Most underrated band of all time [that you listen to]?

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Petrocelli
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Re: Most underrated band of all time [that you listen to]?

Post by Petrocelli »

JupiterJones wrote:
Petrocelli wrote: I hate to disagree with the good professor, but there are great songs, albums, movies and restaurants. There just are.
If we define great as "historically significant, broadly critically lauded, and/or having a strong influential impact on the art form", or something more objective like that, then I agree. It would tough to argue that "Sgt Pepper's" or "Let it Bleed" were not great albums.

But if we dial it back to a more personal, subjective level--which is likely the level at which the professor was putting it--it's not quite so cut-and-dried. I never was a big Stones fan, so while I recognize that "Let it Bleed" is an important album, I don't personally consider it "great" to me (and in fact I probably would rather listen to Barry Manilow's Greatest Hits... there are some killer tunes on there!)
Interesting discussion.

Let me make the point this way.

If I like the Sistine Chapel, and you don't, that means we like different things. But if you try to argue that that work of art is not "great", you are wrong.

If I like Beethoven's 9th Symphony, and you don't, that means we like different things. But if you try to argue that that work of art is not "great", you are wrong.

Rock music is another form of art. As an art form, it has created great works of art -- like Revolver, or London Calling, or Are You Experienced. If you argue those albums are not "great", you are wrong.

As for the college professor, I have to admit, he was right on when he said Rod Stewart's Hot Legs wasn't "great." However, for him or her trying to tell a group of students not to use the word "great" when discussing art is so dopey that only a college professor could say it and get away with it.
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Re: Most underrated band of all time [that you listen to]?

Post by Petrocelli »

When I used the word "underrated" in my posts above, I was thinking of artists who do not get as much credit as they deserve given the quality of their work, and their impact on music. After reading this thread, I would list the following artists:

Louis Armstrong (took pop music to another level)
Simon and Garfunkel (took folk to another level)
The Clash (took punk to another level)

I think their historical significance may be lost. Given the opinions of my kids, The Beatles may be joining this group soon.
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Re: Most underrated band of all time [that you listen to]?

Post by chaz »

Petrocelli wrote:When I used the word "underrated" in my posts above, I was thinking of artists who do not get as much credit as they deserve given the quality of their work, and their impact on music. After reading this thread, I would list the following artists:

Louis Armstrong (took pop music to another level)
Simon and Garfunkel (took folk to another level)
The Clash (took punk to another level)

I think their historical significance may be lost. Given the opinions of my kids, The Beatles may be joining this group soon.
I like the Beatles.
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Re: Most underrated band of all time [that you listen to]?

Post by jacksprat »

Alice Cooper ( Billion Dollar Babies ) - great music and entertainment in one package...
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Re: Most underrated band of all time [that you listen to]?

Post by gkaplan »

Gee, I was going to rank Alice Cooper as one of the most overrated bands, along with the Rolling Stones.
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Re: Most underrated band of all time [that you listen to]?

Post by scouter »

Petrocelli wrote:
JupiterJones wrote:
Petrocelli wrote: I hate to disagree with the good professor, but there are great songs, albums, movies and restaurants. There just are.
If we define great as "historically significant, broadly critically lauded, and/or having a strong influential impact on the art form", or something more objective like that, then I agree. It would tough to argue that "Sgt Pepper's" or "Let it Bleed" were not great albums.

But if we dial it back to a more personal, subjective level--which is likely the level at which the professor was putting it--it's not quite so cut-and-dried. I never was a big Stones fan, so while I recognize that "Let it Bleed" is an important album, I don't personally consider it "great" to me (and in fact I probably would rather listen to Barry Manilow's Greatest Hits... there are some killer tunes on there!)
Interesting discussion.

Let me make the point this way.

If I like the Sistine Chapel, and you don't, that means we like different things. But if you try to argue that that work of art is not "great", you are wrong.

