Buy a new Windows 8 disc to clear Dell's bloat

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Tabulator
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Buy a new Windows 8 disc to clear Dell's bloat

Post by Tabulator » Thu Aug 08, 2013 1:39 am

I am thinking of buying a new Dell desktop with Windows 8.

Is it possible to get a clean Windows 8 installation on that new computer by purchasing an additional Windows disc from a store such as Walmart? I am thinking of this as an easier and more effective (though also more expensive) method than manually removing the crapware.

I expect the whole project to cost less than $500; spending more on Windows does not bother me if it works well.

Thanks for sharing any tips or experience.

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markenx
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Re: Buy a new Windows 8 disc to clear Dell's bloat

Post by markenx » Thu Aug 08, 2013 2:26 am

Even easier, check out the new Refresh or Reset PC features, they may do exactly what you want for free.

How to do it:
http://windows.microsoft.com/en-US/wind ... h-reset-pc

Big explanation:
http://blogs.msdn.com/b/b8/archive/2012 ... ur-pc.aspx

(Note, I haven't used them but I'm hoping they leave a clean install since that's the whole point of it)

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frugaltype
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Re: Buy a new Windows 8 disc to clear Dell's bloat

Post by frugaltype » Thu Aug 08, 2013 4:22 am

How long does it take to go through Add or Remove Programs, or whatever the Windows 8 equivalent is? 15 minutes?

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Watty
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Re: Buy a new Windows 8 disc to clear Dell's bloat

Post by Watty » Thu Aug 08, 2013 5:41 am

Paying for a new copy of windows would be ridiculous and not only would it be expensive but you would also likely just get a new set of junk installed with it. An alternative would be to take it into a computer shop and have them clean it up.

I have not use it but I have seen several comments about a people using a utility called decrapifier that you can download to clean up much of the junk. There are probably a lot of other similar utilities available. You can search for this this for find reviews about it.

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Hondo
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Re: Buy a new Windows 8 disc to clear Dell's bloat

Post by Hondo » Thu Aug 08, 2013 6:18 am

I would try this: http://pcdecrapifier.com/

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nisiprius
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Re: Buy a new Windows 8 disc to clear Dell's bloat

Post by nisiprius » Thu Aug 08, 2013 6:22 am

It SHOULD be possible to get a cleanly preinstalled copy of Windows 8 on a new computer by buying a "Signature" computer from The Microsoft Store.

http://www.microsoftstore.com/store/msu ... tSignature

Limited selection but not hopeless, prices not sensational but broadly competitive.

(I was noodging my wife to do just this and she and I both wish she had. We actually made a pilgrimage to a "Microsoft Store" for just the purpose, but it turned out that this particular Microsoft Store was just a trade-show-booth-sized affair out in the middle of a mall aisle--not much more than a pushcart--not the full-sized Microsoft Store we could have gone to by driving thirty miles more--and they weren't selling anything but a laptop, which wasn't what she wanted.

So, instead, she bought an HP-badged computer, full of crapware, from Costco, on the theory that it should work with her HP all-in-one, and that turned out to be a major struggle. I don't want to get into details, but among other things the printer showed up twice on the list of available printers, and printed perfectly from within any application except Internet Explorer, and refused to print anything from within Internet Explorer (such as receipts, invoices, confirmations, etc). My theory is that Microsoft has a driver for her model within the Windows distribution, and that HP has an updated or enhanced driver for the same model, and that HP somehow included both on its preinstall--or the two companies' update mechanism were conflicting with each other and not recognizing that the old driver should be removed if a new driver were going to be installed.

Googling turned up a gazillion troubleshooting directions from Microsoft and others, but they all covered the case where the printer isn't seen or doesn't print. Not one of them covered the case of the printer working fine from most applications but not Internet Explorer).
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Re: Buy a new Windows 8 disc to clear Dell's bloat

Post by topos » Thu Aug 08, 2013 6:46 am

Paying for a new copy of windows would be ridiculous and not only would it be expensive but you would also likely just get a new set of junk installed with it. An alternative would be to take it into a computer shop and have them clean it u
I do not agree with that. Using my Microsoft developer license, I did install new copies of Windows as delivered by Microsoft and they do NOT come with any junk. Of course you have to do a new install, which in general is pretty straightforward, except if you have to find some specific drivers. It is a bit a pain when the specific network driver is not include in Windows (which means, you cannot even download it using that computer). :oops:
The other drawback is indeed the cost of a fresh copy if you have to buy it.
My experience with Dell computer is they do not come with much junk. Last time I bought one (3 month ago), I only removed a couple of "junk" (like anti virus, I prefer the Microsoft one). HP on the other hand is pretty bad.
I'll will be much less confident in other software like "decrapifier".
As Nispirius suggested, buying a Microsoft "signature" PC is a good way to go if you do not want to bother with any of that.

