014 2:25 pm

chaz wrote:
tadamsmar wrote:
sls239 wrote:I think you have 2 options:

1) Put a lot of effort in trying to avoid the Metro interface
2) Take the time to customize the Metro interface so that it is useful to you.
I am mainly trying to keep my wife happy at this point. I don't want to have to maintain a separate Windows 7 system for her, she was making noises in that direction.
Do keep your wife happy. Put 7 on the computer. Or wait for 9.
In the OP I said that I have a new HP and the HP hardware is not Windows 7 compatible. So it's not that easy. I looked into that early on.

I am not going to stay with XP, that involves risks and legal compliance issues.

But she is already using Window 8.1 for her consulting work. So I think we are over the hump. Part of it is just a bit of learning and getting use to something that is different.
Last edited by tadamsmar on Thu Feb 20, 2014 2:27 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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iceport
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Re: Living with Windows 8

Post by iceport » Thu Feb 20, 2014 2:26 pm

tadamsmar wrote:I am mainly trying to keep my wife happy at this point. I don't want to have to maintain a separate Windows 7 system for her, she was making noises in that direction.
I've never seen so many intelligent people expend so much time and energy avoiding simple solutions...

--Peter
"Discipline matters more than allocation.” ─William Bernstein

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tadamsmar
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Re: Living with Windows 8

Post by tadamsmar » Thu Feb 20, 2014 2:29 pm

petrico wrote:
tadamsmar wrote:I am mainly trying to keep my wife happy at this point. I don't want to have to maintain a separate Windows 7 system for her, she was making noises in that direction.
I've never seen so many intelligent people expend so much time and energy avoiding simple solutions...

--Peter
You mean the Classic Shell?

Not sure what you mean by simple solutions that I am avoiding?

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Re: Living with Windows 8

Post by Quickfoot » Thu Feb 20, 2014 2:31 pm

I actually liked Windows 8 better than 8.1. Windows 8 is not hard to use, just a little different.

If you really want the start menu just install classic start menu (it's a free download).

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Re: Living with Windows 8

Post by iceport » Thu Feb 20, 2014 2:46 pm

tadamsmar wrote:
petrico wrote:
tadamsmar wrote:I am mainly trying to keep my wife happy at this point. I don't want to have to maintain a separate Windows 7 system for her, she was making noises in that direction.
I've never seen so many intelligent people expend so much time and energy avoiding simple solutions...

--Peter
You mean the Classic Shell?

Not sure what you mean by simple solutions that I am avoiding?
I guess Classic Shell in part. (Have you even tried it? Less than 5 MB, free, and installs in a flash.)

Maybe you all are using your computers differently than me, I just don't know.

All I do know is that with a few settings changes, my daily experience with Windows 8.1 is nearly identical to my interactions with Windows XP, so I guess I'm lost. I installed Adobe and made that my default PDF reader, so I guess I didn't have that metro reader problem. The ribbon at the top of file explorer? That's just like the newer Office products, so that's not an issue. I installed a start button and set it to look exactly like my old XP start button menu -- and all installed programs show up on it -- so that's no longer an issue. I don't use social networking apps, so maybe those are taking you to the metro mode? I don't get it.

Seriously, tadamsmar, there's only a very rare reminder that I'm not using Windows XP, and usually it's a good thing. I quite honestly don't know why you would ever need to see the metro interface routinely unless you want to.

--Peter
"Discipline matters more than allocation.” ─William Bernstein

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tadamsmar
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Re: Living with Windows 8

Post by tadamsmar » Thu Feb 20, 2014 2:54 pm

petrico wrote:
tadamsmar wrote:
petrico wrote:
tadamsmar wrote:I am mainly trying to keep my wife happy at this point. I don't want to have to maintain a separate Windows 7 system for her, she was making noises in that direction.
I've never seen so many intelligent people expend so much time and energy avoiding simple solutions...

--Peter
You mean the Classic Shell?

Not sure what you mean by simple solutions that I am avoiding?
I guess Classic Shell in part. (Have you even tried it? Less than 5 MB, free, and installs in a flash.)

Maybe you all are using your computers differently than me, I just don't know.