If I like Beethoven's 9th Symphony, and you don't, that means we like different things. But if you try to argue that that work of art is not "great", you are wrong.

Rock music is another form of art. As an art form, it has created great works of art -- like Revolver, or London Calling, or Are You Experienced. If you argue those albums are not "great", you are wrong.

As for the college professor, I have to admit, he was right on when he said Rod Stewart's Hot Legs wasn't "great." However, for him or her trying to tell a group of students not to use the word "great" when discussing art is so dopey that only a college professor could say it and get away with it.
Not to sound like Bill Clinton, but it all depends on what your definition of "great" is. If it's mass acceptance or sales, then "Saturday Night Fever" is greater than "Are You Experienced". If it's what the critics say, then there are rap albums we've probably never heard that are "greater" than "Rubber Soul". It's different for each person.

The gist of what he was teaching, (and I don't think it was dopey at all) is that when you call something "great", you are implying "I like this and other people like this, so if you don't like it, you're wrong." He was encouraging us to decide for ourselves and not blindly trust the opinions of critics or the general public. It's also a more tactful way of expressing likes and dislikes.
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Re: Most underrated band of all time [that you listen to]?

Post by Petrocelli »

scouter wrote:Not to sound like Bill Clinton, but it all depends on what your definition of "great" is. If it's mass acceptance or sales, then "Saturday Night Fever" is greater than "Are You Experienced". If it's what the critics say, then there are rap albums we've probably never heard that are "greater" than "Rubber Soul". It's different for each person.

The gist of what he was teaching, (and I don't think it was dopey at all) is that when you call something "great", you are implying "I like this and other people like this, so if you don't like it, you're wrong." He was encouraging us to decide for ourselves and not blindly trust the opinions of critics or the general public. It's also a more tactful way of expressing likes and dislikes.
Perhaps my college professors had a different outlook than yours.

When I was in college, we had four required courses. Two of them were called the "Great Books", which are one year surveys of the great books in literature, and the great books in philosophy. The former started with The Illiad and the latter started with Plato's Republic.

(If you are interested, you can read more about the "Great Books" curriculum here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Books

We also had to take half year surveys of art and music. The former started with the Kouros Boy and the latter started with Gregorian chants. (We never got to Rod Stewart's Hot Legs in the latter class though.)

I can assure you, I don't particularly like The Illiad or The Republic. However, I can appreciate why both are "great" works.

Put simply, I was taught that there are "great" works of literature and art.
Last edited by Petrocelli on Tue Sep 18, 2012 11:25 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Most underrated band of all time [that you listen to]?

Post by Petrocelli »

gkaplan wrote:Gee, I was going to rank Alice Cooper as one of the most overrated bands, along with the Rolling Stones.
I don't think Alice Cooper is highly ranked by a lot of people. I did meet him once on a golf course, and he seems like a nice guy.

As for the Stones, the made some truly amazing albums between 1965 and 1980. However, they continued to play for several more decades and may have tarnished their reputation.
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Re: Most underrated band of all time [that you listen to]?

Post by graveday »

The Stones got tarnished pretty badly at Altamont.
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Re: Most underrated band of all time [that you listen to]?

Post by TnGuy »

Mott The Hoople and Ian Hunter as a solo.


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Re: Most underrated band of all time [that you listen to]?

Post by Petrocelli »

graveday wrote:The Stones got tarnished pretty badly at Altamont.
Actually, that may have helped their image in an odd way.
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Re: Most underrated band of all time [that you listen to]?

Post by bengal22 »

Of course the whole irony of this thread is that as soon as a band becomes the most underrated they are no longer underrated.
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Re: Most underrated band of all time [that you listen to]?

Post by graveday »

Irony aside, just when I thought there was no hope for another deep dig, I came up with 'The Fugs'.

Give up a hand for 'Slum Goddess of the Lower East Side.'
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Re: Most underrated band of all time [that you listen to]?