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plannerman
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Re: Buy a new Windows 8 disc to clear Dell's bloat

Post by plannerman » Thu Aug 08, 2013 6:56 am

It has been some time since my last Dell PC purchase. The last two PCs I bought, however, I bought from Dell's small business website. They came with almost no crapware. As near as I can tell, the CPUs are identical.

plannerman

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frugaltype
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Re: Buy a new Windows 8 disc to clear Dell's bloat

Post by frugaltype » Thu Aug 08, 2013 7:39 am

nisiprius wrote:
So, instead, she bought an HP-badged computer, full of crapware, from Costco, on the theory that it should work with her HP all-in-one, and that turned out to be a major struggle. I don't want to get into details, but among other things the printer showed up twice on the list of available printers, and printed perfectly from within any application except Internet Explorer, and refused to print anything from within Internet Explorer (such as receipts, invoices, confirmations, etc). My theory is that Microsoft has a driver for her model within the Windows distribution, and that HP has an updated or enhanced driver for the same model, and that HP somehow included both on its preinstall--or the two companies' update mechanism were conflicting with each other and not recognizing that the old driver should be removed if a new driver were going to be installed.
Seriously, use Firefox.

I froze my software and saved it for future use. Enough of companies dancing on my head. I have a set of instructions, found by trial and error, that install software for my HP all-in-one on XP. I have never tried to print from IE, but from Firefox and everything else I use, it works fine.

Meanwhile, use printscreen and dump things into Paint.

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Re: Buy a new Windows 8 disc to clear Dell's bloat

Post by ieee488 » Thu Aug 08, 2013 7:45 am

plannerman wrote:It has been some time since my last Dell PC purchase. The last two PCs I bought, however, I bought from Dell's small business website. They came with almost no crapware. As near as I can tell, the CPUs are identical.

plannerman
The consumer series line of Dell PC come with bloatware. These are the ones people find in the stores.
The business series line like the Latitudes do not. I purchased two a few years ago, and it came with just Windows and Roxio.
topos wrote:
Paying for a new copy of windows would be ridiculous and not only would it be expensive but you would also likely just get a new set of junk installed with it. An alternative would be to take it into a computer shop and have them clean it u
I do not agree with that.
+1

What Watty wrote is simply not true.

I have Dell's Windows XP, Vista, and Window7 discs.
And there is not an ounce of bloatware once Windows is installed. Nothing is there except Windows.

The bloatware is because of $ the PC manufacturers get from putting the bloatware on the PC.
Dell Optiplex 3020 (Win7 Pro), Dell Precision M6300 (Ubuntu Linux 12.04), Dell Precision M6300 (Win7 Pro), Dell Latitude D531 (Vista)

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Re: Buy a new Windows 8 disc to clear Dell's bloat

Post by Ged » Thu Aug 08, 2013 9:10 am


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KarlJ
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Re: Buy a new Windows 8 disc to clear Dell's bloat

Post by KarlJ » Thu Aug 08, 2013 10:23 am

This year I purchased a Dell Windows 8 desktop PC from Costco and it did not have anything I consider bloatware on it. A CyberLink Suite was preinstalled that included PowerDVD software to play DVD movies that I use on occasion. I have not used the other CyberLink Suite programs, such as PowerDirector for editing videos, but I am glad to have these programs for possible future use.

learnfpga
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Re: Buy a new Windows 8 disc to clear Dell's bloat

Post by learnfpga » Thu Aug 08, 2013 11:50 am

Tabulator wrote:I am thinking of buying a new Dell desktop with Windows 8.

Is it possible to get a clean Windows 8 installation on that new computer by purchasing an additional Windows disc from a store such as Walmart? I am thinking of this as an easier and more effective (though also more expensive) method than manually removing the crapware.

I expect the whole project to cost less than $500; spending more on Windows does not bother me if it works well.

Thanks for sharing any tips or experience.
I have purchased Dell laptops in the past and they used to have an option to buy OEM windows disc for $10.00. I think they have stopped doing that from windows 8. I have multiple Win 7 re-installation discs from past. I always format new laptop to get rid of bloatware and then install fresh copy of of OS.