All I do know is that with a few settings changes, my daily experience with Windows 8.1 is nearly identical to my interactions with Windows XP, so I guess I'm lost. I installed Adobe and made that my default PDF reader, so I guess I didn't have that metro reader problem. The ribbon at the top of file explorer? That's just like the newer Office products, so that's not an issue. I installed a start button and set it to look exactly like my old XP start button menu -- and all installed programs show up on it -- so that's no longer an issue. I don't use social networking apps, so maybe those are taking you to the metro mode? I don't get it.

Seriously, tadamsmar, there's only a very rare reminder that I'm not using Windows XP, and usually it's a good thing. I quite honestly don't know why you would ever need to see the metro interface routinely unless you want to.

--Peter
From my perspective, you are debating some sort of imagined straw man that is not me.

All I did was start a tread to share ideas about making it easier to go from XP to Windows 8. Do you think that it's all so simple and obvious that a thread on how to do it is somehow excessive?

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Re: Living with Windows 8

Post by abuss368 » Thu Feb 20, 2014 3:08 pm

G-Money wrote:
tadamsmar wrote:Here are a few pointers for dealing with Windows 8:

. . .

But some of you may have better ideas about how the make Window 8 more tolerable.
Well, there's always:

7. Buy a Mac. :)
Indeed.
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iceport
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Re: Living with Windows 8

Post by iceport » Thu Feb 20, 2014 3:10 pm

tadamsmar wrote:
petrico wrote:
tadamsmar wrote:
petrico wrote:
tadamsmar wrote:I am mainly trying to keep my wife happy at this point. I don't want to have to maintain a separate Windows 7 system for her, she was making noises in that direction.
I've never seen so many intelligent people expend so much time and energy avoiding simple solutions...

--Peter
You mean the Classic Shell?

Not sure what you mean by simple solutions that I am avoiding?
I guess Classic Shell in part. (Have you even tried it? Less than 5 MB, free, and installs in a flash.)

Maybe you all are using your computers differently than me, I just don't know.

All I do know is that with a few settings changes, my daily experience with Windows 8.1 is nearly identical to my interactions with Windows XP, so I guess I'm lost. I installed Adobe and made that my default PDF reader, so I guess I didn't have that metro reader problem. The ribbon at the top of file explorer? That's just like the newer Office products, so that's not an issue. I installed a start button and set it to look exactly like my old XP start button menu -- and all installed programs show up on it -- so that's no longer an issue. I don't use social networking apps, so maybe those are taking you to the metro mode? I don't get it.

Seriously, tadamsmar, there's only a very rare reminder that I'm not using Windows XP, and usually it's a good thing. I quite honestly don't know why you would ever need to see the metro interface routinely unless you want to.

--Peter
From my perspective, you are debating some sort of imagined straw man that is not me.

All I did was start a tread to share ideas about making it easier to go from XP to Windows 8. Do you think that it's all so simple and obvious that a thread on how to do it is somehow excessive?
Not at all. It's just that the transition seemed unexpectedly easy to me, and I'm no power user but a hopeless creature of habit. So maybe it would help if you provided some specific examples of the difficulties you're encountering.

So far, it seems there are simple solutions to staying in desktop mode, making desktop apps the defaults, and creating start button or desktop shortcuts to all your programs.

Are there any other trouble spots?

--Peter
"Discipline matters more than allocation.” ─William Bernstein

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tadamsmar
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Re: Living with Windows 8

Post by tadamsmar » Thu Feb 20, 2014 3:29 pm

At the moment, the only difficulty that I am encountering is that I sometime get an error message when I sign out of an account. (I set up separate accounts for my wife and I, plus an admin account and a guest account.)

The problem is that the message appears for only a brief moment. I think the content is something about an exception at a particular address, and I have gotten those on XP but on XP they stayed on the screen till I clicked to shut the little window displaying the message. These just go away quickly and I can't take notes on them.

Heck, I might ignore these on my XP system, but since this one is new and under warranty I kind of wanted to look into the issue.