Post by Mission man »

Southside Johnny and the Asbury Jukes
Greg Kihn Band
Split Enz
Graham Parker and the Rumour
Crazy Hourse
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Re: Most underrated band of all time [that you listen to]?

Post by tadamsmar »

graveday wrote:Irony aside, just when I thought there was no hope for another deep dig, I came up with 'The Fugs'.

Give up a hand for 'Slum Goddess of the Lower East Side.'
Hey, I already posted the Fugs!

They are so underrated we can't even mention the names of some of their best songs.

There is a new memoir by the founder of the Fugs which I found to be a good read:

http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_noss_ ... words=fugs
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Re: Most underrated band of all time [that you listen to]?

Post by graveday »

Oops, sorry, Tadamsmar. Good on you, though. Thanks for the heads up on the book.
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Re: Most underrated band of all time [that you listen to]?

Post by book lover »

Harry Chapin
Al Stewart
Renaissance
Gordon Lightfoot
Toto
Peter Gabriel
The Cars
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Re: Most underrated band of all time [that you listen to]?

Post by 29palms »

CHICAGO bar none. Great saxaphone, trombone, guitar, you name it. They do it all. Nobody does it like these guys.
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Re: Most underrated band of all time [that you listen to]?

Post by snyder66 »

Maybe early Chicago, not the ballad years. Although, I was in my girl chasing days when they came out.
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Re: Most underrated band of all time [that you listen to]?

Post by Johm221122 »

Talking Heads were a good band,they did get in Rocking Roll Hall Of Fame but kind of forgotten today
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talking_Heads
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Re: Most underrated band of all time [that you listen to]?

Post by JupiterJones »

The Waterboys

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Re: Most underrated band of all time [that you listen to]?

Post by DesertGuy »

Emerson, Lake & Palmer.

While they achieved some fame, I'd say not nearly enough.
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Re: Most underrated band of all time [that you listen to]?

Post by Yam the Bomb »

You guys are completely ignoring the Monkeys.

Those dang Beatles stole all their thunder.
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Re: Most underrated band of all time [that you listen to]?

Post by graveday »

The Beatles just stole their cute.
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Re: Most underrated band of all time [that you listen to]?

Post by steve_14 »

Johm221122 wrote:Talking Heads were a good band,they did get in Rocking Roll Hall Of Fame but kind of forgotten today
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talking_Heads
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They were great geniuses, and are hopefully remembered by many. I remember reading David Byrne being a visiting professor at Cal a few years back.
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Re: Most underrated band of all time [that you listen to]?

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The Light Crust Doughboys (from Burris Mills)
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Re: Most underrated band of all time [that you listen to]?

Post by deanbrew »

I wondered if someone would mention the Monkees (not Monkeys). Despite their origin - being cast for a TV show - one could argue that Mike Nesmith was underrated as a musician and singer and Mickey Dolenz was underrated as a singer. Not in terms of records sold, of course, but in general and critical acclaim. Both of these guys were plenty talented to have been in other bands.
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Re: Most underrated band of all time [that you listen to]?

Post by Petrocelli »

deanbrew wrote:...one could argue that Mike Nesmith was underrated as a musician and singer and Mickey Dolenz was underrated as a singer. Not in terms of records sold, of course, but in general and critical acclaim.
You could also make the argument that if Danny Bonaducci had joined the Rolling Stones after Mick Taylor quit instead of joining the Partridge Family then he would be in the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame.
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Re: Most underrated band of all time [that you listen to]?

Post by deanbrew »

Petrocelli wrote:
deanbrew wrote:...one could argue that Mike Nesmith was underrated as a musician and singer and Mickey Dolenz was underrated as a singer. Not in terms of records sold, of course, but in general and critical acclaim.
You could also make the argument that if Danny Bonaducci had joined the Rolling Stones after Mick Taylor quit instead of joining the Partridge Family then he would be in the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame.
I realize you're being facetious, but :?: ? Even a ludicrous argument should have some basis. Your post proves my point, that the Monkees are held in such low regard that someone might equate them to the Partridge Family.