Call Dell and find out what your options are. I think you can download OS directly from MS website by proving that your Dell came with original OS.

What would a customer do if a year from now your hard drive crashes and you put a new HDD. You should have some way to re-installing original OS.

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Re: Buy a new Windows 8 disc to clear Dell's bloat

Post by ieee488 » Thu Aug 08, 2013 12:12 pm

learnfpga wrote:What would a customer do if a year from now your hard drive crashes and you put a new HDD. You should have some way to re-installing original OS.
The major manufacturers are "forcing" the consumers to create their own Windows back-up DVD.
That's what you should do first thing.
Dell Optiplex 3020 (Win7 Pro), Dell Precision M6300 (Ubuntu Linux 12.04), Dell Precision M6300 (Win7 Pro), Dell Latitude D531 (Vista)

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Re: Buy a new Windows 8 disc to clear Dell's bloat

Post by boffalora » Thu Aug 08, 2013 2:31 pm

When I'm asked to clean up a friend's computer bloated with crapware, regardless of whether it came with the machine or the user unwittingly downloaded it, I first install free CCleaner (www.ccleaner.com) from a flash drive. Opening the Tools tab on CCleaner will reveal every program installed on the machine, in alphabetical order. From there it's easy to uninstall unwanted programs line by line. Periodically I'll run CCleaner's Registry cleaner to eliminate unneeded files left behind, and even more frequently the Cleaner tab.

Doing a serious cleanup of the machine before ever connecting it to the internet keeps it from being reinfected in short order. Only then will I connect it to the internet and download and run an antimalware program (most often, free Microsoft Security Essentials).

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ejvyas
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Re: Buy a new Windows 8 disc to clear Dell's bloat

Post by ejvyas » Thu Aug 08, 2013 2:35 pm

Read this: http://arstechnica.com/information-tech ... -a-new-pc/

I hope its legal since you will end up using your own Windows key. The article talks about Windows 7 but it should be possible to do Windows 8 too

indexmeasap
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Re: Buy a new Windows 8 disc to clear Dell's bloat

Post by indexmeasap » Thu Aug 08, 2013 3:46 pm

When you purchase the new Dell desktop with Windows 8, you need to make sure to get the Reinstallation CD. It is VERY important. This might be included or it might cost an extra $10 - PAY the EXTRA money! You do NOT need to repurchase Windows 8 from Wallmart.

You absolutely need it the Reinstallation CD, which is completely different than a "Recovery Disk" or "System Restore Backup". Those other things are completely useless. If you Dell desktop hard drive ever becomes corrupt or the PC completely crashes, the only thing that will save the day is the Reinstallation CD. In addition to the Reinstallation CD you need to save the drivers from Dell.com for you specific model.

e.g. my old Dell Dimension 3000 require the following drivers installed in this order:
1. Chipset
2. Video Graphic
3. Audio
4. Network Adaptor

Call Dell's technical support and they will inform you on the correct drivers for your specific computer if you need clarification.

If you buy a lower end computer, Windows might not distribute the Reinstallation CD through Dell. I experiences this recently when I bough a $300 HP desktop through Wallmart.com (my crapware was disgusting) I could not get the Reinstallation CD through Wallmart or even Microsoft. You will need to create the Reinstallation CD on your own by downloading the ISO file:

http://www.redmondpie.com/download-wind ... microsoft/

Contact Microsoft customer support if you have any questions - you are not stealing a bootleg copy and this is not illegal. You purchased a valid copy of Windows 8 with a valid product key, this is just how Microsoft chooses to provide the Reinstallation CD these days.

Using Refresh, Reset PC, pcdecrapifier, or going to the microsoft store to get a clean installation is like using a band aid on a knife wound. Just be sure to obtain the Reinstallaion CD.

Good Luck

Tabulator
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Re: Buy a new Windows 8 disc to clear Dell's bloat

Post by Tabulator » Thu Aug 08, 2013 7:03 pm

Thanks for alerting me to the fact that the bloat may more than merely annoying. It sounds downright creepy.

The most hopefully helpful information I have seen so far is at Ars Technica.

As stated in that article, Microsoft is rumored to offer a disc for around $30. I am still leaning toward buying a full copy at Walmart to avoid the hassle of creating a Microsoft account and dealing with support reps.

Other people on the web say that when one buys a Dell product, one does not pay for, and therefore should not expect, a clean copy of Windows.