PS: I did not find the transition that easy. I was pretty much blind sided by the new default desktop. I had trouble signing up for the Microsoft account that is needed to have an admin password, I did not get the confirmation email, but that might have been due to a yahoo mail bug. I had trouble locating the free Windows 8.1 update. I kept having trouble getting back to the desktop at first for numerous reasons. I found it hard to locate all the stuff that use to be located under My Computer. I had some difficulty locating apps, but now I have the hang of it. My wife started making noises about wanting a Window 7 computer and I looked into installing Windows 7 on the new HP computer and found that it was not supported, and this blindsided me. I considered selling the new computer and just getting one with Windows 7 but decided that was too much of a hassle. My wife needs desktop with Office for some consulting work, so she can't just abandon the desktop and use a tablet. But I think we are over the hump, I just started the thread more for others than to get help for myself, but I do find some of your suggestions potentially useful.

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Re: Living with Windows 8

Post by iceport » Thu Feb 20, 2014 3:49 pm

Thanks for the explanation, tadamsmar. I guess I had a "heads up" on what to expect and how to address the issues from this forum, and just getting back the start button made me very happy. I did not intend to be argumentative.

On the Microsoft account, you really didn't need one to set up your PC accounts. There's an option (not an obvious one) to use a "local account" so that's what I set up. I want as few connections as possible to the cloud. I did need a Microsoft account to download the windows 8.1 update from the "Store," but an old Hotmail account sufficed, believe it or not!

Hopefully, someone else will have an answer to the message on sign-out. I've never seen it.

--Peter
"Discipline matters more than allocation.” ─William Bernstein

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TimeRunner
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Re: Living with Windows 8

Post by TimeRunner » Thu Feb 20, 2014 4:28 pm

For that sign-out account error message, check the Windows 8 Event Viewer (various system, security log files). Here's a relavent video: http://youtu.be/EfrQPpl3wPA
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Enjoying Windows 8

Post by yatesd » Thu Feb 20, 2014 4:40 pm

My suggestion is to spend 30 minutes learning Windows 8 rather than assuming it will work exactly like .....whatever. It will take 30 minutes and some training to get good at Windows 8, Linux, Mac OS (Mavericks), or any major OS release.

Formatting the HD or buying an outdated computer with weak security just doesn't make any sense to me.

Here are some great tips
http://www.techradar.com/us/news/softwa ... ts-1028220

http://www.techradar.com/us/reviews/pc- ... 745/review
Last edited by yatesd on Thu Feb 20, 2014 4:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Living with Windows 8

Post by THY4373 » Thu Feb 20, 2014 4:40 pm

petrico wrote: I'm confused. What effort does it take to avoid the metro interface? Boot to desktop... use Classic Shell... why would you ever need to see the metro interface if you don't choose to?
I agree with you to a point but the problem is some features and applications in Windows take you back to Metro. I have weeded most of these out over time but it is in my experience not quite as simple as boot to desktop and use Classic Shell. That seems to get you 90% or so of the way there but it did take a bit more than that for me on the one Win 8 instance I have though I do have it where I like it now. That said I mostly use Linux so it is not a major issue for me one way or the other.

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Re: Enjoying Windows 8

Post by nisiprius » Thu Feb 20, 2014 5:12 pm

yatesd wrote:My suggestion is to spend 30 minutes learning Windows 8 rather than assuming it will work exactly like .....whatever. It will take 30 minutes and some training to get good at Windows 8, Linux, Mac OS (Mavericks), or any major OS release...
It has taken my wife much longer than 30 minutes. She went into Windows 8 determined to "just learn it." She's no techie but no computerphobe.

So, my wife bought a new computer, consciously chose Windows 8, consciously chose to learn it, has lived with it for about eight months now. And she hates it. She feels it gets in her way, makes things difficult.

Of course, when you talk about learning "Windows 8" it depends of course what you mean "Windows 8." If "it" were just Metro, it might not be so bad. Although it is bad enough. Metro is full of design decisions (like having all controls invisible, and making it difficult to have more than one window open at a time) that make sense for a smartphone but not for a 1600x900 monitor. That is to say, it's not just different, it's less usable--usability on desktops was traded off in order to make it more usable on smartphones.