Bonaducci never sang or played a note.

Nesmith actually sang and played guitar, and wrote several songs, including "Mary, Mary", "Listen to the Band", "You Might Just Be The One", "Circle Sky" and others. He sang many more as a Monkee and later as a solo artist. He went on to have a solo career and released several albums. In addition, he was a pioneer in music videos, creating a company (that he sold) that eventually morphed into the whole MTV network.

Dolenz is a closer parallel to Bonaducci, as they were both child actors. But name me one song that "Danny" sang. I can name dozens that Mickey sang, and quite well, too. Note I'm not giving him any credit for playing the drums.
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Re: Most underrated band of all time [that you listen to]?

Post by mikef40320 »

The correct answer is Phish
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Re: Most underrated band of all time [that you listen to]?

Post by graveday »

How about these guys, soon to be embroiled in finger pointing.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ulVQsQBenvs
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Re: Most underrated band of all time [that you listen to]?

Post by JupiterJones »

Regarding the Monkees, it seems that there are often several stages of one's musical development:

First, you start out as the average, undiscerning music consumer and think that bands like the Monkees are pretty great.

Then, you get a bit of musical education. You start listing to stuff that's maybe a bit off the beaten bath. Indie and underground music. Jazz. Classical. Maybe you learn to play an instrument yourself and/or take a music appreciation class in college. And you realize that the Monkees are a bunch of prefab crap designed solely to sell records.

But finally, if you're lucky, you learn and listen even more. And eventually you come to understand that the Monkees are pretty great after all. :P

You could apply this to a lot of oft-maligned bands. Those stuck at step #2 will dismiss, say, Carpenters as being nothing more than their parents' elevator music. But the ones who make it to step #3 know better.

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Re: Most underrated band of all time [that you listen to]?

Post by Petrocelli »

deanbrew wrote:
I realize you're being facetious, but :?: ? Even a ludicrous argument should have some basis. Your post proves my point, that the Monkees are held in such low regard that someone might equate them to the Partridge Family.

Bonaducci never sang or played a note.

Nesmith actually sang and played guitar, and wrote several songs, including "Mary, Mary", "Listen to the Band", "You Might Just Be The One", "Circle Sky" and others. He sang many more as a Monkee and later as a solo artist. He went on to have a solo career and released several albums. In addition, he was a pioneer in music videos, creating a company (that he sold) that eventually morphed into the whole MTV network.
Admittedly, I was being facetious. I will admit that Mike Nesmith can play guitar and he did write a few songs, two of which I have actually heard of.

Certainly, he is better than Danny Bonaducci. But are you seriously contending he was is "the most underrated artist of all time"?

I'll stick with The Clash as my choice.
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Re: Most underrated band of all time [that you listen to]?

Post by Petrocelli »

JupiterJones wrote:
But finally, if you're lucky, you learn and listen even more. And eventually you come to understand that the Monkees are pretty great after all. :P

You could apply this to a lot of oft-maligned bands. Those stuck at step #2 will dismiss, say, Carpenters as being nothing more than their parents' elevator music. But the ones who make it to step #3 know better.
Apparently, I have still not made it to step no. 3.
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Re: Most underrated band of all time [that you listen to]?

Post by SteveB3005 »

The Carpenters, 'Close to You' album is ranked 175th of the 500 Greatest Albums by Rolling Stone. Paraphrasing from my copy, it says they epitomized the early seventies and that some of those early ballads like 'Close to You' and 'We've Only Just Begun' we're influential in much later indie music.

Each there own, but it's a little sappy for me and I would have had it further back than 175th. Btw 174th was Bob Dylan- 'Desire', and 176th was Aerosmith- 'Rocks'
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Re: Most underrated band of all time [that you listen to]?

Post by Yam the Bomb »

Actually I've seen videos of Peter Tork playing acoustic guitar and singing and he was way better than I expected. I don't know if he's world class but definitely under rated.