To those who think I'm wasting money: The first idea on my shopping list was a $600 Mac mini. Even with Windows 8 retail I am well below budget.

My main question now is what edition of Windows 8 to buy. There are several choices I don't understand.

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Re: Buy a new Windows 8 disc to clear Dell's bloat

Post by Barefootgirl » Thu Aug 08, 2013 8:00 pm

Maybe an ignorant question on my part, but even if the Windows option is slightly cheaper - over time, would the amount of time spent to keep it clean and possibly other charges for new software make the Apple a better option?....I ask this from the perspective of a person who wouldn't mind paying more for a device less troublesome and time consuming to maintain?

BFG
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Re: Buy a new Windows 8 disc to clear Dell's bloat

Post by thewizzer » Thu Aug 08, 2013 8:31 pm

Barefootgirl wrote:Maybe an ignorant question on my part, but even if the Windows option is slightly cheaper - over time, would the amount of time spent to keep it clean and possibly other charges for new software make the Apple a better option?....I ask this from the perspective of a person who wouldn't mind paying more for a device less troublesome and time consuming to maintain?

BFG

From a strictly financial perspective, the answer is....maybe.

If one shops around, there are usually good deals to be had on a PC. Not so much with an Apple product (they don't really go on sale). It's probably safe to say that one would be unlikely to recoup the added cost of an Apple simply due to extra charges for PC software and cleaning. However, Apple products do hold their value quite well and are easily resold. I expect when the time comes to replace my iMac that I'm currently using, I'll be able to sell it on ebay for at least $300, maybe more. In my experience with PC's, they are basically scrap when you get done with them (I'm sure there are exceptions for super high end, hand built PC's, but this has been my experience after owning more than one Dell, Sony Vaio, etc. purchased at big box stores or online).

I grew up using Apple products, went to college and turned into a PC guy for several years, and eventually migrated back to all Apple products. I'm not a computer junkie and I find Apple stuff to be infinitely more user friendly. Personal preferences definitely rule in this category, though. Not trying to start a flame war.

And as for the OP's original question, I have no idea and nothing to add.

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Re: Buy a new Windows 8 disc to clear Dell's bloat

Post by Barefootgirl » Thu Aug 08, 2013 9:22 pm

Hi wizze,

This is an issue for me - as I get older, my time and peace of mind are taking on a greater priority than money.

As I read through your post, it reminded me of our recent car discussions here, so maybe there is analogy that could be drawn. I paid something of a premium (over other auto brands) for my new Toyota, but I feel that the less time and money that I spend returning it for repairs and knowing I will still be able to sell it down the road with some value, seems worth it.

Thanks, BFG
How many retired people does it take to screw in a lightbulb? Only one, but he takes all day.

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Re: Buy a new Windows 8 disc to clear Dell's bloat

Post by ieee488 » Thu Aug 08, 2013 9:34 pm

Barefootgirl wrote:Maybe an ignorant question on my part, but even if the Windows option is slightly cheaper - over time, would the amount of time spent to keep it clean and possibly other charges for new software make the Apple a better option?....I ask this from the perspective of a person who wouldn't mind paying more for a device less troublesome and time consuming to maintain?

BFG
It is not slightly cheaper. It is 2x to 3x cheaper.

If you compare the price of a brand new 15" Macbook, it is $1799.
There is NO way I am going to pay that however much the resale value it may have.

Even when I was using Windows exclusively, I never had any real problems with malware etc.
It worked.

Now I am using Ubuntu Linux.
I buy used refurbished Dell Latitude and Precision laptops. Not a single problem.
Dell Optiplex 3020 (Win7 Pro), Dell Precision M6300 (Ubuntu Linux 12.04), Dell Precision M6300 (Win7 Pro), Dell Latitude D531 (Vista)

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magellan
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Re: Buy a new Windows 8 disc to clear Dell's bloat

Post by magellan » Thu Aug 08, 2013 9:36 pm

Perhaps you could try this microsoft windows 8 upgrade link:
http://windows.microsoft.com/en-US/wind ... t-key-only

It asks for a license key and once validated gives you an option to burn a Windows 8 install disk.

I'm not sure it'll work with a dell OEM license key, but it might be worth a try.

Jim

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Re: Buy a new Windows 8 disc to clear Dell's bloat

Post by mortal » Thu Aug 08, 2013 9:51 pm

Also, there's linux.

http://www.linuxmint.com/edition.php?id=141

When I bought my laptop, windows vista stayed installed for all of 5 minutes after the first boot. Unless you're a gamer, or you need to run some windows only software, I highly recommend it.