But the problem is that you can't use just Metro. Nor can you avoid using Metro. Not even when just using Microsoft's applications. A lot of Windows utilities you need just to get ordinary things done (like installing the printer) do not have Metro interfaces, so you are constantly confronted with the need to shift mentally between two completely different user interfaces.

I have no idea what Classic Shell does, but it's fairly irrelevant--the problem is not the Shell, or rather that's just a small part of the problem. The problem is inconsistent user interfaces between applications you invoke with the Shell. Also, I would add that my personal experience with third-party add-ons that affect the shell user interface have been uniformly bad--they seem great when they are working, but they have a tendency to break with every OS rev and then you have to wait for the vendor to fix it...

Classic Microsoft: the one thing my wife genuinely liked about Windows 8 was having the Bing picture of the day as her desktop wallpaper. You'd think this would be the perfect win-win--Microsoft forces Bing on end-users and they genuinely like it. Well, when she updated to Windows 8.1, it stopped working. There was no warning before the update, no explanation after the update, no control panel setting she can find to get it to work again. On a minor point update, Microsoft removes a well-liked feature that serves Microsoft's own interests.

P.S. It doesn't help that if you use Bing to search for answers to seemingly simple questions about how to get things done in Windows 8, much of the time the web page it finds will say "Windows 7" at the top--with no indication of whether or not it applies to Windows 8 as well. It seems bizarre to me that they didn't update the pages to say "Windows 7 and 8". It suggests fundamental chaos permeating their system...

By the way, what IS the name for The User Interface Formally Known As Metro?
Last edited by nisiprius on Thu Feb 20, 2014 5:20 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Living with Windows 8

Post by 02sbxstr » Thu Feb 20, 2014 5:18 pm

I've been using 8 for sometime now, opting to move immediately to my old desktop upon booting. I'm happy with using 8 this way. Windows 8 seems to be very stable - I haven't seen the blue screen of death ever on this laptop. I would like to update to 8.1, but keep getting the message I must delete Sentinel Run-time Drivers, which is not a simple uninstall. Have had no success in delete approaches identified by Google searches so far. ANyone else had this problem or maybe solved it?

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Re: Living with Windows 8

Post by ThatGuy » Thu Feb 20, 2014 5:42 pm

Nisi, I just googled your issue and it appears that your wife needs to install the Bing Desktop. I've noticed this in Windows Updates, so if she wants to install the desktop (I don't know what else is included), that may be a solution.

Links of Knowledge:

http://www.zdnet.com/how-to-get-your-bi ... 000017427/

http://www.bing.com/explore/desktop

BTW, I have W8 on an HTPC. Granted, I don't do real work on that machine, but getting it usuable was a simple as installing classic shell. Once this program is installed it automatically starts on log in, which forces you to the desktop. No need to fiddle with any other settings.
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Re: Living with Windows 8

Post by Mel Lindauer » Thu Feb 20, 2014 6:02 pm

I installed this free app from the app store after upgrading to 8.1 and it works great -- just like my old Win 7. Like others, I had previously returned a Win 8 machine because I felt like I was on an Easter egg hunt, trying to find where all my "goodies" were hidden, despite having started with PCs when they still ran DOS 1.0 and basically going through all the various versions of Windows (except Vista, which I intentionally avoided). However, when my Win 7 computer started acting up, I had to get a new one immediately, so I reluctantly got a Win 8 laptop.

http://www.pokki.com/windows-8-start-menu?ref=cm
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tadamsmar
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Re: Living with Windows 8

Post by tadamsmar » Thu Feb 20, 2014 7:04 pm

TimeRunner wrote:For that sign-out account error message, check the Windows 8 Event Viewer (various system, security log files). Here's a relavent video: http://youtu.be/EfrQPpl3wPA
Thanks, but there are no event logs on the main screen of the event viewer. Nothing.

There are administrative events, but I don't think it's there, it seems to be a pain to click and view each of those.
Last edited by tadamsmar on Thu Feb 20, 2014 9:39 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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.....