Andy Timmons is definitely one of the best guitarists and fairly unknown. The critics love him though.
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Re: Most underrated band of all time [that you listen to]?

Post by deanbrew »

Petrocelli wrote:


Certainly, he is better than Danny Bonaducci. But are you seriously contending he was is "the most underrated artist of all time"?
No, I'm not saying the Monkees are "the most" underrated. But I do think they are underrated, since they are held in such low esteem by many. They became much more than a bunch of actors pretending to be a band. And I would rather listen to the Monkees and Mike Nesmith than quite a few artists who have been named in this thread.

I think the Clash is a good pick. I posted my picks several pages ago: Rush, Sparks, Cheap Trick, Los Lobos, The Call, The Smithereens, BR549, The Clarks, The Mavericks, The Derailers, Carter Brothers, & The Decemberists - take your pick.
Last edited by deanbrew on Sat Sep 22, 2012 1:24 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Most underrated band of all time [that you listen to]?

Post by winterescape »

JDaniels wrote:Some friends and I were discussing this topic.

Our top three were:
1) The Who
2) Rush
3) Boston

All great bands that never got the credit they deserved.

What are yours?
+1 for Boston
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Re: Most underrated band of all time [that you listen to]?

Post by Petrocelli »

deanbrew wrote:
No, I'm not saying the Monkees are "the most" underrated. But I do think they are underrated, since they are held in such low esteem by many. They became much more than a bunch of actors pretending to be a band. And I would rather listen to the Monkees and Mike Nesmith than quite a few artists who have been named in this thread.

I think the Clash is a good pick. I posted my picks several pages ago: Rush, Sparks, Cheap Trick, Los Lobos, The Call, The Smithereens, BR549, The Clarks, The Mavericks, The Derailers, Carter Brothers, & The Decemberists - take your pick.
Interesting thread. (Well, at least it's interesting to me and that's pretty much all that matters.)

I think all the other bands are ranked in my book pretty much where they should be. For example, The Carpenters or Monkeys were commercially successful bands who had a lot of hits in short periods of times. That's all. I rate them both as good. They are not great.

I think Los Lobos is very underrated. One of my favorite bands. Those familiar with their music know they are a great band. But most people probably wouldn't rank them as great.
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Re: Most underrated band of all time [that you listen to]?

Post by graveday »

Los Lobos is among the greatest live bands ever. Two lead guitars, horn, rhythym, meaty themes, and grit to spare.
It's on my bucket list to see them live. I just have a live cd, heh.
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Re: Most underrated band of all time [that you listen to]?

Post by rec7 »

[quote="SteveB3005"]The Carpenters, 'Close to You' album is ranked 175th of the 500 Greatest Albums by Rolling Stone. Paraphrasing from my copy, it says they epitomized the early seventies and that some of those early ballads like 'Close to You' and 'We've Only Just Begun' we're influential in much later indie music.

Each there own, but it's a little sappy for me and I would have had it further back than 175th. Btw 174th was Bob Dylan- 'Desire', and 176th was Aerosmith- 'Rocks'[/quote]

I think the Carpenters did a better job than the Beatles on this one http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fsgj4xcxXyA
now here is the Beatles one http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=alMyNn8ONoI

She was only around 19 when she did this.
What do you think?
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Re: Most underrated band of all time [that you listen to]?

Post by Default User BR »

rec7 wrote:She was only around 19 when she did this.
What do you think?
My opinion is that Karen Carpenter was a tremendous talent who was to a degree mismanaged by her label, and was dragged down by her loyalty to her brother. She wanted to expand into different material, as evidenced by her attempt at a solo album, and received a smack-down from the label.

To what extent that might have contributed to her disease and early death, I couldn't even speculate.


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Re: Most underrated band of all time [that you listen to]?