Tabulator
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Re: Buy a new Windows 8 disc to clear Dell's bloat

Post by Tabulator » Fri Aug 09, 2013 12:38 am

I have no shortage of appreciation for the many good *nix choices. Windows just happens to be more appropriate for me in this case.

ieee488
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Re: Buy a new Windows 8 disc to clear Dell's bloat

Post by ieee488 » Fri Aug 09, 2013 8:06 am

Tabulator wrote:I have no shortage of appreciation for the many good *nix choices. Windows just happens to be more appropriate for me in this case.
You could always try Linux without giving up Windows. With a modern laptop, you could create a bootable USB thumb drive with Linux.

Anyway, have you gone to the local store and see what bloatware is actually installed?
If you don't mind ordering online, purchase a Dell Optiplex series desktop. it won't come with bloatware.
This type of desktop is sold to major corporations.
I purchased two in SFF (small form factor) about 3 years ago, and it did not come with any bloatware.
Dell Optiplex 3020 (Win7 Pro), Dell Precision M6300 (Ubuntu Linux 12.04), Dell Precision M6300 (Win7 Pro), Dell Latitude D531 (Vista)

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Higman
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Re: Buy a new Windows 8 disc to clear Dell's bloat

Post by Higman » Fri Aug 09, 2013 8:50 am

Modern PCs have enough hard drive capacity (1TB) that any bloatware will occupy only a fraction of the HD. The only real impact is that many start up automatically and occupy RAM and some CPU cycles as well as contacting home web sites for updates. If you don’t want to bother deleting the bloatware then another option is to run the Autoruns utility and stop them from starting. Check out:

http://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/sysi ... 63902.aspx

This option is especially useful if you think that someday you might want to try a particular program. Just turn it back on with Autoruns.

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Re: Buy a new Windows 8 disc to clear Dell's bloat

Post by Luke Duke » Fri Aug 09, 2013 10:17 am

Hondo wrote:I would try this: http://pcdecrapifier.com/
I came to post this. I've never used it myself since I build my own computers, but it gets good reviews.

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Dutch
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Re: Buy a new Windows 8 disc to clear Dell's bloat

Post by Dutch » Fri Aug 09, 2013 10:47 am

So much contusion and complicated suggestions.

Honestly, just run pcdecrapifier and be done with it.

Tabulator
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Re: Buy a new Windows 8 disc to clear Dell's bloat

Post by Tabulator » Fri Aug 09, 2013 11:22 am

I ordered an Inspiron from Newegg, and Windows 8 from Amazon. Grand total including tax and shipping: $455. Seems like a pretty good deal to me -- and hopefully not too much hassle. Thanks for all the input, everyone.

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soaring
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Re: Buy a new Windows 8 disc to clear Dell's bloat

Post by soaring » Fri Aug 09, 2013 11:39 am

plannerman wrote:It has been some time since my last Dell PC purchase. The last two PCs I bought, however, I bought from Dell's small business website. They came with almost no crapware. As near as I can tell, the CPUs are identical.

plannerman
:thumbsup

I just bought a Lenovo win7 professional...primarily business computers and it had no bloatware either.

edit: oops didn't see your post to order when I posted.
Desiderata

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Re: Buy a new Windows 8 disc to clear Dell's bloat

Post by Epsilon Delta » Fri Aug 09, 2013 11:47 am

ieee488 wrote:You could always try Linux without giving up Windows. With a modern laptop, you could create a bootable USB thumb drive with Linux.
In my experience running Linux off of a USB (or a DVD) is not the same experience as running from an internal drive. The removable drives are quite a bit slower, do strange things if you try to install applications and by default have no swap space, which can slow things down. In general you can see what things look like and that they work, but can't see how fast things are. Installing Linux inside windows can give a better idea of how the system will respond.

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Re: Buy a new Windows 8 disc to clear Dell's bloat

Post by Tabulator » Fri Aug 09, 2013 11:50 am

Anyone tried LibreOffice under Windows 8? That's the next thing I have to figure out.

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Re: Buy a new Windows 8 disc to clear Dell's bloat

Post by Digital Dave » Fri Aug 09, 2013 8:21 pm

Tabulator wrote:Anyone tried LibreOffice under Windows 8? That's the next thing I have to figure out.
Yes I am. It works fine. My version isn't quite the latest, but it is nearly the latest. No problems at all with Windows 8.
Dave
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