Post by pinecrest » Thu Feb 20, 2014 9:29 pm

.....
Last edited by pinecrest on Wed Feb 26, 2014 3:29 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Living with Windows 8

Post by yatesd » Fri Feb 21, 2014 6:22 am

pinecrest wrote:
tadamsmar wrote:
5. If you open a PDF file, it's not clear how to close it, no X in the corner of the window, you have to use Alt-F4. You can download the Adobe PDF reader that works just like it does on XP.
Adobe and Windows products are probably the least safe options for anything. Open-source freeware is usually the safest for most applications Though more and more freeware products are starting to add "stuff", if only during the download.
I'd like to think of it this way...Windows 8 includes touch optimized apps for free (touch version of IE is great on a tablet, adobe reader, etc.). However, I don't even use the touch optimized version of IE on a non-touch capable product. I will use the desktop version of IE 11 or Chrome. Both are very good. IMHO Microsoft is further along than Apple where they have a completely different OS for mobile and desktop....with no touch capabilities in Mavericks. If you don't think this is relevant for business, then you haven't used W8 to demonstrate with a touch optimized PowerPoint via tablet or a 90" touch screen.

Another data point for avoiding old software:
http://www.pcpro.co.uk/news/security/38 ... =pulsenews

"Users can mitigate the threat by upgrading from Windows XP and updating Java and Office," the company's researchers. "If you have Java 1.6, update Java to the latest 1.7 version. If you are using an out-of-date Microsoft Office 2007 or 2010, update Microsoft Office to the latest version."

Windows XP is being targeted, but notice that Windows 7, old versions of Java, and old versions of MS Office are also problems.

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BigFoot48
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Re: Living with Windows 8

Post by BigFoot48 » Fri Feb 21, 2014 10:17 am

I just bought an Acer laptop with lighted keyboard (yeah!), touch screen and Windows 8, which I updated it to 8.1. My initial reaction was much confusion and unhappiness, but I quickly fixed that by installing Classic Start which I had used for years on my Win7 laptop.

Now I have both the comfortable past and the challenging future all in one, and I, for one, welcome my Windows 8 Overlord!
Retired | Two-time in top-10 in Bogleheads S&P500 contest; 12-time loser

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TimeRunner
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Re: Living with Windows 8

Post by TimeRunner » Fri Feb 21, 2014 12:56 pm

tadamsmar wrote:
TimeRunner wrote:For that sign-out account error message, check the Windows 8 Event Viewer (various system, security log files). Here's a relavent video: http://youtu.be/EfrQPpl3wPA
Thanks, but there are no event logs on the main screen of the event viewer. Nothing.

There are administrative events, but I don't think it's there, it seems to be a pain to click and view each of those.
I don't know. I wish I could help further, but I'm on Windows 7. Bringing up the event viewer should bring up the typical Windows logs like Application, Security, Setup, System as well as application logs, forwarded events, custom views, etc. These would be on the left-hand navigation pane under "Event Viewer (Local)". Perhaps someone with Win8 could look at theirs and confirm.
"What'd ya expect in an opera, a happy ending?" -Bugs Bunny

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Post by pinecrest » Fri Feb 21, 2014 3:10 pm

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Last edited by pinecrest on Wed Feb 26, 2014 3:28 am, edited 1 time in total.

pinecrest
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Post by pinecrest » Fri Feb 21, 2014 3:14 pm

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iceport
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Re: Living with Windows 8

Post by iceport » Fri Feb 21, 2014 7:25 pm

pinecrest wrote:
petrico wrote:
On the Microsoft account, you really didn't need one to set up your PC accounts. There's an option (not an obvious one) to use a "local account" so that's what I set up. I want as few connections as possible to the cloud. I did need a Microsoft account to download the windows 8.1 update from the "Store," but an old Hotmail account sufficed, believe it or not!
--Peter
Peter,

Thank you for the info on local accounts. I don't plan on getting Windows 8, but having to connect to Microsoft to get an Admin account would be a deal-breaker for me. I hope that isn't a requirement in Windows 9. If Microsoft is indeed going that route, it will definitely be Linux for me.
pinecrest,

Glad you found it helpful. Using a Microsoft account for the device provides a cloud connection to Microsoft. It seems to be one of their main goals to popularize a single operating system across the full spectrum of devices, and allowing it all to look and feel as similar as possible. Using a Microsoft account allows you to sync PC settings across multiple machines, primarily. That's nothing I'm interested in.