Post by deanbrew »

rec7 wrote: I think the Carpenters did a better job than the Beatles on this one http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fsgj4xcxXyA
now here is the Beatles one http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=alMyNn8ONoI

She was only around 19 when she did this.
What do you think?
Better than the Beatles version? No, not even close.

With that said, Karen Carpenter had an amazing voice, and it's a shame she was so carefully managed and died so young. Incredible singer.
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Re: Most underrated band of all time [that you listen to]?

Post by 29palms »

Underrated bands?
I don't know if these are undderated per say, but I'm a big 70's fan of music then. There were many too. I specifically liked Chicago and the Eagles. I liked alot of the 70's pop music too. I liked the Climax Blues Band, I liked Gerry Rafferty, England Dan and John Ford Coley, 3 dog night, there are way too many to list. There are definate underrated songs. I like a song by Joe Jackson called "It's different for girls". and I never hear it in the radio and its real good. Toto had some cool stuff. Redbone..."come and get your love"
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JupiterJones
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Re: Most underrated band of all time [that you listen to]?

Post by JupiterJones »

rec7 wrote: I think the Carpenters did a better job than the Beatles on this one http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fsgj4xcxXyA
[...]
What do you think?
Hmmm... I don't think I go as far as to say "better". (And I'm the guy who brought up Carpenters in the first place!)

But it's a very, very good arrangement of that song. That's really my philosophy of Beatles covers--you're not going to do it any better than they did, so your only recourse is to shoot for "different, in a good way".

Richard Carpenter is a fantastic arranger, and I think he did some great stuff with the tune. I can see how someone might not like the sort of light-pop style in which he worked, but even those people gotta admit that he did that style better than just about anyone. And Karen was a one-in-a-million singer (and not too shabby of a drummer, incidentally)

JJ
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deanbrew
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Re: Most underrated band of all time [that you listen to]?

Post by deanbrew »

29palms wrote:Underrated bands?
I don't know if these are undderated per say, but I'm a big 70's fan of music then. There were many too. I specifically liked Chicago and the Eagles. I liked alot of the 70's pop music too. I liked the Climax Blues Band, I liked Gerry Rafferty, England Dan and John Ford Coley, 3 dog night, there are way too many to list. There are definate underrated songs. I like a song by Joe Jackson called "It's different for girls". and I never hear it in the radio and its real good. Toto had some cool stuff. Redbone..."come and get your love"

Wow. That's all I can say.
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rec7
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Re: Most underrated band of all time [that you listen to]?

Post by rec7 »

[quote="winterescape"][quote="JDaniels"]Some friends and I were discussing this topic.

Our top three were:
1) The Who
2) Rush
3) Boston

All great bands that never got the credit they deserved.

What are yours?[/quote]

+1 for Boston[/quote]
Like Boston check out this one. Their best I think. Has to be the most underrated Boston song ever.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gmc_t7m2pC4&feature=fvst
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Johm221122
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Re: Most underrated band of all time [that you listen to]?

Post by Johm221122 »

rec7 wrote:
winterescape wrote:
JDaniels wrote:Some friends and I were discussing this topic.

Our top three were:
1) The Who
2) Rush
3) Boston

All great bands that never got the credit they deserved.

What are yours?
+1 for Boston
Like Boston check out this one. Their best I think. Has to be the most underrated Boston song ever.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gmc_t7m2pC4&feature=fvst
Thanks for link.Boston was great band and listening to these old songs reminds of how great music was back in the past.Guess I'm getting old this new generations music doesn't do it for me
29palms
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Re: Most underrated band of all time [that you listen to]?

Post by 29palms »

The Wofman Jack show, Charlie Tuna, American Top 40 with Casy Kasum, all great listening. Remember "Oh what a night", Frankie Avlon and the 4 Seasons I think. I liked Carley Simon, I liked a whole bunch of tunes of the 1970's.
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Re: Most underrated band of all time [that you listen to]?

Post by sscritic »

29palms wrote:The Wofman Jack show
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