--Peter

Image
"Discipline matters more than allocation.” ─William Bernstein

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Mel Lindauer
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Re: Living with Windows 8

Post by Mel Lindauer » Fri Feb 21, 2014 8:04 pm

petrico wrote:
pinecrest wrote:
petrico wrote:
On the Microsoft account, you really didn't need one to set up your PC accounts. There's an option (not an obvious one) to use a "local account" so that's what I set up. I want as few connections as possible to the cloud. I did need a Microsoft account to download the windows 8.1 update from the "Store," but an old Hotmail account sufficed, believe it or not!
--Peter
Peter,

Thank you for the info on local accounts. I don't plan on getting Windows 8, but having to connect to Microsoft to get an Admin account would be a deal-breaker for me. I hope that isn't a requirement in Windows 9. If Microsoft is indeed going that route, it will definitely be Linux for me.
pinecrest,

Glad you found it helpful. Using a Microsoft account for the device provides a cloud connection to Microsoft. It seems to be one of their main goals to popularize a single operating system across the full spectrum of devices, and allowing it all to look and feel as similar as possible. Using a Microsoft account allows you to sync PC settings across multiple machines, primarily. That's nothing I'm interested in.

--Peter

Image
Hi Peter:

How did you get that screenshot in Win 8.1? I've used CTL+P as well as the Print Screen Keys and neither work for me like they used to in earlier versions of Windows. Any ideas?
Best Regards - Mel | | Semper Fi

pa7VQbb1kTkj1eLn3spK
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Re: Living with Windows 8

Post by pa7VQbb1kTkj1eLn3spK » Fri Feb 21, 2014 8:15 pm

Get Stardock's Start8, by far the best "Start" menu option out there. It'll be the best $5 you'll spend and less if you can find a 20% coupon online. I've used ClassicShell and it'll do the job, but Start8 is much more customizable and looks a hell of a lot better too.

I hated Windows 8 because of the Metro UI and dreaded having to use it because it supports Secure Boot, but once I got Start8, I prefer 8.1 over 7 by a long shot and I think 7 is the best OS Microsoft has put out since Windows2000.

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iceport
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Re: Living with Windows 8

Post by iceport » Fri Feb 21, 2014 8:37 pm

Mel Lindauer wrote:Hi Peter:

How did you get that screenshot in Win 8.1? I've used CTL+P as well as the Print Screen Keys and neither work for me like they used to in earlier versions of Windows. Any ideas?
Hi Mel,

I actually took the hard road: I used some old screen-capture software that I've dragged around for years. (It wasn't easy, because that account set-up page is a metro page, but the screen-capture software is desktop. But Windows 8.1 lets you partition the screen by grabbing near the top edge and pulling it to one side, so I had that metro sign-in page on half the monitor and the desktop on the other half so that I could run the desktop software.)

But to your question, I tested the Ctrl+P and the PrtScn key on my PC, and both worked for me in capturing the desktop screen. When I toggled to a metro page, the PrtScn key worked fine but Ctrl+P didn't.

Since you're on a laptop, I can't imagine why the keyboard would not have this functionality. But it did work on my desktop PC, so it might not be a Windows 8.1 issue. Could it be a driver problem?

--Peter
"Discipline matters more than allocation.” ─William Bernstein

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iceport
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How to take a screenshot in Windows 8.1

Post by iceport » Sat Feb 22, 2014 9:11 am

OK, Mel, I think I've got you covered.

I did some searching, and found this Winaero blog entry: How to take a screenshot in Windows 8.1: three ways without using third party tools. You should be able to use:

1) the Windows key+Print Screen* (saves a .PNG file to a subfolder in the "Pictures" folder);
2) the Print Screen* key alone; or
3) the Windows 8 Snipping Tool (which apparently existed in Windows 7).

* That web page has the following note for the Print Screen key on laptops:
(Note: if you are using a laptop or tablet, it may have an Fn key and the Print Screen key text on your keyboard may be enclosed inside a box, with some other function assigned to the same key when Fn is not held down. It means you are supposed to hold down the Fn key to use the function enclosed in the box. So if Win+Print Screen does not work, then try Win+Fn+Print Screen).
The Snipping Tool has a cool feature that even lets you capture open menus. (The Snipping Tool is under "Programs/Windows Accessories" in the start menu, the same place you can find the Calculator. Or, you can "Search" for it.)

From Microsoft: Use Snipping Tool to capture screen shots

I didn't find any reference to using "Ctrl+P" for a screen capture in Windows 8/8.1, but I did find a whole bunch of other Windows 8/8.1 keyboard shortcuts here:

http://windows.microsoft.com/en-us/wind ... -shortcuts

Hope that helps Mel. I learned a lot searching for this.

--Peter
"Discipline matters more than allocation.” ─William Bernstein

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iceport
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Add a Network Activity Indicator

Post by iceport » Tue Feb 25, 2014 7:31 pm

Another Windows 8.1 customization you can make is to add a network activity indicator.

If, as I do, you really dislike not knowing when your PC is downloading or uploading data from/to the internet, there's a simple remedy:

Network Activity Indicator for Windows 7

Image

Yes, it says it's "for Windows 7," but it works just fine on Windows 8.1. Not only that, this 1m 44s Channel 9 video indicates that Microsoft people endorse the utility:

No Network Activity Indicator in Windows 7: But Why?

Working online without a network activity indicator is like driving in a heat wave with no temperature gauge.

(And yes, this was about the biggest "issue" I had left with Windows 8.1.)

--Peter
"Discipline matters more than allocation.” ─William Bernstein

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Mel Lindauer
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Re: Add a Network Activity Indicator

Post by Mel Lindauer » Tue Feb 25, 2014 9:18 pm

petrico wrote:Another Windows 8.1 customization you can make is to add a network activity indicator.

If, as I do, you really dislike not knowing when your PC is downloading or uploading data from/to the internet, there's a simple remedy:

Network Activity Indicator for Windows 7

Image

Yes, it says it's "for Windows 7," but it works just fine on Windows 8.1. Not only that, this 1m 44s Channel 9 video indicates that Microsoft people endorse the utility:

No Network Activity Indicator in Windows 7: But Why?

Working online without a network activity indicator is like driving in a heat wave with no temperature gauge.

(And yes, this was about the biggest "issue" I had left with Windows 8.1.)

--Peter
Hi Again Pete:

Here's what I found out:
1. CTL+P works but the image can't be pasted into Notepad. However, it can be pasted into MS Word (I didn't think it was working because I was testing pasting the screen shot into Notepad).
2. The Windows key+Print Screen works. Same thing, OK in Word, not in Notepad.
3. Function Key and PrintScreen don't work.
3. Simply type "Print Screen"in the Win 8.1 metro screen and it turns out there's an app for that! I attached it to my task bar and it works fine. However, no need for the extra baggage, since the others work fine, so I'll remove it.

Thanks for steering me in the right direction. Turns out I had it all along but can't figure out why I can't paste it into Notepad like I used to do in Win 7.
Best Regards - Mel | | Semper Fi

The Wizard
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Re: Living with Windows 8

Post by The Wizard » Wed Feb 26, 2014 10:11 am

Mel, try pasting into WordPad, not NotePad...
Attempted new signature...

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Mel Lindauer
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Re: Living with Windows 8

Post by Mel Lindauer » Wed Feb 26, 2014 11:23 am

The Wizard wrote:Mel, try pasting into WordPad, not NotePad...
BINGO! That works. Thanks so much. You are, indeed, The Wizard! :D
Best Regards - Mel | | Semper Fi

smackboy1
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Re: Living with Windows 8

Post by smackboy1 » Wed Feb 26, 2014 11:47 am

HP Quick Start installs Start Button like function. It works on non-HP platforms too.

http://h10025.www1.hp.com/ewfrf/wc/docu ... c=en&lc=en
Disclaimer: nothing written here should be taken as legal advice, but I did stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night.

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